Maci

[Caracoa1]

Maci has 3 illegitimate children and drank throughout her last pregnancy....she didn't expose Ryan because she didn't want that thrown in her face.

[lexiexx]

6 hours ago, LotusFlower said:

That's all Ryan's doing.  

No, that's half Maci's doing.   She was so horrified with Farrah being on the show that she wanted to pull Bentley off because of what people would think.   Or so she said.  Now it's okay that he is the kid with the dad who nods out while driving and a history of drug use?   That's convenient.  

[Tatum]

8 hours ago, lexiexx said:

I don't think any of them care about insulting viewers, I wouldn't.   These people have real lives outside of the show.  Once again, consider Bentley and his own personal life.   He doesn't deserve to be known as the kid of a drug addict, this footage is never going to go away.   Nice stigma to put on an 8 year old kid.  

 

7 hours ago, LotusFlower said:

That's all Ryan's doing.  

 

I understand your point @LotusFlower, that Ryan is the one with the embarrassing behavior (with regards to drugs), so the onus should be on him to decline being filmed until he gets himself straightened out, not Maci. However, we all know Ryan doesn't give a shit about what's best for Bentley, at least not when it's up against Ryan's own convenience and comfort. Ryan has never done right by Bentley and probably never will. At the point where it becomes clear that Ryan is not going to do the right thing, then it does become Maci's responsibility.

 

Is that fair, that she should have to miss out on a paycheck because Ryan is perfectly comfortable airing his issues onscreen? No, just like it wasn't fair that Maci couldn't get her studying done back in 2009 because Ryan refused to change one diaper or give Bentley one bottle so Maci could work undistracted. Maci has plenty to be angry at Ryan about. That said, Maci is an adult, Bentley isn't, and if it comes down to Maci having to do more than her share of work or sacrifice a paycheck (that she really shouldn't need at this point), vs. Bentley being hungry, in pain, or humiliated in front of his classmates over his ridiculous father, then Maci has to suck it up and deal.

 

And really, I wouldn't even be so hard on Maci (having a druggie father is embarrassing, but children of parents who committed greater crimes still survive) if she hadn't shrieked and hollered about Farrah's return to Teen Mom. Sher made her bed trying to make her vendetta against Farrah about her own personal morals, and now she has to hold herself to the same standard with regards to Ryan.

[ReadMeLattice]

9 hours ago, lexiexx said:

  

the general public isn't entitled to know Ryan's personal/medical issues even if he is on a reality show.  

I mean...they are, imo. Otherwise he doesn't deserve his paycheck. There are plenty of deadbeat baby daddies with drug problems. They are afforded privacy Ryan gives up when he signs up for a reality show season after season and takes MTV money. That's the point of a reality show. People give up their privacy and get paid to do it. Amber's addiction, Catelynn's mental health problems, Tyler's inability to respect adoption boundaries, and even the positives like Chelsea's relationship with Cole aren't "our business" either. They made it our business when they signed up for an MTV reality show. The dads and family members sign up or don't just like the moms and negotiate paychecks and screen time. They've done it for many years, they know full well it's about the drama. If you're a hardcore drug addict or the partner or parent of one, don't sign up. Easy enough. 

Edited July 5, 2017 by Lm2162

[Tatum]

19 minutes ago, Lm2162 said:

I mean...they are, imo. Otherwise he doesn't deserve his paycheck. There are plenty of deadbeat baby daddies with drug problems. They are afforded privacy Ryan gives up when he signs up for a reality show season after season and takes MTV money. That's the point of a reality show. People give up their privacy and get paid to do it. Amber's addiction, Catelynn's mental health problems, Tyler's inability to respect adoption boundaries, and even the positives like Chelsea's relationship with Cole aren't "our business" either. They made it our business when they signed up for an MTV reality show. The dads and family members sign up or don't just like the moms and negotiate paychecks and screen time. They've done it for many years, they know full well it's about the drama. If you're a hardcore drug addict or the partner or parent of one, don't sign up. Easy enough. 

Thank you! That drives me crazy when real celebrities and pseudo celebrities like these losers are like, please give me all the benefits of fame (money, free doo-dads, comp'd vacations, clothes, jewelry, meals, etc.), but also allow me complete privacy when it suits me, and I still reserve the right to bitch about any of the pitfalls of fame, despite how much I like (and take full advantage of) the benefits. It's even more obnoxious when it's reality stars pulling this. At least overpaid athletes, actors, musicians, etc. provide some form of entertainment and do some sort of physical work in exchange for their paycheck. For Ryan, the Teen Moms, the Kardashians, etc.- being in the public is their talent (cough).

 

However, I think @lexiexx's point was not that Ryan deserves privacy for his own sake, but for Bentley's. If Ryan is willing to make an ass of himself on TV for a few bucks, that's all fine and well, but it's not just Ryan who feels the embarrassment and Bentley isn't getting compensated for his embarrassment nor was it his decision to allow it.  At that point, someone else needs to step up and say enough is enough.

[ReadMeLattice]

I agree with that last point but we could say that about any child on this show. Imo it's wrong to involve your kid in reality TV to begin with, especially because the reason you're on reality TV is likely because there's an embarrassing family problem. 

[Tatum]

Well yes, when it comes to that, none of these people have a leg to stand on. Maci is only getting singled out because of that little bitch fit she threw last season.

[jacksgirl]

Read about how Maverick has silent reflux (Can't link well on this device and on treadmill). All I want to do is scream at her and ask of maybe it's linked to pounding Bud Lites until 20 weeks pregnant. I despise her. Sanctimonious Idiot. 

[ReadMeLattice]

2 minutes ago, Tatum said:

Well yes, when it comes to that, none of these people have a leg to stand on. Maci is only getting singled out because of that little bitch fit she threw last season.

Yeah, that's what drives me nuts. It makes all of her behavior now way less understandable. If she hadn't acted so high and mighty I'd "get her" a lot more now. I still don't think she has any fault in the "Ryan's family" situation at all, and I do believe that Ryan's drug use has recently escalated beyond a point where it ever was before, but she really shouldn't throw stones from a glass house in terms of righteousness compared to Farrah, etc.  

Edited July 5, 2017 by Lm2162

[MissMel]

7 minutes ago, Lm2162 said:

I agree with that last point but we could say that about any child on this show. Imo it's wrong to involve your kid in reality TV to begin with, especially because the reason you're on reality TV is likely because there's an embarrassing family problem. 

Bolding mine.  I think that's key here, 'to begin with'.  That horse has done left the barn.  What good will it do to shut the door now?  Kids have to deal with all sorts of crap growing up but, hopefully, they have a 'normal' to center on.  For these kids, this is their normal.   Cameras, the crew, the show?  All normal to them.

As far as Maci goes, I don't know.  I agree she hasn't made the best decisions but she doesn't really have a reference to make more informed ones, does she?  She also doesn't hide her drinking.  We see it every episode.  She even said they argue after the cameras leave.  Have we heard why Larry cut Ryan off and say he's done with him, wouldn't piss on him if he was on fire, and if Jen doesn't like it she can leave?  What about Ryan killing cats and posting it?  The house got searched, too.  Nobody searches a house for allen wrenches or gets kicked out over them.  We all know know those things multiply like wet gremlins after midnight so, what's up there?

Look, my kids could've/would've/should've had things better than they did.  I screwed some things up.  I tried though.  One thing I can say is we always had one majorly important rule.  No secrets.  That cuts both ways, Lol.  I'd hate to be in Maci's situation though.  Who knew this show would even happen or go on for so long?  All her mistakes are magnified.  And on record for Bentley to see.  I think I'd rather have the cameras around and force Ryan's issues out into the light than have three households shooshing him to keep their secrects from the other two households he spends time in.  I really think that would be far more damaging in the long run for him.  Just my two cents.  Take it for it's worth.  :)

[ghoulina]

2 hours ago, Caracoa1 said:

Maci has 3 illegitimate children and drank throughout her last pregnancy....she didn't expose Ryan because she didn't want that thrown in her face.

Can we not call her kids illegitimate? That kind of word hurts the children more than anything. They're real kids and they can't help how they were brought into the world. While Maci may very likely have used pregnancies to lock down her husband, I just hate the notion that children born to unmarried parents are in some way less "real" than children born to married parents. Not all parents can get married. Not all people believe in the institution of marriage. I wasn't married when my first was born, but I've been with his father (and father of my other 2 children) for 11 years now, and we'll be married 9 years next month. Is he somehow less legitimate than his brother and sister? Poor Bentley has already had his pecker and poop talked about on camera. Jayde's potty training has been filmed. Do we really need to degrade these innocent kids any further? 

[ReadMeLattice]

6 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

Can we not call her kids illegitimate? That kind of word hurts the children more than anything. They're real kids and they can't help how they were brought into the world. While Maci may very likely have used pregnancies to lock down her husband, I just hate the notion that children born to unmarried parents are in some way less "real" than children born to married parents. Not all parents can get married. Not all people believe in the institution of marriage. I wasn't married when my first was born, but I've been with his father (and father of my other 2 children) for 11 years now, and we'll be married 9 years next month. Is he somehow less legitimate than his brother and sister? Poor Bentley has already had his pecker and poop talked about on camera. Jayde's potty training has been filmed. Do we really need to degrade these innocent kids any further? 

Plus, around half (by some calculations, most) of children born in the U.S. are now "illegitimate" by the "unmarried parents" definition. At this point it's actually statistically just as typical for kids to be born outside of marriage as in one. This doesn't mean Maci's choices for procreation patterns are positive or ones I agree with, but they are not atypical. That's the reality. What kills me is how she *pretends* to be traditional, but that's another story.

Edited July 5, 2017 by Lm2162

[EmeraldGirl]

I'm torn on all of this. I personally would call this the time to pull the plug for Bentley's sake. It's one thing to be a preschooler with Maci's silly early non-drama, but this is serious shit. The father who never gave him two seconds of attention is a raging drug addict. And his new wife decided to play it as a helpless victim to the evil Maci. And Maci started out liking her - probably hoping she might be the one to help Ryan.  Bentley needs not be a part of those two messes.  I know Maci went with the storyline of wanting Ryan more involved, but that'll be her mistake to live with for going with that storyline.

I'm assuming his previous issues were kept quiet because the family asked it to be. It's a touchy situation, but it wasn't Maci's place to out it on tv.  This year MTV got scary film and probably announced they were going to run it. Some of us knew all along, but there was a large element who thought he had a TBI. Well, the hopefully not dead cat is out of the bag now.

Bentley needs some privacy. I know it's hard to pass up that huge amount of money, plus publicity for their company that is apparently doing ok business. But I'm guessing they'll all go with the public service announcement angle.  I feel for Jen and Larry. I was getting sick of their entitlement around getting Bentley, but the devastation on their faces at that wedding was painful to me.  I have adults sons, and sometimes I think that there but for the grace of whatever go all of us. 

[ghoulina]

I agree. As much as I can't seem to stop watching this show, I think it would be best to quit filming once the children start school. They deserve privacy; they didn't sign up for this. It's one thing if you're a Chelsea and most of your scenes are light hearted and fun. But you can't tell me that some of Bentley's peers don't now know about his poop aversion or that some of Leah's schoolmates haven't seen the rages her mother flies into. It's not cool. 

[jacksgirl]

DGAF if these former teen moms are married, single, or in a relationship. For the kids sake, I want to see these women  in healthy relationships with their parents, family members and significant others. Sofia doesn't have this, Leah does (no thanks to Amber), Bentley does and Carly most likely does. 

[GreatKazu]

That has been the point made all along - Maci's sanctimonious and hypocritical judmental behavior.

I was the one who nentioned the Farrah hypocrisy right when Ryan's drug issue was finally confirmed. And @Tatum noted what I pointed out long ago - Ryan is a druggie. He can't make proper decisions. Therefore, Maci, being the more responsible one (ha!) of the two, needs to make the decision for Bentley as to what is in his best interest. Just like it was all on Mackenzie to have kept Ryan off the road, which she failed to do. 

Maci, unfortunately, is put in the position to have to call the shots due to Ryan's incapacitation and his lack of desire to parent.

Sadly, Maci chose Ryan as Bentley's dad, she is now stuck having to deal with those consequences. Not that Maci minds being in control, but now she needs to get her ass in gear and follow through with what she needs to do, and yet, it appears she is not doing it. 

I think the Bud Lites are being chugged a lot more with all this drama going on.

Edited July 5, 2017 by GreatKazu

[Tatum]

26 minutes ago, GreatKazu said:

That has been the point made all along - Maci's sanctimonious and hypocritical judmental behavior.

 

Right...this isn't a case of everyone else can do whatever the fuck they want onscreen, consequences to their kids be damned, but Maci is responsible for not only her own behavior, but of everyone else's related to Bentley. This is a case of Maci opening that can of worms herself when she decided that Bentley appearing on the same show as someone who had made a porno was completely inappropriate. Once she tried to claim the moral high ground (on a show where no one has cause to claim the moral high ground), she set herself up for being held to a higher standard than everyone else. A standard which she has repeatedly failed to meet.

 

I've pretty much despised Maci since she went on a campaign against Farrah. Although we all know porn itself wasn't Maci's issue, it was what she claimed motivated her. The underlying implication being, that being filmed having anal sex is somehow much more shameful than druge abuse, child abuse, child endangerment, domestic violence, animal abuse, etc. At the end of the day, I bet Maci still considers being the child of a porn actress to be more embarrassing than being the child of a druggie. As a somewhat feminist, this offends me.

Edited July 5, 2017 by Tatum

[jacksgirl]

Tatum and Greatkazu, totes agree. In fact,  Maci may be the worst of them all with her "I'm better than you" attitude.  I'm actually willing to cut Mack some slack about the whole letter, she's a novice in the Teen Mom world. For everyone's sake, I hope rehab has and will continue to be successful for Ryan. A sober and healthy Ryan is good for everyone including the drivers of the state of Tennessee. Sad Panda is worthless.

[ReadMeLattice]

9 minutes ago, jacksgirl said:

 I'm actually willing to cut Mack some slack about the whole letter, she's a novice in the Teen Mom world. 

She sure is trying to fit in (or be a breakout star) with a dramatic walk-off though, lol. It's like foundational TM to have someone walk off every reunion. Like a quota.

I loved Amber's threat to walk off that even Dr. Worthless pretty much ignored. Girl, you're way over your walk-off limit, nobody cares anymore.

Edited July 5, 2017 by Lm2162

[lexiexx]

4 hours ago, Lm2162 said:

I mean...they are, imo. Otherwise he doesn't deserve his paycheck. There are plenty of deadbeat baby daddies with drug problems. They are afforded privacy Ryan gives up when he signs up for a reality show season after season and takes MTV money. That's the point of a reality show. People give up their privacy and get paid to do it. Amber's addiction, Catelynn's mental health problems, Tyler's inability to respect adoption boundaries, and even the positives like Chelsea's relationship with Cole aren't "our business" either. They made it our business when they signed up for an MTV reality show. The dads and family members sign up or don't just like the moms and negotiate paychecks and screen time. They've done it for many years, they know full well it's about the drama. If you're a hardcore drug addict or the partner or parent of one, don't sign up. Easy enough. 

Ryan isn't even capable of staying in his own lane when driving. He was in a very bad place.  I just feel like there should be some kind of boundaries when it comes to something that serious when Bentley is going to be the one to pay the price for it more than the adults will.   It's more serious than typical baby daddy drama at that point in my opinion.  

[lexiexx]

4 hours ago, Lm2162 said:

I agree with that last point but we could say that about any child on this show. Imo it's wrong to involve your kid in reality TV to begin with, especially because the reason you're on reality TV is likely because there's an embarrassing family problem. 

I think the main point in calling out Maci's kids born out of wedlock is that she has been trying to get married and have another kid since Kyle.   

Just because these moms have put their kids out there when they shouldn't have doesn't mean it has to go on.   Lots of kids consider messed up lifestyles to be normal because it's all they know but gat doesn't make it any better.  

[ReadMeLattice]

26 minutes ago, lexiexx said:

Ryan isn't even capable of staying in his own lane when driving. He was in a very bad place.  I just feel like there should be some kind of boundaries when it comes to something that serious when Bentley is going to be the one to pay the price for it more than the adults will.   It's more serious than typical baby daddy drama at that point in my opinion.  

I agree, but I don't see how his driving is particularly Maci's fault for "exposing?" She wasn't even there. And he's ultimately the one I find most responsible. Not his parents, not Mackenzie, not Maci, him. I get that addiction is a messed up thing but there are several addicts on this show. We saw Amber beat up her partner on-screen and I wouldn't call her "exploited" for having her bad behavior exposed even though she was high at the time. He's endangering others too. I just don't have any sympathy for him when he's still calling his ex psycho and his wife is still defending him. Maybe focus on your own problems bro. Maci's a bitch who should take him to court and his family and wife (who also has a child she probably exposes to him) are whiny enablers, but ultimately he's the one endangering people and any embarrassment he feels is on him. I'm assuming he knew full well he was still using every time he signed up for the show. I don't feel bad for Catelynn being put down for driving drunk, for Maci being insulted for drinking pregnant, etc., so I don't feel bad for him either. It's not like it's a sudden radical shift and he was a great responsible dad before. 

Edited July 5, 2017 by Lm2162

[LotusFlower]

6 hours ago, lexiexx said:

No, that's half Maci's doing.   She was so horrified with Farrah being on the show that she wanted to pull Bentley off because of what people would think.   Or so she said.  Now it's okay that he is the kid with the dad who nods out while driving and a history of drug use?   That's convenient.  

 

4 hours ago, Tatum said:

I understand your point @LotusFlower, that Ryan is the one with the embarrassing behavior (with regards to drugs), so the onus should be on him to decline being filmed until he gets himself straightened out, not Maci. However, we all know Ryan doesn't give a shit about what's best for Bentley, at least not when it's up against Ryan's own convenience and comfort. Ryan has never done right by Bentley and probably never will. At the point where it becomes clear that Ryan is not going to do the right thing, then it does become Maci's responsibility.

I think people's dislike of Maci colors their view of the addiction issue.  The whole Farrah/porn thing was ridiculous (and it was all MTV's fault, but they put it all on Maci....but that's a whole other story), but I think it's conflating two very different issues.  Ryan, and Ryan alone, is responsible for his drug use, and his parents and Mackenzie are responsible for their enabling.  He's the one that's embarrassing himself and his family, including his son.  But on that subject, why are you attaching such shame to the problem?  We're in the midst of an opioids crisis, and drug addiction is rampant and commonplace.  I've been really hard on Ryan because of the non-parent that he's always been, but I can also sympathize with his plight because he's dealing with a disease.  What's Amber's excuse?  How 'bout Janelle?  Try having them as parents.  We can debate Maci's sanctimony re: Farrah's porn, but I think comparing it to Ryan's drug use is a hard line to take in regard to addiction issues.

I also don't understand saying Maci is the responsible parent, so it's up to her to yank Bentley off the show, or stop filming altogether.  Um - yea - to all of that, for all of them.  But then there wouldn't be a show.  And frankly, I don't think any of us who watch the show have any ground to stand on to say this.  Yes, MTV is exploiting these kids, but every viewer is complicit in what's happening.  

[Tatum]

43 minutes ago, LotusFlower said:

 

I think people's dislike of Maci colors their view of the addiction issue.  The whole Farrah/porn thing was ridiculous (and it was all MTV's fault, but they put it all on Maci....but that's a whole other story), but I think it's conflating two very different issues.  Ryan, and Ryan alone, is responsible for his drug use, and his parents and Mackenzie are responsible for their enabling.  He's the one that's embarrassing himself and his family, including his son.  But on that subject, why are you attaching such shame to the problem?  We're in the midst of an opioids crisis, and drug addiction is rampant and commonplace.  I've been really hard on Ryan because of the non-parent that he's always been, but I can also sympathize with his plight because he's dealing with a disease.  What's Amber's excuse?  How 'bout Janelle?  Try having them as parents.  We can debate Maci's sanctimony re: Farrah's porn, but I think comparing it to Ryan's drug use is a hard line to take in regard to addiction issues.

I also don't understand saying Maci is the responsible parent, so it's up to her to yank Bentley off the show, or stop filming altogether.  Um - yea - to all of that, for all of them.  But then there wouldn't be a show.  And frankly, I don't think any of us who watch the show have any ground to stand on to say this.  Yes, MTV is exploiting these kids, but every viewer is complicit in what's happening.  

I don't see how Maci wasn't at fault for the Farrah thing. I don't think MTV put that on her at all. She's the one who threw the hypocritical snit about Farrah and stomped off.

 

No one is blaming Maci for Ryan's drug use. If the stance is that Ryan's behavior is embarrassing (or perhaps embarrassing is the wrong word to use, but in some causing harm, I'll just say) to Bentley (and that was what was stated on the previous page), and Ryan isn't going to back off from MTV's check, then maybe Maci should. By that I mean if Maci declines to film, that will automatically end Ryan's own involvement with the show, as Teen Mom isn't going to film Ryan without Maci. Both will have the affect of getting Ryan off the air. And while I agree that using the word "embarrassing" or "shame" might seem harsh with regards to drug addiction, the truth is that addiction can make you do things that probably aren't great to be filmed. I mean, alcoholism is as much a disease as drug addiction, yet I bet David Hasselhoff's daughters were pretty mortified at released footage of him drunkenly rolling around on the floor eating cheeseburgers.

 

And yes, they've all made poor decisions. As I stated before, Maci is only being singled out because she chose to declare herself the morality queen last season. Really, her whole appearance on this season, without even considering Ryan's drug use, is not in line with what she spouted last season.

 

And I will have to disagree with you that viewers cannot point out the damage these parents (nearly all of them) are causing these kids in the long run by appearing on this show, just because the viewers watch the show. These kids are underage and their parents should be making better decisions for them. That is on the parents, not the production crew, not MTV, not the viewers.

Edited July 5, 2017 by Tatum

[LotusFlower]

.  

14 minutes ago, Tatum said:

No one is blaming Maci for Ryan's drug use. If the stance is that Ryan's behavior is embarrassing (or perhaps embarrassing is the wrong word to use, but in some causing harm, I'll just say) to Bentley (and that was what was stated on the previous page), and Ryan isn't going to back off from MTV's check, then maybe Maci should.

How do you know that Ryan embarrasses Bentley?  Has he ever said so?  Implied as much?  Or are you just assuming?  My guess is that he's more embarrassed that his mother talked about his pooping at school as opposed to his father's behavior.  Will he be embarrassed in the future?  Maybe, but again, that applies to all the kids, about everything.

19 minutes ago, Tatum said:

And I will have to disagree with you that viewers cannot point out the damage these parents (nearly all of them) are causing these kids in the long run by appearing on this show, just because the viewers watch the show. These kids are underage and their parents should be making better decisions for them. That is on the parents, not the production crew, not MTV, not the viewers.

You can point out anything you want (I do!)  But it's just so hypocritical to watch a show exploiting teen moms and their kids while complaining that a teen mom is exploiting her kid!  

25 minutes ago, Tatum said:

I don't see how Maci wasn't at fault for the Farrah thing. I don't think MTV put that on her at all. She's the one who threw the hypocritical snit about Farrah and stomped off.

Maci is responsible for everything she said and did re: Farrah.  I just think MTV used her.  They're the ones that fired Farrah.  The other girls apparently agreed or were ok with it, but it was MTV's decision.  Halfway through filming, they reversed course, and needed to address the topic, but Farrah wouldn't cooperate (remember they brought it up with her, she started to cry out of embarrassment and stormed off.  She told the producers it was their responsibility to explain their decision, and it was one of the few times I agreed with her).  The producers were then stuck, cuz the show needs narrative and storyline, so as soon as Maci threw her little snit - they jumped all over it.  Yes, Maci said what she said, but MTV used it and made it into a much bigger deal solely as a way to explain their back-and-forth decision.  It bothered me at the time because they got off totally scott-free, and it was ALL their decision.  

[Tatum]

1 minute ago, LotusFlower said:

.  

How do you know that Ryan embarrasses Bentley?  Has he ever said so?  Implied as much?  Or are you just assuming?  My guess is that he's more embarrassed that his mother talked about his pooping at school as opposed to his father's behavior.  Will he be embarrassed in the future?  Maybe, but again, that applies to all the kids, about everything.

You can point out anything you want (I do!)  But it's just so hypocritical to watch a show exploiting teen moms and their kids while complaining that a teen mom is exploiting her kid!  

Maci is responsible for everything she said and did re: Farrah.  I just think MTV used her.  They're the ones that fired Farrah.  The other girls apparently agreed or were ok with it, but it was MTV's decision.  Halfway through filming, they reversed course, and needed to address the topic, but Farrah wouldn't cooperate (remember they brought it up with her, she started to cry out of embarrassment and stormed off.  She told the producers it was their responsibility to explain their decision, and it was one of the few times I agreed with her).  The producers were then stuck, cuz the show needs narrative and storyline, so as soon as Maci threw her little snit - they jumped all over it.  Yes, Maci said what she said, but MTV used it and made it into a much bigger deal solely as a way to explain their back-and-forth decision.  It bothered me at the time because they got off totally scott-free, and it was ALL their decision.  

I don't know that Ryan embarrasses Bentley. I don't even really have an opinion on whether he does or not. Or even a guess. My point was, you were asking on the previous page why Maci should have to be the one to leave the show when Ryan is the one with the problem. And my answer was, if the argument is that Ryan's involvement on the show will cause some kind of distress to Bentley, then Maci should leave the show because that will effectively terminate Ryan's involvement on the show. She can force him off the air just by declining the show herself. That's not very fair to her, but if (again, IF) the alternative is distress to Bentley, then I think she should still do it.

 

And I honestly don't see pointing out the exploitation as hypocrisy. Parents are the ones directly responsible for the well-being of their child. Sure, everyone could boycott the show, drive the ratings down, and get it cancelled. Sure, the producers could say, we are doing an awful thing, creating this show, and even though it's lucrative, for the sake of the kids, we should scrap this whole thing. And those both might be good things to happen. But at the end of the day, the parents are the ones directly responsible for their kids, and they have a greater culpability than either the producers or the viewers. Just my opinion.

 

As far as MTV blaming Maci, I don't know about that. I don't think they used Maci or tried to blame her for their decision to originally exclude Farrah. In fact, Maci specifically said prior to the season starting that it was not their (meaning the moms') choice to exclude Farrah, and they were sorry it worked out that way. I will agree, it was shitty (albeit hilarious to me, because I don't like her), of them to tell Maci, on camera, that Farrah was a part of the show, just so they could film her reaction and then air it. They did more or less instigate bad feelings between Maci and Farrah when Farrah might have otherwise assumed things between them were fine, but I don't think they did it to make it look like their decision to not have Farrah at first had anything to do with Maci. I think they just wanted ratings and a possible fight, come reunion time.

[LotusFlower]

39 minutes ago, Tatum said:

I don't know that Ryan embarrasses Bentley. I don't even really have an opinion on whether he does or not. Or even a guess. My point was, you were asking on the previous page why Maci should have to be the one to leave the show when Ryan is the one with the problem. And my answer was, if the argument is that Ryan's involvement on the show will cause some kind of distress to Bentley, then Maci should leave the show because that will effectively terminate Ryan's involvement on the show. She can force him off the air just by declining the show herself. That's not very fair to her, but if (again, IF) the alternative is distress to Bentley, then I think she should still do it.

No, I never asked any question about Maci leaving the show.  I only talked about the subject in relation to Ryan and his parents' role on the show, and Mackenzie's preposterous request for privacy.  And your post (and Lexixie's) talked about Maci, as the adult and responsible parent, needing to think of Bentley's best interest in regards to keeping him on the show, not if.  That's what I was responding to.

52 minutes ago, Tatum said:

And I honestly don't see pointing out the exploitation as hypocrisy. Parents are the ones directly responsible for the well-being of their child. Sure, everyone could boycott the show, drive the ratings down, and get it cancelled. Sure, the producers could say, we are doing an awful thing, creating this show, and even though it's lucrative, for the sake of the kids, we should scrap this whole thing. And those both might be good things to happen. But at the end of the day, the parents are the ones directly responsible for their kids, and they have a greater culpability than either the producers or the viewers. Just my opinion.

 

Of course parents are ultimately responsible for their kids, and this is a scenario with lots of exploitation going on. I'm simply saying we're complicit.  

57 minutes ago, Tatum said:

As far as MTV blaming Maci, I don't know about that. I don't think they used Maci or tried to blame her for their decision to originally exclude Farrah. In fact, Maci specifically said prior to the season starting that it was not their (meaning the moms') choice to exclude Farrah, and they were sorry it worked out that way. I will agree, it was shitty (albeit hilarious to me, because I don't like her), of them to tell Maci, on camera, that Farrah was a part of the show, just so they could film her reaction and then air it. They did more or less instigate bad feelings between Maci and Farrah when Farrah might have otherwise assumed things between them were fine, but I don't think they did it to make it look like their decision to not have Farrah at first had anything to do with Maci. I think they just wanted ratings and a possible fight, come reunion time.

Do you remember the scene when the producers explained their decision to fire and then rehire Farrah?  Yea, me neither, cuz it didn't happen.  (And this was the year that they started breaking the 4th wall).  But of course we all remember the scene when Maci threw her little fit, the scene backstage at the after show between the two, the drama at the reunion, etc...  I agree that they instigated bad feelings for the sake of drama, which I just think is gross, esp. since, as you pointed out, Maci didn't care that much.  But it was also shady and disingenuous.  Case in point - they needed or wanted to address the topic at the reunion, so they had Dr. Duh bring it up during Maci's segment (of course), and had him explain to her (as opposed to the studio and tv audience) that pursuing a career in porn is a real-life choice for some young women, and they're all about reality, y'all!  Maci got the lecture as a way of explaining their reversed decision.  Again - shady.

[Tatum]

26 minutes ago, LotusFlower said:

Do you remember the scene when the producers explained their decision to fire and then rehire Farrah?  Yea, me neither, cuz it didn't happen.  (And this was the year that they started breaking the 4th wall).  But of course we all remember the scene when Maci threw her little fit, the scene backstage at the after show between the two, the drama at the reunion, etc...  I agree that they instigated bad feelings for the sake of drama, which I just think is gross, esp. since, as you pointed out, Maci didn't care that much.  But it was also shady and disingenuous.  Case in point - they needed or wanted to address the topic at the reunion, so they had Dr. Duh bring it up during Maci's segment (of course), and had him explain to her (as opposed to the studio and tv audience) that pursuing a career in porn is a real-life choice for some young women, and they're all about reality, y'all!  Maci got the lecture as a way of explaining their reversed decision.  Again - shady.

I guess...but if you ask me, she willingly walked into that trap when she tried to claim that it was inappropriate for Bentley to be on the same show as someone who did porn. Her pride was wounded and she didn't want Farrah back, and she tried to cover it up by using porn as a convenient scapegoat.  Even Amber managed to keep her shit together long enough to say that she didn't have any room to judge anyone.

Should MTV/the production company have admitted their own hypocrisy instead of schooling Maci about a faulty way of thinking, a thinking in which they had previously shared? Yes, I agree that would have been best. But I still don't feel sorry for Maci that she was left holding the hypocrisy bag while MTV lectured her, like they weren't just as bad as she was, 3 months ago.

 

26 minutes ago, LotusFlower said:

No, I never asked any question about Maci leaving the show.  I only talked about the subject in relation to Ryan and his parents' role on the show, and Mackenzie's preposterous request for privacy.  And your post (and Lexixie's) talked about Maci, as the adult and responsible parent, needing to think of Bentley's best interest in regards to keeping him on the show, not if.  That's what I was responding to.

 

I misunderstood you then. I thought the conversation was about Ryan's behavior while being filmed that could someday cause distress to Bentley, and that he probably shouldn't be filmed. Maci can't force him to quit Teen Mom, but if she were to quit, Ryan would likely be punted as well, and that would achieve the goal of him not being on the show. But now I see the discussion was about whether or not Maci should have said anything about Ryan's issues, not whether or not Maci should use whatever is in her power to not allow Ryan's behavior to embarrass her son publicly. My bad.

My point in bringing Maci's fit last year was not so much to draw parallels between a porn career, a drug addiction, and other possible dubious behaviors, but to point out that she's the only one (that I've seen, I admit I don't watch either this or TM2 much anymore) that has directly commented on potential harm coming to her child by being involved on this show, yet she only seems to invoke this wisdom when it's convenient for her.

[LotusFlower]

3 hours ago, Tatum said:

 

 

Quote

I misunderstood you then. I thought the conversation was about Ryan's behavior while being filmed that could someday cause distress to Bentley, and that he probably shouldn't be filmed. Maci can't force him to quit Teen Mom, but if she were to quit, Ryan would likely be punted as well, and that would achieve the goal of him not being on the show. But now I see the discussion was about whether or not Maci should have said anything about Ryan's issues, not whether or not Maci should use whatever is in her power to not allow Ryan's behavior to embarrass her son publicly. My bad.

My point in bringing Maci's fit last year was not so much to draw parallels between a porn career, a drug addiction, and other possible dubious behaviors, but to point out that she's the only one (that I've seen, I admit I don't watch either this or TM2 much anymore) that has directly commented on potential harm coming to her child by being involved on this show, yet she only seems to invoke this wisdom when it's convenient for her.

Re: your first graph - no worries.  Re: your second - I agree.  (Hey, what do you know?!)  I'm no Maci fan, and I don't know how I suddenly became her defender.  In fact, I don't think I've ever posted in this thread, but I was gobsmacked after Mackenzie's open letter accusations to Maci, and there wasn't a reunion thread yet, so I just started typing away... I just couldn't believe Maci was getting blamed for Ryan's addiction, and for folks to start saying that things said on a reality show are embarrassing or invasive - it just brings up the ole hypocrisy claim.

Edited July 6, 2017 by LotusFlower

[GreatKazu]

4 hours ago, Tatum said:

My point in bringing Maci's fit last year was not so much to draw parallels between a porn career, a drug addiction, and other possible dubious behaviors, but to point out that she's the only one (that I've seen, I admit I don't watch either this or TM2 much anymore) that has directly commented on potential harm coming to her child by being involved on this show, yet she only seems to invoke this wisdom when it's convenient for her.

You are correct. I posted links to interviews Maci gave to MTV (those links are here on her page somewhere) regarding her issues with Farrah. Maci clearly stated she was having an issue with MTV potentially airing footage of Farrah at her job which at that time was at strip clubs. She was hosting various events. MTV was filming her at that time per several online sites. Maci stated her apprehension of MTV airing strip club footage while her son was on the show, was something that bothered her. I Googled a few of those online sites from that time period and they do mention MTV filming Farrah at those strip clubs for the upcoming season. That confirms what Maci stated. Maci must have read those same articles or got wind of what MTV was filming as far as Farrah was concerned. Going by that interview she gave, prior to the new season being completed, it appears Maci balked at MTV having any scenes relating to Farrah and her LEGIT job. We never did see any footage relating to Farrah's job at the club.

In fact, here is another clip I found of Maci. Keep in mind, we did watch Maci all over a stripper in Vegas during a scene of her bachelorette party. Isn't that a bit risque? Is that okay for her son to watch?

http://womanista.com/news/2017/05/30/teen-moms-maci-bookout-speaks-out-about-farrah-abrahams-parentin/

"As far as the way I felt when she was returning, it's not about Farrah. I don't hold a grudge towards her. I'm not mad at her. I don't judge her, nothing like that," Bookout said while talking with E! News.

"But there's also a fine line with what I find appropriate, and I just don't think it's appropriate for my six-year-old son to be involved with some of the things that Farrah is involved with," she said.

Bookout continued by explaining that she doesn't want her eldest son, Bentley Cadence Edwards, to watch some of the risqué activities in which Farrah involves herself.

"If we're watching one scene and he's in the front yard throwing baseball and then five seconds later they are in a strip club, to me that's just not appropriate," she said. "The show is going to air on Mondays and that's going to be happening and then he has to wake up and go to school the next day with six and seven-year-olds in Kindergarten that just watched all of that happen. So it's difficult for me because I feel like my ability to make the right choices as a parent was kind of taken away from me when they decided to bring her back."

Even though Bookout doesn't agree with some of Abraham's behavior, the mother of three says that she wouldn't reject befriending someone like Abraham just because of her decisions.

"I've said it in every interview today, and I think the best way to really get my point across is that, you know, my very best friend could be a stripper and do porn as long as she treats me and my family right and she's a good person," Bookout said. "I don't care what she does, she is still going to be my best friend. But that doesn't mean I'm going to involve what her choice of career is with my six-year-old son or that I'm going to expose any of that to him."

 

 Maci, your ability to make the right choices for Bentley were not taken from you. The choice is there for you to decide if you will remain on the show or whether you will pull you and your son off the show. There are more options, they are just NOT the options you want.

Edited July 6, 2017 by GreatKazu

[lexiexx]

10 hours ago, Lm2162 said:

I agree, but I don't see how his driving is particularly Maci's fault for "exposing?" She wasn't even there. And he's ultimately the one I find most responsible. Not his parents, not Mackenzie, not Maci, him. I get that addiction is a messed up thing but there are several addicts on this show. We saw Amber beat up her partner on-screen and I wouldn't call her "exploited" for having her bad behavior exposed even though she was high at the time. He's endangering others too. I just don't have any sympathy for him when he's still calling his ex psycho and his wife is still defending him. Maybe focus on your own problems bro. Maci's a bitch who should take him to court and his family and wife (who also has a child she probably exposes to him) are whiny enablers, but ultimately he's the one endangering people and any embarrassment he feels is on him. I'm assuming he knew full well he was still using every time he signed up for the show. I don't feel bad for Catelynn being put down for driving drunk, for Maci being insulted for drinking pregnant, etc., so I don't feel bad for him either. It's not like it's a sudden radical shift and he was a great responsible dad before. 

I never said his driving was Maci's fault.  I also never said anyone but Ryan was responsible for his behavior.  I couldn't care less if Ryan is embarrassed.   I'm saying that because Bentley did not sign up for this, and it's a mortifying shit show, Maci should step in and shut it down.   Especially since she claimed in the past that she cares about what the show associates Bentley with.  I do see the difference between mumbling weirdo Ryan who everyone speculated to have a TBI versus Ryan straight out of a scene of intervention to be a pretty radical shift.   I agree with you that he endangered other people, that's why I'm so incredulous that Maci tried making a storyline out of how she wanted Ryan to do more ALONE with Bentley.  Of course he knew he was using, but he's a drug addict.   How can you expect him to have any real judgement when he was so fucked up?  All of the kids on this show have been exploited in similar ways, it's gross.   The difference is that Maci claimed to take issue with what people would think of Bentley and the other ones didn't.  This is probably a big part of why Brandon and Theresa didn't want Carly's pictures out there and didn't want to be discussed on the show.   Because they are grown ups who can see what kind of damage it can do and how inappropriate it is.

 

 

10 hours ago, LotusFlower said:

 

I think people's dislike of Maci colors their view of the addiction issue.  The whole Farrah/porn thing was ridiculous (and it was all MTV's fault, but they put it all on Maci....but that's a whole other story), but I think it's conflating two very different issues.  Ryan, and Ryan alone, is responsible for his drug use, and his parents and Mackenzie are responsible for their enabling.  He's the one that's embarrassing himself and his family, including his son.  But on that subject, why are you attaching such shame to the problem?  We're in the midst of an opioids crisis, and drug addiction is rampant and commonplace.  I've been really hard on Ryan because of the non-parent that he's always been, but I can also sympathize with his plight because he's dealing with a disease.  What's Amber's excuse?  How 'bout Janelle?  Try having them as parents.  We can debate Maci's sanctimony re: Farrah's porn, but I think comparing it to Ryan's drug use is a hard line to take in regard to addiction issues.

I also don't understand saying Maci is the responsible parent, so it's up to her to yank Bentley off the show, or stop filming altogether.  Um - yea - to all of that, for all of them.  But then there wouldn't be a show.  And frankly, I don't think any of us who watch the show have any ground to stand on to say this.  Yes, MTV is exploiting these kids, but every viewer is complicit in what's happening.  

Or maybe Maci's fans are giving her the free pass she likes to give herself.   It's not MTV's fault that Maci had a tantrum.   They can put whoever they want on their show, who is Maci to tell them otherwise?  They didn't ask her, they told her, and she had a tantrum.  Till she realized that she relies on MTV money anyway.  I"m pretty sure that the kids who are going to torture Bentley about his dad aren't going to think 'hey, theres a crisis out there.   let's be cool'.   Are you serious?  They  already confirmed on one of the specials that the kids pick on Bentley over Ryan.  I don't know why we're even  comparing Jenelle and Amber here, they are both losers who also don't care about the embarrassing shit their kids will get picked on for so they can get that fast MTV's money.  So what if there wasn't a show anymore?   It's not the job of the viewer to parent the teen mom kids.  

 

6 hours ago, LotusFlower said:

 

Re: your first graph - no worries.  Re: your second - I agree.  (Hey, what do you know?!)  I'm no Maci fan, and I don't know how I suddenly became her defender.  In fact, I don't think I've ever posted in this thread, but I was gobsmacked after Mackenzie's open letter accusations to Maci, and there wasn't a reunion thread yet, so I just started typing away... I just couldn't believe Maci was getting blamed for Ryan's addiction, and for folks to start saying that things said on a reality show are embarrassing or invasive - it just brings up the ole hypocrisy claim.

Just because Mackenzie is an annoying jackass doesn't make Maci any better. Being on a tv show doesn't necessarily mean that 100% of your life should be public.   Remember when Maci was 6 months pregnant and showing but sat right there through the reunion show with her hands clasped and said she didn't know if she was having more kids?   Just another example of how Maci is a raging hypocrite and a liar.   

[ReadMeLattice]

15 minutes ago, lexiexx said:

I How can you expect him to have any real judgement when he was so fucked up? 

  

I mean...the same way I expect Amber not to beat people up when she's high, Jenelle not to abuse her dogs or neglect her kids when she's high and in the throes of addiction, Cate not to drive when she's high...I think they're fucked up for doing those things even when they were really, really messed up and very mentally out of it at the time. There are a lot of addicts on this show. They all have enablers, and all of their enablers have their own issues and hypocrisies. It's hard to tell when who should have done what because we'll never get a real straight answer from *any* of these people about the actual sequence of events. Maci, Mackenzie, Ryan, Jen, and Larry are all going to have a different story about when the problem started and when they were first made aware of it, and probably none of them are actually telling the truth (although the only one I kind of trust is Larry, though he's too beholden to Jen to be fully trustworthy). They're just running their agendas.

Edited July 6, 2017 by Lm2162

[lexiexx]

Oh I agree that every single person on that show has an agenda.   But a drug addict signing on for a reality show thinking he can cover up the fact that he's a drug addict?   That seems like a no brainer.  Of course he would.  I'm talking about him signing onto a reality show.  Nobody has excused him driving when he was high.

Edited July 6, 2017 by lexiexx

[LotusFlower]

55 minutes ago, lexiexx said:

Nobody has excused him driving when he was high.

Mackenzie did.  She blamed Maci for the 25 days, 600 hours, five hundred twenty-five thousand six hundred minutes (and ten million seconds) that she allowed Ryan to roam this earth, or at least the state of Tennessee, high as a kite.  That was my only point.  

[ReadMeLattice]

8 hours ago, lexiexx said:

Oh I agree that every single person on that show has an agenda.   But a drug addict signing on for a reality show thinking he can cover up the fact that he's a drug addict?   That seems like a no brainer.  Of course he would.  I'm talking about him signing onto a reality show.  Nobody has excused him driving when he was high.

Right, but...all of them do that too. They've all signed up again and again in the throes of addiction. It seems like a wash, and it's hard to know what to condemn and what to think someone needs real help for (and everything in between) when you're dealing with this level of dysfunction among this many people. But nobody blamed Barb for Jenelle's actions or Gary for Amber's. 

Edited July 6, 2017 by Lm2162

[Tatum]

4 hours ago, LotusFlower said:

Mackenzie did.  She blamed Maci for the 25 days, 600 hours, five hundred twenty-five thousand six hundred minutes (and ten million seconds) that she allowed Ryan to roam this earth, or at least the state of Tennessee, high as a kite.  That was my only point.  

Wait really? Damn it, now I'm going to have to watch this. 

 

You know what's super sad? I fully concede Ryan is basically a useless, selfish criminal that is no longer attractive and who's only asset remaining is his association with a reality show diminishing in popularity.

Yet for this unholy union I'm still scratching my head wondering what HE is getting out of marrying HER. Curious. 

[lexiexx]

4 hours ago, Lm2162 said:

Right, but...all of them do that too. They've all signed up again and again in the throes of addiction. It seems like a wash, and it's hard to know what to condemn and what to think someone needs real help for (and everything in between) when you're dealing with this level of dysfunction among this many people.

What is the point of comparing them all?  Nobody on here is saying Ryan is better or worse than any of the others who have done bad things when they were high.   They were also roasted when it was happening.  This is the maci thread.   Clearly Ryan needs real help, as did jenelle and Amber.   The show is a wash tho.  It needs to be cancelled.  

[ReadMeLattice]

2 hours ago, Tatum said:

Wait really? Damn it, now I'm going to have to watch this. 

 

You know what's super sad? I fully concede Ryan is basically a useless, selfish criminal that is no longer attractive and who's only asset remaining is his association with a reality show diminishing in popularity.

Yet for this unholy union I'm still scratching my head wondering what HE is getting out of marrying HER. Curious. 

A lot of us speculated she was essentially his caretaker for a while. Obviously that's not true, but it seems to be their dynamic.

Edited July 6, 2017 by Lm2162

[Tatum]

8 minutes ago, Lm2162 said:

A lot of us speculated she was essentially his caretaker for a while. Obviously that's not true, but it seems to be their dynamic.

I mean, I can see why Ryan's parents want Mackenzie around, but why does Ryan want to marry her? He's probably not of the opinion that he needs a caretaker, he never really cared about custody of Bentley (if he was, for example, trying to look better in front of family court by being married, which it's been thrown around that's what Mackenzie is thinking for her own custody case), and she's not particularly attractive, smart, or interesting, (and even if she was, or Ryan thought she was, what's the rush to get married)- why does Ryan want to get married so quickly? I mean, I get he's not operating on all cylinders right now, but it's not like getting married is something you would just decide you had to do in the next few months, even in an altered state. It's not like Ryan got super high one day and was like, hey wouldn't it be a riot if we went to a courthouse and got married? And then it happened before he sobered up. It's a rush marriage, but not so rushed that Ryan wouldn't have had a few moments of sobriety to really consider this marriage.

If Maci has a theory, I'd love to hear it. Even though I would probably make fun of it, I still want to know.

[LotusFlower]

55 minutes ago, Tatum said:

I mean, I can see why Ryan's parents want Mackenzie around, but why does Ryan want to marry her? He's probably not of the opinion that he needs a caretaker, he never really cared about custody of Bentley (if he was, for example, trying to look better in front of family court by being married, which it's been thrown around that's what Mackenzie is thinking for her own custody case), and she's not particularly attractive, smart, or interesting, (and even if she was, or Ryan thought she was, what's the rush to get married)- why does Ryan want to get married so quickly? I mean, I get he's not operating on all cylinders right now, but it's not like getting married is something you would just decide you had to do in the next few months, even in an altered state. It's not like Ryan got super high one day and was like, hey wouldn't it be a riot if we went to a courthouse and got married? And then it happened before he sobered up. It's a rush marriage, but not so rushed that Ryan wouldn't have had a few moments of sobriety to really consider this marriage.

If Maci has a theory, I'd love to hear it. Even though I would probably make fun of it, I still want to know.

He and Mackenzie said it was to improve his chances of getting more custody or visitation with Bentley (if and when he goes to court).

[Tatum]

48 minutes ago, LotusFlower said:

He and Mackenzie said it was to improve his chances of getting more custody or visitation with Bentley (if and when he goes to court).

Yes, but like I said in the quoted post, he doesn't really care. I mean, he might have said that was the reason, but who here really believes that after blowing off his existing visitation with Bentley 99% of the time, he all the sudden is moved to make a legal commitment to someone he met a year ago on the off chance he might get more custody?

[ReadMeLattice]

7 minutes ago, Tatum said:

Yes, but like I said in the quoted post, he doesn't really care. I mean, he might have said that was the reason, but who here really believes that after blowing off his existing visitation with Bentley 99% of the time, he all the sudden is moved to make a legal commitment to someone he met a year ago on the off chance he might get more custody?

And also, good luck with that after that video! Yeah, I don't get it either. Maybe he's just one of those people who gets aggressively pursued (which Mack clearly does with him) and just gives in and doesn't much care either way? Like, he'll just accept it as long as they make nice and have sex with him? She's not going to nag him, she's always on his side, she makes things easy for him. Probably is willing to do the cooking and cleaning, and he could very well be attracted to her. Yes she's not gorgeous (and nor is Maci) but he could easily personally find her attractive. She's young and malleable and his parents adore her and have pushed it. I doubt he's thinking about the reasons for their union all that deeply.

Edited July 6, 2017 by Lm2162

[LotusFlower]

5 minutes ago, Tatum said:

Yes, but like I said in the quoted post, he doesn't really care. I mean, he might have said that was the reason, but who here really believes that after blowing off his existing visitation with Bentley 99% of the time, he all the sudden is moved to make a legal commitment to someone he met a year ago on the off chance he might get more custody?

I get it, but I think his parents are behind it (getting more time with Bentley....pushing for a legal agreement).  Ryan doesn't care about spending time with Bentley, but they do.

[teapot]

19 minutes ago, Lm2162 said:

And also, good luck with that after that video! Yeah, I don't get it either. Maybe he's just one of those people who gets aggressively pursued (which Mack clearly does with him) and just gives in and doesn't much care either way? Like, he'll just accept it as long as they make nice and have sex with him? She's not going to nag him, she's always on his side, she makes things easy for him. Probably is willing to do the cooking and cleaning, and he could very well be attracted to her. Yes she's not gorgeous (and nor is Maci) but he could easily personally find her attractive. She's young and malleable and his parents adore her and have pushed it. I doubt he's thinking about the reasons for their union all that deeply.

 

15 minutes ago, LotusFlower said:

I get it, but I think his parents are behind it (getting more time with Bentley....pushing for a legal agreement).  Ryan doesn't care about spending time with Bentley, but they do.

all of the above, but why out of the blue on a weeknight with a dress???? why not a quickie court house wedding if it's a legal thing, or a big (or even small non-haphazard)  to-do if it's a for real love thing?

[Tatum]

I know I should not try to make sense of why these fools do anything...and yet here I am.

 

Ryan looks like he's gaining some weight. Perhaps Mac is one hell of a cook and she's holding out his favorite recipes until he makes an honest woman out of her.

[ReadMeLattice]

11 minutes ago, teapot said:

 

all of the above, but why out of the blue on a weeknight with a dress???? why not a quickie court house wedding if it's a legal thing, or a big (or even small non-haphazard)  to-do if it's a for real love thing?

I would assume because Mack insisted and Ryan is sort of one of those loser-pushovers. Yes he's on drugs, but he has also always just really wanted things to be easy for him (hence why he hated Maci so much during her pregnancy; it was inconvenient). If she'll throw less of a fit if she wears a wedding dress, so be it...you know? He gets his sex, drugs, and parental approval, and the status of being married, which 'round their parts seems pretty important. His parents will get somewhat off his back and Mack basically had to almost die in that car before she would even mildly whine "Ryannnn....."

Edited July 6, 2017 by Lm2162

[Tatum]

13 minutes ago, Lm2162 said:

I would assume because Mack insisted and Ryan is sort of one of those loser-pushovers. Yes he's on drugs, but he has also always just really wanted things to be easy for him (hence why he hated Maci so much during her pregnancy; it was inconvenient). If she'll throw less of a fit if she wears a wedding dress, so be it...you know? He gets his sex, drugs, and parental approval, and the status of being married, which 'round their parts seems pretty important. His parents will get somewhat off his back and Mack basically had to almost die in that car before she would even mildly whine "Ryannnn....."

I must watch this tragedy of a wedding. Was it an actual episode, or did they just show clips during the reunion?

[mscav]

Tatum, the parking lot wedding and all of its glory can be seen on the season finale.

[GreatKazu]

11 hours ago, LotusFlower said:

Mackenzie did.  She blamed Maci for the 25 days, 600 hours, five hundred twenty-five thousand six hundred minutes (and ten million seconds) that she allowed Ryan to roam this earth, or at least the state of Tennessee, high as a kite.  That was my only point.  

Right, Mac allowed that. And everyone here has blasted her for that. 

Discussing what the rest of the clan failed to do does not mean Mac is not accountable. 

This is all going in circles.

Quote

He and Mackenzie said it was to improve his chances of getting more custody or visitation with Bentley (if and when he goes to court).

If and when. He won't. Anyone believe that was the reason? I sure don't. No lawyer would tell any couple to get married especially for ONE day of visitation, which is what Ryan said. He said they were seeking only one day more of visitation. I think Mac told him that in order to get him down the grass aisle. Ryan deserves to have his visitation severed and only see Bentley under supervised visitation, but not the Edwards as supervisors. 

 

1 hour ago, Tatum said:

I must watch this tragedy of a wedding. Was it an actual episode, or did they just show clips during the reunion?

Watch it, Tatum. Then, come back and give us your view. 

Edited July 6, 2017 by GreatKazu

[Tatum]

I saw the wedding clip on People.com just now. I have been laughing my ass off in the episode thread and reading the PTV recap. I usually don't even bother with opening the episode threads since I don't watch them and have nothing to contribute. But NONE of you could tell me this was worth my time to make an exception?? (Obviously kidding here).

 

I was surprised to see Ryan comforting Jen instead of just staring back at her with dead eyes like he usually does. I could do without seeing him kiss his mother on the mouth though. Any passerby would have assumed the mother of the groom hates the bride.