Batman: The Animated Series - General Discussion

[GHScorpiosRule]

Efrem's portrayal of Alfred is my favorite. Because he was all things to a young orphaned Bruce: Father figure, mentor, valet, majordomo, and knows him best because he "diapered his bottom" so he "bloody well" does know him!

Though he respected him, there was always a touch of irreverence in his performances, and I love that.

[GHScorpiosRule]

Kevin Conroy said this about Bats in the first season dvd interviews and I think he hit the nail on the head.

Bruce Wayne "died" the night his parents were born and though he didn't know how he would avenge their deaths, that was the night that Batman was born.

Thoughts?

I love this take on Bats that Timm and company did, because he is what I've always envisioned Batman to be: Dark, moody, broody, a symbol of justice. And being as he is the only human hero, he honed his mind and body. He's the goddamn Batman! Love him. He's an arrogant asshole, but that's what I love about him!

[GHScorpiosRule]

I really loved Timm's take on Catwoman in this series, and Adrienne Barbeau was the Purrrrfect choice to play her.

 

Again, Andrea Romano was just AWESOME at finding the best actors for these characters.

[GHScorpiosRule]

I really, really loved (again) Timm's take on Dick/Robin in the first three seasons.

 

Turning him into a pseudo Bruce in the final season? Not so much. Only because the last time we see them together, in Batman:Subzero, Bruce and Dick were still very close, there was no tension between them. Well, not much anyway.  There's also the face that Timm and company decided to turn Bruce/Bats into a raging unfeeling asshole who didn't care about anyone or anything except fighting for justice, which contradicted the way he was characterized and portrayed in the first three seasons.

Not too keen on this dark and bitter Dick Grayson. But I so loved him in the first three.

[GHScorpiosRule]

It goes without saying that I freakin' LOVED Mark Hamill's take on The Joker.  He made him funny, psychotic, menacing, scary...Too many funny lines that were too long to use for the thread title, so I just used the one from "The Man Who Killed Batman" when Joker realizes that Bats is "dead."

[GHScorpiosRule]

The show runners/creators some time during the third season changed the opening credits and name to Adventures of Batman and Robin. Though the score was still the same, but slightly tweaked, I liked it. But much preferred the opening to the original.

We got to see a lot more of Robin, which I liked.

I can't recall if the "The Demon Quest" was from this season or the second. I really LOVED those episodes.

[GHScorpiosRule]

I thought this the weakest of the seasons and didn't care for the stylized look or change. But understand they did it to match up with Superman: The Animated Series.

Bats was morphed into a raging asshole, who apparently didn't care for anyone or anything anymore except for catching/getting the bad guys. A TOTAL contradiction to who he was in the previous seasons.

Didn't care for Dick's "turning" into Bats, either, with his bitterness/darkness/resentment. Or that nothing happened with him and Babs, He's supposed to be a lighter character than Bruce, as Paul Dini said himself in the season 2, I think, it was DVD.

I FUCKING HATED how they totally changed Selina's look--from a tall, svelte, beautiful woman, whose green eyes we could see behind her mask, to this goth-like short, mutant, who had big white space for "eyes" and pasty vampire look.  And sorry, lack of trust was NOT the reason things "could never work out" between those two. It was her penchant for committing crimes.

Didn't care of Dick's/Nightwing's mullet, either.

OR, that the "original" Robin costume that Tim saw in the Batcave in "Sins of the Father" was red/black, instead of the red/yellow/green. Jeebus.

Aaand, I know it's nitpicky, but I didn't care for Amanda Kane in "Circus Acts" or the retcon that Dick knew her. Yeah, yeah, it could have happened, but I didn't see her in "Robin's Reckoning" now did I?

But I did like Batgirl's new look and I MUCH preferred and loved that she was recast with Tara Strong. Melissa Gilbert's Babs/Batgirl was annoying.

They got really lazy by this time. The "disguises" that Bats came up with were a [ii]Joke[/i]. I mean, really? In "No Fear", his idea of a disguise was just to slap on a skinny 'stache, while wearing the same suit that Bruce Wayne did? Compare that to the first two seasons, where he would color his hair ("The Forgotten:) and put putty make-up on, or totally change his look ("Shadow of the Bat"), where you didn't even recognize him. Blergh.

[GHScorpiosRule]

I fucking LOVED this movie! And was so excited that it got a theatrical release!

Let's dish!

[GHScorpiosRule]

Another great movie. Wish it had also gotten a theatrical release.

So sad that this would be the last time we'd get the original animated look for this show. It would be another year? before Bats and company would show up again in The New Adventures of Batman/Superman.

I think Dr. Freeze is the only villain in Batman's Rogue Gallery that I actually empathize with. Okay, and Two-Face. Well until the last season of this show, anyway.

[Athena]

Probably my favourite from this era. So touching. So much Batgirl/Robin!

[GHScorpiosRule]

Probably my favourite from this era. So touching. So much Batgirl/Robin!

Athena! So...finally have time to post, eh?

I think Phantasm is my favorite between these two. Probably because it's almost like a Batman Begins/Year One sort of thing. And the animation! The one where Bats is in the rain, watching Andrea and that pipsqueak having dinner before we get the flashback...I..it was like an oil painting come to life!

There was action! Adventure! Mystery! Romance! Emotion!

Man, I feel like a rewatch coming on here...

[NCChic]

This is my favorite of the movies. Loved, loved, loved the storyline. It turned me into a Babs/Dick fan. That was such an awesome romance.

I owned it on VHS, but need to add it to my DVD collection.

[Athena]

I really like Batman and Wonder Woman after Justice League, but my first Batman 'ship' was from Batman/Catwoman (Bruce/Selina) from this show. I still remember their sizzling animated chemistry! How did this show do that?!

[GHScorpiosRule]

Writers and how Kevin Conroy and Adrieene Barbeau read their lines.  You could really see how conflicted Bruce/Bats was in Seasons 1-3, before the stylized and final season turned him into a raging asshole with NO layers, and turned her into a one dimensional witch, who just loved to steal, taking away HER layers, not to mention making her half her size into a shorty, when her tall, svelte, sophisticated self as a blonde was a better fit/match for Bats.

[GHScorpiosRule]

I'm so sad. I just heard that Efrem Zimbalist, Jr., who played our Alfred Pennyworth, passed away this past Friday.

 

R.I.P., Mr. Zimbalist. You were my favorite Alfred.

[GHScorpiosRule]

Just got this yesterday and watched it and I'm left with...this:

1. Damian is an arrogant little turd, entitled little putz.

2. Damien is quite the bratty sociopath

3. SO GLAD that Dick kicked his ass and hung him up like the annoying brat he is!

As for the rest--Admittedly, I never read the story, and I don't want to. BUT from a movie's perspective, the casting for R'as and Talia were WRONG! WRONG! WRONG! Don't get me wrong, I love Giancarlo Esposito as an actor, but R'as is Middle Eastern. They should have had him use a European accent at best, just like David Warren or just get Oded Fehr. And as for that drugging rapist, Skank, Talia, also, European accent or English, which is one of the easiest to do, EFREM could do IT! And rolling my eyes with all that "My Love" nonsense. It's "beloved" and I wish she would have just stayed, you know what, but noooooooo, Bats had to save her. Now we're stuck with her forever. And I refuse to believe that R'as is really dead. He has always cheated death.

 

Now, I love me my Thomas Gibson, but his reading of Deathstroke was so...wooden...stilted. Though I loved him calling Damian an arrogant little brat. And please SPARE me as to how that little turd was able to fight after having his arm broken after being pinned tot he wall with a knife and the other with a sword. UGH.

 

And from everything I've ever seen, that turd Ubu was supposed to be DEVOTED TO R'as! What the hell happened?

 

Nightwing/Dick/Alfred and Bats were the ONLY thing I liked about this movie

[NCChic]

My question is: who are voicing Bats/Nightwing/Alfred? I'm sure they couldn't get Ephram Zimbleist, as he was I'll (RIP). I could never get the right link to show me the voices.

[NCChic]

I loved Old Wounds. I have it downloaded on my iPad. I thought that was a terrific piece of storytelling - how desperate Robin was to get out of Batman's shadow (and was still like him despite attempts not to be), and his romance with Barbara. I wish they had explored it a bit more though. And then the utter betrayal at being kept in the dark about Batgirl's identity.

However, I saw that Bruce could see just how much Barbara cared for Dick. Enough to trust her with his own secret.

Makes me want to go watch it again..... YMMV of course. ;-)

Edited May 6, 2014 by NCChic

[GHScorpiosRule]

My question is: who are voicing Bats/Nightwing/Alfred? I'm sure they couldn't get Ephram Zimbleist, as he was I'll (RIP). I could never get the right link to show me the voices.

Bats/Bruce was voiced by Jason O'Mara

Alfred: David McCallum (he was also Alfred in Batman:Gotham Knights)

Nightwing/Dick: Sean Maher

[NCChic]

Thanks. I'm just so spoiled with Kevin Conroy's voice that no one else could ever be Batman in any animated series. I will ride the Conroy-will-always-be-Batman train until it rides into the great Bat-Heaven in the sky.

 

I love me some David McCallum, however.

 

I was just so spoiled at the level of talent in B:TaS that everyone else kind of pales in comparison.

[GHScorpiosRule]

You are preaching to the choir, NCChic. I've stated here and elsewhere, that Conroy set the standard and ruined me for anyone else to ever voice Bats.

 

Fortunately for us, the next movie, Batman:Assault on Arkham, KevinFucking!Conroy is BACK as Bats! Along with CCH Pounder as Amanda Waller. I thought that Hamill was back as Joker, but it's Troy Baker, who I swear is channeling Hamill!

[GHScorpiosRule]

Oh, I love Old Wounds too--it explains why Dick is such a...dick toward Bruce/Bats.

 

BUT...the whole backstory totally contradicts the relationship that Bruce/Bats and Dick/Robin had. Bruce/Bats was NEVER cold, distance or a total asshole toward Dick/Robin; or that catching criminals took precedence over milestones in Dick's life.

 

And then they totally dropped the romance between Dick and Barbara. The two, who were getting totally serious about each other in Subzero, which IS in the show's continuity/is canon.

[NCChic]

And then they totally dropped the romance between Dick and Barbara. The two, who were getting totally serious about each other in Subzero, which IS in the show's continuity/is canon.

That totally frustrated me! Almost as if they just used it for that one episode and then....poof. Nothing.

[CletusMusashi]

Best version of the character ever. Heath Ledger may get honorary mention for best live-action version, but only the DCAU's Mr. J. could fly through the sky on a tree while singing "batman smells," and still be terrifying.

He was funny, scary, frivolous, intense, ingenius, and batshit insane. Voice acting and gag props were always spot-on, plus he had Harley.

Well, at least as far as the public was concerned, he had Harley. As far as their private lives went, I'm pretty sure he was more into Bats. He only strung Harley along because he needed a beard. And possibly because spotted hyenas are matriarchal, so she was better than he was at controlling "the babies."

Although the show did a good job of giving nuanced characterizations to many villains, many more were still one-note gimmick monkeys. No such problem with Mr. J. Sometimes he would be unable to get henchmen, because everyone was terrified to work for him. Sometimes he would be investing in non-humorous normal crime, simply because he was that hard up for cash. And sometimes he would be hosting a big get-together for other major supervillains, but only because Harley was there to remember everyone's birthdays and prison release days.

To the extent that an insane criminal mastermind (whose "super power" is looking like a pointy-nosed clown) slugging it out with a three hundred pound bodybuilder gymnast dressed as a bat is ever going to make sense... the character actually made sense.

And this isn't coming from somebody who went into the cartoon wanting to like it. This is from an old Adam West fan who thought that a serious Batman was about as appealing as an Amish Industrial band. But The Joker won me over, even before Kevin Conroy's Batman did. Shit, even when I discovered Killer Croc and The Ventriloquist and the undisputed best version of Mr. Frieze, I never stopped thinking that they did a great job on their Joker.

Here's a trick they utilized that future versions of the franchise might want to consider: 

"STOP KILLING BATMAN'S PRIMARY LONG-TERM ANTAGONIST AFTER THE FIRST TWO HOURS!"

[DisneyBoy]

I am intensely bummed that we will never get a commentary track recording for Subzero featuring the director (now deceased) or the voice of Mr. Freeze (also deceased).

[DisneyBoy]

Mixed Bag my bat butt!  I loved these episodes!

[darkestboy]

In my opinion, one of the best takes on the character. I was actually surprised when I realised that she was in less episodes than I had anticipated.

 

Ranking her appearances though ...

 

Almost Got Im

The Cat And The Claw

Cat Scratch Fever

Tyger, Tyger

Batgirl Returns

Catwalk

Perchance To Dream

[darkestboy]

Hamill really excelled in the role and Joker had so many great episodes, though Christmas With The Joker remains one of my personal favourites.

[GHScorpiosRule]

HAPPY BOITHDAY to my favorite hero! 75 and you don't look a day over 30!

 

 

 

Oops! Wrong one! Hee

 

 

Oopsie again. Not that one, this one:

 

 

 

Okay, see? Ageless!!!!!

 

[GHScorpiosRule]

Because it's clear, there can never be enough of Batman...

 

putting this here because it's Batman week, month, whatever.

 

Batman Turns 75

[Tenshinhan]

Bruce Wayne "died" the night his parents were killed and though he didn't know how he would avenge their deaths, that was the night that Batman was born.

 

I've never really liked the idea that Bruce Wayne is just a mask for the Batman.  I prefer to think of Wayne and Batman as both being real, and the same person.  Sure, I understand the disinterested playboy act that he puts on as Wayne, and the costumed identity of the Batman being used to instill fear and inspire righteousness, but I see it as all one person.

 

 

 He's an arrogant asshole, but that's what I love about him!

 

I personally hate the depiction of the Batman as an "arrogant asshole".  That's just not who the character is in my view.  I don't like how this show seemed to make him into even more of an asshole after the revamp in Season Four.  I'll take warm and compassionate over cold and dickish.

[GHScorpiosRule]

You'll get no argument from me of how much of a jerk Bats and Bruce both became in the last season, when everything was "stylized."  Any layers, warmth, caring that Bruce and Batman both had, was wiped clean. I think I ranted about it upthread. I hated it. I really hated how Batman/Robin,Bruce/Dick had that fight, and that Bruce missed Dick's graduation. Something that Bruce would never do. His callous disregard in "Old Wounds" flashbacks. I hated every single minute of it.

[GHScorpiosRule]

So, have any of y'all seen this yet? It came out this past Tuesday. I got mine on Monday; pre-order is a wonderful thang!

 

First: YES! The return of KevinFucking!Conroy as Bats.

 

Second: Boo! Not enough of Bats. It's been so long.

 

I enjoyed it, though I remain confuzzled why these movies insist on making Waller look obesely fugly. But Huzzah! We got CCH Pounder!

 

Toby what'shisface did a good job of playing Mark Hamill playing the Joker, I thought.

 

I didn't care for the white-washing of Deadshot. The Justice League and Gotham Knights versions are ones I much prefer, as they show that he and Bats are opposite mirrors of each other, if that makes sense.

 

And that sex scene totally squicked me out. If they're gonna show sex, I want them to be between Bruce and Diana!

 

As for the special features, could the MEN have given the character of Harley any more of a tongue bath? PUHLEAZE.  And Dini is looking freakingly like one of those Duck Dynasty guys, and why the hell didn't they try to get Bruce Timm, since he was also a co-creator of Harley?

 

And dammit, they've got fucking Jason O'Mara for the next League movie instead of Conroy. A friend of mine, who has met Conroy at the last ComicCon, told me that Conroy LOVES to voice Bats and is willing to do so for each movie. It's FUCKING Warner Brothers that's the problem.  And this is O'Mara's THIRD run at playing Bats. No. Just no. What is wrong with Warner Brothers? Don't they realize what they have in Conroy?

 

And I totally knew (spoilering just in case)

that it was Bats beneath Black Spider's costume and everyone thought he had beaten Bat's ass.

AS IF.

[rho]

I can't recall if the "The Demon Quest" was from this season or the second. I really LOVED those episodes.

 

Hands down my favorite episodes of the series!!

 

I was living outside the US during the original broadcast so I caught onto the show kind of late and The Demon Quest two-parter was the first episode I saw. Instantly hooked me!

[rho]

Finally watched it after having it sit on my desk for months but I loved it. I agree, not enough Batman especially since Conroy was back but I loved seeing tons of Harley. It kind of reminded me of the episode Harley & Ivy from season 1. I think all in all Batman was in it just as much as he needed to be. And I agree about Amanda Waller. That's not a good look for her at all.

[Trini]

I'm really behind on seeing the animated movies, but I did see this one, and I remember thinking "Wow, this is really good -- this should be like, a real [live-action] movie!" 

 

One thing I remember is that I liked the idea that Bruce Wayne had a chance to go down a different path and have another (happy?) life.

[DisneyBoy]

Hey y'all - new Batman: The Animated Series soundtrack drops tomorrow from LaLaLand Records.  Anyone else into these?

[Twilight Man]

The action figures that are at WalMart (and a few other places)

http://www.walmart.com/ip/DC-Comics-Solar-Saw-Batman-Action-Figure/24074148

 

are finally getting a couple of animated films to promote them.

 

Batman Unlimited: Animal Instincts will be available in May.

https://games.yahoo.com/news/batman-animated-film-releasing-may-201000900.html

 

Batman, Nightwing, Red Robin, Green Arrow, and Flash

take on the Penguin with his "mutant" underlings

Man-Bat, Killer Croc, Cheetah, and Silverback

and a robotic animal army.

(I'm hating the chin guards on almost all the heroes but what-evs)

 

Another Batman Unlimited film will be available in the fall of 2015.

Edited February 11, 2015 by Twilight Man

[darkestboy]

I've only started watching this (The New Batman Adventures) now for the first time in many years and the first four episodes, well ...

 

Holiday Knights: Loved the little vignettes - the use of Poison Ivy, Harley Quinn, Clayface and the Joker worked well. Liked Bullock and Montoya as a mall Santa and elf, liked seeing Barbara helping out and don't mind Tim's Robin too much.

 

Sins Of The Father: Decent backstory for Tim's Robin and his family background, nice use of Two Face and despite the horrible mullet, nice to see Dick appear at the end.

 

Cold Comfort: Not exactly a classic like Heart Of Ice but as decent as Deep Freeze and Sub Zero though. Fairly good use of Mr Freeze though.

 

Never Fear: Probably the best use of Tim so far if I'm being honest but Bruce was reckless undercover and Batman never use to be so homicidal when affected by the fear toxins. The Scarecrow, bulked up aside did look intimidating though.

Edited May 20, 2015 by darkestboy

[darkestboy]

More episodes watched, so thoughts on them then ...

 

You Scratch My Back: Nice to see Catwoman back but her new look is too severe and she was never this back. Nightwing seemed a little OOC until the last five minutes. Not a bad episode but could've been better.

 

Double Talk: Dull, very dull this one. I guess I just don't care for the Ventriloquist/Scarface and despite some attempts of psychological warfare, this episode didn't do anything too interesting. Or interesting at all.

 

Joker's Millions: Hilarious episode and definitely one of my favourites as well. Joker blowing through tonnes of fake money, being terrified of the IRS, the auditioning for replacement Harleys and of course, Harley getting her own back as well.

 

Growing Pains: I really loved this one. Best use of Tim's Robin, a great return episode for Clayface too. Batman felt a little sidelined in the episode but other than that, I loved it.

[GHScorpiosRule]

In addition to the change of animation style that I didn't like; I absolutely hated that they made Bruce/Batman into an unfeeling raging asshole.

 

Also, unlike the first three seasons, where he had all the great make-up to change his appearance to NOT look like Bruce, in this season, they thought just having Bruce slap on a pencil thin mustache would fool people?

[darkestboy]

Caught up with episodes 9-12 so some thoughts then ...

 

Mean Seasons: Not a subtle commentary on the model/media industry but I really liked Calender Girl and she's the type of one-off villain that Gotham could probably do as well.

 

The Demon Within: Klarion was a right little brat but it was a solid episode with some good use of Robin as well. Better than expected.

 

Over The Edge: A good episode, especially for the father/daughter moment at the last scene with Gordon and Barbara but a little too similar to Perchance To Dream though.

 

Torch Song: Dull episode. Found Firefly more annoying than threatening to be honest.

[darkestboy]

A little further along now ...

 

Love Is A Croc: Unusual pairing with Baby Doll and Killer, it nearly works but not quite.

 

The Ulimate Thrill: Another pairing with Penguin/Roxy Rocket. Marginally better than the previous episode.

 

Cult Of The Cat: Better episode than You Scratch My Back for Catwoman IMO.

 

Critters: Yawn. That's all I can about that one.

[darkestboy]

I actually liked this one. The cameos of Zsasz, Penguin, Two Face, Bane and Poison Ivy was a nice touch but shame we didn't get a Catwoman one.

 

Riddler, I could've done with a few more scenes but he was good in what we got.

 

Until seeing this, I had never heard of KGBeast, Black Spider and King Shark though.

 

Boomerang was a bit annoying from time to time though.

 

Loved the use of Batman throughout the movie and Waller was a stone cold bitch as well. Now did she survive a certain target on her head?

 

Mainly though, the movie was about Harley, Joker and deadshot for me. Those three worked extremely well and the little nods to Batman Returns were an added bonus. Also Killer Frost was awesome too.

Edited June 2, 2015 by darkestboy

[darkestboy]

Nearly finished the series off but more thoughts on episodes I've seen ....

 

Animal Act: I wasn't expecting the Mad Hatter in this one but he was well served and I liked seeing a bit more on Dick's former stomping ground as well.

 

Old Wounds: Great episode showing how Dick went from Robin to Nightwing, even if Batman was a total dick in flashbacks.

 

Legends Of The Dark Knight: One of the best episodes ever. Loved the multiple viewpoints, the snarky meta and the varying animations as well.

 

Girls Nite Out: More Batgirl/Supergirl please. I would've traded Livewire for Catwoman with Harley and Ivy though.

[darkestboy]

Last batch of episodes.

 

Chemistry: Not a bad episode as such but easily the weakest one with Ivy though. House & Garden did the plant thingy a lot better to be honest.

 

Judgement Day: Loved this one. I should've seen the Two Face reveal coming but I didn't and it still worked a treat though. Possibly his best episode.

 

Beware The Creeper: Pretty hilarious episode to be honest. Really liked the title character, even if he was a little too literal. Nice history lesson on the Joker's origins too.

 

Mad Love: Loved it. Loved the backstory with Harley Quinn and her Puddin' as well. An excellent final regular episode, though I wish that Nightwing/Batgirl/Robin had factored into it a little.

[DisneyBoy]

Melissa Gilbert's Babs/Batgirl was annoying.

 

 

What now? Bite your tongue. I loved that her voice had character. Tara Strong is great, don't get me wrong, but I preferred Batgirl being less "pretty" sounding. Melissa had a strength to her, and so did the actress from Subzero (forgetting her name).

 

I loved Old Wounds. I have it downloaded on my iPad. I thought that was a terrific piece of storytelling - how desperate Robin was to get out of Batman's shadow (and was still like him despite attempts not to be), and his romance with Barbara. I wish they had explored it a bit more though. And then the utter betrayal at being kept in the dark about Batgirl's identity.

 

I agree that the Dick/Babs love story went under-developed. All the DCAU shows under-developed the romances. Bruce/Selina were rather tepid and murky, though they got the most screen-time together. Dick and Babs only came together in Subzero which was after the initial dates (which we never got to see) and then we only got a quick flashback in Old Wounds to contextualize how serious they'd previously been. Sheyera and John in JL flirted at length, but their "together" period was skipped over entirely. Clark and Lois never even dated, but she apparently was "seeing" (?) Superman, hence their picnic in JLU in Season Two...

 

Harley and Joker seemed to have the most developed romance, and even there...we don't see much...not that I wanted to see more than what we got!

Edited June 28, 2015 by DisneyBoy

[darkestboy]

I also did a watch both Return Of The Joker and Mystery Of The Batwoman as well. Both were fantastic.

[Twilight Man]

Hello kiddies!!!   Uncle Joker here!!!

 

It's my turn to take on the Caped Cuckoo in these animated "just buy our toys" films.

I've assembled a ragtag bunch of misfits to be my canon fodder as I try to destroy Gotham with a digital "laughing" virus.

 

But Batsy has called in the reserves as well:  The Baby Bats, The Green Goofball, and The Tin Man.

 

You know I just love a big party!!!!

Edited September 8, 2015 by Twilight Man

[DisneyBoy]

I wouldn't call Mystery of the Batwoman "fantastic". They recast the Penguin needlessly and wasted time revisiting this beloved cast of characters by focusing on three new ones for the purposes of possibly building a new brand. Consider how little we actually saw of Tim growing as a character (considering what they already established would happen to him in BB), or of Bruce and Barbara sorting out their feelings for each other. I have so much hate for that scene where Bruce pretends static is interfering during his call with Barbara and hangs up on her. She is written as love-sick and the thing is played for laughs. UGH.