How To Speculate w/o Spoilers: Hiding the Ball

[Milaxx]

12 minutes ago, Layne said:

Sorry idk what you're trying to say here. Did you mean "I know why Charles was on trial" or "I wonder why Charles was on trial" (or something else)? They're kind of opposite statements so idk which to respond to. :)

typo corrected

[wanderingstar]

Quote

As for Micheala, yeah we could get more backstory without Brett. All it would take is another heart to heart with Asher to allow for more exposition. I just like Brett Butler.

I would like to meet more of Michaela's family and see how she is in that milieu. I'd just like to understand how she transformed from the backwoods girl to the Michaela we know.

[Keepitmoving]

1 hour ago, Gillian Rosh said:

I would like to meet more of Michaela's family and see how she is in that milieu. I'd just like to understand how she transformed from the backwoods girl to the Michaela we know.

Exactly, the actress said in an interview that the character is very polished, she used the word polished, despite her background. Hell, I just want to picture this childhood, and I can't in full. A tough childhood takes on many forms, my mother and her siblings had tough childhoods, but that doesn't mean their childhoods resembled someone else's who one would consider having a tough childhood.  A tough childhood can look a number of different ways and vary in severity.  Bonnie had a tough childhood, horrific, being molested by her father and we have yet to get any backstory on where the hell her mother was when all this was going on.  But while Bonnie, Anna, Wes and Michaela had rough childhoods, the childhoods look different and vary in severity. This is what I mean, Nowalk needs to share that screen time instead of allowing one or two characters to hog up episodes. It's lazy, because from where I'm seated, he's got a ton of story to tell on these characters and I hope he doesn't continue to skimp on the details.  I mean right now I can't tell if mama Pratt ever bothered to make Michaela a damn sandwich.  I mean she looked at mama Pratt and said she didn't know what love was coming from her, so her not knowing whether or not what she feels for Asher is love or not, made total sense to me. But at the same time,  there has got to have been some serious neglect, something for you to walk away from your childhood feeling like you did have any love, not even the feeling of being cared for a little bit and I need details on what that looks like. There are siblings on drugs...I mean, what was an average day in the life of this girl like growing up in the Bayou? How old was she when they found her in that shack, I'm thinking she was a toddler but, I don't know.   Most important, I'd like to know what are these things the actress stated that Michaela had to do to survive, because that's what she also said in the interview, she said "things she had to do." 

Wasting the damn screen time with likes of Meggie and Simon, I hope those two don't come back, there's not enough time to waste on them.

Edited March 15, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[Milaxx]

Quote

  ON 3/21/2017 AT 1:31 AM, ARKISTICMOCKERY SAID:

What I've been trying to figure out is Wes' connection that is not just his DNA. There are so many things that could've happend during the summer break (of course he must have done something to learn more about the Mahoney's) or at the backdoors which we never get to see. Who was he talking to. Is it really In Case of Emergency or is it a code (ICE) could also point out to Immigration and Customs Enforcement which also connects Eve Rothlo again.

Did Frank's phone call to Laurel when she was in Miami (where he mentioned that Annalise sent a hitman) have any weight on the attempt to bring Annalise down?

Let's just say, Laurel have all the rights to be paranoid right now.

The conspiracy theories are really intriguing. And I'm loving it more.

 Mostly I think we have several issues at play. Whatever business dealings the Castillos and Wallace Mahoney and/or the Mahoney family have going on, the need of the Philly DA office to destroy AK and mysteries surrounding Wes/Christophe's parentage. I don't think Laurel's call to Frank had any bearing on them bringing AK down. The DA's office had been trying to bring her down since Sinclair.

Eve didn't actually work for ICE, she was just pretending to in order to get Rose to talk. I will be interested to see who "In Case of Emergency" was.

[harmfulhazards]

41 minutes ago, Milaxx said:

Eve didn't actually work for ICE, she was just pretending to in order to get Rose to talk. I will be interested to see who "In Case of Emergency" was.

Was it explicitly stated that she didn't? Her name and signature were on Rose's release documents, that's how Wes found out about her involvement. It would have been extremely stupid on her part to use her real name if she was pretending. And so far Eve has been portrayed as someone relatively careful. I have always assumed that she did really work for ICE at the time and just agreed to abuse her authority a little as a favor for Annalise.

[Milaxx]

AK told Wallace it really wasn't ICE, but something she had done  to scare Rose into testifying. Eve has been shown to bend the rues for AK. Her whole defense of Nate was her using her name to bend the rules, including getting the nurse to switch blood test when he was accused of murdering his wife. 

[Milaxx]

Quote

 

  7 HOURS AGO, LADY CALYPSO SAID:

So, with Michaela's reaction in this particular episode, it's odd to think that she'd be reacting this hard over the baby being the "him" that she's crying about, only because Michaela hasn't shown herself to be that invested in Laurel's pregnancy. Unless she had been there when Laurel's baby was born, I'd think that Michaela's devastated reaction is more about Asher or Connor's death than the baby's. 

 

I agree Micheala is likely not crying over the baby but I don't see Nowalk offing another major character this soon. So I really don't see any of the K4 being killed. TBH I don't even see Oliver being in any real trouble. I think Nowalk want to get more mileage out of Coliver. I think Micheala's upset is more along the lines of no matter what they do, they can't get away from the death and destruction that has been their life since they became oart of the K5

[apn85]

15 hours ago, Milaxx said:

I agree Micheala is likely not crying over the baby but I don't see Nowalk offing another major character this soon. So I really don't see any of the K4 being killed. TBH I don't even see Oliver being in any real trouble. I think Nowalk want to get more mileage out of Coliver. I think Micheala's upset is more along the lines of no matter what they do, they can't get away from the death and destruction that has been their life since they became oart of the K5

This I could see. I don't think he would kill another member of the K4. I don't see him offing Oliver either. I do think Michaela could possibly be that upset if Laurel's baby died, but I still don't think it's the baby she's speaking about. It's confusing at times just exactly how close Michaela and Laurel are. On the one hand, you had Michaela telling Laurel in the hospital she would be there for her no matter what. You also had Michaela sitting in bed with Laurel that night the K4 was hanging out in her hospital room. You had Michaela bringing clothes to her for Wes' funeral. You also had Michaela spending the night with Laurel and sleeping in bed with her so she wouldn't be alone upset as she was. All of that is pretty indicative of a close friendship. By the end of last season, it wasn't hard to believe that Michaela and Laurel had honestly become friends and that Michaela genuinely worried about her. THAT Michaela, I could absolutely see crying over something happening to Laurel's baby. 

Then we FF to this season, where it is obvious Michaela hasn't been in contact with Laurel. When they met that night at the restaurant, it was news to Michaela that Laurel was keeping the baby. I don't know if Michaela/Asher and Connor/Oliver had been in contact (I don't really remember the conversation....) but it was clear Laurel had not been in contact with any of them. Also, based on what Connor said when he dropped in on Laurel....none of them, save for him, know she's staying at Wes' place. She apparently still has her apartment. 

So, S3 Michaela, I could absolutely believe crying over Laurel and her baby. S4 Michaela, I'm not entirely sure. Then again, I don't see her crying over Simon or someone random either. Unless its, as you say, just the fact they can't get away from death/destruction no matter how hard they try. She looks awfully traumatized though. 

[Milaxx]

I get the impression that Laurel sort of dropped out of site from all of them and that contact was mainly limited to phone calls and text. Masher has been in touch with Connor because they knew about Oliver's marriage proposal. Overall I got the impression everyone just chilled a bit and tried to get back to normal but kept minimally in touch with each other. It's been a very vague month or maybe two  from what I gather. I didn't find it unusual because once the semester started Michaela was back in care taking mode chiding Connor &  Asher on how to handle themselves at the interviews and even texting Laurel to shower and present herself better.

 

I do have a list of questions I'm trying to keep in the back of my mind because it seems like those are the small exploits PN uses later on for his big reveal. I may update my questions list as the season goes on.

1. Who is Issac talking to before AK comes to his office in ep2? He says "you know what you're doing, you know its wrong. you keep going and I'll stop picking up your calls." or something like that (could this be Simon? IS he also a patient if Isaac?)

2. Laurel is trying to take her dad down. Will that property(?) that her dad signed over into her name come back to cause trouble for her?

3. How long before they realize how troubled Laurel is? It's not just living in Wes's apartment. It looks like she hasn't thrown out any of his old clothes & stuff.

4. Ep 4 previews has AK meet with Dean Hargrove.  Is AK going to work for the University again?

5. Is Simon  just some rando who only serves to act as adversaries to the K4? I'd think there may be more there because those flyers from last season strike me as more than just a jealous student.

6. Did Bonnie's family kick her out after her father was exposed as a pedophile? Did she live with AK? Was she pregnant?

Edited October 18, 2017 by Milaxx

[apn85]

2 hours ago, Milaxx said:

I get the impression that Laurel sort of dropped out of site from all of them and that contact was mainly limited to phone calls and text. Masher has been in touch with Connor because they knew about Oliver's marriage proposal. Overall I got the impression everyone just chilled a bit and tried to get back to normal but kept minimally in touch with each other. It's been a very vague month or maybe two  from what I gather. I didn't find it unusual because once the semester started Michaela was back in care taking mode chiding Connor &  Asher on how to handle themselves at the interviews and even texting Laurel to shower and present herself better.

 

I do have a list of questions I'm trying to keep in the back of my mind because it seems like those are the small exploits PN uses later on for his big reveal. I may update my questions list as the season goes on.

1. Who is Issac talking to before AK comes to his office in ep2? He says "you know what you're doing, you know its wrong. you keep going and I'll stop picking up your calls." or something like that

2. Laurel is trying to take her dad down. Will that property(?) that her dad signed over into her name come back to cause trouble for her?

3. How long before they realize how troubled Laurel is? It's not just living in Wes's apartment. It looks like she hasn't thrown out any of his old clothes & stuff.

4. Ep 4 previews has AK meet with Dean Hargrove.  Is AK going to work for the University again?

5. Is Simon  just some rando who only serves to act as adversaries to the K4? I'd think there may be more there because those flyers from last season strike me as more than just a jealous student.

6. Did Bonnie's family kick her out after her father was exposed as a pedophile? Did she live with AK? Was she pregnant?

I guess it's just hard for me to imagine being pregnant and not knowing if I was going to keep it or not and not telling a close girlfriend of mine who was entirely aware of the situation and had been a support to me. Just can't fathom it. Or, nosy as Michaela can be, her not texting/calling and asking. So for me, it was odd. I get Laurel going off the grid for a bit, but given all that went on, I can't imagine Michaela not checking in on her. It never stopped her before. Or maybe she did and Laurel kept telling her she didn't know what she was going to do yet. It doesn't matter, but I just found it odd. Oh well, Nowalk's world. Not mine. 

Your questions raise some interesting points. Several I have wondered myself. Specifically:

2. That is a very good point! Since it's in her name, who knows! 

3. I had a friend disagree with me, but I think Laurel is deeply depressed. 90% of me wants to be annoyed with her, but then I think about how I also believe she is in a very depressed state. She looks disheveled, she's holed up in Wes' place and as you pointed out....hasn't gotten rid of his things. She doesn't care about much of anything. She lashes out at people who honestly don't deserve it. You'd think her obsession with taking her Dad down would be a tip-off. Or, you'd think Connor would say to Michaela in passing, "Hey, did you know Laurel is staying at Wes' place?" Then again, Connor is on such thin ice with her already that he might not feel it's his place.  

6. I've wondered this since Bonnie made that suggestion to Annalise during S2 in that flashback on how to help with pregnancy aches/pains. Then last week Frank asking Bonnie how she felt when that was her kicked to the curb while pregnant while he was going to bat for Laurel. I think we're gonna find out something like that, for sure. 

[Milaxx]

I think a lot of it goes to Laurel's mental state. She is not well and  I don't have a label for it whether it be depression or PTSD,. So the hiding things from like where she's living and her decision to keep the baby line up with her current mental state. I think Connor is both too caught up i his own depression and still guilty about  Wes to say anything.

 

The more I think about it, the more I think Bonnie did get pregnant & had an abortion. She was the first to offer to assist Laurel if she decided that was what she wanted.

[secnarf]

20 minutes ago, apn85 said:

6. I've wondered this since Bonnie made that suggestion to Annalise during S2 in that flashback on how to help with pregnancy aches/pains. Then last week Frank asking Bonnie how she felt when that was her kicked to the curb while pregnant while he was going to bat for Laurel. I think we're gonna find out something like that, for sure. 

When did this happen?! I don't remember it at all but if it happened like that, then it would be confirmation that Bonnie was pregnant and Frank knew about it.

[Milaxx]

30 minutes ago, secnarf said:

When did this happen?! I don't remember it at all but if it happened like that, then it would be confirmation that Bonnie was pregnant and Frank knew about it.

It was a flashback scene. I think it's in the episode right before AK & Frank go to work on the Mahooney trial. Give me a sec, I can find it. Still looking for the exact ep, but apparently others caught it as well There's an entire reddit thread.

Found it. Ep2.11 around the 14.52 mark. AK has sciatica from the pressure of the baby and Bonnie tells her to lay on her side.  Saying, "it helps sometimes." Perhaps Bonnie was speaking from actual experience.

Then last  episode around 38.29 mark when Frank was trying to convince Bonnie to hire Laurel as an intern he says, "she pregnant Bon, with the dead puppy's baby. What are we supposed to do, kick her to the curb?How did you feel when your family did that to you?"

So yeah, Bonnie was pregnant and Frank knows.

Edited October 18, 2017 by Milaxx

[apn85]

10 minutes ago, secnarf said:

When did this happen?! I don't remember it at all but if it happened like that, then it would be confirmation that Bonnie was pregnant and Frank knew about it.

It was last episode. Frank was trying to convince Bonnie to hire Laurel as her Intern. They were in her kitchen. He said, "She's pregnant, Bon. With the dead puppy's baby. What are we supposed to do? Kick her to the curb? How'd it feel when your family did that to you?" 

[possibilities]

Is Laurel paying rent to keep Wes's apartment as well as her own?

[apn85]

2 minutes ago, possibilities said:

Is Laurel paying rent to keep Wes's apartment as well as her own?

I'm sure! She's got the money. 

[Milaxx]

It's not clear. When Connor came over he had her mail from her old place and that's how he found out she had moved, but that's about it.

[helenamonster]

I didn't think Frank was referring to Bonnie also being pregnant when her family kicked her to the curb, just that they kicked her out (perhaps, unfortunately, for coming clean about her father). But with this show, anything's possible.

They still haven't really answered how Laurel knows her dad kills Wes. Was it really just her seeing Dominic and suddenly putting it all together? The first episode gave me the impression that she had spent the month we missed really digging into things and coming across something juicy, but they seemed to have dropped that (if they ever intended it to begin with).

But yeah, girlfriend needs help (and I maintain the deeply unpopular opinions of both still liking her and not thinking she's taking over the show). The last thing she needs right now is to be a single mother, but she also doesn't need whatever awful thing is certain to have befallen her premature baby.

[apn85]

15 minutes ago, helenamonster said:

I didn't think Frank was referring to Bonnie also being pregnant when her family kicked her to the curb, just that they kicked her out (perhaps, unfortunately, for coming clean about her father). But with this show, anything's possible.

They still haven't really answered how Laurel knows her dad kills Wes. Was it really just her seeing Dominic and suddenly putting it all together? The first episode gave me the impression that she had spent the month we missed really digging into things and coming across something juicy, but they seemed to have dropped that (if they ever intended it to begin with).

But yeah, girlfriend needs help (and I maintain the deeply unpopular opinions of both still liking her and not thinking she's taking over the show). The last thing she needs right now is to be a single mother, but she also doesn't need whatever awful thing is certain to have befallen her premature baby.

 

I know my posts probably don't reflect it, but Laurel is my favorite character. Always has been. I think that is why I have been so distraught, lol. It's just really hard to defend some of the stuff she's done/said, but I still love her. At this point, part of me feels like she needs to go ahead and have a nervous breakdown, so she can focus on healing and come out much better off. I know that sounds horrible, but she's been teetering for a while now. I also think she needs somebody. Everyone needs somebody. I know the mass majority dislikes Frank, but if she'll open up to him and allow him to be there for her, I'm cool with it! And I am not saying romantically, I just mean someone that she can depend on if she were to need something. She doesn't seem to want to rely on the K4 save for their help in figuring out the stuff with Wes. But she's so closed off. She lets people in about as far as talking about her plans and her reasons for avenging Wes and that's it.  One of the most heartbreaking, yet endearing, scenes in the 3 seasons of Laurel was the one between her and Annalise last season. When Annalise came over to her place to tell her Wes had been cremated and Laurel finally just opened up and yelled at Annalise that they trusted her and one of them was dead and they needed to figure out why. Then she admitted to Annalise that she was angry. She let her walls down and opened up for a split second.  Am I expecting that from her anytime soon? No, I'm really not. I just think she's isolated herself so much and won't let anyone close (I have my doubts she'll even let Frank in) and it's sad. 

[Annber03]

21 hours ago, helenamonster said:

But yeah, girlfriend needs help (and I maintain the deeply unpopular opinions of both still liking her and not thinking she's taking over the show). 

I'll join you in that unpopular opinion section :). I fully agree with the posts here about her suffering some sort of depression/breakdown/PTSD sort of deal. 

 

On 10/17/2017 at 7:15 PM, Milaxx said:

.I think Connor is both too caught up i his own depression and still guilty about  Wes to say anything.

I feel like that's the case to some degree with everyone in the group now. I feel like they all do care about what's going on with each other right now, and are probably aware on some level of each other's suffering, but yeah, they're all going through some serious personal shit of some kind. Add in how easy it is for them nowadays to put up these "everything's fine" shields, and yeah. That's going to make it that much tougher to help each other, no matter how much they may personally want to do so. 

[Milaxx]

On 10/19/2017 at 0:36 AM, helenamonster said:

I didn't think Frank was referring to Bonnie also being pregnant when her family kicked her to the curb, just that they kicked her out (perhaps, unfortunately, for coming clean about her father). But with this show, anything's possible.

They still haven't really answered how Laurel knows her dad kills Wes. Was it really just her seeing Dominic and suddenly putting it all together? The first episode gave me the impression that she had spent the month we missed really digging into things and coming across something juicy, but they seemed to have dropped that (if they ever intended it to begin with).

But yeah, girlfriend needs help (and I maintain the deeply unpopular opinions of both still liking her and not thinking she's taking over the show). The last thing she needs right now is to be a single mother, but she also doesn't need whatever awful thing is certain to have befallen her premature baby.

The best thing I can figure is Laurel knows that's the sort of thing Dominic does.  So if he's around somebody's dying. Yeah, don't really know other than her crazy how she knows for sure. As for taking over the show TBH I thought she kinda sucked the air out of the room last season being the weepy widow. Somehow I like unstable, woman on the edge of a nervous breakdown Laurel.

[helenamonster]

On 10/19/2017 at 1:04 AM, apn85 said:

I know my posts probably don't reflect it, but Laurel is my favorite character. Always has been. I think that is why I have been so distraught, lol. It's just really hard to defend some of the stuff she's done/said, but I still love her. At this point, part of me feels like she needs to go ahead and have a nervous breakdown, so she can focus on healing and come out much better off. I know that sounds horrible, but she's been teetering for a while now. I also think she needs somebody. Everyone needs somebody. I know the mass majority dislikes Frank, but if she'll open up to him and allow him to be there for her, I'm cool with it! And I am not saying romantically, I just mean someone that she can depend on if she were to need something. She doesn't seem to want to rely on the K4 save for their help in figuring out the stuff with Wes. But she's so closed off. She lets people in about as far as talking about her plans and her reasons for avenging Wes and that's it.  One of the most heartbreaking, yet endearing, scenes in the 3 seasons of Laurel was the one between her and Annalise last season. When Annalise came over to her place to tell her Wes had been cremated and Laurel finally just opened up and yelled at Annalise that they trusted her and one of them was dead and they needed to figure out why. Then she admitted to Annalise that she was angry. She let her walls down and opened up for a split second.  Am I expecting that from her anytime soon? No, I'm really not. I just think she's isolated herself so much and won't let anyone close (I have my doubts she'll even let Frank in) and it's sad. 

Yeah, I feel this too. I'm both frustrated with the decisions Laurel's making and the storyline the show has put her in, but I want her to come out the other side stronger, even if it does mean she needs to break all the way down first. I miss quiet-but-scary, borderline-sociopath Laurel. Remember when she held onto Michaela's ring and let her squirm so she'd keep quiet about Sam? Good times.

[juliet73]

I think the blood all over the law office belongs to Simon.  Michaela asking the pdoc "is he dead?", she's referring to Simon, not Laurel's baby.  I think Michaela starts to look into Laurel's dad, but doesn't want to get in trouble so she uses Simon's computer, etc so she won't get caught.  Somehow Laurel's dad notices something is not right with his accounts and sends someone out to "take care of it".  I think the blood at Annalise's house is Laurel's due to some kind of pregnancy hemorrage.

Obviously Dr Jimmy Smits is hiding something.  I don't know what he means by Annalise being a trigger for him?  Is it because she is in AA/discussing her drinking and he is a former addict?

Edited October 23, 2017 by juliet73

[Milaxx]

Simon is on my list of suspects to be the dead guy. I don't think it will be Jorge or Jeff because they've already killed Asher's, Wes and Bonnie's fathers. Unless they are planning to kill someone's parents every season, that's enough. Don't forget he made those posters last season and still seems oddly obsessed with AK and the K4.

Random thought:

If Laurel's baby does indeed live, I suspect the blood on Michaela's dress is from rushing the baby to the hospital after whatever happened to Laurel. That would explain the blood only being on her dress as she cradled the baby.

[Aquarius97]

On 24/10/2017 at 1:01 AM, juliet73 said:

I think the blood all over the law office belongs to Simon.  Michaela asking the pdoc "is he dead?", she's referring to Simon, not Laurel's baby.  I think Michaela starts to look into Laurel's dad, but doesn't want to get in trouble so she uses Simon's computer, etc so she won't get caught.  Somehow Laurel's dad notices something is not right with his accounts and sends someone out to "take care of it".  I think the blood at Annalise's house is Laurel's due to some kind of pregnancy hemorrage.

Obviously Dr Jimmy Smits is hiding something.  I don't know what he means by Annalise being a trigger for him?  Is it because she is in AA/discussing her drinking and he is a former addict?

But if that's the case with Simon, why would Laurel's father send someone to kill Simon in the office? That doesn't help to uncover the murder it if they used Simon's account to search things from Laurel's dad, as they would find what Simon "was looking for"

 

Btw, we can have a list of "save" characters: Laurel, Frank, Dr Smits, Michaela, Bonnie, Oliver and AK (she is obviously not going to die)

And also a "non safe" characters: Connor, Asher, Nate, Tegan, Simon, Denver (that would be epic if Denver got killed) and some minor characters like Soraya

I might be missing someone, but more or less that should be the lists. My bet is on Denver to die

[secnarf]

43 minutes ago, Aquarius97 said:

Btw, we can have a list of "save" characters: Laurel, Frank, Dr Smits, Michaela, Bonnie, Oliver and AK (she is obviously not going to die)

And also a "non safe" characters: Connor, Asher, Nate, Tegan, Simon, Denver (that would be epic if Denver got killed) and some minor characters like Soraya

I might be missing someone, but more or less that should be the lists. My bet is on Denver to die

I'm gonna go ahead and say that Laurel's baby is firmly in the "not safe" category.

Regardless of whether you believe Michaela was referring to him when she asked if "he" is dead, that baby is most definitely not safe.

[Milaxx]

3 hours ago, Aquarius97 said:

But if that's the case with Simon, why would Laurel's father send someone to kill Simon in the office? That doesn't help to uncover the murder it if they used Simon's account to search things from Laurel's dad, as they would find what Simon "was looking for"

 

Btw, we can have a list of "save" characters: Laurel, Frank, Dr Smits, Michaela, Bonnie, Oliver and AK (she is obviously not going to die)

And also a "non safe" characters: Connor, Asher, Nate, Tegan, Simon, Denver (that would be epic if Denver got killed) and some minor characters like Soraya

I might be missing someone, but more or less that should be the lists. My bet is on Denver to die

okay, I'll play:

* Definitely Safe: Michaela, Isaac, Oliver, Frank, & Laurel  we all know/have seen. 

My guess as to who's also safe: Asher, Connor, Nate,  & AK. - I don't think any of the K4 will die this season

On the bubble: The baby, Tegan, Jorge & Soroya 

2 hours ago, secnarf said:

Regardless of whether you believe Michaela was referring to him when she asked if "he" is dead, that baby is most definitely not safe.

Agreed. Whether this baby is a 7 or 8 month delivery, the birth appears to have been somewhat traumatic. 

High probability of death: Denver, Simon

 

* I'll update the definitely safe list as they revel the each week.

[possibilities]

Isaac is the shrink, right? Who is Jorge?

[Aquarius97]

9 hours ago, secnarf said:

I'm gonna go ahead and say that Laurel's baby is firmly in the "not safe" category.

Regardless of whether you believe Michaela was referring to him when she asked if "he" is dead, that baby is most definitely not safe.

But the baby is certainly not the one being murdered in C&G

[Milaxx]

4 hours ago, possibilities said:

Isaac is the shrink, right? Who is Jorge?

Isaac is the shrink. Jorge Castillo is Laurel's dad

[Milaxx]

Updating my choices after this week's ep.

 Definitely Safe: Michaela, Isaac, Oliver, Frank, & Laurel  we all know/have seen. 

Probably safe: Asher, Connor, Nate,  & AK. - I don't think any of the K4 will die this season

On the bubble: *The baby, , Jorge & Soroya 

 High probability of death: Denver, Simon, Tegan

 

this week's crackpot theories:

1. Laurel is not pregnant. She was pregnant, found out it was Frank's and that's why she went so mental. Guilt+ grief.The result is a hysterical pregnancy.

2. Simon is Bonnie's long lost baby she had at 14.  He's also my guess for whatever happens at  C & G. I suspect it's Asher being jealous, thinking Michaela is cheating on him and flying into a rage over something stupid Simon says.

3. AK gets Connor to re-eroll in law school.  Or he doesn't return to school and becomes her Frank. (TBH - I'd prefer he get a job with legal, aid, but whatever.)

Edited October 27, 2017 by Milaxx

[Lady Calypso]

7 hours ago, Milaxx said:

 High probability of death: Denver, Simon, Tegan

I'm basically all but convinced it's Simon at this point, after Asher's part in this week's flashforward. And now it can make sense as to why Michaela's so distraught over "his" death. If Asher killed him, she'd be just as distraught over her boyfriend going to jail. 

And now you can add Asher to the "definitely safe" list.

7 hours ago, Milaxx said:

2. Simon is Bonnie's long lost baby she had at 14.  He's also my guess for whatever happens at  C & G. I suspect it's Asher being jealous, thinking Michaela is cheating on him and flying into a rage over something stupid Simon says.

Hmm. I never even considered it. I'm positive Bonnie's baby will make an appearance at some point, and I guess the baby would be in their twenties now. Though, if he IS the baby, which I'm not so convinced of yet, then I don't know why they'd also kill him too, since they'd want to explore that story. So basically, if he is the baby, he goes off my list of death suspects. 

[Milaxx]

Well Michaela asked , "Is he dead?"  Not that he was dead. So maybe Simon lives but Asher is jailed for assault or attempted murder (or maybe Asher's scene is unrelated to the events at C & G.). So Simon lives but is seriously injured.

[possibilities]

If Tegan's dead, that would still leave us wondering which "he" Michaela is suspecting of being dead.

[Milaxx]

True, but the reviews made her seem a little shady.  That could be a red herring though,.

Edited October 27, 2017 by Milaxx

[helenamonster]

17 hours ago, Milaxx said:

2. Simon is Bonnie's long lost baby she had at 14.  He's also my guess for whatever happens at  C & G. I suspect it's Asher being jealous, thinking Michaela is cheating on him and flying into a rage over something stupid Simon says.

As soon as Bonnie said that she didn't know what happened to her baby, I immediately thought it was going to be one of the rugrats. I had to think if the math worked out though. Simon's a second-year law student, so he's 23/24 at the youngest, he could be a couple years older. It's 2016 in show time, which means he would have been born no later than 1992/1993. If Bonnie was 14 when she had him, that means she was 24/25 in 2002 during her trial and when she started law school herself, which checks out. Did they make a reference to exactly how long ago the Councilman (and others) had been raping her. I could have sworn one of Annalise's attempts to discredit her included a "this happened ___ years ago, why are you coming forward now?" Because then that would seal her age, give a year for when she had the baby, and we'd know for sure.

10 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

I'm basically all but convinced it's Simon at this point, after Asher's part in this week's flashforward. And now it can make sense as to why Michaela's so distraught over "his" death. If Asher killed him, she'd be just as distraught over her boyfriend going to jail. 

Exactly. Not distraught over "him" being dead, but if he is, that means Asher is in big, big trouble. Also, that what happened with Sinclair was not a fluke and she's been in love with a very dangerous person.

[Milaxx]

11 minutes ago, helenamonster said:

As soon as Bonnie said that she didn't know what happened to her baby, I immediately thought it was going to be one of the rugrats. I had to think if the math worked out though. Simon's a second-year law student, so he's 23/24 at the youngest, he could be a couple years older. It's 2016 in show time, which means he would have been born no later than 1992/1993. If Bonnie was 14 when she had him, that means she was 24/25 in 2002 during her trial and when she started law school herself, which checks out. Did they make a reference to exactly how long ago the Councilman (and others) had been raping her. I could have sworn one of Annalise's attempts to discredit her included a "this happened ___ years ago, why are you coming forward now?" Because then that would seal her age, give a year for when she had the baby, and we'd know for sure.

"That happened 10 years ago..." That being the rape/birth at 14 meaning Bonnie is 23/24 in 2002

[helenamonster]

3 minutes ago, Milaxx said:

"That happened 10 years ago..." That being the rape/birth at 14 meaning Bonnie is 23/24 in 2002

Alright, then let's start the bidding on which rugrat is Bonnie's long lost kid! Simon probably has the best odds as we don't know much about him/his family life. I'll throw Oliver's name in the ring; we've been with him for three seasons now and know nothing about his family (also Conrad Ricamora is mixed race). Michaela is deeply unlikely, Connor and Laurel slightly less so, and Asher would just be disgusting.

Or...oh my god what if it's Rebecca? And Bonnie killed her own daughter! That's it, that's who I want it to be!

[Milaxx]

Just now, helenamonster said:

Alright, then let's start the bidding on which rugrat is Bonnie's long lost kid! Simon probably has the best odds as we don't know much about him/his family life. I'll throw Oliver's name in the ring; we've been with him for three seasons now and know nothing about his family (also Conrad Ricamora is mixed race). Michaela is deeply unlikely, Connor and Laurel slightly less so, and Asher would just be disgusting.

Or...oh my god what if it's Rebecca? And Bonnie killed her own daughter! That's it, that's who I want it to be!

A lot of people on reddit though of Rebecca. I almost hope it's not because I'm not sure how Bonnie could deal knowing she killed her own child. Besides if t's Simon, it would make sense why he's so obsessed with the K5 and kinda resents AK.

[Milaxx]

Regarding the 2 crimes scenes. I think the scene at C & G involves Asher, Simon and Oliver. Then crime scene #2 is Micheala, maybe Connor, AK & Laurel.  I' not surprised that Isaac is involved since he figured out that Julie was really Bonnie. AK has talked about the K5, Bonnie/Frank & Sam in therapy. My impression is whatever happens at C & G has to do more with Asher's jealousy,his temper and the fact that Micheala & Oliver are keeping Connor & Oliver out of the loop. Not quite sure abut what happens at AK's place, but I wouldn't be surprised if it involved Laurel going to AK's place to confront her over something

[possibilities]

Isaac figuring out that Julie is Bonnie would in theory not be something he could say or do anything about, though, right? Confidentiality. Him being at the hospital should mean either he was at the scene of one of the events for some reason-- but then he'd be being questioned as a witness-- or he was at the hospital anyway and somehow got involved from there-- but he shouldn't know/recognize any of the people we've seen at the hospital, so that doesn't add up either-- or he was called by someone. Since Anna is missing, it's not her who called him. I doubt Bonnie called him either.

I think there's a chunk of story missing and we can't really know yet how we get from Isaac being A's therapist and nothing else, to him being in a scene at the hospital where he and Michaela recognize and are friendly towards each other on sight, and Frank and Laurel both know him and he's allowed in the room while she's still unconscious.

[Milaxx]

In reality he broke HIPPA last week. He should have never mentioned AK"s name.. Once he figured out who Julie really was he should have ended the session , told her he could no longer treat her and offer to refer her to another therapist.  How would need to inform the any therapist he referred her to that she came to him under deceptive circumstance. He would also need to document the events of the session in his dictation notes. On the show, however, we have at least 2 more weeks until the flashforwards. For all we know he tells Annalise what happened, or he googles Annalise, or goes to her hotel and meets the K4 or any other hand wavy thing the writers come up  with.

[Milaxx]

On 10/27/2017 at 1:05 AM, Milaxx said:

Updating my choices after this week's ep.

 Definitely Safe: Michaela, Isaac, Oliver, Frank, & Laurel  we all know/have seen. 

Probably safe: Asher, Connor, Nate,  & AK. - I don't think any of the K4 will die this season

On the bubble: *The baby, , Jorge & Soroya 

 High probability of death: Denver, Simon, Tegan

Well this week was a game changer:

Updating my choices after this week's ep.

 Definitely Safe: AK, Asher, Michaela, Isaac, Oliver, Frank, & Laurel   

Probably safe:  Connor, Nate,  &  I don't think any of the K4 will die this season

On the bubble: *The baby, , Jorge & Soroya 

 High probability of death: Denver, Tegan, & maybe IT guy (Lonzo?)

[Keepitmoving]

Regarding who is safe, I don't think seeing any of the remaining four in flash forwards proves they are safe from getting axed. They showed Wes in a flash forward and I thought he was safe, but he wasn't. But then again would they kill off another one of them? Who the hell knows, it's possible, cause a lot of stupid shit goes down in Shondaland, just dumb.

Edited November 4, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[Aquarius97]

But last season, Wes' flashback was the only one in which no other main character was present. In the rest of S3 flashbacks, when another characters was confirmed alive, they always had with them an already confirmed character

[Keepitmoving]

Well then, that leaves Asher. He's in a jail cell without any other character being present. Bonnie shows up at the law office and Ollie is there. Laurel, Frank and the Dr.; Mickey and  the Dr.... Oh wait, where's Connor? Please, he's not going anywhere, he's Nowalk's baby and neither is Anna even though it looks like she's bleeding out in some shower. At least we know she didn't take off with that baby. I don't know, I find something very strange with Michaela's flash forward scene. I just don't get why she looks so out of it and disheveled. Or, why she looks like she shows up at the hospital out of nowhere, being that the Dr.is just seeing her and she's not with Frank in Laurel's hospital room. It's just strange to me. Well we shall see.

[harmfulhazards]

I'm not sure if there are reasons to believe that any of the main characters die. Last season was built about one of them dying from the beginning and was advertised as such, but this one is not. The flashfowards are more about dropping "clues" the writers will desperately try to tie together last minute before shooting the midseason finale, than about revealing "safe" characters, like it happened in the first two seasons. And remember that this season's big mystery is "Where?' instead of "Who killed who?" or "Who's dead?". Minor characters were always cannon fodder of this show, so some of them may die, but not like we will be expected to get too invested.

[secnarf]

25 minutes ago, harmfulhazards said:

I'm not sure if there are reasons to believe that any of the main characters die. Last season was built about one of them dying from the beginning and was advertised as such, but this one is not. The flashfowards are more about dropping "clues" the writers will desperately try to tie together last minute before shooting the midseason finale, than about revealing "safe" characters, like it happened in the first two seasons. And remember that this season's big mystery is "Where?' instead of "Who killed who?" or "Who's dead?". Minor characters were always cannon fodder of this show, so some of them may die, but not like we will be expected to get too invested.

I think the speculation about who could be dead largely stems from Michaela's comment "He's dead, isn't he" or something along those lines. Also that this is a show called How To Get Away With Murder and we have a whole second half of the season, whose mystery is going to be set up in the finale and very well might be a murder.

[Milaxx]

Since there appears to be 2 different crime scenes 2 different events occur and they both culminate at the hospital. I still don't think any major characters die because this first half of the season appears to be more concerned with Laurel's baby. 

Wild guesses:

Crime scene at C & G. Micheala, Asher, Tegan Simon and/or Lonzo & Oliver. Something with trying to get into that server room, getting found out and Asher either being jealous and/or angry and injuring someone. who Micheal thinks is dead. 

Crime Scene at Annalise's hotel: Annalise, Laurel, Connor, Dominick and belatedly Frank. If the baby survives maybe someone trying to steal the baby and Connor taking off in hiding while Frank gets Laurel to the hospital. Whatever it is I have a feeling it will be Hapstall Mansion levels of crazy.

[harmfulhazards]

20 hours ago, secnarf said:

I think the speculation about who could be dead largely stems from Michaela's comment "He's dead, isn't he" or something along those lines. Also that this is a show called How To Get Away With Murder and we have a whole second half of the season, whose mystery is going to be set up in the finale and very well might be a murder.

Fair enough. They did this "OMG, is the fan fave dead?" bait so often, that perhaps I stopped buying it. But the only guys that are not in flash forwards yet are Connor and Nate. First is the ultimate fan favorite and Pete's self-admitted wish fulfillment character. No way something permanently bad ever happens to him. The other one is lead's main love interest and with Wes gone their only remaining black guy. He is useless, but killing him is bad for ideological reasons.