Spoiler Discussion Thread

[Belinea]

That is actually confusing to me. So did Ray just give her a promotion after all? I always thought he gave her the whole company. She still could be fired as CEO but the company would still belong to her. Didn't Oliver say she inherited the company in episode 4x02. 

[BkWurm1]

8 minutes ago, Belinea said:

That is actually confusing to me. So did Ray just give her a promotion after all? I always thought he gave her the whole company. She still could be fired as CEO but the company would still belong to her. Didn't Oliver say she inherited the company in episode 4x02. 

They absolutely said she inherited the company (it's also what we read in the written agreement that Ray had Felicity secretly sign) but once again these writers equate owning and being CEO as the same thing but it's even stupider in reverse. 

2 hours ago, lemotomato said:

Yeah, I was just going to comment on how empty those claims of "a lighter season" sound now. And I suspect that Felicity getting fired from PT is going to facilitate her leaving town (willingly or not) at the end of the season, which I really really do not want. I'm going to be all sorts of pissy and bitter if that happens, honestly. It's something that can't even be fixed by fanfic, because a whole summer of angsty fic where Oliver and Felicity are separated? No thanks.

There remains a tiny part of me that is rooting for her to leave just for bragging rights. 

[lemotomato]

25 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

There remains a tiny part of me that is rooting for her to leave just for bragging rights. 

I'll be terribly vexed at you if it happens. :P

I realize that Felicity leaving town has a lot of story potential, but I'm tired of the angst. I don't even need to see Olicity make up and get back together by the end of the season, but I do need to be given hope that they're working on it over the summer. Which they can't do if she's gone for whatever reason.

[bijoux]

This is a shot from the extended promo. People on Twitter are saying it's the "daughter" actress.

[BkWurm1]

Is TA going to be in the next episode still?  I mean, Donna gets to yell at him at some point, right?  Could that be a spare daughter of his?

 

3 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

I'll be terribly vexed at you if it happens. :P

I realize that Felicity leaving town has a lot of story potential, but I'm tired of the angst. I don't even need to see Olicity make up and get back together by the end of the season, but I do need to be given hope that they're working on it over the summer. Which they can't do if she's gone for whatever reason.

In some ways I don't think it would be that angsty since by the beginning of season five everyone would be reunited (and it would skip a summer of relationship development that once again we wouldn't get to see) but I have other reason not to want them apart (aka them pulling rando love interests for either Oliver or Felicity which would just be awful to the characters) including not wanting the pressure to think of what happens at the end of season 5, lol. 

[bijoux]

I'm pretty sure we had it confirmed at some point that TA is in 4x22, which is when I also think Cooper is back. He definitely mentioned a scene with CR.

[bijoux]

With the way the extended promo is cut, it sure looks like Thea luring Oliver and Dig under the dome. Which really sucks, especially since she didn't seem really concerened with the team or the world at large in this epsode.

[wonderwall]

12 minutes ago, bijoux said:

With the way the extended promo is cut, it sure looks like Thea luring Oliver and Dig under the dome. Which really sucks, especially since she didn't seem really concerened with the team or the world at large in this epsode.

Hey if Felicity were in that position this episode she'd be called a selfish bitch right now I'm guessing :) ahhhhhhh the insane standards felicity is put in... 

Anyways, yeah it does seem like she's luring them in... But tbh I could care less about that. I'm more interested in Felicity in the next episode. See if the writers will actually have her be affected 

[bijoux]

All I know is, Oliver and Dig can't spend the entire episode under the dome. Felicity is going to be stretched too thin otherwise. Echo tweeted he's in the last two episodes, Noah is still there, Cooper is coming and I'm not sure anymore when PB posted that Facebook live video, whether it was the filming of this or the next episode. If it's the next, it means she has some scenes with Quentin as well. God damnit, she's got a ton of other nukes to dissable, she doesn't have time for all of them on her own.

I'm scrolling through Instagram and ER posted she did ADR for the show yesterday. Don't let me down, damnit, and have it be for the finale. It's got to be for next week, her last episode ever!

Edited May 12, 2016 by bijoux

[looptab]

4 hours ago, apinknightmare said:

ETA: Just thinking about it, maybe she already DID come to terms or whatever, and that was the whole "I said that because I was hurt, you can change" thing?

Yeah, I think that was it her acknowledging her part in the break up.

1 hour ago, lemotomato said:

I'll be terribly vexed at you if it happens. :P

I realize that Felicity leaving town has a lot of story potential, but I'm tired of the angst. I don't even need to see Olicity make up and get back together by the end of the season, but I do need to be given hope that they're working on it over the summer. Which they can't do if she's gone for whatever reason.

I'm lost, are we back to thinking that Felicity leaves at the end or is this just brought on by her being fired? I'm honestly on the "everybody leaves but Oliver and Felicity" train, given those spoiler pics from the finale.

1 hour ago, bijoux said:

I'm pretty sure we had it confirmed at some point that TA is in 4x22, which is when I also think Cooper is back. He definitely mentioned a scene with CR.

It was also in the episode description, so yes he is definitely in 422.

[kismet]

Here is my spoiler wish for Thea for the hiatus - I want her character to go on an actual vacation, perhaps O/F can give her some frequent flyer miles. I didn't realize it until someone posted it in the episode thread, but the poor woman has been promised multiple vacations, trips & spa days and has been jipped out of every single one. She deserves some quality R&R, maybe then she can actually clear her head and be given an actual plotline about her next season.

[DeadZeus]

a big gripe i have.

Team Arrow spent all season only dealing with hive and not saving any common folk... So i'm actually surprised ppl know there was a BC and GA in town the whole time.. Who saw them? They are only dealing with personal stuff and hive only... There is no one they save that can tell the tale except for the Cupid episode i guess?

And now after a full season of ONLY dealing with hive they still fail lolz

[looptab]

Well, yes, this has been an issue for the past two seasons - we kinda lost the sense of the city and its inhabitants. Though I think it's not that much of an issue this season as it was in season 3 - this season the Ghosts and DD's plan interested Star City, so them fighting them was meant to protect Star City and save Star City citizens. Also there's been the train in 401, the shooting at the beach in 409, the Demolition Squad in 416, Anarky kidnapping that girl. Probably something else I'm forgetting as well. I wouldn't say they're just dealing with personal stuff.

Edited May 12, 2016 by looptab

[Morrigan2575]

I was watching the extended promoand i think that Thea isn't brainwashed. I think she's angry over Alex's death and lashing out at Oliver. I think this is their Merlyn vs Queen storyline.

I have a bad feeling their suprising answer is either she's a Merlyn or she's neither and walks away.  I'd prefer the latter but sonce they don't seem willing to actually get rid of Malcolm  I fear S5 is going to be Evil Malcolm/Thea against TA

[nksarmi]

56 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I was watching the extended promoand i think that Thea isn't brainwashed. I think she's angry over Alex's death and lashing out at Oliver. I think this is their Merlyn vs Queen storyline.

I have a bad feeling their suprising answer is either she's a Merlyn or she's neither and walks away.  I'd prefer the latter but sonce they don't seem willing to actually get rid of Malcolm  I fear S5 is going to be Evil Malcolm/Thea against TA

Oh yea that sounds like fun - only not. I'll stop watching. I'm almost done with Flash because I'm bored but evil Malcolm/Thea against TA and a whole season of Oliver trying to "save her soul" - yea I'd have to rage quit Arrow over that.

[ComicFan777]

I'd rather have Thea run off with Anarky and be crazy together than have her evil team up with Malcolm.

[Morrigan2575]

I really hope I'm wrong although neither option appeals. She's either going dark/evil because she's a Merlyn or she's brainwashed...again. yay! (Not)

I suppose a they could pull a S3 "surprising" decision and have Thea decide she's neither.  Then they could have her change her name to Thea Dearden as a nod to the comics. I still think S4 ends with Thea and/or Diggle leaving town. I also won't rule out Felicity, given the events of Monument Point

Edited May 12, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[apinknightmare]

Since Malcolm took Ruve aside and told her that Oliver was coming for Thea, I'm hoping part of that had to do with getting some of those pills HIVE uses for brainwashing. NOT that I want her to be brainwashed, but if given the option between her actually being so angry over Alex that she's lashing out at OLIVER over Malcolm or being brainwashed, I'll take brainwashed. For my own sanity.

Edited May 12, 2016 by apinknightmare

[Morrigan2575]

If i had a choice i'd go with D "none of the above".

I'm just so sick of the same Thea storyline that i really, really, really don't want her brainwashed again.  However, evil/crazy Thea Merlyn has no appeal either. 

Edited May 12, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

If i had a choice i'd go with D "none of the above".

I'm just so sick of the same Thea storyline that i really, really, really don't want her brainwashed again.  However, evil/crazy Thea Merlyn has no appeal either. 

Well, she's either A) brainwashed, B) pretending to be brainwashed, or C) legit going off the rails. 

B is my preference. 
A is my backup. 
C = no way in hell would I buy that

[nksarmi]

2 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

Since Malcolm took Ruve aside and told her that Oliver was coming for Thea, I'm hoping part of that had to do with getting some of those pills HIVE uses for brainwashing. NOT that I want her to be brainwashed, but if given the option between her actually being so angry over Alex that she's lashing out at OLIVER over Malcolm or being brainwashed, I'll take brainwashed. For my own sanity.

Oh yea brainwashed - again - yea! - or faking it are the only options I find acceptable. If she's actually gone over to the dark side - I just won't be able to take it anymore. They could have made Thea evil back in season three and I would have been ok with it. Hell, they could have even done it with the blood lust thing this season. But now - it would fly in the face of everything they've told me and even though she's a relatively minor character on the show and not a character I truly watch the show for - that kind of bad writing would be the final straw. This show used to be so good, but something has gone horribly wrong and I'm not very confident they can fix it.

[Genki]

I like Thea a lot, but I hope they don't loose the momentum that was built this week to "rescue" her from the ark.

There is only a 24 hour buffer on the nukes so far, rescuing Thea should not be a priority. Anarky gave them a big road map the Death Star-esque flaw. They should be aiming to ruin the Ark so the plan to nuke the world and survive underground is not viable.

Edited May 12, 2016 by Genki
Grammar

[Belinea]

Just looking at Thea's storyline really makes me wonder whether they have any idea what to do with her. I mean, she should be a capable fighter yet she is the damsel even more often than Felicity. Oliver always has to save his sister. I am generally bored by this storyline. Also I am bored by the notion that you have to cramp everything in the last 4 episodes. They storylines become so rushed and it is never really all that complete. Don't they have time to establish all these characters and their problems? And why does DD want to kill everyone. Because he is evil? Is there a reason and I missed it?

Also I think the nuke thing is quite a big thing to put on Felicity's shoulders. Isn't there anybody in the Pentagon that could help? At all? And I have to admit, I don't want the team to split up again. They spilt up almost every season and they have to come back next season. Otherwise what's the point. Why do that again? Even if Oliver stays alone. They will have to return at some point. 

The company is also lost again because apparently you can fire the owner. What will Felicity do now? Couldn't they have had more time to develop all this properly?

BTW: Is Curtis on holiday?

Edited May 12, 2016 by Belinea

[Morrigan2575]

7 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

Well, she's either A) brainwashed, B) pretending to be brainwashed, or C) legit going off the rails. 

B is my preference. 
A is my backup. 
C = no way in hell would I buy that

Yep, which I why I pick D) None of the above :-)  LOL

B would be my preference as well, let's hope it's a scam but not really sure what the play would be.

[looptab]

I didn't even think she might be pretending  - I instantly thought she was brainwashed, period. But I like it, and I hope that's it. Maybe she knows she's being watched, or suspects that Malcolm has something planned against Oliver once he comes to her rescue. Can't reconcile that with why she'd send the text, so I'm pretending not to have that info yet, haha.

Edited May 12, 2016 by looptab

[tarotx]

I loved last night's episode. Even the Thea repeated beats. So much of this season has been a kind of retread of season 3 that I can overlook a lot. Though, I do hope this is the final time. She really does need to take control over her own life and stop letting Oliver Queen and Malcolm Merlyn move her like a chess piece. I think she will leave team Arrow but not the fight. No way Thea can blame Oliver and not Malcolm. I think she'll blame herself and both of them as well. I think she will decide she isn't a Queen or a Merlyn. She will give up the red suit and head toward something shaded gray. I think she will accept responsibility in helping to create Anarky and I really do see them ending up as a team. Though I've been predicting that all year and so far I'm not good at my predictions :P

I feel for Felicity having to divert the Nuke into the small town instead of the large city. She doesn't really have the soul to make tough choices like that. She's brave and smart so does make the tough choices but it eats at her. I sense a make a difference to real people push for her. I do see her opening up Smoak Technologies and probably with Curtis. 

I'm not sure what will happen with Diggle but I see him leaving team Arrow as well. He's emotionally worn out and needs time to just be a family man. Though he may just be at the point that he's broken like after Afghanistan, which could be a strain on his marriage.

I think Oliver will be Mayor. 

[looptab]

Funny thing is, what would she blame Oliver for? It's not like he asked her to be a part of the Team like he did Diggle and Felicity. She pretty much just started donning the leather after Roy's advice, but it was still her decision, so..?

[apinknightmare]

6 minutes ago, looptab said:

Can't reconcile that with why she'd send the text, so I'm pretending not to have that info yet, haha.

I suppose she could figure that if the team infiltrates the ark and destroys Darhk's safe haven, that would buy them some kind of time. Destroying the world seems like a much less appealing option when there isn't a safe place to go to after you've done it, haha. 

I think she probably is actually brainwashed though.

Edited May 12, 2016 by apinknightmare

[tarotx]

4 minutes ago, looptab said:

Funny thing is, what would she blame Oliver for? It's not like he asked her to be a part of the Team like he did Diggle and Felicity. She pretty much just started donning the leather after Roy's advice, but it was still her decision, so..?

 

Oliver decided to Pit her as well as pushed her continued relationship with Malcolm. No way she could just blame Oliver and not Malcolm though. 

[AyChihuahua]

20 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

Well, she's either A) brainwashed, B) pretending to be brainwashed, or C) legit going off the rails. 

B is my preference. 
A is my backup. 
C = no way in hell would I buy that

For me the problem is going off the rails over ALEX. Hey, I love the actor. He was hilarious in Suburgatory. But in this show he's been so boring and wooden he makes the Cane Toad (almost) look interesting by comparison. Going off the rails over THAT GUY? Who you couldn't even bring yourself to give CPR to? I will never buy that. (Also, um, Oliver didn't kill Alex or put Alex in a position to be killed, you little dumbass. I STG there is something really wrong with the Dearden genes.)

Serious for a minute, it really doesn't seem like it should be this impossible to give her a storyline. I liked when she was a surprisingly competent club owner in S2, and I even liked her in the beginning of this season when she was, for a hot minute, a surprisingly competent vigilante. They should just put up a sign in the writers' room with these two repeating storylines Xd out with big red Xs. No more "Thea's in danger and Oliver will DO ANYTHING TO SAVE THEA OMG!" and no more "Is Thea a Merlyn or a Queen?!?!?! Tune in next week to find out...and the week after that...and the week after that...and the week after that...[repeat ad infinitum]." I'm okay with Thea being in danger when everyone is, or being intentional bait, or being in danger and getting her damn self out for once. But that's IT.

[apinknightmare]

6 minutes ago, tarotx said:

Oliver decided to Pit her as well as pushed her continued relationship with Malcolm. No way she could just blame Oliver and not Malcolm though. 

After William was kidnapped, Thea told him she didn't want anything to do with him anymore, and yet she still wound up under the dome - Malcolm would've made sure she was safe regardless of how she felt about him. Alex got drugged because he decided to work for Ruve, and not take Felicity's offer - and that's how he got down there in the first place, so...still not even remotely Oliver's fault, haha.

4 minutes ago, AyChihuahua said:

For me the problem is going off the rails over ALEX.

Agreed. My issue is also that she'd be going off the rails and lashing out at Oliver, who legit had nothing to do with her winding up in her current situation for once in his damn life. 

Edited May 12, 2016 by apinknightmare

[bijoux]

21 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Yep, which I why I pick D) None of the above :-)  LOL

B would be my preference as well, let's hope it's a scam but not really sure what the play would be.

I'm actually hoping for that as well. That she's playing Malcolm by pretending to be brainwashed or off the rails and the text was actually a coded message so Oliver knows what to expect. They should work out coded messages, team members get taken often enough. They need a plan for these things. 

I just don't want for the Queen siblings fight to be real. It's just that their fight at the beginning of the season was hands down my favorite of the early season and possibly of the entire season 4. This would rob the original one of its impact in my eyes.

[looptab]

8 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I suppose she could figure that if the team infiltrates the ark and destroys Darhk's safe haven, that would buy them some kind of time. Destroying the world seems like a much less appealing option when there isn't a safe place to go to after you've done it, haha. 

I think she probably is actually brainwashed though.

Could be. Yeah I'm going with that, thank you:)

4 minutes ago, tarotx said:

Oliver decided to Pit her as well as pushed her continued relationship with Malcolm. No way she could just blame Oliver and not Malcolm though. 

That is true for last season, this season not so much. She's the one who called Malcolm to tell him about DD reversing her bloodlust.

Not to say Oliver shouldn't be blamed for imposing Malcolm's presence on her, just that it would be senseless to do that  considering she then went along with it all on her own.

[tarotx]

I doubt Thea will just be lashing out about Alex. He's the last straw. The girl has suffered a lot of trauma and loss. 

[apinknightmare]

3 minutes ago, tarotx said:

I doubt Thea will just be lashing out about Alex. He's the last straw. The girl has suffered a lot of trauma and loss. 

It still doesn't make much sense that she'd be lashing out at Oliver over Malcolm. Oliver's done some dumb shit to perpetuate things, but Malcolm can be traced back to the root of all of it - and even in this episode, she acknowledges how awful her life is with him in it. I suppose she could've already tried to deal with Malcolm and Oliver is her second target, but that seems unlikely.

Edited May 12, 2016 by apinknightmare

[tarotx]

I think Thea will stew in her grief and angst and it will boil over by the time Oliver comes rescue her. 

[AyChihuahua]

26 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

It still doesn't make much sense that she'd be lashing out at Oliver over Malcolm. Oliver's done some dumb shit to perpetuate things, but Malcolm can be traced back to the root of all of it - and even in this episode, she acknowledges how awful her life is with him in it. I suppose she could've already tried to deal with Malcolm and Oliver is her second target, but that seems unlikely.

Yeah, and it's not like she just hits Oliver or something...I believe she says if he moves she'll shoot him. That seems like more than lashing out to me.

[Midnight Lullaby]

2 minutes ago, AyChihuahua said:

Yeah, and it's not like she just hits Oliver or something...I believe she says if he moves she'll shoot him. That seems like more than lashing out to me.

It would also come out of nowhere. Sure, she throws a dig at Oliver once in a while but she has been very supportive of him lately. One thing would be losing her head and lashing out at MM given their relationship and her feelings towards him but threatening Oliver with a gun when he is there to get her out (which is what she wants) would be too weird to me. 

[calliope1975]

Why can't they write better stories for Thea?? We've already had her ditching the Queen family. She's already teamed up with Malcolm. She's already been brainwashed. The only thing left is to choose to be a Queen. Can we just get to that and skip the rehash?

[Belinea]

Maybe Thea will finally cross over to the dark side and she and Malcolm will be the new evil duo in S5 which will give us another overdone storyline in a way. I have a feeling that no matter what they do with this storyline, everyone will be over it before it even airs. Also, if that bunker is so safe that people cannot get out, why is it so easy to get in? 

Also, wouldn't there be a panic after everyone and their mother realizes that someone just threw a nuclear bomb on a city. Wouldn't governments be all over this, news and other forms of media? Is everyone just going about their day while Oliver saves his sister? Because she isn't exactly unsafe and while she is captured (which is bad) she isn't going to die like the whole planet will. So that doesn't matter more?

Edited May 12, 2016 by Belinea

[Velocity23]

Thea looks like a Merlyn to me ...

[ComicFan777]

The whole thing about rescuing Thea right now bothers me because the team only delayed DD's plans.  Felicity and Noah still need to be protected from HIVE while they work on a final solution to save the world.  Murmur already took a shot at Noah - ARGUS didn't seem adequate and only Diggle and Oliver were able to protect them.  Sending Oliver and Digg to the dome to save Thea in the middle of this mess just seems less important right now, especially since she has Malcolm.  Granted they don't know if Thea is safe with Malcolm, but global danger seems more pressing at this time instead of wandering around DD's underground playhouse to rescue her.

[Angel12d]

At this point I hope Thea just goes dark. If they're gonna do this, don't be wishy washy. Just go full-on. I'm so bored of this back and forth Merlyn or Queen crap. Pick a side already.

But really, is she brainwashed again? 

Edited May 12, 2016 by Angel12d

[AyChihuahua]

Thea going bad would be completely repetitive not bc of the going-bad part, exactly. She hasn't really fully gone bad so far in the series, she's just kind of flirted with badness. It would be repetitive, grotesquely horrifically incredibly boringly repetitive, bc then Oliver would DO ANYTHING TO SAVE THEA OMG! Which has, at this point, happened like 14 times (it feels like 14 billion). If she's co-villains with MM for S5, I just think I'll be out. I have been creeped out with Oliver's obsession with her for two seasons now. Can't take it anymore.

Going to be optimistic...she's drugged or having a quick mental break, and she'll be fine by the end of the episode.

[calliope1975]

48 minutes ago, Belinea said:

Also, wouldn't there be a panic after everyone and their mother realizes that someone just threw a nuclear bomb on a city. Wouldn't governments be all over this, news and other forms of media? Is everyone just going about their day while Oliver saves his sister? Because she isn't exactly unsafe and while she is captured (which is bad) she isn't going to die like the whole planet will. So that doesn't matter more?

I would think so. What's Russia's response to their destroying an American city? Ummm, we were hacked. That's going to go over well. It appears from Lyla that the POTUS knows what's going on, but how do you sell this to an American public that is going to want retaliation. 

I realize that NONE of this will be addressed. #comics!

[Velocity23]

I give up on Thea x.x

Edited May 12, 2016 by Velocity23

[AyChihuahua]

10 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

But really, is she brainwashed again? 

I think the brainwashing must be easier when one doesn't have much of a brain in the first place.

[Artsda]

I like dark Thea, she's more interesting.

[Velocity23]

I would like if there was a dark Thea. Let her kill Merlyn and do her thing. Not whatever this Merlyn/Thea thing is.

[Belinea]

It also bothered me during the episode that she didn't ask Malcolm right away in the kitchen scene what would happen to her friends and her brother. 

Maybe she will have a 'My name is Thea Queen' moment in 4x23. 

Edited May 12, 2016 by Belinea