S03:E07 The Assassination of Monica Lewinsky

[MamaMax]

On 10/23/2021 at 12:34 PM, dubbel zout said:

There was so much collateral damage. Betty Currie and a lot of other people ended up with huge legal bills in order to protect themselves from this entire mess.

Same. All the women were torn apart by the press for their looks, as if it makes any difference to what happened. Ugh. We aren't past that today, either.

So I am going to duck after I say this BUT ---

 

Betty Currie  could have just told the truth.

 

I'll show myself out.

 

[vibeology]

2 minutes ago, MamaMax said:

So I am going to duck after I say this BUT ---

 

Betty Currie  could have just told the truth.

 

I'll show myself out.

 

She absolutely should have told the truth but even if she did it's smart to appear with a lawyer who can protect you and make sure you don't contradict yourself.

There's an episode of The West Wing where Charlie is considering an immunity offer and one of the characters (CJ maybe) points out that without immunity he'd need a lawyer for a hundred hours compared to hiring someone for a few. And I tend to think that fictional situation was in part based on this real event because that's how Sorkin rolls. So even if Betty was honest from the start, she'd still have huge legal bills. Clinton did a bad thing and other people paid the price.

[IntrovertRed]

Did Betty continue to work for Clinton after all this?  Or was she forced out or quit?  

[DanaK]

Just so awful how the women were treated in this scandal and especially in this episode

[Joimiaroxeu]

I didn't realize Paula Jones was in the room when Bill Clinton was giving his testimony.

The guy lied with confidence. Did he have an addiction? It just makes no sense that he'd take so much risk given how easily it could fall apart.

Wow, Betty knew Bill was telling her to lie. And was telling her to tell Monica to lie too. Suborning all kinds of perjury.

Linda Tripp was pathetic, using her kids as an audience for her self-aggrandizement. They were still young here but I wonder when they got older if they realized what kind of person she truly was?

So Bill straight up lied to Hillary. Why did she believe him? I would've thought by that point she knew he was a lying cheater.

Amusing to me how everyone expected Clinton would resign. He redefined the concept of brazening it out.

Oh lordy, there were tapes. But even then, it all could have been a figment of Monica's vivid imagination were it not for the evidence on the blue dress.

The Watergate didn't have an underground parking garage?

Hate to say it but I think SNL did some of their best work during this era. I feel bad for Linda's kids having to see how their mother was portrayed though. School must've been rough for them unless their classmates were all from families who were generally of the same political persuasion as Linda.

Sexual relations. He meant it as sexual intercourse but he knew everyone else would assume he meant any sexual activity at all. Bold strategy even if it wasn't as successful as he likely hoped.

[qtpye]

On 10/20/2021 at 10:32 PM, Empress Josephine said:

What pisses me off about it too was he was acting all sanctimonious with Monica (when she was emotional and upset) for yelling at Betty. On his high horse saying, "Betty didn't come out the Jim Crow South to deal with your nonsense." Or something to that effect. And yet here he is doing that shit to her. He is disgusting on every level and I feel really angry for the shit he put Paula Jones through. He is a piece of garbage.

Betty also did not survive Jim Crow South to deal with him literally not being able to keep his dick in his pants.

On 10/21/2021 at 9:29 AM, Spartan Girl said:

It really was sickening how many “friends” of Monica came out for their 15 minutes of fame, including her garbage teacher, who had the nerve to play the play the victim and smear her in the role of a psychotic stalker when he was the one who strung her along even after he got married.

For all the crap people here gave Monica for how she acted in the affair with Clinton, she did recognize how she must have looked when she saw that clip of herself in the receiving line. Sometimes actions we believe make sense to us at the time look VERY different in when seen through the harsh light of a camera.

I have heard Monica in interviews ( she is very articulate) talk about how no good man would date her after the scandal and how it ruined her chances to have a family.

I compare this with Kim Kardashian (another shapely brunette) whose career started with a sex tape. She has been married several times and has four children.

Do you think people are more forgiving and less judgmental about women having and enjoying sex? Or do you think it has something to do with that Kim usually goes for athletes and people in show business, while Monica probably wanted an educated professional like her father?

[Spartan Girl]

1 minute ago, qtpye said:

Betty also did not survive Jim Crow South to deal with him literally not being able to keep his dick in his pants.

I have heard Monica in interviews ( she is very articulate) talk about how no good man would date her after the scandal and how it ruined her chances to have a family.

I compare this with Kim Kardashian (another shapely brunette) whose career started with a sex tape. She has been married several times and has four children.

Do you think people are more forgiving and less judgmental about women having and enjoying sex? Or do you think it has something to do with that Kim usually goes for athletes and people in show business, while Monica probably wanted an educated professional like her father?

There is no comparison there. Kim’s sex tape didn’t involve a married man and anyway the Kardashians exploited themselves for all the fame and fortune they could get. Aside from one appearance on SNL, Monica didn’t take that route. I don’t think she wanted the “celebrity” that comes with being the president’s mistress. 

[qtpye]

3 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

There is no comparison there. Kim’s sex tape didn’t involve a married man and anyway the Kardashians exploited themselves for all the fame and fortune they could get. Aside from one appearance on SNL, Monica didn’t take that route. I don’t think she wanted the “celebrity” that comes with being the president’s mistress. 

I guess Monica's mother did not "pimp" her while Kim's mother was more than happy to exploit her daughter.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

There is no comparison there. Kim’s sex tape didn’t involve a married man and anyway the Kardashians exploited themselves for all the fame and fortune they could get.

Yes, and I suspect most if not all of Kim's marriages were business arrangements. Kanye didn't need her money but being married to her gave him certain kind of credibility he might not otherwise have had. (The appearance of being a family man with a wife and children.) Monica likely has wanted true love, and the kind of "normal" man she wishes for just probably can't deal with the notoriety.

[chocolatine]

6 hours ago, qtpye said:

I have heard Monica in interviews ( she is very articulate) talk about how no good man would date her after the scandal and how it ruined her chances to have a family.

I compare this with Kim Kardashian (another shapely brunette) whose career started with a sex tape. She has been married several times and has four children.

Do you think people are more forgiving and less judgmental about women having and enjoying sex? Or do you think it has something to do with that Kim usually goes for athletes and people in show business, while Monica probably wanted an educated professional like her father?

With all due respect to Monica, it seemed like no good man would date her before the scandal either (aside from the one date with Jack Tapper). Even more accurately, Monica was the one going after unavailable men who took advantage of her. Also, nobody is guaranteed a healthy long-term romantic relationship and a family. There are millions of people for whom it hasn't happened.

[qtpye]

2 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

With all due respect to Monica, it seemed like no good man would date her before the scandal either (aside from the one date with Jack Tapper). Even more accurately, Monica was the one going after unavailable men who took advantage of her. Also, nobody is guaranteed a healthy long-term romantic relationship and a family. There are millions of people for whom it hasn't happened.

Yes, I think for the first time in the United States there are more single people than married people.

Marriage is no longer a guarantee and it might be better to be single than married to the wrong person.

As I have stated before, I would rather be single than married to William Jefferson Clinton. 

I think Bill Clinton was probably a good father, a solid president, and a terrible husband.

I have actually heard that there was a time that Hillary financially supported the family because her career was more stable as politics can be a rollercoaster when you are getting started.

She must have really loved that man.

[Book Junkie]

On 11/1/2021 at 6:49 PM, qtpye said:

Yes, I think for the first time in the United States there are more single people than married people.

Marriage is no longer a guarantee and it might be better to be single than married to the wrong person.

As I have stated before, I would rather be single than married to William Jefferson Clinton. 

I think Bill Clinton was probably a good father, a solid president, and a terrible husband.

I have actually heard that there was a time that Hillary financially supported the family because her career was more stable as politics can be a rollercoaster when you are getting started.

She must have really loved that man.

Hillary was the breadwinner for many years, because as a senior associate (she may have even been partner), she made way more money as an attorney in the private sector than Bill was paid as Attorney General and Governor of Arkansas.

I've always thought that Hillary didn't necessarily love Bill Clinton, the man, but I think she saw something in him and loved the future power position she saw in him. I saw a documentary about Bill a long time ago, and he always had big political aspirations. I think they had a symbiotic relationship where Hillary provided Bill financial security and connections (she comes from a well-connected, wealthy Chicago family), and he provides her with power and prestige. I don't think either of them were ever really in love with each other.

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 11/1/2021 at 1:25 PM, qtpye said:

Betty also did not survive Jim Crow South to deal with him literally not being able to keep his dick in his pants.

I have heard Monica in interviews ( she is very articulate) talk about how no good man would date her after the scandal and how it ruined her chances to have a family.

I compare this with Kim Kardashian (another shapely brunette) whose career started with a sex tape. She has been married several times and has four children.

Do you think people are more forgiving and less judgmental about women having and enjoying sex? Or do you think it has something to do with that Kim usually goes for athletes and people in show business, while Monica probably wanted an educated professional like her father?

It's an interesting question.

I think the media framed Monica as being undesirable and overweight.

The media framed Kim Kardashian as being sexy, desirable, and sexual.

Monica was not famous in the social media era.  So unfortunately for her, who is telling her story?  Who is framing her?  It's white men.  It's news executives and late night talk show hosts and whoever funds them.  It's Lorne Michaels and whoever funds NBC/CBS/FOX/ABC.

 Kim and her mother weaponized social media to work for them instead of against them.  Who decides who Kim is?  It's people on social media.  Young women, impressionable teenagers.  Girls who for some reason looked up to KK.  

Edited November 14, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[MamaMax]

On 11/3/2021 at 1:37 PM, Book Junkie said:

Hillary was the breadwinner for many years, because as a senior associate (she may have even been partner), she made way more money as an attorney in the private sector than Bill was paid as Attorney General and Governor of Arkansas.

I've always thought that Hillary didn't necessarily love Bill Clinton, the man, but I think she saw something in him and loved the future power position she saw in him. I saw a documentary about Bill a long time ago, and he always had big political aspirations. I think they had a symbiotic relationship where Hillary provided Bill financial security and connections (she comes from a well-connected, wealthy Chicago family), and he provides her with power and prestige. I don't think either of them were ever really in love with each other.

I have to respectfully disagree. I think they are and were both very exceptional people, extraordinarily intelligent, ambitious and accomplished, and that they feel in love as they were a great match based on that, I think Bills infidelities probably were and are heartbreaking for Hilary and that she stayed with him all these years because she loves him. If she didn't, she would have left him long ago, I think.  

[Kel Varnsen]

On 10/30/2021 at 6:10 PM, Joimiaroxeu said:

Wow, Betty knew Bill was telling her to lie. And was telling her to tell Monica to lie too. Suborning all kinds of perjury.

That was some kind of crazy Jedi mind trick where he basically told her to lie, by asking her what she remembered to make sure his account lined up with hers. 

Also it was kind of hilarious that the Leno writers room looked like a super hacky stereotype of a comedy writers room. Like something you might see on The Simpsons. Although based on Leno's jokes I am going to assume that he would probably assemble the most stereotypical writers room of all time.

Edited August 29, 2022 by Kel Varnsen