Season 2: Blood, Gore, We Want Some More!

[CaptainTightpants]

On 11/19/2017 at 7:11 PM, Philbert said:

We've known since season one that Axel has a serious crush on her

But Axel really seemed to have a crush on Doc too. He was going to give her his last pudding cup! Although I thought from the by-play at the compound that they were hinting that Doc is gay, so that might be a non-starter. 

Edited November 29, 2017 by CaptainTightpants

[Philbert]

On 11/28/2017 at 8:30 PM, CaptainTightpants said:

But Axel really seemed to have a crush on Doc too. He was going to give her his last pudding cup! Although I thought from the by-play at the compound that they were hinting that Doc is gay, so that might be a non-starter. 

 And tonight there was at least some flirting between him and Vanessa's sister. Damn dog. It's true what they say about Marines :)

[snowwhyte]

As soon as the Sheriff invited them for BBQ i knew they were cannibals. BBQ always means people in the Apocalypse.

[comanick]

5 hours ago, snowwhyte said:

As soon as the Sheriff invited them for BBQ i knew they were cannibals. BBQ always means people in the Apocalypse.

Yeah, I thought that too but I never assumed they were eating vamps. 

Random Thoughts: 

-At first I liked the new Julius character but now he is starting to behave as stupidly as Doc. Annoying

-What was up with the flirting between Axel and Scarlett? It seemed weird and out of nowhere. 

-Dimitri's storyline makes zero sense at this point. 

-Wheres Vanessa? While she has been annoying lately, an entire episode without her seems weird. Like who were those guys that took her? Where did they take her? 

[BasilSeal]

On 01 December 2017 at 3:47 PM, comanick said:

Wheres Vanessa? While she has been annoying lately, an entire episode without her seems weird. Like who were those guys that took her? Where did they take her? 

Vanessa is with the people who presumably created her in the first place, the shadowy company or govt department who ran 'the farm', the radioactive underground bunker where they were conducting vampire based experiments, and where Vanessa and Scarlet lived as young children, what their aim is isn't clear, probably either a solution to the vampire 'problem', or an attempt to create some sort of human vampire hybrid as a fast healing, extra strong super soldier, or maybe, even some original reason, who know.

either way, this organisation is still functioning and has a secure base with men and infrastructure. Vanessa thought this base was located at the mountain painted on the nursery wall in the farm bunker. Maybe it's the same mountain that is above the clouds and hence deemed safe from vampires, we saw them sending out balloons in the first episode, and cannibal sheriff mentioned it again in the episode, so it has to have some relevance to the plot.

Dimitri is tracking Scarlet, presumably because he somehow knows Vanessa is no longer available, why he want's a van helsing isn't clear but they are  the key to something, for some reason. Dimitri was held captive at the farm by the same people who now have Vanessa, so it's highly likely that he has some thing to do with their special powers.

[CaptainTightpants]

On 11/30/2017 at 11:52 PM, Philbert said:

And tonight there was at least some flirting between him and Vanessa's sister.

I loved this development! When given the chance, always go for the awesome ninja.

On 12/1/2017 at 5:22 AM, snowwhyte said:

As soon as the Sheriff invited them for BBQ i knew they were cannibals. BBQ always means people in the Apocalypse.

The fact that they were making jerky out of necrotic tissue is for me, the grossest thing that the show has thrown at us so far. And the feral vampire was making very distressing upset-puppy sounds as they were roasting it while it was conscious. I wonder if they recorded an actual dog for the show?

I actually thought that was more nauseating than the apparent necrophilia that the deputies indulge in because being cannibals is not bad enough for these heroes!

 

On 12/1/2017 at 10:47 AM, comanick said:

Dimitri's storyline makes zero sense at this point. 

It barely even feels like his storyline is happening in the same show. This noxema sisterhood came out of nowhere and are apparently down with blindly following him in his quest to find Scarlett. Who is "a treasure" according to Dimitri. I don't disagree, she is a breath of fresh air as far as the cast is concerned, but this does not bode well for Scarlett. 

Also, why are the vampires standing around it the afternoon without ill effects? I know they were in the woods but it didn't look all that sheltered from the sun. 

 

3 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

Maybe it's the same mountain that is above the clouds and hence deemed safe from vampires, we saw them sending out balloons in the first episode, and cannibal sheriff mentioned it again in the episode, so it has to have some relevance to the plot.

Episode 12 or 13 is called "Crooked Falls" on my episode list, which is the name of the town that the sheriff mentioned. So I'm assuming that all the plot threads and various characters are going to end up there by the end of the season.  

I didn't miss Vanessa at all this episode. And thankfully Axel is back to his old self, because he is responsible for at least 50% of all the personality in the whole show! 

[BasilSeal]

7 hours ago, CaptainTightpants said:

The fact that they were making jerky out of necrotic tissue is for me, the grossest thing that the show has thrown at us so far.

Forgive the pedantry but the vampires are still living creatures, they're just not human, so their flesh isn't necrotic, if they were eating zombies then that would be a different matter. the fact that the vampires can potentially be turned back adds an extra dimension to the show, there's no moral dichotomy for the characters in the walking dead when they kill the zombies, but when these characters kill vampires, they're killing someone who could be turned back into a decent human being like Phil or Julius have been.

Whatever faults this show has, it's much better at exploring the moral dichotomy at the heart of surviving a world changing event like The Rising. I thought the first series dealt very well with the duplicitous nature of survival, they group must work together, but everyone has their own angle, and their own secrets, It's a theme that the walking dead tries, and IMO fails miserably, to deal with.

[snowwhyte]

It kind of frustrates me that they don't address the moral implications of having a cure for vampirism more. Vanessa has the cure but is still more likely to kill vampires than try to cure them. The cannibals were told of a cure and didn't seem that interested. Even if they are completely selfish and not interested in saving strangers there is always the possibility that they themselves might be turned and need a cure. 

[CaptainTightpants]

12 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

Forgive the pedantry but the vampires are still living creatures, they're just not human, so their flesh isn't necrotic, if they were eating zombies then that would be a different matter.

Yes, I guess on this show vampires are not undead so much "infected". I still find the thought of eating something that eats people as deeply unsettling. Especially when the cannibals kept referring to them as "juicy". I still find the cannibal episode of Torchwood to be creepy as hell and I must have watched it a decade ago. And they were only eating normal people. 

I also realize upon review of episode 7 that I misinterpreted Dimitri's comment about a "treasure". He was talking about the fancy key that Scarlett was hiding, not Scarlett herself. I blame the darkness that the scene was shot in, I couldn't really tell what was going on. I thought that Scarlett would have some worth or leverage even as a hostage if she was valuable in some way. But if the vampires only want the fancy key then the whole gang is in trouble. I really, really hope they keep her in the cast because I am enjoying the dynamic she brings to the group. 

5 hours ago, snowwhyte said:

Vanessa has the cure but is still more likely to kill vampires than try to cure them.

Vanessa seems oddly disengaged from this world. Which I can somewhat see since she essentially slept through the first couple of years of the vampocalypse. I've lost track of how long she has actually been awake but I'm not sure it has been more than a month or so. They definitely need to show some growth for her character and realizing the global nature of the collapse would certainly be a start. She has been only acting on things that affected her or her immediate family up till now. It sucks to be the new messiah, but girl needs to embrace the consequences of her abilities. 

[loki567]

I almost wonder if there's something up with Kelly Overton's contract because Scarlett feels like one of those instances when the writers are trying to replace a major character. She's a Van Helsing, she's part of the same experiments as Vanessa, she has ninja skills, and now she has a flirtation with Axel. Basically seems like Missy Peregrym could be the lead without that much trouble.

Speaking of Axel, the show is so much better off with the non-vampire version of him being front and center. VH desperately needs a sense of humor and he gives it one. 

[comanick]

18 hours ago, loki567 said:

I almost wonder if there's something up with Kelly Overton's contract because Scarlett feels like one of those instances when the writers are trying to replace a major character. She's a Van Helsing, she's part of the same experiments as Vanessa, she has ninja skills, and now she has a flirtation with Axel. Basically seems like Missy Peregrym could be the lead without that much trouble.

Speaking of Axel, the show is so much better off with the non-vampire version of him being front and center. VH desperately needs a sense of humor and he gives it one. 

I wondered that too for a moment, especially when Vanessa didn't show up in the last episode but a part of me also feels like Scarlett won't make it through this season alive. So we will have to wait and see. 

[comanick]

On 12/3/2017 at 10:30 PM, CaptainTightpants said:

It barely even feels like his storyline is happening in the same show. This noxema sisterhood came out of nowhere and are apparently down with blindly following him in his quest to find Scarlett. Who is "a treasure" according to Dimitri. I don't disagree, she is a breath of fresh air as far as the cast is concerned, but this does not bode well for Scarlett. 

Also, why are the vampires standing around it the afternoon without ill effects? I know they were in the woods but it didn't look all that sheltered from the sun. 

I just don't get it. Who the hell is the sisterhood and how could they follow a previous leader so weak and stupid that she would get herself killed by that low level vamp(can't remember his name, the 1 always screaming).  And now they are following said low level vamp? 

How does Dimitri even know that Vanessa is not with Scarlett? 

I think the vamps can walk around in the day because of whatever natural event that caused the rising blocked out the sun at least partially. I assume the days are always cloudy ass oppose to sunny. They even mentioned that is harder for them to move around during the day so the sun must have some effect, just not as much as before. 

[Philbert]

On 12/4/2017 at 6:25 PM, loki567 said:

I almost wonder if there's something up with Kelly Overton's contract because Scarlett feels like one of those instances when the writers are trying to replace a major character. She's a Van Helsing, she's part of the same experiments as Vanessa, she has ninja skills, and now she has a flirtation with Axel. Basically seems like Missy Peregrym could be the lead without that much trouble.

Speaking of Axel, the show is so much better off with the non-vampire version of him being front and center. VH desperately needs a sense of humor and he gives it one. 

 

After tonight's episode, we seem to be well past the 'flirting' part...and that really works for me.

[Philbert]

On 12/4/2017 at 6:05 AM, BasilSeal said:

 

Whatever faults this show has, it's much better at exploring the moral dichotomy at the heart of surviving a world changing event like The Rising. I thought the first series dealt very well with the duplicitous nature of survival, they group must work together, but everyone has their own angle, and their own secrets, It's a theme that the walking dead tries, and IMO fails miserably, to deal with.

 

This post so much. I absolutely loath TWD and I don't understand why some people still like it. It's become a boring, self indulgent mess.  I think SyFy's "Z Nation" does a MUCH better job at this-on just about every level. 

[snowwhyte]

I enjoy this show so much better without Vanessa. Scarlett is great and I like her and Axel together. I really don't want the show to kill her off. It was bad enough that we've probably lost Julius.

[loki567]

I still maintain that it seems like the show is positioning Scarlett as a replacement lead. Personally, I've never minded Kelly Overton, but it's a bad sign that in about three episodes it feels like we've gotten more character development out of Scarlett than Vanessa. Feels like the writers realize they botch Vanessa's character and now are trying for a do-over. 

[comanick]

46 minutes ago, loki567 said:

I still maintain that it seems like the show is positioning Scarlett as a replacement lead. Personally, I've never minded Kelly Overton, but it's a bad sign that in about three episodes it feels like we've gotten more character development out of Scarlett than Vanessa. Feels like the writers realize they botch Vanessa's character and now are trying for a do-over. 

Now i am starting to think the same thing. We havent seen Vanessa in 2 episodes. We are getting a Scarlett background story which wouldn;t be necessary if they were gonna kill her off. She suddenly has the same powers as Vanessa, she's probably a more skilled fighter than Vanessa and shes sleeping with the guy we all assumed vanessa would get with. Its not looking to good for vanessa as the lead which sucks because unlike others I like Vanessa in the lead. I feel the writers totally botched her character this year but I still like her.

I do hope Julius is  dead. His personality 180 has really annoyed me.

What's up with Dimitri? How does he seem to know everything that is going on. How did he even know Julius had the key? Really?  

[millahnna]

Doc and Julius bonding over junk food might be my new favorite thing, ever.

[CaptainTightpants]

Axel draped across a pile of money like a centerfold was the best visual of the episode and a sterling example of why his character is the heart of the show. Although his improvised duct tape and wads of cash armour was also a hilarious moment! He is usually responsible for the brief yet vital moments of humour in the show.

And Julius discovering the delights of modern snackfoods was also a fun moment. I'm glad that the show is doing a better job of balancing some humour with all the darkness this season. 

Doc has shown some good character growth this season, I'm glad that they spent some time on her. She was positively scrappy this episode! And I'm holding out hope that nacho loving Julius is only mostly dead. It is really uncool to kill a dude when he has just discovered the joys of kitkat's!

Dimitri, his sidekick and the sisterhood are still awkward and embarrassing. I'm not sure why the vampires are the low point of a vampire show, but here we are. 

I didn't miss Vanessa at all, I hope we get to stick with Ninja Scarlett and Axel because they are awesome. 

[Philbert]

17 minutes ago, millahnna said:

Doc and Julius bonding over junk food might be my new favorite thing, ever.

 

I already loved the Julius character but that whole scene with the chips/nachos/kit-kits was pure gold. Easily one of the best characters on this show.

[snowwhyte]

10 hours ago, CaptainTightpants said:

 

Dimitri, his sidekick and the sisterhood are still awkward and embarrassing. I'm not sure why the vampires are the low point of a vampire show, but here we are. 

I didn't miss Vanessa at all, I hope we get to stick with Ninja Scarlett and Axel because they are awesome. 

The vampires are definitely the worst part of the show for me especially the new sidekick of Dimitri. The exaggerated, creepy type of vampire is played so much better by Christopher Heyerdahl. This guy reminds me of someone in an acting class who's just been told to play a creepy vampire and just imitates the vampires of old silent films with the exagerated movements. I've given this too much thought but I do feel like some of the vampires don't fit in well with the rest of the show.

[BasilSeal]

On 08/12/2017 at 11:11 AM, snowwhyte said:

I enjoy this show so much better without Vanessa. Scarlett is great and I like her and Axel together. I really don't want the show to kill her off. It was bad enough that we've probably lost Julius.

Dimitri does say Julius is dead, and you'd think his superior senses would tell him whether Julius was breathing or not, but i would be surprised if Julius was dead at this point, it would be a bit of a low key way for an important character to be killed off, i wonder if it's a plot device to separate him from the others and possibly have him meet up with Phil and Lucky and hence direct them to the magic mountain, or whatever it's called, for the big finale showdown.

[snowwhyte]

It would be a bit anticlimactic if Julius spends decades as a vampire, turns human and rediscovers his humanity only to die after being thrown against a tree. 

[Philbert]

"Oh my God, they killed Vanessa. Those bastards!!!!!"

 

Said no Van Helsing fan ever

 

:)

[CaptainTightpants]

I called the old lady as evil from the first scene. That being said, I was surprised by the multiple bullets at the end. though I thought there would be trouble as soon as she picked up the gun. Although this show being this show, I have to assume that Vanessa is probably still alive. And about to go on a fake-mom murder spree. Which Abigail truthfully deserves from what we saw this episode. Subterfuge and deceit never work, indeed! If Vanessa really is dead I hope that Scarlet goes totally ninja on all their asses!

The "V for Vandetta" voice-through-the-vents plot device kinda went nowhere. I'm not sure why they thought that would work. 

The fact that these non-military people are mostly interested in immortality and not a cure for vamparism sadly comes as no surprise. You can count on big corporations to be evil unto the very end apparently. Having Harrison dressed head to toe in black for every scene was quite an anvil. He is obviously and robotically evil with a Mr. Burns/Darth Vader kind of vibe. 

It took Vanessa way too long to figure out that she was being played. That being said this episode was some of the best acting we have seen from Kelly Overton in a while. 

The biggest plot hole I see from this episode is about Vanessa's real mom. If Vanessa and Scarlet are the result of an accidental exposure to the vampiric virus while she was pregnant, why didn't she immediately turn or die? I'm thinking that either there is some questionable science behind that or fake-mom was lying about that too. Also, does that mean that Dimitri is the vamp-dad? He seems the most likely candidate since he was being held at the farm and experimented on at the time. 

[snowwhyte]

Am not convinced Vanessa is dead. I don't know if her death will have much emotional impact if there's no one who knows her there to witness it. Although I suppose Axel and Scarlett could spend several episodes searching for her only to find out about her death. If Vanessa is dead maybe her psychic connection to the people she's saved will mean they feel her death. 

I noticed there was quite a bit of focus on the vampire with the scar. Maybe he will play a role. For some reason I foresee him escaping with Vanessa if she's alive. 

[Bort]

Vanessa is also really hard to kill. She was mortally wounded (and it was pretty brutal) at the beginning of the rising and didn’t die. She spent three years in a coma recovering, but didn’t die. 

[Philbert]

On 12/14/2017 at 11:39 PM, CaptainTightpants said:

I called the old lady as evil from the first scene. That being said, I was surprised by the multiple bullets at the end. though I thought there would be trouble as soon as she picked up the gun. Although this show being this show, I have to assume that Vanessa is probably still alive. And about to go on a fake-mom murder spree. Which Abigail truthfully deserves from what we saw this episode. Subterfuge and deceit never work, indeed! If Vanessa really is dead I hope that Scarlet goes totally ninja on all their asses!

The "V for Vandetta" voice-through-the-vents plot device kinda went nowhere. I'm not sure why they thought that would work. 

The fact that these non-military people are mostly interested in immortality and not a cure for vamparism sadly comes as no surprise. You can count on big corporations to be evil unto the very end apparently. Having Harrison dressed head to toe in black for every scene was quite an anvil. He is obviously and robotically evil with a Mr. Burns/Darth Vader kind of vibe. 

It took Vanessa way too long to figure out that she was being played. That being said this episode was some of the best acting we have seen from Kelly Overton in a while. 

The biggest plot hole I see from this episode is about Vanessa's real mom. If Vanessa and Scarlet are the result of an accidental exposure to the vampiric virus while she was pregnant, why didn't she immediately turn or die? I'm thinking that either there is some questionable science behind that or fake-mom was lying about that too. Also, does that mean that Dimitri is the vamp-dad? He seems the most likely candidate since he was being held at the farm and experimented on at the time. 

 

Yeah I'm pretty much in agreement with you here. The episode needed to show us what it showed us in order to move the plot along, and for the most part, I think it succeeded. Kelly Overton actually surprised me a bit in this one-she was actually quite good as Vanessa struggling to figure out what was going on. There was something very flat about her "mum's" joy seeing her and it became obvious fairly quickly that something hinky was going on. The last few episodes have not been quite as entertaining as earlier on in the season but they are at least moving the story forward a bit more efficiently.  Despite my earlier, tongue in cheek post, I don't think she's really dead either. After all, she started the series in a 3 year long "mostly dead" state. If she's got vampire dna, it will probably take more than 3 bullets to do her in. I also don't buy the theory that the show is getting to replace Vanessa with Scarlett. I could be wrong of course but it seems just a little too pat.

[snowwhyte]

I decided to rewatch the episode and i have questions. The opening scene featured a guy following red balloons who was killed by a vampire. I have a vague recollection of a woman releasing balloons to guide people to their mountain top sanctuary. Is that maybe near where Vanessa is?

If the voice that Vanessa heard was a recording then how did she have multiple conversations with him involving questions with no delayed responses?

[Philbert]

Well, yeah...THAT happened.

 

Seriously, there are times when I really don't know what to make of this show.

[comanick]

That entire episode was pointless. 

[snowwhyte]

Well, that was grim. I know this is a horror but did we need close up shots of Mohammed getting his skin sliced off with a rusty bit of metal? 

I hate when a show follows a cliffhanger episode with a totally unrelated episode. The Walking Dead does it and it's one of the reasons i quit that show.

I have been wanting a bit of back story for Sam and Mohammed but the way they did it just annoyed me. 

[Philbert]

7 hours ago, comanick said:

That entire episode was pointless. 

It was unless they are setting Sam up as the ultimate big bad of this show, eventually replacing Dimitri. He's certainly a much more entertaining villain. But yeah, other than revealing a few more things about Sam's backstory, that episode really didn't do much for the overall storyline. Grim as death though.

[CaptainTightpants]

They really dialed the weird factor up to 11 and broke the knob off on this one. 

Good performances from both actors, but the episode did feel out of place after Vanessa' s apparent murder last week. 

And I was completely unable to believe that Sam's father would still be alive and sitting at the old homestead just waiting to be tourtured to death for the sake of the plot. 

The flashbacks were used well, and I enjoyed seeing Mohammad and Sam's first meeting from both points of view. But I agree with everybody about the unrelenting grimness in this episode. There were no laughs to be had for sure!

[Black Knight]

Just what I wanted, another Sam-centric episode. Just, NO. I don't find him an entertaining villain at all, not in the huge doses of screentime he gets, and his scenes continue to be torture porn. When he hung himself at the end of the episode, I briefly had hope that we were going to finally be rid of him - Doc telling those crazies in an earlier episode that vampires will die from being hung, it just takes longer, suddenly took on an aspect of foreshadowing so that we viewers could be assured that Sam could indeed die from hanging - but then Mohammad went vampire before Sam was dead. And while human Mo would have let Sam dangle, vamp Mo won't have any qualms about letting Sam free to torture, kill, torture, kill, torture and kill some more, repeat ad infinitum. I'm so sick of him. All the vampires are badly done on this show, but at least Dimitri et al have other interests and goals beyond just killing. They set up vampiric societies. They have lore and rules. Sam just wants to kill everyone he sees except Mo.

One of the bizarre things this show does is that it fails to see that the amount of time given to the two types of vampiric villains is completely the opposite of how it should be: Dimitri, and Rebecca before him, who aren't just utterly mindless psychopaths, get minuscule screentime. So even though there is some "there" there, the lack of screentime doesn't flesh it out and so they suck (pun not intended). Sam, who really is just a mindless psychopath, gets tons and tons of screentime which gives us nothing new of significance because there's no there there with him. I wouldn't find Sam tiresome, nor would we get the long scenes of torture porn, if he was used how he should be, in snippets here and there. But this show has it all backwards.

[AngelKitty]

20 minutes ago, Black Knight said:

Just what I wanted, another Sam-centric episode. Just, NO. I don't find him an entertaining villain at all, not in the huge doses of screentime he gets, and his scenes continue to be torture porn.

I wasn't happy with this episode either. I have had enough of this character and hope he's dead, but I'm sure he's not. 

[Bort]

1 hour ago, Black Knight said:

One of the bizarre things this show does is that it fails to see that the amount of time given to the two types of vampiric villains is completely the opposite of how it should be: Dimitri, and Rebecca before him, who aren't just utterly mindless psychopaths, get minuscule screentime.

Totally agree. They really wasted Rebecca as a character, I had wanted to see more of her and her motivation but noooooo... Also, the actress who played Rebecca could actually act, I remember her from the short-lived show, Alphas, so it was a double waste.

And don’t get me started on the overly saturated amount of screentime they’ve given Sam. I am completely bored by his character, I already get what his motivation is. Somebody who rips people apart just to see what their insides look like is not interesting. 

[Black Knight]

On 12/22/2017 at 2:47 PM, Philbert said:

It was unless they are setting Sam up as the ultimate big bad of this show, eventually replacing Dimitri.

Sam can never be the big bad. He's not tied into the mythology, he doesn't know anything about the mythology, and if he were told about the mythology, he wouldn't be interested. He's exactly one step up from the feral vampires, in that he can articulate, but since all he articulates is the same as what the ferals do - kill kill kill - it's not a big step up.

11 hours ago, kariyaki said:

Totally agree. They really wasted Rebecca as a character, I had wanted to see more of her and her motivation but noooooo... Also, the actress who played Rebecca could actually act, I remember her from the short-lived show, Alphas, so it was a double waste.

I don't at all understand the show's choice to kill her off, unless the actress wanted to leave for another project, which would be completely understandable given her thirty seconds of screentime per episode. But yeah, I could tell that she could actually act and that it wasn't her fault that her storyline, such as it was, sucked - that was all down to the thirty seconds of screentime. She seemed to have some interesting plans, but the writers didn't care to show us much about them, and she died with her character still largely unexplained. Dimitri's gotten a little more screentime this season, but they're still keeping him and his plans too vague for viewers to be interested or invested. There's a difference between an enigma/mystery and a blank slate; only the former is intriguing.

[BasilSeal]

On 15/12/2017 at 3:12 AM, Philbert said:

"Oh my God, they killed Vanessa. Those bastards!!!!!"

 

Said no Van Helsing fan ever

 

:)

Indeed. First rule of the apocalypse, "if you didn't see them die, then they're not dead". though how she'll escape an apparent head shot isn't clear to me at the moment.

I see they then take a leaf from the walking dead playbook and switch narratives to a different set of characters following an apparent character death to keep us in suspense. note to show, yeah i know the walking dead has loads of viewers but that's in spite of all th shite things they do, not because of them, don't copy them, it's not big and it's not clever.

 

One question i have following the sam/ mohammed two hander is why does mohamed turn at the end despite vanessa having bitten him and supposedly inoculated him against vampirism?

[snowwhyte]

Well, we know Vanessa can bite a vamp and turn them back but have we seen her bite work to stop someone becoming a vampire? I assumed Mohammed was making that up to stop Sam biting him.

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they didn't drag out the Vanessa death question until season 3. I hope they don't but it wouldn't surprise me. 

[BasilSeal]

Scarlet is bitten by vanessa then doesn't turn when bitten by the sisterhood vampire, but that's not necessarily  relevant because Scarlet is different being V's sister. Vanessa does tell both Scarlett and Mohamed they can't be turned now after they've been bitten, but you're right, there's no actual precedent for this being the case other than Scarlett, and as she's a Van Helsing the rules could be different for her. she also now has Vanessa's gift for turning vampires, which may be as a result of being bitten by V or maybe she had it all along, but she does say she didn't have V's rapid healing powers.

The turned vampires can't be turned back and their blood is unpleasant to vampires, so one would deduce that being bitten by V changes the nature of one's blood, and you'd think that would be the case for non vampires too. Oh well, maybe it will all be explained, or maybe they're just making this shit up as they go along and i wont be.

5 hours ago, snowwhyte said:

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they didn't drag out the Vanessa death question until season 3. I hope they don't but it wouldn't surprise me. 

that would be showing contempt for the fans IMO, but i wouldn't put it past them, as you say. It would be an odd choice to kill the title character at this point, surely they would only do this as a forced decision, either because Kelly Overton doesn't want to appear in further series or because they think her character doesn't work and they need a drastic re write. both are possible, and they have introduced a character that is a carbon copy of Vanessa, and have now gifted her Vanessa's powers. It doesn't really make sense for bad granny to kill Vanessa at this point though, they may be closing in on Scarlett, but there's no guarantee of finding her or that she'll be of use to them, it seems rather rash to kill of V before they are certain they have Scarlett and they can use her.

[snowwhyte]

I do tend to think the writers are making this up as they go along. Its been nearly two seasons and I don't know what the ultimate goal is. What do the more organized vampires want? What is Vanessa's purpose? Is it the story of humankind fighting back against vampires to restore civilization? Is it more of a character based tale of a woman accepting her gifts and embracing her role as saviour of humanity? I know we're not meant to have all the answers but I definitely feel we should have more of a sense of what the show is after two seasons.

[BasilSeal]

I think Dimitri is after greater power and absolute immortality, we're told they die eventually, somehow the demon that Vanessa sees in her visions will bestow this on him, and the key will help Dimitri find the demon / ancient one, or something. Obviously bad granny and young old mad scientist want the demon as well for their immortality experiments, because, well, why not find the embodiment of evil and take it back to your mountain top laboratory cum bond villain lair and experiment on it, what could possibly go wrong?

The first series was about a power struggle between the dominant vampires , Dimitri, Rebbecca and Julius,  Dimitri wins the raffle to be the big bad, Julius becomes human and they kill Rebbecca off because they're no longer interested in the conflict strand of the story. though i agree the organised vampire threat is badly underwritten in this season.

Overall i think that although the sries is flawed, it has a lot to offer, and i've got a lot of good will for the show. thy did a lot of good character stuff in the first season with not much budget, and they were very good on the theme of the duplicity of survival and the individual conflicts of interest of the disparate survivors. I just hope they don't turn this into a shit version of Z nation, especially as Z nation is itself filling that particular niche at the moment.

[millahnna]

On 12/24/2017 at 9:35 AM, Black Knight said:

And while human Mo would have let Sam dangle, vamp Mo won't have any qualms about letting Sam free to torture, kill, torture, kill, torture and kill some more, repeat ad infinitum.

Well Axel was able to resist the urge to go evil while he searched for the cure in Vanessa.  Perhaps Mohammed will be able to as well. I wish they had something more, I don't know...integrated...cohesive...whatever...to the rest of the show with Sam and Mo.  I love Christopher Heyerdal and I don't think he's doing bad work but I agree with the rest of you that the balance is off and their shtick isn't as interesting as other stuff that's taken the back seat.   This last episode would have been ok B plot for me.  It didn't need to be the A plot.

[CaptainTightpants]

So many thoughts! 

Yay! Julius is alive. And I'm thinking that the fact that the mutant vamp guy survived a gunshot to the head means that Vanessa could be still alive as well. With the Elder saying that Vanessa was just darkness and shadows now. And Scarlett and Flesh both losing connection with Vanessa I'm going to guess her chances are about 50/50. 

I kinda thought that Lucky was doomed as soon as she revealed that she was pregnant. Because instant and terrible death is pretty much the only thing that a show like this does with pregnant women. So while that was predictable I wasn't expecting her to decide to go out like a damn boss! Good for her really. 

I was surprised that they killed off Phil at the same time though. I thought he would be around to suffer through the death of Lucky and the turning of Mo. 

I am happy that they have revealed Cali to be a duplicitous double agent. I'm not sure if she is really naive or fully on board with selling the group out. But I have previously found it to be wildly unlikely that she kept surviving various massacres. So for now I'm going with evil middle schooler. 

Finally Doc has a real name, and a girlfriend it looks like. I thought it was a bit delayed for Axel to have a meltdown on her for her previously cowardly and self-serving ways. I'm glad that she got redeemed in everybody's eyes when Julius vouched for her. The actress is really good when they give her something to work with. 

I'm glad that BossLady turned out to be Mama Van Helsing. She legit looks like she could kick all kinds of ass, so that fits. And it looks like the plot is moving forward at last. So they all have to get to the secret evil base and kill everybody and rescue Vanessa (or cry over her body). Which seems like a tall order for the 1 remaining episode. So I'm expecting some huge unresolved cliffhangers for the finale. Something that I hate even more than the show pairing everybody off as romantic couples. Except Axel and Scarlett, who I am still loving. 

Just when you thought that Dr. Evil couldn't get more evil he goes and creates a new strain of quick healing super-ferals. To add insult to injury I have to assume that he created them with Vanessa's cells. Why? How could it possibly help whatever evil world dominating immortality plans he has by wiping out the few humans who are still alive?

Edited December 29, 2017 by CaptainTightpants
spelling

[loki567]

Mama Van Helsing is a splitting image of Kate McKinnon. 

Once again, what the hell are they doing with Vanessa? The ferals surviving head shots suggests she's still alive but it's strange to have your main character out of action for such a long period of time. 

And that's all she wrote for Flesh? What an anti-climatic way to take him out. All the time spent with him and Lucky was an absolute waste. Didn't even really get a reunion with Axel/Doc or any scenes with a newly turned Julius. The first half of this season was a poorly planned mess. Didn't really feel like it righted itself until Axel was turned back. 

[snowwhyte]

Did I miss something? Is Phil dead? I thought he hid behind something when the grenade went off? Or was that scar vamp?

I know it was necessary for plot purposes but it really bugged me that Scarlett shot the newly turned vamp in the head instead of trying to turn him back. That was such a Vanessa move.  

[CaptainTightpants]

4 hours ago, snowwhyte said:

Did I miss something? Is Phil dead? I thought he hid behind something when the grenade went off? Or was that scar vamp?

I know it was necessary for plot purposes but it really bugged me that Scarlett shot the newly turned vamp in the head instead of trying to turn him back. That was such a Vanessa move.  

Since Axel was stress smoking beside 2 fresh graves I assumed that both Lucky and Phil perished. I'm also impressed that someone was able to find cigarettes more than 3 years into the vampocalypse. 

Then the other guy comes to tell Axel that he dismembered and burned the other ferals but that the scar-faced one got away. (BTW, that scar looks like someone tried an old school lobotomy on this guy). 

I was taken aback by Scarlett killing that guy too. She knows she can turn people back now. And this guy was freshly turned and one of the "good guys". He didn't even look like an immediate threat just lumbering around slowly. It should have been fairly easy to tackle him and bite-cure him in the courtyard. 

[comanick]

Well folks, I think thats it for me. Im done. 

At this point the story makes zero sense. They have been pulling plot point out of nowhere and then they lead nowhere. 

Is Vanessa dead? Who knows and I'm already tired of wondering. The writers think this is mystery but its actually just bad writing. 

How is Julius still alive after getting his back broken and then getting bit multiple times by ferals? He shouldnt be alive. 

How about Dimitri? How does he seem to know everything without anyone telling him huh. How does he know Vanessa is not with the group? How does he know Scarlett had the key? How did he know Scarlett no longer had the key but Julius did? The answer is he shouldn't and/or bad writing. 

How did that scarface vamp get out and make it to wherever they are now? And you mean to tell me he could get out and make it all the way there but vanessa couldnt? Come on. 

Mama Van Helsing - You couldnt tell Scarlett was your daughter until she mentioned the key? Really? 

Nothing makes sense anymore on this show. Its a Syfy series so i expect it to be chessy with a weak plot but it should make sense. Season 1 made sense. The plot was weak (Dimitri and Rebecca want to find vanessa to experiment on her) but it at least made sense. Now all the plot points just seem contrived. 

[MrPissyPuppy]

I'm glad Julius is alive no matter how they wind up explaining it.   And they better not do anything to that beautiful black German Shepherd ... I was more worried about him than any other character.     Julius, Axel and Shadow can just go off and have their own adventures apart from the Van Helsings.   Although Mom seemed cool.