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ElectricBoogaloo

By ElectricBoogaloo
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hincandenza

hincandenza

Oof.  I gotta be honest, I'm still excited but that trailer really bothered me.  As I've said elsewhere, I'm not gonna be thrilled if the entire second season is basically them still in Erlich's Brady Bunch-shaped incubator and just a slightly-larger-scale rehash of the "Will our underdog company succeed?!?".  $50K from Tech Crunch is enough to at least rent some office space, you guys.

 

All that stuff was season 1 but there's new territory to mine, so unless you hire the worst patent attorney in the world PP will make millions immediately, and the hard work is to become a billion-dollar company or find some other purpose besides "licensing our algorithm".  There's so much more area to play in for comedy's sake, if we can just move past the "They ARE rich now, if not yet Gregory/Belson rich" stage.  Was Mike Judge worried that the audience won't find it as funny to laugh at their misadventures if they're then driving off in fancy cars to swank homes (well... maybe not swank, SV real estate ain't cheap!)?

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chocolatine

chocolatine

Just because Pied Piper won TC Disrupt doesn't mean Richard is suddenly a savvy CEO and will make all the right strategic decisions. Remember that in the first season the guys burned through their $200k seed capital very quickly, so I'm sure the $50k they won will be gone in a matter of weeks. And Gavin Belson is going to be nipping at their heels optimizing his own compression algorithm. They're going to scramble so hard to get to market first, they won't have time to shower, let alone buy fancy cars. There won't be fancy anything before they're profitable, which will take months even in the best case scenario.

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hincandenza

hincandenza

I don't want to keep belaboring the point so I'll back off of this topic after this, but the show is going to have to accept at some point that their "MacGuffin" is basically too good for some plot lines to occur.  What Richard did at TechCrunch is like showing off your garage-built fully functional "Back to the Future" style hoverboard on the "Today" show.  That shit would be all over social media in minutes, and your phone wouldn't stop ringing off the hook. 

 

It's not that there's no new work- or new challenges- but in cinematic terms we'd typically see here a jump cut to a busy office with the implication of an influx of cash and rapid rise to success, or at least only an episode or two on getting there- not a whole season.  I've previously outlined just a few ways that PP could have tens of millions in the bank in a short period of time without even selling the company (for what would now be billions).  Whether Richard would think of those or not, Peter Gregory's team certainly would since they want their 5% stake to pay off!

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hincandenza

hincandenza

Cool- although I was under the impression they would premiere the first episode of season two, and was all excited it would be available 4 days early.  However, this sounds like they'll be showing a sneak preview clip only, and then streaming S01E01 in full (or some other S01 episode?) for those who don't have HBOGo and want to see if it interests them.  It's kind of ambiguous- presumably on purpose.

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chocolatine

chocolatine

This is week-old news, but I haven't seen it mentioned on these boards yet: the show has been renewed for a third season. Yay! Though I wish it had longer seasons, like SATC used to (Entourage as well, IIRC). It kinda sucks having to wait 10 months between seasons.

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hincandenza

hincandenza

I'd ranted- a LOT- during season 2, for the seemingly constant and unbelievable stumbling blocks of what should have been an insanely successful startup and IPO, including the ham-fisted delete-key shenanigans during their attempt to win the pornsite contract.  I feel somewhat vindicated by this recent article about the show:

 

Hooli offers protagonist Richard Hendricks (Thomas Middleditch) $10 million for his still-nascent startup, Pied Piper.

The initial script called for a much bigger offer, but show creator Mike Judge thought that was over the top.

Judge said, "that's too much, no one is going to buy that it's $100 million," Middleditch said at a South By Southwest panel on Saturday featuring Judge, writer and producer Alec Berg, and several of the show's stars. "So we turned it down to $10 million, and then during season one the news came out about Snapchat turning down that offer of five or six billion, so, egg on our face, I guess."
"We would ask VCs what kind of interesting challenges the Pied Piper guys would have had, and they told us, anyone in the Valley would give these guys $10 million instantly," said Judge. "Probably more."
The fact that a ridiculous amount of money is being thrown around the real Silicon Valley right now actually makes it difficult to create plot twists and obstacles that keep the show interesting, but are also realistic. The technology industry is at a point in history where a startup in Pied Piper's position would be showered with wealth and positively cosseted—but that's not what makes great television.

"That is the challenge of writing the show," said Berg. "We think of them as the bad news bears. They're constantly outsiders, trying to crack the machine, and get a win. Once these guys have money and success, I think, the show sort of ends. So the interesting thing is, how many ways can we get these guys to trip up, without infuriating the audience? And then it's like Lucy grabbing the football away from Charlie Brown." In other words, a pretty tired joke.

 

 

I mean, that's pretty much the problem with season 2: they admittedly could not think of how to write the show with the PP team experiencing any real success, which explains why the show became an unfunny nightmare of poorly thought out artificial failures, when we know that even half-baked app ideas can net seven figures in funding.  Hooli/Google would have, either before or after their patent suit gambit failed, offered billions (we never found out what Gavin Belson offered to Richard at the mexican restaurant).  PP might still choose to go it alone, the same way Snapchat turned down FB's buyout offer, but they wouldn't be begging for scraps from an energy drink company.  Heck, it was recently in the news that over the course of its history, Twitter has lost $3 billion dollars.  If VCs will pour that kind of cash into an unprofitable company with no clear path for how it can be monetized, well...

 

I disagree that it would be game over to have them win in some way; as I've said in the past, there is a lot of humor to be mined with PP in a post-financial success state.  The absurd new-money excesses of people like Erlich, Gilfoyle, or Dinesh (explored in part with the Hanneman character); the ineptness of Richard & Co. handling the buzz-speak laden management style of a tech company (which they've hinted at with Bighead's rapid failing upwards); watching the team try, and likely fail, to adapt to their new status as tech leaders, both in the business world and in the heady circles of Silicon Valley super-rich (which we saw a sliver of when Erlich tried to attend the fundraiser with Jian Yang).  In my opinion, those comedic bits were some of the only enjoyable parts of season 2.  I think for a lot of people watching, the grand pretensions and absurd, unchecked influence of these new money SV elite is as ripe for exploration and parody as the run-of-the-mill tech proletariat/brogrammers we saw in season 1.

 

Instead, it sounds like the creators are just going to circle the drain of "These bumbling idiots can't get anything right!" until the show ends.  Which is sad, because I was/am hoping season 3 is a return to Season 1 form, as opposed to more of the impossible plot-forced "twists" that we saw in season 2 to keep the sitcom status quo of lovable idiots working out of their garage.

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hincandenza

hincandenza

Hm, I'm of mixed feelings: on one hand, we saw several shots of them still in Ye Olde Coding House; but in another there's signs from an actual "pied piper" office and Laurie's line about "You started a company too valuable for you to run".  The latter is the right direction: maybe we could argue season 2 was necessary to show how abysmally bad Richard is as a CEO, and why at most he should have a Woz-like role at PP, but in any case they need to get the hell out of Bachman's house and into some profitable company office space, so we can explore new facets of the show and these characters. I wanna see just how big an HR nightmare Gilfoyle would be in a proper office! :)

 

Also, I thought Gavin was out as CEO with Bighead as the rising star at the end of last season; so either those scenes in the trailer are before his formal departure, or at some point he has/will successfully clawed back to be CEO of his company.

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chocolatine

chocolatine

I wanna see just how big an HR nightmare Gilfoyle would be in a proper office! :)

 

You'd be surprised how much an early-stage chief architect can get away with. I once worked at a SaaS company of ~100 employees, and the chief architect, who was employee #5, was the biggest jerk ever - walked out in the middle of meetings because he was bored, ignored emails and requests, was rude to everyone - and HR/his boss not only did nothing, but fretted about how to keep him happy and kept making concessions for him. He built the system that was the company's product, and nobody else knew it as well as he did, so unless he physically assaulted someone, he was pretty much unifirable.

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Should Be Working

Should Be Working

(edited)

I know the Season 3 previews are just assorted snippets from hours of the show, but what I've seen so far is not at all impressive. Erlich is actually un-funny. And the broad slapstick humor in that scene of Richard giving an ultimatum to the new PP CEO, only to slip and smash his face into the desk - yikes. There's plenty  of comedy gold just waiting if only Judge and company choose to mine it creatively and effectively.

 

Hope the choice of a late middle-aged CEO doesn't turn Season 3 into just another lame battle between real grownups and the wild and crazy younger PP workforce. Erlich's blatant ageist rant is probably a foreshadowing of more to come. Whatever. I'll watch it simply because most of what is on TV is complete garbage and even a sub-par post-Season 1 Silicon Valley still stands out amongst the muck. And I work around people who are sort of like this every day of the work week.

Edited by Should Be Working
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chocolatine

chocolatine

(edited)

This is only tangentially related to the show, but one of its writers, Dan Lyons, has written a hilarious book about his time at a tech startup (he was 52 years old at a company where the median age was 26). I had an a-ha moment of sorts when he described Salesforce founder and CEO Marc Benioff - I had flashbacks to some of Gavin Belson's scenes on the show. I had actually been wondering who Gavin was supposed to be modeled after, since, even though Hooli is supposed to be modeled after Google, Gavin is very different from Sergey Brin, Larry Page, or Eric Schmidt. Now I know. :)

Edited by chocolatine
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Should Be Working

Should Be Working

If you check out Benioff in any of his many Youtube videos, you see this ultra-extroverted, self-confident, and aggressive spewer of tech cliches who very might well be a part of the Gavin Belson's persona, although the valley is full of companies run by similar CEO types with massive and power-hungry egos, so the show's creators' had a lot to draw from.  And I enjoyed Lyons' well-deserved take-down of Hubspot in Disrupted. I've been in tech for of couple of decades (now becoming part of that grey-haired older crowd) and notice this increasing trend towards mindless and humorless group-think corporate cultures built around older and very wealthy CEOs who oversee the assembly lines that pull in the uber gifted high school interns and elite university grads, overwork them to a frazzle with images of immense stock option wealth, and then spit them out about 15 years later for young replacement models. With pampered millenials constituting the core workforce, expect to see and hear more of that "we are all amazing" (except for those over 35) ethos so well described at Hubspot.

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chocolatine

chocolatine

(edited)

If you check out Benioff in any of his many Youtube videos, you see this ultra-extroverted, self-confident, and aggressive spewer of tech cliches who very might well be a part of the Gavin Belson's persona, although the valley is full of companies run by similar CEO types with massive and power-hungry egos, so the show's creators' had a lot to draw from.  And I enjoyed Lyons' well-deserved take-down of Hubspot in Disrupted. I've been in tech for of couple of decades (now becoming part of that grey-haired older crowd) and notice this increasing trend towards mindless and humorless group-think corporate cultures built around older and very wealthy CEOs who oversee the assembly lines that pull in the uber gifted high school interns and elite university grads, overwork them to a frazzle with images of immense stock option wealth, and then spit them out about 15 years later for young replacement models. With pampered millenials constituting the core workforce, expect to see and hear more of that "we are all amazing" (except for those over 35) ethos so well described at Hubspot.

 

Oh, I know there are plenty of other asshole Silicon Valley CEOs, it's just the way Lyons described Benioff in the book conjured Gavin Belson for me. And I agree with you, the "culture" described in Lyons's book has unfortunately become the norm. I once worked at a startup where I was called into HR for not being "excited" enough. Never mind that I had doubled my team's productivity in my first six months on the job - being "excited" was apparently more important. When I tried to explain to the HR lady that it's not natural for human beings to be perpetually excited, she just stared at me blankly. Fortunately for me, my skills and experience are very rare and were essential to the business, so I was able to get away with not engaging in the "woo-hoo, crush it!" speak and telling HR lady to back off.

Edited by chocolatine
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Should Be Working

Should Be Working

(edited)

Oh, I know there are plenty of other asshole Silicon Valley CEOs, it's just the way Lyons described Benioff in the book conjured Gavin Belson for me. 

 

I went back and re-read Lyons' description of Benioff's performance at that tech show and readily agree that his extremely over-the-top entrance (onto a large stage filled with dry ice and thunder and lightning effects, driving the new Tesla Model S, emerging from it dressed as Doc Brown from Back to the Future fame) is exactly the kind of stunt you'd expect Gavin to pull in front of cheering and adoring Hooli employees. Same with Benioff's bizarre story about having just traveled six years into the future to retrieve the latest cloud software from 2019 so he could return and use it in his company's current offerings. And the crowd just ate it up.

 

Since the first dot.com cycle in the late 1990s, Silicon Valley culture has increasingly become stranger than fiction. No wonder the local non-techies detest everything about the industry and its members. And this derives from more than their outlandish pay, hipster dress and ways, or even the fleets of huge sleek Google, Apple, etc. buses that roam the narrow city streets and bay area freeways with their dark-tinted windows, filled with plugged-in programmers who are as unaware of and unconcerned with the people and world around them as any other occupying army.

 

Consider how many fascinating cultural issues this show could address and skewer (outside the confines of the incubator) if only the creators had the will and imagination to do it. To start off, they should listen more closely to Lyons, who knows this stuff intimately.

Edited by Should Be Working
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hincandenza

hincandenza

Oh, I know there are plenty of other asshole Silicon Valley CEOs, it's just the way Lyons described Benioff in the book conjured Gavin Belson for me. And I agree with you, the "culture" described in Lyons's book has unfortunately become the norm. I once worked at a startup where I was called into HR for not being "excited" enough. Never mind that I had doubled my team's productivity in my first six months on the job - being "excited" was apparently more important. When I tried to explain to the HR lady that it's not natural for human beings to be perpetually excited, she just stared at me blankly. Fortunately for me, my skills and experience are very rare and were essential to the business, so I was able to get away with not engaging in the "woo-hoo, crush it!" speak and telling HR lady to back off.

 

 

Since the first dot.com cycle in the late 1990s, Silicon Valley culture has increasingly become stranger than fiction. No wonder the local non-techies detest everything about the industry and its members. And this derives from more than their outlandish pay, hipster dress and ways, or even the fleets of huge sleek Google, Apple, etc. buses that roam the narrow city streets and bay area freeways with their dark-tinted windows, filled with plugged-in programmers who are as unaware of and unconcerned with the people and world around them as any other occupying army.

 

Consider how many fascinating cultural issues this show could address and skewer (outside the confines of the incubator) if only the creators had the will and imagination to do it. To start off, they should listen more closely to Lyons, who knows this stuff intimately.

I was so confused skimming these comments at first, because I thought at first you were talking about the Benioff who is a co-producer of "Game of Thrones". :)

 

Enthusiastic yes the points both of you make, it's been my complaint since season 2 started.  By leaving the core group in this sort of Groundhog Day of failure loop, stuck in that same house all through season 2, it robs us of a chance to explore some of these weird cultural elements of SV.  We've touched on it with Hooli, or the weasel-owning neighbor, but I think it's much funnier if we see our cast struggle with being on the other said of the fake "woo-hoo, crush it!" culture, or expand the stories beyond just going from one tech office to another.  Truth is, I barely remember the overall plotline of season 2- something about a lawsuit, and ongoing financial issues?- whereas all the things I do remember were the funny little one-off set pieces or vignettes that weren't just about the challenges of series A funding. :)

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qtpye

qtpye

Oh, I know there are plenty of other asshole Silicon Valley CEOs, it's just the way Lyons described Benioff in the book conjured Gavin Belson for me. And I agree with you, the "culture" described in Lyons's book has unfortunately become the norm. I once worked at a startup where I was called into HR for not being "excited" enough. Never mind that I had doubled my team's productivity in my first six months on the job - being "excited" was apparently more important. When I tried to explain to the HR lady that it's not natural for human beings to be perpetually excited, she just stared at me blankly. Fortunately for me, my skills and experience are very rare and were essential to the business, so I was able to get away with not engaging in the "woo-hoo, crush it!" speak and telling HR lady to back off.

 

I feel that you were not excited enough about the post to tell us about how you got in trouble for not being excited.  Joking aside, what is wrong with the HR in Silicon Valley.  Do they want their company to resemble a frat house on coke, where everybody is getting high fived for everything?

I went back and re-read Lyons' description of Benioff's performance at that tech show and readily agree that his extremely over-the-top entrance (onto a large stage filled with dry ice and thunder and lightning effects, driving the new Tesla Model S, emerging from it dressed as Doc Brown from Back to the Future fame) is exactly the kind of stunt you'd expect Gavin to pull in front of cheering and adoring Hooli employees. Same with Benioff's bizarre story about having just traveled six years into the future to retrieve the latest cloud software from 2019 so he could return and use it in his company's current offerings. And the crowd just ate it up.

 

Since the first dot.com cycle in the late 1990s, Silicon Valley culture has increasingly become stranger than fiction. No wonder the local non-techies detest everything about the industry and its members. And this derives from more than their outlandish pay, hipster dress and ways, or even the fleets of huge sleek Google, Apple, etc. buses that roam the narrow city streets and bay area freeways with their dark-tinted windows, filled with plugged-in programmers who are as unaware of and unconcerned with the people and world around them as any other occupying army.

 

Consider how many fascinating cultural issues this show could address and skewer (outside the confines of the incubator) if only the creators had the will and imagination to do it. To start off, they should listen more closely to Lyons, who knows this stuff intimately.

 

Not, to mention that the techie invasion has made San Fran totally unaffordable for most of the middle class.  Though, I guess if you have been living there for decades you probably appreciate the increase in property values (though you might not enjoy the taxes).

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RabbitEars

RabbitEars

I picked up a copy of Wired with the cover story about the show. It's less about the show and more about the comedy careers of the cast, which was great fun to read. I follow Kamail Nanjiani on Twitter. That man is funny. 

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chocolatine

chocolatine

(edited)

The show got 11 Emmy nominations, which surprises me because I didn't think it was a great season. Thomas Middleditch even got one for best actor in a comedy, and he talks about it here. I wish Zach Woods had gotten a supporting actor nom.

Edited by chocolatine
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ElectricBoogaloo

ElectricBoogaloo

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On 7/14/2016 at 5:11 PM, chocolatine said:

The show got 11 Emmy nominations, which surprises me because I didn't think it was a great season. Thomas Middleditch even got one for best actor in a comedy, and he talks about it here. I wish Zach Woods had gotten a supporting actor nom.

Full list of Silicon Valley's Emmy nominations:

Lead actor in a comedy - Thomas Middleditch
Comedy series
Outstanding production design for a narrative program (half-hour or less)
Outstanding Casting For A Comedy Series
Outstanding Directing For A Comedy Series - Alec Berg
Outstanding Directing For A Comedy Series - Mike Judge
Outstanding Single-Camera Picture Editing For A Comedy Series - Tim Roche
Outstanding Single-Camera Picture Editing For A Comedy Series - Brian Merken
Outstanding Sound Mixing For A Comedy Or Drama Series (Half-Hour) And Animation
Outstanding Writing For A Comedy Series - Dan O'Keefe
Outstanding Writing For A Comedy Series - Alec Berg
 

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hincandenza

hincandenza

15 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Full list of Silicon Valley's Emmy nominations:

Lead actor in a comedy - Thomas Middleditch
Comedy series
Outstanding production design for a narrative program (half-hour or less)
Outstanding Casting For A Comedy Series
Outstanding Directing For A Comedy Series - Alec Berg
Outstanding Directing For A Comedy Series - Mike Judge
Outstanding Single-Camera Picture Editing For A Comedy Series - Tim Roche
Outstanding Single-Camera Picture Editing For A Comedy Series - Brian Merken
Outstanding Sound Mixing For A Comedy Or Drama Series (Half-Hour) And Animation
Outstanding Writing For A Comedy Series - Dan O'Keefe
Outstanding Writing For A Comedy Series - Alec Berg
 

Seriously?!?  Huh.  I guess I'm the crazy one, then.  Well played, Judge.  Well played...

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hincandenza

hincandenza

New teaser trailer.

This tells us three things:

  1. Richard, who now has no financial stake in PP at all, is going to go off and invent- for what, the 4th time now?- some insane, game-changing next-gen tech that would in the real world be bought by Facebook/Google/Microsoft for 9-10 figures without hesitation.
  2. Richard will nevertheless at no time, in no way, consult even a single competent attorney who works for him, and lose it all through easily avoided shenanigans from unscrupulous characters or a completely implausible scam/theft.
  3. I won't be watching this shitshow, but I may come here to see how much everyone else hates it.
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chocolatine

chocolatine

2 hours ago, hincandenza said:

New teaser trailer.

 

This tells us three things:

  1. Richard, who now has no financial stake in PP at all, is going to go off and invent- for what, the 4th time now?- some insane, game-changing next-gen tech that would in the real world be bought by Facebook/Google/Microsoft for 9-10 figures without hesitation.
  2. Richard will nevertheless at no time, in no way, consult even a single competent attorney who works for him, and lose it all through easily avoided shenanigans from unscrupulous characters or a completely implausible scam/theft.
  3. I won't be watching this shitshow, but I may come here to see how much everyone else hates it.

Aw, @hincandenza, I've enjoyed reading your astute commentary, so please reconsider!

I actually like the preview:

1. Everyone not giving a shit about Richard claiming the name Pied Piper (even though he has no legal right to it since it belongs to the company, but whatever).

2. Richard wanting to invent "a new internet". I've been there with the whiteboard brainstorms; there are a lot of shitty ideas in the beginning; that's exactly the point.

3. Richard trying out being a "woo!" person and Jared fully committing in support. To those of you not involved in the tech startup world, it's commonplace for people to whoop about the tiniest achievements, or even nothing at all, and use inane expressions like "crush it". That's so not in Richard's character that it's hilarious. (FWIW, it's not in my character either. At one startup where I used to work I was once called into HR for not being "excited enough".)

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Should Be Working

Should Be Working

This show had so much potential, the first season proved that. Seasons 2 and 3 were pointless, meandering excursions in bad luck, poor judgment, and low-brow humor. I was hoping Judge and crew might have chosen to do a fresh reboot for Season 4 and focus once again on valley culture and technology rather than continuing to dwell exclusively, and in such mediocre fashion, on the inane foibles of the PP gang and their many tormentors.  

I realize that season previews can be intentionally misleading, but this shitshow, as hincandenza accurately characterizes it, looks like it's off on another adventure in Laverne and Shirley-style comedy that just happens to be set in  contemporary silicon valley.

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ElectricBoogaloo

ElectricBoogaloo

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(edited)

Zach Woods talks about the Silicon Valley stand-ins:


Zach Woods talks about going to the Empire State Building and beach sex:


Thomas Middleditch on Zach Woods’ burgeoning sex symbol status:


The Bone Zone:

Edited by ElectricBoogaloo
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Nordly Beaumont

Nordly Beaumont

I just read that TJ Miller is leaving after this season! I don't know how that will work. The first time I watched SV, it was because I like Martin Starr. I HATED Erlich right off the bat and almost didn't watch any further. But I kept hearing such great things about the show I decided to give it two more episodes. By the end of episode three I was thinking "that episode needed more Erlich." So I just don't know...

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/tj-miller-silicon-valley_us_59272cfce4b01b9a59375bcd?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009

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msani19

msani19

I was thinking the same thing @NordlyBeaumont . I thought Erlich was way too much in the beginning but he rapidly became such an enjoyable character, I looked forward to whatever absurdity he would say or do next. I all seriousness, even if he was staying with the show, I'm thinking that they should wrap it up with S5. The writers seem to be falling into the familiar trap of relying too heavily on a breakout characters eccentricities, so another season of Erlich may be too much. I wonder if that played into his decision to leave the show. How will it work without him, but now importantly where will the guys live??

The whole team needs some sustained success. It feels like a cycle of winning and then a setback; lather, rinse, repeat. I need something to good to happen! Please figure out a way to develop that Monica, I'm begging you, otherwise what's her point. 

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chocolatine

chocolatine

While I'll miss Erlich, this could be the reboot the show desperately needs. No more Erlich means the gang finally has to leave the incubator and interact with other people. I see potential there.

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