The Path - General Discussion

[sjohnson]

The doctor was not engaged in illegal trafficking. 

Cal hasn't been hunting Allison down like a dog, but hunting her like a person who stole $40 000. 

Mary seducing another person for drugs should have given pause to any view of her as just a victim. 

It's one thing to not want to see Ashley as a random blob of sentimentality rather than a glorious modern-day Juliet. But I can't see why you want to insist on adding things that just aren't on screen. Especially when you seem to get offended when reminded of things that are. 

Maybe crazy cults are built on lies, but perfectly respectable religions are built on lies too. As near as I can tell, Mormons are widely regarded as more respectable Christians than theological liberals who aren't committed to the literal truth of Bible stories. You can of course watch this show with a double standard but I can't figure out why you would want to. 

[PamelaMaeSnap]

I apologize in advance for a few thoughts that may jumble up some of the episodes but I bingewatched 2-7 yesterday (I fell asleep midway through Episode 2 three times in a row so watched during the day). 

Am I the only one who thinks that the cousin (Joy?) isn't spying on Hawk but rather is in love with him and therefore jealous of his relationship with Ashley and trying to destroy it? Intermarriage among cousins certainly doesn't seem something that would be frowned upon among these folks.  In fact it's probably encouraged. I'm betting a lot of the teens are officially or unofficially contracted to one another by their parents early on.

Where did redheaded nurse come from? I don't remember her AT ALL until the scene where "poor sweet" Mary clearly knows exactly what tact she has to take to get the drugs from this girl.  Her using sex for whatever she wants/needs is almost enough to make me wonder if her story about her dad is at least partly hogwash (he's so disgusting that I can't totally disbelieve that he's a d*&kwad, but she's not exactly the believable witness to me anymore either).

Okay, I may have TOTALLY been reading/projecting something here but ... in the scene where Abe "earns" his Path T-shirt and takes off his own shirt to don the new one, we see at least one tattoo (looked like a marijuana leaf but am sure it was not given his job) and the girl giving the shirt to him (the pregnant Asian woman, don't know her name) eyeing him ... not sure if she was checking him out because that was a not-too-bad body OR if he might have some tattoo that gives away who he is/what he does and he forgot about it and she caught it and is on to his game.  Or I may just be reading WAY too much into that scene.

Read yesterday that they've already re-upped for Season 2 and that Sean will be promoted to a lead character (in opening credits) so guessing that a) he's not going to be relegated to Milton, Delaware, and never seen again and b) we may get more of his storyline before the end of Episode 10. The story about his sister and friends being murdered in a school shooting was so brief but heartwrenching. I look forward to more from him but preferably WITHOUT Mary.

[sjohnson]

Joy hate is a flip side to Ashley adoration, I think. It's not so much what's actually on screen but that she's interfering with a private fantasy of True Love. And yes, it is very likely Joy has feelings for Hawk. Stronger feelings I think than Ashley does. 

I feel sorry for Mary. I hesitate to condemn her for using people, especially if her version is the complete truth, which I believe it is. She may not be poor sweet Mary but I think she is poor Mary. Maybe forgiving characters for not being perfect is unsatisfying in a meller about heroes versus villains, but it's not like there are any real consequences if we do, are there? The child sexual abuse is a little overworked in movies and TV but God knows it does happen. And the nurse came out of nowhere because she was nobody to Mary until she was useful.

Cal will likely bring Sean back to try to please Mary. I thought he was surprised to hear that she was so committed (if she truly is, she may not really know herself?)

Edited May 8, 2016 by sjohnson

[Guest]

13 hours ago, PamelaMaeSnap said:

Am I the only one who thinks that the cousin (Joy?) isn't spying on Hawk but rather is in love with him and therefore jealous of his relationship with Ashley and trying to destroy it?

I think she's just been raised to believe that watching and tattling is the right thing to do.  

Why do you take two Mormons fishing?   Because if you only take one he'll drink all your beer.  

[MaryPatShelby]

I just watched the second episode, not 2 hours ago, and I don't remember a generator scene.  Was it in one of the tornadoes?  Help???

[PamelaMaeSnap]

3 hours ago, sjohnson said:

Joy hate is a flip side to Ashley adoration, I think. It's not so much what's actually on screen but that she's interfering with a private fantasy of True Love. And yes, it is very likely Joy has feelings for Hawk. Stronger feelings I think than Ashley does. 

I feel sorry for Mary. I hesitate to condemn her for using people, especially if her version is the complete truth, which I believe it is. She may not be poor sweet Mary but I think she is poor Mary. Maybe forgiving characters for not being perfect is unsatisfying in a meller about heroes versus villains, but it's not like there are any real consequences if we do, are there? The child sexual abuse is a little overworked in movies and TV but God knows it does happen. And the nurse came out of nowhere because she was nobody to Mary until she was useful.

Cal will likely bring Sean back to try to please Mary. I thought he was surprised to hear that she was so committed (if she truly is, she may not really know herself?)

All points well taken and good to consider.  It will be interesting to see if indeed Cal brings back Sean to please Mary or if instead next season brings us a storyline that veers from "region" to "region" rather than just the upstate site.  I wouldn't be surprised, instead, if indeed Cal makes Mary his ... well, whatever it would be for the presumptive nominee (LOL) to have a First Lady.  And if the news about that is what ties Sean's story in as another main plotline in some way.

I'm not "unforgiving" of Mary for not being perfect, just curious to see where all of this is going with her and if we'll see more layers of her (I think we already are). 

I still have a strong suspicion that there is more than just nosy meddling and prying re: Joy vs. Hawk.  Though we haven't seen it addressed specifically, there certainly seems to be plenty of intermarrying of members and though I'm not saying they're not there, we haven't really SEEN many members of that age (Joy and Hawk) and who are offspring of members, probably because it hasn't been around long enough for that generation to be of marrying age.

[sjohnson]

One reason I agree about Joy is her many opportunities to rat out Hawk long before a big crisis. To my eyes nothing Hawk/Ashley is written very well but Hawk didn't seem to be acting as if he knew Joy was an habitual tattletale.

Edited May 8, 2016 by sjohnson

[Guest]

21 hours ago, PamelaMaeSnap said:

 Though we haven't seen it addressed specifically, there certainly seems to be plenty of intermarrying of members 

What makes it seem that way?  I haven't noticed any hints of intermarrying family members but I also didn't realize the Asian family was the other family's in-laws until I asked here.  I would be a little surprised if this cult went that way because it's so outside of acceptable behavior and it seems like their goal is to grow from recruitment moreso than from procreation. 

[PamelaMaeSnap]

I guess it's possible that members were already married when they joined ... and I'm guessing also that it hasn't been around long enough for it to become "tradition" or anything ... but it seems that, say, Jason and Allison, both members, were married ... obviously Eddie and Sarah are married ... Sean and Mary seemed to be on the way to marrying and obviously they didn't join together ... Sarah's parents, both members, are married so she was either born into the group or the whole family joined (and Tessa is dead to them since she left) ... And they're clearly NOT supportive of their kids dating IS or whatever they're called, so what other option is there other than to marry other members?

I'm not implying there is incestuous behavior ... just that I am inferring that marrying another member is strongly encouraged.

Also, speaking of Tessa ... I don't know if it was coincidence or not, but found it interesting that in the scene where Sarah goes to track her down, you see a group of Hasidim walking down the street ... another group that sits shiva for family members who leave the religion, much like Tessa is "dead" to her family.

[Guest]

Oh!  I misunderstood.  I thought you meant they encouraged marrying like cousins and stuff.  Sorry.  Within the cult, I totally agree.  

[PamelaMaeSnap]

I can totally see where I was NOT clear ... and I also agree that may be part of why they want to bring in so much new blood, to be fruitful and multiply more Meyerists!

[Boilergal]

Water births creep me out - so I wasn't really excited about that whole thing.  But glad the baby survived.

Eddie and Hawk will be super bonded by the end of their walk.  I wish Eddie would open up to someone about his doubts!  Hopefully Eddie sees what Hawk has missed out on- and there are good people out in the world and helps him move on from the cult into society.  Loved Eddie's emotion at the boardwalk - thinking about his time there.  Not sure about using their last $22 on crab rolls - but I have a feeling they will be taken care of.

I'm really torn about the whole cult thing - to me it doesn't seem all that different from any religion - symbolism, routines, practices, memorization, leaders and followers, corruption, greed, agendas and cover-ups.  I guess the one difference would be that they chose to cut themselves off from society - however, there are a lot of religions where the congregants keep their fellowship mainly within their denomination/church - but I guess not to the point of seclusion in their own compound.   

Cal is a jerk - and Sarah is a hypocrite!!!  I wanted one of her daughters to walk in and catch her kissing Cal. 

There's only 2 episodes left - it doesn't really feel like there's a clear path to take us to the end of the season  (i make me laugh)

[formerlyfreedom]

Sarah meets with Alison Kemp after discovering Eddie’s burner phone. Eddie and Hawk return home, and Sarah confronts Eddie about his crisis of faith. Cal asks Sarah to be his second- in-command. Someone from the organization’s past returns.

[Blue Plastic]

I also didn't realize who any of those other people were, like Joy or even Sarah's parents and brother, until I looked here.  They kind of just act like random people instead of Sarah's family.

Hawk seems to have been a good little Meyerist robot until now, so he might not have had a reason to know Joy would rat him out before.  She acts older than Hawk to me, very set in her ways and one note, so it didn't even occur to me that she's supposed to be close in age and interested in him.

Edited May 12, 2016 by Blue Plastic
correct

[Blue Plastic]

Cal is such a POS and Sarah has the nerve to be mad at Eddie for adultery when he is innocent and she is actually the unfaithful one herself.  I'm so tired of Eddie not defending himself.

So Eddie had a vision of his brother again. So what did it mean?  Vision Brother didn't do much

[Dot Com]

What does POS mean? 

[Miknna]

Is anyone else getting distracted by the lack of continuity with the seasons? Last week they were still surrounded by fiery leaves but it was supposedly December in upstate New York. This week Hawk and Eddie are bundled for the cold and their walk reflects winter- but when we flip back to scenes of Sarah and Eddies home the trees are green and full and there's flowers hanging on their porch. Arbitrary details I'm sure, but I still can't help noticing. 

2 hours ago, Dot Com said:

What does POS mean? 

Piece of shit 

[Enero]

17 hours ago, Boilergal said:

I'm really torn about the whole cult thing - to me it doesn't seem all that different from any religion - symbolism, routines, practices, memorization, leaders and followers, corruption, greed, agendas and cover-ups.  I guess the one difference would be that they chose to cut themselves off from society - however, there are a lot of religions where the congregants keep their fellowship mainly within their denomination/church - but I guess not to the point of seclusion in their own compound.   

 

 

Agreed. There are some things about the religion that seem to be okay i.e. how focused they seem to be on inner peace and how they genuinely want to help people and do good. The problem, like with all religion is the people (and with any organization that's attempting to reach a common goal). People are inherently flawed and thus corruptible. 

 

Quote

Cal is a jerk - and Sarah is a hypocrite!!!  I wanted one of her daughters to walk in and catch her kissing Cal.

 

Yes. Cal is a POS ass. But, to be fair she did stop the make out session. That said, how is cheating a regression but falling off the wagon numerous times and going on a binder not be? Now that is being a hypocrite. Cal can't lead in his state, which makes me think that Sarah will eventually step into the role of leader, considering all she's done lately. I wonder how Cal will take that, probably not so well. 

6 hours ago, Blue Plastic said:

 

So Eddie had a vision of his brother again. So what did it mean?  Vision Brother didn't do much

I think it means that he is meant to take a different path i.e. leave the Movement. If it weren't for his wife and kids I think he would've left the Movement after returning from Peru.  I'm enjoying his walk with Hawk though. I hope it leads somewhere interesting.

Lastly, I'm concerned about the cop. His response to his boss turning the case over to Homeland Security was over the top. His reaction seems to go beyond him not wanting to lose a case. I think he's becoming attached to the Movement and with the case being taken from him he will no longer has an excuse to go there. Whether he realizes his investigation has turned personal or not, is up for debate though. 

I just caught up on this show. It's not the best thing on streaming but so far it's engaging. I want to see were they're going with it. 

Edited May 12, 2016 by Enero

[Blue Plastic]

6 hours ago, Enero said:

Agreed. There are some things about the religion that seem to be okay i.e. how focused they seem to be on inner peace and how they genuinely want to help people and do good. The problem, like with all religion is the people (and with any organization that's attempting to reach a common goal). People are inherently flawed and thus corruptible. 

 

 

Yes. Cal is a POS ass. But, to be fair she did stop the make out session. That said, how is cheating a regression but falling off the wagon numerous times and going on a binder not be? Now that is being a hypocrite. Cal can't lead in his state, which makes me think that Sarah will eventually step into the role of leader, considering all she's done lately. I wonder how Cal will take that, probably not so well. 

I think it means that he is meant to take a different path i.e. leave the Movement. If it weren't for his wife and kids I think he would've left the Movement after returning from Peru.  I'm enjoying his walk with Hawk though. I hope it leads somewhere interesting.

Lastly, I'm concerned about the cop. His response to his boss turning the case over to Homeland Security was over the top. His reaction seems to go beyond him not wanting to lose a case. I think he's becoming attached to the Movement and with the case being taken from him he will no longer has an excuse to go there. Whether he realizes his investigation has turned personal or not, is up for debate though. 

I think you have a good point about the cop.  I've been thinking he seems to like attending events at the Meyerist compound and they kinda telegraphed it with one of his kids being sick - maybe he will decide the religion can heal his child.

How is Eddie going to leave even if Vision Brother tells him to?  He's not going to want to leave his wife and kids. Maybe just be and Hawk will end up leaving. I forgot to say I do like that Eddie and Hawk went on the walk together.

What is up with that creepy figurine?  That and the Peruvian drugs don't seem to fit with the rest of the religion as presented so far IMO.

Edited May 12, 2016 by Blue Plastic
To correct

[Guest]

My daughter watched a documentary on Netflix (The Source Family) about some cult and said the 'leader saved the stillborn baby' thing was also in that.  

Not much else to comment on.  I wish something would happen.  

I'm guessing the $22 clam roll lunch decision is going to bite them in the ass.   How far do they have to walk?  150 miles?  They could do that in 5-6 days, I think, so I doubt they'll starve.  Exposure seems like a real issue, though.  

[Dot Com]

25 minutes ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

 

I'm guessing the $22 clam roll lunch decision is going to bite them in the   How far do they heave to walk?  150 miles?  They could do that in 5-6 days, I think, so I doubt they'll starve.  Exposure seems like a real issue, though.  

The walk is supposed to be 250 miles. They went a bit off course because of the ride they took. So I assume the trip will be longer than 250 miles in the long run. 

The baby was born with her umbilical cord around her neck. Sarah quickly removed it, looked like it was pretty loose to me. 

So in episodes 1-6 people are always barging in on Cal in his office and home. They just waltz right in. Then he kills someone (which I don't think he meant to do) and the body sits in the living room and no one comes to see him. He just missed this big important vote that he called for and no one went to check on him? Not even his bff Sarah? 

[sjohnson]

Yes. I'm afraid there's just no way to explain this except arbitrary writing. And the same problem may apply to Silas' disappearance. My guess is that he was up to no good or he would have just walked in and told everybody what he said to Cal. But he didn't want to close up shop before he looted the store I think. So I can believe he didn't tell anybody what he was up to. (Especially if he was the one who murdered Jason Kemp. If Kemp was murdered it wasn't Cal.) The thing about that is, how did Cal know that Silas didn't walk through the front gate? If Hugh Dancy is in the second season, he needs a way to get away with it. If Silas did murder Jason Kemp, there's a reason for Silas to disappear completely besides foul play.

If the show does apologetics about how religions are only bad if bad people inexplicably take over, then it requires that Cal be painted in the blackest of hues, with magical abilities to overcome the natural goodness of religious people. The murder of Silas may be an irreparable turn into silliness for the sake of melodrama or histrionics. 

There are many good things about the Hawk/Eddie walkabout. But despite appearances Eddie isn't opening up to Hawk about much of anything, beyond a confession that he worships Sarah. (Also, Hawk should have had enough of his Christian classmates to know that he can't put too much stock in a couple of ostentatiously Christian people doing a kindness to people they almost certainly assume are Christian, or from its respectable progenitor.)

Edited May 13, 2016 by sjohnson

[PamelaMaeSnap]

12 hours ago, sjohnson said:

(Also, Hawk should have had enough of his Christian classmates to know that he can't put too much stock in a couple of ostentatiously Christian people doing a kindness to people they almost certainly assume are Christian, or from its respectable progenitor.)

Not that this is a huge issue, but I think it's more than likely that that the "ostentatiously Christian" couple was Jewish.  Brighton Beach is known as "little Odessa" for it's long-standing Russian/Ukraine population, the majority of which are Russian Jews (I think I read they made up about 80% of the population there). 

[sjohnson]

Russian/Ukrainian Jews talk about the Christian thing to do? Was that irony that went over my head?

[ElsbethTascioni]

I'm getting really sick and tired of Cal. He goes on drinking benders, violence bender, murders someone, and somehow no one really notices or cares enough to do something about it. Id Sarah is so devout, she would insist that Cal go through some reprogramming, or whatever they do with people who "fall off The Path".

[PamelaMaeSnap]

My bad ... I totally missed the comment about "the Christian thing to do" ... at least I'm not alone, though ... Hubby also thought they were Russian Jews. I guess we got distracted by the shiny Brighton Beach reference. Thanks for the correction!

[Dot Com]

3 hours ago, PamelaMaeSnap said:

My bad ... I totally missed the comment about "the Christian thing to do" ... at least I'm not alone, though ... Hubby also thought they were Russian Jews. I guess we got distracted by the shiny Brighton Beach reference. Thanks for the correction!

They sounded Russian so I guess they were Russian Christians. 

[MaryPatShelby]

On ‎4‎/‎16‎/‎2016 at 6:43 PM, ToxicUnicorn said:

 

This woman seemed to come out of nowhere, I had no context for her other than what she said.  How does she know Eddie?  Did Eddie ever tell her he would help her and then change his mind?  I must have missed something.

 

After Jesse/Eddie got back from Peru in the first episode, he was disillusioned (due to his vision, probably?) and started googling "is Meyerism real" or similar.  That led him to a want ad of sorts inviting people who questioned Meyerism to call a phone number, which he did, which led to him meeting the blond woman in a motel room late at night (a couple times I think, and one of the times his wife followed him).  The blond had gotten out of Meyerism, and at first seemed to want to assist others in seeing it for what it really was and in getting out.  Now, at least to me, her motivations seem murkier, with the talk about her husband and her insistence that Eddie continue to help her.

[millennium]

I could watch an entire series about Hawk and Eddie on the road, just walking and talking.

The rest of it is so much bullshit.  Compared to Eddie's crisis of faith and wrestling with regret, and Hawk's innocence shining through the prison walls of propaganda, Cal seems like nothing but a cardboard, generic villain who could be on any show.  Eddie's wife is an idiot, her parents are morons, and the junkie girl inspires not even a molecule of sympathy or concern.

Great setting at Coney Island.

[sjohnson]

Agree that melodramatic villainy markers (aka mustache twirling) are covering up any real personality for Cal. But I have to disagree that innocence markers aren't doing the same for Hawk. The power of True Love to lead electricity to the beloved without troubling with wires isn't really characterization in my opinion. 

[ToxicUnicorn]

Quote

and started googling "is Meyerism real" or similar.  That led him to a want ad of sorts inviting people who questioned Meyerism to call a phone number, which he did, which led to him meeting the blond woman in a motel room late at night

Ah, thank you very much, MaryPatShelby.  Somehow I missed all that, but it makes perfect sense.  Eddie is much more interesting when he's questioning Meyerism.  I don't think we know how he got started in the first place - the way he and his wife go at it, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it were simply for the sex.  (I guess I don't feel as if any of these characters are very complex.)

[Guest]

Sarah was raised in it, I think, and Eddie was sucked in kind of like Mary Cox-- after losing his brother as a teen orphan(?) and having no one else to turn to, the cult found him and took him in.  The typical "preying on the weak" strategy.

[sjohnson]

I would be so much more impressed with Eddie if he'd said that his fifteen year old doesn't get kicked out of his home. Eddie's assurance that no Christian really believes the more exotic stuff is bullshit. There is no gathering of religious leaders that couldn't be reproached in exactly the same terms Eddie uses. The thing is, when Eddie thinks that "Sam" needs to believe in his child, that's exactly what he says he rejects. Also, alas, not being a great believer in the proposition that young love is the only true love, Eddie's outrage that Hawk doesn't end up on the streets with Ashley just didn't hit me as wise and good parenting.

Silas has disappeared and no one but Sarah has noticed? I rationalize this as Bill and Felicia being too busy stealing the silverware to pay attention, but the sad truth is, that's just desperation. There's slow burn, and there's pause button. 

If Cal were properly ambitious, he would have Sarah as #3. The sensible power seeker has the unimaginative, routine administrator loyalist as #2, so that the #2 isn't a threat. Then the ambitious, charismatic #3 threatens the #2, not the leader. (A little like Cal being put right below the Silas/Bill/Felicia trio,)

Burns on the hand suggest someone using a torch of some kind to make him break his grip so that he fell off the mountain. Cause of death is indeed falling off the mountain. However, Alison Kemp's attempted suicide strongly suggests that she has been convinced either that Jason did kill himself (in despair over his failure to save Steve?) or that she'll never be able to make a case against suicide. Her entrance into the compound really smells like a further melodramatic turn to her attempted assassination of Cal. 

1 minute ago, sjohnson said:

 

Edited May 18, 2016 by sjohnson

[formerlyfreedom]

Eddie faces exile after his crisis of faith is discovered by The Movement. Cal delivers the final three rungs of The Ladder to the congregation, while Sarah learns a dark secret about The Movement. Eddie, seeking answers, travels to Peru where he uncovers a shocking truth.

[mediawhore]

The fact that Silas' body hasn't been discovered by a hunter with a dog or just a dog out with it's owner is mindnumpingly stupid. Upstate New York is not a great place for dumping bodies. Too many people, too many hunters...just too much. So idiotic.

Eddie just needs to leave with Hawk. End of story. There is nothing that can make me believe that Eddie could possibly love Sarah after the death looks she's been throwing at him for the past two or three episodes. If the writers don't take Eddie and Hawk out of the cult, this show loses what little credibility it has.

A show about a cult could have been really good but Jessica Goldstein and the other writers didn't create that show. This show is just boring, draggy and illogical.

[Enero]

3 hours ago, mediawhore said:

Eddie just needs to leave with Hawk. End of story. 

Agreed. After calling everyone prisoners and punching Cal, how can he possibly stay there, especially if he's not willing to go through reprogramming? If he's still living at the compound next episode that would be completely unbelievable and grounds to drop this show.

Sarah annoyed the hell out of me this episode. I can understand her anger at Eddie for not talking Hawk out of leaving as well as her being upset over discovering Eddie's doubts, but her crying on Cal's shoulders asking him to help her as if she had no idea what to do (which she obviously didn't) was ridiculous. The first thing she should've thought of was going to talk to Ashley, and laying it all out there about him losing his family and when that didn't work then I could see her pulling in Cal. The way it played out with her crying on Cal's shoulders and using his attraction to her to get him to help made me dislike her intensely.  Speaking of the Ashley situation, it's great that Cal is giving them a house to stay in for 18 months, but what happens after enough time has gone by for the bond to have dissolved between her and Hawk? Will Cal then kick them out on the street? And how was it explained to her mother that they now have a fully furnished home to live in rent free?

Something else that bugged, Sarah and Eddie attempting to pick up broken glass with their bare hands, then proceeding to have sex on the same floor where the glass had been broken and mind you was still on the floor and had not been swept up. SMH. Also, are all these sex scenes they're having supposed to show how despite their problems they love each other passionately? If so, I'm just not feeling it. The sex seems more random than meaningful to me. 

8 hours ago, sjohnson said:

Silas has disappeared and no one but Sarah has noticed? I rationalize this as Bill and Felicia being too busy stealing the silverware to pay attention, but the sad truth is, that's just desperation. There's slow burn, and there's pause button. 

 

I agree. Especially now that Cal has announced that Steven has completed  the rungs. Why wouldn't everyone i.e. Billy, Felicia and Silas not be there for that announcement? And if Steven is coming to the compound, why would Cal need to tell Sarah that he (Steve) wants her to help him (Cal) facilitate the next phase in the movement? Shouldn't someone be questioning how convenient it is that none of the other leaders are there when Cal announces that he's slated to take over?

I think Alison's return was the only thing interesting that happened in this episode along with the autopsy report for her husband. At first I thought she was returning to the compound because she had an epiphany while standing on the ice and found that the light saved her, but her brief hesitance to enter the gates makes me think she is up to something. 

I'm very disappointed the walk only lasted one episode. I was hoping it would have an impact on the characters and overall story. We already knew Eddie was having serious doubts and that Hawk was on his way out the door. Cal telling Sarah about Allison was inevitable. Eddie didn't need to go on a walk for that to happen. 

Edited May 19, 2016 by Enero

[ElsbethTascioni]

This episode really killed whatever interest I had in the show. The list of things that annoy me is growing, rapidly. How has no one noticed that Silas is missing? These people are so far up in each others' business, how can they not know that he's gone? Same with Cal and his drinking. How does no one know that Steve is dying, and has been dying for a long time? Aren't there people who actually do the caretaking for him? Don't Bill & Felicia ever drop by? I don't understand why Eddie would go to Sarah's parents for help when they shunned their own daughter, umm...hello Eddie, where do you think Sarah learned her tactics? I also don't understand why he wouldn't help Hawk find a place to stay at least. Couldn't he take him to Sarah's sister? As much as these things annoy me, my ultimate BEC is Sarah. What a horrible person, self-righteous, hypocritical, mean spirited, ugh.

[Madding crowd]

This was a depressing episode. I really hate Sarah. She has a lot of nerve to be questioning Eddie about the truth when she was making out with Cal and letting him sleep in her son's bed while he was on the walk. Any religion which would force a parent to shun their teenager for choosing to stay in high school (and yes, I know Ashley is a part of it too), is a crappy religion. Eddie should take both his kids and run far away.

I don't really get what exact level Cal is supposed to be on. He appears to be the only one who visits Steve, he seems to be controlling the cult finances, yet people don't seem to really treat him like a leader. Sarah in particular, acts like he is accountable to her (well she acts like everyone is accountable to her). I still don't understand how their finances work either. Do all of the cult members get a salary? Sarah and Eddie have a pretty nice house with all of the usual furnishings. 

Also, these people swear a lot, don't seem to care about their kids beyond the brainwashing, and I guess its ok for Sarah to make out with Cal without being deprogrammed, but Eddie has to drink the green goo and be locked up for two weeks. And what the hell was that show Cal was at with the rich guy. Two women in costumes pointing toy guns at each other is entertainment. Weird. 

Edited May 19, 2016 by Madding crowd

[sjohnson]

Never really like Sarah but in her defense, it was Ashley and her mother who first made it perfectly clear that Hawk couldn't be with Ashley and be a Meyerist at the same time. Sarah is going to be furious that her son ditches his mother for a girl friend. Hawk was ditching Eddie too, but Eddie I think after his explanation of how he stuck with his lady love sort of committed himself to supporting his fifteen year old son leaving home for a girl friend. In particular, Eddie decking Cal for breaking up the great romance I think shows his total endorsement of Ashley/Hawk no matter what. Still not convinced that is wise and good on the character's part. Also, since I think Ashley/Hawk is very poorly conceived, making it the hill Eddie dies on is probably going to be a terrible disservice to the character. 

[PamelaMaeSnap]

My guess on what Jason's journal reveals is that he was the one who was actively doing the black-market drug dealing (the cancer drugs for Steve, maybe others based on what appears to be a well-stocked infirmary without a legit doctor doling them out).  If he was committed to the cult, he would have probably known (or been told) not to actually say THEY were doing it, but that he was doing it himself.

Then once they had the drugs and the money was shown to have been in/out of his account, they got rid of him so he couldn't tell tales later.

Too simplistic?

[jonesingjay]

On May 19, 2016 at 11:34 AM, PamelaMaeSnap said:

 

Too simplistic?

Sums up the show rather well.

I use to believe Cal was the villain of the piece. However, week after week, Sarah is giving Cal a run for the money and hasn't even committed murder...yet. 

Edited May 22, 2016 by jonesingjay

[millennium]

On 5/18/2016 at 5:55 PM, mediawhore said:

A show about a cult could have been really good but Jessica Goldstein and the other writers didn't create that show. This show is just boring, draggy and illogical.

There's a good show in here somewhere but damned if I can find it.   There are hints -- for example, my growing hatred of Sarah.   My anger at Eddie for being passive in the face of his wife's righteous cruelty (find your inner Pinkman already!) .  The sorrow I feel for Hawk being surrounded by fucknuts.  

Some of the cylinders are firing but it just won't rev.

Edited May 21, 2016 by millennium

[kelslamu]

I haven't gotten to this episode because I'm having a hard time even figuring out the plot of the show.  Okay, I guess I get the plot, but the way they are going about it made me quit on maybe the sixth episode in.  It has potential, but there is also a lot of believability problems.  Someone should wonder about their esteemed leader and in this day and age it would seem more than just Cal should be in touch with him.  I may watch more just to see if it gets any better, but not holding out much hope.  I wanted it to be good.

[Xcptnl]

Not a question but an observation. The tornado happened in Rindge NH.  The 'commune' is in NY.  Fbi guy is in NY.  But he visited Mary's father in the hospital and the father shows up as he was in the neighborhood at the fbi office. Rindge NH and mid state NY are hours away from each other.  Bugged me. :). And isn't the father a bit concerned the FBI guy will find out about his poor parenting to put it mildly?

[CofCinci]

I was hoping Dr. Meyer would appear to surprise Cal. 

[sjohnson]

Well, that was certainly unexpected. It's always a delight when there is a shocking twist that nevertheless is completely logical. So far as I can tell (but the series heavily relies on withholding key information long past the time it should have been revealed,) there was no reason for Silas' defection. If Meyer had fired Silas, why was he farting around with Cal? A phone call or Skype from Meyer would have terminated Cal, so it couldn't have been Meyer sending Silas to do the pink slipping. Even if for no obvious reason he did, he wouldn't have Silas sneak away from Peru, nor sneak into the NY compound. According to this episode, Felicia knows very well that Silas is missing. Leaping to the conclusion that Cal is involved implies that she knew Silas was covertly meeting with Cal, which by this time kind of makes an accessory after the fact. But it's not like she's committing to the new boss, since the old one is up and about. A surprise that is just pulled out of the collective asses of the writing room is not the best kind. 

On a more general level, giving Eddie a seeming miracle in his prayer for the baby is one thing, albeit one whose meaning I can't see. But that dead bird was far too specific an image to be anything but a commitment to the supernatural. So-called cults that really deliver on the supernatural are not only not cults, they would be more valid than so-called religions, none of which do. 

The scene talking about giving up custody of the kids if Eddie signed the denier paper does answer the question about whether it's policy to break up families. Unfortunately for claims to drama, that's not the way the real world works. If Tom Cruise can't just ignore divorce law for his kids, Sarah Lane can't. There have been cults that have prospered and even got away with lots of stuff because of government support but that's not the Movement in this series. (The recent movie Colonia, about a cult that acted as a torture center for the Pinochet coup is a real life example.)

As near as I can make out, the series' opting for the supernatural inadvertently asks whether Cal is the villain for trying to liberalize the movement, instead of that making him an anti-villain?

I don't know if I'll have the patience to see if the series digs itself out of the hole they seemed to have gotten into. 

PS If the series was really about how the true religion may not be what we expected, the show would have been genuinely provocative if they'd assigned the miracles to a real but unpopular religion or denomination.  Or should we just re-watch Daniel Benzali in the movie Believers?

Edited May 25, 2016 by sjohnson

[ElsbethTascioni]

It looks like they're setting Eddie up to be a true "prophet", since he's having all of these visions that lead him to find Steve alive and well. I'm assuming that next season will be Steve/Eddie vs. Sarah/Cal. It was an unexpected twist, but I don't know that it'll actually end up being good TV. It was nice to see Sarah showing some rational feelings after her family showed up.

[CofCinci]

It's hysterical that Sarah believes DaddyBadTouch's version of Cal's activity on the night Silas disappeared.

[Enero]

I guess I'm the only one who was NOT surprised that Eddie found Dr. Meyer alive. This episode was fairly predictable to me.

I also find it hilarious that Sarah would believe Mary's POS dad. Speaking of Mary, I'm sick of her. She walks around looking like she's half stoned or about to cry almost ALL the time. She finds a good man in Sean, but goes off and screws Cal because she needs to be held by someone who knows all her dark secrets i.e. that she gave him several blowjobs? Because I'm pretty sure Sean knows about her horrible upbringing and of course the drugs. 

Everyone keeps saying how charismatic Cal is.  Am I the only one who doesn't find him charismatic at all? The actor is descent but he's certainly no AP. 

How was Eddie able to live out of a hotel and travel to Peru? Was The Movement still funding him even though he'd left?

So I'm gathering from Felicia's conversation with Sarah that she (Felicia) thinks Cal did something to Silas. Yet no action is being taken against him. Everyone is going on with business as usual. OOkay. 

I agree with whoever that said Eddie will be the true prophet, which should be an exciting prospect. Unfortunately this show is just kind of dull. The stakes should feel much higher, which would create that sense of urgency and excitement the show is severely lacking. 

I don't know if I'll watch S2. I'm slightly intrigued by what's next now that Eddie has found Dr. Meyer alive, but I don't know if that's enough for me to continue watching. 

I will say that one thing the finale made VERY clear was how much Sarah and Cal deserve each other. 

Edited May 26, 2016 by Enero

[sjohnson]

^^^The show is so busy marking Cal as the evil evil that he's rarely ever not twitchy and reckless. (As Dr. DuMaurier called him...they hired Hugh Dancy to reprise Will Graham at his most neurotic.) The show has shown every normal decent human being wanting to avoid his very presence. The only time they've allowed him not be be creepy is when he was advocating for the refugees and for Alison Kemp. And with this last turn, it's pretty clear the show means that to be proof of the magnitude of his depravity, that he wants power *to change things*! The prospect of change is nearly unbearable to a certain type of mind, one very commonly found in the people running things like governments or corporations. Or maybe just a TV series?