We Need To Talk About Cosby

[Gharlane]

On 2/17/2022 at 11:15 AM, Gharlane said:

I'm wondering if there will be an episode about Hefner's regular famous party guests.

On next week's episode of Secrets of Playboy:

"Predators' Ball". Even in the earliest parties at the mansion, celebrities like Roman Polanski and Bill Cosby are a big part of the allure of the Playboy brand, but Hugh Hefner keeps some Hollywood A-listers happy at the expense of the women.

[Gharlane]

On 2/25/2022 at 10:28 AM, Gharlane said:

I remember watching something about Cosby several years ago and there was a manly-looking black female stand-up comedienne who talked about it in her routine. I think this was in the early 1970's, but I remember her saying it was an open secret back then. 

I did some searching and I think it's either Moms Mabley or Luenel. I couldn't find the clip I saw,  but she said that everyone back then (late 1960's, early 1970's) knew what he was doing and never accepted drinks from him. 

[Dr.OO7]

On 2/7/2022 at 4:51 PM, lovinbob said:

Seems like tricking the women would have been a huge part of what made that action arousing to him.  

That's the thing about rape. It's not about the sex, it's about the power. Any one of these guys could easily find a woman to have CONSENSUAL sex with, but they get off on stalking/forcing/drugging them.

[Gharlane]

Quote

In the 1960s Bill Cosby is collecting accolades for his comedy, breaking barriers for Black stunt performers and participating in the nation's sexual liberation and civil rights movement. He also allegedly begins exploiting his power.

I am so conflicted after watching this! He did so much for black people yet was such a horrible person! The story about him taking advantage of that woman whose child died at her pool party was heartbreaking.  I've been watching the Secrets of Playboy special and was amused by what a lot of people were saying here, compared to what they said on that show. Yeah, it was worse at the Playboy mansion.

Edited March 14, 2022 by Gharlane

[Gharlane]

Quote

It's the 1970s and Bill Cosby is becoming an on-screen educator and moral authority, whether he's telling kids to say "no" to drugs or allegedly offering pills to young women.

These were the formative years for my knowledge of Cosby, but I have no recollection of Picture Pages. Was it a stand-alone show or a feature on Captain Kangaroo? I remember watching Black History: Lost, Stolen or Strayed in college and being shocked by the sight of "angry Cosby" on the screen. Wait, Cosby's "education" degress were all a sham? I did not know that! 😲 All the while, his behind-the-scenes activities were going full steam. Oy! 😢

Edited March 15, 2022 by Gharlane

[Rootbeer]

2 hours ago, Gharlane said:

These were the formative years for my knowledge of Cosby, but I have no recollection of Picture Pages. Was it a stand-alone show or a feature on Captain Kangaroo? I remember watching Black History: Lost, Stolen or Strayed in college and being shocked by the sight of "angry Cosby" on the screen. Wait, Cosby's "education" degress were all a sham? I did not know that! :-O All the while, his behind-the-scenes activities were going full steam. Oy! :-(

As far as I can recall, it was always part of Captain Kangaroo; each episode was just a few minutes long.  I think it moved to Nickelodeon once Kangaroo was cancelled, but was still just a brief segment between shows.

[Clawdette]

I had forgotten about Picture Pages!  I couldn't even read the words above without hearing, "Picture pages, pictures, time to get your pencil pages; time to get your crayons and your pencils!"  It was a sweet segment of Captain Kangaroo and my children enjoyed watching.

[wallflower75]

I finished watching the documentary today and I don't know that I have much to add to the discourse that's already gone on here.  Except to say that if people in the comedy business knew not to accept drinks from him all the way back in the 70s, there's no way people on the set of The Cosby Show didn't know what he was.

It's infuriating to me that it took a couple of the participants hearing someone they know come forward to admit that Cosby had raped them before they believed it could be real.  I want to ask them, "Is there some arbitrary number of victims who must come forward before you might believe it happened?  Ten?  Twenty?  A hundred?"  These are the people who say when there's more than one victim, "well, they're latching onto a bandwagon/they heard someone tell their story and made something up."  Bullshit. I don't feel there's any amount of money or publicity that could make up for the backlash each and every survivor received when she came forward.

As far as I'm concerned, the minute someone agrees to settle a civil lawsuit, they're admitting they did something wrong and they don't want it getting out, or why else would they ask for an NDA?  So NBC, admitting that you knew there were allegations and settlements--you think maybe that should've been a red flag that you shouldn't have gotten into business with him there at the end?

[Aryanna]

I haven't seen this show because I don't have showtime but I have kept up with this.

I think Cosby like most people is complicated. I think he really believed in what he was doing to help the black community. But he was also a monster. I don't think anyone is ever completely evil or completely good. So yeah Cosby could accomplish good things while also doing horrible things. 

But this doesn't stop with Cosby. And to let it stop there is doing a disservice. I know people are gonna think I'm a crazy conspiracy theorist but I think this kinda behavior is rampant in Hollywood and among the elite rich. 

CNN has had several people accused of sexual misconduct. Matt Lauer and probably others we don't yet know about at NBC. Charly Rose. A mayor in California is on trial for multiple child sex allegations. Dan Schneider from nickelodeon apparently sexually assaulted young actresses and also employed pedos. Harvey Weinstein. All the elites that Jeffrey Epstein ran with. I just can't buy that he killed himself. Too many coincidences. 

The child star that goes crazy is a cliche. Amanda Bines, Brittany Spears, the kid from The Goonies and so many others. We were told it was because they couldn't transition into adult roles. I think it's because they've been sexually abused. Especially the girls. Go back and look at how sexualized Brittany was early in her career.

I thought this was gonna make some headway when Me Too gained steam but it died out.

[Gharlane]

Dammit, I will have to pay to watch the 3rd part of this series, but not the 4th and final part. 🤬

[Sweet-tea]

On 2/3/2022 at 1:49 PM, sadie said:

Just finished. Well done. Chilling. I never realized the full scope of Cosbys career and the impact he had for the black community. What a shame.

I think what disturbed me the most was when someone made a point of saying “ hey, he was rich, famous, powerful, he could have had willing women all day every day but he didn’t want that…..he wanted to have sex with unconscious, passed out women”, it sent a chill up my spine at the perversion involved in what he did, and did A LOT. And the power moves he made over people he didn’t drug (the one PHD guy ) showed Cosby as the ass he is.

I applaud everyone involved here, it was thoughtful, thought provoking stuff presenting the question “is he a complex human with a good side and an evil side OR is he simply a purely evil guy that only did what good he did as a cover?”. I guess we’ll never know.

At first I didn't understand how so many people could still find Cosby funny and brilliant after they discovered he's a serial rapist. I didn't really get the struggle the commentators were having. And then I watched Cosby's dentist bit and I was laughing out loud. It is still funny. He was that talented. It's very sad. 

I think Camille is horrible. She knew what was going on. She was at home many times when those women were in the house. Some of them said in interviews that's one of the reasons they weren't concerned. They didn't think they would be alone with him. She was at home and pretending to be oblivious. 

I'm so glad Beverly Johnson got away. I wish more women had. 

Edited March 31, 2022 by Sweet-tea

[Spartan Girl]

On 3/15/2022 at 8:24 PM, wallflower75 said:

It's infuriating to me that it took a couple of the participants hearing someone they know come forward to admit that Cosby had raped them before they believed it could be real.  I want to ask them, "Is there some arbitrary number of victims who must come forward before you might believe it happened?  Ten?  Twenty?  A hundred?"  These are the people who say when there's more than one victim, "well, they're latching onto a bandwagon/they heard someone tell their story and made something up."  Bullshit. I don't feel there's any amount of money or publicity that could make up for the backlash each and every survivor received when she came forward.

Seriously. And look, as much as it disgusts me, I get it. I really do. There are celebrities that mean so much to us for this and that. But this was just like OJ all over again, with the “we have to protect our own” mentality that only seems to matter when it involves men. They deliberately overlooked the fact that he was raping Black women because it didn’t fit the conspiracy narrative they clung to. Even when the Black victims spoke out, they just shrugged it off and assumed they were lying—until they were women that they knew. It wasn’t “Cosby is innocent until proven guilty” it was “all those women are liars until proven innocent.” 

Edited July 30, 2022 by Spartan Girl

[kathyk24]

A&E had a two episode special called  the Right to Offend a history of Black Comedy. They struggled how to discuss Bill Cosby due to his horrible crimes. It was great however you couldn't watch with kids in the room because of profanity.

[hiisa]

I watched this but there's a part of me that wishes I hadn't. I love far away from family and on days like Thanksgiving I watch the Thanksgiving ep of The Cosby show. It reminds me of family because I remember sitting around and watching The Cosby Show as a kid. The first on time I watched that ep I was on my mom's lap and she dropped me because we were both laughing so hard. Watching that ep alone in a state far from fam, with my mom passed, brings me back to that moment. Now I watch and every time there's a woman guest star I wonder if she was raped and I have to change the station. Bill Cosby is trash. He's trash for what he did to all of this women and he's trash for all of the memories he's ruined. 

[Gharlane]

I never did get to watch the last two parts of this. *makes note to self*

[Bastet]

On 1/31/2022 at 10:46 PM, Cheezwiz said:

I found the first episode very harrowing to watch. The victim account near the end of the episode was just heartbreaking.

I'm just now watching (I didn't have any access to Showtime when it aired, and it only now finally occurred to me Showtime documentaries are probably now on Paramount+ so I looked this one up last night) and I had to take a break after the first episode to decompress from that woman's story.  The way she described thanking him when he callously pointed to the phone and told her to call a cab - after she asked how she and her passed-out roommate were going to get home - broke me.  The things he's made his victims live with.

I was heartened by how many men, not just women, were appalled watching/listening to old footage like the Spanish Fly crap and Hugh Downs' comments after Barbara Walters' field piece as a Playboy Bunny.  I also liked hearing from two former Bunnies, juxtaposing their differing feelings about the experience without making one a smackdown of the other.  (I like that the one who always felt diminished and degraded by it, as I would, simply said s he knows not everyone felt that way, and I love that the one who was happy to have done it didn't try to claim it as feminist empowerment, just said, look, if there had been equality for women, this is not how I'd have made money, but when I could make at least $1k/week, cash - and in an establishment that would actually toss out a customer for his racist remarks - instead of bringing home a $50 paycheck, hell yes I did it.)

I haven't seen a ton of W. Kamau Bell's stand-up, but what I have seen I have very much enjoyed.  So far, I think he did a great job with this.  I like the title, I like opening with an acknowledgement a shit ton of people declined to be interviewed, and I like giving black people the time to sigh and then piece together their myriad feelings about this man.  It's one thing for those of us who grew up playing and re-playing his comedy albums and returning to The Cosby show for years after it went off the air as comfort TV, and appreciated as white allies what he did for the Black community, to now have those memories tarnished, but we'll never 100% understand what it's like for members of that community to grapple with learning he was a prolific predator all that time; the very least we can do is listen to them and Bell is doing a great job giving them a platform to speak.

I'll see how many parts I can get through tonight without needing another break, but I'm glad I finally dove into this.

[Bastet]

I finished of the remaining three parts last night, and found this so well done.  I love including the BTS footage of Kamau getting the news of Cosby's release, and laughing he doesn't even know what this film is now.  And that he found the perfect way to continue it, by making sure to include the legal reasoning behind that release (clarifying this was not finding him innocent) and then filming a segment on how the victims felt about his release.  Including that this is so much bigger than one man and whether or not he's in prison; this isn't about Cosby, this is about the patriarchy, misogyny, and rape culture that creates and enables the Cosbys of the world.

I like the model who played a cop in one episode of The Cosby Show concluding her story by telling Kamau (not exact words): "Do not edit this out:  There is no way people didn't know what was going on in that dressing room.  You cannot do what he did without people helping you."  I completely agree.  Which is not to say everyone, especially the child actors, knew, but that a hell of a lot of people did.  This film has to include a clip of someone explicitly saying that.

I also appreciate including Mo Ryan's disgust with NBC being ready to give him another show despite knowing about allegations and settlements, plural, only backing out when more women came forward -- that hearing the executive say a few was one thing, but now that there are 15, we walk away was one of those days when she feels like forget it, launch this entire fucking industry into the sun.

I was enraged as expected by the men who believed dozens of women were all lying, only coming around once they found out it had also happened to someone they knew.  But I was somewhat soothed by Lili Bernard just laying waste to the false narrative all his accusers were white women.  She has no time for being erased like that.  Given the pressure on Black women not to come forward against a community icon (on top of the obstacles imposed on any woman speaking up against a powerful man, especially when it comes to sex crimes) - which I'm glad Kamau made sure to explore - it's entirely possible there are a lot of them among the victims who've chosen not to speak publicly, or even within their family and social circles. 

Which is another thing it was good to include, the way Cosby ingratiated himself with some of his victims' families, so that if/when they told someone what he'd done, they weren't just saying something shocking and awful about a beloved public figure, but someone their loved ones thought they knew personally.

It was so sad to hear numerous victims talk about how he'd let them believe or straight out told them they got sloppy drunk and passed out, causing their reaction to be worry that they'd made a fool out of themselves in front of Bill Cosby.  I cannot remember who said it, but they were spot on -- he is a master of his craft, whether that's comedy, acting, or rape.