S03.E04: Sabrosito

[Tikichick]

7 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I'm not sure I consider Chuck to be "twisted", at least not by the way I define twisted.  When I think of a "twisted" person, I think of one who is evil and generally enjoys harming other people. or doesn't care about harming other people if doing so help fulfill his desires.

Chuck is certainly mentally ill, falsely believing that electricity is harmful to him.  He is also pedantic, self righteous and condescending.  But those traits, while annoying don't add up to "twisted" in my book.  Maybe Chuck is truly "twisted", but I haven't seen any evidence of it yet. 

When his ne'er do well, con artist, younger brother was facing a felony sex crime charge, he put a big case on hold, traveled half way across the country, got him out of trouble, gave him a job and helped him get his life together.  Sure, he didn't want that con artist little brother to become a lawyer, at least not at any firm he was associated with, but he didn't try to block him from starting his own practice and actually encouraged him and gave him good advice.  

Was it wrong for him to deceive Jimmy and let him think Howard was the "pig f@$&er" who kept him from being hired as an associate at the firm?  Sure.  But it was also understandable that he didn't want his only, living family member to hate and resent him.  To me, that  doesn't add up to twisted.

He latest plotting against Jimmy, was in response to Jimmy betraying him horribly, by breaking into his client's files, doctoring them and causing Chuck great distress and professional embarrassment, at a time when he was already mentally and emotionally fragile.  I can't really blame Chuck for running a counter scam on Jimmy to catch him in his scam.  

To me twisted, would be more like a person who arranges chow line shankings of his own clients, launders money for violent drug kingpins, wants to put a toxic meth lab behind the skee ball machines at a Laser Tag place, etc.. 

All that said, I still root for Jimmy and hope he gets the best of Chuck in their battle.  Vince Gilligan is a master at getting people to root for the bad guy.

I think it's twisted to get upset with your wife merely because she laughed at your brother's jokes or found him charming -- the same wife you feel entitled to mansplain the finer details of the dish she was cooking in a particularly patronizing way.  

I think it's twisted to browbeat a much lower level em to the extent they're genuinely apologetic as if it is their responsibility the market didn't have Chuck's preferred brand of apples.  Then to take away the livelihood of that same employee when you knowingly used him as a pawn in your sick desire to destroy your brother by setting him up by using his genuine friendship with your brother.  I don't think Chuck's browbeating ended or began with the apples either.

How twisted do you have to be to feel entitled to treat people the way Chuck does?  But then again we're talking the same brother who not only used his brother's love for him to manipulate a confession, but a brother who went ahead and used the confession despite knowing his brother was genuinely concerned for him and cared about him.

[Clanstarling]

17 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

I think it's twisted to get upset with your wife merely because she laughed at your brother's jokes or found him charming -- the same wife you feel entitled to mansplain the finer details of the dish she was cooking in a particularly patronizing way.  

I think it's twisted to browbeat a much lower level em to the extent they're genuinely apologetic as if it is their responsibility the market didn't have Chuck's preferred brand of apples.  Then to take away the livelihood of that same employee when you knowingly used him as a pawn in your sick desire to destroy your brother by setting him up by using his genuine friendship with your brother.  I don't think Chuck's browbeating ended or began with the apples either.

How twisted do you have to be to feel entitled to treat people the way Chuck does?  But then again we're talking the same brother who not only used his brother's love for him to manipulate a confession, but a brother who went ahead and used the confession despite knowing his brother was genuinely concerned for him and cared about him.

Though I lean more to "twisted" than "normal" when it comes to Chuck, my recollection about the apples was more that he was more or less passive aggressively bitching than brow beating Ernesto in regards to the apples. And if getting upset with a spouse because they like (or rather, actually enjoy) someone you dislike or have strong negative feelings about is twisted, I think many of us are twisted.

Edited May 8, 2017 by Clanstarling

[Bryce Lynch]

20 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

I think it's twisted to get upset with your wife merely because she laughed at your brother's jokes or found him charming -- the same wife you feel entitled to mansplain the finer details of the dish she was cooking in a particularly patronizing way.  

I think it's twisted to browbeat a much lower level em to the extent they're genuinely apologetic as if it is their responsibility the market didn't have Chuck's preferred brand of apples.  Then to take away the livelihood of that same employee when you knowingly used him as a pawn in your sick desire to destroy your brother by setting him up by using his genuine friendship with your brother.  I don't think Chuck's browbeating ended or began with the apples either.

How twisted do you have to be to feel entitled to treat people the way Chuck does?  But then again we're talking the same brother who not only used his brother's love for him to manipulate a confession, but a brother who went ahead and used the confession despite knowing his brother was genuinely concerned for him and cared about him.

If everyone who was ever jealous or envious is "twisted", I think you can pretty much include the whole human race.  

Being rather condescending and demanding is not really "twisted" either.  I'd have to watch again, but from what I recall, I wouldn't really consider his shopping instructions to Ernie as being "brow beating".  He was being very particular, in his naturally condescending, but not mean spirited tone.  

His cooking instructions could be considered annoying, but they are not exactly Charles Manson type stuff.  

As for firing Ernie, he lied to Chuck about calling Jimmy about Chuck being at the copy shop, aiding and abetting Jimmy by helping him get away with his criminal acts against Chuck, HHM and Mesa Verde.  As much as I love Ernie, an employee who lies to protect a friend, who has committed a crime against the company, especially when that lie prevents the company from repairing its reputation with a client, deserves to be fired, at least looking at it from the employer's perspective.  

When Chuck offers to arrange the murder of a witness or helps a drug kingpin poison a child, I'll label him "twisted".

I find it interesting that some feel the need to exaggerate the severity of Chuck's flaws and less than desirable behavior, to make him into the "evil villain".  He is Jimmy's antagonist. That is all I need to root against him. :) 

Edited May 8, 2017 by Bryce Lynch

[ShadowFacts]

6 hours ago, MissBluxom said:

Many people think you must give your name or personal info. But you can always just decline and it's not usually a problem.

I wouldn't lie to them. But I'd just say something like, "I'd prefer to remain anonymous." I've done that in the past.

You might think you are anonymous, but don't count on it, depending where you are.  From my own experience, police and sheriff's departments can find out who is calling, obviously, they have to be able to respond to emergency calls from people unable to fully communicate.  I have had to sing out my social security number to redirect the officer off of trying to get me on a warrant and focus back on the problem at hand.  My bigger point is that lots of people, particularly in minority communities, are loathe to call the cops, for many reasons.  Immigration status is also in the mix.  So it wasn't odd to me that no one apparently called at the Hector-Gus showdown.  Drug dealers and their minions are known in the community, and people don't mess.  They like to keep themselves and their families alive and un-assaulted.  

[ShadowFacts]

1 hour ago, Bryce Lynch said:

When Chuck offers to arrange the murder of a witness or helps a drug kingpin poison a child, I'll label him "twisted".

I find it interesting that some feel the need to exaggerate the severity of Chuck's flaws and less than desirable behavior, to make him into the "evil villain".  He is Jimmy's antagonist. That is all I need to root against him. :) 

People who never watched BB don't know what a rat ass Jimmy became.  In BCS Jimmy has done lots of illegal things, but for me, Chuck outdoes him in the interpersonal toxin department.  That is because up until the copy shop alteration, Jimmy was a loyal brother, defending Chuck against whatever Howard might try to do to ace Chuck out, getting up and bringing him the 6 a.m. newspapers and ice and food every day for a year, etc.  He didn't even break with him after he found out about Chuck being behind the no-hire decision at HHM.  Chuck, on the other hand, let his jealousy or whatever is eating him get so out of hand that he made a move for Mesa Verde that he wasn't even that interested in, just to stab his brother.  He is a jerk par excellence in the area of familial loyalty.  He had it at one time when he brought Jimmy to Albuquerque, but he trashed it.  That Jimmy retaliates and later becomes vermin doesn't alter that. 

[Bryce Lynch]

On Sunday, May 07, 2017 at 10:17 AM, Wiendish Fitch said:

I second this. Gus is so good at presenting a kindly, professional, caring facade, even I bought it... even though I watched every single episode of Breaking Bad, and knew what he was capable of. Always remember: this is the man who calmly threatened the life of Walt's baby daughter, and you know he would do it, and you know he'd lose little to no sleep over it. 

Gus has become one of my favorite TV villains ever. Giancarlo Esposito has a special gift of playing various despicable characters (Buggin' Out in Do the Right Thing comes to mind).

Funny thing is, Spike Lee would probably consider Buggin' Out to be a hero, not a villain. 

The main other role I remember Esposito from was Mike Giardello, the Lieutenant's FBI agent son, from "Homicide", definitely a good guy.  

[Drumpf1737]

Quote

(Buggin' Out in Do the Right Thing comes to mind).

Maybe you meant Big Brother All Might Tee from School Daze. Definitely a bad guy.

[MisterBluxom]

IMHO, this was the best episode of the show ever. Best episode of any of the three seasons.

It was so satisfying to see Chuck get what he deserved. Again, that is IMHO. It is just my opinion that Chuck deserved that and I admit that other people may well have different opinions.

But I thought it was just glorious. Absolutely glorious. And I loved it.

[Hanahope]

So I guess that crimes, for the most part, apart from drugs, must be in short supply in New Mexico for a prosecutor to get all worked up about one brother breaking open the door of another brother, yelling at him, and destroying a cassette tape.  Obviously, had Chuck not pushed the entirety of his influence and power on the police/courts, everyone would have looked at him like, "you've got to be kidding, you want to prosecute him for that?"  Anyone and everyone should see that this was a relatively minor domestic dispute among two fairly able bodied men, and no one got hurt.  Unless Chuck wants to explain why he's "incapacitated" and therefore "fearful" of being hurt, an objective person shouldn't believe that Chuck was really "in fear" for his life or other.

Clearly, in larger city, NYC, LA, Philly, Chicago, the police/prosecutors would be laughing up a storm over this waste of judicial and police resources.

[MisterBluxom]

2 hours ago, Hanahope said:

So I guess that crimes, for the most part, apart from drugs, must be in short supply in New Mexico for a prosecutor to get all worked up about one brother breaking open the door of another brother, yelling at him, and destroying a cassette tape.  Obviously, had Chuck not pushed the entirety of his influence and power on the police/courts, everyone would have looked at him like, "you've got to be kidding, you want to prosecute him for that?"  Anyone and everyone should see that this was a relatively minor domestic dispute among two fairly able bodied men, and no one got hurt.  Unless Chuck wants to explain why he's "incapacitated" and therefore "fearful" of being hurt, an objective person shouldn't believe that Chuck was really "in fear" for his life or other.

Clearly, in larger city, NYC, LA, Philly, Chicago, the police/prosecutors would be laughing up a storm over this waste of judicial and police resources.

I think you are very much right on the money.  Most of the reason(s) behind that "show" was to give the audience a form of entertainment. IRL? I doubt it would ever go to that tribunal.

The only reason the writers might give was that the purpose behind that hearing was mostly about the practice of law and not about bringing any crimes to justice. But you never can tell what they might come up with.

[ShadowFacts]

58 minutes ago, MissBluxom said:

I think you are very much right on the money.  Most of the reason(s) behind that "show" was to give the audience a form of entertainment. IRL? I doubt it would ever go to that tribunal.

The only reason the writers might give was that the purpose behind that hearing was mostly about the practice of law and not about bringing any crimes to justice. But you never can tell what they might come up with.

I agree with both you and Hanahope.  Chuck was in zero danger.  He told the DA he was not in fear that Jimmy would do anything to him, and there were two other able-bodied men present.  The door frame got damaged.  This would go exactly nowhere. 

[Tikichick]

17 hours ago, MissBluxom said:

I think you are very much right on the money.  Most of the reason(s) behind that "show" was to give the audience a form of entertainment. IRL? I doubt it would ever go to that tribunal.

The only reason the writers might give was that the purpose behind that hearing was mostly about the practice of law and not about bringing any crimes to justice. But you never can tell what they might come up with.

The criminal matter was resolved in the conference room with the visiting prosecutor.  The tribunal is strictly about Jimmy's law license, which is what Chuck is really after.

[J----av]

On 2017-05-05 at 8:41 AM, Bryce Lynch said:

The Drew Sharp thing might be a stretch.  But it is possible that if Walt had stopped pumping the methylamine when Mike told him the track was clear and the train was about to move, and they immediately started packing up their gear, they would have been in a less compromising position when Drew Sharp saw them.  He might have only seen a bunch of guys hanging out in the desert, like he was, and Todd might not have felt the need to shoot him.

I think the magnet thing is unquestionable.  When they did the test at the scrapyard, the laptop was fried well before it was ripped out of Jesse's hands.  Fring's laptop would have been fried well before Walt turned the power all the way up, and caused all the evidence to fly all over the room.  Plus, Hank said that the laptop was all encrypted, so they probably wouldn't have gotten anything off of it anyway.

The authorities had no idea that the offshore bank account numbers were hidden behind the photograph, until the police re-inventoried all the evidence and saw the numbers behind the photo in the damaged frame.  If the frame doesn't get broken, the police and DEA probably never find out about Mike and his guys, Mike doesn't get killed and Walt doesn't get connected with Jack and the Nazi's to kill Mike's guys in prison.  

 

 Pretty much everything had already fallen off the shelves well before Jesse was telling Walt they had to go

[Bryce Lynch]

Hector seemed to actually have a little respect for Lyle, for having the balls to at least try ro stand up to him.

He stepped aside when he told him they had other customers and he patted him on the shoulder as he walked past him, after he ignored Lyle's demands that he stop smoking and stay out of the employees only area.

[ChipBach]

In other news...  Hector, what's up with those shoes?  Red Mary Janes?