Spoiler Discussion Thread

[Hook75]

"I think it's better to not be with someone I could really care about". His identity crisis never translated into celibacy before, so why is it now? He doesn't have the excuse of hurting Felicity's feelings any more, because she's with another guy. All he's doing is hurting himself, and it's frankly beyond tiresome.

 

I agree, it seems Felicity had no problem moving on, showing little to no care for Oliver- so it is time for him to move on, or at least get some, lol. If Felicity can't be bothered fighting for him, he shouldn't spend his time mooning over her and Raywood or fight for her.

 

I'm thinking Thea is his date.

[apinknightmare]

Felicity's fought for him for two years - it's time for Oliver to learn to fight for himself since him thinking he can't BE himself is his whole reason for why he can't be with her.

 

Maybe Thea is his date. Or maybe he goes solo since he thinks relationships distract him from his mission and therefore probably wouldn't try to bring a date date anyway?

[wonderwall]

I agree, it seems Felicity had no problem moving on, showing little to no care for Oliver- so it is time for him to move on, or at least get some, lol. If Felicity can't be bothered fighting for him, he shouldn't spend his time mooning over her and Raywood or fight for her.

I don't get people's obsession with sex. Oliver doesn't need to 'get some', he's had a lifetimes worth of sex already. What Oliver needs is to sort out his life and him 'moving on' won't change that... also him having sex with randos won't change that either. Oliver not having sex with random women shows growth on his part because that's what 'Ollie' would do and not Oliver. Why would people want him to regress as a character?

 

And I don't get why people want Felicity to fight for Oliver. How can she fight for someone who doesn't even want to be in the relationship in the first place? What Oliver is going through is a personal issue that Felicity can't fix. Oliver has to want to fix his issues which he kind of doesn't.

Edited March 14, 2015 by wonderwall

[statsgirl]

Felicity tried fighting for Oliver, or more specifically for Oliver's soul in the laneway conversation and look where it got her -- shut out of Team Arrow's inner circle.

 

I agree, it seems Felicity had no problem moving on, showing little to no care for Oliver- so it is time for him to move on, or at least get some, lol. If Felicity can't be bothered fighting for him, he shouldn't spend his time mooning over her and Raywood or fight for her.

I'd say Felicity has had a great deal of trouble moving on.  Oliver told her he can't be with her in 3x01 but she was still hoping he would open up to her after Sara died.  He didn't, instead he told her that he was just waiting to lie on the slab himself so she went to Ray for a job but she still went back to the lair the next morning and tried to jolly Oliver out of his angst.  And in the next Flash episode, she told Barry she still had quiet dreams about being with Oliver.

 

After she wanted Oliver to tell her not to go to the dinner with Ray, even after the speech to Carrie when Oliver said he couldn't be with someone, when he went off to kill himself, she continued to hope that he would come back and they could be together, as she told him in 3x12. But he shut her out again, and yet she still waiting for him.  It wasn't until both Oliver and Diggle shut her out of the discussions in Nanda Parbat that she went to Ray to see if she could save him because she couldn't save Oliver and she kissed Ray.  That was all she did until he lunged at her and took her to bed.  So I'd say Felicity has had a great deal of trouble moving on from Oliver, and I doubt she really has yet. 

 

It doesn't make sense for Oliver to take a date to Diggle's wedding since the whole point of this "identity crisis" is because he believes he can't be in a relationship with a woman because it distracts him from being The Arrow.  Why take someone who is looking for a relationship (because you know any woman he invited would be thinking it) when he's already got someone who was more than willing but he felt he couldn't be there for any woman?

[Chaser]

So assuming someone is getting LP in 3x20, SA and KC are missing from the BTS shots. Willa and Emily look fine. I wonder if Roy dies and they LP him. Maybe Laurel is off playing Sara with Nyssa and SA/CH is with Ra's. Or Roy really does die and LL is getting LP and that's why she isn't there. MG makes it sound like 3x20 is a big Team Arrow episode and I wouldn't put it past him to treat LL like a big part of Team Arrow. 

[apinknightmare]

So assuming someone is getting LP in 3x20, SA and KC are missing from the BTS shots. Willa and Emily look fine. I wonder if Roy dies and they LP him. Maybe Laurel is off playing Sara with Nyssa and SA/CH is with Ra's. Or Roy really does die and LL is getting LP and that's why she isn't there. MG makes it sound like 3x20 is a big Team Arrow episode and I wouldn't put it past him to treat LL like a big part of Team Arrow. 

 

KC and SA are missing from some BTS shots, but they were in some that were taken in what looked like an airplane hangar. Well - SA was in those, but it seems like KC was there since she posted a pic of EBR from that set. Unless, I guess, that wasn't her pic that she posted. Seems like the BTS shots with WH in them were in some kind of outside setting, so maybe Oliver and Laurel separate from the group once they get wherever they're going (again, provided that KC was actually there at all in the first set of BTS pics).

 

But yeah, I think we can rule out Team Arrow ever being Oliver, Diggle and Felicity again. 

Edited March 14, 2015 by apinknightmare

[Chaser]

KC and SA are missing from some BTS shots, but they were in some that were taken in what looked like an airplane hangar. Well - SA was in those, but it seems like KC was there since she posted a pic of EBR from that set. Unless, I guess, that wasn't her pic that she posted. Seems like the BTS shots with WH in them were in some kind of outside setting, so maybe Oliver and Laurel separate from the group once they get wherever they're going (again, provided that KC was actually there at all in the first set of BTS pics).

 

But yeah, I think we can rule out Team Arrow ever being Oliver, Diggle and Felicity again. 

The shots I was referring to were the out door shots, not the hanger shots. MG seems to be emphasizing the pain for the audience and seems to reference Team Arrow with it. I get that MG is including Laurel in Team Arrow, but he has to know the audience is still fighting it. If it is Laurel that is LP, he has to be trolling a portion of the audience with his answers.

[wonderwall]

But yeah, I think we can rule out Team Arrow ever being Oliver, Diggle and Felicity again. 

 

This leaves me with so much dread. My heart literally sunk

[apinknightmare]

The shots I was referring to were the out door shots, not the hanger shots. MG seems to be emphasizing the pain for the audience and seems to reference Team Arrow with it. I get that MG is including Laurel in Team Arrow, but he has to know the audience is still fighting it. If it is Laurel that is LP, he has to be trolling a portion of the audience with his answers.

 

I agree that if Laurel dies and does get LPed, he's trolling. 

 

If the LP comes into play, could be that it happens after whatever they're doing in the BTS shots? So everyone's fine but soon to be not fine? I don't know. Since we don't know where Ra's and Oliver stand yet it's difficult to suss out.

[statsgirl]

But yeah, I think we can rule out Team Arrow ever being Oliver, Diggle and Felicity again. 

 

I think Roy fit into Team Arrow pretty seamlessly in the early episodes this season.  It's moving beyond him that's the problem. Even when Sara was there last season, it was imbalanced.  Any chance MG will leave the Team at four? 

 

Yeah, I know.... comics.

[KirkB]

I know this is unlikely but maybe Laurel will make her own base somewhere else? So even though her Canary is obviously still going to be around she won't be in the lair all the time and it will just be Oliver, Diggle, Felicity and Roy?

[kismet]

There are only 2 reasons I can think of ray needing to officiate the dyla nuptials. 1. Poor Writing & character development or 2. Limited Budget. I think both reasons are at play which is why I'm guessing team arrow will all be going to the wedding as a group, which is not uncommon esp considering none of them actually have social life anymore. I have attended weddings as a group of friends when the majority of us were single, rather then just invite some randos, I mean u know who ur gonna hang out with at weddings most of the time anyway. I believe the only plus1 will be ray. If the show is not willing to pay to have guest star/extra play the officiant, I can't imagine they would pay just to have oliver bring a date so he wouldn't be alone.

But I am more interested in finding out what the alpha/omega has to do with the plot. Curious as to how hk flashbacks will play into present day. Beyond introducing tatsu/maseo to resurrect oq from the dead and making me think/fear that they might actually kill a kid. I haven't found a reason for the flashbacks yet & im becoming a little impatient. Superficially I have enjoyed them for oq's wig, its got some body to it this year. But thats not enough payoff at this point in the season.

[tv echo]

So we know that in 3x18, Ray is critically injured (while Felicity keeps vigil), and Ra's kidnaps Quentin.  If Diggle is still away on his Suicide Squad mission or off on a delayed honeymoon, then we're looking at Oliver and Laurel (because she would never stay behind) going to Nanda Parbat to rescue Quentin - perhaps with the help of Malcolm (his redemption?) and Nyssa (Laurel's new BFF)?  Something else to look forward to... (yes, that's sarcasm).

Edited March 14, 2015 by tv echo

[looptab]

So we know that in 3x18, Ray is critically injured (while Felicity keeps vigil), and Ra's kidnaps Quentin.  If Diggle is still away on his Suicide Squad mission or off on a delayed honeymoon, then we're looking at Oliver and Laurel (because she would never stay behind) going to Nanda Parbat to rescue Quentin - perhaps with the help of Malcolm (his redemption?) and Nyssa (Laurel's new BFF)?  Something else to look forward to... (yes, that's sarcasm).

Dig is not going to be off: among those photos of the night-shooting for 318 with Oliver, Roy and Laurel in costume, there were also some with Diggle near the van. I don't think Ra's is going to take Quentin to Nanda Parbat, I think the action will stay in Starling.

Edited March 14, 2015 by looptab

[DrSpaceman10]

They should have had Felicity or Oliver be the officiant. Anyone can get ordained online, and Felicity/Oliver both know Diggle really well. 

[Velocity23]

KC was in Dallas from Sunday till at least Wednesday. So i dont think she did that much shooting. Previous week she was in LA and came back only Friday. I dont think she will have a lot of presence in 3x20.

Edited March 14, 2015 by Velocity23

[Angel12d]

I really hope Laurel isn't the one who dies and gets put in the LP. What an even bigger insult to Sara if that happens. They killed her off but she's the one who stays dead. No. Just no. 

[Chaser]

I really hope Laurel isn't the one who dies and gets put in the LP. What an even bigger insult to Sara if that happens. They killed her off but she's the one who stays dead. No. Just no. 

Sadly, I am preparing myself for this. Ra's goes after Lance in 3.18, Laurel goes 'pretty far' for Oliver in 3.19, and KC is absent a lot in 3.20. Given MG delight in trolling and how he loves Laurel in Team Arrow, I'm thinking he is going to love writng Laurel a hero and Oliver/Diggle/Felicity mourning her.

[looptab]

Sadly, I am preparing myself for this. Ra's goes after Lance in 3.18, Laurel goes 'pretty far' for Oliver in 3.19, and KC is absent a lot in 3.20. Given MG delight in trolling and how he loves Laurel in Team Arrow, I'm thinking he is going to love writng Laurel a hero and Oliver/Diggle/Felicity mourning her.

Yeah, it seems more and more plausible. And more and more horrible. I'm trying to prepare myself for this, too, but failing miserably- any tips to share?:)

[calliope1975]

It would sort of explain why Lance and Ra's are interacting. Otherwise, I can't figure out how that meeting would ever come to pass. Unless it's about Sara.

[apinknightmare]

It would sort of explain why Lance and Ra's are interacting. Otherwise, I can't figure out how that meeting would ever come to pass. Unless it's about Sara.

 

But they're meeting two episodes before the hypothetical pitting. Why on earth would Ra's go after Lance anyway? Why would Ra's care about Laurel at this point? Unless he goes after Lance because Lance is going after Arrow/Oliver, but then that would mean that Oliver turned him down, so why would Ra's do that? Too many questions, haha. 

 

I think Laurel's going to be the one who "dies" too. If it is her, I guess maybe she'll be getting her canary cry.

[Angel12d]

Sadly, I am preparing myself for this. Ra's goes after Lance in 3.18, Laurel goes 'pretty far' for Oliver in 3.19, and KC is absent a lot in 3.20. Given MG delight in trolling and how he loves Laurel in Team Arrow, I'm thinking he is going to love writng Laurel a hero and Oliver/Diggle/Felicity mourning her.

 

I'm prepared for it too but it's just so wrong. So they kill off both Lance sisters but only the one whose name is Laurel can get resurrected?! Terrible. Just ugh. I can't. That's such an insult to Sara and her fans and a cheap way of gaining sympathy/support for Laurel. I'd much rather Roy died and then got LP'd and maybe came back evil/crazy for a while. That'd be more interesting and also plays into the idea that this season is Thea's crucible - and she loses the man she (used to) loves.

 

Also, if 'going pretty far for Oliver' means Laurel sacrifices her own life for him…what?! That's not just going pretty far, that's kind of above and beyond tbh. Plus she seems pretty pissed off at him lately and they're constantly butting heads. What changes for her to make such a sacrifice? 

 

Of course this is all based on the speculation that the LP will even come into play. But it is a bit like Chekhov's LP so it does seem likely. 

[wonderwall]

I think Laurel's going to be the one who "dies" too. If it is her, I guess maybe she'll be getting her canary cry.

 

I feel like someone should ask MG if Laurel will be getting her canary cry... If he says, no, then that's that. If he's vague about it then you know she's gonna get it. 

[apinknightmare]

I feel like someone should ask MG if Laurel will be getting her canary cry... If he says, no, then that's that. If he's vague about it then you know she's gonna get it. 

 

I think he has been asked, but I think his answers were sort of a no to non-committal. Not that it really means anything at this point since the EPs could change their mind, and they've already got a metahuman coming on in 3x19.

[wonderwall]

Best case scenario for Laurel now that she's become BC is for her to become the next Roy. She doesn't say anything, doesn't do anything, just goes out and then comes back and stays quiet lol

[statsgirl]

You know she's never going to not say anything and to stay in the background.  And even if she did, her fans would be deluging MG with hate mail about it.

 

I just want her to go to the new show. Oliver, Diggle Felicity and Roy work with a certain dynamic.  If Laurel stays on Arrow, she's going to completely change the tone of it, as she has this season. There's now way they can put Baby in the corner.

 

 

Sadly, I am preparing myself for this. Ra's goes after Lance in 3.18, Laurel goes 'pretty far' for Oliver in 3.19, and KC is absent a lot in 3.20. Given MG delight in trolling and how he loves Laurel in Team Arrow, I'm thinking he is going to love writng Laurel a hero and Oliver/Diggle/Felicity mourning her.

Without doubt, he will love writing Laurel a hero and Team Arrow doing anything they can to get her back.

 

I really think it would be shooting themselves in the foot though.  Laurel is still a divisive character (one of the male reviewers last week referred to her as the most hated character on Arrow), and with a part of the audience already not liking this season, it would be a mistake of Sleepy Hollow proportions to LP her so she can come back when they didn't Sara.  And don't forget, Sara has to come back for the spin-off and LPing her would be the easiest.

[SleepDeprived]

I really don't think Laurel is dying or getting pitted. I just don't see how her hypothetical death would spur Team Arrow and Merlyn to travel to Nanda Parbat and brave the League just to, possibly, resurrect her. Merlyn, especially, would give zero shits about Laurel's death, I would think.

 

I still think it's Roy that will die in 3.19. Because Colton has had zero presence, that we know of, on the Arrow set since those ominous tweets/Team Arrow in the foundry photos. Also, at least with Roy, I can see Thea being devastated enough that she convinces Merlyn and Oliver to travel to Nanda Parbat, and help her bring back Roy. Additionally, if Roy doesn't come back right in the head after the Lazarus Pitting then he might return in a Jason Todd/Red Hood kind of state, which would give the writers plenty of material to steal borrow from Batman again.

 

With all these talk about the Lazarus Pit resurrecting people, I'm kinda hoping that something out of left field, like the Pit in Nanda Parbat slowly losing its powers or not working as well as it used to, would happen. Like the real reason Ra's wants Oliver to take over is because the LP can't sustain his body anymore (he has been spending a heck of a whole lot of time lounging in that magical tub) and he needs a strong vessel, like Oliver, to transfer his conscious into so that he can continue to be Ra's al Ghul. If he's going to wreak so much havoc in Oliver's life, more than Slade ever did, then Ra's being determined to make Oliver's body his vessel would make more sense than Ra's just really really wanting Oliver to be his new Heir to the Demon.

[kismet]

Sadly, I am preparing myself for this. Ra's goes after Lance in 3.18, Laurel goes 'pretty far' for Oliver in 3.19, and KC is absent a lot in 3.20. Given MG delight in trolling and how he loves Laurel in Team Arrow, I'm thinking he is going to love writng Laurel a hero and Oliver/Diggle/Felicity mourning her.

As much as laurel has had her moments, most of which i blame on poor writing & arc planning. I think it would be absolutely appropriate for everyone on the show to mourn her. She has done heroic things s1-3. Shes not perfect, but she would deserve mourning just likeif anyone from team arrow or the main cast die.

Maybe the lances will get a 2 for 1 deal and both will be LPd. But I really dont think the LP are gonna be used on any current or former member of team arrow.

[looptab]

As much as laurel has had her moments, most of which i blame on poor writing & arc planning. I think it would be absolutely appropriate for everyone on the show to mourn her. She has done heroic things s1-3. Shes not perfect, but she would deserve mourning just likeif anyone from team arrow or the main cast die.

 

Of course she should be mourned, should she die. It's just that, at least for me, that's not an event-nor the dying, nor the resurrecting, and everything that would come in between- that I'd be remotely interested in watching.  It's a storyline that has potential, IMO, and I'd like to see it play out on screen, just not if it revolves around Laurel.

[statsgirl]

In terms of who the character is on the show, it would be appropriate for the on-screen characters to mourn her.  Even Felicity mourned when Moira died.

 

The audience, however, is another question.  It was a shock and a sadness when Sara died, and the ratings and number of viewers went down for the next two weeks as the audience mourned. I don't think that would be the same for Laurel, and LPing Laurel wouldn't meet with universal joy.

 

I really don't think Laurel is dying or getting pitted. I just don't see how her hypothetical death would spur Team Arrow and Merlyn to travel to Nanda Parbat and brave the League just to, possibly, resurrect her. Merlyn, especially, would give zero shits about Laurel's death, I would think.

I knew there was a reason I liked Malcolm.

 

Those are good ideas about Ra's and the Lazarus Pit, SleepDeprived.  It feels like this season, they've wasted both the LP and Ra's as a villain.

[wonderwall]

In terms of who the character is on the show, it would be appropriate for the on-screen characters to mourn her.  Even Felicity mourned when Moira died.

 

Mm I don't think Felicity mourned for Moira at all. She was crying because of what Moira's death would do to Oliver. She was crying for Oliver. *sigh* I miss the moments when they weren't so screwed up. Hopefully we get those back soon :)

Edited March 14, 2015 by wonderwall

[statsgirl]

I think she felt sorry Moira died.  But she wasn't really close to her.

 

From the Paleys

"There is a legend that the man who survived Ras Al Ghuls sword will become ras Al Ghul" #Arrow #PaleyFest

 

Seriously, show?  That's how you're going to retcon it?

[apinknightmare]

Okay, I'm sorry. Regarding the article by Natalie Abrams about the sizzle reel - why exactly is Ray going to try taking down the Arrow? Didn't he say several times that he wanted to get out there and "do what the Arrow is doing" or some other such nonsense? 

 

And now that Lance has found his way into the lair, I guess we know why it goes away. I wonder if SCPD blows it up or if Team Arrow does?

Edited March 15, 2015 by apinknightmare

[Morrigan2575]

My first thought was...so they're shitting all over Oliver this year just to set up a reason for Oliver to want to become Ra's. Basically that's what 312, 313, Raylicity, etc is for.

Talk about plot driving the characters

Edited March 15, 2015 by Morrigan2575

[wonderwall]

I think that maybe something will happen in episode 16 which will turn Ray against the Arrow? IDK Regardless, I think Felicity'd be pissed if Ray were trying to take down the Arrow because he (well usually) actually helps the city. This better not be a plot device to turn Felicity against Ray. Because that would be pretty weak. 

Edited March 15, 2015 by wonderwall

[apinknightmare]

This better not be a plot device to turn Felicity against Ray. Because that would be pretty weak. 

 

In other words, that's probably what it is, haha

[calliope1975]

So they isolate Ray, have him be a stall to many fans preferred ship, make him Phony Stark, and now he's targeting Arrow, the hero of the show. They sure know how to create a beloved character.

[apinknightmare]

There was a spoiler that Atom and Arrow clash over how to deal with some kind of problem, so I guess Ray doesn't like what Oliver's doing? So despite the fact that he's been trying to emulate him, now that he's got his super suit he's going to bring him down? 

[catrox14]

So they isolate Ray, have him be a stall to many fans preferred ship, make him Phony Stark, and now he's targeting Arrow, the hero of the show. They sure know how to create a beloved character.

 

I think they are trying to villainize Oliver in a real way.He'll take Ra's deal and Ray will target him.  Ray is the hero and Oliver is the villain.  And Malcolm will ally with Oliver

[Password]

Every spoiler read about Ray makes me think "Do they want me to like this character?

[Angel12d]

Ray wants to take the Arrow down, despite knowing how much he's helped the city? Um, they're just giving me more reason to dislike him. Do they even know what they're doing?! Haha. What. 

[apinknightmare]

Someone on Twitter posted a pic of the reel and it looks like Felicity gets hurt? Either she's hurt and a police officer is pushing her out of the way, or she's being detained (but the cop is coming at her from the front).

 

Think it's okay to link to her twitter since the trailer isn't out yet? I don't want to screen cap the pic since it's hers, IDK.

Edited March 15, 2015 by apinknightmare

[Password]

I'm sure Oliver will end up doing something questionable, and Ray will swoop in and want to make him accountable.

Ray, go away, do not come back another day.

[apinknightmare]

Someone who was at PF said that Shado is alive in the flashbacks, and there's a still of someone who definitely looks like her, so...

 

I don't know.

Edited March 15, 2015 by apinknightmare

[wonderwall]

Someone who was at PF said that Shado is alive in the flashbacks, and there's a still of someone who definitely looks like her, so...

 

I don't know.

 

I hope she's not alive. Don't get me wrong, I love her. But that would legit make season 2 pointless. Also this is the photo:

 

Edited March 15, 2015 by wonderwall

[Morrigan2575]

How the hell is Shado alive? WTF?! Way to early in any show for death to have no meaning.

[apinknightmare]

How the hell is Shado alive? WTF?! Way to early in any show for death to have no meaning.

 

Well, AK did state (again) that at the end of S3 the show would never be the same. So I guess we're resurrecting the dead now. 

 

And if that's Shado and not some clone (maybe Sara IS coming back as a clone - could that have something to do with the Omega virus?), then she looks pretty good for being shot in the head and left for who knows how long.

[Angel12d]

Maybe Shado is another hallucination? It's happened enough times on this show. We all know they like to repeat stuff.

Also from that brief clip I can't tell if Felicity is getting hurt or being detained by the Police.

[wonderwall]

Apparently Laurel is crossing over to the Flash? Please Flash, take her. I don't want her on Arrow anymore :p ALSO Apparently Cisco LOVES Laurel lmao. ok

Edited March 15, 2015 by wonderwall

[apinknightmare]

Maybe Shado is another hallucination? It's happened enough times on this show. We all know they like to repeat stuff.

Also from that brief clip I can't tell if Felicity is getting hurt or being detained by the Police.

 

First comment: I really hope so. 

 

Second: I really can't tell either. But if she is being detained they're being awfully rough with her, and usually they don't come at you from the front if you're not resisting. Felicity seems like the kind who wouldn't resist (IMO, although it's tough to say what she'd do when panic sets in) - the poster who was at the panel said it looked like she got hurt. Which ep is it when the foundry gets blown up again? Is it 19?