Regina, the Evil Queen: The Only Happy Ending Will Be Hers

[Dani-Ellie]

At the beginning of season 3 (second half) it was clear that Regina was not responsible for Marian's death, and then after Emma changed the timeline, Regina became her killer.

 

Regina imprisoned Marian before Hook and Emma even arrived in the Enchanted Forest, Hook and Emma stayed hidden during the scene in the village when Regina paraded Marian around as an example of what defying the Queen looks like, and Marian was already on Enchanted Forest Death Row in the Queen's dungeon when Emma was taken prisoner. I fail to see how it was clear that Regina was not responsible for Marian's death prior to Emma changing the timeline.

Edited July 19, 2014 by Dani-Ellie

[Mari]

I think the original timeline is probably lost, but I am curious about the development about Marian and how she really died. At the beginning of season 3 (second half) it was clear that Regina was not responsible for Marian's death, and then after Emma changed the timeline, Regina became her killer. The writer's comments over the summer lead me to believe there will be more development to that story.

I know you want to believe the best of Regina, but we weren't given many details in the original timeline.  We were told that Robin felt responsible because of a job he was on--which actually doesn't contradict what happened in the altered timeline.

 

It's quite possible that Regina was responsible for killing Marian in the original timeline, as well as nearly killing her in the modified timeline.

Edited July 19, 2014 by Mari

[FavFable]

It was interesting that Snow even realized how gross her parents were. Bleeding Through had some disturbing moments and some really good character development. It was one of the better episodes from last year.

 

I think the original timeline is probably lost, but I am curious about the development about Marian and how she really died. At the beginning of season 3 (second half) it was clear that Regina was not responsible for Marian's death, and then after Emma changed the timeline, Regina became her killer. The writer's comments over the summer lead me to believe there will be more development to that story.

 

Do you think they will ever clue Regina in that Rumple killed her sister? I am torn about whether or not I want her to get even with him. I would love to see Rumple actually be accountable for something, but not at the expense of Regina's redemption.

I have to disagree. I don't think the timeline is lost. Marian is out of time. She is going to have to pay for that some way. When the storyline is over I think any issues between Marian and Regina will be resolved. I still think Emma's interference will come back to bite everyone.

 

Rumple will not be held accountable for any of his actions. He will claim he was justified in killing an unarmed woman as she sat in a jail cell. Typical of that character. Since Zelena's death is tied to the time travel I think she might be back before the storyline is over. I would love another scene between the two sisters, for Zelena to actually care about Regina as her sister, but I have my doubts.

Edited July 19, 2014 by FavFable

[Serena]

I'm really sick of the good guys having to pay for the villain actions. Marian "paying" for Regina trying to kill her, Neal "paying" for Rumple's misdeeds... I hope they don't go that way with Marian.

[Rockybeach]

 

I have to disagree. I don't think the timeline is lost. Marian is out of time. She is going to have to pay for that some way. When the storyline is over I think any issues between Marian and Regina will be resolved. I still think Emma's interference will come back to bite everyone.

I hope your right. I hated that Emma was fine with changing the timeline as long as it didn't impact her. Heck she could have killed Rumple and saved everyone but she choose not too. Must be nice to play god the way she does.

I don't think Marian will ever be ok with Regina, because the Regina she knows existed 30 years ago. I doubt she will care about who Regina has become. I just hope Regina continues to get back to her true self. Love her development and progress. Have to ask, do you have a favorite Regina episode from season 1?

[Mari]

I hope your right. I hated that Emma was fine with changing the timeline as long as it didn't impact her. Heck she could have killed Rumple and saved everyone but she choose not too. Must be nice to play god the way she does.

I don't think Marian will ever be ok with Regina, because the Regina she knows existed 30 years ago. I doubt she will care about who Regina has become. I just hope Regina continues to get back to her true self. Love her development and progress. Have to ask, do you have a favorite Regina episode from season 1?

Taking my thoughts to the All-Seasons thread.

[FavFable]

I hope your right. I hated that Emma was fine with changing the timeline as long as it didn't impact her. Heck she could have killed Rumple and saved everyone but she choose not too. Must be nice to play god the way she does.

I don't think Marian will ever be ok with Regina, because the Regina she knows existed 30 years ago. I doubt she will care about who Regina has become. I just hope Regina continues to get back to her true self. Love her development and progress. Have to ask, do you have a favorite Regina episode from season 1?

It's typical for the character. She sees herself as the 'savior' and expects everyone to treat her as such.

 

I didn't consider it before, but I think you are right. Marian doesn't know all the changes Regina has gone through in the last couple years. All Marian knows is the Evil Queen. She has never met the Mayor. Even the BBC version of Robin Hood killed off Marian, so I don't think the character will be around too long in Once. Either she wins back Robin and they leave or Robin picks Regina and Marian disappears.

My favorite season 1 episode... Probably The Stable Boy. It really gave the viewers a chance to see the life Regina could have had not for Snow White and her father. I also loved Regina and Daniel together. I thought they were a good match.

 

Did you have a favorite?

Edited July 19, 2014 by FavFable

[Rockybeach]

Actually yeah, it was 'A Land without Magic'. I think everything Regina feared and tried to fight against finally happened. Regina was my least favorite character in season 1, but when her world crashed down around her, and she lost the one person she loved. I actually felt bad for her..... until that final scene...... when she realized magic was coming. That grin just killed me.

 

I get that the Emma apologist's will justify all her actions, and fall all over themselves to excuse her behavior, but I have to say that her actions in the finale and the way she denied Henry the chance to reunite with his family for most of season 3 seems to be a shift by the writers to change Emma. I think they needed to drag her down a bit to her boyfriend's level. I am curious if Marian tries to go after Regina or anyone else, if Emma would hold herself accountable. Anything Marian does going forward will fall on Emma's shoulders. Do you think we will get anymore flashbacks to the EF in Season 4, prior to the time jump? If so do you think it will be the missing year or the earlier stories?

Edited July 19, 2014 by Rockybeach

[Aliasscape]

I hope your right. I hated that Emma was fine with changing the timeline as long as it didn't impact her. Heck she could have killed Rumple and saved everyone but she choose not too. Must be nice to play god the way she does.

I don't think Marian will ever be ok with Regina, because the Regina she knows existed 30 years ago. I doubt she will care about who Regina has become.

The Regina Marian knew existed a year ago as well. It'd be nice to have somebody feel like it takes more than few months to be trusted not to turn back to mass murder.

[FavFable]

Guess I missed it. What mass murder did Regina commit in the last 25 years?

[Aliasscape]

She had every intention of destroying the whole town in 2x13 and 2x20. She didn't get to do it in 2x20 because she lost the device and so Greg and Tamara beat her to setting it off.

[stealinghome]

Also, don't forget that she tried to kill all the Charmings with Cora (and was a party to Johanna's murder)...and I'm pretty sure if Cora got the dagger, she would've started a reign of terror that made Regina's mass murdering/raping/destroying an entire world in the Enchanted Forest look like child's play.

[FavFable]

She had every intention of destroying the whole town in 2x13 and 2x20. She didn't get to do it in 2x20 because she lost the device and so Greg and Tamara beat her to setting it off.

I didn't ask who she intended to murder. You said it had been a few months since she committed a mass murder. So... What mass murder has she actually committed??

[snarkastic]

Guess I missed it. What mass murder did Regina commit in the last 25 years?

 

 

She had every intention of destroying the whole town in 2x13 and 2x20. She didn't get to do it in 2x20 because she lost the device and so Greg and Tamara beat her to setting it off.

 

Also, don't forget that she tried to kill all the Charmings with Cora (and was a party to Johanna's murder)...and I'm pretty sure if Cora got the dagger, she would've started a reign of terror that made Regina's mass murdering/raping/destroying an entire world in the Enchanted Forest look like child's play.

 

What Aliasscape and stealinghome said, but you are also saying 25 years as if anyone recognized that any of that time passed. In the town's viewpoint Regina was mass murdering before the curse and it was only a couple of months (at most) after everyone regained they're memories that she wanted to destroy the whole town. 

[FavFable]

What Aliasscape and stealinghome said, but you are also saying 25 years as if anyone recognized that any of that time passed. In the town's viewpoint Regina was mass murdering before the curse and it was only a couple of months (at most) after everyone regained they're memories that she wanted to destroy the whole town. 

Are you saying Emma only feels 28?

She said in the last few months. So I asked for examples. Still waiting.

[stealinghome]

I didn't ask who she intended to murder. You said it had been a few months since she committed a mass murder. So... What mass murder has she actually committed??

Actually, if we're getting literal what Aliasscape said was

It'd be nice to have somebody feel like it takes more than few months to be trusted not to turn back to mass murder.

Technically, at this point, Regina will always be a mass murderer--it's something she's done in the past, she's never going to not be a mass murderer. I think Aliasscape's point was that it takes more than a few months for people to believe that someone who has committed a mass murder in the past is no longer inclined toward mass murder. Which I agree with, and don't blame the Storybrooke people for side-eyeing Regina one bit, given that as late as 2x20 Regina was, in fact, inclined toward murdering the entire town. (Frankly, given Regina's body count, it would have taken me years to believe she's not going to murder a bunch of people at the drop of a hat. And especially if, like Snow, I was the chief target of much of Regina's evil.)

Edited July 19, 2014 by stealinghome

[yeswedo]

This discussion is getting a little heated and we've been here before. Please do not attack other posters if they disagree with you. Post your opinion civilly and then move on.

 

Use the report button for any posts you feel cross the line. Thanks!

[Mari]

Actually yeah, it was 'A Land without Magic'. I think everything Regina feared and tried to fight against finally happened. Regina was my least favorite character in season 1, but when her world crashed down around her, and she lost the one person she loved. I actually felt bad for her..... until that final scene...... when she realized magic was coming. That grin just killed me.

 

I get that the Emma apologist's will justify all her actions, and fall all over themselves to excuse her behavior, but I have to say that her actions in the finale and the way she denied Henry the chance to reunite with his family for most of season 3 seems to be a shift by the writers to change Emma. I think they needed to drag her down a bit to her boyfriend's level. I am curious if Marian tries to go after Regina or anyone else, if Emma would hold herself accountable. Anything Marian does going forward will fall on Emma's shoulders. Do you think we will get anymore flashbacks to the EF in Season 4, prior to the time jump? If so do you think it will be the missing year or the earlier stories?

Responding in the Emma thread.

[FavFable]

Actually yeah, it was 'A Land without Magic'. I think everything Regina feared and tried to fight against finally happened. Regina was my least favorite character in season 1, but when her world crashed down around her, and she lost the one person she loved. I actually felt bad for her..... until that final scene...... when she realized magic was coming. That grin just killed me.

 

Regina is such a fantastic villain. Don't know if you are a soap fan, but she reminds me of Abby from Knots Landing. She is always about 4 steps ahead of everyone else. I love it. That final scene in season 1 really flipped things. Regina looked broken, desperate and miserable. Then in the span of about 60 seconds, the world flips and she finds a way to gain control again. Excellent moment.

[Rockybeach]

Sorry, not a Soap fan  :(

 

What are your thoughts on Season 2? Cora returning was such an interesting twist. I thought Regina made progress recognizing that she had to change while Emma and Snow were away. I hated the backslide when Cora returned, but I could understand why Regina wanted to trust and believe in her mother.

[Camera One]

I hated the backslide as well. If they had to have Regina backslide, then they needed to give a convincing reason why. Feeling left out because Snow and the Dwarves went to the Diner to celebrate and left her all alone doesn't cut it as motivation, and neither does Snow and Charming thinking that she killed Archie.

And even if they had to make her backslide for that all that (because she loved Cora so much, which I also didn't buy), then they needed to give Regina a bit of agency and start to doubt Cora on her own. I hated Cora because even Regina became a cardboard minion when Cora came onto the Storybrooke scene. Using Regina instead of Cora in "Tiny" made no sense.

I never bought that Cora was such an enjoyable and well-done villain because she was so unapologetic or whatever. She was a despicable witch and I felt deprived of any satisfaction in her death because they had to imply that Snow White did a bad thing by killing her. As someone else once suggested, if they did want to redeem Regina, then she should have clued in at some point, and realized herself that her mother was psycho and she was watching what she herself was like at her ugliest moments, and then Regina should have made the sacrifice to kill Cora in the season finale to stop Storybrooke's destruction. Then, they could have avoided the dumb failsafe thing entirely.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Camera One

[Dani-Ellie]

Honest to your-choice-of-deity, I fully expected the Cora/Regina/Charmings thing to end with Regina having to choose between Cora and Henry. (And choosing Henry, obvs.) It would have been a really nice, logical way for the plotline to play out while furthering Regina's redemption arc in a natural way. And yet, we ended up with what we ended up with.

[Rockybeach]

I hated the backslide as well. If they had to have Regina backslide, then they needed to give a convincing reason why. Feeling left out because Snow and the Dwarves went to the Diner to celebrate and left her all alone doesn't cut it as motivation, and neither does Snow and Charming thinking that she killed Archie.

And even if they had to make her backslide for that all that (because she loved Cora so much, which I also didn't buy), then they needed to give Regina a bit of agency and start to doubt Cora on her own. I hated Cora because even Regina became a cardboard minion when Cora came onto the Storybrooke scene. Using Regina instead of Cora in "Tiny" made no sense.

I never bought that Cora was such an enjoyable and well-done villain because she was so unapologetic or whatever. She was a despicable witch and I felt deprived of any satisfaction in her death because they had to imply that Snow White did a bad thing by killing her. As someone else once suggested, if they did want to redeem Regina, then she should have clued in at some point, and realized herself that her mother was psycho and she was watching what she herself was like at her ugliest moments, and then Regina should have made the sacrifice to kill Cora in the season finale to stop Storybrooke's destruction. Then, they could have avoided the dumb failsafe thing entirely.

I actually did buy the backslide. I don't think Regina cared if Snow or Charming believed her. What put her over the edge was Emma blaming her and threatening to keep Henry away from her. She was losing the one person she loved. Then her mother shows up saying all the right things. Apologizing, promising to be a better mother. Regina wanted to believe her.

I agree with you about how it played out. It was stupid. Regina had to know if she hurt any of the Charming's or Neal she would lose him forever.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Rockybeach

[stealinghome]

What put her over the edge was Emma blaming her and threatening to keep Henry away from her. She was losing the one person she loved. Then her mother shows up saying all the right things. Apologizing, promising to be a better mother. Regina wanted to believe her.

Where the show lost me with Cora/Regina, though, was that Cora flat-out admitted to Regina that she was the one who framed Regina! She admitted to Regina that she had orchestrated the entire thing specifically to take Henry away from Regina. It made literally no sense to me that after that, and especially given that Cora was the person who had murdered Daniel and that Regina hated her so much she sent Cora through the mirror and sent Hook to kill her, that Regina would team up with Cora after like five seconds. They either needed to play Cora's seduction of Regina out over several episodes, or not have Regina know that Cora orchestrated the whole framing-Regina plot.

 

Like, I actually do feel that making Regina team up with Cora, at least in the way they did, did a real, serious disservice to the Regina character. To me, it was completely out of character that Regina wouldn't immediately go for the throat of the person who separated her from Henry (ie Cora)--and honestly, teaming up so quickly with Cora also, for me, undercut Regina's great love for Daniel and ergo her grudge against Snow.

[KingOfHearts]

What I didn't understand is that after having scenes where Regina even questioned Cora (Stable Boy flashbacks) and Snow placed seeds of doubt in her mind, Regina still relentlessly allied with her mother. The writers hinted Regina was going to betrayed her mother in a very logical way, but then they gave Snow the kill for their big Dark Snow twist. Then for the rest of the season, Regina just intends on killing everyone in order to get to Henry. It's like all her redeeming in 2A was reverted for the failsafe plot. If they kept her redemption stuff from 2A, I don't think she'd be trying to kill everyone. It makes her look absolutely insane to think Henry could love her after that.

 

It's all bark and no bite with these writers when it comes to Regina's redemption.

Edited July 20, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[stealinghome]

What I didn't understand is that after having scenes where Regina even questioned Cora (Stable Boy flashbacks) and Snow placed seeds of doubt in her mind, Regina still relentlessly allied with her mother. The writers hinted Regina was going to betrayed her mother in a very logical way, but then they gave Snow the kill for their big Dark Snow twist. Then for the rest of the season, Regina just intends on killing everyone in order to get to Henry. It's like all her redeeming in 2A was reverted for the failsafe plot. If they kept her redemption stuff from 2A, I don't think she'd be trying to kill everyone. It makes her look absolutely insane to think Henry could love her after that.

I really have wondered whether the initial plan for 2B was for Regina to have to kill Cora to protect Henry, and then they junked that completely for the failsafe plot. Because I agree--even up through 'The Queen is Dead,' it definitely seemed like we were heading for Regina having to turn on Cora when she realized that Cora didn't give a damn about her or Henry. That would have been a much better story, and much better for/truer to the Regina character (and not to mention that it made Regina look even worse that they kept those build-up breadcrumbs in and then had her not act on them).

[Mari]

What I didn't understand is that after having scenes where Regina even questioned Cora (Stable Boy flashbacks) and Snow placed seeds of doubt in her mind, Regina still relentlessly allied with her mother. The writers hinted Regina was going to betrayed her mother in a very logical way, but then they gave Snow the kill for their big Dark Snow twist.

 

It's all bark and no bite with these writers when it comes to Regina's redemption.

The whole thing was bizarre. 

 

I've never understood why Regina blamed Snow pretty much exclusively for Cora's murder of Daniel.  Cora was a woman who managed to manipulate, manage, or control Rumple, Henry Sr., Henry Sr's father, Leopold, Anastasia, and apparently a huge chunk of Wonderland.  On top of that, she obviously manipulated, controlled, and abused Regina herself.  Why on earth would Regina think that the tweener version of Snow would be a match for that?

 

Even when Snow organized Regina's killing of Cora, the anger seemed to be focused on an odd place, for me.  Instead of being focused on how Snow used Regina as a weapon--which I think Regina would have a legitimate reason to be angry for--the anger seemed to be focused on how Snow killed Cora.

 

Snow killing Cora shouldn't have been treated as a tragedy.  Cora's death saved a lot of people.  The only morally iffy thing would be how Cora was killed--why didn't Regina (or the writers?) focus on that?

 

Very little of the Regina/Cora relationship in season 2 made sense to me.

[Shanna Marie]

Where the show lost me with Cora/Regina, though, was that Cora flat-out admitted to Regina that she was the one who framed Regina! She admitted to Regina that she had orchestrated the entire thing specifically to take Henry away from Regina. It made literally no sense to me that after that, and especially given that Cora was the person who had murdered Daniel and that Regina hated her so much she sent Cora through the mirror and sent Hook to kill her, that Regina would team up with Cora after like five seconds.

Yeah, they'd just done the episode in which Regina realized she had turned into her mother, and she hated that. That was when she let Henry go and seemed to be trying to change. Then Cora shows up, admits to having framed Regina, and Regina joins forces with her right away. It would have made a lot more sense for Regina to have a huge epiphany there, seeing how Cora manipulated her and realizing what she must have done to Snow, and finally getting who was really responsible for Daniel. Then she could have really sealed the deal in siding with the good guys by helping them defeat Cora. But I guess they weren't ready to let her really be redeemed for good because if she saw the error of her ways, they couldn't have her backslide yet again. As it is, Regina just looks stupid and easily led, and it makes all of her gripes against Snow and her family look even more shallow while she looks like even more of a hypocrite.

[FavFable]

Sorry, not a Soap fan  :(

 

What are your thoughts on Season 2? Cora returning was such an interesting twist. I thought Regina made progress recognizing that she had to change while Emma and Snow were away. I hated the backslide when Cora returned, but I could understand why Regina wanted to trust and believe in her mother.

I didn't mind the backslide. I think before the backslide Regina wanted to change for Henry. I think after she wanted to change because she knew she could be a better person.

I think Cora was offering Regina everything she wanted. Her son, her mother, a family. I have to say it also had one of my favorite lines. When Regina figures out Cora was the one that framed her, her first response was to tell "Henry, Emma and the two idiots."

Edited July 20, 2014 by FavFable

[KingOfHearts]

I understand a little bit why Regina teamed up with Cora at first, but it was so sudden and inorganic that it just kind of felt weird. Regina desperately wanted her mother's approval, and her mother promised her Henry and everything she wanted, so I can see why she went back into daughter-mode. Cora chose the perfect time to go after Regina according to her plan - right when Regina was hurt and broken the most. In Regina's vulnerability, she went for the only hand reaching out for her. But after all the Cora-betrayal-suspicion moments, it really doesn't make sense. Perhaps she was afraid of what her mother would do if she turned on her, I don't know.

Edited July 20, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Rockybeach]

 

I didn't mind the backslide. I think before the backslide Regina wanted to change for Henry. I think after she wanted to change because she knew she could be a better person.

I think Cora was offering Regina everything she wanted. Her son, her mother, a family. I have to say it also had one of my favorite lines. When Regina figures out Cora was the one that framed her, her first response was to tell "Henry, Emma and the two idiots."

 

 

Do you think Cora was sincere when she told Regina she would have been enough? I can't decide. I think Cora did love Regina. I was convinced she was sincere in season 2, but after Bleeding Through, I am not as sure.

 

I love the hypocrisy of Rumple telling Regina to let it go and not seek revenge on Snow for killing Cora, but then the second he has the chance he murders Zelena.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Rockybeach

[Mari]

Do you think Cora was sincere when she told Regina she would have been enough? I can't decide. I think Cora did love Regina. I was convinced she was sincere in season 2, but after Bleeding Through, I am not as sure.

Personally, I don't.  I thought it was possible that she was sincere, until the Bleeding Through episode--but, a woman who is cold-hearted enough to leave her baby on the side of the road, most likely to die?  No.  Regina wouldn't've been enough, and that's not an insult to Regina.  No one would've been enough.

 

I think it was one final attempt to manipulate Regina into getting revenge on her behalf. 

[KingOfHearts]

 

I think it was one final attempt to manipulate Regina into getting revenge on her behalf.

 

But did Cora know that Regina wasn't the killer?

[Mari]

But did Cora know that Regina wasn't the killer?

Good point--it could also have been one final attempt to make Regina feel guilty.  One last punishment.

[KingOfHearts]

 

Good point--it could also have been one final attempt to make Regina feel guilty.  One last punishment.

That maybe why she didn't give a flip about Regina in Bleeding Through. She thought Regina killed her, perhaps. It seems Cora actually did have a little respect for Snow (she complimented her at Eva's funeral, and tried to teach Snow life lessons), so maybe that's why she was willing to give the information to Snow and not Regina. It's just a theory.

 

Regina: "You officially have a better relationship with my mother than I do - and you killed her."

Edited July 20, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Shanna Marie]

When I think about it, Regina is rather consistent about Cora and Snow. She watched Cora kill Daniel and embarked on a lifelong vendetta against Snow. Cora confessed to framing her for murder, and she blamed Snow and her family for believing Cora's faked evidence.

[Camera One]

Yes, and Emma brought back Marion, and she brought up Snow again too.  So Regina's slogan is Blame Snow!  

[Mari]

Yes, and Emma brought back Marion, and she brought up Snow again too.  So Regina's slogan is Blame Snow!  

Which brings me back to "Why?" 

 

What possible reason does she have to be so creepily obsessed with Snow?

[KingOfHearts]

 

What possible reason does she have to be so creepily obsessed with Snow?

 

Replying in Relationships thread.

[FavFable]

Do you think Cora was sincere when she told Regina she would have been enough? I can't decide. I think Cora did love Regina. I was convinced she was sincere in season 2, but after Bleeding Through, I am not as sure.

 

I love the hypocrisy of Rumple telling Regina to let it go and not seek revenge on Snow for killing Cora, but then the second he has the chance he murders Zelena.

Cora with a heart might have been able to love her daughter, not sure. She removed it before Regina was ever born, so I don't know if she ever really cared about her. I think that is something that stands out between Cora and Regina. Cora took the cowards way out. She removed her heart because power was more important to her. Regina kept her heart. When it finally got too much and she did remove it, it was more of a survival move that a chance to grab power.

 

That is something that really impressed me about season 3 Regina. How deeply she loved even without her heart. She broke the curse without it.. That is pretty amazing.

Edited July 21, 2014 by FavFable

[Rockybeach]

Yeah that was great!! I was hoping she would be the one to break the curse. I love that it proved that not only did she love Henry, he loved her.

 

How many times had Regina saved one of the Charming's in the last 2 seasons? I am thinking it's 5 times? Plus she saved their kid. I hope next season the writers move away from everyone having to step up and save the Charming's, make them more of the heroes and less of the victims. It's getting old.

 

I liked the scene that Belle and Regina shared in season 3, when Regina apologized to Belle. It would be fun to see them share more scenes next year. Although once Regina finds out Rumple killed her sister, she may just avoid Belle and Rumple altogether.

[Camera One]

I hope next season the writers move away from everyone having to step up and save the Charming's

 

I do agree that the Charmings should get to be the bigger heroes more.  But how many times have the Charmings saved Regina?  There was the Wraith, there was saving her from the mob in the Season 2 opener, there was preventing her from dying with the fail-safe she created, there was saving her from Owen's torture machine, there was Snow in her flashbacks saving her from execution in one episode and from her own guards in "The Evil Queen", and there were the Charmings trying to help Regina when she was briefly in danger from Tinkerbelle, and when Zelena did the stand-off on Main Street.  

[Rockybeach]

"there was preventing her from dying with the fail-safe she created"

Regina saved herself, the Charming's didn't save her.

"there were the Charmings trying to help Regina when she was briefly in danger from Tinkerbelle"

They didn't save her from Tinkerbell. Regina faced Tinkerbell on her own.

"when Zelena did the stand-off on Main Street.

So standing around counts as saving? No. Regina faced Zelena and survived. None of the Charmings had anything to do with her survival.

 

If your talking about Emma and her Ego declaring "The Savior" would fight Zelena. That was Emma trying to save the town. Regina wasn't even there yet.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Rockybeach

[Mari]

Although once Regina finds out Rumple killed her sister, she may just avoid Belle and Rumple altogether.

How do you think Regina will feel about Zelena's death?  What do you think she expected her relationship with Zelena to be like?

[stealinghome]

"there was preventing her from dying with the fail-safe she created"

Regina saved herself, the Charming's didn't save her.

No, Emma saved Regina. Regina would not have been able to stop the fail safe, and would have died, without Emma's aid.

In the episode, Regina clearly states that she alone cannot shut down the fail safe. That's why she believed going down to the mines was a suicide mission.

Also, don't forget that the Charmings didn't just save Regina from the wraith in 2x01, but they also stopped the mob from ripping her to shreds in the same episode.

Edited July 22, 2014 by stealinghome

[Camera One]

They didn't save her from Tinkerbell. Regina faced Tinkerbell on her own.

"when Zelena did the stand-off on Main Street.
So standing around counts as saving? No. Regina faced Zelena and survived. None of the Charmings had anything to do with her survival.

 

Yes, that is correct.  That is why I said "trying to help" and not save.  

[Serena]

Emma saved Regina from the fire in 108. She also saved Regina from the thunderstorm in 301 in Neverland - she would have died if Emma hadn't realized what was causing it and stopped it.

In comparison, most of the times Regina "saves" the Charmings are when she's trying to kill them herself and changes her mind at the last minute (like at the end of 3A) or when she's also saving her own ass (Zelena, the failsafe - which, it's true, she only managed to do with Emma's help). Also if Charming hadn't sacrificed his heart to cast the curse and get everyone to Storybrooke, Regina wouldn't have been able to defeat Zelena at all.

[KingOfHearts]

I honestly don't know how the Woegina mold can really stop. The most logical way out of it is to get a character who will call Regina out, but even then, would anyone actually listen to them? I doubt A&E would come remotely close to the wide vicinity of introducing a person like that, anyway. If alternatively they killed off Regina, it would just make it worse because of her cheerleaders looking to her as a martyr.

 

If logic was truly at play, redeeming Regina would be a snap at this point. Marian and Robin would show Regina the crap she's done, Regina would realize it's her own fault, and she'd start coming to terms with herself. If Marian won't shake her, I don't know what will. The fact Regina almost killed her own son because she tried to hurt someone else should have shaken her, but it didn't.

 

It's really not that hard to wake Regina up, but A&E refuse to do it.

Edited July 22, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Camera One]

It all comes down to A&E.  The way they used Regina in 3A would be the ideal (well, until "Save Henry", but at least that was an 8 episode stretch).  So we know they can do it.  Of course, they came back and did a 3B which was as Regina and villain heavy as it could ever be, so I don't have much hope at this point.

[stealinghome]

The thing is, I could put up with Woegina if the show itself would call her out on it. I mean, if you think about it, Regina's ALWAYS been an uber self-pitying, delusional, OTT drama queen who is convinced that her pain is 500% worse than anyone else's. Like, the fact that she's like that is actually rather in line with her S1 characterization. What's changed is simply that the show doesn't provide a dose of reality to offset her self-pity; it's no longer objective about her/her pain and it doesn't let the other characters roll their eyes and tell her about how they've had it hard, too. So I don't think it's Woegina in and of herself that's the problem--it's that she's the writers' pet to such an extent that the writers' permaboner for the character can now be seen from Jupiter.

Edited July 22, 2014 by stealinghome