Unpopular Opinions

[Hipshooter]

I'm absolutely sick of the Firefly references. 

[amensisterfriend]

While rewatching S5 (yes...again!), I'm struck by the UO that Castle/Beckett actually had a lot of really lovely, romantic, sweet etc. scenes that season, and while I totally get why fans were frustrated by not getting to see them talk more, kiss more without being interrupted, etc., I actually really liked their chemistry as a new couple. And to make this even more unpopular, I kind of liked that Beckett was insecure in S5. It made perfect sense to me based on both of their characters and their history that she'd worry once he was finally with her he wouldn't be as thrilled and intrigued by his chase of his 'dream girl' and become disappointed by their reality. I do have a little more trouble buying that exuberant Castle was deliberately somewhat restrained to avoid scaring her away, but I think it was in character for him to keep things lighter and more distant as a self-defense mechanism when he got worried about caring too much and/or pushing her away. Plus, while I get why it annoyed people that Beckett couldn't just relax and be happy more often, being unsure over this new relationship made her more relatable and human to me...I'm a big proponent of relatably flawed, prickly, unsure Beckett over comic book-y, flatly-perfect-at-everything-in-every-way Beckett :) And I think they DID have more happy/connected/compatible etc. moments in S5 than I had initially assumed. (As a huge Gilmore Girls fan who still marvels at just how joyless, incompatible and devoid of chemistry I felt Luke and Lorelai were once they became a couple in S5 of that show, Castle/Beckett---and most other new TV couples---probably seem a whole lot better to me by contrast!)  For me, the key to loving S5 is to just merrily skip a few of those episodes from the second half of the season and maybe even pretend that the season ended with the (IMO!) amazing "Still." Once I do that, I just love this season so much more than is 'popular'!  

 

BTW, another UO about this season is that I think Reality Star Struck is a highly entertaining episode despite understanding why many wish Gina Torres had interacted more with Castle and that I LOVE the scene where Beckett gives Castle a drawer. And I even like the unpopular "Cloudy with a Chance.." and Bigfoot episodes. And...well, I'll just be over here at my tiny S5-loving table, pretending Squab and the Quail, Watershed and some of the Bracken stuff doesn't exist while deriving way too much enjoyment from the rest ;)  

Edited September 12, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[verdana]

BTW, another UO about this season is that I think Reality Star Struck is a highly entertaining episode despite understanding why many wish Gina Torres had interacted more with Castle and that I LOVE the scene where Beckett gives Castle a drawer.

 

 

The drawer scene was sweet and felt symbolic until MilMar ruined it by later on having Kate admit to Castle she'd shacked up with quite a few guys in her college years and presumably also let them have closet space. After that I found the significance of the drawer giving lost much of its emotional impact. Instead of this being a momentous act of her suddenly wanting to give some of her personal, treasured private space to him as a sign of the importance of this man in her day to day life it came over as just the next step in a process that she's already done before with other sleepovers. *shrug* 

 

As for Insecure!Beckett I can only deal with that in small doses before it become irritating and boring. I get why she felt insecure in the first half of S5 and I was okay with it generally and initially I didn't blame her for worrying about whether Castle was truly in it for the long haul but as things moved on her insecurity of the week got tiresome and don't get me started on the latter half of that season, Like many I like to think Still was the true finale. 

Edited September 12, 2015 by verdana

[verdana]

And I even like the unpopular "Cloudy with a Chance.."

 

 

I love Cloudy too, that opening loft scene was wonderful, it's one of the few times since they've got together I've thought Castle looked actively interested in Beckett sexually, the way he was checking her out..sigh that's the Richard Castle I was expecting to see once they got together, it also helped that Nathan looked great in that scene and Kate's "wow" kiss was supposedly a nice ad lib by Stana fantastic! Why they stopped giving fans that kind of sexy interaction as a couple beats me.  The only black spot is the fact they played up for laughs Castle getting chased around the loft by a woman who won't take no for an answer, try changing that around to the guy doing the chasing. *shakes head* 

Edited September 12, 2015 by verdana

[amensisterfriend]

The drawer scene was sweet and felt symbolic until MilMar ruined it by later on having Kate admit to Castle she'd shacked up with quite a few guys in her college years and presumably also let them have closet space. After that I found the significance of the drawer giving lost much of its emotional impact. Instead of this being a momentous act of her suddenly wanting to give some of her personal, treasured private space to him as a sign of the importance of this man in her day to day life it came over as just the next step in a process that she's already done before with other sleepovers.

 

I just enjoy the drawer scene for what it is and is supposed to represent and merrily forget what we find out later on. (Beckett's past appears to be ever changing anyway depending on what the writers randomly toss at us in any given episode, so the comfort is that whatever we learn that feels uncomfortably "un-Beckett" will usually be ignored and/or contradicted!) I'm sure your opinion is the popular one, verdana, but I'm loving S5 and have decided not to let the complaints dampen my enthusiasm. And, as noted, when I skip a few of the episodes I find my overall impression of the season is a whole lot rosier than before. Selective rewatching is a key ingredient in maintaining my love for this this show...and, come to think of it, for most shows! 

 

But then I enjoy focusing on the parts of this show that did and still delight me rather than just relentlessly trashing every single aspect of it, which appears to be a very unpopular opinion :) 

[amensisterfriend]

---Oh, and as if I don't already have enough weird and unpopular opinions, I forgot to mention a major one: as a lifelong whodunit fan, I genuinely enjoy most of this show's mysteries and think they tend to be better than most give them credit for. They don't exactly rival Dame Agatha Christie's, of course (an understatement, I realize!), but I actually find them more engaging than what we see on most other crime shows...albeit with a few notable "god, that case is AWFUL---who wrote this?!") exceptions :)  

[verdana]

I wasn't trying to dampen your enthusiasm for season 5 or anything else, just explaining why that particular scene no longer works for me as it once it did. I have no idea if my opinion on the matter of the drawer giving is shared by many within the fandom or not. 

Edited September 12, 2015 by verdana

[amensisterfriend]

I wasn't trying to dampen your enthusiasm for season 5 or anything else, just explaining why that particular scene no longer works for me as it once it did.

 

Oh, I totally know! I was just making fun of my own need to rewatch with very selective denial (like, Still is totally the last episode of S5, right?! ;)) and to block things out in order to still love the show :) 

[verdana]

Okay that's cool, I figured I might have upset you lol.

 

Still would have made a lovely feel good finale ending for the entire series. There's all the flashbacks, that sweet kiss and the way they're looking at each other and when they walk away arm in arm at the end which symbolises their partnership, although they'd have to include a baby in there somewhere too heh. May be they could do a flash forward when the time comes of them playing with a couple of kids,

Edited September 12, 2015 by verdana

[roamyn]

I guess I'm the opposite of most people here.

The seasons & episodes I love, you guys don't. The ones I dislike immensely most of you seem to love. (Okay, everyone hates the Squib episode.) I'm not sure why my view of the world is skewed. Or what we see different.

But I'm not a huge shipper, or conspiracy theorist. In fact, I hate the Joanna Beckett murder investigations, except 'Knockdown'. I prefer the lighthearted most of the time. I adore Esposito & Ryan & Montgomery & Lanie, and even Gates to a smaller degree. My admiration for Susan Sullivan knows no bounds - the more of her, the better.

Maybe because I just started watching on re-runs this year, so we watch several a night. My view of S1 is not as nostalgic when watching S5 & S6.

Oh, and i HATE Beckett's S1 hair.

Edited September 12, 2015 by roamyn

[amensisterfriend]

In fact, I hate the Joanna Beckett murder investigations, except 'Knockdown'. I prefer the lighthearted most of the time.

 

We totally agree on this one! I find the relatively lighthearted episodes far more enjoyable and rewatchable overall and think that's what the writers and actors tend to do best.

 

And, as you can see from the above, I also share your affection for S5, so you're not alone :)

 

 

 

Oh, and i HATE Beckett's S1 hair.

 

Heh---I love Beckett's S1 hair and think it really suited the character somehow, but I totally get people disliking it! 

Edited September 12, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[roamyn]

Heh---I love Beckett's S1 hair and think it really suited the character somehow, but I totally get people disliking it!

For the record, I don't like the long, wavy extensions, either. I like S2 the best.

And I'm glad I'm not the only S5 lover. In fact, I like alot of S6, too. But there are some awful ones in that season, too.

[amensisterfriend]

Roamyn, I'm so curious---what do you love about later seasons over earlier ones? Are you (like I am!) very relieved to see Castle and Beckett finally together and not dealing with annoying obstacles in the form of outside significant others? Do you feel like Beckett and/or Castle developed and changed for the better as the series progressed? Please don't feel like I'm putting you on the spot---I just love hearing why certain seasons/episodes do and don't resonate with fellow fans :) And I know why many dislike the post-S3 seasons, so I'm excited to hear from someone who likes those seasons as much or even more than S1 and S2! 

Edited September 12, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[roamyn]

You're not putting me on the spot, amen sister. I love discussion like this, as well.

I like that there's a good mix between the lighthearted & taught.

I see more growth in the actors' characters and their acting abilities. You never would've convinced me in S1-3 that Ryan could pull off a hard-ass mobster.

I love 3XK as a villian. So much smoother & more intelligent than Sen. Bracken.

Yes, I'm glad Caskett are together & no more tension so that they can move forward. But I'm no shipper. He & Gina didn't bother me. Neither did Beckett & Motorcycle Dr.

I hated the way Beckett treated or blew off Castle at the begunning, though I don't mind the sceptism from Esposito because that's his character - former military.

I think what I like most is that the show is more of an ensemble and gives the secondary characters more to do. Now just give more to Susan & Tamala. In some ensembles the acting of one or two standouts overshadow the lesser actors. As in TBBT: Jim, Amy, Simon completely overshadow Johnny, Kumar, Kaley & Melissa. Not on Castle. They're all great. Well, Molly's not great, but she's serviceable and a 3rd tier character.

Edited September 12, 2015 by roamyn

[McManda]

I choose 3XK as a better villain over Bracken, too. He seems more like someone that should be a villain to a cop and her shadow, not political, presidential hopeful Bracken. I also think Michael Mosely did a great job turning Jerry Tyson into the guy-next-door killer, someone that you wouldn't expect to be a serial killer - he's attractive, clean cut, and smart, but he's intensely broken.

 

I also like how they related Castle and Tyson as two sides of the same coin; Castle is what happens when the "good" is interested in death and murder, Tyson is what happens when the bad is.

 

Bracken was just ... too omnipresent to make me feel like he was a good villain.

[S55]

I don't hate post-season 3 seasons necessarily. In fact, I started watching Castle after catching up the summer between seasons 3 and 4, and really loved a lot about season 4. I think I've mentioned here before that unlike a lot of the fandom, I don't hate Heartbreak Hotel from season 4. It's not my favorite, but there are episodes I've disliked a LOT more (in season 4 for example, the most forgettable no-rewatch-necessary episodes for me were Kick the Ballistics and A Dance With Death).

 

But I can say, for the most part, I enjoyed seasons 1-4 more than 5-7. However, I also understand that shows take a natural downturn past about season 3 or 4 (I've seen this in many shows prior to Castle), so it's not surprising to me I enjoy the earlier seasons more. 

 

Despite choosing 3XK in the elimination thread (which was really only to have 3 to list), I also like Tyson more than Bracken as a villain. The only time I bought Bracken as a good villain was his first appearance in After the Storm. After that, he felt like a story crutch to me. 

[roamyn]

Part of the problem with Bracken as villian, IMO, is that he's too much of a caricature vs being a well drawn character, like Jerry Tyson.

[femmefan1946]

So many people have mentioned Murder She Wrote lately.

I would be perfectly happy if Castle lost the precinct entirely and became once again a successful writer, who finds trouble while researching his books and while on book tours (allowing NF to visit exotic locales like... Fiji or Edmonton or Minneapolis).

Pay for the exotic locales by losing Beckett. Make an ongoing theme his search for the 'one-armed man'.

Keep Martha for her sass and wisdom. Keep Alexis as his New York sidekick. Bring back Paula and Gina and Meredith.

Keep Lanie and Ryan for professional advice.

[roamyn]

So many people have mentioned Murder She Wrote lately.

I would be perfectly happy if Castle lost the precinct entirely and became once again a successful writer, who finds trouble while researching his books and while on book tours (allowing NF to visit exotic locales like... Fiji or Edmonton or Minneapolis).

Pay for the exotic locales by losing Beckett. Make an ongoing theme his search for the 'one-armed man'.

Keep Martha for her sass and wisdom. Keep Alexis as his New York sidekick. Bring back Paula and Gina and Meredith.

Keep Lanie and Ryan for professional advice.

What abt Espo? (I love him! And Beckett relies heavily on him.)

You can't lose Becket. That won't fly.

And since my grandparents were acquainted with Dr. Sam Shephard, looking for the one-armed or bushy haired man is too clichéd for me.

I'd dump Alexis, except for short visits, keep Martha as his sassy NY sec'y. No exotic locales. But yeah, focus more on writing. Keep Beckett as a cop/captain, and use her (& Ryan & Espo & Lanie) as sounding boards.

[pawneerangers]

This thread was so much fun to read. It really made me think about the show. I think my most unpopular opinion is that I didn't really love Beckett at the very beginning like so many other fans did. She was fine and had things about her you could admire but she was just that usual tough and hardass yet compassionate female detective that's so common in mysteries so I couldn't really warm up to her much. I couldn't even understand why Castle thought she was so special and like no one he had ever met before except that maybe he just socialized with such high society types that even a typical female detective was a novel experience for him. I agree that her character changed a little along with her hair and the show went overboard with having her have so much knowledge and being so excellent at everything, but I don't agree that she lost her uniqueness because I never thought she was that unique even when the show first started. 

 

I loved Castle's character in the first and second season so much though. I understand why people think he was much too egotistical and immature and I was nodding with the people who said they might find him annoying if they met him and want to knock him down a peg but as a character I just thought he was so charismatic and interesting and agree with the fans who called him charming and endearing. I thought his passion for things was cute rather than childish a lot of times. I'm so sick of fictional brooding guys whose angry misery is supposed to be sexy that I love how happy he was about even the little things and how he encouraged Beckett to see the fun in things too. I also thought he was always a good guy who cared about other people rather than just being in love with himself. It makes me sad that having him grow up and mature meant taking away some of what I loved about him and he just has less energy and joyfulness now. 

 

I love Caskett and still do even though someone might not think so from what I wrote here so far LOL! I have the unpopular opinion that I still think they have great chemistry even if some of their conflicts are annoying to watch. 

 

I loved Montgomery and never cared about Gates. I just didn't warm up to her even though I was a big fan of bringing in a female character to be in charge. 

 

I agree that Esposito and Lanie is really lame and couldn't care less about whether they end up together but Esposito's bromance with Ryan is one of my favorite things so I would never want him off the show. 

 

And finally this one is really weird but this is the place to confess it, so I will admit that I hate how Beckett and Castle still call each other by their last names. I understand that that's their habit by now and how they think of each other but it's just unromantic to me now that they're together and makes them sound more like frat brothers than a couple sometimes. 

 

This was like going to Castle Confession LOL. It's so much fun to post here. 

Edited September 17, 2015 by pawneerangers

[roamyn]

That's what cops do. They call each other by their last names. Castle likely picked it up by hanging around them.

You'll see that in almost every cop show. Having a romance doesn't always change habits. (THough we do hear them using each other's name when in peril.)

[amensisterfriend]

That's what cops do. They call each other by their last names. Castle likely picked it up by hanging around them.

You'll see that in almost every cop show. Having a romance doesn't always change habits.

 

I agree that that's common among cops and even that it would feel odd for the characters to suddenly address each other differently just because they're married now, but that doesn't mean all viewers have to enjoy that aspect of Caskett :) It doesn't personally bother me that much, but I definitely know what pawneeranger's is saying---Castle and Beckett casually calling each other by their last names as they would any other cop or 'buddy' is not exactly romantic and can even feel like a mood killer in certain scenes. I guess we could argue that it does make those rare moments when they use each other's first names more special, though! 

 

I agree that Esposito and Lanie is really lame and couldn't care less about whether they end up together

 

Maybe I'm just in denial, but I refuse to believe that not "shipping" Lanie/Esposito is an unpopular opinion :) 

 

I love Caskett and still do even though someone might not think so from what I wrote here so far LOL! I have the unpopular opinion that I still think they have great chemistry even if some of their conflicts are annoying to watch

 

I've seen you on the Gilmore Girls forums, so now I'm thinking that those of us who saw just how joyless, incompatible and devoid of chemistry Lorelai and Luke were (IMO, obviously) once they finally became a couple---which was also in the very last episode of Season 4, by the way---think that Caskett and most other couples fare awfully well by comparison :) Anyway, I don't always like the writing for Caskett at all and do think that Castle as a character has lost a lot of his liveliness and spark for whatever combination of reasons (maybe because the actor is less enthusiastic...?), but I agree that I still see chemistry between Castle and Beckett and think they're meant to be together.

 

I would be perfectly happy if Castle lost the precinct entirely and became once again a successful writer, who finds trouble while researching his books and while on book tours (allowing NF to visit exotic locales like... Fiji or Edmonton or Minneapolis).

 

I've spent most of my life in NYC and always adored how the show so lovingly films and captures different parts of the city, but by now I, too, would really love to see them in a wider variety of locales :)   

 

I don't know if this is unpopular or not, but I hate the 'Castle and Beckett save the woooorld'/conspiracy/domestic and international crisis type of storylines. A key part of the show's charm for me is that underneath the slickly modern urban setting and snarky contemporary dialogue it's actually one of the few shows that's reminiscent of an old-fashioned, timeless whodunit, with generally relatable suspects and motives that tap into various aspects of human nature and emotions we can all identify with (jealousy, fear, greed, etc.) while also allowing for humor and fun. I totally get that 7+ seasons of more traditional whodunits would get stale for people, but I still almost always prefer the Murder She Wrote-ish ones over the 'bigger stakes' episodes that remind me more of a generic made-for-TV action movie of the week.   

[amensisterfriend]

ETA: I forgot to mention another one! While I love Beckett's look in S1 overall, I didn't like either her hair or dress in Home is Where the Heart Stops. Given the ooohhing and ahhhing over how gorgeous she looked, I'm guessing that's a UO :) 

[roamyn]

I've spent most of my life in NYC and

I don't know if this is unpopular or not, but I hate the 'Castle and Beckett save the woooorld'/conspiracy/domestic and international crisis type of storylines. A key part of the show's charm for me is that underneath the slickly modern urban setting and snarky contemporary dialogue it's actually one of the few shows that's reminiscent of an old-fashioned, timeless whodunit, with generally relatable suspects and motives that tap into various aspects of human nature and emotions we can all identify with (jealousy, fear, greed, etc.) while also allowing for humor and fun. I totally get that 7+ seasons of more traditional whodunits would get stale for people, but I still almost always prefer the Murder She Wrote-ish ones over the 'bigger stakes' episodes that remind me more of a generic made-for-TV action movie of the week.

Oh, amen sister, I am sooo with you on this.

While I actually liked Pandora / Linchpin, it's better suited to Jack Bauer.

And I hated Setup & the other one.

Hunt / Target I don't consider this type, because it's really Volkov vs. Jackson. And I thought Nathan did an amazing job,as well as the actors who played Sara's parents.

But the conspiracy ones drive me nuts. Give me some quirky or intense murder any day.

[BellyLaughter]

I am on this team too!

It's like do you want to be a quirky "Murder She Wrote" type show or do you want to be 24's ugly second cousin???

The conspiracy episodes always went too far and it's why I pretty much hated all the 2 parters.

And while I'm at it -- I think I am the only Castle fan who absolutely hates the character of Jordan Shaw....more like Jordan Yawn!

[verdana]

ETA: I forgot to mention another one! While I love Beckett's look in S1 overall, I didn't like either her hair or dress in Home is Where the Heart Stops. Given the ooohhing and ahhhing over how gorgeous she looked, I'm guessing that's a UO :)

I'm not certain your dislike of her dress and 'helmet hair' as I call it is an unpopular one. I've seen a lot of fans disliking that dress as for her hair it looked as if she was wearing a wig that didn't fit her properly. Edited September 18, 2015 by verdana

[femmefan1946]

I'm so sick of fictional brooding guys whose angry misery is supposed to be sexy that I love how happy he was about even the little things and how he encouraged Beckett to see the fun in things too.

 

Yes!

There is a popular opinion that the best person to marry is the one who makes you laugh.

[Julia]

I've spent most of my life in NYC and always adored how the show so lovingly films and captures different parts of the city, but by now I, too, would really love to see them in a wider variety of locales :)

Did they film an episode in NY? Because the series is filmed in LA, as far as I know.

[WendyCR72]

Did they film an episode in NY? Because the series is filmed in LA, as far as I know.

 

Yep. Best I can figure is the crew goes to NYC for establishing shots. But it is filmed in L.A. and NYC is recreated. Besides, NYC looks...more pristine on Castle than it does on other shows that do film there. Hee.

[amensisterfriend]

So for all the very popular (and understandable!) complaints about Beckett's characterization post S2/S3 or so, my possibly unpopular opinion is that Castle has actually changed just as much---and I'm not referring to NF's appearance! He was initially bursting with energy, joie de vivre, a benign sort of cockiness, charm etc. He was also far more clever, sharp and astute.  Now he's...well, none of these things, at least not to nearly the same degree. I can't pinpoint exactly when that all started to change, but in my (unpopular?!) opinion there really is a pretty pronounced difference between who he was when the series started and who he is now. And I totally get that he had to mature---I love that his feelings for Beckett and his work as a de facto detective forced him to take things more seriously, get a little deeper and maybe even become a bit more humble. But there's a difference between growing as a character and growing right out of the traits that made a certain character distinctive to begin with, and for me they crossed that line with Castle. I miss his infectious joy, and I miss thinking that his partnership/relationship with Beckett---while challenging from the beginning---made him a happier and even 'better' person while now it often seems the opposite.      

Edited October 2, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[amensisterfriend]

---Oh, and unrelated note, based on our episode elimination game this seems to be a very unpopular opinion, but...I love S1's Hedge Fund Homeboys.   I'll show myself the door ;) 

[Guest]

Agree about Castle, asf. He's lost his light-heartedness, he's no longer a writer, and he feels like a shell of his old self.

My uo is that I still like Alexis. I didn't like her with Pie, but other than that, I've never disliked her.

[roamyn]

Agree about Castle, asf. He's lost his light-heartedness, he's no longer a writer, and he feels like a shell of his old self.

My uo is that I still like Alexis. I didn't like her with Pie, but other than that, I've never disliked her.

My UO is that I actually liked Pi. He was,a good counterpoint to Alexis's stiffness. Helped her loosen up. Plus he was damn hot! He was also a great foil for Castle.

I think Castle 's joie de vivre changed from lightheartedness, to goofiness. And not fun goofiness, but embarrassing goofiness. He seems to have reverted in age behavior. And his theories are so outlandish to ge unthinkable (and almost always abt conspiracy).

Edited October 3, 2015 by roamyn

[amensisterfriend]

Ready for this one?! I've actually grown to LIKE Beckett's S2 mullet. It's not that I love the hairstyle itself, but somehow it suits the Beckett of those first two seasons---practical, low maintenance, a little endearingly out of it and socially awkward yet distinctive and sneakily cute. It looks like a hairstyle that might be worn by an extremely busy detective who isn't quite sure how or whether to bother with her hair and is torn between growing it out and chopping it off altogether. It's just much more "Beckett'---or at least my personal version of the character---than the frosted, overprocessed, overlong pageant-y locks of later seasons. 

 

In other possible UOs, why is S2 always so much more awesome than I recall?! Not even Demming can ruin it for me! (And, unpopularly enough, I actually far prefer Demming to douchey motorcycle riding surgeon Josh.) 

Edited October 4, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[Tim]

My UO is I absolutely loved S 2 Finale where poor little KB heart gets broken when Gina walks out of the precinct with Castle.  After Flaunting PDA in the work place and inviting super cop into Coffee Land, I was glad to see Castle grow a pair and tell her to take a hike, there were other woman out there.  Too Bad it was short lived and it was the start of Rinse Recycle Repeat on making Castle wait like a puppy dog,

[madmaverick]

It's not that I love the hairstyle itself, but somehow it suits the Beckett of those first two seasons---practical, low maintenance, a little endearingly out of it and socially awkward yet distinctive and sneakily cute. It looks like a hairstyle that might be worn by an extremely busy detective who isn't quite sure how or whether to bother with her hair and is torn between growing it out and chopping it off altogether. It's just much more "Beckett'---or at least my personal version of the character---than the frosted, overprocessed, overlong pageant-y locks of later seasons.

 

This.  Described the Beckett that I miss perfectly.  I wish we could have seen that version of Beckett in love with Castle.  S5 Beckett in love threw some nice love eyeballs and was strangely giggly at times, but she wasn't the Beckett in love that I'd once envisioned her to be based on earlier Beckett as you so aptly described.

 

I thought she looked beautiful in an understated way back then, less like other generic TV beauties that she later evolved into, so the hairstyle never bothered me.  The no nonsense Beckett back then might have had no patience for the dramatics of her latter season self either.  I thought the "walls" was the beginning of poor, over dramatic characterisation (didn't Beckett want to 'dive in' with someone in S3?).  As she was characterised as ever more "badass", she was also characterised as ever more "broken" inside.  Those two (cliche?) traits together just don't go well with me.  My idea of a real badass is not someone like that.  So now we finally have Badass Capt. Beckett with her OJD (Obsessive Justice Disorder, haha. thanks to whomever made this up) but she's broken inside and incapable of being 'all in' her happy marriage due to her obsessions.  She's supposed to be torn apart by her demons, but she's still looking immaculate with her locks and look (and looking confident the next), and that just doesn't fit in with my idea of someone who's really making an agonised decision.

 

If this were the early days, characters like Lanie and Espo might be smacking some sense into Beckett.  But as it isn't, Beckett will probably be shown to know best with her OJD as usual.  Because someone's got to take down the bad guys! ;)

Edited October 4, 2015 by madmaverick

[KaveDweller]

I thought the "walls" was the beginning of poor, over dramatic characterisation (didn't Beckett want to 'dive in' with someone in S3?).

That actually made sense to me, because lots of people think they want something, and then realize they are self sabotaging themselves. I always thought the walls conversation sounded like she had made a realization that her issue had caused her previous relationships to fail, and decided to work in that before jumping into a relationship with Castle. Maybe she figured it out with the therapy she had after her shooting?

My unpopular opinion is that I didn't have an issue with Beckett dating josh in S3. She broke up with Demming for Castle and it blew up in her face (even if that was her fault). It looked like Castle was serious about Gina, so it makes sense she would try to move on. And even after Castle split with Gina, he never gave her any indication that he wanted something serious with Beckett. I think if he had told her how he felt she would have ended things with Josh sooner. But he didn't, so there was nothing wrong with her trying to make things work with Josh.

[amensisterfriend]

Kave, ITA! I wasn't trying to say that Kate was wrong to date Josh...just that I personally found Demming more appealing and could better see why he and Kate might connect :)

[madmaverick]

I liked PhDead?  Heh.

[amensisterfriend]

This has come up elsewhere, but it's on my mind since we're about to start S5 of the episode elimination game (and if you're not playing with us yet, please come do so if you're so inclined!!!): I actually love the often maligned S5. I'll readily admit that it contains a few hideously awful episodes that are among the show's very worst, but I just skip them and focus on the episodes I love...and this season contains a surprising number of those, including three or four episodes that are easily among my favorites of the whole series.  For the most part I find vulnerable, relatively insecure, 'how do I go about being in a serious relationship with a guy I love but am scared I'm too different from and will eventually lose?!'  Beckett weirdly relatable and sympathetic this season rather than annoying---and, while not as awesome as the Original Recipe Beckett of S1-S2, a big improvement over flat, generic, 'blandly awesome in every conceivable way' Beckett we get at certain other points of the series.  And I even think that the chemistry and romantic moments between Castle and Beckett in S5 are far better than pretty much everyone else seems to think they are :) (Granted, after suffering through what I considered to be the horrendously depressing, incompatible, chemistry-free Luke/Lorelai pairing on Gilmore Girls, it's possible that my standards in this area are just really low!) 

Edited October 6, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[smiley13]

I like Alexis and I am glad to see that she is getting more airtime.  I like to see her and Castle working together.

[femmefan1946]

It doesn't bother me that Alexis seems to be taking a year off academia to work in the Real World.

And I don't see why she needs a PI license to do it. Her position is as an administrative assistant or an associate. Not everyone working in a law office has legal training for example.

[moodyblue]

My unpopular opinion is that I didn't have an issue with Beckett dating josh in S3. She broke up with Demming for Castle and it blew up in her face (even if that was her fault). It looked like Castle was serious about Gina, so it makes sense she would try to move on. And even after Castle split with Gina, he never gave her any indication that he wanted something serious with Beckett. I think if he had told her how he felt she would have ended things with Josh sooner. But he didn't, so there was nothing wrong with her trying to make things work with Josh.

 

I didn't have an issue with with Beckett dating Josh, and I thought "Good for her!". I also didn't think she should have broken up with him when he decided not to go to Haiti. I remember her getting a lot of criticism for that on the other message board, but I think, knowing what she knew and thoght at the time, she was right to stay with him.

[KaveDweller]

It doesn't bother me that Alexis seems to be taking a year off academia to work in the Real World.

And I don't see why she needs a PI license to do it. Her position is as an administrative assistant or an associate. Not everyone working in a law office has legal training for example.

 

I definitely don't have an issue with the logistics of Alexis working at the PI firm, even if she's still taking classes.  Lots of people intern or work part time jobs while in school.  I had some semesters where I only had classes three days a week, or only in the morning/evenings.  And she said she's getting course credit for it, so that probably takes the place of one class.  It depends on the major, but Alexis doesn't seem to be pre-med or anything that requires more extensive study time.

[roamyn]

I like S5, too.

Beckett seems more feeling this season w/o losing her gritty-ness. Nathan does some of his best work in Hunt/Target. Castle hasn't reverted to childish silliness yet (mostly S7). Alexis is still tolerable. Gates is more open & empathetic. Espo & Ryan never change. Only poor Susan & Tamala get gypped. They're too good of actresses to be under-utilized.

[amensisterfriend]

This one is VERY unpopular, so please be gentle, but I actually would prefer for Beckett to no longer be on the show than to have her on in this capacity. And I say this as someone who ships (shipPED?! It may be past tense at this point!) Castle and Beckett and who has even defended certain incarnations of Beckett. (I even stuck up for her S2 hair!)

 

This show is, IMO, best when it's FUN and entertaining. I don't need them to try to be edgy and dramatic and hit the reset button in a lame attempt to shake things up. I would have been immensely happy with a Hart to Hart type of thing---a bantering but solidly together couple who solve crimes and deal with external conflicts in lieu of serious relationship angst along the way. I never wanted this show to try to push any envelopes or be darker and more dramatic---I just wanted it to do what it used to do so well. This "new direction" isn't making things interesting to me, just aggravating for all the reasons you guys have articulated so well in other threads.

 

And while I hold the related UO of thinking that I COULD enjoy Rick Castle even without Beckett, depending on the writing and other characters he was paired with, in my UO Beckett needs Castle around to be remotely likable and entertaining to me at this point. Otherwise she's just a joyless, dour, strangely narcissistic, generic comic book "badass" who's preternaturally amazing at everything in the world other than having an actual personality and who sucks the energy from most of her scenes. For me, Beckett needs Castle to lighten her up, tap into her more soft and human side, and change that glower into a smile. Castle obviously has MANY flaws---arguably far more than the dully 'perfect' Beckett often does---but at least I can still enjoy him as a character in scenes with people other than Beckett. In fact, I may as well amp up the unpopularity and admit that at this point I might find him MORE enjoyable when in scenes with people other than Beckett. As much as I've loved their pairing at times, I'm now struggling to remember why I want them to be together. I'd almost rather Castle be single again or eventually paired with, say, an endearingly geeky woman or just someone who brings more joy and humor to the show.  

[Tim]

Well Get Ready for it  **************** Surprisingly I agree with you, I remember one of her lines from Wives of Wall Street, Are you incapable of telling the truth to the producer, funny how that line comes back to bite her in the Ass.  She is the character that has really went from super chemistry with Nathan, Seasons 1-2 Ok in Season 3 and Total Train Wreck in S 4. 

 

I think Stana Katic is a sweet human being, but looking at some of her tweets and Instagram, wonder where she is coming from.  She looses me often in some drabble that the fans embrace as manna from heaven, I don't get it.  She (Beckett)  has pushed, lied, cheated, even if it was emotional, and now throws away her marriage for revenge?  Not buying into it for a minute.  Nathan can and has had chemistry with several co-stars including Maddie, Ellie Monroe, Shaw, Sophia, Natalie R, and several more including K Lehman.  SK had Will a stiff, Demming, nice guy but cardboard at best, Josh, who is second to only Mark Polish for creepy Erik Vaughn who was the Dumbest episode ever until FBOW, and some super star she flirted with don't remember the episode.

 

I think the Show Runners and writers have painted the character into such a corner I don't think she will ever be credible in a relationship with Castle or anyone.  I wait for her next lie, oh yea no more secrets, so she is living it and the lunacy of any man who would take that much crap from any woman is totally ridiculous.  IMO Winters and Hawley have pitched the last three years of character development, and now gambled the house on fans being patient.  Ratings show that they may have bet the farm on some magic beans when they should have bought the cow.  So Sad and disappointing to see how far down this show has gone, if it were a horse I would say Shoot it and put it out it's misery.  IF they can't fix this fast, we won't have to worry about S 9, and I can live at the end of S7 and through Fan Fics which by the way some kick Old Man Winter and Hacker Hawleys ass,  My Rant, and stand by it

Edited October 13, 2015 by Tim

[Gant]

I'm not the biggest fan of the way Beckett's been written since season 3, and mostly agree with what amensisterfriend wrote, but I doubt it has anything to do with Stana Katic's Instagram or supposed "hook ups"... Not sure if it still fits the Unpopular Opinion niche though.

Edited October 13, 2015 by Gant

[Tim]

Edited to remove personal opinion and you are correct in your statements

 

[smiley13]

I have no idea what all of the wig talk is about.  Her hair looks the same to me.