S07.13: The Hangover

[Drogo]

57 minutes ago, IntrovertRed said:

 I like Gabby much more than Mya.  

Both of the new women have enthusiasm and the gift of gab.  Mya notsomuch.

[whydoievencare]

6 hours ago, RedDelicious said:

This is the root of the moving too fast argument that everyone on the show conveniently forgets. I am in complete agreement with you that it is an entire field of red flags. Yes Danielle's acting insane, I agree, and she also knows these two better than anyone else and very likely also knows a massive implosion is inevitable. She knows her friends aren't going to come out of this alive (figuratively speaking).

You may be correct but I don't think any of that is why Danielle is acting so absolutely unhinged.  I agree with you that Danielle's behaviour is totally abnormal. But she's never been able to express why she feels they are moving "so fast" or why she has such strong negative feelings about every aspect of their (Carl's and Lindsay's) relationship.  I find Danielle to be totally repellant with her whining TO EVERYONE about only being informed about the engagement "an hour ago".  When I got engaged to my husband, it was no one's business but ours.  There were no third parties that felt any ownership about our situation.  Danielle is such a fucking weirdo.

Edited May 11, 2023 by whydoievencare

[IntrovertRed]

6 hours ago, Kiki620 said:

This is just a predictor of what they're hoping will be a future of sharing private life moments in exchange for $$$.  Lindsay's probably already practicing what angle the camera should be in between her legs for when she's giving birth and Carlito is passed out in the corner chair.

How is that any different from any Bravo couples who engaged/married on camera?  Are you telling me if Amanda got pregnant, they wouldn't be doing the same thing?  

[Thumper]

5 hours ago, albarino said:

Just caught the episode.  My two take aways are--"dungarees"--thinking I'll bet Danielle read Trixie Belden too!  No, just me?  The second was a shot of a Bud Light bottle.  Jarring.

I always multi-task when I watch Bravo shows and I couldn't believe every time I turned around Danielle was crying.  As everybody else has said, this is not normal behavior but I also blame some of this on alcohol.  That doesn't work once everybody is sober though.  Enough!

 

Yes to “dungarees” and Trixie Belden!  😁😁

[Vivigirl10]

1 hour ago, IntrovertRed said:

How is that any different from any Bravo couples who engaged/married on camera?  Are you telling me if Amanda got pregnant, they wouldn't be doing the same thing?  

I don't think anywhere in my post I said other Bravo couples don't do this as well?  Completely agree.  My point was that once you open the door and make your private business public, you can't then shun the unwelcome comments, opinions, etc. For example, Carl's demand that filming stop. 

[esco1822]

3 hours ago, Drogo said:

Carl celebrated his two years of sobriety in January.  

Didn’t he and Lindsay rekindle after the Kyle Amanda wedding in September 2021?

Yes, they said October, and I believe Carl got sober in January 2021. So he made it 10 out if 12 months before they got together.

They are very clearly happy and in love. They have known each other for years and developed a deep friendship in that time. They know each other. Let them live.

As for Danielle, ugh. A couple of weeks ago I would have been on her side but tonight sealed the deal. I thought Robert wanting to defend her was sweet but ill-advised. If Danielle’s histrionics while conveying her account of the events of that year was anything like that engagement party, I can understand him wanting to stand up for her. Unfortunately, I’m not sure he knew at the time about her spending the season talking shit behind her best friend’s back to people who hate said best friend. Add that to telling both they are moving too fast (unsolicited), especially when Carl told her he was ring-shopping, how could she possibly expect to be part of a process she has so vocally opposed? The degeneration of their friendship has been going on the entire season, she was no longer the trusted confidant for either Lindsay or Carl. Her making their engagement 100% about herself just sealed the deal. 

By the way, did anyone catch her trying to get in on a group hug with Lindsay but ending up just hugging one of the friends who was hugging Lindsay?Awkward!

[esco1822]

25 minutes ago, Kiki620 said:

I don't think anywhere in my post I said other Bravo couples don't do this as well?  Completely agree.  My point was that once you open the door and make your private business public, you can't then shun the unwelcome comments, opinions, etc. For example, Carl's demand that filming stop. 

I actually commend Carl for being as open as he has since his brother’s death. Let’s not forget, the stress of planning that one night, getting everything and everyone in place, sent him to the ER. Adding more stress (bearing responsibility for Danielle’s breakdown and causing a rift between the two couples)on top of all of that, especially working so hard to maintain his sobriety, I think he earned a time out. He deserved to have a night of peace after so much stress. Both Robert and Kyle should have waited until at least the next day to have those conversations, just like all of Lindsay’s friends did regarding Danielle’s behavior. Boys are dumb.

[ZettaK]

5 hours ago, esco1822 said:

He deserved to have a night of peace after so much stress. Both Robert and Kyle should have waited until at least the next day to have those conversations, just like all of Lindsay’s friends did regarding Danielle’s behavior. Boys are dumb.

It's unfortunately being on a reality show. Bravo asked Robert and Kyle to create drama, and they did. Carl had to put up with it. 

[Drogo]

10 hours ago, Kiki620 said:

For example, Carl's demand that filming stop. 

Did he demand that filming stop? I felt like he needed a breather (so as not to throw Roberto into the Atlantic) and went to sit in the alley alone so the cameras and dramatic folk would leave him be for a minute.  
 

10 hours ago, esco1822 said:

By the way, did anyone catch her trying to get in on a group hug with Lindsay but ending up just hugging one of the friends who was hugging Lindsay?Awkward!

The secondhand embarrassment was strong. 

[Dirtybubble]

9 hours ago, ZettaK said:

It's unfortunately being on a reality show. Bravo asked Robert and Kyle to create drama, and they did. Carl had to put up with it. 

This is kinda the thing I circle back too.  What we need to remember is each of their handlers/producers pushing them to be over-the-top and create something to film.  With Danielle I believe she is truly hurt that Lindsay isn't the friend she needs right now but is someone off screen pushing her to behave a certain way by threating her spot on the show or something.  On the beach during touch football she seemed to be ok and cool with everything.  

I just feel real bad for Danielle in this situation and of course she's made mistakes but the beating she's taken on Twitter is just crazy!

I'm finally warming up to Kory and Sam.  I'm not fully invested in them but both seem to be ok together.  Like sure whatever...

[heatherchandler]

21 hours ago, Drogo said:

Carl celebrated his two years of sobriety in January.  

Didn’t he and Lindsay rekindle after the Kyle Amanda wedding in September 2021?

I think he just got sober in 2021, right?  

[Drogo]

24 minutes ago, heatherchandler said:

I think he just got sober in 2021, right?  

January 2021 according to what I’ve read.  

He and Lindsay got together in October 2021.  
 

[Passing Strange]

On 5/9/2023 at 6:22 PM, heatherchandler said:

There is a reason you’re not supposed to get into a relationship, and certainly not an engagement until you have a year of sobriety.  

From what I found in a search, it's a recommendation, not a rule. In fact, AA doesn't even set a time frame for relationships. Healing is a process, and "a year" is shorthand for "take your time with it." The actual amount of time needed could be more or less, it depends on the individual.

  

7 hours ago, Drogo said:

Did he demand that filming stop? I felt like he needed a breather (so as not to throw Roberto into the Atlantic) and went to sit in the alley alone so the cameras and dramatic folk would leave him be for a minute.

That's what it seemed like to me, too. He wanted to clear his head and he didn't want the distractions of Kyle and the camera guy. 

[heatherchandler]

9 hours ago, Passing Strange said:

From what I found in a search, it's a recommendation, not a rule. In fact, AA doesn't even set a time frame for relationships. Healing is a process, and "a year" is shorthand for "take your time with it." The actual amount of time needed could be more or less, it depends on the individual.

I have some experience with this.  It is actually a rule.  It’s not a law, no one can actually stop you, but there are rules/guidelines/steps and good reasons for them.  And there are reasons that the guidelines are not flexible.  AA is not an individualized program.  But it is up to the individual to listen to someone else’s guidance for once.  Some addicts like to try to “work” the program- rather than do the work- huge red flag.
 

It is really important to not date or get into a relationship before a year for many reasons, but mostly because addicts typically crave drama and chaos and often they replace the drug abuse drama and energy with relationship drama.  
 

Also it is important to get your footing.  Carl is not ok, he’s like a baby giraffe trying to walk, he’s still wobbly.  You can see it all over his face.  His mom sees it, you can see the nervousness in her.  An engagement is not great for him right now.  Drug addiction is horrible, it’s almost impossible to wrap your head around how difficult it is, every day, every minute.

He’s also stressed trying to make Lindsay happy (“this should be the best day of her life!”)  He didn’t say “our life.”  He is putting all of the energy he should be using on himself into her.  This is typical and doesn’t end well.

 

Edited May 12, 2023 by heatherchandler

[Passing Strange]

It occurred to me that if the people telling Carl and Lindsay they were going too fast thought it was because he hadn't been sober long enough, that's what they should have said and they probably should have said it long before this.

7 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

I have some experience with this.

That was very helpful, thank you. I can see why someone with experience would be doubtful about Carl's chances for success. I didn't like old Carl but I'm rooting for new Cari, so I'm hoping for his success.

[snarts]

Hoping the best for Carl but I am curious what he's doing for work these days. He left Loverboy last year (although he still hasn't updated Linkedin). Where is he working now? Living off bravo money?  I don't think the Summer House salaries are that high and all that idle time may not be good for him.\

[Dirtybubble]

1 hour ago, snarts said:

Hoping the best for Carl but I am curious what he's doing for work these days. He left Loverboy last year (although he still hasn't updated Linkedin). Where is he working now? Living off bravo money?  I don't think the Summer House salaries are that high and all that idle time may not be good for him.\

Do they still have some sort of deal with Marshall's?  I haven't seen any commercials this year with them 🤷‍♀️  I'm sure their public appearances bring in a lot of money as well.  And I've heard rumors (not facts just rumors) that Linds is going to do the second season of Traitors sooo idk.  If they can land a gig with one of the H.W. shows that would really boost their payday.

[RedDelicious]

On 5/12/2023 at 9:02 AM, Passing Strange said:

It occurred to me that if the people telling Carl and Lindsay they were going too fast thought it was because he hadn't been sober long enough, that's what they should have said and they probably should have said it long before this.

I also have a little bit of experience with this in two past relationships. Even if the person in recovery is open about being in AA, you’re never supposed to “out” them or talk openly about their involvement. It’s part of the “anonymous” piece. It’s not anyone else’s story to tell or talk about or to evaluate. It’s like the proverbial elephant in the room, especially in a reality television setting. 

[snarts]

1 hour ago, RedDelicious said:

I also have a little bit of experience with this in two past relationships. Even if the person in recovery is open about being in AA, you’re never supposed to “out” them or talk openly about their involvement. It’s part of the “anonymous” piece. It’s not anyone else’s story to tell or talk about or to evaluate. It’s like the proverbial elephant in the room, especially in a reality television setting. 

It's a bit of an assumption that Carl's even in or working a program.

[RedDelicious]

2 hours ago, snarts said:

It's a bit of an assumption that Carl's even in or working a program.

I didn’t make an assumption about him being in a program. The point is if he is in a program, the other cast members would not be able to say that’s why they think he and Lindsay were moving too fast.

[Passing Strange]

2 hours ago, RedDelicious said:

I didn’t make an assumption about him being in a program. The point is if he is in a program, the other cast members would not be able to say that’s why they think he and Lindsay were moving too fast.

Good point that we don't know about Carl and any program. I mentioned AA in my post because it's well-known.

The cast members have expressed opinions and concerns about Carl's sobriety in this and past seasons. Telling him the basis for a concern doesn't identify him as a participant in a specific program. But it might have led to less drama, so I wouldn't put it past production to have told them not to explain.

[heatherchandler]

On 5/12/2023 at 8:24 AM, snarts said:

Hoping the best for Carl but I am curious what he's doing for work these days. He left Loverboy last year (although he still hasn't updated Linkedin). Where is he working now? Living off bravo money?  I don't think the Summer House salaries are that high and all that idle time may not be good for him.\

Idle time is very bad for him. Lindsay is so selfish to tell him that he should leave Loverboy.  She wants her husband to have his OWN hugely successful company.  She should realize that he’s not that guy.  He never will be.
 

He shouldn’t have left his job, he needs stability while in the first few years of recovery. 

4 hours ago, RedDelicious said:

I didn’t make an assumption about him being in a program. The point is if he is in a program, the other cast members would not be able to say that’s why they think he and Lindsay were moving too fast.

He may have mentioned meetings.  Or I’m mixing him up with another recovering alcoholic on Bravo.

[Thumper]

Never mind — wrong episode.

Edited May 16, 2023 by Thumper

[RedDelicious]

14 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

He may have mentioned meetings.  Or I’m mixing him up with another recovering alcoholic on Bravo.

I’m 99.9% sure he mentioned going to meetings out in the Hamptons. 

15 hours ago, Passing Strange said:

The cast members have expressed opinions and concerns about Carl's sobriety in this and past seasons. Telling him the basis for a concern doesn't identify him as a participant in a specific program. But it might have led to less drama, so I wouldn't put it past production to have told them not to explain.

It doesn’t identify him, no. But if someone *is in a program or the program, their participation should not be commented on publicly. 

[RedDelicious]

(meaning on the show)