Charmed - General Discussion

[Writing Wrongs]

If you want some hilarious and snarky Charmed recaps you should listen to Allison Pregler's Charmed Rewind episodes on YT:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVqAewJbgI4&list=PLzSaABvhwN1OuNLVTYriPyqvQ4WCCeD6x

[Writing Wrongs]

On the plus side, Charmed is getting a lot of notice on social media and YT videos. I'm all for people discovering this show.

[Halting Hex]

So my DVR is recording random episodes, and while I enjoy this series, I don't have it memorized.  So I took a squint (pun?) at Sight Unseen and heck, I know Phoebe goes nutso covering for Cole, but how did she actually demand that Prue apologize for suspecting him when Phoebe had just heard Troxa say that Belthazor was working with him?  She knows Cole is Belthazor, she knows Belthazor is working for the Triad, how does that add up to "apologize"?

(Yes, Cole is actually being a double-agent, but Phoebe has no way to know that [Cole hasn't told her], so she should at least inform Prue that Cole is a demon.)

Oh, and when the episode suddenly switches to Abbey the (not-quite-)lesbian stalker, why are the sisters suddenly dressed like they're going snowboarding?  Troxa, the demon who is vulnerable to cold, is already dead.  You can ditch the layers, sisters.  Honestly.

[Writing Wrongs]

Recent panel:

Lexington Comic Com

[EarlGreyTea]

On 12/16/2023 at 9:59 AM, Pearson80 said:

Wow!  I am so happy that Shannen was vindicated and that horrid Kern apologized. However the damage was done to her reputation.  Shannen always wanted the best for the show and I never understood why Kern, Spelling  and others were so upset to the point that they fired her.  We all know now that Alyssa was the troublemaker because Rose told the world on twitter. 

I always sensed that Alyssa disliked the closeness between Holly and Shannen.  She probably felt left out of their bond off the show.  Holly and Shannen had been friends for 10 years before working on the show together.  So their friendship would always be strong.

It sucks that Shannen was not able to see Holly in the hospital. I am glad that they were able to patch things up during the era of season 2.  This is why Holly said that if the producers had stayed out of the issues between Shannen and Alyssa, they would have gotten over it eventually.

I think we'll never know the true side of things. I feel HMC has done a great job of playing both sides against the middle. She was publicly close to Alyssa in the early 2000s and 2010s, then somewhere along the way reconciled with Shannen and now parrots Shannen's side of things. I truly believe all three of them probably behaved heinously. As HMC once said, there were no angels.

The whole relationship between all four of them seems to ebb and flow. I distinctly remember them being good 10 years ago with publicly supportive tweets.  I can see why Shannen, with a terminal diagnosis, wants her side of the story finally told, but HMC's behavior has been petty and off-putting to me.

The story about Shannen being kept by Alyssa and her mom from seeing Holly in the hospital is bizarre. In the first place, what gave them that power and in the second place, if HMC and Shannen were as close as they always say, why was Alyssa the middleman in the first place?

I realize all of this was traumatic for all four them, but it's been 24 years. None of them seem to let anything go. Well, HMC doesn't. I really don't like her. I love Shannen's podcast, though.

 

Edited March 28 by EarlGreyTea

[EarlGreyTea]

On 1/13/2024 at 10:58 AM, iMonrey said:

What I found strange was Shannen's claim that the "narrative" for years had been that she quit. But that's not so. I distinctly remember at the time it happened, she was notified during the hiatus after Season 3 that she was being let go. There were rumors that she had asked Spelling to be released from her contract at the end of Season 3 and he denied her request, so maybe that's what she means. There were also rumors that Alyssa's manager was also looking for ways to break her contract with the show. The new info from this podcast is that Alyssa was threatening to sue. 

Also that Holly wanted to leave when they fired Shannen but they threatened to sue her and garnish any future wages she made. Wow.

Time heals all wounds they say, and with age comes perspective. I've caught a few YouTube videos of ComicCon panels with various Charmed cast members, including Shannen and Rose. Alyssa wasn't in any of them. The rest of them seem to get along and appreciate the fandom. I was surprised to see Rose involved since it seemed like she absolutely hated doing the show, but she seems to have at least grown to appreciate the fans.

Yeah, she was definitely fired and I definitely remember the gleeful headlines that she was let go from another Spelling show.

So I finally listened to Shannen's interview with Holly. I was disappointed to hear almost no accountability from either of them, as much as I like Shannen. To hear them tell it, they were worker bees and the only ones who cared about the quality of the show. To hear them tell it, they had some bad days but nothing to cause such a huge dilemma that resulted in Shannen's firing. To me, it's a case of either not remembering, or not wanting to admit, even all these years later, that all three of them behaved heinously. As vague as Alyssa has been about her role in all of this, at least she publicly apologized, and said she played a role in the conflict. I heard none of this from either Shannen or Holly.

I don't believe that being late to 90210 or being too dedicated to her work on Charmed were Shannen's biggest flaws. Her firings speak to much more than that. And I like her a lot!

Edited March 29 by EarlGreyTea

[KeithJ]

My wife pretty much has Charmed on every morning on TNT and I noticed today that Enter The Demon (S4 E4) was not in widescreen.  It was in 4:3 with black bars on the sides of the screen.  I checked Peacock and it is widescreen there.

Why would TNT have this one episode in 4:3?

[Morrigan2575]

Shannon passed away, I'm very sad to hear that. 😢 

[Bellatrix]

In loving remembrance of Shannen Doherty and with sincere gratitude ♥️

[Writing Wrongs]

I am so bummed. First Luke and now Shannen.

[Pearson80]

I actually cried this morning upon hearing the news.  I have always been a fan of Shannen and may she rest in peace.  Charmed was never the same without her. 

I hope that somebody has given Holly Marie a hug because I know that she is hurting beyond we can even imagine because they were best friends and she loved Shannen fiercely.. She was always rooting for her and defending her always no matter what..

[Writing Wrongs]

Same for Sarah Michelle Gellar. Her and Shannen were very close.

Shannen had just joined The House of Halliwell Podcast.

[Spartan Girl]

Prue was the best sister, hands down. Without her, the show just got stupid. RIP Shannen. You deserved better.

Edited July 15 by Spartan Girl

[Bellatrix]

59 minutes ago, Pearson80 said:

I actually cried this morning upon hearing the news.  I have always been a fan of Shannen and may she rest in peace.  Charmed was never the same without her. 

 

16 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

Prue was the best sister, hands down. Without her, the show just got stupid. RIP Shannon. You deserved better.

Completely agree with you both.

Shannen just had that IT-factor. When she was on screen she immediately drew your eye and held your attention. There are many great actors out there, but there are not many who have that sort of magnetism on screen. (That is not to disparage other actors, just to highlight that natural ability Shannen had.) She just popped on screen.

I remember being angry when she was fired from Beverly Hills 90210, and furious and absolutely devastated when she was fired from Charmed.

 

[Halting Hex]

Goddamn cancer is harder to vanquish than Shax.  RIP Shannen.

2 hours ago, Writing Wrongs said:

Same for Sarah Michelle Gellar. Her and Shannen were very close.

Between Shannen's cancer and Selma Blair's battles with MS, being Smidge's pal is almost as bad for your health as dating Buffy.  Sigh.

2 hours ago, Pearson80 said:

I hope that somebody has given Holly Marie a hug because I know that she is hurting beyond we can even imagine because they were best friends and she loved Shannen fiercely.. She was always rooting for her and defending her always no matter what..

Remember, they knew each other even before the show.  (There's pics of their trip to Ireland in 1996 or whenever.)  I remember reading that Shannen refused to take the part unless HMC was cast as Piper, and of course Holly was furious about the firing and let everybody know about it.

Really good career retrospective on the BBC World News.  Didn't know BH90210 and this show were so big in the UK.   That's nice.

Thank you for Heather Duke, Brenda Walsh, and our Late Lamented dearest Prudence.  Rest easy, now.

Edited July 14 by Halting Hex

[iMonrey]

Very sad new, Shannen was very brave and shared her story so valiantly.

I was so happy to see the "House of Halliwell" podcast come back with Shannen and now I wonder what will happen with it. My hope is that they go forward with it in her honor and memory. For all us Charmed fans who appreciate the show.

[andromeda331]

RIP Shannen. Cancer sucks. I loved her as Brenda and she was so good as Prue and Heather Duke. I know she was in Little House on the Prairie but I first saw her on Our House as Kris Witherspoon.

[Writing Wrongs]

Shannen recorded episodes for the new House of Halliwell reboot podcast and they are planning on airing them as well as continuing the podcast to honor Shannen.

People

SMG comments

Holly comments

I just read a post by actor James Hong on X talking about working with Shannen on Charmed. He references the body switch episode, Enter The Demon. I think he's confusing Shannen with Rose. Awkward...

Edited July 15 by Writing Wrongs

[Spartan Girl]

At least Prue got one final moment of glory using telekinesis on those stupid reporters and that mob of lunatics that shot Piper.

Now I wonder how different the show would’ve been if Piper had been the one to die instead of Prue. Considering how awful her character got in later seasons, maybe it would’ve been better that way.

[andromeda331]

1 hour ago, Spartan Girl said:

At least Prue got one final moment of glory using telekinesis on those stupid reporters and that mob of lunatics that shot Piper.

Now I wonder how different the show would’ve been if Piper had been the one to die instead of Prue. Considering how awful her character got in later seasons, maybe it would’ve been better that way.

I always find it ironic for me at the time I would have picked Prue to die over Phoebe. Prue was really annoying and season 3 and I didn't like her that much.  From insisting on saving her ex who didn't want to be saved, treated her boyfriends crappy, and power of one kicks. However a season later I hated Phoebe so much that I wish she had been killed instead of Prue.

Edited July 21 by andromeda331

[Halting Hex]

On 7/21/2024 at 11:49 AM, Spartan Girl said:

I wonder how different the show would’ve been if Piper had been the one to die instead of Prue.

I can't imagine that the ship could have run too smoothly with Shannen and Alyssa continuing without Holly there to act as a buffer.  Imagining the dynamic with a new cast member (Rose or whomever) having to act in that role makes me flinch.

It's been observed that the 3 sisters can be classified as Freud's 3 "interacting agents".  Phoebe is the Id (representing Personal Desires), Prue is the Ego (representing the need for Control) and Piper is the Superego, stuck in the middle.  (It's no wonder that Piper's power is to stop time.) I find it ironic that Holly's role in the group dynamic IMO matches Piper's role in the sisterly dynamic.

Edited July 22 by Halting Hex

[Writing Wrongs]

The latest House of Halliwell episode, "Remembering Shannen Doherty" is really sad. Holly is trying to hold it together.

[andromeda331]

I was watching Just Harried. Patty tells the girls about having a premotion of Piper's wedding day. It made me think of Patty's letter to Sam in H20 that she wouldn't take on the water demon if she didn't think she'd make it home to her girls. I wonder if the premotion make her think that she would? Did that factor into her decision? And that's why she wasn't worried?   

[EarlGreyTea]

On 7/31/2024 at 3:10 AM, andromeda331 said:

I was watching Just Harried. Patty tells the girls about having a premotion of Piper's wedding day. It made me think of Patty's letter to Sam in H20 that she wouldn't take on the water demon if she didn't think she'd make it home to her girls. I wonder if the premotion make her think that she would? Did that factor into her decision? And that's why she wasn't worried?   

Honestly, I think that's giving the writers WAY too much credit. If I recall, they didn't even properly plan out who Chris was when he first appeared. CHRIS, the son of one of the sisters.

[Writing Wrongs]

Why did she even have premonitions? Her power was the same as Piper's. She only had a premonition in That 70s Episode because she was pregnant with Phoebe and channeling her power. 

At least that's how I understood it. Maybe she had several while pregnant. Who knows. Continuity isn't this shows strong suit.

Shannen really had an issue with Prue and Andy's relationship. On the podcasts, she says he comes off too stalkerish.

Edited August 25 by Writing Wrongs

[andromeda331]

18 hours ago, Writing Wrongs said:

Why did she even have premonitions? Her power was the same as Piper's. She only had a premonition in That 70s Episode because she was pregnant with Phoebe and channeling her power. 

At least that's how I understood it. Maybe she had several while pregnant. Who knows. Continuity isn't this shows strong suit.

Yes, Patty only had premontions while she was pregnant with Phoebe. Like how Piper tapped into Wyatt's power that made her invincible while she was pregnant. The first premonition Patty had was seeing the Charmed ones although she though they were warlocks in that 70s episode. Grams was surprised because she didn't have premonitions but they didn't know she was pregnant with Phoebe. She mentions having a premonition of Piper's wedding day the day Phoebe was born. 

Yeah, like it would have been great in season six during the trial or before when Phoebe and Paige murder Phoebe's classmate if they had revisited season two Morality Bites where Phoebe murdered someone in the future.

Stalker is harsh. I don't think Andy was a stalker he was a cop who kept being thrown into investigating the same cases as Prue because were supernatural. 

[Halting Hex]

Because I can never cease to find new ways to waste time (it's my superpower!), I found myself today wandering through the Wayback Machine's archive of the old TelevisionWithoutPity.com forums, and in the forum for this show, in the "Because the First Time Wasn't Bad Enough:  Reruns" topic, as Season 8 was winding to a close and everybody knew that the series had been CANCELLED!!, on April 26, 2006, DiePhoebeDie asked:

Quote

And how long is TNT going to keep Charmed in its line up?

18 years and going strong!  (Without interruption, IIRC).  Which is pretty awesome,  I must say.

(In contrast, poor orphan Buffy the Vampire Slayer has bounced all over the dial, from FX to PopTV  to Pivot and its current home on Fuse [yeah, I never heard of Fuse either], with annoying gaps in between. [Further grumbling relegated to that show's forum].) 

Congratulations, sisters!  I mean, still light-years behind Star Trek, but damned impressive, nevertheless.

 

Edited September 14 by Halting Hex

[Primal Slayer]

On 9/14/2024 at 3:49 PM, Halting Hex said:

Because I can never cease to find new ways to waste time (it's my superpower!), I found myself today wandering through the Wayback Machine's archive of the old TelevisionWithoutPity.com forums, and in the forum for this show, in the "Because the First Time Wasn't Bad Enough:  Reruns" topic, as Season 8 was winding to a close and everybody knew that the series had been CANCELLED!!, on April 26, 2006, DiePhoebeDie asked:

18 years and going strong!  (Without interruption, IIRC).  Which is pretty awesome,  I must say.

(In contrast, poor orphan Buffy the Vampire Slayer has bounced all over the dial, from FX to PopTV  to Pivot and its current home on Fuse [yeah, I never heard of Fuse either], with annoying gaps in between. [Further grumbling relegated to that show's forum].) 

Congratulations, sisters!  I mean, still light-years behind Star Trek, but damned impressive, nevertheless.

 

It is funny and sad that while Buffy was the stronger show and has more acclaim...Charmed has stood the test of the time in every other way. 

Still streaming strong on TNT that isnt some random channel

An actually quality remaster to help keep it up to date with the generation

[Primal Slayer]

I know it doesnt matter but for those interested - from a lawusit against Alyssa with her entertainment agency that it appears she lost.

[Halting Hex]

Holy shninkies!  Really, Alyssa??  I think it's safe to say that, whatever the animus involved, Shannen was not literally out to destroy you.

Also it's interesting to note that when Holly blew her top over Shannen's firing (read that T.V. Guide interview) and threatened to quit and was only palliated with a raise to $50,000 per episode (which still wasn't as much as Milano was getting), apparently Alyssa went right back into negotiations (Shannen was fired in July; Holly got the new deal in August, probably) and got an even better deal (her raise was over half of HMC's total).  I mean, good if you can get it, but it almost reads like Alyssa wanted revenge for Holly getting her raise.

And then to stiff your agents because they signed Shannen??  Dude, the blood feud is over.  (Or should be.)   This "it's me or her" crap is getting old, I say.  Not a good look.

(No, I don't think Holly was just using Shannen's firing as a pretext for negotiations.  She and Shannen go back to 1993, IIRC.  Shannen wasn't going to take the part if Spelling didn't cast Holly.  I think HMC was legit pissed.)

[Primal Slayer]

13 minutes ago, Halting Hex said:

Holy shninkies!  Really, Alyssa??  I think it's safe to say that, whatever the animus involved, Shannen was not literally out to destroy you.

Also it's interesting to note that when Holly blew her top over Shannen's firing (read that T.V. Guide interview) and threatened to quit and was only palliated with a raise to $50,000 per episode (which still wasn't as much as Milano was getting), apparently Alyssa went right back into negotiations (Shannen was fired in July; Holly got the new deal in August, probably) and got an even better deal (her raise was over half of HMC's total).  I mean, good if you can get it, but it almost reads like Alyssa wanted revenge for Holly getting her raise.

And then to stiff your agents because they signed Shannen??  Dude, the blood feud is over.  (Or should be.)   This "it's me or her" crap is getting old, I say.  Not a good look.

(No, I don't think Holly was just using Shannen's firing as a pretext for negotiations.  She and Shannen go back to 1993, IIRC.  Shannen wasn't going to take the part if Spelling didn't cast Holly.  I think HMC was legit pissed.)

 Exactly. There's no way that Shannen could've been out to destroy her yet the studio allowed Shannen to direct her twice in the season? This definitely showed (imo) that Alyssa was way more bitter than Shannen and the stories of Alyssa stating it was her or Shannen....very true. 

She won once by getting Shannen fired....but she lost the 2nd time trying to punish her agency over working with her. And she tried to play sly in the lawsuit, its very interesting to read
https://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/TAC/2005-10 The Endeavor Agency, LLC v. Alyssa Milano, AJM Productions, Inc..pdf

It was released to the public by california so....

[Halting Hex]

Also, not to validate a lot of "bony hag" insults, but some people clearly think that Alyssa looked far healthier when Shannen was "causing" her to gain weight in S3 than in S6, say.

And, yes, while most legal decisions are not exactly an exciting read, they are available to the public, since the suits are part of the public record. I won't hijack the thread, but I can think of at least three bits of salacious celebrity gossip that are verified in publicly-available legal documents, and that's doubtless only the tip of the iceberg.

Edited September 22 by Halting Hex

[andromeda331]

Damn Alyssa, you suck.

[Halting Hex]

On 7/15/2024 at 3:08 PM, Writing Wrongs said:

I just read a post by actor James Hong on X talking about working with Shannen on Charmed. He references the body switch episode, Enter The Demon. I think he's confusing Shannen with Rose. Awkward...

To be fair, James Hong is 95 years old.  And he's worked with a lot of actresses in his time.

[Acmeproducts]

On 9/21/2024 at 9:36 PM, Halting Hex said:

Also, not to validate a lot of "bony hag" insults, but some people clearly think that Alyssa looked far healthier when Shannen was "causing" her to gain weight in S3 than in S6, say.

And, yes, while most legal decisions are not exactly an exciting read, they are available to the public, since the suits are part of the public record. I won't hijack the thread, but I can think of at least three bits of salacious celebrity gossip that are verified in publicly-available legal documents, and that's doubtless only the tip of the iceberg.

How did Shannen cause Alyssa to gain weight?

[Halting Hex]

According to Alyssa's testimony recorded above, that was due to her and Shannen having 'conflicts on set".  Whether causing Alyssa stress with the deliberate idea of driving Alyssa to eat was part of Shannen's plan to "destroy" Alyssa or whether it was merely a side benefit ("bitch was trying to stress me out and she made me over-eat, too!") is unclear.

I mean, clearly Alyssa (and her attorneys) are trying to monsterize Shannen, because their "defense" for not paying WME their commissions is "they signed Shannen, even though they knew she had caused me so much pain! It's a breach!", so I can't take this too seriously.  (The part about Shannen causing Alyssa 'physical and emotional pain" seems a bit much, IMO.)  But that's apparently what Milano was claiming, anyhow.

[Acmeproducts]

Alyssa seems like a troublemaker.

[Pearson80]

Based on the documents posted above, Alyssa was truly a vindictive petty small-minded person. She was a piece of work.  I now understand why Rose called her out so spectacularly a few years ago on tweeter, telling the world how Alyssa made life unbearable on the set of the show. I remember Shannen even  asked to be released from her contract in season 3 due to Alyssa's antics. She just could not take it anymore. 

 Alyssa's disdain for Shannen and paranoia is so over the top and nonsensical.  I think she should have just spoken to Shannen privately about their petty issues and then move on.  Not everybody is meant to be friends in life. Being respectful and professional in order to put on a great show for the fans is all that really mattered at the end of the day.  

I truly believe that the original power of 3 envisioned by Constance Burge was truly special and it is a shame that egos got in the way of that.  

[Primal Slayer]

While it is up to the individual....imo since Alyssa wanted to be on par with Shannen salary wise...it always baffles me that she (to our knowledge) didnt push for equal compensation for Her/Holly. Instead she became the highest paid with Holly coming in 2nd. 

[andromeda331]

On 11/9/2024 at 7:17 PM, Primal Slayer said:

While it is up to the individual....imo since Alyssa wanted to be on par with Shannen salary wise...it always baffles me that she (to our knowledge) didnt push for equal compensation for Her/Holly. Instead she became the highest paid with Holly coming in 2nd. 

Exactly, I'd agree with her if she thought she and Holly should both get equal pay. But nope. All she cared about was herself and screwed over Holly.