Other Pro Gridiron Football (USFL, AAF, XFL, CFL..)

[Athena]

If the NFL isn't enough, there are other options. Discuss them here.

[merylinkid]

For a first week of games, the AAF wasn't bad.    Will tune in this week to see how it goes.   

Christian Hackenberg shows why he never made it in the NFL.   As did others.   THAT line needs to go away "just trying to get a(nother) chance in the NFL" is old already.

[Raja]

The hit, helmet to helmet against the quarterback no less as his helmet goes flying and I was expecting the Sky Judge  to overturn the no call. But I guess now that the new league has its promo picture that such hits will be outlawed as it is in all modern football organizations.

[xaxat]

8 hours ago, merylinkid said:

Christian Hackenberg shows why he never made it in the NFL.   As did others.   THAT line needs to go away "just trying to get a(nother) chance in the NFL" is old already.

Especially funny since the  hosts for the game intro were trying to convince viewers that Hackenberg had corrected some "flaw" in his delivery and was a totally new QB. 

I don't think either league has explicitly stated it, but the AAF must have some kind of relationship with the NFL. (They wouldn't be on NFL Network otherwise.) That, and year head start, would seem to give them a big league over the XFL.

[Raja]

The AAC doesn't have to be on the level of the old XFL or the USFL  just better than say Alabama versus New Mexico State game that is sitting on someone's NCAA package, is expected to be. While  the NBA development league is available concurrent with the NBA season for junkies the AAF has an open season all to itself. Presumably without a Donald Trump around to force a head to head broadcast with the NFL and the better NCAA match ups .

[ae2]

On 2/11/2019 at 9:47 PM, Raja said:

The hit, helmet to helmet against the quarterback no less as his helmet goes flying and I was expecting the Sky Judge  to overturn the no call. But I guess now that the new league has its promo picture that such hits will be outlawed as it is in all modern football organizations.

I don't think it was helmet to helmet. I haven't seen any super slow mo shots from the right camera angle, but from seeing it live and watching replays it sure looks like he hit the QB right in the chest, below the helmet. Keep in mind that Bercovici's helmet fell off again just a few plays later without taking a brutal hit, and there were a few other helmet losses during the game. It seems like there were some fitting or helmet strap issues that are hopefully fixed before this week.

All that said, the hit would no doubt have been a penalty in the NFL. We'll see whether the AAF tightens its rules or lets the players get away with some harder hits than the NFL does.

[merylinkid]

Watched the games yesterday.   If they don't start scoring it's going to die a slow, boring death.   Seriously, no one tunes in to watch 12-6 games, where the defense isn't even that amazing.   Hopefully when they have more time to practice they can get better with the play calling.

The announcers are very 6th string too.    Even on the NFL network.   Like these guys have anything else to do in the offseason?    At least TNT hasn't needed football analysts for awhile so they can be excused not being good at calling games.   The rest, ugh.   

[Ohwell]

I only watched one game so far, Birmingham vs. Utah and, while there wasn't much scoring, I did appreciate the fact that it didn't look so brutal.  One guy got hurt but I didn't see what happened to him.  The guys were out there to play but they didn't want to kill each other.  So there's that, I guess.  

I'll do a drive by every now and then and watch some other games.

[xaxat]

I've watched part of two games and the only lasting impression I have is of the officials' uniforms. And not in a good way.

[Ohwell]

Actually, the more I think about it, I kinda like the "amateurishness" of it all.  They aren't making enough money to be divas or assholes *coughAntonioBrowncough*.  Sure, some of them aspire to be in the NFL and some are rejects, but they're doing something they love to do.  I also like the fact that the announcers aren't that professional sounding, and there's no Romo to annoy the hell out of me.

[xaxat]

This can't be good. 

Hurricanes owner gives AAF $250 million after league was 'running short on cash'

[merylinkid]

There was a follow up story, it wasn't because they needed cash (so they said).   They had it planned with multiple rounds of investments, Hurricanes Guy just moved up the date of his planned investment because he saw how well the numbers came out for week 1.  

That said, game attendance is SPARSE.   Makes Chargers games look well attended.

[xaxat]

Darren Rovell reported that they missed their first payroll. 

[Sounder]

I think I would like it better if the league focused more on its undiscovered talents that the NFL overlooks (seeing that there are only so many jobs)..... because there plenty of guys from the more than 220 sum collegiate programs if you count them all up.  The NRL will always have the elite of the crop..... but the guys that the AAF gets have talent too..... problem is.....they are nameless to you..... some of them are already standing out but you don't know who they are..... after some of these make an NFL impact in the fall..... you'll know who they are and what this league is about.  But do you want that?..... or are you folding your arms and saying "I'm not impressed"  because it isn't top tier.  It isn't being marketed to females and non fans alike like the NFL does.   Its for real football fans.   I do think one thing that would help is to put more eyeballs on it..... because the fans that'll watch this don't have premium access to everything.  I understand CBS has other commitments with NCAA hoops and masters golf so why can't they at least sublet games to a free digital channel like Stadium?.   

[Sounder]

The good thing about this is that its relatively short..... it comes after the super bowl to soothe your withdrawals..... its there to fill that February gap of no NFL ..... No baseball yet..... all star break jokes by NBA and NHL....not into NASCAR....and it'll be done before you know it...... even before the NFL draft.  It needs to stay around...... and why?    Because we don't want Vince McMahon to do it.  He's gonna try though..... I'm already folding my arms......

[Sounder]

Vince is a showman for sure..... I just don't think he can do a serious league that doesn't have a sports entertainment feel to it..... like the 2001 edition. There will be a team here..... when it was announced.... it was met by a general sense of yawwwwwn......... zzzzzzzzz........ maybe if tickets are cheap or free..... and they come pick me up...... 

[Sounder]

I really don't know what the ultimate goal of these new leagues are..... the NFL is so powerful it can't be challenged.  The only way the NFL ever goes away is if it kills itself..... and really the only way they do that is by breaking the fans trust which lately I've wondered about.  Its six months between super bowl and preseason.  There's plenty of activities to occupy a fans time.....its not the same as games being played.   And it seems no matter how many times it hasn't succeeded..... there's that insatiable need for filling that "void".   Question is...... Is there even a void to fill?    

I really don't know what the ultimate goal of these new leagues are..... the NFL is so powerful it can't be challenged.  The only way the NFL ever goes away is if it kills itself..... and really the only way they do that is by breaking the fans trust which lately I've wondered about.  Its six months between super bowl and preseason.  There's plenty of activities to occupy a fans time.....its not the same as games being played.   And it seems no matter how many times it hasn't succeeded..... there's that insatiable need for filling that "void".   Question is...... Is there even a void to fill?    

[Sounder]

I don't know why that posted twice..... anyway...... Jim Zorn is named gm and head coach for xfl seattle.   That announcement came from xfl commissioner Oliver Luck.... famous for being Andrew's father.   Are you excited?

[Sounder]

In the meantime..... through three weeks.... the AAF numbers look about as expected.  San Antonio and Orlando are showing good turnouts..... Birmingham....now on its fifth team..... is solid.  Salt Lake, Arizona, Atlanta, and Memphis had i guess you would call sparse turnouts of around ten thousand.  Im sure when we see the first sub ten thousand turnout..... the media hounds will jump on it.   I dont think you can judge its total tv performance until people find it.   Meanwhile..... CBS needs better promotion..... use the ncaa touney to push the CBSN telecasts. 

[merylinkid]

The numbers aren't bad for a league's first season.    But yeah, if they want a second season people have to find it.   Also the games can't be either 9-6 or blowouts.   One team can't dominate either.    The Old American Football (not the AFL) Browns so dominated everyone that no one game out to see the games.   Why bother, you knew who was going to win.    The new AAF is at risk with Orlando doing this. 

As for what is the purpose, fill in the time between the super bowl and the draft with actual games rather than just news stories and the combine.   be a developmental league for the NFL.   Guys who can't get live reps in the NFL can stand out and maybe an NFL team will sign them.   Trent Richardson is showing he should be in the NFL.   On the other hand, Christian Hackenberg is showing why he should never have been.   It's also to give guys who just love playing a chance to continue playing.    

[ae2]

It will be interesting to see what the AAF does in the offseason. (Assuming all their numbers and financials work out and they have a second season, of course.)

Since each player is on the same contract, and all the teams are owned by the Alliance, what will trades look like if they exist? Will the Alliance induce trades in order to build and maintain parity?

Will there be any sort of free agency?

[Raja]

50 minutes ago, ae2 said:

It will be interesting to see what the AAF does in the offseason. (Assuming all their numbers and financials work out and they have a second season, of course.)

Since each player is on the same contract, and all the teams are owned by the Alliance, what will trades look like if they exist? Will the Alliance induce trades in order to build and maintain parity?

Will there be any sort of free agency?

I doubt it, "free agency" would be making a NFL squad and moving up to the big leagues.

[Sounder]

5 hours ago, ae2 said:

It will be interesting to see what the AAF does in the offseason. (Assuming all their numbers and financials work out and they have a second season, of course.)

Since each player is on the same contract, and all the teams are owned by the Alliance, what will trades look like if they exist? Will the Alliance induce trades in order to build and maintain parity?

Will there be any sort of free agency?

I doubt there's free agency..... guys just sign alliance contracts and if appropriate...... they get assigned to a team based on their collegiate territory.   I guess guys that don't fall into the territorial system just get assigned where needed.  Guys that sign alliance contracts get three years for $250000.  That's roughly 80 to 85 thou a year.  Not bad for regular people.   If they make an NFL squad.... they are released from their AAF obligation.... but if they don't..... theyyyyyy muuuuuust returrrrrrrrrrrn.

[Sounder]

One way or another..... post NFL football bridging late winter and early spring is staying...... there are more potential startups still in the works..... the Freedom Football League is a concept of several former nfl'rs who may think they have the cash and connections to pull it off...... arena football is still determined to stick around but it's been on life support undet the same "afl" moniker that represents years of instability and potential fans couldn't embrace it because  its always leaving town.   They even sold their souls to the rock band KISS.  At one time..... especially during the NBC years.... I thought it had its best chance to break out and be big league.  I thougjht a couple rule changes to help defense a little more wouldve solved the ping and pong nature of the sport..... back and forth touchdowns till time expires doesn't get it done for me.  

[Sounder]

I don't know what happens in a year if AAF sees anorher season....there will actually be "competition" between two sub leagues for supremacy in spring football's epic showdown.  Will one of then fall?  Or could it merge into a super spring sub major football league?  I think a perfect AAF has twelve teams that make for full coverage of the territorial map.  Because that IS really the main selling point to have fans care about their local teams and should be even more utilized than it is currently. 

[Sounder]

It's also important for cbs to allow the AAF to sell games to its local markets for away briadcasts on local tv even if its not covered nationally.  The more the better.   And dont call it "developmental"..... I hate the term..... makes it sound like something is wrong with the players that they have to overcome.  Like a disability..... like....." will you donate 69 cents a day to help guys like us?".  Call it a "Sub-major league"..... I like it better already.

[Raja]

Well the NBA and WWE got the "developmental" terminology over. Even if they both have rebranded. I still think in terms of the minor leagues myself.

[ae2]

1 hour ago, icemiser69 said:

If leagues keep failing, eventually there won't be any startup leagues.  There reaches a point where people with massive dollars will stop trying to pound a square peg into a round hole.

The goal should be to put teams in locations where there is a great deal of interest in professional football, not necessarily large population centers. 

I have no clue how the San Diego team is doing in terms of attendance, but if they couldn't find a way to keep an NFL team, it seems unlikely that there would be enough interest in a start up team.  As a former San Diego Charger fan, I understand that there were a lot of complications that led to the Chargers leaving.  I think most of that blame goes on Spanos, but I also believe that there were other major factors in play.

The revenue requirements for supporting an AAF team will be significantly lower than an NFL team. Just looking at players, the NFL salary cap is $190 million right now. AAF players get a 3 year contract at $250k, so a 53 man roster is under $5 million a year. With lower attendance they can also potentially play in smaller, cheaper venues.

It also helps that all teams are owned by the Alliance. So each individual team doesn't need a certain audience size on its own, they can be supported by the success of other teams, for awhile at least.

The in-stadium audience doesn't matter nearly as much as the TV viewership numbers. In my opinion they're hurting themselves by only broadcasting on closed networks right now (NFL Network and CBS Sports). I'd like to see the games at least on major cable networks.

That said, you still may be right that some of these towns won't pull enough interest to keep their teams. Here are some unofficial attendance numbers. San Diego is doing okay all things considered.

I thought initially that the AAF wanted to be successful enough at developing players that the NFL buys them in 5-10 years. However, with Dundon's $250 million investment I'm not so certain that's the goal, since it would take a multi-billion dollar buy out for him to turn a reasonable profit as an investor.

[Moose135]

1 hour ago, icemiser69 said:

Perhaps I am not watching the correct cable channels, but I haven't seen any advertisements advertising this new league. 

Until the posts here during the first weekend of play, I didn't even know this was a thing - I hadn't heard or read anything about it anywhere.  I still haven't seen a game, and rarely see anything about it other than in this thread.

[xaxat]

The CFL has banned Johnny Manziel from the league. Neither the league nor his former team has offered an explanation. 

[Sounder]

Wow..... some awesome insights.   Hey...... there are GAMES this weekend!!!..... Obviously.... the showcase will be the Commanders vs Apollos.   CBSN will broadcast it...... and I won't see it and that bums me out.   I would see it if they would allow me.....but oh..... I guess the onus is on ME to get access to CBSN .....but I won't.   And that's the point.   There were advertisements for the league even during NFL games on CBS.  I found out about it quite by accident actually just browsing the web.  Once again.....the onus is on THEM to get the games to us.  Cuz anyone not an absolute diehard fan wouldn't make that effort.   

[Sounder]

7 hours ago, ae2 said:

The revenue requirements for supporting an AAF team will be significantly lower than an NFL team. Just looking at players, the NFL salary cap is $190 million right now. AAF players get a 3 year contract at $250k, so a 53 man roster is under $5 million a year. With lower attendance they can also potentially play in smaller, cheaper venues.

It also helps that all teams are owned by the Alliance. So each individual team doesn't need a certain audience size on its own, they can be supported by the success of other teams, for awhile at least.

The in-stadium audience doesn't matter nearly as much as the TV viewership numbers. In my opinion they're hurting themselves by only broadcasting on closed networks right now (NFL Network and CBS Sports). I'd like to see the games at least on major cable networks.

That said, you still may be right that some of these towns won't pull enough interest to keep their teams. Here are some unofficial attendance numbers. San Diego is doing okay all things considered.

I thought initially that the AAF wanted to be successful enough at developing players that the NFL buys them in 5-10 years. However, with Dundon's $250 million investment I'm not so certain that's the goal, since it would take a multi-billion dollar buy out for him to turn a reasonable profit as an investor.

I agree tv performance matters...... but in game attendance is really a hand in hand thing in that oceans of empty seats juuuust don't look quite so good on tv and doesn't do much to convince people you got something.....i don't know for sure.... but I thought Salt Lake could play in the soccer venue which would be far more appropriate..... but I guess Real Salt Lake  must have some say and don't want football teams tearing up their pitch...... so off to the university stadium..... which is too big.  And other cities that have built "soccer specific" fields to host MLS might say the same thing.   

[Sounder]

Isn't it just appropriate that Christian "Hack"enburg is playing sub league ball and not prospering?  This is the kind of thing I didn't want the AAF to do.  I want the league to find qb talents perhaps from non high profile colleges that otherwise don't get seen.   We've seen what he's not done in the NFL.   We've seen what  Johnny Manziel has not done.  I think the AAF should run..... but car crashes sell tickets.  And they need to do more of THAT.   Hell never play in the NFL again.  THATS clear.   How bout if they ease him back in by doing a sobby back story worthy of american ninja warrior to get people to feel sorry for him again .   Hey Johnny WELCOME!!!!..... want a beer?

[Sounder]

But we can flip the coin for Trent Richardson.   The Iron running back..... a former Alabama player and top five nfl pick has performed well.  Is there an nfl team outside of Buffalo where he can really contribute?   Most teams use multiple back schemes nowadays.... most teams already have multiple backs..... one notable one is the Dallas Cowboys where Ezekial Elliott pretty much carries the mail to such an extent that i can't remember who the second guy is.   And running backs age like dogs so getting someone somewhat still a proven commodity could be a plus for an "america s team" that hasnt been to a bowl in 24 seasons and counting i believe.

[ae2]

https://dailycaller.com/2019/02/28/johnny-manziel-missed-meetings-cfl-ban-report/

Quote

According 3DownNation.com, Manziel was booted out of the league and cut from the Montreal Alouettes after he missed mandatory meetings required by the league. When he joined the CFL in the summer of 2018, the Texas A&M Heisman winner was required to attended mandatory doctor appointments and therapy, according to USA Today. (RELATED: Johnny Manziel Reacts To Getting Kicked Out Of The CFL, Says He ‘Reestablished’ His Love For Football)

Manziel missing the meetings and getting tossed from the league was described as “an out clause if he wanted it” by 3DownNation.com.

Missing meetings in an attempt to get out of his contract will mean nothing in the long run. People were worried about substance abuse issues, and that doesn’t sound like it’s the case at all.

[Sounder]

I had earlier mentioned that the city of Birmingham is on it's fifth professional football teams with the AAF Iron..... correct that.   Here is the list that i compiled:  WFL Americans, USFL Stallions,  WLAF Fire,  CFL Barracudas,  XFL Thunderbolts...... and the Iron...... SIX total.   And they've all played at Legion Field..... making it a shrine of sub league teams.    Only non NFL outdoor leagues count in this survey..... no arena teams...... if i added those,  I could tack on a few more.

[Sounder]

But Memphis is right on the cusp of evening the score:  WFL Southmen,  USFL Showboats,  CFL Mad Dogs,  XFL Maniax,   and the AAF Express......Five.   There could be more.    The Tennessee Oilers passed throigh on their way to Nashville.   If the proposed Memphis Kings of the NFL wouldve materialized in the early seventies.....NONE of these woulda happened.   

[Sounder]

So Birmingham vs Memphis is probably the most contested sub league rivalry in the history of professional football.   Like Bears/Packers only with multiple leagues and teams.     Who's got the upper hand? ...... results to come.......

[merylinkid]

CFL - as in Canadian football League?   In the SOUTH???????

[Sounder]

The survey yielded eleven results and it's Memphis 6 Birmingham 5.  There will be an AAF meeting between the Iron and Express later this season...... the Iron beat "Hack"enburg and the Express 26-0 in the first meeting.  So its more than just another game...... ultimate bragging rights are at stake.

[Sounder]

2 hours ago, merylinkid said:

CFL - as in Canadian football League?   In the SOUTH???????

And yes.....the CFL conducted a two year experiment with US markets.... after Baltimore won the 1995 Grey Cup...... experiment ended.

[Sounder]

Nelson Spruce,  Wide receiver for the San Diego Fleet is one of the players to watch...... he caught two TDs last week....in part thanks to a qb switch to Brian Nelson .... Spruce.... from Colorado, while there tied or broke 43 school records..... but didn't perform well at the NFL combine..... doesn't have the measurables that make scouts drool..... stock dropped..... he didn't get drafted.  He was studly in college..... he's doing it again in the AAF.   Sometimes..... pure talent doesn't show itself at the combine.

[Sounder]

Zach Mettenberger (you remember)..... will be the starter from now on for the Memphis Express..... he made the CBS players to watch list for week four after a good performance against Orlando.

[Sounder]

Week 4 in the AAF:   Saturday.....San Diego at Memphis on B/R Live...... Orlando at Salt Lake on NFL Net..... Sunday......San Antonio at Birmingham on CBSN..... Atlanta at Arizona on NFL Net.    All games available on fuboTv......damn....... I got NONE of these!    

[merylinkid]

I still haven't figured out Bleacher Report live.   I am certainly not streaming a game on my laptop.   I have a 48 inch tv screen for a reason, and it is not so I can watch games on my 14 inch laptop.   Last week I didn't watch the BR game, so forgot to turn on the night game on NFLN.    They really need to make the games more accessible if they want to survive past one year.

[Sounder]

2 hours ago, merylinkid said:

I still haven't figured out Bleacher Report live.   I am certainly not streaming a game on my laptop.   I have a 48 inch tv screen for a reason, and it is not so I can watch games on my 14 inch laptop.   Last week I didn't watch the BR game, so forgot to turn on the night game on NFLN.    They really need to make the games more accessible if they want to survive past one year.

Not only am I cheering that post.... cuz I agree.... it brings a question:   Isn't it possible to connect your laptop to your 48 inch screen?   Myself....I still kick it old school with a 20 inch that doesn't have the connections.  So for now....I gotta use my android.   But since I'm such a geek for this league becuz my belief that pro football needs this level of league.....the AAF will make the NFL a better product with better fundamental players taught by football savvy people that might even finally be able to shrink NFL preseason to two games with that eighteen game regular schedule they're likely gonna do anyway.   With all that..... I'll do more to follow it.   How many more football geeks are out there?   Make a deal with Stadium channel at least because they really need a league to cover other than that Frisbee sport.  Let CBS produce it cuz it needs the NFL style coverage and trappings to give it and its players a first class environment.

[Sounder]

2 minutes ago, Sounder said:

Not only am I cheering that post.... cuz I agree.... it brings a question:   Isn't it possible to connect your laptop to your 48 inch screen?   Myself....I still kick it old school with a 20 inch that doesn't have the connections.  So for now....I gotta use my android.   But since I'm such a geek for this league becuz my belief that pro football needs this level of league.....the AAF will make the NFL a better product with better fundamental players taught by football savvy people that might even finally be able to shrink NFL preseason to two games with that eighteen game regular schedule they're likely gonna do anyway.   With all that..... I'll do more to follow it.   How many more football geeks are out there?   Make a deal with Stadium channel at least because they really need a league to cover other than that Frisbee sport.  Let CBS produce it cuz it needs the NFL style coverage and trappings to give it and its players a first class environment.

And it would also help legitimize these second level markets that will likely remain so..... franchises people will grow to rally behind and be willing to wear its team gear with pride.  If not.....you'll get even MORE teams and more leagues that adds even more sub league history like the great Birmingham/Memphis legacy.   San Antonio and Orlando too for that matter turn up in every league.  Unless the NFL wants to be a 48 team monolith.... and I don't see that......this is the highest level of ball these markets will get.  And it's pretty good stuff.  Help it grow to be even better.

[merylinkid]

They moved the game next week between Birmingham and Orlando to tnt.   They want folks to see what should be a good game between the top teams.

[Sounder]

I have heard much speculation about AAF expansion and where it should go.....

1 Portland....a territory with an appropriate stadium.... a large population center....strong collegiate football in the northwest.....so a lot of potentially strong talent here.......a natural fit...... and it has had second league history with WFL and USFL teams.

2  Columbus:  A 20 000 seat venue is available here and a team that would draw it's talents in big ten territory..... had previous second team in WLAF  (Ohio Glory).

3.   Oakland:   Yes I would go there.....an area with a somewhat solid collegiate football player base...... and how can you call Oakland fans disloyal?  The Davises gave Oakland pro football.... took it away..... brought it back..... and even though for the time being its remaining...... it's leaving again for good.    Showed to be an interested fan base for the USFL Invaders despite the Raiders departure to LA.    Can tear down Mount Davis still and restore the Coliseum.....restore it's views.....reduce to maybe 30,000 seats for baseball and AAF football.....it would work.   I'd tear down Mount Davis even with the Raiders still there...... even during the NFL season.

4.   The league needs a territorial presence in the upper northeast. and I'm thinking maybe Red Bulls Arena or the Carrier Dome in the New York region   There is collegiate talent here.....and the #1 tv market is here.....still gotta consider that.

4.  Raleigh-Durham:  Have you noticed the numbers of players from this region on NFL rosters?   If you include the Virginia area here you could build one solid tremendous football roster even with the second guys.   The area has experienced second football before with the Skyhawks of WLAF.

[Sounder]

2 minutes ago, Sounder said:

I have heard much speculation about AAF expansion and where it should go.....

1 Portland....a territory with an appropriate stadium.... a large population center....strong collegiate football in the northwest.....so a lot of potentially strong talent here.......a natural fit...... and it has had second league history with WFL and USFL teams.

2  Columbus:  A 20 000 seat venue is available here and a team that would draw it's talents in big ten territory..... had previous second team in WLAF  (Ohio Glory).

3.   Oakland:   Yes I would go there.....an area with a somewhat solid collegiate football player base...... and how can you call Oakland fans disloyal?  The Davises gave Oakland pro football.... took it away..... brought it back..... and even though for the time being its remaining...... it's leaving again for good.    Showed to be an interested fan base for the USFL Invaders despite the Raiders departure to LA.    Can tear down Mount Davis still and restore the Coliseum.....restore it's views.....reduce to maybe 30,000 seats for baseball and AAF football.....it would work.   I'd tear down Mount Davis even with the Raiders still there...... even during the NFL season.

4.   The league needs a territorial presence in the upper northeast. and I'm thinking maybe Red Bulls Arena or the Carrier Dome in the New York region   There is collegiate talent here.....and the #1 tv market is here.....still gotta consider that.

4.  Raleigh-Durham:  Have you noticed the numbers of players from this region on NFL rosters?   If you include the Virginia area here you could build one solid tremendous football roster even with the second guys.   The area has experienced second football before with the Skyhawks of WLAF.

So that's my top five..... not the top three and two fours.