Katsullivan

You know, I would have said that if I didn't get a strong impression that there is a degree of spite behind the way Iris is written. Making Barry dump her before "Duet" because he needed space, and anyway he never really wanted to marry her? That was nonsensical, cruel and it's never properly resolved. The writers obviously needed to put Westallen on a break to give the musical a theme, but it wasn't necessary to do it this way. There might be some absent-minded carelessness behind the way Iris/ Westallen is written. But there's also a great deal of deliberate malice.

Well, the actress has been pointedly disinterested in any of her canon romantic plotlines, preferring instead to talk up the crack ship between her and Barry so I won't be surprised if that influences her performance.

Yes, I remember picking up on this in the first season but it fizzled out. I can't say I'm too disappointed. It read too much like Barry being a "Nice Guy" to Iris, and I wasn't there for that. But considering the nothing we eventually got, I wish we had that instead. Missed opportunities with Westallen are more the norm than the exception. As earlier discussed, the future byline was a stumbling block to their relationship that they could have milked across the entire season, really. Have Barry/Iris dancing around each other because Iris doesn't want destiny to control her choices and Barry is resenting her for it, because she is effectively letting destiny control her actions by rebelling against destiny. Forgiveness should follow an apology, should it not? Barry never apologises to Iris. Or his apology is his proposal which, imo, seems offensive. As if Iris should be so grateful to be getting an offer of marriage, that she should forgive the fact that the dumped her when she had barely months to live, and left her stuck in the apartment that he insisted they moved into, because she dared to have misgivings about the dubious motives for him proposing to her. Barry's decision for "space" came across like Barry punishing Iris. The more I think about it, the more it strikes me that the show gives Barry too much power in that relationship. He wants to them to move in, so they do. He wants them to have sex, so they do. He wants them to get married, so Iris accepts his proposal. Iris changes her mind about his proposal - and he dumps her. The Music Maester "fixes" Barry, so he proposes to her again and she accepts it without question. The season 3 dynamic is not even an inversion of season 1 where Barry was pining and Iris was oblivious.

Just quoting everything because I agree with it all. The show subtly makes it clear that Iris has always been in love with Barry, she just never realised it. It's shown when she tells Eddie that he's her first serious boyfriend because her life was full with her Dad and Barry. It's shown the first time Barry sees Iris and Eddie together and Iris acts like a cheating wife. It's shown with the tidbit that she was petty about his girlfriends, despite her claims of being supportive and wanting him to get a girlfriend of his own. She breaks dates to follow him to science conventions. She expects him to be enthusiastic about her blog because it's important to her. They "break up" over their fight about her blog and she cries about it, then ices him afterwards and Eddie even picks up on that. Eddie even admits that he was threatened by their relationship at first. Which he should be, because if Barry wasn't in a coma, Iris would never have dated him. Even their quarrel when she finds out that he's the Flash and all the "you were supposed to be my best friend!" / "I AM your best friend!" No, people. There's too much passion and tension for a platonic relationship. I never saw it that way but now that you've broken it down, I 100% agree that the future byline really was another hurdle for the relationship, and not the other way around and by the The Runaway Dinosaur episode, Iris and Barry have come to terms with it, their apparent cosmic connection. They are not letting it influence their decisions by deliberately rebelling against it just for the sake of proving it wrong.

Big neon warning sign where characterisation is concerned. The moment writers start making characters do bad things that they'll be ultimately blameless for, you can see the Mary Sueism written all over the work. Made most striking in the previous to last episode. Wally gets chewed out and banned by Barry, with no support from anyone except Jessie, while Caitlin's "betrayal" is only regarded as such by Julian, the newest member of the group and the one who has romantic interests in her. Actions without consequences are the death knoll of any good story.

Er.... TV is watched, not explained. I don't need Julie Plec to sit down on my couch to tell me what I'm watching nor should I need to follow her tweets to understand what just happened. If it looks like rape, and smells like rape and sounds like rape, then it's rape. Trying to claim that it's anything else because the writers said so is exactly the point @doram was making about Damon being protected by the narrative. But it's semantics really in this show. No, it's not. Consequences: a result or effect of an action or condition. / importance or relevance. Punishment: the infliction or imposition of a penalty as retribution for an offense.

LOL! It's extremely funny that you should say that because there was actually an article written about this in season 3 - which was, coincidentally when Plec took over the show from Kevin. Vampire Diaries is turning into Damon fanfic, as written by Damon If you don't have the time to read the entire article:

I think these two statements summarise in a nutshell what has been wrong with this story since Kevin left in s2. That second question could be addressed to the writers without any alteration.

Yeah, it's pretty much confirmed at this point that Kai will be in season 8. But for how many episodes and for what end is still speculation. And as @doram said, Kat/Bonnie being subjected to a rape scene is very likely. Kai was also their most dangerous villain, and he was obsessed with Bonnie so from a character pov, it makes sense that he would try to force her into sex if he got the chance.

OK, I just heard this really disturbing rumour: I'm actually surprised that a CW show has gone on this long without doing a gritty rape/attempted rape arc but seriously guys, it's not necessary! There are many ways to give Bonnie her magic back without doing this nonsense!

If JK Rowling figuratively dropping anvils on the Harry/Hermione shippers didn't stop them from hoping for a Harmione endgame in book 7 and being furious that she wrote an epilogue that put Paid to all the shipping theories, then I doubt that the SDCC panel will make an impact on Jonsa speculations. Fans will ship what they will, and will be disappointed even after being given fair warning. It's just the nature of fandom.

Or to quote Edmund Burke and Martin King Jnr: all that is required for evil to prosper is for good people to stand by and do nothing. Those are the consequences of Sansa's cowardice - being complicit in evil, and it led to an innocent direwolf being murdered because Sansa didn't want to compromise her dreams of being a fairy-tale princess.

That only matters if Arya's endgame is to, find her way back to the light. If it's for her to continue her somewhat-dark, lone-wolf path and maybe seek adventures "West of Westeros", then she'll need someone as hardened as herself by her side. I don't think all, if any of the surviving Starks will have a textbook happy ending.

Yes, this. I don't think people would be so offended by Sansa's story if it actually made sense. But her story was all over the place. You can even tell from the interviews from the actress and writers that they have no idea what they're doing with her character.

Yes, I was trying not to point out the obvious. But yes, it is sexist that people call Dany a Sue - a girl who was raped at 13, was a fugitive all her childhood, and has lost so much, and constantly screws up despite having the best intentions, etc, but Jon who is the epitome of the lost heir fantasy trope isn't seen as one.

So that answers the question then.

That is a big question and concern for me. Of course, I am Team Benvolio. I am a sucker for forced engagement turned true love trope. In addition, I appreciated that Escalus was doing what he felt was the best for his people, but I still felt he screwed Rosaline over when he duped her into accepting the engagement against her will. I want the love triangle to drag for a long time because both men are so attractive and I'd like to see more of them. That's probably how they'll drag the story across an indefinite number of seasons. They'll play up the Escalus/Rosaline arc in season 1, and end with her engagement to Benvolio. Season 2 will be about ramping up the mystery and bringing Rosaline and Benvolio closer together. They might add a few more murders and stuff. It might end with Benvolio be accused of the murders and kidnapping Rosaline. Season 3 will be Benvolio and Rosaline on the run and end with their marriage. I can't see how this story moves past 3 seasons.

Dear Robb's heart was in the right place but he showed over and over again that he should have left the politiking to his mother. He made so many bad calls in his time as King: sending Theon to the Iron Islands, marrying Jeyne, re-allying with the Freys after insulting them... When Robb wants to make Jon his heir, does he mention someone else leaving the Night's Watch successfully or is this just one of the (stupid) things he thinks he can get away with because "I'm the King and I can do what I want!", complete with flourish and riding off like a brat? Question for the book readers: is there any mention of anyone abandoning the Night's Watch and not being punished for it? I know there's a World book, and there are the Dunk and Egg books, etc. Because if Jon is the first person to abandon the Night Watch and not be punished for it, I would expect that to be hyped up a great deal more than if, like WearyTraveler explained, they don't show every minutiae of Jon's discussions with his bannermen. We start the scene with Jon talking about the White Walkers at least, so we know it's not something he was deliberately hiding. This explanation takes far less mind-bending than:

I don't think Sansa is going to die in childbirth because I don't think any of the main female characters will die in childbirth. But I agree that Sansa fits the "death by childbirth" trope better than any of the more military women like Dany or Arya. Yeah, that's like GRRM putting all the R+L=J clues and then turning around to say he put those clues to show that R+L is not equal to J. It's head-scratching because why did you put the clues in the first place? No one was even thinking R + L = J until you did?? Anyway, like you said, it's a waiting game at this stage. I remember all the increasingly elaborate reasons against R + L = J . The most common ones were that it was too predictable, and too Mary-Sueish. By the way, isn't interesting that Dany is considered a Mary Sue despite all her hardships (sold into marriage by her brother at 13, raped, lost her child and husband, etc) but Jon gets a second life and is not?

I'm not a big Damon fan. I also feel that Plec put her personal feelings or crush on Ian into the writing of this story. Stefan feels like if he hasn't had a story in 2 seasons now. Last year, did he even meet Kai, the season's Big Bad?

@doram: Michael and Jane weren't even really dating when he was lying about having a girlfriend and moving on, because Jane had already ended things with him. He didn't even know if she still had feelings for him because they hadn't seen each other in many months. But if you count Jane's first kiss, then that makes it two times that Rafael broke her heart.

Am I the only one that did not see the Bonora chemistry? I think Bonnie had more chemistry with Liv Parker in season 5. They should have made her the gay twin.

oh good. I can quote my own posts because after the last episode, I'm sure that this is what has happened.

Why do Bamon fans never condemn Damon for sleeping with his brother's girlfriend? Why is the blame always put solely on Elena's shoulders?

If Bonnie gets together with Damon or Enzo, she's never going to have family of her own blood. She may be able to find our make the cure for Enzo, but Damon won't take a cure without Elena. I wonder if the producers have thought about this?