The Waltons - General Discussion

[Egg McMuffin]

I think The Waltons was a bubble show in terms of renewal for seasons 7-9, so each of those season finales (Founders Day, The Valedictorian, The Revel) were designed so they could serve as series finales as well. I thought the ending with the boys going off to war would have been an effective finale - the depression is truly over at that point. And they could have left it vague in terms of whether they all come back.

[Prairie Rose]

Hallmark Drama is currently airing the "Starring Jon Walmsley" aka "be very afraid" Season 9 episodes. INSP just cycled back to the beginning. 

Richard Thomas is in my neck of the woods, starring as Atticus Fitch in a stage revival of To Kill a Mockingbird at Playhouse Square in Cleveland. He even filmed a greeting:

 

[Egg McMuffin]

On 5/10/2022 at 5:08 PM, Prairie Rose said:

Hallmark Drama is currently airing the "Starring Jon Walmsley" aka "be very afraid" Season 9 episodes. INSP just cycled back to the beginning. 

LOL. I wonder if Jon ever thought at the beginning of the series that he’d eventually have top billing.

BTW, the intro for those episodes is so cheap. The intro for the early episodes had the title card over two pictures: the mountain and the house. Then we see pictures of the cast members with their credits. For those late episodes, the title card is over the picture of the house, and the cast credits then roll over the picture of the mountain. It reeked of, “We give up!”

[Prairie Rose]

10 minutes ago, Egg McMuffin said:

LOL. I wonder if Jon ever thought at the beginning of the series that he’d eventually have top billing.

I think he started the series sixth billed - first in the closing credits. Only John Boy and the adult Waltons were featured in the opening credits then.

Speaking of Mr. Walmsley, it is kind of bittersweet watching the Jason/Toni scenes knowing that he and Lisa Harrison (newly married at the time) would eventually split up after almost 30 years of my marriage. Apparently, Ralph Waite was officiant of their nuptials and Michael Learned hosted the reception at her home. Mr. Waite told People magazine: “I didn’t know whether I was the father, the minister or a friend.”

None of the Walton kids save Richard Thomas had the charm and gravitas to carry the show. As part of the ensemble, they were fine.

Edited May 13, 2022 by Prairie Rose

[methodwriter85]

On 5/12/2022 at 8:37 PM, Prairie Rose said:

None of the Walton kids save Richard Thomas had the charm and gravitas to carry the show. As part of the ensemble, they were fine.

I mean, there's  a reason why Mary McDonough and Judy Norton were the only other "kid" cast member to have any kind of a significant television career outside of the Waltons. The rest of them found something else.

Speaking of Mary Ellen, Marcelle LeBlanc posted herself in front of her trailer for the planned Thanksgiving movie.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CdtSMIpLMKi/

I still think it's funny they chose to film these movies in Georgia instead of in Canada. Marcelle told Judy in her web series that they had to wear ice packs underneath their woolen winter clothes and how grateful that experience made her feel for air conditioning, LOL. 

[Prairie Rose]

The 1982 sequel movies are airing on Hallmark Drama now. Were any of them considered genuine backdoor pilots?

Edited May 28, 2022 by Prairie Rose

[Katy M]

6 hours ago, Prairie Rose said:

The 1982 sequel movies are airing on Hallmark Drama now. Were any of them considered genuine backdoor pilots?

No, they were always just meant to be movies.

[Egg McMuffin]

9 hours ago, Prairie Rose said:

The 1982 sequel movies are airing on Hallmark Drama now. Were any of them considered genuine backdoor pilots?

Earl Hamner started talking about a sequel series called “The Young Waltons” or “Walton’s Mountain” as early as 1979 when Michael Learned was leaving. He wanted to write out the parents and focus on the children. The NBC movies tested that concept, using the “Walton’s Mountain” title and new intro graphics and theme music.

These movies set up the concept for a follow-up series: John was still living in Arizona with Livvie and in two of the movies only showed up halfway through the proceedings. He was only there in a supporting role. Instead, the focus was on the five youngest Walton children (John Boy and eventually Jason were in New York), the spouses (Cindy, Paul, and Jonesy), and a recast Aimee Godsey, with Ike, Corabeth and the Baldwins sisters around for support.

[Prairie Rose]

On 5/12/2022 at 8:37 PM, Prairie Rose said:

I think he started the series sixth billed - first in the closing credits.   

I have to correct myself...Mr. Walmsley was originally seventh billed. When the six younger Waltons were listed in the closing credits, Judy Norton was credited before him.

[LadyIrony]

On 3/19/2022 at 6:24 AM, Egg McMuffin said:

I watched part of “The Hawk” the sixth season premiere today. This was the first episode after Richard Thomas departed, and all I can say is: what were the writers smoking over the summer?

Livvie, Corabeth, and Sarah (Livvie’s new - and short lived - BFF) go to the university to hire a new pastor, since Rev Fordwick moved to the west coast to live with two women. The ladies do about as much due diligence as the menfolk did when they hired Curt Willard the previous season. Meaning: none. They hire Hank Buchanan on the spot. Erin winds up crushing on Hank. Corabeth, meanwhile confesses that Hank makes her feel all tingly, and in a moment of TMI, tells Livvie that Ike hasn’t tingled her for years.

Also, Elizabeth and Aimee take a bath together, singing in the tub while accompanied by Jason on the piano.

What a weird episode!

I wanted Corabeth to cuck Ike just for something dramatic to happen lol! I think back then it would have been an outrage. By the stage of this ep though the show really shifted from a family drama of sorts to something more soapie in nature. The women in particular start acting and dressing differently, it's like the last few seasons of Happy Days where you could sense no one cared anymore. 

 It would have been good if Erin hooked up with the pastor. I thought that was what would happen. 

Corabeth and Ike were always a bad match. Corabeth being so pretentious and all and Ike being more like the humble yet sturdy store owner. He deserved better than her but probably thought she was as good as he was ever going to get. I never felt the love between them and Corabeth was most likely bored stupid by him. 

[Zella]

Over the past few months, I've worked my way through The Waltons after never having seen it. I did this recently with Little House on the Prairie too. I wasn't born until after these shows were off the air, but I grew up watching a lot of classic 60s and 70s shows. Neither is one I ever caught in reruns or that my immediate family made an effort to view, however.

I was actually pleasantly surprised by how good the first few seasons of The Waltons were. I really enjoyed the family dynamics and liked how the storylines weren't too exaggerated. A lot of what unfolded seemed pretty reasonable to expect for an everyday family. I also appreciated that the show didn't really heavily trade in the Appalachian stereotypes I was expecting, though I think the "poor" Waltons had a lot more material goods than my Appalachian grandparents had during the Depression. 

I freely admit John Boy could be a twat and he definitely was the golden child who could do no wrong in the family, but as someone who knows Richard Thomas primarily as an FBI agent on The Americans, I was actually pretty impressed with his early acting. (Obviously some dark forces at work that would transform one from the eager beaver idealist John Boy to caustic no-nonsense Special Agent Gaad after he left the mountain. LOL)

I think him leaving was hard for the show to recover from, but for me, the heart and soul of the show was Grandpa, and after he died, it was never same. As they lost cast members, it also really affected the dynamic of the show, but I thought them firing Ralph Waite was also the final nail in the coffin. The rest of the cast that remained couldn't really act and lacked any gravitas. (Jim Bob's complete inability to not mumble his lines with the same monotone never failed to take me out of any dramatic moment involving him, but he was hardly the only offender when it came to not being able to handle dramatic scenes.)

I finally got used to Robert Wightman as John Boy 2.0 and actually thought he was one of the more talented remaining cast members by the end, but the way he would only appear sporadically when he was first introduced meant it took me a couple of seasons before I could recognize him on sight. I kept thinking, "Who the fuck is that guy everyone acts like they know? Is that somebody's new boyfriend? Oh it's the new John Boy." 

I thought LHOTP declined pretty steeply too in its later years, but its final season was so batshit crazy that it was weirdly entertaining in a trainwreck kind of way. The Waltons definitely jumped the shark in its last season (I can't stop laughing every time I think about that terrible episode when they bring Curt back from the dead with a different actor), but it wasn't a fun trainwreck. It was just meh.

I think I'll skip the movies, but I don't mind at all revisiting the first 5 seasons down the road. 

Edited June 8, 2022 by Zella

[methodwriter85]

10 hours ago, Zella said:

I thought LHOTP declined pretty steeply too in its later years, but its final season was so batshit crazy that it was weirdly entertaining in a trainwreck kind of way. The Waltons definitely jumped the shark in its last season (I can't stop laughing every time I think about that terrible episode when they bring Curt back from the dead with a different actor), but it wasn't a fun trainwreck. It was just meh.

The difference is that Michael Landon basically was a diva who never saw a scenery chewing scene he didn't like, and the actors were directed accordingly which led to alot of shouting from Melissa Gilbert. He also shamelessly ripped off his own show by hiring Shannen Doherty and Not Tracey Nelson to re-enact Laura and Nellie's rivalry.  

[LadyIrony]

On 6/9/2022 at 8:27 AM, Zella said:

Over the past few months, I've worked my way through The Waltons after never having seen it. I did this recently with Little House on the Prairie too. I wasn't born until after these shows were off the air, but I grew up watching a lot of classic 60s and 70s shows. Neither is one I ever caught in reruns or that my immediate family made an effort to view, however.

I was actually pleasantly surprised by how good the first few seasons of The Waltons were. I really enjoyed the family dynamics and liked how the storylines weren't too exaggerated. A lot of what unfolded seemed pretty reasonable to expect for an everyday family. I also appreciated that the show didn't really heavily trade in the Appalachian stereotypes I was expecting, though I think the "poor" Waltons had a lot more material goods than my Appalachian grandparents had during the Depression. 

I freely admit John Boy could be a twat and he definitely was the golden child who could do no wrong in the family, but as someone who knows Richard Thomas primarily as an FBI agent on The Americans, I was actually pretty impressed with his early acting. (Obviously some dark forces at work that would transform one from the eager beaver idealist John Boy to caustic no-nonsense Special Agent Gaad after he left the mountain. LOL)

I think him leaving was hard for the show to recover from, but for me, the heart and soul of the show was Grandpa, and after he died, it was never same. As they lost cast members, it also really affected the dynamic of the show, but I thought them firing Ralph Waite was also the final nail in the coffin. The rest of the cast that remained couldn't really act and lacked any gravitas. (Jim Bob's complete inability to not mumble his lines with the same monotone never failed to take me out of any dramatic moment involving him, but he was hardly the only offender when it came to not being able to handle dramatic scenes.)

I finally got used to Robert Wightman as John Boy 2.0 and actually thought he was one of the more talented remaining cast members by the end, but the way he would only appear sporadically when he was first introduced meant it took me a couple of seasons before I could recognize him on sight. I kept thinking, "Who the fuck is that guy everyone acts like they know? Is that somebody's new boyfriend? Oh it's the new John Boy." 

I thought LHOTP declined pretty steeply too in its later years, but its final season was so batshit crazy that it was weirdly entertaining in a trainwreck kind of way. The Waltons definitely jumped the shark in its last season (I can't stop laughing every time I think about that terrible episode when they bring Curt back from the dead with a different actor), but it wasn't a fun trainwreck. It was just meh.

I think I'll skip the movies, but I don't mind at all revisiting the first 5 seasons down the road. 

The Walton's is a lot more authentic than the very preachy LHOP which at times was more like Happy Days but set on the Prairie with heavy doses of morality preaching. Not a lot of attention paid to period authenticity. 

The Walton's really start to lose it when Ellen Corby (Grandma) has an actual stroke and watching Grandpa have to be separated from her is heart breaking than it is heartbreaking again to see Ellen try and work whilst recovering from the stroke. Brave yes but not great to watch when one only wants to be entertained. 

The season where the mother is gone and of course John Boy leaves than the father leaves (fired) and finally Grandpa (I might be getting the order of these things wrong). 

It pushes the focus on the rest of the kids who were mostly scenery in previous seasons. The older girls try and push their looks while Elizabeth starts to get older and outshines them both. 

For a family that were always crying poor they did seem to have a lot of stuff and they did all pass up on earning money at times for morality/family values. I doubt that would have really happened back then. I also doubt the father would be ok with one son wanting to take a chance on being a writer and another wanting to be a musician whilst having to pay strangers to work the family mill. I don't think parents back then were about encouraging their kids dreams! 

[SusanM]

I really liked The Waltons when it was still the original family with the original John Boy.  I also actually liked a lot of the episodes set during the war years.  For me though the "jump the shark" episode was the one when we find out that Mary Ellen's husband had not actually been killed in the war after all.  Worst Plot Ever.  It was embarassing to watch. 

And don't get me started on the movie set in 1963 where they somehow forgot about the existence of some of the Walton grandchildren and had clearly had all the characters drink from the Fountain of Youth.  

[Blergh]

It was sad that when they had some serious plot twists, the remaining Waltons seemed completely over their heads. There was one in which Ben had gotten captured by the Japanese in the Pacific Theater and had made the US flag from scraps even though he knew he would be  punished by being put into the tiny, suffocating 'sweat box' [which was VERY light punishment re Japanese prison camps].

. Alas,  his performer (Eric Scott) couldn't muster being more than slightly annoyed and sweaty from the whole turn of events as though he'd had to run an extra lap around the track at gym class for mouthing off at the PE teacher! 

[SusanM]

2 minutes ago, Blergh said:

Alas,  his performer (Eric Scott) couldn't muster being more than slightly annoyed and sweaty from the whole turn of events as though he'd had to run an extra lap around the track at gym class for mouthing off at the PE teacher! 

Ben and Jim Bob were typical of a lot of kid actors.  Once they got past a certain age whatever acting ability they had was pretty much gone.  I'd argue this was truer of Jim Bob than Ben but I totally agree that Ben couldn't pull off the dramatic moments.  At all.

I think all the girls did just fine - probably Elizabeth was the least capable and Mary Ellen went through a phase where she over emoted everything but settled down.   

[HyeChaps]

What I did like about this show was the historical details, especially in the early years.

[LadyIrony]

1 hour ago, Blergh said:

It was sad that when they had some serious plot twists, the remaining Waltons seemed completely over their heads. There was one in which Ben had gotten captured by the Japanese in the Pacific Theater and had made the US flag from scraps even though he knew he would be  punished by being put into the tiny, suffocating 'sweat box' [which was VERY light punishment re Japanese prison camps].

. Alas,  his performer (Eric Scott) couldn't muster being more than slightly annoyed and sweaty from the whole turn of events as though he'd had to run an extra lap around the track at gym class for mouthing off at the PE teacher! 

And when the boys come back from war there isn't any PTSD or changes in them. I don't think they really mention it which probably would have been normal. They did slightly explore the theme of PTSD through the other vet who beats his wife and the Walton boys are like white knights. 

1 hour ago, HyeChaps said:

What I did like about this show was the historical details, especially in the early years.

Sometimes the emotion or background was missing though. There was the ep where King George V of England is abdicating and the family sit around listening on the radio looking very shocked. I would have liked to  know if that was really how it was back then. I wanted to know how a King in England affects some Hillbillies in America or anyone in America. That would have been interesting to see more of. 

John Boy watching the Hindenburg go down was the classic though, so obviously standing in front of the original footage and  having some burning paper thrown at him afterwards! 

[Zella]

2 hours ago, LadyIrony said:

I wanted to know how a King in England affects some Hillbillies in America or anyone in America. That would have been interesting to see more of. 

My grandpa is a hillbilly from Appalachian North Carolina, and he still talks pretty excitedly about hearing about Elizabeth's coronation on the radio when he was a young teen. So, I can see them finding the abdication a welcome distraction of something. That point would probably be sold better if the family actually seemed poorer. I'm sure for my grandpa, as a kid growing up without shoes or indoor plumbing, the coronation seemed fantastically grand in the same way an abdication may have been deliciously scandalous. 

4 hours ago, Blergh said:

It was sad that when they had some serious plot twists, the remaining Waltons seemed completely over their heads. There was one in which Ben had gotten captured by the Japanese in the Pacific Theater and had made the US flag from scraps even though he knew he would be  punished by being put into the tiny, suffocating 'sweat box' [which was VERY light punishment re Japanese prison camps].

. Alas,  his performer (Eric Scott) couldn't muster being more than slightly annoyed and sweaty from the whole turn of events as though he'd had to run an extra lap around the track at gym class for mouthing off at the PE teacher! 

As a WWII buff, I was looking forward to the WWII episodes but I thought they were some of the lamest ones I've ever seen devoted to the war. Ben's time as a Japanese POW seemed like something out of a summer camp rather than the grim reality.

Edited June 11, 2022 by Zella

[andromeda331]

7 hours ago, Zella said:

As a WWII buff, I was looking forward to the WWII episodes bu I thought they were some of the lamest ones I've ever seen devoted to the war. Ben's time as a Japanese POW seemed like something out of a summer camp rather than the grim reality.

So was I. I wanted to see what it was like for the Waltons in WW2. Which branch did the boys join? Seeing their experiences in the war. Which boys went to Europe and which went to the Pacific? What was it like for them to see places so different from home? My dad was from a really small farm town and still talks about how different Vietnam was for him. Did Mary Ellen and Erin help out with the war effort? How hard it was for the family especially Olivia and John worrying about their sons. There was so much they could have done and they didn't. I did like them killing off Curtis in WW2 there was no way they were going to kill off any of the Walton boys but choosing to kill of Curtis was a great way to bring the war to the family. I also liked John having to choose which boys went to war. Most if not all he knew their entire lives and family. That would be hard job. Same with G.W. was killed in war. I also like the scene where John comes up on Olivia looking into the boys' room wishing they didn't have sons because they wouldn't have to go to war. It was a good real moment of her and then John realizing not all of their sons might make it home. 

[Egg McMuffin]

They should have ended it after season 5. It concluded the series’ original premise - young aspiring writer comes of age in the Appalachians - as John Boy left the mountain to move to New York after selling his book. You can see why the show won Emmys in those years.

The remaining seasons were just a series of declines (Grandpa dying, the parents leaving, John Boy showing up with a new face, the other kids struggling to act as they got older). There are still some good episodes here and there, but not enough to justify continuing.

[sATL]

Several of the walton's movies are airing today, June 11 on the GAC channel. I just discovered them, so I might have missed some goodies that I don't remember like Mary Ellen and Jonesy wedding and Jason and Toni's wedding.  Here is the schedule.

[sATL]

15 hours ago, Zella said:

As a WWII buff, I was looking forward to the WWII episodes but I thought they were some of the lamest ones I've ever seen devoted to the war. Ben's time as a Japanese POW seemed like something out of a summer camp rather than the grim reality.

The lamest to me featured a son, who dreamt for years of airplanes in addition to being mechanically strong, getting stationed in a few towns over and who seemed to always be on a weekend pass. I don't think there was a scene devoted to his camp setting or his fellow army members. At least with the other 3- we saw something..

Then when the war is over - didn't stay in the service... He planned to go before the war, went to the recruiting office the day of pearl harbor, enlisted in the day of his HS graduation, so why not reenlist after the war - ie peacetime? What exactly did he come home for/to-do - run a country off-road car garage ? If anyone should have did 20 yrs (or until Korea broke out) and then retire out - Jim Bob James Robert, should have be the one.

Edited June 11, 2022 by sATL

[sATL]

7 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

So was I. I wanted to see what it was like for the Waltons in WW2. Which branch did the boys join? Seeing their experiences in the war. Which boys went to Europe and which went to the Pacific? What was it like for them to see places so different from home? My dad was from a really small farm town and still talks about how different Vietnam was for him. Did Mary Ellen and Erin help out with the war effort? How hard it was for the family especially Olivia and John worrying about their sons. There was so much they could have done and they didn't. I did like them killing off Curtis in WW2 there was no way they were going to kill off any of the Walton boys but choosing to kill of Curtis was a great way to bring the war to the family. I also liked John having to choose which boys went to war. Most if not all he knew their entire lives and family. That would be hard job. Same with G.W. was killed in war. I also like the scene where John comes up on Olivia looking into the boys' room wishing they didn't have sons because they wouldn't have to go to war. It was a good real moment of her and then John realizing not all of their sons might make it home. 

so did I. didn't care for the man - to harsh looking and acting.. And just how much older was he than mary ellen?

Now if it was Jonesy. I would have cried..

And to the same point that has been stated why MASH killed off Henry Blake - not everyone comes home from war. Curt was an easy expendable target.

I didn't see it as John choosing which son went. Jim Bob was too young  w/o signatures , & john/olivia had a hard rule about finishing HS, Jason had somekind of extension from not reporting for the draft ( I guess due to school) and when Ben did decided he wanted to go - he went. 

Edited June 11, 2022 by sATL

[SusanM]

3 minutes ago, sATL said:

I didn't see it as John choosing which son went. Jim Bob was too young  w/o signatures, Jason had somekind of extension from not reporting for the draft ( I guess due to school) and when Ben did decided he wanted to go - he went. 

John wasn't choosing which of his own sons would go.  He was on the draft board (I think that's what it was called) so he was making decisions about the young men in the area who were eligible to go.

[SusanM]

34 minutes ago, sATL said:

What exactly did he come home for/to-do - run a country off-road car garage ? If anyone should have did 20 yrs (or until Korea broke out) and then retire out - Jim Bob James Robert, should have be the one.

This was part of the problem with keeping the show on the air as long as it did.  Realistically Ben would have stayed home because he worked with his father but likely all the other sons would have struck out on their own not just John Boy.  That was the reality of small town life then, and probably still is.  I get, of course, why they didn't do that, but given that the actor playing Jim Bob was just not very good, writing his character off with only sporadic appearances might have been a good idea!

Edited June 11, 2022 by SusanM

[sATL]

5 minutes ago, SusanM said:

This was part of the problem with keeping the show on the air as long as it did.  Realistically Ben would have stayed home because he worked with his father but likely all the other sons would have struck out on their own not just John Boy.  That was the reality of small town life then, and probably still is.  I get, of course, why they didn't do that, but given that the actor playing Jim Bob was just not very good, writing his character off with only sporadic appearances might have been a good idea!

Actually - I'm still a little sad on Ben staying too.. what was the university that cindy's father got him into for engineering - Duke ? He had the GI Bill and Cindy's fathers string-pulling, already married with a child, that seemed to be too good of a deal to passed up. I would have like to see them do cameos of him being in college. But John has to go take Olivia to AZ

[SusanM]

4 minutes ago, sATL said:

Actually - I'm still a little sad on Ben staying too..

That bothered me to at the time but I guess it was realistic - somewhat akin to at least one boy having to stay home and take over the farm.  In my family back a few generations what seemed to happen was one girl got to be the "old maid" and stay home to run the house and look after the aging parents!  Not fair but real.

Edited June 11, 2022 by SusanM

[Blergh]

On 6/10/2022 at 6:32 PM, LadyIrony said:

Sometimes the emotion or background was missing though. There was the ep where King George V of England is abdicating and the family sit around listening on the radio looking very shocked. I would have liked to  know if that was really how it was back then. I wanted to know how a King in England affects some Hillbillies in America or anyone in America. That would have been interesting to see more of. 

OK, I asked my 90-something mother who wasn't a hillbilly but grew up in a small Virginia town during that time  to let me know what those rural folks may have been  thinking at the time. Mama said that, due to radio, newsreels and newspapers being widespread everyone at the time in her hometown was connected to the news and was enthralled with the whole idea of King Edward VIII of Great Britain 'giving up the [British] throne for the woman he loved' ( albeit a woman from Baltimore who  had a bit of a shady rep- even in Mama's neck of the woods at the time ). THAT part of the historic scenario the show somewhat nailed- especially how the preteen, teen girl and young women romantically viewed it at the time (of course, the REAL power struggles between the king & government and his dubious ties were hushed up for many decades). 

HOWEVER, the show blew it by having everyone run around in summer frocks and being out of school - totally ignoring the fact that the Abdication occurred December 11,1936 and the future Duke of Windsor's broadcast would be aired December 12th in the States. Yep, two weeks before Christmas! How tough would it have been to have had the cast in sweaters, coats, woolen hats and mittens with maybe some decorations around the house and at Ike's store? 

Edited June 12, 2022 by Blergh

[sATL]

1 hour ago, Blergh said:

OK, I asked my 90-something mother who wasn't a hillbilly but grew up in a small Virginia town during that time  to let me know were thinking at the time. Mama said that, due to radio, newsreels and newspapers being widespread everyone at the time in her hometown was enthralled with the whole idea of King Edward VIII of Great Britain 'giving up the [British] throne for the woman he loved' ( albeit a woman from Baltimore who  had a bit of a shady rep- even in Mama's neck of the woods at the time ). THAT part of the historic scenario the show somewhat nailed- especially how the preteen, teen girl and young women romantically viewed it at the time (of course, the REAL power struggles between the king & government and his dubious ties were hushed up for many decades). 

HOWEVER, the show blew it by having everyone run around in summer frocks and being out of school - totally ignoring the fact that the Abdication occurred December 11,1936 and the future Duke of Windsor's broadcast would be aired December 12th in the States. Yep, two weeks before Christmas! How tough would it have been to have had the cast in sweaters, coats, woolen hats and mittens with maybe some decorations around the house and at Ike's store? 

I agree. A King in England leaving his position for a US divorced woman was definitely news in the US. And probably it was one of those days/weeks when little exciting news was going on here. ( link ) . Look how much news the marriages of Prince Charles (to Diana) and William were here... I can only imagine the coordination of Queen E also generated many glued to the tv/radio all day.

Excellent detective work !!! I guess they were like me - so focused on when George VI left the throne , due to death, no one bothered to look up when he TOOK the throne.

Edited June 11, 2022 by sATL

[LadyIrony]

21 hours ago, Zella said:

My grandpa is a hillbilly from Appalachian North Carolina, and he still talks pretty excitedly about hearing about Elizabeth's coronation on the radio when he was a young teen. So, I can see them finding the abdication a welcome distraction of something. That point would probably be sold better if the family actually seemed poorer. I'm sure for my grandpa, as a kid growing up without shoes or indoor plumbing, the coronation seemed fantastically grand in the same way an abdication may have been deliciously scandalous. 

Thanks for that. It does make sense. It's a glimpse into a very different life and culture.  The Walton's, despite always crying poor were very well off for their time and social group. For a start they live on a mountain named after them but also have a business which always seems to be working even though they don't maintain that saw! I would imagine during the depression things like a wireless set if they had one at all would have been sold when things got tough. So the fact they are listening to it on their own in their double story house says a lot. 

21 hours ago, Zella said:

As a WWII buff, I was looking forward to the WWII episodes but I thought they were some of the lamest ones I've ever seen devoted to the war. Ben's time as a Japanese POW seemed like something out of a summer camp rather than the grim reality.

Same here. I was expecting more battle scenes and just more of their experiences overall but there was little of it. And what we did see was badly done. 

14 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

So was I. I wanted to see what it was like for the Waltons in WW2. Which branch did the boys join? Seeing their experiences in the war. Which boys went to Europe and which went to the Pacific? What was it like for them to see places so different from home? My dad was from a really small farm town and still talks about how different Vietnam was for him. Did Mary Ellen and Erin help out with the war effort? How hard it was for the family especially Olivia and John worrying about their sons. There was so much they could have done and they didn't. I did like them killing off Curtis in WW2 there was no way they were going to kill off any of the Walton boys but choosing to kill of Curtis was a great way to bring the war to the family. I also liked John having to choose which boys went to war. Most if not all he knew their entire lives and family. That would be hard job. Same with G.W. was killed in war. I also like the scene where John comes up on Olivia looking into the boys' room wishing they didn't have sons because they wouldn't have to go to war. It was a good real moment of her and then John realizing not all of their sons might make it home. 

Same here. I think having to choose the boys who went to war was a huge weight on John Snr but I also wonder how the other townsfolk saw the Waltons afterward. They lost sons and all the Walton boys came back. People are in despair and they get angry at things like that. Start feeling resentment etc. Way too heavy by that point of the show to get into. 

10 hours ago, Egg McMuffin said:

They should have ended it after season 5. It concluded the series’ original premise - young aspiring writer comes of age in the Appalachians - as John Boy left the mountain to move to New York after selling his book. You can see why the show won Emmys in those years.

The remaining seasons were just a series of declines (Grandpa dying, the parents leaving, John Boy showing up with a new face, the other kids struggling to act as they got older). There are still some good episodes here and there, but not enough to justify continuing.

They could have done a spin off series just on John Boy, I think it would have been interesting but perhaps it wouldn't have lasted too long. I would have liked to see more of John Boy developing his career and experiencing the big smoke etc

I think Richard Thomas thought he was going to be a big star and wanted something different, which I understand but it never really happened for him. By the last couple of seasons all the big guns of the show are gone and you just have the supporting cast left and they aren't very interesting or as yourself and others have said, good actors.

1 hour ago, Blergh said:

OK, I asked my 90-something mother who wasn't a hillbilly but grew up in a small Virginia town during that time  to let me know were thinking at the time. Mama said that, due to radio, newsreels and newspapers being widespread everyone at the time in her hometown was enthralled with the whole idea of King Edward VIII of Great Britain 'giving up the [British] throne for the woman he loved' ( albeit a woman from Baltimore who  had a bit of a shady rep- even in Mama's neck of the woods at the time ). THAT part of the historic scenario the show somewhat nailed- especially how the preteen, teen girl and young women romantically viewed it at the time (of course, the REAL power struggles between the king & government and his dubious ties were hushed up for many decades). 

HOWEVER, the show blew it by having everyone run around in summer frocks and being out of school - totally ignoring the fact that the Abdication occurred December 11,1936 and the future Duke of Windsor's broadcast would be aired December 12th in the States. Yep, two weeks before Christmas! How tough would it have been to have had the cast in sweaters, coats, woolen hats and mittens with maybe some decorations around the house and at Ike's store? 

Thanks for that. I guess it was all a view into another life and world. So much different to their own. 

I never even considered what time of the year it was! The Walton's did some things well and some things not so well. As the seasons went on their track record was more "Not so well".

6 hours ago, sATL said:

so did I. didn't care for the man - to harsh looking and acting.. And just how much older was he than mary ellen?

Now if it was Jonesy. I would have cried..

And to the same point that has been stated why MASH killed off Henry Blake - not everyone comes home from war. Curt was an easy expendable target.

I didn't see it as John choosing which son went. Jim Bob was too young  w/o signatures , & john/olivia had a hard rule about finishing HS, Jason had somekind of extension from not reporting for the draft ( I guess due to school) and when Ben did decided he wanted to go - he went. 

I didn't like him either but Mary Ellen was also rather harsh looking at times and walked like a Wharfie. In real life the original actor who played Curt was 20 years older than Judy Norton but I think within the show he was supposed to be more age appropriate by our definitions. For the period I don't think anyone would have thought anything of a 40 year old man, especially a Dr marrying a 19 year old woman. 

[Zella]

4 hours ago, LadyIrony said:

The Walton's, despite always crying poor were very well off for their time and social group. For a start they live on a mountain named after them but also have a business which always seems to be working even though they don't maintain that saw! I would imagine during the depression things like a wireless set if they had one at all would have been sold when things got tough. So the fact they are listening to it on their own in their double story house says a lot. 

Yes! My grandparents, who were born in 1938 and 1943 so didn't even have Depression-era memories, have commented to me before about how unrealistically nice the Walton house is, per what they remembered growing up in the 40s and 50s. They actually enjoy the show, but they never fail to mention that. My grandpa likes to joke that he didn't even know the Depression had ended until he joined the military in the 50s when he was a teenager. He still has absolutely no tolerance for people who bitch about army food because that was the first time he ever got enough to eat 3 times a day. 

[andromeda331]

15 hours ago, SusanM said:

John wasn't choosing which of his own sons would go.  He was on the draft board (I think that's what it was called) so he was making decisions about the young men in the area who were eligible to go.

That would be really hard to do. He knew pretty much all of the boys he was choosing.

10 hours ago, Blergh said:

OK, I asked my 90-something mother who wasn't a hillbilly but grew up in a small Virginia town during that time  to let me know were thinking at the time. Mama said that, due to radio, newsreels and newspapers being widespread everyone at the time in her hometown was enthralled with the whole idea of King Edward VIII of Great Britain 'giving up the [British] throne for the woman he loved' ( albeit a woman from Baltimore who  had a bit of a shady rep- even in Mama's neck of the woods at the time ). THAT part of the historic scenario the show somewhat nailed- especially how the preteen, teen girl and young women romantically viewed it at the time (of course, the REAL power struggles between the king & government and his dubious ties were hushed up for many decades). 

HOWEVER, the show blew it by having everyone run around in summer frocks and being out of school - totally ignoring the fact that the Abdication occurred December 11,1936 and the future Duke of Windsor's broadcast would be aired December 12th in the States. Yep, two weeks before Christmas! How tough would it have been to have had the cast in sweaters, coats, woolen hats and mittens with maybe some decorations around the house and at Ike's store? 

My mom's grandparents were teased about being Edward and Wallis. Her grandfather's name was Edward and she was a divorcee with two young daughters. They were dating at the time of the abducation. Especially his friends teased him about dating a divorcee and how scandelous it was.  He was divorced too. They married a year later.

9 hours ago, LadyIrony said:

Same here. I think having to choose the boys who went to war was a huge weight on John Snr but I also wonder how the other townsfolk saw the Waltons afterward. They lost sons and all the Walton boys came back. People are in despair and they get angry at things like that. Start feeling resentment etc. Way too heavy by that point of the show to get into. 

Too heavy for the show. But yes there would be some who blamed John Sr for the deaths of their sons. If he hadn't picked them they would be alive. And resentment that all of his came home while others didn't. My dad came home but his cousin didn't. It was hard for both families. They were happy he came home but wondered why their own son didn't. My dad wondered the same thing.  

[Katy M]

2 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

But yes there would be some who blamed John Sr for the deaths of their sons.

They did do an episode about that.  The one guy was attempting to kill the boys, and then they found out John Boy was MIA, so apparently then all was right with the world.

[Egg McMuffin]

I found it amazing that John Boy, who never fought a minute of battle, managed to become MIA. That guy was always letting the others do the dirty work of running the mill or fighting in WWII while he was filling up his notepads and burning the house down.

[Zella]

4 hours ago, Katy M said:

They did do an episode about that.  The one guy was attempting to kill the boys, and then they found out John Boy was MIA, so apparently then all was right with the world.

What was super frustrating with that episode is that it could have been a rather interesting, thought-provoking episode if it hadn't gotten so melodramatic. 

[Blergh]

4 hours ago, Zella said:

What was super frustrating with that episode is that it could have been a rather interesting, thought-provoking episode if it hadn't gotten so melodramatic. 

And, of course, the father of the fallen soldier did proclaim 'an eye for an eye and a SON for a SON!' so I wonder how they kept him from making good on this threat once John Boy (2) got found alive.

Of course, during the whole 'John Boy's missing then unconscious' arc, The Narrator (Earl Hamner) never once said anything close to  'Of course since I'm narrating what my parents and family were going through until my discovery/recovery it's obvious I survived but try to consider that my loved ones didn't know that at the time of the story'!

P.S. Oddly enough John Boy 2 DID resemble Jim Bob more than than any of their sibs-  including Original John Boy!

Edited June 12, 2022 by Blergh

[Egg McMuffin]

6 minutes ago, Blergh said:

And, of course, the father of the fallen soldier did proclaim 'an eye for an eye and a SON for a SON!' so I wonder how they kept him from making good on this threat once John Boy (2) got found alive.

Of course, during the whole 'John Boy's missing then unconscious' arc, The Narrator (Earl Hamner) never once said anything close to  'Of course since I'm narrating what my parents and family were going through until my discovery/recovery it's obvious I survived but try to consider that my loved ones didn't know that at the time of this part of the story'!

That exposes a bigger issue for the second half of the series: how the hell does John Boy continue to narrate the stories in such detail when he’s not around to see them firsthand?

They actually try to address this in the episode where Erin gets married: “My sister Erin's wedding is as clear in my memory as it is in my mother's, although neither of us were there.” Yeah, right - LOL.

[Zella]

42 minutes ago, Egg McMuffin said:

That exposes a bigger issue for the second half of the series: how the hell does John Boy continue to narrate the stories in such detail when he’s not around to see them firsthand?

That did drive me crazy! I actually assumed they'd drop the narration after Richard Thomas left and was surprised when they continued with it. 

[sATL]

17 hours ago, Zella said:

Yes! My grandparents, who were born in 1938 and 1943 so didn't even have Depression-era memories, have commented to me before about how unrealistically nice the Walton house is, per what they remembered growing up in the 40s and 50s. They actually enjoy the show, but they never fail to mention that. My grandpa likes to joke that he didn't even know the Depression had ended until he joined the military in the 50s when he was a teenager. He still has absolutely no tolerance for people who bitch about army food because that was the first time he ever got enough to eat 3 times a day. 

This a a point I missed from my Jim Bob James Robert rant above. Even though the waltons seems to have it cushy on the food front,  JB-JR came home from the war and still had to share a room with a 8 year cousin Jeffery and I guess Jason was still around-when he wasn't at the bar he bought. At least in the service he would have had a room provided for and possibly not in the barracks once the war ended, or when he rose in rank. 

He still had chores to do like cutting wood for the house and working part-time in the mill. Just seem like he might would have seen a better life, as a young person, by staying in the army air corps. He still would had plenty of time to chase women.

[Blergh]

12 minutes ago, Zella said:

That did drive me crazy! I actually assumed they'd drop the narration after Richard Thomas left and was surprised when they continued with it. 

Maybe they could have had The Narrator just preface    the newer stories with  'According to this letter from Mama/Daddy/ the kitchen sink.. .'

[Zella]

11 minutes ago, Blergh said:

Maybe they could have had The Narrator just preface    the newer stories with  'According to this letter from Mama/Daddy/ the kitchen sink.. .'

Yes! That would have worked. "As Jim Bob later mumbled to me. . . ."

[Blergh]

1 hour ago, Egg McMuffin said:

That exposes a bigger issue for the second half of the series: how the hell does John Boy continue to narrate the stories in such detail when he’s not around to see them firsthand?

They actually try to address this in the episode where Erin gets married: “My sister Erin's wedding is as clear in my memory as it is in my mother's, although neither of us were there.” Yeah, right - LOL.

OK, I get that Olivia was supposed to have been still recovering from her TB relapse (and Miss Learned was doing another series) but what was SO important to have kept  John-Boy/s from his middle sister's wedding that he somehow still narrated?! 

I mean, if the now-frail Grandma was able to dress up and pipe up her blessing for the wedding, what was keeping John-Boy/s away. ..and did the script even bother to attempt an excuse?

BTW, Miss Norton has said that the cast would plea with the movie writers NOT to drop characters or change their fates from what the show had established but the writers always told them that these changes were so trivial that none of the viewers would ever notice. Talk about famous last words. . .Yep, the cast KNEW that their audience had elephant memories! 

[Egg McMuffin]

4 minutes ago, Blergh said:

OK, I get that Olivia was supposed to have been still recovering from her TB relapse (and Miss Learned was doing another series) but what was SO important to have kept  John-Boy/s from his middle sister's wedding that he somehow still narrated?! 

He missed both Erin’s wedding and Mary Ellen’s wedding to Jonesy in those NBC TV movies. Robert Wightman did appear in the last NBC movie (“A Day for Thanks…”), so I don’t know why they didn’t hire him so John Boy could show up at those weddings. Wightman doesn’t have many credits at the time according to imdb.

It was odd to me that after going to the trouble of hiring a new John Boy, he wasn’t around regularly - he’d just pop in and out during the last few years. And there was never much rhyme or reason of why he was/wasn’t there.

[sATL]

26 minutes ago, Blergh said:

OK, I get that Olivia was supposed to have been still recovering from her TB relapse (and Miss Learned was doing another series) but what was SO important to have kept  John-Boy/s from his middle sister's wedding that he somehow still narrated?! 

I mean, if the now-frail Grandma was able to dress up and pipe up her blessing for the wedding, what was keeping John-Boy/s away. ..and did the script even bother to attempt an excuse?

what year was it supposedly when Erin got married ? Maybe John Boy went back to stars and stripes to cover Korea or Vietnam..  😂

I don't know who was in worse medical shape at those movies-weddings... Grandma or Emily Baldwin.. 

[Blergh]

10 minutes ago, sATL said:

what year was it supposedly when Erin got married ? Maybe John Boy went back to stars and stripes to cover Korea or Vietnam..  😂

I don't know who was in worse medical shape at those movies-weddings... Grandma or Emily Baldwin.. 

In the the last one 'A Walton Easter'(1997),it was rather upsetting seeing the very frail Miss Mamie(Helen Kleeb[1907-2003]) and Miss Emily (Mary Jackson [1910-2005])  propped up in their chairs   with anachronistic large hearing aids in the Baldwins' Parlor to have their single scene in which the once-comic relief characters bequeathed the once-staunchly Baptist Walton Family their Recipe recipe ! 

I suppose it was good that these elderly performers (as well as Miss Corby) got to have a little income in their twilight years. However, as I said, it was sad seeing the once cheerful and daffy yet proud characters now barely hanging on.  At least Grandma seemed to have had her extended progeny and extended family caring for her offcamera  but the Baldwins didn't seem to have had anyone doing so despite their frailty. 

[sATL]

3 minutes ago, Blergh said:

In the the last one 'A Walton Easter'(1997),it was rather upsetting seeing the very frail Miss Mamie(Helen Kleeb[1907-2003]) and Miss Emily (Mary Jackson [1910-2005])  propped up in their chairs   with anachronistic large hearing aids in the Baldwins' Parlor to have their single scene in which the once-comic relief characters bequeathed the once-staunchly Baptist Walton Family their Recipe recipe ! 

I suppose it was good that these elderly performers (as well as Miss Corby) got to have a little income in their twilight years. However, as I said, it was sad seeing the once cheerful and daffy yet proud characters now barely hanging on.  At least Grandma seemed to have had her extended progeny and extended family caring for her offcamera  but the Baldwins didn't seem to have had anyone doing so despite their frailty. 

I meant what year in "walton times".... did Erin marry... I know it was pre- 11-22-1963 since she was divorced with 3 kiddies by them.

Ms Emily was starting to show signs of Parkinson disease in one of the movies. 

Edited June 12, 2022 by sATL

[Blergh]

1 minute ago, sATL said:

I meant what year in "walton times"....

Ms Emily was starting to show signs of Parkinson disease in one of the movies. 

I think Erin was supposed to have gotten married  shortly after WWII c. 1946-48 while the last movie took place in. ..1969 [just two years before The Homecoming was aired]!

[LadyIrony]

18 hours ago, Zella said:

Yes! My grandparents, who were born in 1938 and 1943 so didn't even have Depression-era memories, have commented to me before about how unrealistically nice the Walton house is, per what they remembered growing up in the 40s and 50s. They actually enjoy the show, but they never fail to mention that. My grandpa likes to joke that he didn't even know the Depression had ended until he joined the military in the 50s when he was a teenager. He still has absolutely no tolerance for people who bitch about army food because that was the first time he ever got enough to eat 3 times a day. 

It's a common thing in TV shows and movies where characters have far more than their means should allow. I also figure though that the Walton's have been there a long time so it is accumulated wealth over many generations. They are probably using goods that were bought or made by previous generations so they would be saving a lot. 

We struggling through the eyes of others. The family who were pushed off their land who made an armed resistance against the authorities. The odd drifters who passed by, the book salesman who conned the gullible mother and John Boy into buying the book series that would never arrive. Books would be an unnecessary luxury! The look on John Snr's face!

They aren't a typical struggling depression era family that is for sure. 

10 hours ago, Katy M said:

They did do an episode about that.  The one guy was attempting to kill the boys, and then they found out John Boy was MIA, so apparently then all was right with the world.

It was a very weird ep. And after that you just allow the guy to stay free? I would be thinking he could snap again at any moment!

7 hours ago, Egg McMuffin said:

I found it amazing that John Boy, who never fought a minute of battle, managed to become MIA. That guy was always letting the others do the dirty work of running the mill or fighting in WWII while he was filling up his notepads and burning the house down.

LOL Burning down the house due to smoking a pretentious pipe, letting Grandpa take the blame, selling the family plot of land to buy an old printing press which he barely used before running off and leaving it to Jim Bob or Whatever Bob to maintain so it didn't rust. 

What a guy! 

5 hours ago, Zella said:

What was super frustrating with that episode is that it could have been a rather interesting, thought-provoking episode if it hadn't gotten so melodramatic. 

It was a cliche simple ending too. He gives up on it when John Boy goes missing. Hmmmm

2 hours ago, Blergh said:

And, of course, the father of the fallen soldier did proclaim 'an eye for an eye and a SON for a SON!' so I wonder how they kept him from making good on this threat once John Boy (2) got found alive.

Of course, during the whole 'John Boy's missing then unconscious' arc, The Narrator (Earl Hamner) never once said anything close to  'Of course since I'm narrating what my parents and family were going through until my discovery/recovery it's obvious I survived but try to consider that my loved ones didn't know that at the time of the story'!

P.S. Oddly enough John Boy 2 DID resemble Jim Bob more than than any of their sibs-  including Original John Boy!

Maybe he cooled down or realized the Walton family outgunned his? It could have become a real Hatfield McCoy thing! I recall it did get to the point of John Snr getting his rifle out and confronting him unless I am getting stories mixed up. The guy did take a shot at one of the Walton boys too. 

I did some quick Googling on Hamner and I didn't find anything about him having gone missing in WW2 so I think that was just added for the sake of storyline. 

Watching the show growing up I had no idea it was the "real" John Boy narrating the show! 

[Blergh]

7 minutes ago, LadyIrony said:

 . 

Watching the show growing up I had no idea it was the "real" John Boy narrating the show! 

Keep in mind that Mr. Hamner's sibs made it clear that Walton's Mountain was where he'd have LIKED to have grown up not his actual home!

BTW, the entire time of the show his mother Doris was credited as 'Story Consultant' and Mr. Hamner said that he phoned her after every show to ask about it .  I guess that might have meant that she piped up that the scripts weren't  so far off the mark to keep her from cashing those checks!