General Days

Logan, Michelle, Leon, and Audrey don't want to be on the show at all, so I'm sure they avoided the cameras. They were all definitely on the boat ride on the day of the rehearsal. I'm sure they were at the wedding. At the wedding reception, I did see Leon in a couple of brief flashes, dancing near Christine. You could see Garrison behind Janelle and some attractive brunette woman, during the lap dance scene. (I still can't get over that Christine did that in front of -- well, in front of anyone -- her whole family and the worldwide television audience.) Here are pictures of my TV screen, that I took with my very old phone. The sun was coming in the window and hitting the TV (which needs to be dusted). Sorry for the quality. I also had to convert them to jpegs, and reduce the quality, so that they wouldn't be too large to post here. Leon is in the white/light shirt with the darker spots, to our left of Mykelti, who is dancing in the center in a rust colored dress. Here's Garrison. Sorry for the sunspot (and possible smudge on Garrison's mouth). Edited to add: You can see all 12 of the OG13 kids who attended (Gwendlyn did not) in the family photo (Christine + kids) in this Today Show article on the wedding. https://www.today.com/popculture/tv/christine-brown-david-woolley-wedding-details-rcna132348

Love Janelle getting in the comment that she sees David and Christine sitting on the porch in their rocking chairs, with their kids and grandkids. (Edit: I'm behind. My kid and his GF came in. I finally shooed them away, so I could watch.)

Aspyn knew she didn't want polygamy for herself, but I think she thought more positively of it, until she learned the realities of her mother's marriage to Kody. Aspyn had an interview where she said it. She was in a lilac blouse. Ysabel said it was fun growing up in, but she wouldn't want it for herself (she was wearing a top with varying shades of pinks and purples. Gabe's interview had in on the couch with Savanah. He said he thinks polygamy can be a beautiful lifestyle for people who want it and everything that comes with it. Savanah added people "who believe in it," but said she wouldn't be able to make it work. Mykelti (who was wearing a green top & faded jean jacket in her couch interview) said her opinion on polygamy started to shift during their time in Las Vegas. She said that it's so perfect now (with Christine & David) makes it obvious something was wrong in the Browns' polygamous marriage. She doesn't think any of her parents got what they needed out of it.

Christine's mom has had a rough life.

Right. I agree, @GeorgiaRai. I think Mykelti should / should have vaccinated her kids against chickenpox. Since she didn't (or if she did, since they only had one shot and it didn't prevent infection), I can see her looking for home remedies to treat the kids' misery. Colloidal oatmeal baths help with chickenpox. I know. I had it as an adult (before the vaccine).

I think Christine perceives/perceived the letter "Y" as feminine, so her daughters all have a "Y" in their names, but her son doesn't. Don't ask me why. I don't even have wine on hand.

Now don't sell Janelle short. She spells Savanah wrong.

No. They weren't related, or weren't directly related. I think Mykelti said Maddie told her to do it for a cough remedy.

I ended up watching the first episode. It was about the Jeffs' group, but not so much about him, so I was able to get through it. I am interested to see what they have to say about the AUB.

A&E has a new docu-series, Secrets of Polygamy. I found it when I was looking for something else and stumbled upon this article in The Salt Lake Tribune. The series (or perhaps the season) contains ten one-hour episodes. The first of those episodes concentrates on more recent developments in the FLDS church (the Warren Jeffs group), and one Samuel Bateman and several of his followers. Here's what the US DOJ has to say about Bateman (CONTENT WARNING: child sexual abuse; CSAM; and all manner of awfulness): https://www.justice.gov/usao-az/pr/colorado-city-man-and-10-members-polygamist-sect-charged-illicit-sexual-conduct-minors I personally cannot stomach another thing about the FLDS group. However the Google Knowledge Panel that came up when I search on the series title indicated that the Apostolic United Brethren (AUB, i.e. the Browns' cult) will be the focus of another episode. I searched on that and found this article: https://www.pennlive.com/tv/2024/01/how-to-watch-the-premiere-of-aes-new-series-the-secrets-of-polygamy.html Here's a quote: I've recently read about Christine's late uncle, Vance Allred (died in 2021), who left the AUB after discovering that some sexual abuse had been covered up and/or at least not effectively addressed. Here is a Reddit post about the interview that Vance did with John Dehlin at Mormon Stories. According to Vance, his uncle Owen — Christine Brown's great-uncle/step-grandfather (Annie's mother married him after she left Floren LeBaron, which is how Annie is step-sisters with Kristyn Decker) — knew about the abuse, was distressed about it, but didn't know how to address it. Vance got fed up and exited. Like Christine's father, Rex, Vance was the son of Rulon C. Allred (who was murdered on Ervil LeBaron's orders — Ervil was the brother of Floren — are you dizzy yet). More recently, the guy who was the AUB leader from 2014 to 2021, the late Lynn Thompson [who is some sort of (distant?) relation, I think, to Aspyn's husband Mitch], was accused by his daughter Rosemary Williams (of My Five Wives fame) of molesting her when she was young. I don't know which AUB stories this new Secrets of Polygamy series plans to cover, but I figured it was worth a mention. Here is more from A&E: Here are some trailers/previews: I'm pretty sure Kollene Snow — one of the young plyg escapees featured on Sister Wives — is in these next two videos. If you have cable, I'm pretty sure you can stream the series from A&E for free. Otherwise, it looked to me like it was available to people who subscribe to HULU LIVE. There are other options (Sling, etc.) mentioned at the Penn Live link above.

I don't think the abuse in Robyn's first marriage is b.s. Her three oldest kids were way too hungry for Kody's affection, and I'll never forget Aurora sobbing with relief when Kody said he could adopt them. Just because Robyn sucks doesn't mean her ex didn't also suck.

Regarding the rings in the Sister Wives title animation, I would like to see one of the rings melt. Maybe that would feel cruel to Meri, and if so, I wouldn't want it. I just think that part of the story is significant. I liked that they put a ring as the "i" in Sister Wives for Christine and David's wedding special. I thought it was a sweet touch.

I think Christine is working through her own guilt over certain issues with her kids. She's trying, in her Christiney way, to set things right. Sometimes, Christine's issues manifest in passive-aggression. We've seen that on the show, since the beginning. I think Christine is actively trying to make amends, not to best Robyn and Kody, but because she loves Mykelti and feels bad about things in their past. Although, I do think she would think if she showed up Robyn and Kody in the process, Christine would see that as a bonus. Issues: she has them. This time (the wedding Instagram), Christine made a misstep in trying to show her appreciation of Mykelti, but I think the desire to show her gratitude was sincere. The fandom lionized Christine in wake of her divorce, but she is not perfect. She's just a person doing her best, while tending to her own damage, and trying to have a better second half of her life than she did in the first half. ABOUT MYKELTI In the early seasons of the show, the kids who stuck out to me as deeply unhappy were Leon, Mykelti, and Hunter. (Maddie was angry in the wake of the move to Vegas, but she was normal teen angry. Meanwhile, parentified Logan and Aspyn reacted by being too good to be true.) Since this is the Mykelti thread, I'll stick to her. I think Mykelti was treated poorly, not only by the other older kids and Meri, but also by Kody and Christine. I think the family had sort of a pack mentality, and didn't consider Mykelti part of the pack. I wouldn't encourage anyone to subscribe to Mykelti's Patreon if you have a distaste for her. That said, on Patreon, Mykelti is far more relaxed than she is on the show — more vulnerable and much more herself. Her voice is even more natural. She's likable, and she has a sense of humor, even about herself. On her Patreon, I see a young woman who is still working on her issues too. And she's honest about that, sometimes painfully so. Other times, she is less than candid (and those times seem pretty obvious to me), usually out of a desire not to hang a family member out to dry. Yeah, she seems to be a devotee of pseudo-scientific "medicine": let your kids get chickenpox, have your placenta dried and put into capsules, and take as a supplement to combat postpartum, soak an onion in honey blah blah blah. The day I take medical advice from reality TV show subjects is the day my family should tell a court I am a danger to myself and others. Just like with their MLM stuff, anyone who thinks this whole family's pseudo-science makes medical sense was already primed to fall for it, anyhow. Mykelti's mother, Slay Queen Christine, raised her to trust that sort ignorance cloaked as folk wisdom. And Christine was indoctrinated with it from a long line of cultists. That's their only lasting "polygamist royalty" inheritance, poor things. (Btw, Mykelti specifically got the onion in honey remedy from Maddie, who is a big naturopathy fan. And I'll note here, Grandma Sheryl was an actual nurse and wasn't even raised in Mormonism, in case people are wondering where that buck stops.)

MO-AB (two syllables, first syllable rhymes with "toe")

When Christine ran down the middle of the aisle on the boat, and a bunch of the kids were visible to her left. She handed something off to Hunter after she chugged. He was next to his girlfriend Audrey, who was next to Logan's wife, Michelle, who was next to Logan. Behind Logan and Michelle, you can see Maddie, Caleb, and Paedon. Garrison was right in front of Hunter. He was seated next to Aspyn and Mitch. In the row ahead of them were Tony, Mykelti, Ysabel, and Savanah. Janelle was in front of them, next to some guy (maybe one of Christine's brothers? IDK, and a little boy). In the row in front of Janelle was Leon, Leon's Audrey, and Gabe. I felt the same way, but a few people have mentioned that maybe it has to do with the kids being older — which I guess I can get. I was surprised it fazed Ysabel and Aspyn though. As I understand it, that town is pretty much all AUB (and probably some non-practicing people who grew up there). Yes, I think so. I went back and listened again. There was a lot of crosstalk and incomplete sentences. The following isn't a perfect transcript, but it's fairly accurate. ___ REX: Love you so much, honey. CHRISTINE: Love you too, Daddy. R: You have a lot of fun, hon. C: You too. R: It's gonna be way different years than those last 20 or-- C: Yeah. R: He was — C: I'm gonna be loved, Dad. R: Oh honey, he was just — he was just bawling. 'I can't believe I lost her'. Oh honey. C: But now I get this. R: Here you are with a wonderful man. I'm telling ya. C: I know, Dad. He's amazing. R: He loves you a lot. C: I know. He loves me so much. R: So neat. You're gonna be treated good. C: Yes, I am. R: For a very long time. C: Yes. Yes. I'm gonna be treated great, Dad. R: Time goes by so fast. C: I know. It's weird, right? R: The next thing you know it's like boom. C: No. I'm 51, Dad. It's weird. R: That can't be. ___ Mr. Allred seemed to have a big scar on his forehead, and sort of from his right cheek to his ear. It made me wonder if he'd had cancer removed or something.

After the mainstream LDS church abandoned the principle of plural marriage, so that Utah could become a state, some polygamous Mormons took off for Mexico, to evade legal consequences. Mitt Romney's father, George, was born in Chihuahua, Mexico (where there were plyg Mormon colonies), and although George's parents were reportedly monogamous, their parents (his grandparents) were polygamists. The Browns' sect, the Apostolic United Brethren (AUB), has its temple in Mexico. It has an endowment house in Bluffdale, Utah, which is right near Lehi, as well as endowment houses in Pinesdale, Montana (where Robyn lived with Preston Jessop), Lovell, Wyoming (which is where Kody's family is from), and a few more locations. To my knowledge, the Mexico temple is their only temple location.

It was David's daughter, Raegan/Rae, who said David and Christine both have very strong personalities and both are leaders. I only remember because my impression of David is similar to yours, so I was surprised to hear him described that way. I didn't think it was offensive, at first. Overall. I thought Meri's well wishes seemed kind and sincere. The part with Robyn and Kody together was obnoxious. I get why Robyn thought she might have to direct the conversation -- because you never know what's going to come out of Kody's mouth. Then Robyn shot herself in the foot by saying something about them being happy if the "can be" or as happy as they "can be." Even her tone was sour. That, I did find offensive. Later, when Kody gave his own thoughts/well-wishes, without Robyn present, he did much better than I expected. The Woolley name is big in early LDS history and in the history of polygamous break-away groups (after the mainstream church abandoned polygamy, to ensure statehood for Utah): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorin_C._Woolley I distinctly remember seeing Hunter, his Audrey, Logan, and Michelle on the boat (and Leon, too). I think all of Janelle's kids might have been on it, but I'm not positive. I think that video is inaccurate about one thing. I do remember Mykelti originally saying she didn't know why Gwendlyn wasn't there (and I too thought it was a lie at the time). I do not remember Mykelti saying Christine was hurt. I could be forgetting, but I felt like the YouTuber added that bit. I suspect Gwen wasn't there for a few reasons: 1. Her demanding semester was true enough 2. Paedon 3. Gwen & Bea let production film at (season 19 spoiler): Gwen got pissed, because the production sort of steamrolled (I hope the spoiler tags work. I'll delete right away and take my answer to the spoiler thread if it doesn't.)

I quoted the above posts about Christine's resemblance/connection to Anna LeBaron (of the Daughters of the Cult docu-series), and posted about them in the Christine thread, HERE. Long story short: Christine is an Allred and a LeBaron (Annie, Christine's mom, was a niece of Ervil. So Annie's uncle had her father-in-law murdered, when Christine was just a little girl.)

(To be clear, I was talking about Annie -- Christine's mom -- being sad, not Anna, who is one of the documentary subjects. The family tree is already a wreath. Such similar names make it all so much harder to track.)

Right? I haven't watched the whole docu-series yet (I keep putting it on after my husband falls asleep, because he's not into it, then I fall asleep), but it really makes it hit home how indoctrinated someone like Christine would have been. She's from two pretty big name plyg families. That she (and Annie, before her) managed to extract themselves not just from their marriages, but from their families' religious sects is impressive. I always feel so sad when I see Annie (i.e. Christine's mother). Even when she's at her best on the show, I see a person who has been so injured by life.

Importing from the Mykelti thread... The discussion turned to the ABC News docu-series (currently on Hulu), Daughters of the Cult. @Roslyn is right... It is. I knew Annie Allred (aka Ruthann Stephens, i.e. Christine Brown's mother) was a LeBaron. According to Anna LeBaron's (one of the women in the docu-series) description of their family connection, her father, Ervil LeBaron, would be Christine's great-uncle on her mother's side (i.e. Christine's mother Annie's dad (Floren) and Ervil were brothers). This is in line with what I'd previously read about Christine's LeBaron connection. https://www.facebook.com/annaklebaron/posts/these-two-cousins-were-photographed-on-their-respective-wedding-days-that-is-me-/2272393056326867/ Facebook post didn't embed. I've broken it into two screenshots, because the post was long and I didn't want to decrease the size. For people who use screen readers, the text of Anna LeBaron's Facebook post reads:

Yesh. Here's a screenshot (that I got from Reddit), of Christine's Instagram post, before she edited it. The "before the rest of my kids" seems to me like it was a passive-aggressive swipe at her other children.

Okay, see you on the other side, sister watchers.

NOTE TO KODY: Truely is only a year older than Dayton was when you spiritually married Robyn. Don't count your daddy/stepdaddy chickens, before they've hatched (and built a nest out of that straw on your head).

QUESTION: When Christine's dad, Rex, was whispering to her outside (on rehearsal day), did I understand him correctly? Was Rex saying that Kody cried to him, "I can't believe she left me"? I think he's a former Mormon, but I don't think they've been explicit about his faith on the show or on the girls' Patreons.