TCM: The Greatest Movie Channel

[prican58]

It's funny, Rinaldo, how often folks say that the old Hollywood stars are all gone. Mickey Rooney, Eli Wallach, Joan Fontaine, among others have died within the last couple of years. I guess De Havilland is probably the last "great" star remaining but when someone like Joan Leslie passes on you realize that still others do remain. Jane Powell, Margaret O'Brien and I'm sure there are more actors with various degrees of fame. 

 

On another note, I am watching the Decades Channel and a show called The Rogues from 1964. Stars are Gig Young, David Niven, Charles Boyer and Gladys Cooper. They all didn't necessarily appear in every show together as they played international cousins who try to con the con men and foil the nefarious. It's a great example of how with the death of the studio system, the old guard moved over to tv. I'm watching Ida Lupino guest starring on it now. I had never heard of it as it only lasted one season.

 

Charles Boyer as charming as ever. 

[elle]

I was going to say that actor looks amazingly like Audie Murphy to me.  I was almost thinking Brando for the Clooney character.

I agree, especially how young this actor looks and how young Audie was.

 

I'm not sure if there is an easy one to one to one amalgam (pardon the expression) for Clooney's character.  Robert Taylor is an obvious choice because of the comparison to the fictional movie and "Quo Vadis".  I also see bits of Richard Burton.  But, from what little bit I have seen of the trailer, it looks like he is almost playing Ulysses Everett T. McGill in Hollywood.

 

I had to look this up, but a few other MGM cowboys include Tim McCoy and Gary Cooper.

[Milburn Stone]

I'm not sure if there is an easy one to one to one amalgam (pardon the expression) for Clooney's character.  Robert Taylor is an obvious choice because of the comparison to the fictional movie and "Quo Vadis".  I also see bits of Richard Burton.  But, from what little bit I have seen of the trailer, it looks like he is almost playing Ulysses Everett T. McGill in Hollywood.

 

My reaction to the trailer was that the various characters were not supposed to even be amalgams of real-life stars. So, it's not like Clooney is "mostly A, with bits of B, and just a smidgen of C thrown in." Rather, I perceived the intent as: "These are recognizable archetypes of the sorts of actors who populated Hollywood back then." The difference between a roman a clef and a novel, if you will.

[Rinaldo]

I'll buy that, Milburn Stone. Though there was really only one swimming movie star, so we probably have to allow for a decent smidgen of Esther Williams in that character.

 

I adored The Rogues. It was only one season, yes, and it didn't quite work out as planned even while it lasted: Boyer, Niven, and Young were to be the main characters, but Niven had a much more active movie schedule than the other two at that time, while Young's was winding down, so they tended to alternate episodes, with Young getting the most, and only a few had two or three of them. The workload on Young was so much more than anticipated that Larry Hagman was brought in to shoulder some of the burden. Gladys Cooper and Robert Coote (which I always think of as a My Fair Lady reunion, though she did the movie and he the stage production) were the people at headquarters, running the jobs and playing supporting roles in the scams (they of course didn't have major movie careers at that point). I wish the show could be issued on DVD.

 

Added: I just discovered that I get this channel, of which I was previously unaware! And a Rogues marathon seems to be going on right now! Thank you, thank you.

Edited October 18, 2015 by Rinaldo

[prican58]

Was watching "Jezebel"  this evening and I wonder about the plantation scenes with all the slaves and their children singing and dancing at the urging of Miss Julie.
 
What was going through the minds of the film makers ie. screenwriters when putting this film (and others) together.  Was it "Oooh, let's have all the black folk hanging around the big house and have them sing and dance for the white folk." And what could possibly have been going through the minds of these African Americans as they basically had to sing for their supper? It isn't a news flash to me..Hollywood was (and is) rife with racist images and I understand that in order for us to have our Poitiers, other folks had to pave the way. I get it.  It's just so aggravating. I usually can brush it off as history but what set me off was actress Theresa Harris who played Zette, Julie's maid. 

 

Now, I know this actress' history. She had been acting since 1930 in a ridiculous amount of uncredited roles before and after playing an important role in Baby Face with Stanwyck (she did get credit in this one). And I love her as Maureen O'Hara's  housekeeper Cleo in Miracle on 34th Street (no credit here either).    What set me off was that in watching, I didn't recognize her. Why? She was a light skinned woman, not like Dorothy Dandridge but more like Lena Horne. Since I didn't recognize her at first I thought to myself,  Hmmm, this is not this actress's actual skin tone. It seems "polished" for lack of a better word. Yep, her skin had been darkened to match the skin of the other Blacks in the cast like Eddie Anderson and Stymie Beard. And then in checking the credits there it was...Theresa Harris as Zette.  It just riled me up!

As I said, none of this type of casting is news to me but it just seemed so blatant!  Am I over reacting? I'm sure Miss Harris was happy to be working and actually having scenes with Bette Davis. But it must have eaten at her craw to have to give in to this stuff. This woman was talented in so many ways and it is such a crime that the world was the way it was back then. In and out of Hollywood.

 

Ok. I have vented. Still....

[Rinaldo]

If I may, I don't think you're overreacting at all, it's a perfectly proportionate reaction to what you describe. But you also answered your own questions (as I'm sure you know), it's no new discovery that the world was the way it was (which is no excuse in a sense, but it's beyond changing from where we are, not that we live in a perfect world now of course). And, again of course, there are even much worse examples in old Hollywood (and in real life) from that period.

[Julia]

Was watching "Jezebel"  this evening and I wonder about the plantation scenes with all the slaves and their children singing and dancing at the urging of Miss Julie.

 

What was going through the minds of the film makers ie. screenwriters when putting this film (and others) together.  Was it "Oooh, let's have all the black folk hanging around the big house and have them sing and dance for the white folk." And what could possibly have been going through the minds of these African Americans as they basically had to sing for their supper?

 

I'm already on the record somewhere back in this thread about how godawful I think the racial politics of Jezebel are - somewhere on a continuum between GWTW and Birth of a Nation, JMO - but in the twisted internal logic of a thoroughly awful, racist plot, there actually is a reason for that scene.

 

Everything in this movie leads to the scene where in order to redeem herself by sacrificing her life, Julie has to get Pres away from his quaker wife. She does that by convincing her that Julie has to be the one to take him to the fever island, because (as a quaker and an abolitionist) his wife doesn't understand 'darkies' or know how to give them orders.

Julie, of course, is a sociopathic narcissist and a spoiled child and a total loss as a human being, but she's still a white southerner. So when the crazy little skinny white lady who wants them to interrupt their dying to act as unpaid servants says hop, naturally 'darkies' on the island are gonna hop. Which is what that scene was. Julie making people hop, so we know she can do it.

[Milburn Stone]

As I said, none of this type of casting is news to me but it just seemed so blatant!  Am I over reacting? I'm sure Miss Harris was happy to be working and actually having scenes with Bette Davis. But it must have eaten at her craw to have to give in to this stuff.

 

 

Although the treatment of black actors in movies is certainly the most egregious example of demeaningness, somewhere along the same spectrum is the casting of actors specifically because they look hideous (Vincent Schiavelli), or because they are good at playing gay stereotypes embraced by audiences (Franklin Pangborn), or because they are eminently believable as *ssholes (William Atherton, Jeffrey Jones). In all these cases, from egregious to less so, I think you're correct that the actors are grateful for the job, but I think their gratification goes beyond that. I think they probably say, "Damn, I'm good at playing the [fill in stereotype here]." I bet they took pride in it. And they weren't wrong. I don't know for sure, but I bet that even Stepin Fetchit and Willie Best, along with Franklin Pangborn, took considerable pride in being skilled comic actors adept at playing stereotypes, for which we shouldn't condemn them unless we are equally willing to be condemned by future generations for our sins. 

[Rinaldo]

As the question was raised (5 pages back) whether Gena Rowlands had the body of film work to her credit to merit a lifetime achievement award, here's today's entry in one of the blogs I follow (the author has praised Rowlands on more than one occasion, as she mentions).

 

It's not proof of anything, of course; but it's one item in the case for the defense: "Gena Rowlands' Lifetime Achievement Oscar."

[Milburn Stone]

It's hard for me to argue against the Gena Rowlands blog post. The facts are clearly on the side of "she's done a ton of praiseworthy movie work."

 

This leaves me wondering why, against all reason, I continue to think of her as "not a movie star."

 

Oddly, I think of her more as a theater actress. Oddly, because I consulted the ibdb, and it turns out she's only been in one Broadway play in her entire life, and that in 1956!

 

Yet something about her, despite all evidence to the contrary, makes me think of her as a theater actress, not a movie actress. It very well could be just me.

[voiceover]

Was glad to hear Amy Heckerling echo some of my own thoughts on A League Of Their Own, a movie I have always wished to like more than I do.  It's grown on me a little over the years, but not much.

Let's start with the good: 

*The "There's no crying in baseball!!" scene is -- ugh, I hate to trot out an overused -- iconic.  Not just for movie fans, but for sports fans (of which, I am both, so...)  It's probably an even bigger deal to sports fans.  It's hilarious and true and Tom Hanks plays it brilliantly.

*The moment when the women are playing catch on the field, and the ball goes over Geena Davis's head, and drops in front of a group of African-American women.  She motions for the one closest to her to toss it back, and she does.  But it's not any weak-ass lob -- it's a bullet over Davis's head that is caught by another player, some distance away.  No dialogue after -- just a reminder about who wasn't even allowed to play with the girls.  "At least", at that time, the Negro Leagues flourished.  For the men.

* Any time Geena Davis and Tom Hanks share a scene.  Some great chem, wasted.  Okay: I get why they weren't going to have a romance.  But I wish they would have!

 

And the rest: bleahhhhh.  I thought Kit was a brat, and if we're going to be treated with that ending to the game, shouldn't I be rooting for her?  What a way to undercut the theme of powerful women!

have someone tank it because of guilt??

 

And that whole tacked-on DVD extra!! as Heckerling said, sholdn't we feel happy? joyful?  Instead, it's all an old lady-memory-downer.

 

*grumbling while climbing down from high horse*

Edited October 21, 2015 by voiceover

[bluepiano]

I don't know for sure, but I bet that even Stepin Fetchit and Willie Best, along with Franklin Pangborn, took considerable pride in being skilled comic actors adept at playing stereotypes, for which we shouldn't condemn them unless we are equally willing to be condemned by future generations for our sins. 

 

Golden Era Hollywood was full of great character actors and actresses, who, like Franklin Pangborn, did more or less the same schtick in every movie. For me, it's one of the joys of movies of that era, because they were so good at what they did. But for African-American performers, it was a different matter, because they were limited by their race. You mention Willie Best, who I love. Bob Hope once called him the best comic actor he ever worked with. But it wasn't like Hollywood was ever going to give Willie Best a starring vehicle, in the way Red Skelton graduated from playing small roles to getting his own movies. (Sadly, Best died young, but that's another story).

 

As to how black (or Asian or Latino) performers felt about the mostly clichéd roles they had to play, I think that's a complicated question. It's probably best not to generalize, and also best to resist viewing things through the lens of our own time in history. For example, it's easy for us today to look at the maids and "mammies" that Hattie McDaniel played, and see her as a victim. But off screen, she lived in a mansion, dressed elegantly, and rode around in a chauffeured limo, which according to accounts I've read from the time, was a great source of pride for black people. Twenty or thirty years later, she might've been considered a sell-out, but for her time, it was the fact of her success that mattered, and her winning the Academy Award I'm sure was cause for huge celebration.

Edited October 22, 2015 by bluepiano

[prican58]

So correct , bluepiano. They all did the best they could in the circumstances they were given.

 

I'm watching The Producers in between innings of the Mets game and Dick Shawn is just so freaking hilarious in his "audition" within the movie. Total nut job and he would have been so successful in this current era of show biz. 

 

 

He's equally nuts in Mad, Mad, Mad World, as well

Edited October 22, 2015 by prican58

[ratgirlagogo]

  Hattie McDaniel and others who played servants - those were not always demeaning characters, as the many admirers of Moliere and P.G. Wodehouse and Gone With the Wind  could tell you.  Hattie's character may be a slave but she is the most admirable character in the movie. Of course I love Moliere and Wodehouse but I don't like GWTW. 

 

I believe that Stepin Fetchit and SleepnEat made a living (Stepin Fetchit in particular made a lot of money) playing demeaning characters most of the time.  I have no real idea what they were capable of as performers beyond that - plenty of contemporary performers seem pretty equally limited even without social limits.  On the other hand I've always felt  Mantan Moreland really could have played any character that Bob Hope played - he played an identical witty cowardly loveable character - as you can see in anything he was in - next time they shoehorn King of the Zombies into 31 Days of Oscar watch how he elevates a  miserable B-horror movie - into, well, into one of my favorites for me.  I don't think I've ever seen a bad performance from him, not even towards the end of his life - his brief turn in Spider Baby for example is wonderful (which you can compare with poor alcohol-addled Lon Chaney Jr's in the same film).  He is someone that I am CERTAIN could have had a more celebrated career twenty or so years later.

Edited October 22, 2015 by ratgirlagogo

[Crisopera]

Hattie McDaniel famously said, "I'd rather play a maid than be one."

[Milburn Stone]

Golden Era Hollywood was full of great character actors and actresses, who, like Franklin Pangborn, did more or less the same schtick in every movie. For me, it's one of the joys of movies of that era, because they were so good at what they did. But for African-American performers, it was a different matter, because they were limited by their race.

 

For the most heart-breaking case of a black actor limited by prejudice, look no further than Ernest Anderson, who played a young shop assistant (to Olivia de Havilland) going for his law degree in John Huston's second movie as a director, In This Our Life. (It immediately follows The Maltese Falcon in Huston's résumé.) It's an important part, with well-written dialogue that Anderson projects with quiet intelligence and pride in a most un-stereotypical manner for the period. All things considered, it was an amazingly progressive performance in an amazingly progressive movie in terms of race.

 

And then...nothing. Anderson was forced by stereotyping to play nothing but porters, waiters, elevator operators, and houseboys for the rest of his career. Often in roles so small they were uncredited. He has about five seconds as a porter in North by Northwest, uncredited.

 

Although there are other cases of wasted talent in Hollywood history, I know of nothing comparable to Anderson's descent. But you have to watch In This Our Life to know it.

[Wiendish Fitch]

In This Our Life is indeed a strange movie: when Bette Davis is onscreen, it's trashy melodrama (not her fault, it's just how her character is written); when Olivia de Havilland is onscreen, it's a more down-to-earth story. I love the scene when de Havilland's Roy (yes, she and Davis have masculine names in this movie, just go with it) learns of Anderson's Parry's ambitions to be a lawyer, and she offers encouragement and support (and not in a condescending, indulgent way). Their scenes are my favorite in the movie, and I love how Parry is allowed to be thoughtful, well-spoken, and human, as opposed to a one-note stereotype. How shameful that the racism of the time hindered the talented Anderson. Alas, his story is just one of too many.

 

 

[Inquisitionist]

TCM fans might enjoy this New Yorker blurb about Dance, Girl, Dance which starred Lucille Ball and Maureen O'Hara.  There's a video-clip, too.

 

... with the best women directors, their experiences of gender relations fuse with the depiction of women characters—and also, as with the director Dorothy Arzner, in the film “Dance, Girl, Dance” (which I discuss in this clip), give rise to a distinctive aesthetic style that embodies that experience. The question isn’t whether a man could have come up with these cinematic devices and deployed them to the same end; only Arzner did so. In the process, she got fiercely committed performances from her leads...

 

I'll keep an eye out for this one.

[ratgirlagogo]

And indeed you should.

[prican58]

Fitch and Milburn, I  had forgotten about that. I have seen the film several times and always came away with the notion that Mr Anderson was a gem that never got to shine. He was a very attractive young man and he could have had a nice career.

 

I kind of liken it to actors like Philip Ahn, Keye Luke, Victor Sen Yung and other Asian Ameican actors who were able to have very long careers even though they played many stereotypical roles as well. Maybe it was due to the fact that they were most active in the WWII years and so many films about the War were made and films did need their share of "Japanese" characters. Americans couldn't tell the difference between the various Asian groups so any Asian American  actor could play Japanese as long as he fit the role.

I've been wondering what book to read next and I think I will get Donald Bogle's Bright Boulevards, Bold Dreams: The Story of Black Hollywood. I have always wanted to read it so no time like the present (or near future).

 

Amazon, here I come.

[bluepiano]

I kind of liken it to actors like Philip Ahn, Keye Luke, Victor Sen Yung and other Asian Ameican actors who were able to have very long careers even though they played many stereotypical roles as well.

 

The career of Anna May Wong was an interesting one. She was beautiful and talented but of course could never be a major star. She supposedly campaigned to get the lead female part in The Good Earth, but the role went to German-born Luise Rainier. (And the male lead was American Paul Muni).

 

 

I'm watching The Producers in between innings of the Mets game and Dick Shawn is just so freaking hilarious in his "audition" within the movie. Total nut job and he would have been so successful in this current era of show biz. 

 

In addition to The Producers and Mad Mad World, offhand his only other movie I can think of was Penelope, where he played Natalie Wood's shrink. It was a more conventional role, but he was good in it. I just don't think that Hollywood knew what to do with him.

 

In the '50 and early '60s members of my family owned a night club a little north of New York City. Dick Shawn played there, and years later they were still talking about how funny he was. (Among others who performed there were Diahann Caroll, Lenny Bruce, and Jonathon Winters. Sadly, it was all before my time.)

Edited October 23, 2015 by bluepiano

[Rinaldo]

prican58, that's somewhat akin to the way that refugee actors from Nazi Germany, who fled to avoid persecution or out of hatred of the regime, often found that the roles available to them (because of their accents, and to some extent their appearance) in WWII movies were Nazis.

[Milburn Stone]

 

I've been wondering what book to read next and I think I will get Donald Bogle's Bright Boulevards, Bold Dreams: The Story of Black Hollywood. I have always wanted to read it so no time like the present (or near future).

 

Amazon, here I come.

 

I read his Toms, Coons, Mulattoes, Mammies and Bucks years ago. (The seventies?) The title is so memorable I didn't even have to look it up to refresh my memory as to what order the words came in.

 

But I didn't know he wrote another one. From the title of T,C,M,M and B you can deduce that it was about the stereotypical roles black actors were forced to play. Does Bright Boulevards cover substantially different ground?

[aradia22]

On this topic (sort of) does anyone know of a good biography of Anna May Wong?

[mariah23]

There was a good documentary that aired on TCM a years ago. I can't remember what it was called.

[Crisopera]

This one was on PBS a few years ago.  http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2849694/

 

And this was also on PBS: http://www.pbs.org/wnet/americanmasters/hollywood-chinese-introduction/1146/

 

Both very interesting.

[Julia]

The flip side of that was Merle Oberon, whose indian mother posed as her servant because she felt that she wouldn't have a career if anyone found out she wasn't 100% european.

[Crisopera]

Which is of course sadly true for both European and Hollywood films of the period.  She would have been only used as an "exotic," instead of the English Rose she normally played.  She never would have been cast as Anne Boleyn or Cathy in Wuthering Heights, for example; certainly nothing where she was involved in a romantic relationship with a white man, even though she was married to one (Alexander Korda).

Edited October 23, 2015 by Crisopera

[prican58]

I suppose every person with a uniqueness (?) like ethnicity, accent, appearance etc had to struggle to get the lead roles because to the average person watching a movie they couldn't very well play the WASP. Blacks could only really be black on screen (in various hues as witnessed with Theresa Harris), Asians could only be asian (at least Keye Luke and Victor Sen Young got to play Chinese American roles in the Chan films). 

 

I like what you said, Rinaldo, about the German/Austrian actors like Henreid, Paul Lukas, and Conrad Veidt. But really for these 3 men they did play leads and important supporting roles regardless of the accents. Perhaps because they were white men? Hmmm. I was going to say that Lukas and Henreid didn't play Nazis but that would be wrong. At least re Lukas. I know he played a Nazi spy or something in Confessions of a Nazi Spy. He was great in that. (Just realized he was born in Austria-Hungary.)

Type casting and stereotypes don't seem to have a type. If you were "other", whether that be male, female, black, Latin or Asian, if you didn't fit in as a Stewart/Fonda/Cooper or a Flynn/Power or a Crawford/Davis/Stanwyck/Jean Arthur then you were most likely pigeon holed as something else.

 

I guess that's the requirement to be a working character actor as well. Not a bad thing to be.

 

Milburn, I read TCMMB in college and did a report on it.  Yes , the 70's as I graduated in 1981. Here is the Amazon description of the book.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Bright-Boulevards-Bold-Dreams-Hollywood/dp/0345454197/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1445642760&sr=1-1&keywords=bright+boulevards+bold+dreams+the+story+of+black+hollywood

[mariah23]

I'm seriously depressed now.  Maureen O'Hara has died at age 95.

[Milburn Stone]

 

Milburn, I read TCMMB in college and did a report on it.  Yes , the 70's as I graduated in 1981. Here is the Amazon description of [bright Boulevards]:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Bright-Boulevards-Bold-Dreams-Hollywood/dp/0345454197/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1445642760&sr=1-1&keywords=bright+boulevards+bold+dreams+the+story+of+black+hollywood

 

Sounds good. I'm gonna get it.

[3pwood]

I'm seriously depressed now.  Maureen O'Hara has died at age 95.

 

She had a long career & was versatile enough to range from The Hunchback of Notre Dame with Charles Laughton to The Parent Trap with Hayley Mills.  I was surprised that she had settled in Boise, Idaho, but why not?

[mariah23]

She had a long career & was versatile enough to range from The Hunchback of Notre Dame with Charles Laughton to The Parent Trap with Hayley Mills. I was surprised that she had settled in Boise, Idaho, but why not?

Her grandson lived there.

[Crisopera]

Aw, I loved Maureen O'Hara, especially in her swashbuckling movies.  One of the most beautiful women in Hollywood, especially in Technicolor.

[elle]

I have always loved her comedic turn in The Parent Trap as well as the "transformation" from Boston to California.  That is a beautiful dress she wears in that first scene.  imdb shows that she was working as late as 2000.  And I believe she was a guest programmer on TCM as well as being honored at one of the festivals.

[prican58]

Oh wow! I gasped when I saw Ms O'Hara died. I feel shock and awe right now? 95 years. Wonderful that she was not actually ill and she just drifted off to that big back lot in the sky. Great that we got to see her being interviewed by Robert last year.

Miracle on 34th Street will be extra special viewing this Christmas. It's going to be on the big screen Christmas week and weather permitting I will go. I hate being in midtown Manhattan during the last few days before Christmas. But I love that film and it would be a dream come true.

 

I remember seeing her for the first time in Hunchback and really being floored by how beautiful she was. Even in black and white she was mesmerizing.

[3pwood]

 

I hate being in midtown Manhattan during the last few days before Christmas.

 

prican58, want to trade places?  I'm in Calif & Christmas really doesn't work for me without snow.  I envy you being able to see Miracle On 34th Street in its proper setting.

[Julia]

Her last theatrical movie, Only the Lonely, was kind of brilliant. She played the mother of John Candy's Chicago cop something like Shirley McLaine's monster Debbie Reynolds in Postcards from the Edge but not sentimental at all. Just a really brave performance.

[prican58]

prican58, want to trade places?  I'm in Calif & Christmas really doesn't work for me without snow.  I envy you being able to see Miracle On 34th Street in its proper setting.

yes, I see your dilemma, but no, I like the cold/Christmas combo and feeling all warm and cozy. Snow, you can keep. I just hate the crowds and this particular theater is right in the heart of Times Square/Broadway. I would have bought the tickets already but don't know if there will be a snow storm and I wouldn't want to waste my tickets. Yeah, I really do want to see it on the big screen whee it belongs.i

[NewDigs]

Thanks for the Maureen O'Hara memories. NPR remembered her with snippets from The Quiet Man and it's a beautiful movie (but I'm not a John Wayne fan).

You've reminded of so much more.

Parent Trap! I can't count how many times I saw it. Who didn't want Ms. O'Hara for a mom?

And I am very jealous of big-screen Miracle.

[Wiendish Fitch]

Maureen OHara was one the classiest actresses who ever lived, not to mention one of the loveliest creatures to ever grace cinema. She's so lovely in The Hunchback of Notre Dame, vulnerable yet strong in Dance Girl Dance (an underrated feminist gem), wonderfully tough and brave in The Black Swan, and delightful as a modern sophisticate who learns to believe again in Miracle on 34th Street.

 

I will bet you all dinner and a dessert that when TCM or the Oscars do their "In Memoriam" tributes, they will use O'Hara's scenes from The Quiet Man. Seriously, that movie's alternate title could be Maureen O'Hara in 3-Strip Technicolor is More Beautiful than Any of You Can Ever Hope to Be. 

[prican58]

Here is a link to see if Miracle on 34th Street will be playing near you. Good luck

 

http://fathomevents.com/event/miracle-on-34th-street/more-info/theater-locations

[bluepiano]

I suppose every person with a uniqueness (?) like ethnicity, accent, appearance etc had to struggle to get the lead roles because to the average person watching a movie they couldn't very well play the WASP.

 

Myna Loy, born in Montana of Scotch and Swedish heritage, was considered to have an exotic look, so early on she was frequently cast in "native girl" type roles, playing everything from Chinese to Turkish to Mexican. In The Squall (1929), which TCM showed not long ago, she was an evil gypsy temptress. The movie is ridiculously over-the-top, but Myrna looks drop-dead gorgeous, in a role that's a long way from Nora Charles.

 

For one example of many, there was an American actress named Ona Munson, who made a career of playing evil "dragon woman" stereotyped Asians. (She's in a movie they show on TCM called The Shanghai Gesture, which is a hoot. The young Gene Tierney, another "exotic" type, is in that too). Neither Warner Oland or Sidney Toler, the two actors best known for playing Charlie Chan, was Asian. (Oland was born in Sweden). And because of his dark good looks, Jewish New Yorker Jacob Krantz was turned into "Latin lover" Ricardo Cortez. etc. etc.

 

Conrad Veidt, who you mentioned, had a fascinating career. A huge star in the silent movies in his native Germany (Cabinet of Dr. Caligari, The Man Who Laughs), he was outspoken against the Nazis and married a Jewish woman. They fled to England, and then wound up in Hollywood, where he had his most famous English language role as the Nazi captain in Casablanca. He was from a wealthy family, and reportedly gave all his money to the British to help in the war effort. Sadly, he died of a heat attack at only 50.

 

There is a story that many of the extras in the café scene in Casablanca were actually European refugees from the Nazis, and in the scene in which everyone stands to sing La Marseilles many of them were overwhelmed with emotion and some even burst into tears. No wonder it's such a great scene.

Edited October 25, 2015 by bluepiano

[henrysmom]

Talking about wasted talent, I was reminded of commentary on Easter Parade.  The historian talked about the actress playing Ann Miller's maid, and I was intrigued to find out more.  Jeni LeGon had quite a career and quite a life.  This is her obituary from The Independent, a British newspaper.  

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/obituaries/jeni-le-gon-the-first-black-woman-to-sign-for-a-major-hollywood-studio-8459120.html

 

And here is the NY Times obit, which sadly quotes LeGon making rather disturbing comments about Fred Astaire.  Sad.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/17/arts/dance/jeni-legon-singer-and-solo-tap-dancer-dies-at-96.html?_r=0

Edited October 26, 2015 by henrysmom

[Julia]

At the risk of exposing my ignorance, this month's On Demand selections include a bunch of Genevieve Tobin movies. I feel a bit dim, because I've never heard of Genevieve Tobin. Is she someone I need to discover?

[Inquisitionist]

I've never heard of Genevieve Tobin.  According to IMDb, her film appearances stopped in 1940, when she "abandoned her career for high society after marrying" director William Keighley

[bluepiano]

She was in a lot of fluffy comedies in the early '30s, usually playing the flighty socialite. A stock role in comedies of that era, in which everyone seems to live on Park Avenue, wear fabulous clothes, and drink their meals.

 

I have a DVD of a movie she's in with Cary Grant called Kiss and Make-up (1934), in which he's a famous plastic surgeon and she's a rich, spoiled housewife who's his number one patient. It's a fun move, and interesting to see that even in 1934 they were making fun of the obsession with attaining physical "perfection" through artificial means. (Edward Everett Horton is the husband she ditches for Cary. Always a bonus in my book to see EEH).

 

The most significant movie she was in was The Petrified Forest, where she plays Mrs. Chisolm, one of the hostages at the diner. She's again the rich wife, but this time with a hard edge, and it's a good performance. TCM just showed this movie, one of my favorites. Bogart is amazing in the role that supposedly made him a star (he has relatively few lines but makes every one of them count) and Bette never fails to break my heart.

Edited October 26, 2015 by bluepiano

[Rinaldo]

I have an embarrassing admission to make. All these many years I've been alive, I've never been clear in my mind on Maureen O'Hara vs. Maureen O'Sullivan. (I know: all Maureens with Irish surnames are indistinguishable... shame on me.) No excuse: I just hadn't seen enough of their movie work to form a crystal clear picture of the difference.

 

But I made myself work on it for 10 minutes (it took only 10 minutes! why hadn't I don't this before?), and I've got it now. Maureen O'Sullivan was Jane, both for Tarzan and in Pride and Prejudice, and had the Farrow children (which means that she's the one in Hannah and Her Sisters). And Maureen O'Hara did everything else. Yes, I know it's more nuanced than that; but I now feel reasonably confident about a subject that always made me nervous before. So, progress.

[Milburn Stone]

But I made myself work on it for 10 minutes (it took only 10 minutes! why hadn't I don't this before?), and I've got it now. Maureen O'Sullivan was Jane, both for Tarzan and in Pride and Prejudice, and had the Farrow children (which means that she's the one in Hannah and Her Sisters). And Maureen O'Hara did everything else. Yes, I know it's more nuanced than that; but I now feel reasonably confident about a subject that always made me nervous before. So, progress.

 

Yes, but what about Margaret Sullivan? :)

[Rinaldo]

Her, I don't have a problem with. I know where she fits in. (Around 1980 I did briefly mix up Richard Kiel and Kiel Martin, though.)