S07.E22: Leaving Storybrooke

[Camera One]

5 minutes ago, jhlipton said:

Or have Adult Henry talk to Young Henry.  

When Adult Henry and Young Henry first met, Young Henry talked to Adult Henry like he was a total loser.  So I don't think Adult Henry would have much influence, unfortunately.  

[darkestboy]

I really liked that series finale. It wasn't perfect and I still believe that the show should've ended last year but it actually served as a good ending for the show.

Bringing all the realms and Storybrooke together did seem a little much, Regina but it sort of works. I don't mind Regina getting her happy ending though.

Nice seeing Emma, real Hook, Snow, Charming, Zelena, Belle and Robin once again. And the Blue Fairy escaped a horrible enough fate or did she?

Rumple defeating his wish self and dying worked for me. Jacinda and Lucy given hardly any screentime also worked. I love that Alice and Robyn essentially got more screen time.

The show wasn't perfect but this was a good ending though, 8/10

[companionenvy]

2 hours ago, darkestboy said:

I don't mind Regina getting her happy ending though.

To clarify, I don't actually mind Regina getting her happy ending, either. I mind the form that happy ending took, which, IMO, required trampling over the stories of other characters and totally suspending emotional realism. 

Hook, Rumple (if we're counting afterlife, which I think we should), and several other villains on this show got happy endings without becoming super Kings and Queens of all creation. No reason the same couldn't have happened for Regina. 

Glad you liked it, though, and if I ignore the last ten minutes, I quite enjoyed much of it too. 

[Kktjones]

So I had decided not to watch, but it happened to be on when I turned on the TV and I saw they were in Storybrooke. So I watched up until Zelena told Alice & Robin that Regina and Emma had taken Henry on a graduation trip and then I noped the hell out of there. It just felt so baity and I had no desire to see the rest of the Regina love fest.

Since then I have finally seen the final scene with Emma, Hook, and Baby Hope. Ignoring the ridiculous premise that they were making Regina “Queen of everything”, what the hell was that dialogue?? First we have Regina looking around and saying “is everyone here?” in a baby voice looking like a 6th grader waiting for her crush to show up at her birthday party. Then Emma bursts in and says “Sorry.” Followed by stating “I’m late.” (I know they were going for the parallel with the pilot, but she didn’t even say it like Regina did where it was all one sentence.) Then Regina, in a super sappy voice, says “Emma”. Ewww.

Things don’t get better from there. Next we’re treated to some awkward dialogue where they call each other Madam Mayor and Miss Swan (never mind the fact Emma’s been married for several years now). Sorry, I was excited to see the Swan Jones family, but why do they always insist on these strange exchanges between Emma and Regina? There hasn’t been one that felt natural and organic since about S3.

Kind of bummed that they used the return of Snow & Charming to be all about rescuing and then crowning Regina. I truly loved them in the early days, but in the end they (especially Snow) were just props in Regina's story. While I found Emma's exchange with Regina to be hella strange, I still loved seeing her one last time with husband and baby in tow. She looked so happy and content in that final shot that it left me feeling really good. Also, since I didn’t watch S7 it’s easy for me to just ignore all the nonsense that seemed to happen in this episode (and here’s a post on Tumblr that pretty much sums up how I feel about it – did someone here write this?). It also helps that my head cannon is Regina makes it about another week before she’s taken out by a family member of another one of her victims – this one not named Henry!

[RulerofallIsurvey]

I watched this ep this weekend.  And to be honest, I'd not watched the last 4 or 5 eps, so I binged them all on Saturday, just to get to the finale.  (Does that make me a completionist or just an idiot?  :/  Don't answer that!)  Standard disclaimer: I haven't read the other comments yet, so apologies in advance for any duplication, though I doubt I'm the only one who thought/felt this way.

All in all, a pretty lack-luster finale, especially for a  series-ender.  I guess A&E had already checked out by the time they wrote/filmed this.  (Remind me to never again watch any show which is associated with them.) 

Best moments for me were when Snow and Charming showed up in Black Knight disguises and Emma and Hook and Baby Jones bursting through the door at the end.  (Of course Emma had to be wearing her red leather jacket or NO ONE would have known who she was, amiright?  //snark)  Seeing Hook (not just Whook) deliriously happy holding his and Emma's child was worth the rest of the awful episode.  And all credit for that goes to Jen and Colin.  Good job, guys!

I thought I was going to puke when Snow make Regina queen of all the realms.  No really.  That's not even hyperbole.  I felt physically ill.  For a brief, shining moment before Emma arrived, I thought Regina might have an epiphany like Gold finally did and turn down the crown because she finally realized that all she'd ever wanted was a family who loved her and she had that now so she didn't need to seek to have the power any more and Snow was the rightful queen.  (That would have been a fitting end for the character, imo).  But nope.  A&E really had to hand Regina everything and then some, didn't they?  Anyone else notice she was wearing a very classic Disney Cinderella like blue gown? (Excuse me, I have to go rinse this bad taste out of my mouth)

While I'm on this subject, if anyone can point me to a good fanfic that's written like the series end should have been written (because I know members of this forum can do a much better job than A&E) , I'd be very grateful! 

Speaking of Rumple earlier, I'm glad he finally learned a lesson - and maybe it stuck.  How sad for him that Hook was the closest thing he ever had to a friend?  Still, his meeting Belle in the afterlife felt as unearned as Cora crossing the light bridge in the Underworld. 

[Inquirer]

Interestingly, A&E say here that the plan all along was for the show's final villain to be "OG Rumple", who would be defeated by current Rumple.

And for once, I believe them on this one - not only because it makes sense, but because they did the S6 finale not knowing if they'd get renewed or not, and after the Black Fairy was killed, who was the last villain to appear? OG Rumple (Clippy!Rumple as opposed to Wish!Rumple, though), tempting current Rumple to do the wrong thing.  There were BTS reports that Rumple was going to die in the S6 finale prior to the confirmation of the S7 renewal and that Robert Carlyle was on board for it, so I think that if the renewal hadn't happened or if Robert hadn't signed on to it, we'd have had Rumple doing the same heart-merging death he had here, but with Gideon's heart rather than Wish!Hook's, and obviously no reunion with Belle in the afterlife since she'd have been left still alive to raise the re-babified Gideon, which would've been her happy ending.

The telltale sign to me is how abrupt the scene ends - Rumple tries to command Gideon to not kill Emma by holding his heart, then Clippy!Rumple reveals that this isn't going to work due to the Black Fairy's magic...then Clippy!Rumple just walks away.  Cue a scene or two later, suddenly Rumple walks back to Belle, moping about how he failed.  That was way too big an anti-climax, even for this show.  It definitely feels like something bigger was going to happen there (namely, Rumple's death), but it got changed.

Edited May 21, 2018 by Inquirer

[KingOfHearts]

9 minutes ago, Inquirer said:

Interestingly, A&E say here that the plan all along was for the show's final villain to be "OG Rumple", who would be defeated by current Rumple.

I've always loved the idea of OG Rumple as the final villain of the show, because it fits thematically. But I didn't want a separate Rumple. I wanted Rumple to revert back to original recipe. He was the most powerful and clever villain this show has ever had.

[Inquirer]

4 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

But I didn't want a separate Rumple. I wanted Rumple to revert back to original recipe. He was the most powerful and clever villain this show has ever had.

THAT was clearly what SHOULD have happened, but of course it was never going to happen because A&E love them their "redemptions".

[RulerofallIsurvey]

On 5/19/2018 at 2:01 AM, Camera One said:

I did discover this alternate ending. 

It all makes so much more sense now!  Thanks!  ;)

On 5/19/2018 at 7:39 AM, Shanna Marie said:

I actually lost sleep trying to figure out how all this was supposed to work.

Oh, sweetie, don't trouble yourself.  As Wise One Rumple once said (hey!  If Regina gets to be Queen of Everything, I'm thinking Rumple gets to be The Old Wise One in this 'infinite realms all brought together in Maine' premise.) "Your questions are pointless."

[Camera One]

I found another extended scene.

REGINA: "And in the end, we can get past it all... with HOPE."

The crowd claps and Regina mingles.  Regina walks off with Adult Henry and Jacinda.

EMMA walks up to the podium.

SNOW:  I'm glad you got here just in time.  I wanted you to give me some input on how to make this better.

EMMA: That was great, Mom, but it looks like a lot of work.  Are you sure there needs to be a coronation for everyone in the Top 200?

SNOW: The joining of the realms has created such a mess.  This is the only way to bring everyone together and highlight each person in the Council of 200 equally.

CHARMING: You'll need to pay me extra for all the bowing.  For a minute there, I almost threw my sword out of habit.

SNOW: David!  Remember, Emma, it's you next week.  The crowds will be much bigger, but I can't think of a larger venue than this.  Having Regina this week was a good test run with a small audience, though I owe the Dwarves and fifty other people dinner at Granny's.

MEANWHILE, IN THE CROWD.

GRANNY: I think my face is permanently stuck with all this fake smiling.

WISH BLUE: I'm beginning to miss that Book Prison.  Do you celebrate all the evil villains here?

GRUMPY: Who voted for Regina anyway?

BLUE: Unfortunately, there are those who believe someone with Dark magic is better able to protect us.  

DOC: Our Munchkin friends in the Oz realm voted for Ozma.  

BLUE: That reminds me.  Has anyone seen Glinda around?  We're trying to build a database of the evil witches and warlocks still roaming around out there.  Merlin is going to Skype in from Heaven, and of course Wish Merlin will be here in person.

HAPPY: Let's not think unhappy thoughts during such a celebration.

GRUMPY: You do remember the GQ tried to kill you a few dozen times, and I'm not talking about the magazine.

ARCHIE: Well, I can't wait 'til next week when our Emma gets crowned.

Edited May 21, 2018 by Camera One

[SilverShadow]

@Camera One This is now my head-canon. 

[asabovesobelow]

3 hours ago, Kktjones said:

Since then I have finally seen the final scene with Emma, Hook, and Baby Hope. Ignoring the ridiculous premise that they were making Regina “Queen of everything”, what the hell was that dialogue?? First we have Regina looking around and saying “is everyone here?” in a baby voice looking like a 6th grader waiting for her crush to show up at her birthday party. Then Emma bursts in and says “Sorry.” Followed by stating “I’m late.” (I know they were going for the parallel with the pilot, but she didn’t even say it like Regina did where it was all one sentence.) Then Regina, in a super sappy voice, says “Emma”. Ewww.

Things don’t get better from there. Next we’re treated to some awkward dialogue where they call each other Madam Mayor and Miss Swan (never mind the fact Emma’s been married for several years now). Sorry, I was excited to see the Swan Jones family, but why do they always insist on these strange exchanges between Emma and Regina? 

To keep the SQ fans watching and yearning. It's bait-y and pander-y, and ultimately leads to disappointment. Repeatedly, continually. But for those that would love to see that relationship on screen, it's just enough of a crumb to keep the flame burning. (I personally melted into a puddle at the 'Emma' in a super sappy voice.) Which they have done every single season. They should have recognized the pairing, acknowledged the appeal, and then had the courage of their convictions to not show the two characters in scenes riddled with subtext. Why they did it in the last episode is beyond me, since the only thing left to gain is enticing fans to a new show, I guess. But sorry dudes, that ship has sailed.

[Kktjones]

39 minutes ago, asabovesobelow said:

To keep the SQ fans watching and yearning. It's bait-y and pander-y, and ultimately leads to disappointment. Repeatedly, continually. But for those that would love to see that relationship on screen, it's just enough of a crumb to keep the flame burning. (I personally melted into a puddle at the 'Emma' in a super sappy voice.)

I'm glad you liked that! It just felt so strange to me - everything about that scene was just a little off, but the dialogue between them seemed even more clunky than the rest. And yes, I do think both Regina's "Is everyone here" and "Emma" did seem very baity - as did the mention of Emma & Regina on a graduation trip with Henry. I never really saw the queerbaiting until S6, but this was pretty bad. And like you said, why bother? The show is over. I just wish that in the end these two could have had a comfortable, friendly conversation instead of it always feeling like Lana's trying to sell one thing and JMo another.

[tri4335]

54 minutes ago, asabovesobelow said:

To keep the SQ fans watching and yearning. It's bait-y and pander-y, and ultimately leads to disappointment. Repeatedly, continually. But for those that would love to see that relationship on screen, it's just enough of a crumb to keep the flame burning. (I personally melted into a puddle at the 'Emma' in a super sappy voice.) Which they have done every single season. They should have recognized the pairing, acknowledged the appeal, and then had the courage of their convictions to not show the two characters in scenes riddled with subtext. Why they did it in the last episode is beyond me, since the only thing left to gain is enticing fans to a new show, I guess. But sorry dudes, that ship has sailed.

 

10 minutes ago, Kktjones said:

I'm glad you liked that! It just felt so strange to me - everything about that scene was just a little off, but the dialogue between them seemed even more clunky than the rest. And yes, I do think both Regina's "Is everyone here" and "Emma" did seem very baity - as did the mention of Emma & Regina on a graduation trip with Henry. I never really saw the queerbaiting until S6, but this was pretty bad. And like you said, why bother? The show is over. I just wish that in the end these two could have had a comfortable, friendly conversation instead of it always feeling like Lana's trying to sell one thing and JMo another.

It is for the DVD sales. This way they can have SQ's buy the complete set!  The question I have is what did they pay JMO to fly to VC for such a small piece in the finale???

[KingOfHearts]

@Camera One you constantly remind us all of this show's comedic potential. 

[Kktjones]

Someone just posted a couple pages of the coronation scene script. Interestingly this seems to indicate that some of the awkwardness of the Emma/Regina exchanges were directing/acting choices. I am happy to see that the baby's name in canon is "Hope Swan-Jones" and that she's "impossibly cute." Also interesting to see the Wish Henry was supposed to arrive with them wearing his deputy badge. Guess they decided to edit that connection out...

Edited May 21, 2018 by Kktjones

[Camera One]

12 minutes ago, Kktjones said:

 Also interesting to see the Wish Henry was supposed to arrive with them wearing his deputy badge. Guess they decided to edit that connection out...

Yeah, that's interesting.  What we saw was Wish Henry escorting Regina in with Adult Henry.  It makes more sense that he would be with Emma.

Quote

She HUGS her son.  It's emotional.

LOL.  That didn't show.

15 minutes ago, Kktjones said:

Interestingly this seems to indicate that some of the awkwardness of the Emma/Regina exchanges were directing/acting choices. 

The line that was written was really awkward too.  "So -- is this it?  This is your happy ending?"  

I mean, who would even say that?

[Shanna Marie]

Okay, I spent the whole day on buses, an airplane, and a train, and I've got a proper keyboard again, so here I go!

The ending just plain doesn't work, on so many levels. First, the whole "let's combine all the realms so no one will have to be separated again" is basically a solution in search of a problem. I suppose it kind of flows from WRumple's plan to send everyone off into their own realm (which makes no sense as an evil scheme), but it seems like that could still happen even with the realm mash-up, since he was creating pocket universes. I could kind of have understood it if they'd actually all been separated that way and it was an emotional response, but as it is, it's a bizarre idea. Really, the Missing Year when they were separated from Emma and Henry was about the only time they were really separated in a way that required something as drastic as a Dark Curse. Or there was the time in the Underworld, but I certainly hope they weren't also bringing the realm of the dead to Storybrooke. Otherwise, the separations have been more about memory curses, not being in different realms. There are so many ways to travel between realms that bringing all the realms together seems like pointless overkill -- there's Jefferson's magic hat (I'm sure he's made another one by this point), magic beans, Pegasus sail (destroyed, but we're talking multiple realms here), silver slippers, Shadow (killed, but multiple realms), Kraken blood submarine engine, enchanted wood (wardrobe, ashes -- did the Jolly Roger have any power like that?), magical tornado, the Sorcerer's doors, the uniting true loves flower, and then there's stuff that should be possible but that they never tried. Like, a combo of mermaid realm-jumping swimming, a Ziploc baggie, and the Wonderland get bigger/smaller mushrooms -- eat get smaller mushroom, get into airfilled baggie, Ariel puts it in her purse, swims between realms, opens baggie, person eats get bigger mushroom. Oh, and there was the White Rabbit and the scheduled portal Henry was trying to catch at the beginning of the season. Being separated in different realms isn't really an issue. And when it is an issue at all, it only seems to affect this one group of people. The entire universe gets rearranged for the somewhat limited convenience of this one little group of people. Somehow, I doubt the rest of the population is going to be electing any of those people to be in charge of anything. Plus, they've now made it easy for the villains from one realm to travel to other realms that may not be prepared to deal with them. In short, this all seems like a really, really bad idea.

Then there's the timeline issue. For all this to happen, adult Henry and the others need to have been cursed back in time. But with all the realms mashed up, is teen Henry going to go traveling? Will the curse need to be cast, or will past Gothel just be able to wander over? And if the curse isn't cast, what happens? What they needed to do was have a big goodbye to all the future characters, send them back to their time to go on with their lives (or back to Hyperion Heights), and wipe the memories of the past characters so they won't screw up the future. Then end with the big family celebration before they give Henry his big send-off. As it is, it's hard to imagine that the timeline isn't going to be utterly destroyed. If Henry doesn't go off adventuring, will Lucy vanish? (Please?)

And there's the Regina issue. First, as others have said, the ending should have been more about Emma's ending than Regina's. But if they're going to do Regina's ending, there's something wrong about ending by giving the "reformed" villain the thing she was trying to have when she was evil. Whether or not she ever actually wanted to be queen or that was Cora's thing, she did end up making herself a queen and not just a queen consort by murdering the king and kicking the rightful heir out. She stole the crown and the palace from Snow, and admitted that was what she did (well, more like gloated). It's so very wrong to have the person she stole the crown from crowning her. If the "reformed" villain gets the thing she already took when she was evil (only bigger and better), that doesn't show any kind of reformation. If she's changed, she should want something different. For instance, with the Hooks -- Hook was on the wrong side of the law, focused only on what he wanted, but at the end, both versions are cops upholding the law, and they're focused on fatherhood. This outcome is not what evil Hook would ever have wanted, so it's a sign of how much he's changed. Regina's a raging narcissist, so her learning to love herself is kind of pointless. I don't know what her happy ending would be -- she already has everything. Maybe she liked running a bar and opens one in Storybrooke?

It's also unearned. Regina may have cast the spell that brought the realms together -- offscreen, and as I said, it was pointless -- but we never saw her doing anything to merit being in charge of everything. It was Snow who rallied everyone together to deal with the situation. It sounds like it was Snow who organized the election in the first place, so she was interacting with all the realms. Regina didn't take any kind of leadership in dealing with Rumple or in dealing with Hyperion Heights. She's been a sideline player all season with no real story arc. Making the very end about her is totally out of the blue.

[Kktjones]

3 minutes ago, Camera One said:

The line that was written was really awkward too.  "So -- is this it?  This is your happy ending?"  

I mean, who would even say that?

Honestly - it almost sounds sarcastic when you see it written that way! Let's just say the whole damn thing was just strange. (I mean "HOLY.BLODDY.HELL" - really?). But the "Sorry I'm late" was broken into two sentences by JMo - either by her own choice or the director's...

[Camera One]

I tried saying it out loud, and it does sound sarcastic.  I guess they wanted to give Jennifer Morrison one more challenging acting moment.

It might as well be, "So --- is this it?  Can we put you off to pasture?"

[Camera One]

If you want another laugh, Adam is being generous and posted the script for Rumple and Belle's epic final scene.

[Rumsy4]

58 minutes ago, Shanna Marie said:

She's been a sideline player all season with no real story arc. Making the very end about her is totally out of the blue.

It's a WTF ending completely disconnected from the rest of the series, let alone the season. According to Lana's own admission, nobody knew what Regina's Happy Ending would look like until the finale. That's because she wanted something different every season!! I don't get these writers. They adore Regina and want her to have all things. So why did they practically sideline her in Season 7? Once they'd decided to sideline her, they should have stuck with it, and not made her the freaking Queen of the Multiverse in the last ten minutes of the Show. 

15 minutes ago, Camera One said:

If you want another laugh, Adam is being generous and posted the script for Rumple and Belle's epic final scene.

Quote

But Gold can't help but hope, and neither can we...

Um...

Edited May 21, 2018 by Rumsy4

[KingOfHearts]

43 minutes ago, Camera One said:

If you want another laugh, Adam is being generous and posted the script for Rumple and Belle's epic final scene.

I would've preferred if they had shot it in the Storybrooke woods as the script says. The soundstage was incredibly distracting and took me out of it. I was really thinking Belle would've appeared more like Robin when he got his soul got obliterated, ghostly and translucent. As he dies and everyone is still in the room in the Dark Castle, she touches his face and smiles, then he's gone. 

What we got was, "OMG, remember the well and the Beauty and the Beast costumes?!" Their reunion in 1x22 was more heartfelt.

Edited May 21, 2018 by KingOfHearts

[Camera One]

Quote

WIDEN to FIND -- GOLD.  And yeah, that's who we will remember him as.  

Why?  Gold did some unspeakably evil things as well.

I love how they seem to imply what "we" the viewers will think.  

Quote

... the white light envelopes them -- and us

Uh, no thanks.

[coops]

2 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

As it is, it's hard to imagine that the timeline isn't going to be utterly destroyed. If Henry doesn't go off adventuring, will Lucy vanish? (Please?)

I think that is the thing that is most off putting for viewers. The show has got to be the most ridiculously complicated show EVER and not in a good way like Game of Thrones were there's a wide range of lots of different characters which makes the world feel like a real place. There's Wish Realm versions of all the characters, the future versions, the alternate realm versions, etc. The timeline had always been impossible conundrum that's only true purpose is to make people want to rip their own hair out. The first couple of seasons the show was getting praised for creating a complicated, tangled web but there's a world of difference between a complex story that somehow manages to weave all the threads together and just making everything overly complicated so the only way to sort it out is to hand wave and say 'in the end everything was merged together and everyone lived happily ever after, goodbye.' Talk about deus ex machina. Except in this case it wasn't God coming to solve the unsolvable, it was, surprise, surprise, Regina. 

[Camera One]

Usually, we can cobble together a POSSIBLE explanation to explain most of the inconsistencies and contradictions in the timeline.  But I think it is actually impossible to do with this series finale, and with Season 7 in general.  

[tennisgurl]

Whats really more baffling about Regina being crowed Queen of Everything (besides literally everything) is that Regina has never struck me as much of a leader, or someone who even really wanted to actually lead people. When she was the the Evil Queen, there was either when she was Leopold's wife, where she seemed to just sit around being pissed at him and Snow, or plotting her revenge and take over, or when she was full on EQ, where her days seemed to consist of killing random innocent civilians, looking for Snow and her allies, raping Graham, and picking out which over the top outfit she should put on. Even as Mayor Mills, she seemed to more enjoy having power over everyone than actually being a Mayor, and she didnt really seem to do very much, besides rock a power suit. And then when she became good, she always seemed more interested in being accepted and having her pasta eaten by her boyfriend. She never really led people, even as a good guy. It was usually Snow or Emma or Charming taking the lead on most missions or crisis. She was usually there for snark or fireballs, or to make sad faces about her boyfriend angst or about how much her life supposedly sucks. 

Really, being Queen was more Cora's idea than hers, from the start. She liked power and being able to lord it over people, but she never showed interest in the day to day aspects of ruling a nation (any thoughts on trade? The economy? Just getting people behind her?) or even of running a small town. Nor did she really seek to lead the Nevengers, the Storeybrooke crew, or even in the stupid resistance in the new EF. She was just kinda there. She wants people to like her, but I never saw anything about her that made people want to follow her, or has she shown any real desire to be a true leader and inspire people, or help people during one of their many crisis. Even people who might be alright with following an evil sorceress if she could keep their country prosperous and safe probably wouldn't follow her, as she seems to have no interest in how running a country or group actually works. 

[Camera One]

In this "complex" world that A&E has created, kingdoms and towns just run themselves.  

A casual fan from another message board watched the finale, and she liked that Regina was crowned Queen.  But she wondered what was the reason for bringing of all the realms to Storybrooke.  Was there some sort of danger?  

That's the biggest problem with it.  There was absolutely no reason for it to be done.  If Wish Rumple had started some process which would have destroyed all the realms (like that nebulous thing that The Black Fairy did last year), then that would have been a valid reason.  But Regina's idea in this episode came out of nowhere.

[KingOfHearts]

1 minute ago, Camera One said:

That's the biggest problem with it.  There was absolutely no reason for it to be done.  If Wish Rumple had started some process which would have destroyed all the realms (like that nebulous thing that The Black Fairy did last year), then that would have been a valid reason.  But Regina's idea in this episode came out of nowhere.

Instead, why not create permanent portals so that magic beans are no longer necessary? I don't understand why the writers never did that. 

[tennisgurl]

4 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

Instead, why not create permanent portals so that magic beans are no longer necessary? I don't understand why the writers never did that. 

Thats what I thought they would do, and I thought that would actually be a good way to end the show. With the portals to the different realms all open, so that people can easily find each other, with Storeybrooke as a kind of Woods Between the Words where people cross from one realm to another. Then people can cross between worlds, but without dragging people who dont want to go into some new world they know nothing about. I thought that made way more sense than randomly grafting all the realms into one messed up blanket. The way Regina seemed to say it, this was all done because it was more convenient for her and her family, screw the countless other people who probably dont have friends and family that pop from realm to realm on a daily basis. 

[Camera One]

Now now, then we wouldn't have had that awesome CGI journey where Tinkerbelle flew around and we got to soar above Disneyworld Maine, which could basically be a threat to all humanity, what with uncontrollable mythical monsters, evil witches and warlocks, medieval epidemics, outdated modes of thinking, plus thieves, bandits and pirates.

Edited May 22, 2018 by Camera One

[KingOfHearts]

Were WHook and Alice at the coronation? I didn't see them.

[Rumsy4]

3 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

Were WHook and Alice at the coronation? I didn't see them.

Yup.

[Camera One]

4 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

Were WHook and Alice at the coronation? I didn't see them.

Yep, they were to the left of the main aisle, from the perspective of Snowing.  That was the side with Wish Henry, Granny, Blue, Gepetto, Pinocchio, Tiana, and all our favorite random extras.  Robyn was there too.

EDIT: Wow, nice Gif.  I forgot Zelena and Archie were on that side as well.

Edited May 22, 2018 by Camera One

[Camera One]

This episode needs a title change.  It should actually be called "Never Leaving Storybrooke Again".  

[Inquirer]

2 hours ago, KingOfHearts said:

I would've preferred if they had shot it in the Storybrooke woods as the script says. The soundstage was incredibly distracting and took me out of it.

Hell no, the soundstage was great! Made everyone accept that Rumple's in purgatory instead of Heaven, whereas the woods would be too Heavenly. 

Quote

Why?  Gold did some unspeakably evil things as well.

Also, why are they still calling him Gold? He's freaking Weaver now! Just call him Weaver!

Quote

Yeah, that's interesting.  What we saw was Wish Henry escorting Regina in with Adult Henry.  It makes more sense that he would be with Emma.

Lana must have insisted on Regina having both Henrys to herself. God forbid Wish Henry be with literally the only mother he ever knew.

Edited May 22, 2018 by Inquirer

[RoberTee]

So... Once Upon a Time (finally) ended. And first let me say this is a show that holds a special place in my heart. Not because of its quality, which leaves a lot to be desired, but because when it started, almost seven years ago, I was in a very different stage of my life and I started watching it with very special person at the time, with whom I don't talk anymore due to a series of bad decisions and misjudgements on my part. But point is my life changed A LOT since this show started and throughout these ups and down I never missed one single episode of this messy adventure, alongside its heroes and villains. So tonight, as I was watching the last minutes, I did tear up a bit, no exactly because of the show itself, but because it felt like the end of an era for me. And as the quality of the show dropped, a lot of people around me stopped watching it (and rightfuly so), but even during the times I was hate-watching, it always felt like a safe place for me. Such is the power of movies and television. They can touch in a million different ways and leave you this nostalgic feeling about yourself and your life that you don't quite know how to replace. 

Now that I opened up a bit about myself, let me talk about the show. The first three seasons were as good as it gets for a show with this premise. Good humour, nice storylines, some very smart twists and that old Disney touch we expect from this kind of show. Jennifer Morrison proved she can be a very captivating leading actress and the likes of Lana Parrilla, Robert Carlyle and Ginnifer Goodwin gave outstanding (sometimes Emmy-worthy) performances. Some memorable guest stars are also worth mentioning, like Barbra Hershey, Kristin Bauer Van Straten, Robbie Kay or Rebecca Mader, who all gave us brilliant villains, or even Sebastian Stan or Jamie Dornan, who ended up moving to bigger career but nonetheless left their mark in the OUAT-verse. 

Then came season four and ABC decided to cash in on the Frozen hype and not even Elizabeth Mitchell's and Victoria Smurfit's villainesses managed to save the boat. It was all downhill from there. But I am glad they let the ship sink, because it sunk so low that by the time season six came, I was loving it again in a it's-so-bad-it's-good way. The show become almost a comedy, a parody of its former self, and I shamefuly ate every little bit of it! But the show did have a proper happy ending at the finale of season six, but instead of bowing out, they decided to milk the cow until it dried. And so came the most unnecessary season of a TV show of all time, the one no one asked for, season seven. And with it came a bunch of characters we knew nothing about but some how we were supposed to care about after spending six years with a different set of characters. Of course all the new characters were useless and irrelevant and none will be remembered a month from now (shout out to Adelaide Kane, the only one who raised above poor storytelling and underdeveloped characters and actually gave a standout, well-rounded performance). And all of this brings us to the episode I saw tonight, the series finale. And to that I say:

WHAT THE FUCK?? 

That was probably the worst episode of all time :lmao: Did a toddler write this? I was laughing out loud the whole time (except for the last minutes, when I started to cry for the reasons I mentioned before). But seriously, what the hell happened? 

All of a sudden Robin and Alice are in the Wish Realm? ? And Zelena's with them? ? And where the fuck did the Charmings came from? ? And who's castle were they on during the round table meeting? ? And Wish Henry hugging Regina after pointing a sword to her chest? ? Wish Rumple easily turning to dust? ? Regina's dramatic speech when Rumple died? ?

Until here this was classic silly OUAT, but then... 

Regina somehow brought ALL the realms to Marine?? Why? Why would you do that? Did you at least ask other people what they thought? And does this mean there are two version of each character living in the same place? WAIT! Does this mean there are THREE version of Henry? Real Teen Henry, Wish Teen Henry AND Adult Henry? So Teen Henry has to watch his adult self make out with his future wife? What about when Teen Henry grows up? He's gonna end up alone because Adult Henry is married to Teen Henry's future wife? And who was elected Queen? Storybrooke Regina or Future Regina? Shouldn't they at least co-reign? What about the Future Zelena who's leaving in San Francisco with her fiance? Did someone tell her she's in the past? Or is Storybrooke Zelena now the mother of Child Robin and Teen Robin? Are both Zelena's walking Teen Robin down the aisle? Will Child Robin be Teen Robin's flower girl? 

HOW ARE THESE CHARACTERS FROM ALTERNATE UNIVERSES AND DIFFERENT TIMELINES ALL LIVING TOGETHER IN THE SAME TOWN?? 

Actually, it was a fitting ending to a very, very, very messy show! LMAO

RIP Once Upon a Time. You'll always have a special place in my heart and I shall remember you with nothing but kindness. 

PS: I low-key hope Wish Peter Pan and Wish Cruella are still locked somewhere in Wish Rumple's castle in Storybrooke and Regina and Henry just forgot about them ?

[Mitch]

Oh RoberTee, you kind of put into words how I feel about the show..I started watching in a kind of goofy time in my life where things were up in the air and I could really see myself casting the Dark Curse to get to something new...(and for a split second it would be fun to have everyone under my thumb..for a day or two then like Regina I would have gotten bored..) as a matter of fact, I first learned about the show from a billboard..outside a therapists office "serioulsy" (little did I know that I would need therapy BECAUSE of this show years later...) Its all good now but I the show has a place in my heart because of that rough patch, and I thought it sucked right after the curse broke but I stuck in there!

The finale sucked as bad as the show has for the last few seasons..which I expected but the show said, "Hold my beer" by doing one last jump over that shark with the last 10 minutes! It made no sense at all...(how big are the Maine woods anyway????) Can satelittes see Agrablah now? Will some hiker stumble into Oz? You could tell the network was just like "Get the damn thing over and off our screens" that the last two episodes had no oversight or interference..it was A & E's wet dream combined with thier one last suck up to the corporate Disney...( "See its a real life Disneyworld in the Maine woods....now can we have another job??")

I wanted the Black Fairy to waltz in and Bwhahah..."Regina, you sap, you fell for my plan, now that I have ALL of you together it will be much easier to kill you all! BWAHAHAHAHA...." THE END!

[Shanna Marie]

16 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

She liked power and being able to lord it over people, but she never showed interest in the day to day aspects of ruling a nation (any thoughts on trade? The economy? Just getting people behind her?) or even of running a small town. Nor did she really seek to lead the Nevengers, the Storeybrooke crew, or even in the stupid resistance in the new EF. She was just kinda there.

That's a good point. She really only became queen and mayor because it put her in a position to get her revenge against Snow. She liked having power over others but had zero interest in leading. She only sort of managed to act like a real mayor during the curse because that was part of her scheme, but once the curse broke and everyone knew who she was, I don't think she did one "mayoral" thing. The only time the mayor's office seemed to involve doing anything to lead the town, it was during the time Snow was drafted into being mayor while Regina sulked about Robin. Then Snow had to deal with the power outage and then hold town meetings to figure out how to deal with the ice wall. Emma was the one who provided leadership to the Nevengers, and Regina went off on her own when she didn't agree with the plan. Regina spent most of season 4 sulking about not getting everything she wanted. She was mostly off on her own for a lot of season 5 rather than providing any kind of leadership. If someone needed to rally the troops, it was either Emma or Snow. Even in this episode, it was Snow rallying everyone. Which makes it equally hard to believe that Regina would want this at all unless it's a purely ceremonial title that comes with no actual power or responsibility (basically, being Miss Storyverse who does little more than declare festivals to be open) or that anyone would think of her as a leader, even if you don't factor in the evil part. I can just picture her opponents' attack ads pointing out that she's twice abandoned her position to go off and do her own thing, first with Robin and later to go follow Henry around. Except she's back in time now, so I guess to them she hasn't yet quit.

I wonder what 2018 Regina thinks of all this. Is she stuck being mayor of Storybrooke while her future self is Queen of the Universe? Can Regina become Queen of the Universe if she doesn't run off to follow Henry and get stuck in the curse? Or in this timeline will she run off to the Disenchanted Forest to try to get away from her future self?

[Rumsy4]

2 hours ago, Mitch said:

it was A & E's wet dream combined with thier one last suck up to the corporate Disney...( "See its a real life Disneyworld in the Maine woods....now can we have another job??")

And it looks like it worked. :-p

2 hours ago, Mitch said:

I wanted the Black Fairy to waltz in and Bwhahah..."Regina, you sap, you fell for my plan, now that I have ALL of you together it will be much easier to kill you all! BWAHAHAHAHA...." THE END!

Exactly. This just paved the way for all the villains who ever wanted world domination.

[KingOfHearts]

I don't think everyone in the multiverse wants to live three doors down from the Evil Queen, the Wicked Witch, and Maleficent.

[RulerofallIsurvey]

21 hours ago, Camera One said:

I tried saying it out loud, and it does sound sarcastic.  I guess they wanted to give Jennifer Morrison one more challenging acting moment.

It might as well be, "So --- is this it?  Can we put you off to pasture?"

That's probably exactly what Emma was thinking.  I know I would have been.

[tennisgurl]

3 hours ago, KingOfHearts said:

I don't think everyone in the multiverse wants to live three doors down from the Evil Queen, the Wicked Witch, and Maleficent.

Its almost like putting every supervillain in the multiverse together in one place, frequently mixed with people who have no way to defend themselves against them, is a really bad idea or something!

[Shanna Marie]

I've decided that my headcanon is that Emma was actually the one elected to be overall ruler, but she said something like, "Um, thanks, I'm honored, but I've got a newborn and a job. I don't have time to play queen of the universe. Give it to Regina. That'll keep her busy, make her happy, and keep her out of the Henrys' hair so they have a chance at not turning into Norman Bates."

[ParadoxLost]

50 minutes ago, Shanna Marie said:

I've decided that my headcanon is that Emma was actually the one elected to be overall ruler, but she said something like, "Um, thanks, I'm honored, but I've got a newborn and a job. I don't have time to play queen of the universe. Give it to Regina. That'll keep her busy, make her happy, and keep her out of the Henrys' hair so they have a chance at not turning into Norman Bates."

This is right in line with my headcannon for years that the reason everyone treated Regina like family was that they had secret townhall meetings where they strategized on how to manage Regina to keep her from lashing out and wreaking havoc upon them again.

[Camera One]

1 minute ago, ParadoxLost said:

This is right in line with my headcannon for years that the reason everyone treated Regina like family was that they had secret townhall meetings where they strategized on how to manage Regina to keep her from lashing out and wreaking havoc upon them again.

Yeah, I began thinking this in the 4A episode where Snow, Emma, Charming and even Henry assumed that Regina might go beserk since she "lost" Robin with the return of Marian.  It makes the show less infuriating to imagine that Emma, Snow and Henry say things just to placate her.

[Rumsy4]

After the Lasagne debacle they learned their lesson. 

[tennisgurl]

Honestly, everyone just placating Regina and treating her like a super powered toddler on the verge of a meltdown every five seconds to keep her from setting people on fire makes WAY more sense than everything just deciding that she was the best thing since chocolate chip cookies. Its backed up pretty well by cannon too. People are always bending over backwards for her and to keep her happy, more than anyone else. 

Maybe the Queen of Everything is secretly like Miss America, a mostly ceremonial title (except no charity work or raising awareness about causes like MA) where Regina wears pretty dresses, smiles, waves, and gets to hang out in her big fancy castle all day long while people cheer for her. She sits in cars during parades, and cuts ribbons at new parks with giant scissors. Meanwhile, Snow, Charming, Emma, and leaders from other lands are all running a constitutional monarchy behind her back, and are the ones actually calling the shots. That way, they can actually keep this massive fractured mess of a million realms running without having to worry about Regina screwing things up. 

Edited May 23, 2018 by tennisgurl

[Camera One]

The deleted scene with Wish Granny, Wish Grumpy and Wish Blue at the Snowing statue (hopefully it will be on the DVD) suggested that life was really bad in the Wish Realm.  So Evil Wish Henry was a really bad King, I guess?  Why would he turn against all his grandparents' old friends?  Yes, he experienced loss but he would have had a solid upbringing and he had many people who would have loved him.  I actually thought Wish Henry was one of the more entertaining aspects of the 2-hour finale (it's so rare to see someone actually treating Regina with contempt), but as usual, they didn't put much thought into the characters.  I suppose Wish Rumple could have been wreaking havoc on the kingdom, but then they had Wish Henry willingly and happily making a deal with him.  I don't get why Wish Henry suddenly cut Regina's hand.  

Edited May 23, 2018 by Camera One

[KingOfHearts]

The Outlaw Queen scene was kind of offensive, imo. The scene with Emma and Neal in 5x12 made a little more sense, since Emma acted surprised to see him. Regina's conversation with Robin was acted as if they did these afterlife Skype calls on a regular basis. The pep talk didn't do anything to help Regina since Snowing showed up to save her anyway. It was pointless. Neal assured Emma the Underworld was dangerous, which served the story in letting the audience know it wouldn't be easy saving Hook. (Plus, there was no way we could go to the Underworld and not have him addressed. That would be weird.) Robin, on the other hand, is not needed at all, especially since the purpose of the ending was to show Regina's happy ending was herself.