S19.E13: The Undiscovered Country

[Aethera]

As I've said before in Episode Threads - I think at this point, everyone who posts regularly in this forum has been very clear on their opinions about Benson and Barba. 

We want to let discussion of the two of them, as is relevant to particular episodes, continue, but it keeps resulting in fights. I think everyone needs to take a deep breath, and stop posting the same content over and over again. If you have already expressed your opinion on Benson and Barba, please don't keep posting the same thoughts and arguments over and over again. 

Also, let's remember that Benson is a fictional character, and everyone here is allowed to like her or hate her or roll their eyes or whatever they want. But opinions about her are not hills worth dying on. If you disagree with someone, and you've already stated your opinion, just scroll past the post and move on. 

[wonderwoman]

On February 8, 2018 at 12:26 AM, Vicky8675309 said:

big eye roll at Olivia going into the hostage situation and "fixing" it.....she does everything and is like a superhero....ugh

Exactly my reaction. As for the rest... I have no words.

Edited February 16, 2018 by wonderwoman

[Xeliou66]

A few more thoughts about this episode :

I liked that McCoy mentioned Mark Jefferies to Stone, I liked Jefferies on Justice, he was a cool DA that didn’t get enough screen time, and it was a nice touch that McCoy knows him. 

I really liked the balance of this episode, it wasn’t preachy or heavy handed despite having an SVU member personally involved, both Dworkin and Stone made good points. 

I just really wish this had been a 2 parter and Info Wars had never aired, a 2 parter would’ve allowed a greater exploration of the case, of the parents and their wishes, of why Barba went off the deep end, of McCoy’s reaction to the case, I would’ve loved to see him chew Barba out and hear about who he would appoint to handle SVU cases in the meantime, probably O’Dwyer, Dworkin should’ve gotten more screen time, we could’ve had more testimony from both sides and we could’ve had Barba say goodbye to everyone, not just Benson and McCoy, I wish we had gotten a scene with Fin, Carisi and Rollins saying goodbye to Barba as well.

I’m really glad to see that Jack McCoy is back in office as DA, and I didn’t find it to be a continuity error at all, it’s very believable that McCoy would be back in office, the new DA was probably unpopular after the escort scandal and McCoy likely decide to run against him and won. I also think that this explains why Cutter wasn’t heard from again on SVU after his handful of appearances, McCoy probably gave him back his old job as EADA prosecuting mainly homicides.

Edited February 25, 2018 by Xeliou66

[Joe Hellandback]

I quite liked this, nice to see some familiar faces and a nice goodbye for Barba. What will he do now? I figure represent Cuban refugees/political dissidents but it would be awesome if he came back some time representing a defendant against the SVU.

Never seen Stone before so I have an open mind. The essential thing is that he doesn't become Benson's lapdog, I want a scene where she walks up to him drinking in a bar and he says to her "No, we're not playing that game" and walks away. 

[QueenMab]

Joe....I too would love that scene! Not letting her pour enough scotch down Stone's throat to get him to pour out all his emotional insecurities while she sits there gathering Intel, and discovering every button to push he has to make him her "bitch on a leash", is NOT how we want this to go! One good " that ain't going to work with me" scene from Stone would be very satisfying. :)

[WineCheeseChocolat]

A round of which ADA did it better...

Stomping on the law and civil liberties in a show of anguish after getting too personally attached to a case...

ADA Barba in The Undiscovered Country or ADA Cabot in Guilt?

I vote Cabot.

Bonus round! The usage of”suck” in a professional setting

Lt Benson in The Undiscovered Country (I hope you suck) or ADA Novak in Uncle (I guess I suck)

I vote Novak.

[jzmd]

Quote

On 2/7/2018 at 9:28 PM, catrice2 said:

Am I the only one from the Law and Order family that cares that Ben Stone is dead? I did not care about the episode, have not watched more than a few in 3 years, but came back for Jack. Olivia is a joke.  Never liked Barba or the way the actor portrayed him.  

Catrice2, it is so refreshing to find a site that isn't completely dedicated to the worship of Rafael Barba/Raul Esparza.

 

[agentp]

On 2/9/2018 at 9:51 AM, methadonna said:

(sorry, ever since I saw her on Inside the Actor’s Studio—at which point, I had still enjoyed her on the show—I’ve suspected she’s...not very bright, and it’s made it harder for me to appreciate even Early Benson, because RL Mariska came across to me as such an icky combination of dumb and desperate-to-be-liked-while-being-extremely-dislikable)

Hey, cut her some slack, will ya? She’s Californian, “dumb and desperate-to-be-liked-while-being-extremely-unlikeable” are par for the course.

[CrystalBlue]

On 5/26/2019 at 9:17 PM, agentp said:

Hey, cut her some slack, will ya? She’s Californian, “dumb and desperate-to-be-liked-while-being-extremely-unlikeable” are par for the course.

Hey, I'm a native Californian.  Is this thread about the ep "The Undiscovered Country" or for bashing certain people?

[agentp]

On 7/3/2019 at 5:57 AM, CrystalBlue said:

Hey, I'm a native Californian.  Is this thread about the ep "The Undiscovered Country" or for bashing certain people?

Sorry, I was feeling snarky when I typed that. Apologies for offending you. As for the thread, based on the posts, I think it’s a combination of both.

[CrystalBlue]

8 hours ago, agentp said:

Sorry, I was feeling snarky when I typed that. Apologies for offending you. As for the thread, based on the posts, I think it’s a combination of both.

No problem!  😄  

[Xeliou66]

This episode was on on a rerun tonight and I watched it: as much as I dislike how Barba departed, I like the episode just for seeing Jack McCoy again, and especially for McCoy’s speech at Ben Stone’s funeral, for anyone who loved the original L&O and for fans of both Stone and McCoy, that was an awesome moment, I loved McCoy’s speech and I loved McCoy and Peter’s conversation outside the courthouse. Dworkin was great as always as well, I laughed out loud at his “what did the little bastard do to you?” joke to Barba.

So while I thought Barba’s exit was a really poor ending for his character, I can’t help but like the episode just for seeing McCoy again and his interactions with everyone, and particularly McCoy’s eulogy of Ben Stone, best moment in the last couple of seasons of SVU.

Edited September 13, 2019 by Xeliou66

[GreyBunny]

So, I happened across this episode and it reminded me why I haven’t watched SVU in years. 

It was absolute shit.

The father should have been charged with kidnapping and assaulting the babysitter, and, regardless of the baby’s condition, it wasn’t at all Barba’s place to make any decisions for the boy and pull the plug. He should have been found guilty.

Ugh.

[Xeliou66]

8 hours ago, GreyBunny said:

So, I happened across this episode and it reminded me why I haven’t watched SVU in years. 

It was absolute shit.

The father should have been charged with kidnapping and assaulting the babysitter, and, regardless of the baby’s condition, it wasn’t at all Barba’s place to make any decisions for the boy and pull the plug. He should have been found guilty.

Ugh.

The father was charged - I think he took a plea, McCoy told Barba to plead him out. But I would’ve liked more clarification on that, and on what the father’s position on the whole thing was anyway. Barba’s exit was really poor, and Barba had become a shell of his old self, I really hate what they did to him.

And there were a lot of flaws with this episode, but what prevented it from being awful was the appearance of Jack McCoy -it was great to see him once again, and for fans of the Mothership, it was especially special seeing him eulogize Ben Stone. Plus we had Dworkin on, he was a memorable defense attorney from the Mothership and I loved his humor, asking Barba “so what did the little bastard ever do to you?” was really good dark humor. 

[GreyBunny]

On 12/7/2020 at 6:50 AM, Xeliou66 said:

The father was charged - I think he took a plea, McCoy told Barba to plead him out. But I would’ve liked more clarification on that, and on what the father’s position on the whole thing was anyway. Barba’s exit was really poor, and Barba had become a shell of his old self, I really hate what they did to him.

And there were a lot of flaws with this episode, but what prevented it from being awful was the appearance of Jack McCoy -it was great to see him once again, and for fans of the Mothership, it was especially special seeing him eulogize Ben Stone. Plus we had Dworkin on, he was a memorable defense attorney from the Mothership and I loved his humor, asking Barba “so what did the little bastard ever do to you?” was really good dark humor. 

He had a history of sleeping with his female subordinates, he grossed me out because of that. Couldn’t watch him anymore. 

[Sidthesloth44]

What the hell have I missed? I haven't watched SVU  cronologically in a long time, but I knew that Barba would be leaving mid season 19. Tho I had no clue that they have run his character into the ground by season 18! Apparently he has been reduced from a hotshot prosecutor with a silver tounge to simply be Bensons love interest. How pathetic and sad is that?? Personally I have never gotten any romance vibe from those two, and if they ever hooked up it would look and be so wrong! 

I loved Rafael since his first appearence, with his suit, law knowlegde and confidence/swagger. I was hooked. It saddens me to read what he has been reduced to, when IMO he has been carrying the show for years.  

His exit was a disgrace, and Barba deserved a worthy send off, but nah, they had to appease the Barson shippers I guess. That speech to Olivia was downright repulsive, and sounded  like something straight from a fanfiction. I'm just happy it didn't end with Barson becoming canon.

All in all I'm sad to see Barba go, but also relieved that he did before the writers could damage him further (if that's possible). He's coming back now in 22x04, and I hope they bring back s14-17 Barba, and not Captain Bensons unrequited love interest.

Thank god for fanfiction, keeping the dead characters alive.

[lavenderblue]

I haven't watched new episodes of SVU since about 2014 or '15, so for the last couple months I've been catching up on the past several seasons as something to do on Hulu. I watched this last night, rolling my eyes at Benson's unwarranted but typical unprofessionalism with Stone and then the lunacy of Barba's final scene with Benson, and then came over here and laughed so hard at the similar reactions in this thread. Truly cathartic.