Spoiler Discussion Thread

[SmallScreenDiva]

10 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

^^^From Social Media Thread

Well this just ups my estimate damn, it might be MSF or MSP reunion instead of Feb Sweeps.

Don't give me hope :P I read that tweet as "brace yourself for a love interest we're gonna shove down your throats even if you hate them because we need to stall this damn thing" Felt like it was an excuse saying "They'll bang others but look, they'll always love each other."

(I do prefer your more positive interpretation)

[Morrigan2575]

I'm not giving up hope. I've been saying Feb Sweeps since S4 and now I'm upping the reunion to MSF or MSP.

[statsgirl]

Juliana Harkavy seems the right age to be NuCanary.  In the DC verse, she played Sarah on Constantine.

I hate other love interest once the OTP couple has got together.  They are such a waste of time.
 

Quote

 

Amanda @EWPOPFest! @Fangirlw_oChill

Greg doesn't think anyone will ever be in Olicity's life that can replace the other!

 

Damage control?  You're going to hate the next episodes but don't dump the show.

9 hours ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Jesus, they really can't write Thea as anything more than somebody's daughter, can they?

A man's daughter, that's what this show values.  Robert, Walter, Malcolm and now Quentin.  We know she's Moira's daughter but we have to read it into her role as Oliver's Chief of Staff because they don't value mother/child relationships.

5 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

I do hope that at some point Oliver and Felicity acknowledge that she has put up these walls between them.  She doesn't let herself lean on Oliver in a personal kind of way even as she still is there for him and I really want Oliver to realize it and have him acknowledge how painful it really is not to be let all the way in just like he didn't let Felicity all the way in last year with the BMD.    

They will only if it's a plot point.  Otherwise, it will never come up.

Edited October 30, 2016 by statsgirl

[apinknightmare]

11 minutes ago, calliope1975 said:

Was there spoiler talk of a flashback LI for Russia? Did I make that up? 

I don't think there's been any talk of it apart from here - where we made up stories about "Tina" being someone Oliver was acquainted with from the past (his Bratva wife, someone somehow related to the Bratva, something Goodfellas, etc), who appears in the present, because Arrow is environmentally friendly and likes recycling.

Edited October 30, 2016 by apinknightmare

[Chaser]

If JH is the new actress, I wonder if she is in 5x10 or they filmed some scenes from 5x11. From what I've seen SA is not a quick follow on Twitter. He didnt follow Poppy for months. Last I looked he wasn't following CP. He only recently followed TR and JD. Makes me think he has already worked with her.

[Morrigan2575]

I think this person will be Jade Canary, Starling or Lady Blackhawke (non Zalinda version).

[apinknightmare]

12 minutes ago, Chaser said:

He didnt follow Poppy for months.

Maybe he forgot her real name like most of us did!

[Chaser]

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I think this person will be Jade Canary, Starling or Lady Blackhawke (non Zalinda version).

If she is Jade Canary can her nickname be Power Ranger?

[Cleanqueen]

41 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I think this person will be Jade Canary, Starling or Lady Blackhawke (non Zalinda version).

Jade Canary? As in Sandra Wu-San aka Lady Shiva? Nah they've already appropriated enough asian characters, if they do this one it'll be worse. I do think perhaps she'll be Lady Black Hawk or any other member of BOP we have yet to meet

[Velocity23]

I am here waiting for stills and Chico is just clueless!

[Belinea]

46 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

I am here waiting for stills and Chico is just clueless!

What exactly is her job? 

Also, the actress pictured has really nice hair. 

As for O/F: The feeling I get is that they don't want to drop it 100% but they want to tell another story with other people at the moment and since they are unable to write a story that would make sense for a formerly engaged couple, they just pretend that everything is cool and all has been resolved in hopes that it will make sense as long as nobody asks. If someone then asks they'll give a non-answer and hope that will get people to shut up because at least you didn't say anything negative. In reality, they will go back to it if all else fails.  

Edited October 30, 2016 by Belinea

[Midnight Lullaby]

7 hours ago, calliope1975 said:

I am one of those fans that feels the temp LI's fall in the garbage story telling pile, but I just choose to not watch/acknowledge those scenes because I am apparently 5 years old. What's funny (to me) is, while I'm sure I wouldn't like it, I probably wouldn't care as much and view it as standard ship stalling if Olicity hadn't been almost married last year. That's the straw that broke my shipper back. 

This is a problem I have too. Going from almost married and totally committed to platonic friends with one dating someone else gives me whiplash. It's not so much ship stalling as it's ops we went too far, let's rewind the story back a little. I wouldn't mind other LIs (wouldn't love either but wouldn't have trouble accepting them) if they were used in a compelling story that made sense after what happened last year. Not one that would have made sense in season 2 or 3. I still enjoy Olicity but what they are doing now for me is garbage story telling.

[Morrigan2575]

9 hours ago, Chaser said:

If she is Jade Canary can her nickname be Power Ranger?

Was that a thing in the show? I never watched.

9 hours ago, Cleanqueen said:

Jade Canary? As in Sandra Wu-San aka Lady Shiva? Nah they've already appropriated enough asian characters, if they do this one it'll be worse. I do think perhaps she'll be Lady Black Hawk or any other member of BOP we have yet to meet

As in they'll make up their own character and call her Jade Canary. Just like Artemis is not Artemis Crock she's an original character called Evelyn Sharp. Just like White Canary is not the sister of the 12 Silks, she's an original character called Sara Lance, etc etc

[Chaser]

I was referring to color coding canaries. I don't think there ever was a Jade power ranger.

On LOT, do they call Sara "White Canary" or do they ever shorten it to "Canary"?

[Chaser]

Going back to if KC was filming yet or not, I think she was still in Boston on Friday. Her assistant posted a pic with Boston location.

[tv echo]

I just posted video clips from the EW PopFest in the Mind Your Surroundings thread (page 215). From that panel, here's my transcription:

Quote

-- On when is Olicity getting back together, SA: "I don't know. I just read the scripts." GBerlanti: "I'm not sure - I can't say anything about that... Obviously, they work together every week, right? And they're very close. And, uh, I can't imagine anyone that would ever be in either of their lives that would replace the other person." SA: "Yeah, we haven't really discussed, like, our relationship yet this season. But we do discuss - um, Oliver and Felicity discuss a little bit about the relationship and, you know, where it is in this week's episode. Fun scenes."

Berlanti could've said the exact the same thing about Oliver and Diggle.

ETA: Juliana Harkavy kinda looks like KC.

Edited October 30, 2016 by tv echo

[Velocity23]

I really dont see the KC resemblance. I just saw some clips of auditions and man it was horrible and i got female Wild Dog vibes.

[tarotx]

Do we have Juliana Harkavy's audition? I think the casting sides call for a character similar to the one she played on the walking dead. Which I don't watch and just found a video clip searching her name :p 

People on twitter are upset that Arrow hired another white Actress. 

[Velocity23]

Dont think we will get it from the actress.

[apinknightmare]

9 minutes ago, tarotx said:

Do we have Juliana Harkavy's audition? I think the casting sides call for a character similar to the one she played on the walking dead. Which I don't watch and just found a video clip searching her name :p 

People on twitter are upset that Arrow hired another white Actress. 

That kid at the end has better aim than anyone on Arrow.

[fangirlforever320]

21 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

I really dont see the KC resemblance. I just saw some clips of auditions and man it was horrible and i got female Wild Dog vibes.

Where are these clips? I just heard about them. 

[Morrigan2575]

A bunch are in the spoiler only thread, go back a page or 2

[Thundercatmary]

I could see her more with Wild Dong than with Oliver but maybe that's just my wishful thinking lol

[fangirlforever320]

9 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

A bunch are in the spoiler only thread, go back a page or 2

Thank you! 

[Morrigan2575]

She was with The Governor? Oh I hate her already. Poor Hershel, Die Bitch, Die! LOL

Yeah I know Lyla was there too but I already knew Lyla before she ended up on TWD so she gets a pass.?

Edited October 30, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[statsgirl]

8 hours ago, tv echo said:

SA: "Yeah, we haven't really discussed, like, our relationship yet this season. But we do discuss - um, Oliver and Felicity discuss a little bit about the relationship and, you know, where it is in this week's episode. Fun scenes."

So that's the big scene in 505 where we're supposed to see the direction Olicity is going in?

Given what SA has said before, and the episodes he really likes on the show, I'm worried.  Because there's no way I can see that a real discussion about their relationship, especially since Felicity is still dating Mayo, qualifies as "fun".

[Morrigan2575]

9 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

So that's the big scene in 505 where we're supposed to see the direction Olicity is going in?

Given what SA has said before, and the episodes he really likes on the show, I'm worried.  Because there's no way I can see that a real discussion about their relationship, especially since Felicity is still dating Mayo, qualifies as "fun".

I don't recall direction, I recall them saying clarity, which is exactly what a conversation about their relationship status would detail.

[Thundercatmary]

They just keep giving non answers which is frustrating to me since i'm a fan of Oliver/Felicity together, I'm not expecting anything good from 5x5.

[apinknightmare]

At this point I'm expecting Oliver to find out about the boyfriend, sit Felicity down and say, "Tell me all about him." 

[Thundercatmary]

The thing is, it might be nice to see that Oliver loves her enough to want her to be happy but we don't know anything about Mayo and her relationship. So it would seem super weird to think the audience would care about her and Mayo or find any value in Oliver accepting it. The whole thing is nonsensical and poorly thought out.

I figure he will bang the reporter, hopefully the reporter doesn't stick around to long. Then NuCanary shows up and I really hope they don't throw her at Oliver because that's to far for me.

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, Thundercatmary said:

The whole thing is nonsensical and poorly thought out.

Well, that's Arrow for ya.

[Mellowyellow]

I'm more worried about nucanary than the reporter. I wonder if they'll still push the new romance if the chemistry is bad or they might get super lucky like HIMYM did with the mother and cast someone with even better chemistry than Olicity.

[quarks]

11 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

So that's the big scene in 505 where we're supposed to see the direction Olicity is going in?

Given what SA has said before, and the episodes he really likes on the show, I'm worried.  Because there's no way I can see that a real discussion about their relationship, especially since Felicity is still dating Mayo, qualifies as "fun".

As Morrigan2575 just said, I don't think 505 is going to indicate the direction, just explain the current status in the way 501-504 really didn't.

Other than feeling thankful that Dolph Lundgren doesn't show up until 506, which I know is just me, I have absolutely no expectations for 505, especially since Amell and I often disagree about what qualifies as fun or great.  So frankly, if we get out of 505 without Amell or EBR breaking into a cover of Leonard Cohen's "Hallelujah," I'll probably be good.

With that said, I do want to note that Oliver and Felicity have had some great scenes/been fun to watch in episodes where one of them has either just been with someone else (206), been visibly interested in someone else (208/209), with someone else (218/219), just returned from watching someone else build a robot suit (309), and just got dumped by someone else (320).  So I don't think the presence of Mayo Cop means that they can't have fun scenes.  I've liked pretty much all of their scenes so far this season, for instance. So, again, as long as we don't get "Hallelujah," bring on 505.

[tarotx]

Opps I thought he was being scarcastic when he said fun scenes.

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, tarotx said:

Opps I thought he was being scarcastic when he said fun scenes.

Ha, I thought he might've been too. He didn't sound all that sarcastic in the video, so it's impossible to tell. EVERYTHING IS AMBIGUOUS.

[dtissagirl]

16 minutes ago, quarks said:

So frankly, if we get out of 505 without Amell or EBR breaking into a cover of Leonard Cohen's "Hallelujah," I'll probably be good.

Dear lord no. I really need Hallelujah banned from television forever. Just do Famous Blue Raincoat instead, people. The chick left the guy for his brother, it's kinda more fitting anyway.

[Guest]

I can't picture O/F's 'moving on' or 'I just want you to be happy, go bang someone else!' talk ever being fun. No thanks. 

[statsgirl]

For me "clarity" implies direction.  If Oliver goes green and bangs the reporter in reaction, I know they'll be getting together sooner rather than later. If he tells her "I just want you to be happy", it won't be till the end of the season if that.

Hallelujah reminds me of House and his ex Stacy, and I don't wanted to be reminded of that at all.  If we're doing Leonard Cohen, how about Anthem ("There is a crack, a crack in everything/ That's how the light gets in") or for Oliver Bird on a Wire ("  If I, if I have been unkind, I hope that you can just let it go by. If I, if I have been untrue,I hope you know it was never to you).

1 hour ago, quarks said:

With that said, I do want to note that Oliver and Felicity have had some great scenes/been fun to watch in episodes where one of them has either just been with someone else (206), been visibly interested in someone else (208/209), with someone else (218/219), just returned from watching someone else build a robot suit (309), and just got dumped by someone else (320).  So I don't think the presence of Mayo Cop means that they can't have fun scenes.  I've liked pretty much all of their scenes so far this season, for instance. So, again, as long as we don't get "Hallelujah," bring on 505.

I agree with 206 (especially "We're still in Russia"). 208/209 was good for Oliver's jealousy and 320 because they were actually together.  No to 218/219 and in 309 Felicity wasn't with Ray.  As soon as she was actively dating/sleeping with him, all the Oliver/Felicity scenes went to crud.

I've liked a number of their scenes this year but knowing Felicity is sleeping with Mayo is a pebble in my shoe, especially when she has a good scene with Oliver.

Edited October 31, 2016 by statsgirl

[fangirlforever320]

46 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

As soon as she was actively dating/sleeping with him, all the Oliver/Felicity scenes went to crud.

I gotta disagree here. I felt 3x16 especially was a GREAT episode for Oliver and Felicity. Plus 3x18 gave us Mama Smoak telling Felicity she knew she was in love with Oliver and Felicity ditching out on Ray's ILU in favor of getting him jello... Also I really love 3x19 too. She nearly told him she loved him, right there in the street outside Palmer Tech. My heart!  

So I gotta agree, that sometimes scenes where they're with other people CAN be great. But you have to be open to them being great, at the same time. 

[SmallScreenDiva]

42 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

As soon as she was actively dating/sleeping with him, all the Oliver/Felicity scenes went to crud.

My favorite Oliver/Felicity scene while Felicity was dating Ray was the one in "The Offer.," where Oliver goes to visit her at PT and she jumps 3 feet away from Ray when she sees Oliver at the door. I still laugh when I remember that :)

Curious, would there have been enough time to tweak 505 if the show wanted to? Just wondering if the feedback and ratings from the last episodes would have had an impact.

[fangirlforever320]

3 minutes ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Curious, would there have been enough time to tweak 505 if the show wanted to? Just wondering if the feedback and ratings from the last episodes would have had an impact.

No. 5x05 was filmed towards the end of August. 

[Morrigan2575]

16 minutes ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Curious, would there have been enough time to tweak 505 if the show wanted to? Just wondering if the feedback and ratings from the last episodes would have had an impact.

Not really, at best they could edit something out or insert a pick up scene filmed later. That's about it, of course it would also depend on when they decided to make a change.

Edited October 31, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[SmallScreenDiva]

5 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Not really, at best they could edit something out or insert a pick up scene filmed later. That's about it, of course it would also depend on when they decided to make a change.

Yeah, I was thinking more of an edit, something that could be done in post because actual shooting happened months ago. 

[fangirlforever320]

15 minutes ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Yeah, I was thinking more of an edit, something that could be done in post because actual shooting happened months ago. 

I doubt they would. They haven't in the past. They've told us countless times that fan reactions during the season/filming isn't a large part of their story decision making process. I think the greatest chance of seeing any change would be in 5b at this point, but I also do think that they have a plan for the season and they intend to stick to it. 

Basically, if their plan was to have them try to move on with others and then come back together towards the end of the season, I don't see them changing that now, even if a certain segment of fans are upset with how it's done. 

[Morrigan2575]

24 minutes ago, fangirlforever320 said:

I doubt they would. They haven't in the past. They've told us countless times that fan reactions during the season/filming isn't a large part of their story decision making process. I think the greatest chance of seeing any change would be in 5b at this point, but I also do think that they have a plan for the season and they intend to stick to it. 

Basically, if their plan was to have them try to move on with others and then come back together towards the end of the season, I don't see them changing that now, even if a certain segment of fans are upset with how it's done. 

Online fan reactions? Not really. Online fan reactions coupled with sinking ratings and Network/Studio execs breathing down your neck to fix it?  Hell, yeah.

Now, i don't believe they've edited anything in or out of 505 but, the idea that this show is made in a vacuum and Nothing impacts it?  Nope. 

[way2interested]

44 minutes ago, fangirlforever320 said:

I doubt they would. They haven't in the past. They've told us countless times that fan reactions during the season/filming isn't a large part of their story decision making process. I think the greatest chance of seeing any change would be in 5b at this point, but I also do think that they have a plan for the season and they intend to stick to it. 

Basically, if their plan was to have them try to move on with others and then come back together towards the end of the season, I don't see them changing that now, even if a certain segment of fans are upset with how it's done. 

Well, I don't know if they've ever tweaked things for their "a" portion of their seasons (although the pitching of turning the Atom show into LoT with CL -a side reaction to 301 along with the lack of reaction to BR in 3a- could have possibly happened during 3a time, but I don't remember the timeline exactly), but they have edited/added things from reactions before in general, if that's what you meant by "they haven't in the past." The flashforward in 310 proving that Felicity wasn't in the grave was shot during 414 in reaction to 409/401, Thea's OOC defense of Oliver in 414 was added in from reactions in 408, etc., sometimes these things happen. They even pseudo-admitted that they didn't put Olicity back together in 423 because of the overall reaction from both them and viewers from how abruptly they broke up (and to not alienate the importance of Laurel's death).

As much as they say that fan reactions aren't part of their process, it still is to a small extent. They're at least very aware of fan reactions and occasionally write to them on purpose (223, Felicity's bf in 501), and the network (who does care about overall viewer/fan reactions to an extent) can still have final say in their process. Now, I'm not saying that they would demand an end to any temp LI subplot they may have in mind (even though I don't think that's where they're going with Tina), but they can insist on small changes that can have maximum effects at the time, even in 505. The power of editing can make scenes that were intending to have romance not and vice-versa, that were intending to have animosity not and vice versa, etc., or it can completely decimate entire scenes/lines/actions that could have been deemed problematic (ex: an entire subplot for Felicity was cut in 418 even though it was already publicized from CW itself. Why? Who knows exactly, but it was cut along with scenes for which they had a guest star for, so it probably wasn't all for "cut for time purposes").

IDK, nothing substantial from 505 or from any subplots in 5b may change, but execution definitely has opportunity for changes, especially if the network deems it necessary for them to fix. 

Edited October 31, 2016 by way2interested

[fangirlforever320]

7 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Online fan reactions? Not really. Online fan reactions coupled with sinking ratings and Network/Studio execs breathing down your neck to fix it?  Hell, yeah.

Now, i don't believe they've edited anything in or out of 505 but, the idea that this show is made in a vacuum and Nothing impacts it?  Nope. 

I think this is where I've failed to make my point clearly. I apologize. I'm not saying that fan reactions aren't taken into consideration. I'm saying that I don't think those reactions have a great impact on episodes already filmed (and perhaps those already written). And I think this because of what I've heard these very writers say about their process in writing this show. 

As for the ratings, that's a whole 'nother can of worms and I don't think it's its a terrible a situation as some are making it out to be. 

[fangirlforever320]

3 minutes ago, way2interested said:

Well, I don't know if they've ever tweaked things for their "a" portion of their seasons (although the pitching of turning the Atom show into LoT with CL -a side reaction to 301 along with the lack of reaction to BR in 3a- could have possibly happened during 3a time, but I don't remember the timeline exactly), but they have edited/added things from reactions before in general, if that's what you meant by "they haven't in the past." The flashforward in 310 proving that Felicity wasn't in the grave was shot during 414 in reaction to 409/401, Thea's OOC defense of Oliver in 414 was added in from reactions in 408, etc., sometimes these things happen. They even pseudo-admitted that they didn't put Olicity back together in 423 because of the overall reaction from both them and viewers from how abruptly they broke up (and to not alienate the importance of Laurel's death).

As much as they say that fan reactions aren't part of their process, it still is to a small extent. They're at least very aware of fan reactions and occasionally write to them on purpose (223, Felicity's bf in 501), and the network (who does care about overall viewer/fan reactions to an extent) can still have final say in their process. Now, I'm not saying that they would demand an end to any temp LI subplot they may have in mind (even though I don't think that's where they're going with Tina), but they can insist on small changes that can have maximum effects at the time, even in 505. The power of editing can make scenes that were intending to have romance not and vice-versa, that were intending to have animosity not and vice versa, etc., or it can completely decimate entire scenes/lines/actions that could have been deemed problematic (ex: an entire subplot for Felicity was cut in 418 even though it was already publicized from CW itself. Why? Who knows exactly, but it was cut along with scenes for which they a guest star for, so it probably wasn't all for "cut for time purposes").

IDK, nothing substantial from 505 or from any subplots in 5b may change, but execution definitely has opportunity for changes, especially if the network deems it necessary for them to fix. 

I can agree with this. I meant major story beats aren't usually changed, but other things are added in. Though I do believe the plan all along was to show the flashforward in 4x10. They knew they "played out" Felicity being in the grave by almost having her die at the end of 4x09 and she was an easy elimination. I do believe Taiana's status as flashback love-interest was severely cut back due to fan reaction in season 4, so there IS that. But I also happen to think they weren't wild about the flashback love interest storyline to begin with and it was only network pressure that caused them to include it in the first place. I think for certain story points they WANT to push through on, there's not much that can dissuade them from doing it, especially if it's already written and filmed. 

I'm sorry I wasn't clear in my post. 

[Cleanqueen]

My question is everyone thinks this episode is bad, why do we think as such. Other than the boyfriend still being in the episode I haven't read or seen anything to suggest the episode will be bad. They've been pimping this episode since July anytime someone asked about Olicity, so why would these EP's try to piss off their largest fanbase. Up until recently when some online rumours started, we would never have speculated that oliver would bang the reporter even after seeing her debut episode where her and oliver hardly said a word to each other. I feel like all people are going with is that oh so seductive voice she used in the trailer, which might end up being edited for all we know.

So I'll probably be the only one, but I think 5x05 is going to be a great episode and it'll be the first episode where Olicity finally discusses the status of their romantic relationship and I can't wait to watch it.

[EmilyBettFan]

Just give us another steamy Olicity sex scene when they get together because that sure as hell would get ratings back up!