S01.E06: The Good Man

[ghoulina]

We've seen the tactic a few times on the parent show.  Zombies are slow so a light jog can put you substantially ahead of them.  Salzar's casual demeanor while leading them though was a bit odd but I still thought it was awesome.

 

 

To me, nothing will ever be as badass as Merle stringing them along in that car, drinking and blaring Motorhead. And, at least he was leading his walkers to people who were undoubtedly bad. Daniel unleashed thousands on nurses and sick people and maybe stragglers left behind in surrounding neighborhoods. He sucks.

[Brooke0707]

That was terrible. I get not wanting to be a zombie in front of your kid, but she doesn't tell him goodbye?  She doesn't wait like a hot minute before asking her ex to shoot her in the head?  This is the beginning of the whole thing.  I think it is unrealistic that Liza reacted that way - especially because the zombie didn't take a big bite out of her arm - she basically had a scratch.  She is that certain that a scratch is enough?  To be honest, I'm not even sure why she thought it was a zombie scratch.  Just totally unrealistic.  And then Madison and Trevor, after two minutes are all "K, I'll shoot you."  WTF?  And why did they kill the only semi-interesting character?

 

Madison is terrible. Just terrible. The expression on her face never changes. She sees someone getting eaten - blank stare. She shares a kiss with her boyfriend - blank stare.

 

I was so excited about this show, but I thought it was terrible.  They didn't tell the story they said they would tell, they didn't take advantage of being in LA, and they disrespected the audience by giving them the cheapest, shoddiest product to make a quick buck.  They had their plot points in mind and wrote around that, at the expense of the script and characters not making any sense.  And now, after six episodes, we are basically back where TWD started, except with boring characters and bad writing.

 

By the way, these are horrible people.  They are okay with killing thousands of people for the off chance they can find Nick and Griselda?  And they don't even bother to close the gate of their own neighborhood?  They should get rid of the cast.  They should get rid of the writers.  They should start all over again.

Edited October 9, 2015 by Brooke0707

[riverheightsnancy]

Anyway, I simply must INSIST you fire up your Netflix and get started on TWD.  ASAP, girl!  The pilot is one of the best things ever put on television.

 

Ok, so I did. And I have to say that having seen TWD and comparing FTWD, there really is no comparison. Like you said the 1st episode is really compelling. It answered quite a few questions that I had in general. The fear is palpable and it holds your attention. Because they have been showing all of the episodes before the broadcast of the new season, I have seen almost all of them, missed a few here and there, but got the general idea. I will have to go back and watch a few I missed, it really is an interesting show, glad I gave it a chance. I will see you guys in the TWD forum on Sunday! 

[peach]

Ok, so I did. And I have to say that having seen TWD and comparing FTWD, there really is no comparison. Like you said the 1st episode is really compelling. It answered quite a few questions that I had in general. The fear is palpable and it holds your attention. Because they have been showing all of the episodes before the broadcast of the new season, I have seen almost all of them, missed a few here and there, but got the general idea. I will have to go back and watch a few I missed, it really is an interesting show, glad I gave it a chance. I will see you guys in the TWD forum on Sunday! 

Yay!  That's excellent!  I'm glad you enjoyed it.  As you can see, they do pretty much explain how things went down right from the first episode, and FTWD didn't really add to that universe.  IMO.

 

If you have time, be sure to watch the episode "Clear" from season 3 before Sunday's premiere.  That one is connected to the upcoming season.

 

As for an LA apocalypse, I watched This Is The End last night, and it had a lot more fear and suspense than FTWD, and it was a comedy.  lol

Edited October 10, 2015 by peach

[editorgrrl]

I get not wanting to be a zombie in front of your kid, but she doesn't tell him goodbye? She doesn't wait like a hot minute before asking her ex to shoot her in the head? This is the beginning of the whole thing. I think it is unrealistic that Liza reacted that way—especially because the zombie didn't take a big bite out of her arm.

Liza told Daniel how to care for Ofelia, and she told Chris she loved him. She knew first-hand (from the infirmary and from Dr. Exner) what would happen to her: "I've seen what it does. The bites don't turn you, but the infection's not treatable. The infection kills you like anything else. Then it happens. It doesn't matter how you die, you come back. We all come back. Don't let that happen to me. Don't let our son see that, okay? "

Unlike most of the other characters, Liza (and Dr. Exner) gave important information to the others. I personally couldn't fault anyone for suiciding out of the ZA—least of all someone who's been bitten and might kill her own child.

[Raven1707]

I think it is unrealistic that Liza reacted that way - especially because the zombie didn't take a big bite out of her arm - she basically had a scratch.  She is that certain that a scratch is enough?  To be honest, I'm not even sure why she thought it was a zombie scratch.

 

A scratch? There was a set of bite marks -- four upper, four lower -- on Liza's right side after she had to fight off a zombie during their escape.

[Ohwell]

If I'm Liza I still would have put some peroxide or something on that shit and waited awhile before I'd agree to have someone blow my brains out. 

 

I still say they shot her too quickly.  Madison gets rid of a potential love interest for that turd Travis, and he gets rid of the ex-wife problem.

Edited October 10, 2015 by Ohwell

[Bongo Fury]

If I'm Liza I still would have put some peroxide or something on that shit and waited awhile before I'd agree to have someone blow my brains out. 

 

I still say they shot her too quickly. 

 

Yes, what you are saying makes sense logically. But on Fear/TWD character's actions must service the plot first and foremost. And the plot dictates that Liza must die in the season finale. So it was clumsily forced. 

Edited October 10, 2015 by Bongo Fury

[Ohwell]

Also, I was thinking that, even though Liza told Chris she loved him, that wasn't really a goodbye; he had every reason to believe he would see her again.  As difficult as is would have been for her to explain her injuries, and as difficult as it would have been for him to hear this from his mother, it would have better for him to know that, if medical remedies didn't work, she would need to be killed to keep from turning.  

 

As it stands now, he might very well think that his dad and dad's new squeeze just killed his mother to get her out of the way, and there are no other witnesses to say otherwise.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Ohwell

[Yolapukka]

 

As it stands now, he might very well think that his dad and dad's new squeeze just killed his mother to get her out of the way, and there are no other witnesses to say otherwise.

 

Well as far as I'm concerned they did just that very thing. They didn't try to talk her out of dying at that very moment to instead have meaningful time with her son or literally enjoy a last sunset. That would have meant the inconvenience of sitting vigil with her. I can't see Madison being up for that, she's too ruthless and selfish. Travis is too spineless to do anything other than go along with them after expressing a weak protest. 

[Ohwell]

Travis and Madison were all "let's kill her now before we get on the yacht." 

 

I want them and the rest of these assholes to think they're going to get on that damn yacht and for Strand to screw them all over somehow, sail off into the sunset and meet some new characters.   I'd like to see Strand again and I'd like for Chris to somehow survive, but I'm done with the rest of this crew. 

 

Yeah, I know none of this is going to happen.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Ohwell

[Brooke0707]

Liza told Daniel how to care for Ofelia, and she told Chris she loved him. She knew first-hand (from the infirmary and from Dr. Exner) what would happen to her: "I've seen what it does. The bites don't turn you, but the infection's not treatable. The infection kills you like anything else. Then it happens. It doesn't matter how you die, you come back. We all come back. Don't let that happen to me. Don't let our son see that, okay? "

Unlike most of the other characters, Liza (and Dr. Exner) gave important information to the others. I personally couldn't fault anyone for suiciding out of the ZA—least of all someone who's been bitten and might kill her own child.

 

I don't consider telling Chris she loves him to be anything resembling a goodbye and I don't think Chris did either hence his utter shock and horror when finding his mother's dead body.  I know that she took care of patients for a week or two.  It still doesn't make me think that everyone would think that there is absolutely no solution, that no one is immune to this virus, and that she would want to kill herself before she even got flu symptoms.  We're two weeks into this - I don't think all of human hope would be gone yet.  She doesn't want to turn - okay that is understandable.  But, she had time to explain to everyone what was happening, including her son.  If this was about not hurting him, I think it hurt him much more to hear a gunshot and for him to find his mother's dead body on the beach.  I think it probably hurt him much more to think of his dad killing his mom.  She had an hour to spare to at least tell Chris what was happening.  

A scratch? There was a set of bite marks -- four upper, four lower -- on Liza's right side after she had to fight off a zombie during their escape.

Okay, my bad.  I watched the episode once and when she pulled her shirt up, it just didn't look that bad honestly.  It looked like a scratch.  Not like when the zombies take a chunk out of someone's arm or something.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Brooke0707

[raven]

 

She had an hour to spare to at least tell Chris what was happening.

And she chose not to.  Maybe she gave up after what she'd seen.  I don't blame Madison or Travis either; they don't know how fast she'll turn.  I think Travis would look at it as fulfilling her last wish; to drag it out, to argue with her, would prolong her suffering and Chris's. They are all in emotional shock.  It wasn't particularly emotional for me because I hadn't built up any investment in Liza, but I don't think it was a heinous act or anything. 

 

 

They are okay with killing thousands of people for the off chance they can find Nick and Griselda?

Who are the thousands of people?  Most of LA is gone.  Daniel released the zombies - it was his plan - and though I don't think he cared about collateral damage, I don't see why he wouldn't have thought the soldiers could hold them off.  Besides, they (Daniel, Travis, etc) knew the soldiers were going to leave; best to try now when they at least think their family members are in the compound.  I just don't see it as an overtly evil act - unlike Strand, who can blithely walk by people begging for help because they don't have anything to offer him. 

 

I would be more surprised if they had a perfectly conceptualized plan with no risk to themselves or anyone else.  Except for Daniel, these are teachers, students, etc., people who've never been in a crisis situation - drug problems and divorce, that seems to be it.  For me, it's about do I find their actions believable in the context of the story, which I do.  I don't have to like all of them, and I don't on original WD either.

 

WRT to the yacht, I don't want them cooped up on it with no one to talk to but each other.  It would make more sense to me that they would try to find some kind of civilzation or encampments; I'd like to see what's going on elsewhere.  TWD often feels claustrophic, I hope FTWD will open things up a bit.

Edited October 11, 2015 by raven

[Brooke0707]

And she chose not to.  Maybe she gave up after what she'd seen.  I don't blame Madison or Travis either; they don't know how fast she'll turn.  I think Travis would look at it as fulfilling her last wish; to drag it out, to argue with her, would prolong her suffering and Chris's. They are all in emotional shock.  It wasn't particularly emotional for me because I hadn't built up any investment in Liza, but I don't think it was a heinous act or anything. 

 

Who are the thousands of people?  Most of LA is gone.  Daniel released the zombies - it was his plan - and though I don't think he cared about collateral damage, I don't see why he wouldn't have thought the soldiers could hold them off.  Besides, they (Daniel, Travis, etc) knew the soldiers were going to leave; best to try now when they at least think their family members are in the compound.  I just don't see it as an overtly evil act - unlike Strand, who can blithely walk by people begging for help because they don't have anything to offer him. 

 

I would be more surprised if they had a perfectly conceptualized plan with no risk to themselves or anyone else.  Except for Daniel, these are teachers, students, etc., people who've never been in a crisis situation - drug problems and divorce, that seems to be it.  For me, it's about do I find their actions believable in the context of the story, which I do.  I don't have to like all of them, and I don't on original WD either.

 

WRT to the yacht, I don't want them cooped up on it with no one to talk to but each other.  It would make more sense to me that they would try to find some kind of civilzation or encampments; I'd like to see what's going on elsewhere.  TWD often feels claustrophic, I hope FTWD will open things up a bit.

 

Yeah, she chose not to and that's what makes me think she was in that moment acting like a shitty person.  I don't think she was evil, but certainly I do think she made a really bad and selfish decision as a mother.  The whole thing was very rushed in my view - like they wanted to add something dramatic for the end because it wouldn't be exciting enough for us without any deaths.

 

All of the people at the base for one - they are innocents, just like Grismelda and Nick.  And Salazar basically guaranteed their deaths to maybe save his wife who likely had no chance of surviving her injuries.  But, it is in character for him, so I'll give the writers that.  He has tortured people before - I think he is supposed to be a bad person.  And then the zombies will presumably continue on their way, looking for others to kill.  Even if I am to buy the BS from the writers that LA went from millions of people to a couple thousand in a week (where are the bodies or zombies?), they have shown us that there are pockets of life.  Still a crappy thing to unleash all of the zombies when they will likely kill and destroy, and may eventually walk their way to places where there is human life.

[raven]

 

All of the people at the base for one - they are innocents, just like Grismelda and Nick.

And who knows what would happen to them when the military took off?  I thought the military plan was to kill the sick ones and take off. 

 

To me, it would have been more unrealistic if, in what the group viewed as a crisis situation, Salazar was thinking "well Griselda's probably dead anyway, why bother" or if they were worrying about other possible pockets of people.  They had to have a narrow focus IMO. 

 

From a storytelling perspective, for me it gave me a sense of what they would do when desperate; would it be stepping up or the actions of a bunch of cold hearted bastards. I like that the decisions cause debate.  I can def see your point about Liza, which makes me think if she had had someone who really cared about her as a person, not Mom or ex-wife, would they have stood up to her?  Did she feel just feel alone, desperate, have a weak moment and give in?  Yes, I'm probably giving this too much thought :)

[GreyBunny]

Okay, after watching the spectacular season 6 premiere of the mothership show, Fear the Walking Dead can go fuck itself.  Seriously, it's a load of horseshit that needs to get mucked out of the AMC stall and buried in a deep pit far away from humanity.  I'm not going to bother with season 2 of Fear.  At all.  Good riddance.

[peach]

Okay, after watching the spectacular season 6 premiere of the mothership show, Fear the Walking Dead can go fuck itself.  Seriously, it's a load of horseshit that needs to get mucked out of the AMC stall and buried in a deep pit far away from humanity.  I'm not going to bother with season 2 of Fear.  At all.  Good riddance.

 

I'm revising my opinion.  If they want to grab up some fast cash with this crap show, and spend it ON The Real Walking Dead, I'm good with it.  I still don't want to watch it, though.  lol  But every missing zombie on Fear might equal another zombie for the good show?

[Jack Kerouac]

Okay, after watching the spectacular season 6 premiere of the mothership show, Fear the Walking Dead can go fuck itself.  Seriously, it's a load of horseshit that needs to get mucked out of the AMC stall and buried in a deep pit far away from humanity.  I'm not going to bother with season 2 of Fear.  At all.  Good riddance.

 

Ha! Awesome. Felt the exact same way after watching the Season 6 premiere of the mothership. FTWD just sucks, so hard.

[HalcyonDays]

Hey Everyone!

 

Since this thread is supposed to be for specific episode 6 discussion, and we've have lots of time between season, I've got two new threads for you to discuss the show in!

 

Season 2 Wish List - Plot and Zombies Please? - What you would like to see in season 2, your wish list, but with NO spoilers.

Season 2 - Spoilers and Speculation - What you think will happen and want to see, based on spoilers you've read about.

 

Thanks!!

[AnnaMayWong]

So, yeah. That was a finale. THANK GOD!

I guess I can stop hate watching this turd of a show and move on to TWD. Although I do get to snark on what was an anti-climactic climax to this mini season.

Salazar wanted to kill his army hostage because he's tell his buddies and the family would get in trouble? Who's Andy going to tell? His group is a speck on the horizon watching their looted TV with no electricity and no broadcasts. If nothing else demonstrated that this "family" is a group of self-centered assholes, it had to have been leaving the compound gate wide open when they left for the medical facility. Well, that and Salazar unleashing 2000 zombies on the medical facility was pretty over the top as diversions go. I do have to say that bitten soldier running into the helicopter blades was a nice nod to the original Dawn of the Dead.

So, the group leaves the 2 youngest members behind with no weapons and minimal instruction. "If we don't come back, leave." Um, so how long should they wait? An hour, 2, 3?? Could you narrow it down a bit? Remember a big ka-boom is arriving a 0900 to blow up the facility.

Again, we get to see just how EVIL the military is. They steal the SUV so they can get the hell out of the facility before the zombies eat everyone, time is of the essence! But of course there's always time for attempted rape and a good ole 3 on 1 beatdown of a teenager. Was I the only one that found the scene of the Dr. on the walkie talkie asking when the EVIL military was going to pick her up? She's watching the copter fly away as the military guy is saying "Um, stand by, uh, we're uh reassessing, um yeah, that's it." I kept waiting for the Dr. to say back, "I'm standing RIGHT HERE motherfucker! I can see your ass flying away!"

How did junkie boy become such a proficient pickpocket that he lifted the cell key off of Strand? Why were there so many zombies in the kitchen area of the facility? Did they all die of food poisoning? Why didn't they try to convince the Dr. to come with them? She would have been a big help because these jackasses are always getting hurt somehow. Liza getting bitten sucked, but she was bitter and snarky up to the end when she asked Maddie to shoot her "because it would BREAK Travis" . *Snerk*

The ending shots of Travis & Maddie doing a bad From Here to Eternity scene, the panoramic scan of the house., the yacht and the empty ocean... just so cheezy. I had to watch the Talking Dead to see how Hardwick was gonna play up this show - he did what he could. Can't polish a turd, can ya? The guy who played Travis had a kiwi accent? I guess we now know most of his concentration went into sounding american rather than focusing on his acting. Not sure what the actress playing Madison's excuse was.

Too good! Too funny! ON POINT and Marvelous!

[Spiraling]

I'm still so mad that Liza's gone because that's exactly what Madison wanted.  And Travis might be grieving but Liza out of the picture makes it a lot easier for him too.  Turd.

I am extremely late to the party (DVDs just came out in France), but during that last scene Madison was like, "Hey, it's just us now, baby!" Dislike.