All Episodes Talk

[Dandesun]

I love that Starr Manning: Adventure Biologist remains a thing in this community.

Also, you know Starr is fully prepared for quicksand despite it not being as much of an issue as TV shows I watched growing up would have you believe.

There is a big part of me that would wonder what Starr would think of unknowingly hooking up with Max' kid given how much of a pain in the ass Max was in her tender years.

Blair would be all 'look, I get it, Holden men have charm coming out of their ears' while both Todd and Max would be entirely against their child being involved with the child of their enemy.

But in all seriousness, this is just yet another casualty in the forever need to tie Marty to Todd. Cole and Starr should never have been and the fact that they shared a half sibling and it was never talked about left out the real issue. Mannings vs Holdens with star-crossed Adventure Biologist and Charming Rogue? That had soap goodness written all over it.

[UYI]

I missed posting about this at the time, but the week of May 13th-May 17th marked the 20th anniversary of Live Week (and they were the exact same days of the week as in 2002, too!). I was 13 years old at the time, and I remember just how GOOD it was.

The best part was that the closing credits were all done by former actors on the show:

Monday: Susan Batten (The Mystical Cornpone Bitch...err, Luna Moody)

Tuesday: Roy Thinnes (Sloan Carpenter)

Wednesday: Dennis Parlato (Michael Grande)

Thursday: Jessica Tuck (Megan Gordon Harrison)

Friday: Ty Treadway (Dr. Colin McIver)

Even better, not only did they bring back dead characters for their live shows (get it?), but NONE of them were ever brought back from the dead, so the joke holds up even now!

Best of all, that Friday was the Daytime Emmys, and while many cast members were too pooped out to go that year (ESPECIALLY Kassie DePaiva, who did the majority of the heavy lifting that week), a few of them still went, and they got to be a part of this:

Side note: That day was also Fiona Hutchison's birthday! :D 

[UYI]

On 6/2/2022 at 3:21 PM, Dandesun said:

There is a big part of me that would wonder what Starr would think of unknowingly hooking up with Max' kid given how much of a pain in the ass Mannings vs Holdens with star-crossed Adventure Biologist and Charming Rogue? That had soap goodness written all over it.

To the surprise of no one here, I would've been all over a potential T&B/M&G couple showdown. ;) 

[Melgaypet]

I've been watching some 90's OLTL, specifically Kevin and Cassie. I had forgotten that the night they had sex for the first time was the same night Kelly hit Blair with her car. Quite a night for the Cramer women! I had also forgotten that at the time Kelly was living with Kevin (and Drew, I believe) at the carriage house. Kelly comes home distraught and Cassie has to sneak out and then fucking Tea shows up to try to seduce Kevin and finds Cassie's glove and right then Kelly goes flying out. "Aunt Dorian called, Blair's been in a car accident!" and I'm like, biiiitch. It was pretty soapy.

It also made me feel sorry for Andrew. I always liked him. Here's a clip from when Andrew/Cassie were happy!

Edited July 3, 2022 by Melgaypet

[TeeVee329]

Two little moments jumped out at me rewatching this:

1) The dayplayer cop calling one of the bashers "sweetheart", parroting back the insult the main basher had just hurled at Fish, was a subtle show of support for his fellow officer that I really liked.

2) And then you have possibly John McBain's best moment ever, him instructing that the ringleader be put in the cell with Mitch Laurence.  "Who the hell's Mitch Laurence?".  Oh you'll find out, buddy.

Edited July 7, 2022 by TeeVee329

[DanaBeth]

On 6/7/2022 at 4:24 PM, UYI said:

I missed posting about this at the time, but the week of May 13th-May 17th marked the 20th anniversary of Live Week (and they were the exact same days of the week as in 2002, too!). I was 13 years old at the time, and I remember just how GOOD it was.

The best part was that the closing credits were all done by former actors on the show:

Monday: Susan Batten (The Mystical Cornpone Bitch...err, Luna Moody)

Tuesday: Roy Thinnes (Sloan Carpenter)

Wednesday: Dennis Parlato (Michael Grande)

Thursday: Jessica Tuck (Megan Gordon Harrison)

Friday: Ty Treadway (Dr. Colin McIver)

Even better, not only did they bring back dead characters for their live shows (get it?), but NONE of them were ever brought back from the dead, so the joke holds up even now!

Best of all, that Friday was the Daytime Emmys, and while many cast members were too pooped out to go that year (ESPECIALLY Kassie DePaiva, who did the majority of the heavy lifting that week), a few of them still went, and they got to be a part of this:

Side note: That day was also Fiona Hutchison's birthday! :D 

Could you please tell me if Gabrielle got pregnant a second time by Max bcz she and he apparently had an affair when she was married to Steve, right?  Did she miscarry that baby?  Any video of all this?

[UYI]

13 hours ago, DanaBeth said:

Could you please tell me if Gabrielle got pregnant a second time by Max bcz she and he apparently had an affair when she was married to Steve, right?  Did she miscarry that baby?  Any video of all this?

I think she faked a pregnancy/miscarriage after she and Max had sex when Steve was stuck in a coma; I don't think she was ever pregnant again after Al. 

On 7/3/2022 at 2:12 PM, Melgaypet said:

I've been watching some 90's OLTL, specifically Kevin and Cassie. I had forgotten that the night they had sex for the first time was the same night Kelly hit Blair with her car. Quite a night for the Cramer women! I had also forgotten that at the time Kelly was living with Kevin (and Drew, I believe) at the carriage house. Kelly comes home distraught and Cassie has to sneak out and then fucking Tea shows up to try to seduce Kevin and finds Cassie's glove and right then Kelly goes flying out. "Aunt Dorian called, Blair's been in a car accident!" and I'm like, biiiitch. It was pretty soapy.

It also made me feel sorry for Andrew. I always liked him. Here's a clip from when Andrew/Cassie were happy!

I'll say this much: Cassie kept her secret about sleeping with Kevin for less than a day. Not every soap reveals an affair that quickly! 

[spiritandsky333]

DOES ANYONE HAVE THE SCENE THEY CAN POST FOR DEC 18, 1989 WHERE MAX IS ROUGHLY DANCING WITH GABRIELLE ON THE TERRACE AT THE CENTENNIAL BALL?  Cannot find it anywhere and dying to see this scene!!  Thx so much

Or the "affair" between Max/Gabrielle when she is married to Steve??

[Panopticon]

Ronald Carlivati is having one of his infamous Twitter meltdowns. So far he has blocked multiple fans for referring to two characters as cousins; taunted and called out several of those fans; called out a well-known Days commenter/cheerleader for saying a formerly niche character doesn’t work in his larger role; and expressed that people who don’t watch Days shouldn’t discuss it.

It made me so nostalgic for the end of OLTL. (I wonder if Ronald will call anyone’s principal this time!?!)

But really: I hope the Banner found a way to thrive in the new economy and that Viki is still reigning as a benevolent queen. I hope that Jessica didn’t have any more personality splits and is living happily ever after with Brody and their kids. I hope that Natalie found a man worthy of her awesomeness. I hope that Starr Manning: Adventure Biologist discovered a new species of crocodile. I hope that Blair is ruling over her corner of Llanview like she deserves to (and okay Todd can be there too). I hope that every so often David announces that he has a date with destiny… and he does not mean Ms. Evans. And I hope that Bo and Nora met Snoop for lunch last week.
 

[UYI]

On 8/6/2022 at 2:40 AM, spiritandsky333 said:

DOES ANYONE HAVE THE SCENE THEY CAN POST FOR DEC 18, 1989 WHERE MAX IS ROUGHLY DANCING WITH GABRIELLE ON THE TERRACE AT THE CENTENNIAL BALL?  Cannot find it anywhere and dying to see this scene!!  Thx so much

They're actually posting January 1990 episodes right now, where Max is a coma after being shot by the Wymans when they attempted to kidnap and sell Al. This is the story where Gabrielle vows to become a nun if he survives; there's a lot of stuff coming that I haven't seen since the Fiona Fest fan page days of the 2000's, along with stuff I just plain haven't seen before; the M&G fan in me is STOKED right now, to say the least. 

ETA: Actually, @spiritandsky333, it looks like that scene aired in the final five minutes of the December 15th, 1989 episode...but unfortunately, that's the part missing here. Sigh.

Edited August 20, 2022 by UYI

[jsbt]

In the wake of Michael Malone's death, I have been rewatching some eps from '92 and '93 tonight (including the Spring Fling) as I assembled my thoughts. So here's a few no one needed:

Malone was far from flawless. His AW stint is infamous and seems to have contained mostly recycled material and characters from his mythical 13 Bourbon Street pilot as well as some of OLTL (Cindy on AW in particular seems to have been a melange of Alex and Tina's 1992 storylines). I've roasted the insanity of his second OLTL stint many times, too; it went from dream to disaster very quickly and was one of the most deranged things I've ever watched short of Jim Reilly. But it was never not gonzo and entertaining, and even then there was always some smidge of poetry and soul, however misguided, to his most ill-advised work; you could always see the personal fascinations peeking through, the private obsessions and character work Malone valued, even if it was about stuff you found silly or stupid. I remember how even in 2004 he loved to stop the story flow for single episodes where random people would reconnect and talk over their problems, like when Kevin Buchanan and Jen Rappaport would sit down at Ultra Violet, get boozed up and hash out their differences over his little brother Joey, who they had both cuckolded and run out of town at different times, and discuss how Jen was ultimately a substitute for Kelly, the teenage sweetheart Kevin had taken from his brother. I remember being stunned they got that onscreen in such a plot-driven show. This is essential character stuff, beats we rarely got to see played out on bad soaps in '04 let alone today, and he and his team made the time for it even when most of the show was in the toilet (and Joey had not been onscreen for months).

A friend told me (and he's right) that Malone's work defined the last 20 years of OLTL and they never stopped chasing the critical high of the Spring Fling and the DID saga after he was gone. I think that's correct, but the difference is Malone, flaws and all (and his murky fetishization of Todd and Marty aside), usually wanted to turn the page from a lot of that, whereas most of his successors did not. I think the Victor Lord/DID retcon still holds up, though I understand some people's issues with it. I think it's one of the greatest stories they ever told. I think the Dorian twist - that she didn't kill Victor, and had spent twenty years taking the scorn and hatred of the entire town to protect the woman who hated her as easily as breathing - was absolutely brilliant, even if Robin Strasser never liked it. And the Billy Douglas story and climax is still absolutely beautiful and heartbreaking.

I have never connected to a soap heroine more than Susan Haskell as Marty and I never will, probably because as a troubled kid I identified with her a little too much as a bitter, raw nerve. In those days, alongside Nora, Marty was my absolute favorite, because even when she became a full-fledged heroine she always had that fire. I didn't know they let people who behaved like her or seemed as wounded as her (even before the rape) on TV, let alone on daytime television. And the fact that Bob Krimmer's Andrew, the soulful bird watcher and monastic dreamer, was seemingly Malone's onscreen avatar was so telling. His forbidden passion for two women he couldn't have - first Megan, then Marty - hits much differently to me as an adult than as a kid drawn to more outwardly flashy male characters.

There's so much more to talk about, of course, like the incessant fascination with avant-garde fantasy episodes that sometimes worked and sometimes flopped in Malone's heyday, and the ones that completely tanked on a much lower budget in 2003-2004. (I'm of the opinion that the Midsummer Night's Dream epilogue to Jake and Megan's story in '92 does mostly work and was incredibly bold, but uh, don't ask me about that whole thing with Luna and Tina going into her past lives or Luna's ghost husband.) The Antonio of it all in the 2000s and the Santis. And can you completely divorce the artistry of 1993-1995's storylines from the fact that the show's leads ultimately were two rapist twin brothers woven out of Malone's work decades later? Maybe not, but I still loved those stories and even the early years of Todd's metamorphosis even if I think today he is a relic who should mostly be put away. And the hard-to-find stuff in '92 sometimes fascinates me most of all, when they were still finding their way - there has never been an Asian-American lead on a soap opera who dominated the way Mia Korf's Blair did that year since, ever.

So much of how people view OLTL today, as a multicultural, socially relevant, dynamic and fiery soap, with its finger on the pulse of ugly issues other shows would shy away from, a show that is still relevant and could still be revived, is because of Michael Malone, Linda Gottlieb and their crew. If any soap is relevant to these times it's OLTL. I don't think it'll be back, but the reason it still doesn't feel dead to me is in large part thanks to a man whose work will never die. You can say whatever you want about his work onscreen, but it never settled and never went quietly. RIP.

(I do hope someone finally unearths the Bourbon Street pilot now.)

[UYI]

4 hours ago, jsbt said:

There has never been an Asian-American lead on a soap opera who dominated the way Mia Korf's Blair did that year since, ever.

There is no question that Kassie made Blair her own, and her casting undid a lot of the sketchier aspects of Blair's backstory with Mia in the role (having basically the only lead Asian-American character in daytime ever be the product of a rape of her mentally ill mother? yikes), but it is truly a shame to see the kind of statement that character made onscreen via MK get stamped out so quickly. 

[Grinaldi]

I didn't realize Malone had passed away. While he isn't the first or second face on my Mt Rushmore (that's Agnes and Claire Labine) his work in the 90's is probably the best this show ever was. The DID retcon wasn't just strong writing, it was also necessary. It deepened Viki and grounded her in real understandable trauma. I mean, I'm sure watching your lover seemingly blow up in your dad's underground city would mess with a person. It's not going to shatter your psyche. And the Spring Fling story gave so much good material not just to Haskell and Howarth but to Hillary as well. I've honestly lost track of what he did in his late return. It's close to Higley's run and neither worked at all. 

I've always said this show was at it's best when it was about that big portrait of Victor Lord hanging over the mantel. And he got that, the element of ghost story this show had after Victor died.

And he gave us the Billy story. I was 17 in 1992 and my parents weren't much better than the Douglases in accepting me. Seeing Viki and the people of Llanview stand up for the gay teen meant more to me than I can ever say. If that was his only legacy, dayenu.

But he also gave us Jean Randolph.  His memory is a blessing.

[UYI]

19 hours ago, Grinaldi said:

 The DID retcon wasn't just strong writing, it was also necessary. It deepened Viki and grounded her in real understandable trauma. I mean, I'm sure watching your lover seemingly blow up in your dad's underground city would mess with a person. It's not going to shatter your psyche. 

It absolutely made sense, but I can also understand why Agnes Nixon didn't like it, either--she seemed to largely base Viki as she was in the beginning of the series on who she was at that age in real life, and there were aspects of Viki's relationship with her father that were based on her relationship with her own father--and while she made it clear that he wasn't really there for her at all, and felt she had no future as a writer (oops!), he wasn't abusive in the way that Victor was revealed to be towards Viki at all.

Was Malone the one who wanted Victor Sr. to be alive/take his granddaughter's literal heart away in 2003, or was that actually Frons? I can actually see Frons forcing that on him, although Malone certainly had some weird ideas mixed in with all the great stories he came up with.

Credit where credit is due, though: Throwaway line or not, I accept Ron's story, with Dorian saying that she was the one who killed Victor Sr. when she and Viki locked in the Llanfair basement during Asa's funeral in 2007, as canon, along with her line of response after Viki protested that he turned up alive ("IF that was him", or something to that effect), because it would be JUST like Mitch to produce an impostor and pass him off as Victor Sr. just to fuck with Viki's brain. He would have TOTALLY gone there, just for funsies. 

Edited August 23, 2022 by UYI

[dubbel zout]

50 minutes ago, UYI said:

it would be JUST like Mitch to produce an impostor and pass him off as Victor Sr. just to fuck with Viki's brain. He would have TOTALLY gone there, just for funsies. 

Mitch Laurence was a fantastic villain, and Roscoe Born did a fantastic job playing him.

[jsbt]

56 minutes ago, UYI said:

Was Malone the one who wanted Victor Sr. to be alive/take his granddaughter's literal heart away in 2003, or was that actually Frons? I can actually see Frons forcing that on him, although Malone certainly had some weird ideas mixed in with all the great stories he came up with.

Credit where credit is due, though: Throwaway line or not, I accept Ron's story, with Dorian saying that she was the one who killed Victor Sr. when she and Viki locked in the Llanfair basement during Asa's funeral in 2007, as canon, along with her line of response after Viki protested that he turned up alive ("IF that was him", or something to that effect), because it would be JUST like Mitch to produce an impostor and pass him off as Victor Sr. just to fuck with Viki's brain. He would have TOTALLY gone there, just for funsies. 

The Heart of a Lord mess was Malone's idea. It was a debacle. I don't know of any way in which Frons tampered with it, but he was micromanaging a lot back then so you never know. To my knowledge Malone never discussed the details of what went down in his second run while he was alive. It was Ron who ultimately put something of a bow on it years later by giving the entire mess some point, by having the signet ring Victor the imposter gave to Roger Howarth's Todd (and which Todd was fascinated with at the time) be a key element in the Two Todds story.

I was very glad when they basically said in '07 that yes, that Victor was an imposter. They even changed his death date in the mausoleum back to the '70s. I wish they'd gone all the way though and been explicit about it in the scripts vs. just having Dorian imply it (and I hated Dorian suddenly claiming she killed Victor after all - makes no sense).

Edited August 24, 2022 by jsbt

[UYI]

Some of my favorite scenes of OLTL's greatest ever couple (IMO) are in this episode. I hadn't seen these since the Fiona Fest fan site days of the mid-late aughts, back when RealPlayer was fighting for relevancy during YouTube's infancy. I'm so happy. :)

[Melgaypet]

My memory - which of course could be wrong - is that Dorian did something with Victor's medication that would have killed him had Viki-as-Tori not gotten there first. Dorian was as shocked as anyone when Victor was exhumed* and the new autopsy revealed he had been smothered with a pillow.

*I'm definitely in the Heart of a Lord Victor was an imposter camp. I figure he was some Lord relation Mitch found somewhere and brainwashed into believing he actually was Victor Lord. I mean, do we know what happened to Clayton-Powell Lord I, Powell's grandfather and Victor's brother?

[jsbt]

Two Malone-era OLTL stories that never happened (or at least, not in quite that way in one case) I didn't know about but stumbled upon when digging around recently, from a SOD/SOW? article around early '94.

• Cain Rogan was intended to be unveiled as Asa's grandson, hence allowing two of his heirs to vie for Tina.
• The Dorian/Joey affair had originally been planned... with Chris McKenna's Joey(!!). The network balked at this due to McKenna being very, very young, and Malone later pushed it through after SORASing with Nathan Fillion.
• The entire Max/Blair gambling story was originally planned to use Angela Holliday (Susan Diol) instead, until Malone realized every character involved tied back to Blair and decided to bring her back.

Edited September 14, 2022 by jsbt

[Dr.OO7]

On 9/14/2022 at 7:54 AM, jsbt said:

The Dorian/Joey affair had originally been planned... with Chris McKenna's Joey(!!). The network balked at this due to McKenna being very, very young, and Malone later pushed it through after SORASing with Nathan Fillion

ACK. That would have been borderline child molestation/statutory rape.

On 9/14/2022 at 7:54 AM, jsbt said:

The entire Max/Blair gambling story was originally planned to use Angela Holliday (Susan Diol) instead, until Malone realized every character involved tied back to Blair and decided to bring her back.

As much as I hated that story, that turnaround makes sense. Max and Angela had no history and barely interacted when she came to town. It would have been completely illogical for them to have an affair, whereas his past with Blair gave credence to both of their actions, as despicable as they were. 

[methodwriter85]

On 6/2/2022 at 3:21 PM, Dandesun said:

But in all seriousness, this is just yet another casualty in the forever need to tie Marty to Todd. Cole and Starr should never have been and the fact that they shared a half sibling and it was never talked about left out the real issue. Mannings vs Holdens with star-crossed Adventure Biologist and Charming Rogue? That had soap goodness written all over it.

This sounds horrible, but I wasn't particularly moved by them killing off Starr's child. I mean, in all honestly, I figured GH was going to bring the kid back to life but didn't get the chance to because of the Prospect Park mess. It kind of works out for Starr that she got to spend her 20's free and clear and not tied down with a baby and Cole.

I like to imagine that Starr had a fun life, traveling around, and then eventually found love with a guy who isn't tied Marty Saybrooke in any way.

Edited September 20, 2022 by methodwriter85

[Jalyn]

5 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

This sounds horrible, but I wasn't particularly moved by them killing off Starr's child. I mean, in all honestly, I figured GH was going to bring the kid back to life but didn't get the chance to because of the Prospect Park mess. It kind of works out for Starr that she got to spend her 20's free and clear and not tied down with a baby and Cole.

I like to imagine that Starr had a fun life, traveling around, and then eventually found love with a guy who isn't tied Marty Saybrooke in any way.

Somehow, there are snakes

[Melgaypet]

12 hours ago, Jalyn said:

Somehow, there are snakes

Starr Manning: Adventure Biologist must always have snakes.

You know that Starr/Frankie storyline I was talking about a page or so back? I said that in that version of Llanview, Hope was around but Cole was not. I changed my mind. Cole would still be long gone, but I think Hope would still be Chloe. That's something I wish they had done, do a baby switch and leave it lie for years. Frankie and Starr would be firmly in a relationship when the switch was revealed and Chlope would be a teenager. That would be so messy for everyone!

Edited September 20, 2022 by Melgaypet

[jsbt]

On 9/18/2022 at 8:13 PM, Dr.OO7 said:

As much as I hated that story, that turnaround makes sense. Max and Angela had no history and barely interacted when she came to town. It would have been completely illogical for them to have an affair, whereas his past with Blair gave credence to both of their actions, as despicable as they were. 

I agree. I'm not sure how the hell it was supposed to work with Max given the trajectory of that material with Cord.

[jsbt]

On 9/19/2022 at 5:15 PM, methodwriter85 said:

This sounds horrible, but I wasn't particularly moved by them killing off Starr's child. I mean, in all honestly, I figured GH was going to bring the kid back to life but didn't get the chance to because of the Prospect Park mess. It kind of works out for Starr that she got to spend her 20's free and clear and not tied down with a baby and Cole.

I thought it was a tacky thing to do for an experiment that didn't last (same as killing Téa's kid with Victor). I suspect Ron had planned to reveal that Cole, Hope and Victor II were all alive in the end along with Robin Scorpio, but the fact is he didn't get it onscreen. But no, I never liked Hope or the fact that they turned Starr into the ultimate single teen mom and little else. I wouldn't have killed the kid off, but I would've kept Starr gone for a long time because of it.

That being said, I'm a hypocrite to complain about the crossover material. Had a revival of OLTL worked, and in a demented universe in which I somehow perversely had control of one or both shows, I would've eventually done a long arc on GH in which Gina Tognoni's Dr. Sarah Webber returns to Port Charles in an unhappy marriage with several young/secondary school-aged kids, not unlike what the British soaps often do when they bring on a whole family gaggle at once - it would be an experiment. Sarah would be a hyper-competent surgeon and seemingly perfect mother who resumes a complicated relationship with her little sister Elizabeth, a woman who got knocked up very young, gave up her dreams and has been working for the clock ever since. It would only be a year into unrelated story that the audience would discover that Sarah's youngest child, a little girl they adopted, is actually Hope Thornhart, bought in secret by her sketchy husband on the black market. No OLTL characters would be active on the show at the time. I like a long game!

Edited September 22, 2022 by jsbt

[TeeVee329]

On 9/19/2022 at 8:15 PM, methodwriter85 said:

This sounds horrible, but I wasn't particularly moved by them killing off Starr's child. I mean, in all honestly, I figured GH was going to bring the kid back to life but didn't get the chance to because of the Prospect Park mess. It kind of works out for Starr that she got to spend her 20's free and clear and not tied down with a baby and Cole.

This is reminding me how much I didn't like Starr on GH.  While her desire to kill Sonny was relatable, all the snarling and sniffling she was doing at that time was not good, and then her relationship with Michael couldn't have been more boring.

Starr would need a big reset - and, sacrilege I know, but also maybe a new actress - to ever interest me again.

[Panopticon]

The one thing I clearly remember about Starr on GH was her referring to Sam as “my little cousin.” (Did she tell Sam he wasn’t her brother anymore after the Victor/Todd reveal because that’s how little Blair matters?)

I realized that that dialog was there to simplify backstory for GH viewers who weren’t familiar with OLTL and wasn’t really supposed to say anything about Starr as a person, but in that moment I absolutely loathed her anyway. 

[jsbt]

I can dog Starr about many, many things but I'm sure she wouldn't have ever said that to Sam; I can see her potentially revising it for strangers (or not).

I also would've wanted to see Starr reinvented as something of a cosmetics-corporate tycoon a la Kim Kardashian with a science and research angle to her company's pursuits, not dissimilar to what Y&R used to do with Ashley Abbott in the lab and all that (not that Starr is a patch on Ashley Abbott). And she'd often be a real bitch. Kristen is best at that, even if she hated playing it as she got older. She always looked better with dark hair too, the one saving grace of her second stint at GH.

Edited September 24, 2022 by jsbt

[Panopticon]

Eh, I see Starr downgrading her relationship from with Sam from siblings to cousins in any context* as a betrayal of both Sam and Blair. I could see Starr doing it because Starr could be horrendous about Blair sometimes... but I can't give her a pass in-universe. Saying "my brother thinks such-and-such" is not going to confuse a stranger where "my cousin thinks such-and-such" would not.

*Excluding lying to someone who wanted to hurt Sam to get to Starr, etc.

[TeeVee329]

On 9/24/2022 at 12:40 PM, jsbt said:

She (Kristen Alderson) always looked better with dark hair too, the one saving grace of her second stint at GH.

Agreed, the only "see, totally different character!" hair styling choice that worked when the OLTL 3 came back to GH.

Speaking of, I'll take this opportunity to once again say that the ending for John McBain the whole kerfuffle led to - him disappearing alone into an endless undercover FBI assignment - was extremely true to who John is IMO.

[jsbt]

8 hours ago, TeeVee329 said:

Speaking of, I'll take this opportunity to once again say that the ending for John McBain the whole kerfuffle led to - him disappearing alone into an endless undercover FBI assignment - was extremely true to who John is IMO.

I agree.

[Guest]

On 9/29/2022 at 8:44 PM, TeeVee329 said:

Speaking of, I'll take this opportunity to once again say that the ending for John McBain the whole kerfuffle led to - him disappearing alone into an endless undercover FBI assignment - was extremely true to who John is IMO.

If only he had done that after Jared died. Or even slightly before Jared died.

[mason86]

they should've had langston emancipated instead of going through all that with her uncle

[UYI]

JARED & NATALIE REUNION INCOMING!

[jsbt]

Somebody has got to ask these two about the fuckery that went down with their storyline in 2009. They got a barely-onscreen wedding and were then very firmly backburnered til JB was fired, with a lot of onscreen hints of conflict with Jessica post-Tess, etc. that did not ultimately play out.

Edited November 17, 2022 by jsbt

[TeeVee329]

There were little things in that slow 2009 period that I'm curious if were meant to blossom into more.  Like, I remember Kim having a very big reaction to meeting Jared, thinking he was super hot, maybe Kim was going to try and work an angle there vs. Clint in some original plan.  And there were Nat and Jared's interactions with Kyle, which I always loved.  Brett Claywell and John Brotherton are, by Instagram accounts, good friends to this day so I've always wondered if there was more story there too.  And yes, it's sucks that they veered away from a more grounded conflict between them and Jessica post-the 2008 Tess rampage.

Edited November 19, 2022 by TeeVee329

[jsbt]

On 11/19/2022 at 5:28 AM, TeeVee329 said:

There were little things in that slow 2009 period that I'm curious if were meant to blossom into more.

IIRC there was a literal spoiler in the mags around the same period that summer which indicated Viki and Charlie (just after marrying) were considering adoption. I thought that potentially would've been a huge deal and something fresh, to add a young and unconnected child to the core family mix for two older characters a la Tad on AMC, but whatever it was meant to indicate it mysteriously never aired.

[TeeVee329]

3 hours ago, jsbt said:

IIRC there was a literal spoiler in the mags around the same period that summer which indicated Viki and Charlie (just after marrying) were considering adoption. I thought that potentially would've been a huge deal and something fresh, to add a young and unconnected child to the core family mix for two older characters a la Tad on AMC, but whatever it was meant to indicate it mysteriously never aired.

Didn't Viki take in Markko that summer, after he had gotten kicked out of his house for his relationship with Lang?

That aside, I wouldn't be surprised - given Frank or Frons or both were hot on keeping Starr and her peer group front and center - if they considered giving Viki and Charlie an adopted child in that age range so they could be involved in those teen dramas versus having stories of their own.

[NatsumeRika]

Hello there!  I've been trying to find any record of Jesse Corti's character Julio who would have been seen in the old 1991 episodes.  There doesn't seem to be any information on who is character was, how many episodes he was in, or anything at all, really.  Would anyone happen to know?  Thank you so much!

[BlueSkies]

I love Kassie

 

Im watching some old clips of her with the Blair, Todd, and Eli storylines.  Can someone be kind enough to explain the context of it all 

[Dandesun]

On 12/21/2022 at 4:34 AM, BlueSkies said:

I love Kassie

 

Im watching some old clips of her with the Blair, Todd, and Eli storylines.  Can someone be kind enough to explain the context of it all 

I may need some context for your context. What is it you're looking for?

[BlueSkies]

3 hours ago, Dandesun said:

I may need some context for your context. What is it you're looking for?

it looks like Blair had a fight with Todd and is living at her house while aggressively perusing/seducing Eli 

[Dandesun]

Blair was absolutely free and single when she started hooking up with Eli. At that point, she was DONE with Vic!Todd but they decided to make Blair get a little dog in manger regarding Tea to, I suppose, 'keep things interesting' or whatever.

Tea was in the process of dumping VicTodd (or just separating for awhile?) because Dani hated him so much when Blair and Eli first banged it out. The problem was that Blair and Eli were super fun and hot and sexy and people responded to that which I don't think the powers that be wanted.

Basically, VicTodd was Blair's sad sack ex who couldn't be with his Twu Wuv Tea. And Blair was briefly living in Rapehaus (VicTodd's new place with the shitty cow print rug) because... was that post Powell and nuRebecca's brief moment of 'oh for fuck's sake, really? these guys?' to make us feel really really really bad for VicTodd after the fucking Rapemance shit with Marty.

Seriously, Blair and Eli were the best part of that nonsense.

[TeeVee329]

3 hours ago, Dandesun said:

And Blair was briefly living in Rapehaus (VicTodd's new place with the shitty cow print rug) because... was that post Powell and nuRebecca's brief moment of 'oh for fuck's sake, really? these guys?' to make us feel really really really bad for VicTodd after the fucking Rapemance shit with Marty.

Blair was at VicTodd's because Dorian, threatened by Mitch Laurence, used her power as mayor to free Lowell, the former mayor who had had Starr and Hope kidnapped as part of his drug ring.  All the Carmers turned on Dor and moved into VicTodd's, though Starr, Lang, and Hope all fled to Cole and Markko's apartment pretty soon after.

I do remember we were all VERY concerned that Blair was again getting leftovers because Eli had rather inexplicably turned on brother Ross to support slash moon at Tea over the Dani sitch.  But yeah, Blair and Eli ended up being hot and fun and adult before it was torched that summer of teens, Teens, TEENS.

[Melgaypet]

On 12/28/2022 at 7:18 PM, TeeVee329 said:

Blair was at VicTodd's because Dorian, threatened by Mitch Laurence, used her power as mayor to free Lowell, the former mayor who had had Starr and Hope kidnapped as part of his drug ring.  All the Carmers turned on Dor and moved into VicTodd's, though Starr, Lang, and Hope all fled to Cole and Markko's apartment pretty soon after.

I do remember we were all VERY concerned that Blair was again getting leftovers because Eli had rather inexplicably turned on brother Ross to support slash moon at Tea over the Dani sitch.  But yeah, Blair and Eli ended up being hot and fun and adult before it was torched that summer of teens, Teens, TEENS.

Ah, when Mitch Laurence was somehow omniscient (except about one Very Relevant Detail) and Dorian had to be outplayed and isolated. Blair would have been able to figure out what was going on if the writers had allowed her to think about it for ten seconds and poor Cassie was relegated to a cliffhanger where she drank possibly poisoned eggnog or something and Andrew showed up to report that she wasn't dead. The three of them should have teamed up to take Mitch down. No, scratch that - Dorian and Viki should have teamed up. Instead, Dorian enlisted Charlie in an asinine plan to kill Mitch that ended with Jessica getting shot, Viki did nothing that I recall, VicTodd and Blair seemed barely aware that Mitch was in town (not that I wasn't thoroughly sick of VicTodd by that time, but Mitch Laurence being back should have been a Red Alert situation), and goddamn John McBain was made into Mitch's nemesis despite having no history with Mitch whatsoever.

ANYWAY. We were talking about Blair and Eli, right? I remember how hilarious the juxtaposition of their first sex scene was with VicTodd and Tea's (not really) last one. Clearly, it was supposed to be the noble and unfairly parted true lovers saying a poignant goodbye compared to the pathetic, slutty, also-rans jumping into bed to distract themselves from the ones who didn't want them. EXCEPT, it played like the most miserable, maudlin sex ever next to an amazing, orgasmic good time. Remember how Blair and Eli just destroyed the room? The scratches down Eli's back?

If the purpose was to forget Tea, it certainly worked for Eli. He was all about Blair from then on. It was a refreshing change. Of course the writers ruined it, because we Blair can't have nice things.

Edited December 30, 2022 by Melgaypet

[TeeVee329]

9 hours ago, Melgaypet said:

Remember how Blair and Eli just destroyed the room?

And if I'm remembering right, Rex sought Eli out in the next episode because Gigi had chosen Schuyler so asshole decided he should get full custody of the child Gigi raised alone for 90% of his life.  Anyway, Eli took said meeting in the trashed hotel room, which was funny.

[jsbt]

Then of course Eli ended up being some sort of many-aliases serial killer who had committed literally every lingering crime in town and killed many women or something all over the country. I don't even remember the exact details and I have a good memory for this dumb shit.

By the writing team's own admission they had no idea who had done half of those recent crimes (like Marty being pushed down the stairs to miscarry) when they first wrote them so they ended up later finding some weird-ass twist for Eli after the fact because they didn't care about him or Blair. The showrunners' rooting interest at that time in that section of the canvas was solely with Victor/Todd and Téa; whenever the audience got into something organically they'd either overplay it and wreck it or try to actively subvert or undermine it. Eli was the latter. I still remember Matt Walton talking about Bob Woods' baffled reaction to the sudden twist BTS.

[TeeVee329]

On 1/5/2023 at 11:00 AM, jsbt said:

Then of course Eli ended up being some sort of many-aliases serial killer who had committed literally every lingering crime in town and killed many women or something all over the country. I don't even remember the exact details and I have a good memory for this dumb shit.

Remember how they out-of-nowhere looped in comatose Evangeline just to kill her off to give Cris and Layla a two-episode story?

I do remember, at the time, Ron claimed it had been all planned, but then later (maybe after the ABC run had wrapped?) admitted they had story gaps because they had to write out Rachel/Kim/Schuyler/Kyle/Fish and thus Marty went down the hospital stairs with no set idea on who had done it.

[jsbt]

2 hours ago, TeeVee329 said:

I do remember, at the time, Ron claimed it had been all planned, but then later (maybe after the ABC run had wrapped?) admitted they had story gaps because they had to write out Rachel/Kim/Schuyler/Kyle/Fish and thus Marty went down the hospital stairs with no set idea on who had done it.

He sure did. Ridiculous.

It was totally unnecessary to off Van during that. But the whole thing was unnecessary.

[Melgaypet]

They also made Eli the one who bashed Ford in the head. Out of nowhere, for a reason the audience knew nothing about, despite having several viable suspects. Jessica, Langston, Markko, Dorian, Hannah (again!), the Pizza Girl. All tied to Ford being a skank ho (and in Jessica's case, a rapist).

Apparently Ford somehow knew about Eli being Pure Evil and was blackmailing him over it (which was conveniently forgotten when it was time for Ford's insta-redemption). Eli didn't even succeed in killing him! Insult to injury, making him evil and incompetent.

ETA: As for Van, the obvious, soapy move was to recast and bring her out of her coma to cause trouble for Cris and Layla.

Edited January 8, 2023 by Melgaypet