Social Media and Behind the Scenes: AKA Everything Else Not "News and Media"

[tv echo]

More from The CW Upfronts...

TV upfronts: CBS promises Good Wife spinoff; the CW goes big on superheroes
Brian Moylan Thursday 19 May 2016 17.38 EDT
http://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2016/may/19/cbs-cw-tv-upfronts-good-wife-superheroes

Quote

The CW is now dedicating four of their 10 hours of original programing to shows adapted from DC Comics. That’s Supergirl on Monday, The Flash on Tuesday, Arrow on Wednesday, and Legends of Tomorrow on Thursday. And then, on the fifth day, Superman rested.

The 10 Most Memorable Moments From This Year's Upfronts Which network was the funniest, and which had the best Hamilton parody? By Jason Lynch
May 20, 2016, 8:49 AM EDT
http://www.adweek.com/news/television/10-most-memorable-moments-year-s-upfronts-171596

Quote

The CW: Now that NBCUniversal has pulled the plug on its Thursday afternoon cable upfront (hooray!), The CW knew that its presentation was the only thing standing between buyers and the end of a grueling upfronts week. So the network gave its audience an even better gift than an open bar: a succinct, fast-moving presentation that was over in 45 minutes flat. An upfronts miracle!

Edited May 20, 2016 by tv echo

[wonderwall]

Did anyone know there was a museum of sex??? LMFAO EBR seems to be having fun there

https://twitter.com/baby_tp/status/733745337085628416

[thegirlsleuth]

That's interesting that Supernatural ties at the top of ad spending.  Hope Jared and Jensen are asking for their own unicorns.

[NumberCruncher]

Interesting info, tv echo.  All of the top CW shows are getting pretty much the same amount of advertiser dollars which I would never have suspected.  It certainly makes the whole ratings discussion at bit more intriguing.  Someone with more TV advertising knowledge correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that the $$$ amount of ad buys were traditionally tied to ratings in which higher-rated shows commanded a higher price tag.  This doesn't seem to quite fit that model to me.  Maybe ad buys are sold as some sort of package deal on The CW?  It certainly would explain why they tell anyone and everyone that ratings mean nothing.

[Morrigan2575]

8 minutes ago, NumberCruncher said:

Interesting info, tv echo.  All of the top CW shows are getting pretty much the same amount of advertiser dollars which I would never have suspected.  It certainly makes the whole ratings discussion at bit more intriguing.  Someone with more TV advertising knowledge correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that the $$$ amount of ad buys were traditionally tied to ratings in which higher-rated shows commanded a higher price tag.  This doesn't seem to quite fit that model to me.  Maybe ad buys are sold as some sort of package deal on The CW?  It certainly would explain why they tell anyone and everyone that ratings mean nothing.

They do and in a little while we'll get to see the ad rates per show for the 2016-2017 season.  I'm honestly not even sure i understand what those graphs (previous page) are saying.  

Here's the list of what each 30 second commercial costs per show for the 2015-2016 season.

Ad Rate List

Edited May 20, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[kismet]

3 hours ago, tv echo said:

The CW's poor treatment of Arrow just makes me not want to watch their three other superhero shows (Flash, LoT, Supergirl) next season.

It's like if a family has four children and one is treated like a king, two are treated like princesses, and the fourth is treated like a poor relation - well then, I'm going to want to give attention to the neglected child.

The only positive spin I can think of is now that the CW has 2 golden children with SG & F, perhaps they can just let the ARROW be. Perhaps we can go back to focusing on ARROW and not all the Flarrowverse shenanigans & spin-off launches. There is some perks to being the forgotten children, I just hope we get to enjoy it and not just the negative aspects.

23 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

Did anyone know there was a museum of sex??? LMFAO EBR seems to be having fun there

https://twitter.com/baby_tp/status/733745337085628416

Yes, I have visited it. It's rather entertaining. :) Although I don't remember that exhibit.

[NumberCruncher]

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

They do and in a little while we'll get to see the ad rates per show for the 2016-2017 season.  I'm honestly not even sure i understand what those graphs (previous page) are saying.  

Here's the list of what each 30 second commercial costs per show for the 2015-2016 season.

Ad Rate List

If that's the case then I have no idea what that graph means either but it certainly does seem a bit contradictory to what you would expect.  I know that the total running time of a Flash episode isn't any different than Arrow so wouldn't they have roughly the same amount of available ad space?  I wouldn't expect the number of commercials to be that different and so if The Flash is getting more $$$ per commercial, it should theoretically be a higher percentage of the total spend versus other CW shows.  Something doesn't compute there with me but perhaps I'm not reading those charts right.

[tv echo]

The only way to reconcile the inconsistency would be if The CW sold fewer ads to run during The Flash (and used more promos).

ETA: I meant to say "sold" but originally wrote "purchased" instead.

Edited May 21, 2016 by tv echo

[Velocity23]

i would guess the type of commercial that is being aired during a show. Some shows get prestige demo groups. I know the 100 lost some advertisers/brands during the season due to the shows messiness. And they air promos for other shows instead.

The Flash feels like one of the most kid friendly shows on the whole network.

[NumberCruncher]

I guess I can see that.  I'm not an avid Flash watcher so I haven't really been paying close attention but does it get a higher percentage of internal CW advertising (i.e. other shows) than its sister shows?

[Morrigan2575]

6 minutes ago, tv echo said:

The only way to reconcile the inconsistency would be if The CW purchased fewer ads to run during The Flash (and used more promos).

 

4 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

i would guess the type of commercial that is being aired during a show. Some shows get prestige demo groups. I know the 100 lost some advertisers/brands during the season due to the shows messiness. And they air promos for other shows instead.

This makes sense, so basically Flash gets more money per ad but doesn't air as many ads (which does explain why there are so many CW show promos during Flash).

i find this interesting because it means that SPN/Arrow are pretty much in the sweet spot. The earn less per ad but sell more ads which make them ultimately (slightly) more profitable or at the very least more attractive to ad buyers and The CW (since they don't have to spend much money promoting the show)

Edited May 20, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[bijoux]

This is a very cute photo. It was posted by the fan who's in it with SA and EBR.

[tv echo]

From that same fan (apparently includes part where DR and EBR crash SA's panel but only audio, which is more than okay ;))...

Edited May 20, 2016 by tv echo

[SmallScreenDiva]

Seeing how cute and playful Stephen and Emily are in those City of Heroes 2 con photos makes me so frustrated there haven't been any official Olicity photos (green screen for vacation photos used as props DO NOT count). And even though the session sounded like it was rushed (didn't somebody say 15 minutes for more than 100 people?) a good many fans still got some adorable poses from what I've seen on Twitter.

[Chaser]

Someone on Twitter said it was like 155 for the Olicity photo op. I guess it was listed on the site. 

Kind of curious how that was in comparison to others. 

[bijoux]

I think it was 45 minutes in the end. Handling 155 people still sounds like a lot.

[apinknightmare]

7 minutes ago, Chaser said:

Someone on Twitter said it was like 155 for the Olicity photo op. I guess it was listed on the site. 

Kind of curious how that was in comparison to others. 

I could be wrong, because I have no idea how far back in the thread the price list for CoH is, but I think the duos were like, £5 or so less than whatever the two people's individual photo op prices were? So theirs was probably more because SA's individual price was a lot higher than everyone else's.

Edited May 20, 2016 by apinknightmare

[Chaser]

Oh sorry. I was unclear. 155 photos sold for the Olicity Photo Op.

I was wondering how many ones where sold for the others.

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, Chaser said:

Oh sorry. I was unclear. 155 photos sold for the Olicity Photo Op.

I was wondering how many ones where sold for the others.

I misunderstood, haha. Combined with the post before yours, your question is perfectly clear. 

[wonderwall]

6 minutes ago, Chaser said:

Oh sorry. I was unclear. 155 photos sold for the Olicity Photo Op.

I was wondering how many ones where sold for the others.

[Midnight Lullaby]

There were 158 SA/EBR photo ops but a few people asked the con to remove them from the site after they downloaded them. Then 12 SA/KC, 11 BR/EBR/SA, 35 WH/CH/KC. The rest no idea, I didn't even check. I think they probably underestimated what people wanted or they would have given more time for the SA/EBR one.

[bijoux]

I really wish someone who purchased the other two photo ops wold post their pic. I wonder what poses they asked for.

[Morrigan2575]

1 minute ago, wonderwall said:

if they had given us OTA instead of Brandon there probably would have been as many OTA as Olicity photos. i personally would have done only one (OTA) but people were definitely doing multiple photo ops so i don't think they would have deminished each other 

[CabotCove]

Quote

I love that interview with Stephen. Damn straight. They did launch everything else. I'm glad that he no longer feels like he has to be so 'yay metahumans' . SA knows that the core Arrow audience IMO wants the Arrow of s1-s2.

LOL, yet he was campaigning for crossovers with Supergirl and the DCCU.

They left the "grounded" storytelling, because they were running out of ideas but sure lets go back to that. Lets see how long this new "realism" last before they introduce faeries, vampires and mermaids. 

Edited May 20, 2016 by WildcardC

[wonderwall]

1 minute ago, WildcardC said:

LOL, yet he was campaigning for crossovers with Supergirl and the DCCU.

I don't think I've seen him 'campaign' for them... I've seen videos where he's resigned that it's a possibility... Could you link me where he was actively rooting for and campaigning for crossovers?

[CabotCove]

I just read somewhere thats he wanted a Supergirl/Arrow crossover. I admit I did not see the video. The guy loves competition and attention, I doubt he will just be OK that Flash/Supergirl/LOT crossover but not his show.

Quote

Megalyn has no business being at the CW Upfronts event (after parties sure but not the morning event).this is for the CW Primetime schedule, not the CW Seed. this is a media event to set ad rates (commercials).

Webshows have ads too, and we really dont know the full circumstances of why CW chose who they chose. Is this compulsory, some people might have chose not to go

Edited May 20, 2016 by WildcardC

[wonderwall]

3 minutes ago, WildcardC said:

I just read somewhere thats he wanted a Supergirl/Arrow crossover. I admit I did not see the video. The guy loves competition and attention, I doubt he will just be OK that Flash/Supergirl/LOT crossover but not his show.

I wouldn't really take what journos say all too seriously. Because all the videos I've seen, he seemed less than enthusiastic about it. I read a writeup of the video and they blew his enthusiasm way out of proportion.

Edited May 20, 2016 by wonderwall

[tarotx]

Stephen on crossovers ...

“I’m always interested and it’s always great for fans. I just have to make sure that they balance keeping up the quality of your show — last year when they wanted me to come to ‘Legends’ and play old Oliver, I was like, ‘That would be awesome, but show me how this works in our schedule so it’s not comprising whatever episode we’re working on.’ And it was great and we did it. So I would just like to see a plan.”

http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/arrow-season-5-supergirl-crossover-villain-stephen-amell-1201778868/

[SmallScreenDiva]

6 minutes ago, WildcardC said:

I just read somewhere thats he wanted a Supergirl/Arrow crossover. I admit I did not see the video. The guy loves competition and attention, I doubt he will just be OK that Flash/Supergirl/LOT crossover but not his show.

I've seen those articles, they're mostly from crappy entertainment and pseudo news sites. It really helps to track down the original article and watch the videos for information. Because as @wonderwall mentioned, things are blown way out of proportion or twisted. Sometimes the "news" is utterly unrecognizable even when you know what the original story is.

[CabotCove]

Quote

“‘Supergirl’ is coming, but we don’t have to introduce a new show next year. In Season 2, it was the introduction of ‘The Flash’ and crossovers there, and last year there was a lot with ‘Legends of Tomorrow,’ and we don’t have to do that this year because ‘Supergirl’ is already established,” Amell said. “So I would like to focus on a lot of the stuff that I think ‘Arrow’ does very well.”

http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/arrow-season-5-supergirl-crossover-villain-stephen-amell-1201778868/

Of course I agree that crossovers should be minimized but LOL he is acting like 3/4 of his show was held hostage by launching shows & crossovers. Flash launch was  exactly 2 episodes. Forget about the ratings boost The Flash/Barry brought to his show, multiple times. Yeah Steve, I would like to see what it is that Arrow does best, when its not padding up its season with other superhero stories. Flash pretty much took the lion share of launching LOT (initially), sending 4 of its characters after their centric episodes.

Edited May 20, 2016 by WildcardC

[wonderwall]

3 minutes ago, WildcardC said:

http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/arrow-season-5-supergirl-crossover-villain-stephen-amell-1201778868/

Of course I agree that crossovers should be minimized but LOL he is acting like 3/4 of his show was held hostage by launching shows & crossovers. Flash launch was  2 episodes. Forget about the ratings boost The Flash/Barry brought to his show, multiple times. Yeah Steve, I would like to see what it is that Arrow does best, when its not padding up its season with other superhero stories. Flash pretty much took the lion share of launching LOT (initially), sending 4 of its characters after their centric episodes.

Well... Not really. If you consider S3 (Where Palmer was in 18 episodes) + S4 (Sara's resurrection which took 5 episodes and butchered Laurel's character even further + another episode to save Palmer), Arrow actually took the lion share of launching LoT

Edited May 20, 2016 by wonderwall

[NumberCruncher]

Yep we had to endure an entire season of Ray Palmer's audition for his own TV show in S3 which clearly bombed since what was originally supposed to be a BR launching vehicle ended up being a GOTG knock-off.  It brought us not only the love triangle from hell that plagued Arrow S3 but also further cemented my dislike for BR in general.  Yep, I'm still mad about it.

[CabotCove]

Quote

ell... Not really. If you consider S3 (Where Palmer was in 18 episodes) + S4 (Sara's resurrection which took 5 episodes and butchered Laurel's character even further + another episode to save Palmer), Arrow actually took the lion share of launching LoT

Ray's 18 episodes were mostly about him coming to serve a season long storyline on Arrow. He was important to move along Felicity/Olicity storylines   "Daniel" could have been any guy, superhero or not, and he likely would have been given that much time. There was going to be a "Daniel" for Felicity whether there was a spin off planned or not, it just happened that the two purposes collided. Ok yeah maybe S4 Sara's episodes were a tiny bit many. But Sara & Ray were like unofficial regulars of Arrow at one point (S2/S3 respectively),  so yeah the show owed it to them to send them off properly. 

Edited May 20, 2016 by WildcardC

[wonderwall]

2 minutes ago, WildcardC said:

Ray's 18 episodes were mostly about him coming to serve a season long storyline on Arrow. He was important to move along Felicity/Olicity storylines   "Daniel" could have been any guy, superhero or not, and he likely would have been given that much time. Ok yeah maybe S4 Sara's episodes were a tiny bit many. But Sara & Ray were like unofficial regulars of Arrow at one point (S2/S3 respectively),  so yeah the show owed it to them to send them off properly. 

Meh. I think that Ray's arc was weird in S3. In the end Ray's relationship with Felicity had more to do with Ray than Felicity. There's a reason why people say Felicity was stuck on Palmer island, because most of their scenes had nothing to do with the main plot. Arrow spent far too long on Ray building his suit and taking over Oliver's company. 

And I don't think the show owed Sara/Ray anything. I'd much preferred it if LoT handled the team actually getting together instead of Arrow/Flash. That goes for Sara's resurrection, Ray becoming un-tiny again, the stupid Hawk stuff etc.

Also I think it's a moot point saying what show took the lions share of launching LoT. Bottom line is both showed suffered.

[NumberCruncher]

8 minutes ago, WildcardC said:

Ray's 18 episodes were mostly about him coming to serve a season long storyline on Arrow. He was important to move along Felicity/Olicity storylines   "Daniel" could have been any guy, superhero or not, and he likely would have been given that much time. Ok yeah maybe S4 Sara's episodes were a tiny bit many. But Sara & Ray were like unofficial regulars of Arrow at one point (S2/S3 respectively),  so yeah the show owed it to them to send them off properly. 

Actually I would argue Ray's storyline had very little to do with Arrow and was specifically there to launch an origin storyline for his character.  Ray interacted with Team Arrow and its mission very, very little.  The Olicity aspect was side story at best.  In fact, I'm willing to bet that if you added up the total Ray/Oliver screentime in S3 it was less than 20 minutes in Ray's 18 episodes.  Why?  Because he had no business being on Oliver's show.  The Ray scenes always felt detached from the A story and were clearly being used to introduce the audience to The ATOM rather than integrating into Arrow's season arc.

Edited May 20, 2016 by NumberCruncher

[CabotCove]

Quote

In fact, I'm willing to bet that if you added up the total Ray/Oliver screentime in S3 it was less than 20 minutes in Ray's 18 episodes. 

He was there for mainly Felicity's story not Oliver. And of course his own. Thats what they call supporting characters for a supporting character. 

Quote

 In the end Ray's relationship with Felicity had more to do with Ray than Felicity. 

Disagree.Agreeing to disagree.  Moving along, as all this is water under the bridge.

[tarotx]

Stephen is talking about his time, as well as time away from the main characters of his show. Sara was an Arrow character but Ray was always going to be Spinoff bound so everything about him on Arrow is for (what turned out to be) LOT.

But we don't even need to bring up season 3.

While I think s4 Sara's resurrection was largely centered around Laurel and Lance, it's the having to do that storylines (for LOT) that took freedom away from the Arrow creative team. A part of me believes that tptb went magic with Damian Darhk because the Pit was going to be used to bring someone back from the dead. Thea was never shown to be dead-dead so dead-dead could still be dead without cries for the pit. In the comics Damain Darhk is a gangster. A much better fit for Arrow. And Darhk&Anarky are computer guys. I can see HIVE having a similar Nuclear endgame without the magic. And I really think adding magic reshaped the flashbacks. So I get Stephen demanding to see the plan from now on.

The Only thing LOT did to Flash was take up some episode space to kind of redeem Snart and create the new Firestorm. Oh and the Hawks well yeah well they ruin everything....

Edited May 20, 2016 by tarotx

[NumberCruncher]

13 minutes ago, WildcardC said:

He was there for mainly Felicity's story not Oliver. And of course his own. Thats what they call supporting characters for a supporting character. 

Disagree.Agreeing to disagree.  Moving along, as all this is water under the bridge.

Ray was not a support to Oliver's story.  If he was a support to Felicity's storyline then why did they spend 18 episodes using her to help him develop his ATOM suit?  It was an ATOM origin story and she was used to support it.  There's a big reason why most people here dreaded that Felicity was banished to Palmer Island all season rather than being in Team Arrow where she belonged.

Edited May 20, 2016 by NumberCruncher

[wonderwall]

Yeah. I remember reviewers towards the end of the season were talking about how Ray's scenes were so disjointed with the rest of the episode, like he was on a different show. And that's not a good thing especially when said character who has said scenes is only a recurring actor bound for a spinoff show. And not only that, the writers wanted to make Ray into a romantic lead, which muddled up things even more.

[dtissagirl]

Crazy Eyes' scenes even had the comedic musical score, that's how far removed from the A-plot it was. It was a creeper sitcom that randomly aired in the middle of Arrow.

[kismet]

Ray's story was as supportive and purposeful to Felicity's story as wearing your underwear on the outside of your jeans. Which in the end is just a really bad fashion statement.

As for Olicity it would have been stalled with or without Ray, it had no need for Ray to help it along in any way during s3. The reason they were not together had everything to do with Oliver and nothing to do with Ray. R/F actually had no bearing on her relationship with OQ except to help her borrow a jet where O/F had a touching scene. So thanks Ray for providing the jet.

Edited May 21, 2016 by kismet

[Password]

3 hours ago, kismet said:

R/F actually had no bearing on her relationship with OQ except to help her borrow a jet where O/F had a touching scene. So thanks Ray for providing the jet.

Cheers Ray. 

[EmilyBettFan]

Ray had no purpose to Arrow'a story or to Oliver's. Anyone can see that. Also Felicity was used to prop up Ray and it was ridiculous because she earned her right to be part of the team but, they took that away from her to usher in LL and kept her away from what she does best. That's why there's the term Palmer Island.

[spartan]

12 hours ago, wonderwall said:

lies just to feed the gossip about olicity

[Midnight Lullaby]

30 minutes ago, spartan said:

lies just to feed the gossip about olicity

A little hard to lie since all the photo ops taken where publicly posted on the website so people could see and download them.

[dtissagirl]

2 hours ago, spartan said:

lies just to feed the gossip about olicity

You can count the pictures one by one by yourself if you want to, they're publically available on the internet.

Also, the Willa/Colton duo sold 90 pictures, and the Willa solo op sold 97. It's all there.

Edited May 21, 2016 by dtissagirl

[Soulfire]

2 hours ago, spartan said:

lies just to feed the gossip about olicity

 

10 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

You can count the pictures one by one by yourself if you want to, they're publically available on the internet.

What @dtissagirl said -- and considering some people, including me and a handful others I personally know, asked to have their Stephen and Emily photo removed, that number (155) should be even higher.

[looptab]

@Soulfire,Do you know how long did the photo ops last, in the end?

[Soulfire]

19 minutes ago, looptab said:

@Soulfire,Do you know how long did the photo ops last, in the end?

Each photo op session lasted different times, and I can give estimates for each I attended (Stephen solo, Emily solo, Emily and Charlotte duo, Stephen and Emily duo, and a David Ramsey solo) but the Stephen and Emily duo specifically lasted longer than the given time (11.15-11.30am). The photo session before it finished early, so they decided to start Stephen and Emily's at around 10.45 instead -- and it ran til about 11.20. So roughly 35mins ish?

Edited May 21, 2016 by Soulfire

[arjumand]

15 hours ago, tarotx said:

Stephen on crossovers ...

“I’m always interested and it’s always great for fans. I just have to make sure that they balance keeping up the quality of your show — last year when they wanted me to come to ‘Legends’ and play old Oliver, I was like, ‘That would be awesome, but show me how this works in our schedule so it’s not comprising whatever episode we’re working on.’ And it was great and we did it. So I would just like to see a plan.”

http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/arrow-season-5-supergirl-crossover-villain-stephen-amell-1201778868/

Re. what I bolded: So say we all, Stephen.

And you know what, I'd like to see them take their casting much more seriously. I mean, Elysia Rotaru was an abject failure on all levels. What the hell were they thinking?

Agree on all aspects of Palmer Island (lol! My hatred for Ray is so great I think I was actively avoiding any mention of him, so this is the first time I've heard it) and whatever we're calling this season's spinoff whoring. Hawk Apocalypse? I got nothing.