Spoiler Discussion Thread

[apinknightmare]

Words cannot express how much I hope, I really really hope, that Oliver's playing a long game here. 

[AyChihuahua]

I am trying to be optimistic, but Oliver's overall not been great at the long con/plan.

 

ETA: That twitter on the spoilers thread pretty much confirms it's Nyssa/Oliver.  Wonder if the continuing Batman ripoff will finally drive away comic fanboys...Batman fanboys bc the ripping off, Green Arrow fanboys because seriously, use some damn GA plots instead of ripping off Batman all the time.  I wonder if the spoilers and promos showing how bad the next two episodes are for Olicity/Team Arrow will adversely affect ratings.  

Edited April 27, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[apinknightmare]

I am trying to be optimistic, but he's overall not been great at the long con/plan.

 

He's said he doesn't have a plan about fifty times this year, and I'm hoping that was to make us all believe he doesn't have one now. I mean, he did manage to pull off a short con last year. Maybe he's grown?!

[AyChihuahua]

 

Maybe he's grown?!

This show is impossible to figure out, because no rules or logic apply.  But I'd say no, he hasn't grown, because he's been unbearably, unbelievably, painfully stupid ALL SEASON LONG.  If anything, he's regressed in every possible way...other than learning a little more swordsmanship.  But seriously, the writers don't actually pay attention to history or characterization or logic, so who the heck knows.  I still can't believe the guy who refused to turn on Yao Fei, who he didn't even know that well and who shot him with an arrow, even when he was being pretty severely tortured, is now susceptible to brainwashing in three weeks by the dude who pretty much murdered the shit out of his beloved sister.  

Edited April 27, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[apinknightmare]

I was just kidding, haha. But yeah, I agree. I'm going to hold out hope for a long con though.

[Happy Harpy]

Dinner at the Diggles aside, everything I read about the spoilers is either offensive, depressing, infuriating, or all of the above.

 

I just hope that it's bad PR once again, since in spite of the critical backlash, TPTB seem to think it's a good idea to get the audience worked up instead of excited.

[Morrigan2575]

I am trying to be optimistic, but Oliver's overall not been great at the long con/plan.

 

ETA: That twitter on the spoilers thread pretty much confirms it's Nyssa/Oliver.  Wonder if the continuing Batman ripoff will finally drive away comic fanboys...Batman fanboys bc the ripping off, Green Arrow fanboys because seriously, use some damn GA plots instead of ripping off Batman all the time.  I wonder if the spoilers and promos showing how bad the next two episodes are for Olicity/Team Arrow will adversely affect ratings.

what Twitter?

[AyChihuahua]

what Twitter?

Tiffany Vogt @TVWatchtower  ·  Apr 25

@DJ_Traxi @sacredsmoak - Ra's has a very twisted mind. IF he were to force Nyssa and Oliver to get married, it would be to save Nyssa's life

 

That's not how you answer if it has nothing to do with Nyssa.  

 

 

I just hope that it's bad PR once again, since in spite of the critical backlash, TPTB seem to think it's a good idea to get the audience worked up instead of excited.

As long as people watch, they don't care whether anyone actually enjoys it.  And people do indeed keep watching.

Edited April 27, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[apinknightmare]

Tiffany Vogt @TVWatchtower  ·  Apr 25

@DJ_Traxi @sacredsmoak - Ra's has a very twisted mind. IF he were to force Nyssa and Oliver to get married, it would be to save Nyssa's life

 

That's not how you answer if it has nothing to do with Nyssa.  \

 

She also said she didn't have any idea who was going to get married - that the EPs were very tight-lipped on that one. I wonder if she wasn't being completely honest. 

 

And LOL @ Ra's making Nyssa marry Oliver to save her life. Who would be threatening her but him? 

[AyChihuahua]

She may not have known before, but heard more later.  That tweet is dated yesterday.  But primarily that's a lot of detail for why it could be Nyssa if it's not Nyssa.

 

I'm still pretty curious re why Oliver's jetting off to Central City to help Barry, especially if his team is in NP in 22.  Presumably Nyssa's hiding them somewhere in NP while building up a rebellion against her father.  It seems really bizarre for Ra's actually to send him to help, but again, with this show who the hell knows. 

[Morrigan2575]

Tiffany Vogt @TVWatchtower · Apr 25

@DJ_Traxi @sacredsmoak - Ra's has a very twisted mind. IF he were to force Nyssa and Oliver to get married, it would be to save Nyssa's life

That's not how you answer if it has nothing to do with Nyssa.

.

But this person has stated outright she has no idea who is getting married. She only saw episode 20 and the EPs never mentioned the wedding. She's only speculating based on questions being posed to her. In fact the first time she was asked about O/N she said it would be "wrong on so many levels". Also, when asked who she thought was getting married she said Roy/Thea.

BTW - she also said (yesterday) that she never considered the possibility of O/N until fans brought it up.

Edited April 27, 2015 by Morrigan2575

[Chaser]

I really don't think Vogt knows as much as people think; I think she is just speculating with the fans on a lot of stuff.

[steeledwithakiss]

I feel like we know more or less what is going to happen in the last 3 episodes. If we're right Oliver marries Nyssa for whatever reason, at the end he claims his identity back (My name is Oliver Queen). He's probably going to be pretty nasty to Diggle enough to cause a rift. And I'm guessing Felicity and Oliver ends up the season in a good place (it seems like the logical  way to go since this season has been very angsty for them). Thea is apparently getting a mask and getting closure with Roy. I don't know if I'm clueless but the writers did manage to surprise me with Felicity drugging Oliver last episode. And yet we still felt like we knew everything that was going to happen. So I think it's possible the writers will manage to surprise us, be it in a good or a bad way. But just like for The Fallen we knew how it would end. Oliver stayed with the League and T/M/D/F went back to SC. It feels like no matter how exactly it happens the endgame of the season is pretty obvious.

 

However, at the end of s1 having Oliver failing th city was the big surprise (and maybe Tommy dying in some ways). S2 Oliver declaring his love (then taking it back) to Felicity was the got ya moment since we already knew he would beat Slade. I hope the writers have something up their sleeves again. I'm addicted to spoilers but I still like to be surprised once in a while.

Edited April 27, 2015 by steeledwithakiss

[wonderwall]

Honestly though, I think the most offensive thing about the next few episodes will be that damn earring. 

[apinknightmare]

Honestly though, I think the most offensive thing about the next few episodes will be that damn earring. 

 

He looks like an evil Mr. Clean.

[wonderwall]

He looks like an evil Mr. Clean.

...At least his face is still pretty? I dunno. Why does Ra's care about looks and if he has a buzzcut and an earring? Hmmm 

 

I now feel like Ra's wants to be a judge on ANTM

Edited April 27, 2015 by wonderwall

[quarks]

I have no particular opinion on the earring, yet. 

 

But what I'm getting from the trailers is not "Ra's wants Oliver to marry Nyssa," but "Ra's wants Oliver to kill Nyssa and Diggle," which seems slightly different.

 

Depending upon how you view marriage, of course. And Diggle.

[SmallScreenDiva]

I really don't think Vogt knows as much as people think; I think she is just speculating with the fans on a lot of stuff.

 

Yeah, Vogt is the same entertainment journalist who kept insisting during SDCC that Stephen said Felicity is his girl this season and beyond, even when all the videos that came out showed he said this season (and smiled when asked about the future). So I take whatever she says with a grain of salt (I take Natalie Abrams' reports with a boulder, FYI).

[apinknightmare]

I have no particular opinion on the earring, yet.

But what I'm getting from the trailers is not "Ra's wants Oliver to marry Nyssa," but "Ra's wants Oliver to kill Nyssa and Diggle," which seems slightly different.

Depending upon how you view marriage, of course. And Diggle.

I thought Ra's wanted Oliver to kill Nyssa too, but in the Asian trailer he says he's supposed to bring her to Nanda Parbat.

I suppose he could've been talking about taking Diggle back to Nanda Parbat. Seemed like Nyssa though.

Edited April 27, 2015 by apinknightmare

[AyChihuahua]

In 21 Ra's wants Oliver to kill Nyssa.  Then Oliver takes Nyssa back to NP.  Honestly, this is the show that literally had Roy go from hating Malcolm to loving him in one episode when Malcolm did nothing different.  There will be some other pulled-out-of-Ra's ass prophecy or Ra's will be sad about his daughter dying or blah blah blah insanely stupid plotcakes, and voila it will be Nyssa and Oliver.

 

For the record, I'm on board with hoping it's Roy and Thea.  Young (consensual, non-drugged, non-Batman-ripoff, neither partner is gay) love is fine with me, and I love Roy.

 

On the tiny, tiny plus side, this is some evidence that maybe all the LOA does not mindlessly kneel before Ra's.  The fact that Nyssa's any kind of a threat to Oliver as Ra's implies she maybe has her own followers.  Which makes sense...this crazy cult that's all about tradition, with Nyssa the known Heir for years, suddenly an interloper with stupid hair (WHY THE HAIRCUT, NO ONE ELSE IN THE LOA HAS A SHORN HEAD, AND IT'S NOT TAKING AWAY HIS IDENTITY AS OLIVER BECAUSE IT'S ONLY LIKE TWO INCHES SHORTER ANYWAY, I HATE THIS SHOW) and an earring comes trotting in to take her place. 

 

I swear to God, Nyssa better kill the absolute shit out of Ra's.

Edited April 27, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[calliope1975]

I think I got myself all excited from watching and enjoying the last two episodes. Reading these last three ep descriptions, it's time to rein in the optimism and go back to watching only after reading East Coasters opinions. Curse my desire to want to love this show again. Damn you, Berlanti!

 

I'm afraid to watch any promos. Is this earring dangly?

[apinknightmare]

I'm afraid to watch any promos. Is this earring dangly?

Difficult to say. It looks hoop-like.

[AyChihuahua]

Difficult to say. It looks hoop-like.

Oh JFC FML.  

[Sunshine]

According to the twitter account there is no earring. She posted a HD quality of the video as well as a screen shot which shows no earring and said the earring was just a shadow on the lower quality video she had posted.

Edited April 27, 2015 by Sunshine

[wonderwall]

Nahhh it's an earring. And it's terrible

 

 

I'm hating the buzzcut too

Edited April 27, 2015 by wonderwall

[apinknightmare]

Felicity had better put a camera or some kind of mind-righting device in that damn thing.

[Morena]

More Diggle and Thea scenes? Great.  I can take or leave Thea/Felicity...I think the female Thea should be closest to is Laurel. 

I think Thea can try to avoid to met Laurel because she killed Sara. Laurel didnt blame Thea, but as Roy felt guilty for killing a cop (even under the mirakuru action), Thea can also feel that way, not knowing how to treat Laurel.  maybe every time she meet Laurel, Thea remember what she did

Edited April 27, 2015 by Morena

[Sunshine]

Nahhh it's an earring. And it's terrible

 

 

I'm hating the buzzcut too

The 2 pictures posted on @ibelong2olicity's twitter feed (source of the video in spoilers) are the same but different coloring with no earring.  I don't really care one way or the other but just thought I'd mention it.  I am not technically savvy enough to even know how they get one from the other. LOL! 

[quarks]

I thought Ra's wanted Oliver to kill Nyssa too, but in the Asian trailer he says he's supposed to bring her to Nanda Parbat.

 

Right, but the sequence of the Asian trailer is:

 

Nyssa says that Oliver will be coming for her, followed by various short snippets.

 

Oliver says "I'm here to bring you back."

 

Then, we see Nyssa kneeling on the floor, looking up at Oliver. Either in voiceover or at the scene, she says, "I'm not afraid."  Oliver starts pulling out a weapon.

 

The Canadian promo has Ra's telling Oliver that there is a rival Heir to the Demon, and that Oliver must eliminate this threat. Then we get Nyssa saying "Oliver Queen is dead. He's a memory," and a shot of Laurel trying out the Canary Cry for the first time.  Diggle tells us that there's nothing Ra's Al Ghul can do that can turn Oliver against the people he loves, which of course means that there is something Ra's Al Ghul can do that can turn Oliver against the people he loves, which in this case I think means Diggle, since that's immediately followed by an Oliver/Diggle thing.

 

#

 

I could easily be wrong here, but I'm just not getting wedding vibes from any of this. I'm getting Ra's Al Ghul wants Oliver to be an actual assassin again vibes from this, which makes sense given that Oliver is, in theory, supposed to be heading up a group of assassins.

 

I am getting hints of "closure" for Thea in a couple of different interviews now (in interviews regarding her storylines with both Roy and Malcolm), which suggests that she may be leaving the show, in which case a wedding with Roy with occasional later guest appearances from them both makes a lot of sense and fits the spoilers we've gotten. I'm also getting more than just hints that Oliver and Felicity have pretty much moved past any sort of regular dating at this point - I mean, they're at the point where Oliver is perfectly ok with Felicity drugging him after sex and even thinks it's kinda hot. 

 

The main argument I see against an Oliver/Felicity wedding in episode 322 isn't an internal one: it's an external one, which is that my sense is that the CW would want to promote the hell out of any Oliver/Felicity wedding with THE BIG ARROW WEDDING and a major spread in Entertainment Weekly if they could get it, none of which is happening. Having said that, if this wedding is, like Oliver's first "I love you," and Oliver and Felicity's post sex scene, some sort of plot twist - and given Arrow, there's a good chance of this - that could explain a lot.

 

And sure, none of this rules out an Oliver/Nyssa wedding, because, well, this show still has Malcolm sleeping on Thea's couch. Which says it all, really. I'm just not getting those vibes from these trailers. Then again, the wedding isn't until 322, and the trailers are for 321.

[apinknightmare]

If the uploader of the video says there's no earring, I believe her, if only because I want there to be no earring.

[calliope1975]

I am already irritated at even the possibility of a wedding between Nyssa and Oliver. But an earring? A fucking earring? Ra's has gone too far. I fail to believe the guy who survived 7 years of one crappy life would submit to an earring! 

 

And no, Earring will NOT be joining the League of Extraordinary Inanimate Objects.

[catrox14]

I wouldn't go by the sequence of the promo. Promo monkeys muck with stuff all the time. I've learned that with Mad Men and SPN that what is in the promo often bears little resemblance to the episode #letmehavemydelusions

Okay wait. Why the earring hate? I mean men wear earrings all the time! :(. 

[apinknightmare]

Nahhh it's an earring. And it's terrible

I'm hating the buzzcut too

M

Now that I look at it it seems like light is hitting his ear a certain way, and the stud on his hood next to it makes it look like there's an earring, but there's not. Whew.

[catrox14]

I like the buzzcut myself. :)

[statsgirl]

I guess SA is going to have to wear a wig for his role of Casey Jones.

 

I still wouldn't be surprised is the role of Ra's comes with some major jewelry. We knew about the ring and the swirly capes, there's quite a bit of peacocking there.

 

I knew when they let Oliver and Felicity get together, the stupid was going to come.  The promo makes it look like Oliver is taking Nyssa back to Nanda Parbat for an execution (why?) but then it will turn out to be a marriage.  For no reason whatsoever but to keep Oliver and Felicity apart  This is when TV shows lose me; not when the couple gets together but when the writing goes to ridiculously stupid lengths to keep them apart.  Brain-washing? Really show?  This is also where Moonlighting actually feel apart, not when Dave and Maddie slept together but the idiocy of how the next two seasons kept them apart.

 

Ugh.  As if it weren't bad enough that taxes are due this week.

 

The main argument I see against an Oliver/Felicity wedding in episode 322 isn't an internal one: it's an external one, which is that my sense is that the CW would want to promote the hell out of any Oliver/Felicity wedding with THE BIG ARROW WEDDING and a major spread in Entertainment Weekly if they could get it, none of which is happening. Having said that, if this wedding is, like Oliver's first "I love you," and Oliver and Felicity's post sex scene, some sort of plot twist - and given Arrow, there's a good chance of this - that could explain a lot.

Yeah.  Look how much they promoted the Thousand-And-One-Nights sex scene.  "The moment you've been waiting for".

 

At this point it would be a relief to find it's a fake wedding for Oliver and Felicity, no matter how much I don't want them to get married at this point.

 

Tiffany Vogt @TVWatchtower  ·  Apr 25
@DJ_Traxi @sacredsmoak - Ra's has a very twisted mind. IF he were to force Nyssa and Oliver to get married, it would be to save Nyssa's life

 

That's not how you answer if it has nothing to do with Nyssa. 

But it is how you answer it when you have no clue but want to answer the tweet. People need to learn not to do that. MG is guilty of the same thing, answering questions he really should let pass.

 

 

Donnell’s character, Tommy Merlyn, died at the end of season one— much to fans’ disappointment. But just like with “The Affair,” death doesn’t mean automatically being written out of the script forever: Donnell will be back in season four next fall.

MG said that the LP won't be used to bring back characters the audience loves like Moira and Tommy so he's probably going to be in flashbacks or hallucinations again.  Unfortunately.

[apinknightmare]

How does a wedding between a brainwashed Oliver and a lesbian Nyssa keep Oliver and Felicity apart? They were going to be apart anyway. Once this LoA storyline is over, that sham marriage will be too, if it comes to pass. Makes no difference to me if he's brainwashed and single or brainwashed and in a sham marriage. There's no way he and Nyssa decide to try to make a go of it after he leaves the League to prolong the angst.

Edited April 27, 2015 by apinknightmare

[catrox14]

 

MG said that the LP won't be used to bring back characters the audience loves like Moira and Tommy so he's probably going to be in flashbacks or hallucinations again.  Unfortunately.

 

MG also said Malcolm Merlyn was dead...I don't think he is a reliable person is all I'm saying. :)

[statsgirl]

How can Felicity trust Oliver if he forgets her so easily and marries Nyssa just because of a little brain-washing?  How can Oliver trust himself to treat Felicity properly when he keeps hurting her so much?

 

Trust me, MG will find a way.

[catrox14]

SWERVE! Malcolm marries Nyssa.  Discuss

[apinknightmare]

SWERVE! Malcolm marries Nyssa. Discuss

Malcolm's been married before. Not him, unfortunately.

[catrox14]

Dammit! I keep forgetting that rule.  Wait, maybe we can circumvent that rule because the laws of marriage in the LoA are different!

 

HUGE SWERVE : Zombie!Tommy marries Laurel

[Chaser]

Thinking about this latest episode and how it sets up the rest of the season. 

 

Oliver/Diggle: Foreshadowed trouble ahead while re-enforcing they are brothers. AKAThis is going to hurt and probably for awhile, but brothers are brothers.

 

Oliver/Felicity: Having Felicity say ILY, sleeping together, not saying good-bye, happiness talk. AKA Felicity will be the biggest factor in pulling him back. I'm thinking a parallel to 3x01. Felicity gets hurt or is in danger again, but this time he fights to be Oliver Queen. 

 

MG said that Diggle and Felicity will be central in the finale and I think 3x20 was the underline on this statement. 

 

Oliver/Thea: I'm curious about this relationship the most. I don't think we have much on what Thea is going to be doing. I want her to fight for her brother so I find it interesting she is leaving to see Roy in 3x22. Makes me wonder about what happens in 3x21 between her and Oliver.

 

Did BR film for 3x23? I was thinking the meaningful scene in 3x22 between him and Felicity, was his send off from SC. Does anyone know if Flash or Arrow is going to set it up?

 

Nyssa is supposed to be playing a big role in the last three episodes. I think she will take ownership of the league at the end of the season. Heading into the finale episodes, Laurel is being tied more to Nyssa than Oliver/Diggle/Felicity. I think she will play side kick action role for the remainder of the season because they haven't tied her to Oliver's story at all so she shouldn't have a place there. I could see her leaving with Nyssa for the summer to train. 

[kismet]

She also said she didn't have any idea who was going to get married - that the EPs were very tight-lipped on that one. I wonder if she wasn't being completely honest. 

 

And LOL @ Ra's making Nyssa marry Oliver to save her life. Who would be threatening her but him? 

I appreciate that she provides info. But I generally don't trust her opinion or analysis of info she describes, its generally not as on point as one would hope. Most people here provide better insight.

[statsgirl]

MG keeps saying how the LP is going to change Thea and Malcolm said it changes you 'in your soul' but nothing in the spoilers hints at any real craziness.

[kismet]

...At least his face is still pretty? I dunno. Why does Ra's care about looks and if he has a buzzcut and an earring? Hmmm 

 

I now feel like Ra's wants to be a judge on ANTM

I feel crossover potential all over the place. Maybe SA's wife can have a guest spot & run one of the challenges :)

[looptab]

Saw the New Zealand promo. And now I'm freaking out. !@$&!

[wonderwall]

Saw the New Zealand promo. And now I'm freaking out. !@$&!

... Wait, what about it made you freak out? :p I don't have headphones right now so I can't watch it!

[Kordi]

I´ve just watched it and I was surprised to see Thea as Speedy(?)/ Dark Crazy Thea(?) shooting an arrow through Oliver´s arm, apparantly in an attempt to protect Diggle from beeing run through by Oliver with a sword... I hope I interpreted it correctly. I´m at work right now, and I´m not supposed to watch vids... so I cannot go back for rewatching to make sure I got it right :-)

[looptab]

Nevermind, I read Kordi's post and went back to watch it and I had totally misunderstood the shot. I hadn't even seen that arrow, ahah. Not freaking out now. Phew!

Edited April 27, 2015 by looptab

[kismet]

I´ve just watched it and I was surprised to see Thea as Speedy(?)/ Dark Crazy Thea(?) shooting an arrow through Oliver´s arm, apparantly in an attempt to protect Diggle from beeing run through by Oliver with a sword... I hope I interpreted it correctly. I´m at work right now, and I´m not supposed to watch vids... so I cannot go back for rewatching to make sure I got it right :-)

Also at work, and on silent that too is my interpretation. Can't rewatch now either :( Looks like Thea will be force to reckon with. I wonder if Thea will be the bad cop to Felicity's good cop to help break the brainwashing.