Elizabeth Webber: Forever The Manipulative Miss Or Adorable Angel?

[dubbel zout]

3 minutes ago, UYI said:

Those are some bushy AF eyebrows, though, lol. 

Go back and look at shows from the '80s with FH and IB. Talk about Brezhnev brows. FH has joked about it on more than one occasion.

[Asp Burger]

On 8/2/2017 at 0:14 PM, TeeVee329 said:

And what's this, Liz had a sister before Rebecca Budig?

I'm fine with them pretending otherwise. The character was such a waste of space with both Jennifer Sky and Sarah Laine, and a lot of it was their blandness; I didn't especially want better writing for them. Maybe the third time would be the charm, but I don't have that much faith in GH casting.  

More ageless-Becky trivia: The second actress to play Liz's supposedly older sister is younger than Becky by five and a half years. So, yes, Sarah Laine was playing a doctor (wasn't she actually a doctor? Or at least far along in med school?) at 19, unless there's some really bold birth-date lying on the internet. Becky, as the younger sister who was waiting tables at Kelly's and hadn't figured out what she wanted to do, still looked like the younger one.   

Edited August 4, 2017 by Asp Burger

[UYI]

19 hours ago, Asp Burger said:

I'm fine with them pretending otherwise. The character was such a waste of space with both Jennifer Sky and Sarah Laine, and a lot of it was their blandness; I didn't especially want better writing for them. Maybe the third time would be the charm, but I don't have that much faith in GH casting.  

More ageless-Becky trivia: The second actress to play Liz's supposedly older sister is younger than Becky by five and a half years. So, yes, Sarah Laine was playing a doctor (wasn't she actually a doctor? Or at least far along in med school?) at 19, unless there's some really bold birth-date lying on the internet. Becky, as the younger sister who was waiting tables at Kelly's and hadn't figured out what she wanted to do, still looked like the younger one.   

The irony is that Elizabeth Webber wouldn't even exist at all had Becky never auditioned for the role of Sarah. Despite not being cast in that role, the show liked her enough to create the role of Elizabeth just for her, with no extra audition necessary. Becky herself has confirmed this. 

[WendyCR72]

Wasn't BH originally slated to be some "secret daughter" of Alexis' back in the day? Alexis was sending letters and such, and I thought I read that BH may have had something to do with that angle until the story was dropped, and then that is how Liz came to pass.

Eh, who knows.

[dubbel zout]

She was supposed to be Sonny's sister, I believe. jsbt has talked about it at some length, maybe even in this thread.

ETA: Sorry! It was Gia who was supposed to be Sonny's secret sister. I think they wanted to hook up Liz and Sonny at one point, though, which given this show, isn't hard to believe.

Edited August 5, 2017 by dubbel zout

[UYI]

All I know is that Becky auditioned for Sarah--she was the only non-blonde in the final group--didn't get it, and then supposedly got called up shortly afterwards with the role of Liz having been created just for her. I suppose Becky could have left something out of that story, but I didn't think so.

Not that it matters, really, but that's the story I've heard her tell before. 

[Darklazr]

On 8/5/2017 at 9:44 AM, dubbel zout said:

She was supposed to be Sonny's sister, I believe. jsbt has talked about it at some length, maybe even in this thread.

ETA: Sorry! It was Gia who was supposed to be Sonny's secret sister. I think they wanted to hook up Liz and Sonny at one point, though, which given this show, isn't hard to believe.

Elizabeth donated blood to save Sonny's life and the show was planning on making them siblings, but Frons stepped in and pushed Courtney in that role which is why Liason was dumped in 2002.

[WendyCR72]

Still believe it was Gia, not Liz, whom Courtney shoved aside as Sonny's sister. The way I see it? Courtney did both Gia and Liz a favor.

[katie9918]

Yeah, there would have been a lot more immediate story at the time, considering how much Sonny was despised by the half-brother Gia already had, if it was Gia who was originally going to be Sonny's unknown half-sister.

 

I agree that both Gia and Liz dodged a bullet there.

[WendyCR72]

4 minutes ago, katie9918 said:

Yeah, there would have been a lot more immediate story at the time, considering how much Sonny was despised by the half-brother Gia already had, if it was Gia who was originally going to be Sonny's unknown half-sister.

 

I agree that both Gia and Liz dodged a bullet there.

And I think that was the plan, because Taggart and Gia's mom did pop up, and she used to act odd with any Sonny mention, and I believe Mike, Sonny's dad, was suddenly popping up, too. And since, as you say, Taggart already loathed Sonny, connecting the dots was easy.

But then Frons got tingles over Courtney and that was that.

I hated Courtney, but as I said, she was the perfect sacrifice sister, in this case.

[UYI]

The only hole in that story is Courtney was introduced in late 2001, when Angela Shapiro was still President of ABC Daytime, and Megan McTavish was still GH's headwriter. By the time Frons came along a year later, Pratt & Guza were writing GH, and I think it was under Shapiro/JFP/McTavish that Courtney became Sonny's sister, right? (As opposed to Liz, to avoid drifting TOO far off-topic). 

[dubbel zout]

Ugh, even by that point Elizabeth had suffered enough. She didn't need Sonny as her brother.

[Bringonthedrama]

On 8/4/2017 at 4:41 AM, Asp Burger said:

I'm fine with them pretending otherwise. The character was such a waste of space with both Jennifer Sky and Sarah Laine, and a lot of it was their blandness;

Sarah doesn't have to be re-cast to give Liz some sense of family.  She could look a bit crushed that Hayden's gone, and someone, maybe Bobbie (due to the history) could ask if she's okay because she seems pretty upset.  Liz could then have a line like "It's just ... I talked to my sister Sarah, and she wanted me and the boys, Grams and Hayden to come see her for Thanksgiving.  She was looking forward to meeting Hayden, and to becoming an aunt again. Feeling like a family has been especially hard since Steven went to prison. I thought her idea was great and I was going ask Hayden, but she took off before I got a chance.  So I'm a little sad."

Or Liz could run into Olivia in the hospital for some reason, and congratulate her on her recent marriage to Ned.  Olivia could say something about feeling really blessed because she didn't believe she would find happiness again after Steven went to prison. 

O: "How is Steven?"

L: "He's okay. He misses caring for patients, seeing my boys grow up.  But he'll make parole in xxxx and we'll see him for Thanksgiving or Christmas. I'm really looking forward to that."

Is it really that hard to throw in some lines once in a while letting the audience know that she's not all alone in the world except for runaway Hayden? That she actually talks to *some* family, even though we still don't know her mother's name after all these years? SHEESH.

[dubbel zout]

12 hours ago, Bringonthedrama said:

O: "How is Steven?"

"The inmates love it when he plays guitar and sings 'Hallelujah,' right? I know I did."

[Oracle42]

I don't know why this show is so stuck on romantic relationships as the only vehicle for character development. 

[dubbel zout]

The writers are lazy and unimaginative.

[Darklazr]

The show should have undone HateChel being a Hardy/Webber and let her leave town with Finn.

[coffee drinker]

Fan video.  BH is my favorite.  8)

 

[Darklazr]

Elizabeth/BH is my fav!  Thanks for posting the video.

[Neptune]

[Darklazr]

BH looks stunning, but the IIC can't or won't promote her without RoHo being up her ass. 

[coffee drinker]

Nice article of Becky and her kids for Mother's Day.  :)

  

 

Edited May 8, 2018 by coffee drinker

[dubbel zout]

What a nice photo—her 6-year-old is adorable! 

It's so dumb Elizabeth is still stuck with young kids, especially given the SORASing that's been done with others. If Carly can be a grandmother, Elizabeth can have at least one teenager.

[UYI]

And I somehow think Becky would be perfectly fine with it, no matter how many compliments she gets about not looking her age. I mean, generally women who become moms understand they won't stay the same age forever, you know?

[dubbel zout]

I don't think BH cares about that. Maybe it's SBu who doesn't want to deal with teens? After all, they SORASed Michael out of his teen years pretty quickly.

[ulkis]

I'm confused, I thought the oldest was born when Liz gave birth to Cameron?

[coffee drinker]

5 hours ago, ulkis said:

I'm confused, I thought the oldest was born when Liz gave birth to Cameron?

Ethan was born in 2001.  That pregnancy wasn't written into the show.  Ella is the "Cameron" pregnancy.  She was born in 2004.  Emerson is the "Aiden" pregnancy.  Guza wasn't writing the show when Ethan was born.  Amazing isn't it that a writer (McTavish) could ignore the actress's real life condition and resist the need to write it in.  

[Oracle42]

So Cam should be at least 14, instead of 10

[coffee drinker]

8 minutes ago, Oracle42 said:

So Cam should be at least 14, instead of 10

Yep.  In real time Cameron was born in May 2004 (off screen).  Both Cameron and Jake have May birthdays.  Cameron's I don't recall has ever been acknowledged on screen.  Becky's daughter Ella was born in April 2004.  

[ulkis]

Thanks, coffeedrinker!

[dubbel zout]

3 hours ago, coffee drinker said:

Amazing isn't it that a writer (McTavish) could ignore the actress's real life condition and resist the need to write it in.  

Plus, it was McTavish.

[Asp Burger]

I remember Becky's 2001 pregnancy very well. Gigantic purses and lots of sitting-down scenes. She had more fullness in the face, though. She commented later that that was an awkward time on the show, because it was so obvious to everyone that she was pregnant, and she was glad Guza wrote the later pregnancies in.  

What was going on with the character in 2001 was mostly a supporting role in the Endgame story. She was saying a lot of variations on "We've got to help Lucky, Nikolas, we've just got to!" Writing a pregnancy in would have been very soapy, because Liz was in a steady relationship with someone who was faking having any memory of their "connection." But that would have made the story more about Liz than Jill Farren Phelps and McTavish wanted it to be. It was hard to avoid the conclusion in McTavish's year that Liz was her least favorite of the revised Scooby gang. She was all about (Coltin's) Nikolas and Gia, and the Jacob Young Lucky was obviously someone ABC Daytime wanted to happen in a big way. 

Edited May 20, 2018 by Asp Burger

[Darklazr]

Yes, it is time to SORAS Cam to 14.

[Bringonthedrama]

On 5/23/2018 at 2:05 PM, Darklazr said:

Yes, it is time to SORAS Cam to 14.

Absolutely. I thought there was a reference in recent years to Cam being 12, so it's time for him to have a 14th birthday party. I would like to see a snarky Cam - in front of Jason - call Joss a spoiled brat who behaves like an entitled princess just like her mother.  Then, to Jason: "And you've enabled all of it."

[Oracle42]

I think it would reflect badly on Elizabeth. Cam doesn't know Jason well enough to be that familiar with him, and mouthing off like that to an adult he doesn't really know would make him sound just as bad as, if not worse than, Joss. And it wouldn't actually make sense since Jason wasn't actually around for the past five years anyway.

 Plus, Franco makes much more sense as a target for Cam.

[CharethCutestory]

I admit Liz has always been a favorite of mine. It breaks my heart what they've done to her over the years. I want to see her get back to the person she used to be alongside all her battle scars, be alone for a while (I'm no fan of Franco or Friz), and get a really great story line to work with that's about her and her being strong. This new plot with Kiki and fighting for victims of sexual abuse/harassment could really evolve her. She's been there. Bring her brother back and put some people in her corner. Yes she's done bad things but this is Port Charles, who the heck hasn't? People drag Liz for having three baby daddies which always irked the crap outta me. So does Carly, who has always been greedy and diabolical but gets a pass and the title of "survivor." Don't get me started on Sonny "Spread my seed" Corinthos. Mobsters run everything. 

I agree that its time to age up Cameron and make him a teen. Maybe more like 16-17. And make him an angry one who's rebelling. The kid has been through so much. Never knew his real dad (who also had troubles), had several father figures in and out of his life. He watched Jake be the center of attention for years. Giving him a similar story to Zander's back when, working for a Sonny rival maybe, getting into a bad scene, but ultimately redeemed could be cool. Imagine as Jake becomes closer with Jason (I hope) Cam is working for one of his rivals. Cam having a lot of animosity for Jason wouldn't be farfetched IMO and could cross over a lot of characters/plots.

[Oracle42]

On 6/10/2018 at 8:17 PM, CharethCutestory said:

Cam having a lot of animosity for Jason wouldn't be farfetched IMO and could cross over a lot of characters/plots.

Does Cam even know Jason? Franco, definitely. Drew, maybe. But why would Cam have animosity for Jason?

I mean, there's the SOS, but that was over 10 years ago, at the time Lucky had done more damage to Cam's family than Jason, and Jason wasn't around Cam when he and Liz were together. Plus, quite a bit had happened with Liz/Lucky since then that wasn't related to Jason.

Cam should have a very fraught relationship with Jake, though. The only men who've ever treated Cam like he matters just as much as Jake have been Lucky and Drew (well, Drew up until he moved out) and the disparity has been especially pronounced with Franco.

Edited June 12, 2018 by Oracle42

[Melgaypet]

Little Braden Walkes had a habit of giving Steve Burton the most adorable baby bitchface and since then it has amused me to headcanon that Cam hates Jason. Though logically he shouldn't really remember him much. I need to believe he hates Franco, though. Need it deep in my soul. I wonder if Cam thinks his mother has epically horrible taste in men.

3 hours ago, Oracle42 said:

Can should have a very fraught relationship with Jake, though.

So much word to this.

[CharethCutestory]

6 hours ago, Oracle42 said:

Does Cam even know Jason? Franco, definitely. Drew, maybe. But why would Cam have animosity for Jason?

I mean, there's the SOS, but that was over 10 years ago, at the time Lucky had done more damage to Cam's family than Jason, and Jason wasn't around Cam when he and Liz were together. Plus, quite a bit had happened with Liz/Lucky since then that wasn't related to Jason.

Can should have a very fraught relationship with Jake, though. The only men who've ever treated Cam like he matters just as much as Jake have been Lucky and Drew (well, Drew up until he moved out) and the disparity has been especially pronounced with Franco.

I was just theorizing aging Cam into an angsty, angry teen who's pissed at the world and lashing out at people in his path including his mother and hopefully Franco. With Jason its more that he doesn't know him that would be grounds for his dislike and blame. It doesn't need to be rational. Jason is Jake's dad but he walked away from Jake, Liz, and also Cam at the time. That heartbreak and Jake's "death" hit Liz hard and she's been pretty OOC nuts ever since. Cam's witnessed all of it. And now she's with Franco of all people?? Ridiculous and gross. 

Every adult played a part in the whole Jake paternity saga but now that Jason is back and seems to want to be a dad to Jake that could bother Cam. I can see the Cam and Jake relationship going either way. Liz loves all her boys but she definitely favors Jake, I think because he is Jason's. He's been favored in the show overall, ala Michael.  Or Cam could end up being super protective of Jake, seeing himself as the big brother/father figure that's always been around. Bottom line, I'm just ready for them to age this kid and get a little drama going!!

[Melgaypet]

Just like the show, we've forgotten poor Archaeus! Where does he fit in? It would make the most sense to me if Cam was resentful of Jake and protective of Aiden.

Edited June 13, 2018 by Melgaypet

[Oracle42]

If well cast, Cam has the potential to be a really interesting character. 

I wish Guza had capitalized on the sparky chem between JJ!Lucky and Maxie and paired them up - because SORAS!Cam interacting with them could've been good soap. There'd be earned animosity there mixed with/offset by the fact that Lucky is the only one who has never favored Jake over him

[Melgaypet]

25 minutes ago, Oracle42 said:

If well cast, Cam has the potential to be a really interesting character. 

I wish Guza had capitalized on the sparky chem between JJ!Lucky and Maxie and paired them up - because SORAS!Cam interacting with them could've been good soap. There'd be earned animosity there mixed with/offset by the fact that Lucky is the only one who has never favored Jake over him

You get me.

[Darklazr]

On 6/12/2018 at 10:30 AM, Oracle42 said:

If well cast, Cam has the potential to be a really interesting character. 

I wish Guza had capitalized on the sparky chem between JJ!Lucky and Maxie and paired them up - because SORAS!Cam interacting with them could've been good soap. There'd be earned animosity there mixed with/offset by the fact that Lucky is the only one who has never favored Jake over him

I disagree.  Lucky never bothered to EVER adopt Cam and he dumped Cam / Aiden in 2011 right before Christmas.  Lucky chose to go to rehab in 2006 and it had zero to do with Cam, because Elizabeth was having a Spencer baby and that trumped the kid that he chose to raise and never adopted.  

 

Elizabeth has had horrible taste in relationships (Ric and Franco) since Cam was born, but the one that will always stick out is how Lucky has spent one hour or less around Cam, Jake and Aiden since 2011.

I would prefer Cam to hate on Franco, because the man is living in their house and chose not to marry his mother a few months ago.  Cam being protective of his mother and brothers is one that makes sense and he is not thrilled with any man that comes sniffing around his family.