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Spoiler Discussion Thread


Morrigan2575
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Thinking about what @TrueMyth said. The mystery of the nude undersuit is still bugging me.

 

If it was for warmth off set I would imagine she'd just wear a jacket. It if was warmth on set I think that would be unflattering unless the shots are far off in distance. They could also be trying to light a scene, but that seems to be a lot of effort to have someone put on a nude suit under a dress for lighting, and I would anticipate they would have stand in & not the principal be there instead. It being used for modesty then that would be logical, but its illogical for her to throw her dress over it for the interview, again a sweater would have done the job to cover the costume. Im thinking that TrueMyth might be on to something and it is being used for protection from explosives or squibs. And if that is the case then she must be pretty close for reaction shots, because otherwise I would imagine they would simply put in stunt double. Another theory that had been passed around earlier in the threads was that the nude arms were covering up injury/wounds make-up. Which could be possible too. My guess is it was for stunt protection. So it should be interesting what happens. I believe they were filming 19 at the time, but it could have been end of 18. It was too early for them to be filming 20.

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Didn't MG debunk the 'Felicity dying and getting LP'd theory? I swear I saw a reblog of his answer on tumblr. 

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Read a tumblr post (http://ah-maa-zing.tumblr.com/post/114160901774/arrow-speculation-who-dies) that was trying to figure out who would die. After deliberating they decided Thea would die & be put in LP. It made some good points. Im beginning to agree with this theory. I too can only see OQ becoming Ras to save the 2 women whom he loves the most. Maybe Diggle as well, but we all know DR is not gonna get killed. FS is too obvious an answer, plus we need to disentangle her from Ray to even make it possible. If she gets injured in r/t Ray, then Ray would be involved in saving her & I don't see or hear about him in NP. If FS gets injured the minute she starts working just for TA, that's too cliche & predictable. But Thea on the other hand has been teetering on death & darkness for most of the season. And this season was all about saving Thea's soul. What if in saving her life via the LP, they lose her soul in the process? Then we have a nice arc set-up for next season or the comics trying to get Thea back from the darkness. The special effects mask fitting pic that was leaked & removed could have been her getting fitted for prosthetics required during the LP or its aftermath and not a superhero mask. It did seem like a lot of molding just to make a mask, esp. if it is likely just an eye mask. I'm guessing that there are rule & consequences to the LP, perhaps only those chosen can use the waters without injury - which is why Ras seems unaffected. While those not chosen can survive but are scarred in someway at least temporarily. I just think going into NP the first time OQ knew 2 things and somehow I think the end of the season will all link back to those 2 people he was sure about (Thea & Felicity).

 

Roy is my next guess. But would OQ become Ras to save him in the LP? Not sure. Think it is more likely that he is locked up in the house of corrections. I do recall that pic they released from the production office that had him in a HOC issued jacket. Explaining why he's been off set & unable to help TA. Perhaps LL will help him get out the legal way. Also explains why he keeps on suggesting that RH is not gone from the show. Again provide good arc for comics or s4. There having trouble writing LL into the comics, perfect opportunity to have her defending RH & vigilanting at night for clues to prove his innocence, esp if it comes out about his role in the cops death.

 

LL will go far for OQ but I can't see the writers choosing to LP her, not now that they are also bringing back Sara. Unless & this is absolutely crazy - but what if they LP LL and both her & sara get simultaneously resurrected from the pool. I know wicked crazy & unrealistic, but who knows. Perhaps somebody dropped Sara in earlier, and it just took until LL got there for it to be completed. Although I think is more likely that the Sara we know was never really killed (either Ras or MM), rather the person TA buried was someone who had been chosen or volunteered to die as Sara to set Ras or MM plan in motion. Nyssa would be really upset w/ her father, if he was involved in keeping Sara hidden & faking her death. Perhaps that is how Ras will actually die. Nyssa will kill him because of what he did to her & Sara. Season Finale problem fixed. OQ takes Ras offer, the mission to destroy SC ends. However, he never becomes Ras because Nyssa killing her father trumps the prophecy. In order to become Ras you must defeat Ras. OQ is only getting the offer because of a small print clause on the prophecy, not because he fulfilled the big prophecy. OQ can return to SC as the Arrow & Nyssa takes her rightful place & is now ally to TA. LL remains on as BC since Nyssa now trained her & SL is released from her oath to LoA and chooses to have a normal life outside of SC or NP wherever the spin-off is likely to take place.


Didn't MG debunk the 'Felicity dying and getting LP'd theory? I swear I saw a reblog of his answer on tumblr. 

Yes he did. But I think he's debunked just about every other theory too. Just keep watching is the gist of most of his answers these days. So I think he's just playing this one close to the chest, as he should. I love speculating & trying to figure it out amongst fans. But I don't want it actually spoiled for me from the writers/producers, that would ruin all the fun!

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I love the idea of it being Thea and I think storywise it would be the most cohesive with the story told so far. There are two things they are really building on right now: they kickstarted Roy/Thea back up and they are really focusing on Thea/Oliver. The EPs said that this season would be an award for KC and WH. KC got her BC trilogy mid-season. This feels like WH's time.

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I think it's very possible it's Thea, if the LP is going to be used at all. But it does link back to Oliver saying he would do anything - anything - to save his sister and with him now being adamant about his refusal to be the next Ra's, I can see that being the only thing to change his mind. 

 

It also links into how this season is Thea's crucible - what's bigger than dying and being revived? The Oliver/Thea parallels are great - about the only thing that is this season.

Edited by Guest
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Thinking about MG's weird response re: Thea/Felicity scenes, I think maybe he answered that way because they won't exactly go as we expect? What I see is people generally expecting good interactions between the two, but what if Thea somehow is adversarial towards Felicity? I wouldn't mind an exchange like that, personally. Let your Moira show, Thea. I kinda crave the two of them just serving truth tea to each other. (When they first announced those Thea/Felicity scenes that were then pushed back, I imagined a similar scenario haha). I just don't know that they would be instantly friendly.

Edited by looptab
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Thinking about MG's weird response re: Thea/Felicity scenes, I think maybe he answered that way because they won't exactly go as we expect? What I see is people generally expecting good interactions between the two, but what if Thea somehow is adversarial towards Felicity? I wouldn't mind an exchange like that, personally. Let your Moira show, Thea. I kinda crave the two of them just serving truth tea to each other. (When they first announced those Thea/Felicity scenes that were then pushed back, I imagined a similar scenario haha). I just don't know that they would be instantly friendly.

That thought crossed my mind too. If maybe the reason he didn't respond with a keep watching or something more teasing is because it isn't a positive interaction. Thea is close with Laurel, maybe she still thinks its Laurel for Oliver (I really doubt this btw, he hasn't bothered with breadcrumbs for Oliver and Laurel shippers so why start now). Maybe she is super protective of Oliver and doesn't like to see him hurting. Another option that I much prefer is that, the scene is too spoilery for him to talk about. 

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If they do have a negative interaction, I wonder what it'd even be about? As far as we know, all Thea knows about Felicity is that she is Oliver's friend/former assistant/partner in vigilante-ing. Maybe she could notice Oliver looking a bit lovesick at her and she could not like that, but wouldn't she talk to Oliver about his feelings first before being nasty to Felicity over them? Then he'd tell her that he didn't think they could be together, which is his issue, not Felicity's. If she thought Laurel was still it for Oliver, what's the point of being nasty to Felicity about it? That's Oliver's issue - especially considering Felicity will be at the wedding with Ray, so it's not like she's "keeping" Oliver from Laurel or whatever. I guess maybe Thea could think she was stringing Oliver along, but then that would go back to them not being together being Oliver's decision, and she's not really stringing him along since he's the one who told her no first. 

 

I wonder if Thea knows or finds out that Felicity's the one who found out that Malcolm is her father and told Oliver about it, therefore "causing" her whole current crisis? Never mind the fact that Malcolm was pretty much going to come back and get her regardless after Moira died, but I could see Thea being nasty about that, if she was going to be nasty to Felicity about anything.

Edited by apinknightmare
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I can't think of a really plausible reason for Thea and Felicity to interact negatively, which is why I'm leaning more towards a 'Spoiler Alert Scene.' I just find his answer to be worded a bit oddly.

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I can't see an overtly negative relationship. But I can see an over-protective Thea trying to protect her brother. But honestly, I see her turning to Oliver with her concerns first before turning to Felicity about it. I could see a little Moira coming out in her and calling Felicity out. Thea does not seem to have a filter when it comes to truth tea. Which is amazing btw, luv her one liners. As for the whole MM is her father and FS finding out before her, I can't see how that has any bearing on what is happening right now. The former DA knew about the affair and was going to bring it up in the trial, so it was bound to come up. TQ chose to go with MM at the end of s2 so thats on her. Moira chose to overly protect her children & that is on her (RIP Moira, miss u). RQ knews & Walter likely knew, perhaps they should have told her or helped convince MQ that it was Theas right to know. I can't see how FS finding out & then immediately talking to OQ & MQ about it has any bearing on the current relationship drama between MM/OQ/TQ. Even if FS had told TQ (which would have been completely wrong & not her place) it would probably not have changed what went down this season. Now if MQ or OQ had told Thea earlier, like they should have then we could have probably bypassed a good portion of this MM drama.

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The only way I see Thea acting negatively towards Felicity is if she thinks Felicity is hurting Oliver in some way and her protective sibling side comes out. But I wouldn't even see that lasting beyond an episode.

 

If anything Felicity and Thea have a common ground this season, now that Thea knows what a disgusting human her father is. They both hate Malcolm and I'd love it if they teamed up in some way to destroy him, even though that will never happen because I'm feeling more and more certain that they're trying to redeem that bastard. UGH.

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I don't know either, honestly. I made pretty much the same suppositions, her seeing Oliver all puppy eyed and blaming Felicity for stringing him along. Considering it's the wedding episode I'm expecting they'll beat us with Olicity teasing and whatnot. I'm not so optimist about it, haha. I also wondered about Felicity's role in finding out Thea's parentage. I would like her to say that Oliver found out just  two weeks before Thea did.

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 Considering it's the wedding episode I'm expecting they'll beat us with Olicity teasing and whatnot. I'm not so optimist about it, haha. 

 

Honestly, I think there's just probably going to be one Olicity teasing scene and the rest will be Raylicity because this is the episode with their rough patch. I have no hopes pinned on the wedding episode. I'm already dreading her catching the bouquet. Vomit. I think the Suicide Squad will dominate the episode anyway.

If she's got an issue with Felicity over Oliver, that's really, really going to irritate me.

 

I don't even think it's going to be an issue at all.

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If she's got an issue with Felicity over Oliver, that's really, really going to irritate me.

Haha. I don't know, for me it'd depend on how it'd all play out. I'm torn, I want them to create a bond but I wouldn't mind some conflict. I guess what would really put me off is real bitchiness, though. from either part.

 

ETA:

Honestly, I think there's just probably going to be one Olicity teasing scene and the rest will be Raylicity because this is the episode with their rough patch. I have no hopes pinned on the wedding episode. I'm already dreading her catching the bouquet. Vomit. I think the Suicide Squad will dominate the episode anyway.

 

You and me both :/ I don't know, I'm expecting not so much Raylicity but Felicity going back and forth. But let Diggle shine in all his glory, show, please!

Edited by looptab
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Haha. I don't know, for me it'd depend on how it'd all play out. I'm torn, I want them to create a bond but I wouldn't mind some conflict. I guess what would really put me off is real bitchiness, though. from either part.

 

I wouldn't mind conflict between them either, but if it's about Oliver and his hurt feels, that would irritate me. 

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What did MG say about it again? That we would see soon why he can't talk about it or something?

 

I can't remember his exact words but pretty much.

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I'm waiting with bated breath for Thea to slap Oliver upside the head like she's done in the past and make him realize that he needs to be with Felicity, Arrow or no Arrow.

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From the Spoilers Only thread: 

 

Q: Is there any hope for Lauryssa (laurel+nyssa)? It is a bit of a reach, I know, but unfortunately for me I ship everything that smiles and breathes at each other. I love everything you do!


MG: Thanks!  I think you’ll enjoy Ep. 3x21.

 

Please be trolling. Please. 

 

If not...yikes. I mean, we know they love their sister swapping on this show, but is she actually Sara? Are we in some weird Fight Club universe where they are the very same people?

Edited by apinknightmare
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Honestly, I think there's just probably going to be one Olicity teasing scene and the rest will be Raylicity because this is the episode with their rough patch. I have no hopes pinned on the wedding episode. I'm already dreading her catching the bouquet. Vomit. I think the Suicide Squad will dominate the episode anyway.

 

I don't even think it's going to be an issue at all.

From your keyboard to the TV screen PLZ! I just want the wedding to be all about the DYLA love. I hope they keep all other romantic pinings to a minimum. Its bad enough we got the cliched bouquet catch & RP officiating the ceremony (seriously?). Somebody in the writers room is watching too many bad rom coms & its influencing their abilities, perhaps an intervention is in need. A midnight visit from with a little "u have failed this program" is in order.

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Please be trolling. Please.

 

If not...yikes. I mean, we know they love their sister swapping on this show, but is she actually Sara? Are we in some weird Fight Club universe where they are the very same people?

 

I just cannot. Maybe he's just talking about them having nice moments in 321 that shippers would like, but not that it's ever really going to happen--but I don't know that he'd have that nuanced of an idea of how shipping works. So, yeah, I'm a little worried.

Edited by Carrie Ann
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From the Spoilers Only thread: 

 

 

Please be trolling. Please. 

 

If not...yikes. I mean, we know they love their sister swapping on this show, but is she actually Sara? Are we in some weird Fight Club universe where they are the very same people?

I second the please be trolling. They can't be serious. Can they? The horror!

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321 could be the episode when Sara returns. Thereby being a close & happy moment between all 3 of them.

 

MGs recent tumblr responses seem to have taken on the form of indexing more than anything else. You want to see X, then watch episode #. If u like y, then episode # is your episode. Im choosing to read nothing into what he says...

 

Sidenote - That poor girl shipping anything that smiles & breathes, what rough show she's chosen to follow. Barely anybody smiles on this show. Breathing is also becoming slightly optional.

Edited by kismet
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I think Felicity is going to be torn between defending Ray and agreeing with Oliver. I really get the impression she doesn't know what all Ray intends to do.

 

I highly doubt they are going with a Laurel/Nyssa pairing. I'm just assuming more bonding time, esp if Sara is the one coming back.

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I really hope Felicity gets pissed off at Ray for not telling her about the suit. Like what kind of ass does that? Regardless, what do Ray and Felicity actually talk about? Because I get the feeling that Felicity doesn't  know Ray's intentions with the suit at all. Do they even have any meaningful conversations other than tech talk? I mean, the only things they talked about over the season that was remotely meaningful was when Ray talked about Anna and when Ray/Felicity had that uncomfortably close moment in episode 11 where he told her that he was doing this for her now (which imo makes the least amount of sense because they barely know each other). 

 

Anyways, back to the topic at hand. I'm really really hoping that the writers don't make a complete 180 and turn whatever's going on between O/F into yet another cliche by dragging R in the middle of this. I hope Oliver is respectful of Felicity's decision to have a something with Ray. I hope Ray doesn't get jealous of O/Fs renewed closeness. I hope this whole thing between the three of them has more to do with their vigilante activities than the whole love triangle crap. Last episode gave me hope that the writers can actually write themselves out of this contrived mess without making it into yet another cliche and I feel like that's dangerous lmao

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Omg no, that Laurel/Nyssa thing. NO. NO. NO. Is there not ONE thing of Sara's that doesn't automatically end up with Laurel? I don't mean to call Nyssa a 'thing' but come on. Laurel has Sara's mask, she's taken her name, they shared Oliver back and forth (gross), could we please leave Nyssa out of it?! Omg. This is horrifying. The only thing that's saving this right now is that MG exaggerates big time.

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Considering Oliver didn't throw a jealous hissy fit (as he's won't to do with Felicity concerning other men) I really don't think it'll happen.

Or maybe I'm terribly hopeful it won't happen.

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Anyways, back to the topic at hand. I'm really really hoping that the writers don't make a complete 180 and turn whatever's going on between O/F into yet another cliche by dragging R in the middle of this. I hope Oliver is respectful of Felicity's decision to have a something with Ray. I hope Ray doesn't get jealous of O/Fs renewed closeness. I hope this whole thing between the three of them has more to do with their vigilante activities than the whole love triangle crap. Last episode gave me hope that the writers can actually write themselves out of this contrived mess without making it into yet another cliche and I feel like that's dangerous lmao

 

Oliver was pretty respectful of Felicity's thing with Ray in 316 so I can only think he'll be angry that Ray's suit is possibly putting Felicity in danger? I don't know. I hope we don't go one step forward and three back with these two. 

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To be fair, the suit is an unknown entity. It wouldn't just endanger Felicity but civilians too. Ray, as Laurel, has (had?) no vigilante experience therefore bad things could happen from his lack of experince...and there's the possibility that things could blow up accidentally. Even Barry has things happen and he's SUPER fast...and really should be able to stop them but anyway.

Edited by Limbo
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Do we know why Ray ends up in hospital in 3.18? Could it be after his confrontation with the Arrow goes badly?

 

Actually, I want Oliver to defeat Ray and talk some sense into him (and force him to seek enhancements to his super-Ray-suit in Central City), and then, maybe, Ra's showing up in his Arrow cosplay and injure Ray. To make Felicity believe Oliver hurt him. Because Ra's a 13-year old girl who likes disturbed love triangles (no offence to 13-year old girls out there).

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Do we know why Ray ends up in hospital in 3.18? Could it be after his confrontation with the Arrow goes badly?

 

No, it's during an attack on the mayor's office. 

 

 

 

“Public Enemy” — (8:00-9:00 p.m. ET) (Content Rating TBD) (HDTV)

DONNA SMOAK RETURNS — During an attack on the mayor's office, Ray (Brandon Routh) is critically injured. Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards) is pleasantly surprised when her mother, Donna Smoak (guest star Charlotte Ross), shows up at the hospital to offer her support. With the SCPD out in full force looking for the assailant, Oliver (Stephen Amell) and his team work hard to stay one step ahead of the police to find the man responsible. However, things come to a head when Ra's al Ghul (guest star Matt Nable) kidnaps Captain Lance (Paul Blackthorne). Dwight Little directed the episode written by Marc Guggenheim & Wendy Mericle (#318). Original airdate 4/1/2015.

 

I forgot about this synopsis, haha. So I guess Felicity isn't so devastated and/or worried that she calls Donna and asks her to come.

I'm just confused about the timeline of it all... 

 

Do Felicity/Ray visit CC before Ray goes to the hospital or after Ray goes to the hospital? I'd much rather it be before tbqh

 

It was supposed to be before, but the network-mandated break pushed it until after. 

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It was supposed to be before, but the network-mandated break pushed it until after. 

 

That makes very little sense to me. If Ray is critically injured, how can he be up and running in his suit n CC afterwards? Charlotte Ross tweeted something along the lines of "Who do I tell her to choose"... I mean in my mind obviously it won't be Ray because he's essentially a tertiary character nobody cares about... so if Felicity is supposed to be at a crossroads regarding her life and who she wants to be with and whatnot, it'd be strange to see her and Ray take a vacay to CC afterwards.

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Didn't Guggenheim admit on Tumblr that the timeline is gonna look a bit wonky? Or am I imagining that?

I'm sort of curious if whatever improvements to the robot suit Cisco will make in 118 will prematurely show up in 318.

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No, it's during an attack on the mayor's office. 

 

 

I forgot about this synopsis, haha. So I guess Felicity isn't so devastated and/or worried that she calls Donna and asks her to come.

 

 

 

Thanks! I totally missed this synopsis!

(Still, the major's office could be attacked by Ra's men... bonus points if one of them is dressed as the Arrow - what a great opportunity for Ra's to flip the city's loyalty away from the Arrow)

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(edited)

Didn't Guggenheim admit on Tumblr that the timeline is gonna look a bit wonky? Or am I imagining that?

I'm sort of curious if whatever improvements to the robot suit Cisco will make in 118 will prematurely show up in 318.

I don't know, I've never seen that comment but I only know what he says if it's posted here.

I know AJK said they had to do some re-writes on 118 because of the surprise schedule break.

As far as I can tell there are 3 crossovers in a row, so if the timeline is wonky it's going to be wonky until 320.

Edited by Morrigan2575
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Throwing in my two cents: I don't think Laurel/Nyssa is going to be a real thing. I just think MG meant that they'll have some good friendship moments that shippers can run with if they want to.

Regarding Ray's injuries and the crossover....yeah, it seems like MG has said the timeline will be a little messed up because of the scheduling change. But I thought that AK said something about them having to do some tweaking of the episode scripts because of it. Sooooo.....I'm not sure what to think.

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Throwing in my two cents: I don't think Laurel/Nyssa is going to be a real thing. I just think MG meant that they'll have some good friendship moments that shippers can run with if they want to.

Regarding Ray's injuries and the crossover....yeah, it seems like MG has said the timeline will be a little messed up because of the scheduling change. But I thought that AK said something about them having to do some tweaking of the episode scripts because of it. Sooooo.....I'm not sure what to think.

 

For the first paragraph, please let that be true!

 

Second paragraph, I hope they drop the "Ray is like Barry in Oliver's body crap"... Then again, Iris/Eddie and Ray/Felicity DO go on that double date so.............. IDK I'm just as confused as you

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Throwing in my two cents: I don't think Laurel/Nyssa is going to be a real thing. I just think MG meant that they'll have some good friendship moments that shippers can run with if they want to.

Regarding Ray's injuries and the crossover....yeah, it seems like MG has said the timeline will be a little messed up because of the scheduling change. But I thought that AK said something about them having to do some tweaking of the episode scripts because of it. Sooooo.....I'm not sure what to think.

I think they probably tweaked what they could, but there are probably things that happen in 3x18 that will make it weird for Felicity to leave town after, so there's only so much they can do?

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Do we know why Ray ends up in hospital in 3.18? Could it be after his confrontation with the Arrow goes badly?

 

Actually, I want Oliver to defeat Ray and talk some sense into him (and force him to seek enhancements to his super-Ray-suit in Central City), and then, maybe, Ra's showing up in his Arrow cosplay and injure Ray. To make Felicity believe Oliver hurt him. Because Ra's a 13-year old girl who likes disturbed love triangles (no offence to 13-year old girls out there).

I would think Felicity wouldn't believe Oliver would do that

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Thanks, guys. I imagine editing out any mention the characters make to events from their recent past would solve most of the weirdness. And since AK said they did make adjustments to the 118 script, that's gotta relate to Palmer being injured a week prior. Here's hoping it's not TOO wonky.

You know, this has got to have the EPs thinking about future crossovers. It makes me wonder if one of the changes coming is they'll scale back on the serialized nature of Arrow, and go more villain of the week, procedural style. That would certainly make crossovers work easier.

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Thanks, guys. I imagine editing out any mention the characters make to events from their recent past would solve most of the weirdness. And since AK said they did make adjustments to the 118 script, that's gotta relate to Palmer being injured a week prior. Here's hoping it's not TOO wonky.

You know, this has got to have the EPs thinking about future crossovers. It makes me wonder if one of the changes coming is they'll scale back on the serialized nature of Arrow, and go more villain of the week, procedural style. That would certainly make crossovers work easier.

 

 

Man that would suck if they do that with Arrow.  Serialization is critical to Oliver's SL. It IS the storyline.  That will really piss me off if they do that.

 

Edited by catrox14
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I wouldn't mind half mytharc, half monster of the week, a la X-Files. But there are two lumps of Arrow episodes mid S2 and mid S3 that I'll never ever watch again, and that's because they went full serialized with Laurel [and Malcolm this season], and spectacularly failed imo. I'd be willing to try something new so the mid-season slump would stop.

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I wouldn't mind half mytharc, half monster of the week, a la X-Files. But there are two lumps of Arrow episodes mid S2 and mid S3 that I'll never ever watch again, and that's because they went full serialized with Laurel [and Malcolm this season], and spectacularly failed imo. I'd be willing to try something new so the mid-season slump would stop.

 

I don't blame the serialization but the fact that they pulled focus from Oliver.  I'm in this thing for Oliver.

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I totally don't think these writers have 23 Oliver-focused episodes per season in them, but agree to disagree.

 

If they weren't using the comics to tell part of the story...that would certainly help them keep the story on screen. That bugs me more than anything

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