Spoiler Discussion Thread

[AyChihuahua]

9 minutes ago, kismet said:

Thanks @AyChihuahua! Sometimes I forget s1 Thea. I only remember the annoying teenager. When they didn't kill her in the finale,  I learned to try to like her. luckily she has gotten better. 

Oh, I hate her now. Hated her 1A, liked her when Roy showed up to soften her, liked her super-competent club manager in 2A, hated her whining stupidity in 2B (waaaaaaah, my daddy wasn't my daddy so I will punish ERRYBODY!!!!). Then we had Oliver obsessed with her for most of S3, part of S4, now she gets to show up at a Mayor Oliver event that apparently Felicity isn't important enough to attend. Willa's a fine actress, but I despise/am bored of Thea now.

7 minutes ago, way2interested said:

But then wouldn't the DA's auditions be with EBR? TVLine kind of shot down the DA being Felicity's love interest idea since none of his audition sides even involved Felicity. Sure they might have changed their minds, but they seemed to be more doubling down on chemistry tests since Oliver/Laurel, unless they really don't care at this point. From that the it would seem to be either cop or Mr. Offscreen.

S4 Poppy. That is Exhibit A v. chem tests in later seasons. 

I'm expecting cop, but I would PREFER DA. Cop is puppy cute, DA is quasi-dangerous hot. I do not believe her boyfriend will be 100% offscreen. I think that is really overly optimistic.

Edited July 17, 2016 by AyChihuahua

[way2interested]

Just now, AyChihuahua said:

S4 Poppy. That is Exhibit A v. chem tests in later seasons. 

I'm expecting cop, but I would PREFER DA. Cop is puppy cute, cop is quasi-dangerous hot. I do not believe her boyfriend will be 100% offscreen. I think that is really overly optimistic.

But Poppy was kind of the opposite of what would be happening here in the DA's case. She probably didn't have a chem test and was originally supposed to be a love interest but then scrapped as time went on. This would be not auditioning to be a love interest at all, not having any chemistry tests at all, and then even before they finish filming 501 deciding to make him Felicity's boyfriend this whole time. I mean, I get associating Felicity having a boyfriend with some of the new characters, but it would be just strange to me to have neither of these two characters being associated with Felicity at all in their descriptions (with them actually being more related to Oliver), like a bunch of characters who are brought on as love interests on shows usually are, and then suddenly being introduced as to have been dating Felicity for the last few months, unless one of them and Felicity just begin dating starting with 501 which would then still have my problem with neither of them being announced as Felicity's love interest or even related to anything Felicity. 

As for her boyfriend being offscreen, I don't think if she is to have a boyfriend during 5a and beyond that he would be offscreen, but that if we're talking her having a boyfriend during the hiatus to present to explain why Olicity didn't get back together, that I can see an offscreen boyfriend with him having few appearances before break-up come 501. It may be optimistic, but it would just make more sense to me given what I'm seeing (answering the question of why didn't Olicity get back together over summer, no love interest descriptions from any of the new male characters, SA deciding to mention that Felicity has a boyfriend casually to a fan, being able to give Olicity romantic tension scenes more easily). It could be wrong, but honestly trying to figure one of the new guys into the love interest roles makes less sense to me other than the argument of saying that the writers would do it. I'm not saying this just as not wanting it to happen. I'm just saying this as not understanding the context of having cop/DA being her boyfriend besides blocking Olicity (which breaking them up already did) and pushing Oliver to date the reporter (which he already has reason to at this point without Felicity dating anyone, plus my similar problem with the reporter also not being described as a love interest).

But, if these characters are their love interests, maybe they are trying to keep these characters as love interests a secret (not counting SA's mention) to not drive people away? But eh? Something just doesn't feel right to me.   

[AyChihuahua]

19 minutes ago, way2interested said:

But Poppy was kind of the opposite of what would be happening here in the DA's case. She probably didn't have a chem test and was originally supposed to be a love interest but then scrapped as time went on. This would be not auditioning to be a love interest at all, not having any chemistry tests at all, and then even before they finish filming 501 deciding to make him Felicity's boyfriend this whole time. 

...

But, if these characters are their love interests, maybe they are trying to keep these characters as love interests a secret (not counting SA's mention) to not drive people away? But eh? Something just doesn't feel right to me.   

Wait, what? I mean, she WAS intended to be a love interest. Oliver literally agreed he loved/was in love with her. Therefore, if they had any firing neurons in their sad little heads, they would have had a chem test. They either didn't, or they were stupid about it. So, that would mean once again they cast a love interest w/ SA either not knowing or not caring about chemistry. In S4. So if they did that AGAIN in S5, how would that be surprising? Just because they don't ANNOUNCE either of the dudes as a love interest doesn't mean they won't be a love interest. Why would they spoil something like that?

Of course it's stupid. Of course it will drive [some] people away. Of course it doesn't feel right to you, bc you have fully-functioning neurons. In what way is that evidence that these writers, who thought S3 was cool beans, who thought the Baby Mama was the Virgin Mary, who had no clue they were writing Spawn as severely intellectually-disabled, who thought the BMD was brills, who thought Ray was superhot and not at all creepy, who thought nukes were a mild annoyance, won't do it?

Re Felicity having a bf, you either buy that as a legit spoiler, or you don't. I do. Dettiot has been a reliable source in the past...she misunderstood something in the past, but she reported it accurately. She reported that SA stated "Felicity has a boyfriend." She could be lying. He could be trolling. But if he told the truth and she reported it accurately, it means that Felicity has a boyfriend. The fact that it makes very little sense for the story just doesn't matter. The fact that Oliver dating the reporter makes very little sense for his character doesn't matter. It's a fictional story...the writers could write Oliver turning into a dragon in the premiere if they wanted to. They are the gods of Arrow. I guess it comes down to having trust in them or not, and, based on four years of closely following this show, I have zero trust in them. A position which has turned out incorrectly for me exactly twice, out of about twenty predictions. These writers are DUMB.

Edited July 17, 2016 by AyChihuahua

[way2interested]

21 minutes ago, AyChihuahua said:

Wait, what? I mean, she WAS intended to be a love interest. Oliver literally agreed he loved/was in love with her. Therefore, if they had any firing neurons in their sad little heads, they would have had a chem test. They either didn't, or they were stupid about it. So, that would mean once again they cast a love interest w/ SA either not knowing or not caring about chemistry. In S4. So if they did that AGAIN in S5, how would that be surprising? 

Of course it's stupid. Of course it will drive [some] people away. Of course it doesn't feel right to you, bc you have fully-functioning neurons. In what way is that evidence that these writers, who thought S3 was cool beans, who thought the Baby Mama was the Virgin Mary, who had no clue they were writing Spawn as severely intellectually-disabled, who thought the BMD was brills, who thought Ray was superhot, who thought nukes were a mild annoyance, won't do it?

The only thing I remember regarding Poppy as a love interest was dreamShado calling Poppy his love and Oliver being completely confused about it and just agreeing that he was feeling guilty about keeping a secret from her, which I didn't really see as him agreeing to it. Even the actress referenced that she didn't consider her role the love interest role she signed up for. From that, I think that the subplot was scrapped completely after going into the season with her being a love interest as the initial plan. What I'm saying would be surprising here is that making the DA Felicity's love interest would be doing the same thing but in the opposite order which would make a lot less sense. Poppy(or, Laurel, in fact): Intention for love interest, scrapped as the story went along because of lack of interest all around. DA: no intention for love interest, no chemistry tests, suddenly made love interest in 501 before they even really shoot anything. That's what I would find surprising if he were Felicity's boyfriend, especially when the last two of her love interests did have chemistry tests with her.

My point still stands as I can't think of any reasoning besides saying that it's a stupid idea that they would do. Casting-wise it doesn't make sense because none of these characters were described as being love interest, audition-wise it doesn't make sense (at least in the DA's case) because the intention doesn't appear to be love interest, promotion-wise it doesn't make sense because if they wanted to keep it a secret to not drive people away, SA wouldn't have mentioned it, but if they didn't care either way, wouldn't they have mentioned it with the character descriptions? Then, story-wise it wouldn't make sense because of obvious reasons, but if it does happens it will probably because they think it's a good idea for some reason.

It's not that I don't believe that she has a boyfriend. I just don't understand how it's being executed if it's one of the new guys, and having her bf be a guy that she dated over hiatus makes more sense to me and could still fit in SA saying "Felicity has a boyfriend" depending on what context SA was going with when telling her, if he was focusing on how Oliver and Felicity's relationship was going into 501.

Edited July 17, 2016 by way2interested

[tangerine95]

I think if Felicity does have a boyfriend or a date or whatever it won't be any of the characters they announced. Imo it will be a minor role that would be done by the end of 5.01 and just used as way to show Felicity tried to move on or explain why they didn't get back together during the hiatus or justify Oliver maybe also dating. I just really don't see it being any of the guys that were cast and seem to work closely with Oliver like the DA guy. I think its weird if any of the reccuring characters were suddenly introduced as Felicity's boyfriend, i feel like they would show the whole relationship onscreen and if SA wasn't trolling it sounds to me like the boyfriend thing is something that started over the 5 months offscreen. 

Also I'm not suprised if Poppy didn't screen test with SA tbh. I don't think they ever put much thought or effort in the relationship or the fbs in general this season, it all felt like stalling before they get to bratva imo. Also I don't think they would care if Oliver and Felicity had chemistry with any potential love interests they throw at them at this point because it would all clearly be just for stalling.Ray was a bigger deal because of the spinoff and Barry too and Sara was basically their chance to do BC right so in those cases i get why they did it. 

Edited July 17, 2016 by tangerine95

[kismet]

Can we please have dragons on Arrow? Im joking,  but seriously I love dragons!

Anyway, I do not believe that SA was trolling. I believe FSs boyfriend is a valid rumor/spoiler. For all we know her boyfriend could be OQ, that would be extreme trolling,  but its possible. 

I hope her boyfriend is offscreen. But I do believe there is a strong probability that it will be onscreen and most likely with the cop or the DA.

The only reason I'm suspicious that one of these newbies is warming FSs bed is that it failed so miserably with Ray. They did everything possible to push Raylicity and it cost them the spin-off they wanted. Im not saying that these newbies are destined, but as dumb as these writers can be I don't think they want to make the mistakes of s3.

Then again budgets are tight so if they want to actually show FS in a new relationship its going to be with one of the newbies. If they just want a stalling relationship for plot purposes, I can see them using an offscreen boyfriend. So it really comes down to what the writers want and as of now they have been very tight lipped.

Edited July 17, 2016 by kismet

[Sunshine]

Well, why can't Felicity date Wild Dog?  LOL!  Sorry, I just hate the idea of her dating a cop if she is still heavily involved in vigilantism - a relationship based on lies. I actually think they would avoid hooking her up with another superhero. Sigh!

Does the cop have a comics alter ego?  If not and if he is the boyfriend, perhaps they are trying to parallel the Oliver/McKenna Hall relationship of S1 but played with more humor? Someone on here mentioned TR had good comedic skills when he was cast.  They could get another shot at writing the comedy within the drama they wanted to do with Felicity/Ray.  He's recurring so it might only be a handful of episodes.  It also ties him to the story. Lance probably introduced them. ;) Detectives don't usually interact directly with the Mayor.  That is the DA and/or Commissioner's job.  (Cue Curtis telling her at some point that she can't force it.  One day she'll meet the right guy. Cut to Oliver.)     

As far as chemistry tests go, MG once said that Emily had chemistry with everyone.  They might not have felt the need to test because of that,especially if it's a very minor part of the character's role. Personally, I'm hoping for some random dude! 

As far as not announcing it if it is one of the recurring characters...they are still dealing with BC backlash.  Why intentionally tick off another portion of your viewers?   When SA said that to the fan I am sure he didn't think she was going to broadcast on twitter. No point in fans hating on the character/actor before they ever show up on screen. Mainly I think TPTB are trying to move the discussion of the show away from Oliver & Felicity's relationship and back to superhero show - action/comics character's etc.  Look at the TV Guide's answer to a direct Olicity question being changed to "covering a different angle."       

What I really want to know is what have Thea and Quentin been up to? Diggle seems like a given (Army).  Bigger questions are how does he come back and what is his state of mind.  Felicity also seems a given.  Working (probably Palmer Tech) and playing vigilante with Oliver (based on 4.23). Quentin wasn't reinstated so what has he been doing?  No clue about Thea either.

[kismet]

I think wildcat is too close to OQ which is why i hope against it. Plus i want wildcat for TQ. 

Cop is nice compromise and Lance introducing them works. Plus it does not feel like a conflict of interest like the DA would. I always thought they got rid of the McKenna dynamic too quickly.  I can see them trying to reproduce those s1 vibes.

Chemistry tests are important for main cast, but if this relationship is just a stall, I can see why they might have not have prioritised it considering how much everyone loves EBR. I did see some chemistry in Raylicity, the problem is it never overcame how horrible they wrote Ray. Well that and BR is wicked creepy. 

[AyChihuahua]

1 hour ago, tangerine95 said:

I think its weird if any of the reccuring characters were suddenly introduced as Felicity's boyfriend

I agree. And again, why does that mean they won't do it? It was weird for Oliver to lie to Felicity about his spawn for no reason. It was weird for him to visit the spawn and lie to her about it. It was weird for him to be fine with Malcolm, who had every reason to hate Oliver, knowing about the spawn. It was weird for Thea, who spent 3.5 years canonically hating lies, to be supercool with his lies. It was weird for them not to get back together during sweeps (which nearly EVERYONE on this board, including me, expected). They do weird/stupid things. They just do. I truly do not understand the reluctance to believe they'll do more weird/stupid things.

Edited July 17, 2016 by AyChihuahua

[AyChihuahua]

1 hour ago, way2interested said:

My point still stands as I can't think of any reasoning besides saying that it's a stupid idea that they would do. 

Yes.

[tangerine95]

Yeah I agree they do stupid things so its possible but there was also a lot of dumb stuff I expected them to do and was worried they would and they didn't so it can really go either way at this point lol. 

Edited July 17, 2016 by tangerine95

[AyChihuahua]

38 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

Well, why can't Felicity date Wild Dog?  LOL!  

I like the actor, and that'd be different from her past LIs, so I'd be quasi-okay with that. I think he's Roy 2.0, though, and he's for Thea. Probably as part of a love triangle.

[AyChihuahua]

1 hour ago, kismet said:

as dumb as these writers can be I don't think they want to make the mistakes of s3.

Totally disagree. They brought back, intentionally and knowingly, a number of the very worst elements of S3 in S4. The despised Oliver/Nyssa marriage? Plot point and repeated joke. Thea/MM daddy issues bullshit? Plot point several times. Huge fail of LOA in general? Plot point several times. Olicity breakup? BMD.

[way2interested]

Just now, AyChihuahua said:

I agree. And again, why does that mean they won't do it? It was weird for Oliver to lie to her about his spawn for no reason. It was weird for him to visit the spawn and lie to her about it. It was weird for him to be fine with Malcolm, who had every reason to hate Oliver, knowing about the spawn. It was weird for Thea, who spent 3.5 years canonically hating lies, to be supercool with his lies. It was weird for them not to get back together during sweeps (which nearly EVERYONE on this board, including me, expected). They do weird/stupid things. They just do. I truly do not understand the reluctance to believe they'll do more weird/stupid things.

I do not have a reluctance to believing that Felicity will have a boyfriend. I do not have a reluctance to believing that if her boyfriend is one of the recurring characters that they would just have it be so "just because." I do not have a reluctance that they would do something bad after what they've done before. 

What I am confused is at the idea that, if one of these characters is her boyfriend, for what you believe would last until the typical break-up period (515-520), why would they not mention it in any of the descriptions? Why did TVLine vehemently oppose the idea that the DA is Felicity's love interest? Why would SA reveal a subplot that would last about 3/4s of the season when he's been mum about talking about Olicity this entire time? My aversion to this has nothing to do with how this would be executed in the story and mostly to do with the idea that it would not be following common production practices.

[kismet]

22 minutes ago, AyChihuahua said:

Totally disagree. The t brought back, intensionally and knowi ngly, a number of the very worst elements of S3 in S4. The despised Oliver/Nyssa marriage? Plot point and repeated joke. Thea/MM daddy issues bullshit? Plot point several times. Huge fail of LOA in general? Plot point several times. Olicity breakup? BMD.

Agree to disagree. Because I think most of your points are valid. The biggest difference betweeen your points and Raylicity Is that It cost them their spinoff. Other than that I believe they fully let their dumb lead the way. So I have very little hope In the writers ability but IF they put FS boyfriend offscreen or cast a rando then It will probably be because of Ray's failure.

[AyChihuahua]

28 minutes ago, kismet said:

Agree to disagree. Because I think most of your points are valid. The biggest difference betweeen your points and Raylicity Is that It cost them their spinoff. Other than that I believe they fully let their dumb lead the way. So I have very little hope In the writers ability but IF they put FS boyfriend offscreen or cast a rando then It will probably be because of Ray's failure.

They still got a spinoff, just a different spinoff. And BR/Ray is in it. Personally I think the fail for the spinoff was him, not Raylicity, bc really, what does Raylicity, vs. Ray, have to do with any version of the spinoff? If Raylicity had been a huge success, I very much doubt that EBR would have ended up there instead of Arrow. It was always about Ray/BR.

[AyChihuahua]

57 minutes ago, way2interested said:

I do not have a reluctance to believing that Felicity will have a boyfriend. I do not have a reluctance to believing that if her boyfriend is one of the recurring characters that they would just have it be so "just because." I do not have a reluctance that they would do something bad after what they've done before. 

What I am confused is at the idea that, if one of these characters is her boyfriend, for what you believe would last until the typical break-up period (515-520), why would they not mention it in any of the descriptions? Why did TVLine vehemently oppose the idea that the DA is Felicity's love interest? Why would SA reveal a subplot that would last about 3/4s of the season when he's been mum about talking about Olicity this entire time? My aversion to this has nothing to do with how this would be executed in the story and mostly to do with the idea that it would not be following common production practices.

Who said it would last that long? First of all, I said I think her boyfriend is the cop, not the DA. I said I would PREFER the DA, bc I like his casting. I have no reason to believe she and whoever the dude is will last anywhere near that long. I'm guessing they'll break up around the time Oliver and the reporter start up, probably within the first six or so episodes. And again, they wouldn't mention it in the public casting descriptions bc it is a spoiler. SA would reveal the subplot, that would not necessarily last anywhere near 3/4s of the season, bc he has done that kind of thing before ("Remember 3.20"). 

[statsgirl]

I assumed that ER was chem tested with SA and the testing was okay. She was certainly smoking hot on Supernatural.  The problem with Poppy was in the writing, IMO, compounded by SA sleep walking through the FBs.  Angelina Jolie would have had a tough time pulling that off.

Raylicity had chemistry in 3x01 and as soon as Ray broke up with Felicity.  The mess in the middle wouldn't have come out in chem testing (and MG swore up and down how wonderful the Raylicity chemistry was).

TVLine did seem pretty annoyed that people were calling the new DA a love interest for Felicity but I don't trust the writers not to decide to turn him into one over the summer because they decided they wanted a new twist.

Felicity fell for Oliver, billionaire vigilante, Barry, CSI and later vigilante, and Ray, billionaire wannabe vigilante.  At this point I think any vigilante who is either in law enforcement or business is too close to repeating the cycle in a boring way, which for me leaves all three (DA, cop and ex Marine) out.  But then, I don't see the need for Felicity to date anyone right now.  She's not one of those people who need a man around or they get desperate (I know some of those people in real life too.)  She had a great relationship with Oliver, it ended but she looked like she's still in love with him and between her night job and trying to figure out her day job (get PT back? start her own company?),  she doesn't need a second or third tier boyfriend to fulfill her life.

Why is it that when they want the OTP to stay apart, TV writers always pick the cheap sleazy way of having them date other people?  It always gives me two seasons of a show I don't want to watch.

[AyChihuahua]

2 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

Felicity fell for Oliver, billionaire vigilante, Barry, CSI and later vigilante, and Ray, billionaire wannabe vigilante.  At this point I think any vigilante who is either in law enforcement or business is too close to repeating the cycle in a boring way, which for me leaves all three (DA, cop and ex Marine) out.  But then, I don't see the need for Felicity to date anyone right now.  She's not one of those people who need a man around or they get desperate (I know some of those people in real life too.)  She had a great relationship with Oliver, it ended but she looked like she's still in love with him and between her night job and trying to figure out her day job (get PT back? start her own company?),  she doesn't need a second or third tier boyfriend to fulfill her life.

I agree. I do not WANT any of this. I think that while I can find character justification for either or both of them dating other people, it is an absolutely terrible story choice. Terrible. For me it is the final straw in the destruction of the one true love nature of Olicity. I hate it. I simply do not think any of the plethora of entirely valid reasons not to do it in any way means that these EPs won't do it.

[way2interested]

38 minutes ago, AyChihuahua said:

Who said it would last that long? First of all, I said I think her boyfriend is the cop, not the DA. I said I would PREFER the DA, bc I like his casting. I have no reason to believe she and whoever the dude is will last anywhere near that long. I'm guessing they'll break up around the time Oliver and the reporter start up, probably within the first six or so episodes. And again, they wouldn't mention it in the public casting descriptions bc it is a spoiler. SA would reveal the subplot, that would not necessarily last anywhere near 3/4s of the season, bc he has done that kind of thing before ("Remember 3.20"). 

But intentional love interests are spoiled in casting descriptions all the time, and remember 320 was for a moment/episode, not a subplot/multi-episode relationship. If the cop is the bf for only a few episodes (plus hiatus), it would make even more sense to me to mention it in the cast descriptions, or at least relate him to Felicity so scenes between them would be expected, since he would already be introduced on the show as such and the idea that it wouldn't matter for much anyway. 

I honestly just think that these guys are only related to Oliver and that whoever Felicity's bf is is none of these guys and might just be a rando who fills out basically the role that you've laid out. If it actually does end up being the cop, I wouldn't understand what else he would be doing in the story after he and Felicity break-up and guess that he would probably leave and become a non-entity after they do. If that's relatively what you mean, then I can agree with that possibly happening, but then I would still wonder why they didn't mention it in his casting description in the first place if that becomes his main purpose.

[kismet]

What purpose did any of the ex-LI have? A lot of them still stuck around for awhile. Some even got years.

I just think they have been intentionally mum on FSs arc (including LIs) which means either they don't have much for her ala LL (s4) or whatever they have planned is top secret.  And it is most likely top secret because it will anger a good portion of the audience. 

[tv echo]

Bit of trivia - from a 2015 Vulture interview with EBR:

Quote

What TV shows were you obsessed with five years ago? 
Veronica Mars was a big one for me. Popular, Grey’s Anatomy. Pushing Daisies. I loved that show! I don’t know how old that is now. What was wrong with that show? Nothing was wrong with that show! 

And now Carly Pope is going to be on Arrow.  Hard to believe, but five years ago, there was no Arrow and we had never heard of EBR.

[kismet]

Isn't popular older than 5 yrs? I thought it was more an early 2000s show. Maybe they aired it later in Canada. 

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, kismet said:

Isn't popular older than 5 yrs? I thought it was more an early 2000s show. Maybe they aired it later in Canada. 

Or maybe she picked up the DVDs and started watching it then. 

[Morrigan2575]

Yeah, it's been awhile, 2000-2001 timeframe 

[tv echo]

She probably just binge-watched the shows. Popular ended in 2001. Veronica Mars ended in 2007. Pushing Daisies ended in 2009.

Edited July 17, 2016 by tv echo

[Morrigan2575]

You're probably right, those are all old WB/UPN shows. Probably part of the CW catalogue that got loaded in the Netflix deal.

[statsgirl]

12 hours ago, way2interested said:

I honestly just think that these guys are only related to Oliver and that whoever Felicity's bf is is none of these guys and might just be a rando who fills out basically the role that you've laid out. If it actually does end up being the cop, I wouldn't understand what else he would be doing in the story after he and Felicity break-up and guess that he would probably leave and become a non-entity after they do. If that's relatively what you mean, then I can agree with that possibly happening, but then I would still wonder why they didn't mention it in his casting description in the first place if that becomes his main purpose.

If Quentin is not returning to the force, which is what it sounds like, they're going to need someone to be the police liaison for the Team.  It could have been DA Laurel but she's gone now. Maybe it's the new DA who is going to be on Team Arrow's side, and the cop will be their antagonist.  (If Quentin is not a cop and not Commissioner, what will he do? Open a P.I. agency?)

I wonder if the show will explore with him what it's like to be on both sides of the law as a DA and a vigilante, the story they could have done with Laurel.

12 hours ago, kismet said:

I just think they have been intentionally mum on FSs arc (including LIs) which means either they don't have much for her ala LL (s4) or whatever they have planned is top secret.  And it is most likely top secret because it will anger a good portion of the audience. 

Hope for the best; prepare for the worst.

[lemotomato]

12 hours ago, kismet said:

I just think they have been intentionally mum on FSs arc (including LIs) which means either they don't have much for her ala LL (s4) or whatever they have planned is top secret.  And it is most likely top secret because it will anger a good portion of the audience. 

There hasn't been any season 5 news about anyone aside from Oliver, Curtis, and the newbies. We know nothing about Diggle, Thea, and Lance either, so it's not like TPTB are just keeping mum about Felicity.

[Chaser]

With the exception of Oliver, we haven't officially heard anything on anyone.

What Lemotomato said. 

Edited July 17, 2016 by Chaser

[Morrigan2575]

The BULK of spoilers comes out at SDCC. This is the BIG Media event where we get a shit ton of interviews with actors and producers. This is where we find the theme for the season, the character arcs (first half) and relationships.

We usually get NOTHING substantial before that, only casting notices maybe a few minor tidbits from Cons and if they're filming BTS set pics, which don't really tell us anything 

[lemotomato]

If I were going to start worrying about storylines or lack thereof for Felicity, I'd wait to see if EBR will be at SDCC for press day and the panel, or if she misses them because she's "delayed by filming" like what happened at SDCC pre-season 3. In retrospect, I'm pretty sure that was a deliberate move to keep EBR, KC, and CL from having to talk about their half-hearted (Felicity), secret (Laurel), and non-existent (Sara) season 3 storylines.

Edited July 17, 2016 by lemotomato

[Chaser]

They missed the panel but they didn't miss any of the press. 

Still wonder about them missing the panel since they clearly weren't filming. 

[lemotomato]

1 minute ago, Chaser said:

They missed the panel but they didn't miss any of the press. 

Still wonder about them missing the panel since they clearly weren't filming. 

They made it for some interviews (the infamous IGN one with SA and KC comes to mind), but I believe they missed the interviews in the press room where they go to different tables and reporters ask them questions directly. 

[TrueMyth]

40 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

If Quentin is not returning to the force, which is what it sounds like, they're going to need someone to be the police liaison for the Team.  It could have been DA Laurel but she's gone now. Maybe it's the new DA who is going to be on Team Arrow's side, and the cop will be their antagonist.  (If Quentin is not a cop and not Commissioner, what will he do? Open a P.I. agency?)

I still vote Deputy Mayor for Lance, though I admit that is slightly less likely with him not at the big press conference.  Still, it would help cover when Oliver has to run out and change into leather.

[Morrigan2575]

10 minutes ago, Chaser said:

They missed the panel but they didn't miss any of the press. 

Still wonder about them missing the panel since they clearly weren't filming. 

They were filming.  KC/CL filmed her death scene and EBR was (I believe) filming with BR. 

[Chaser]

Sometimes I go back and reread threads and I could have sworn KC was in SD the day of the panel. 

Edited July 17, 2016 by Chaser

[Morrigan2575]

7 minutes ago, Chaser said:

Sometimes I go back and reread threads and I could have sworn KC was in SD the day of the panel. 

 KC posted selfies from set on Friday night. There are selfies of KC/CL/EBR on the plane down to SD super early Saturday morning and selfies of them in the car on the way to SDCC.

They were filming but, I personally think TPTB arranged for them to film on Friday to keep KC away from SDCC while SA announced that she had been replaced as the main LI. I think keeping EBR away was done to protect her from the fallout and, keeping CL away from the press is obvious in retrospect. 

Edited July 17, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[Starfish35]

12 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

They were filming.  KC/CL filmed her death scene and EBR was (I believe) filming with BR. 

Yeah, I definitely remember that KC and CL were filming Sara's death scene.  I didn't know about EBR though.

[Morrigan2575]

1 minute ago, Starfish35 said:

Yeah, I definitely remember that KC and CL were filming Sara's death scene.  I didn't know about EBR though.

IIRC she was supposedly filming the Felicity/ Ray Elevator scene in 302

[Starfish35]

1 minute ago, Morrigan2575 said:

IIRC she was supposedly filming the Felicity/ Ray Elevator scene in 302

Ah ok. 

[quarks]

Regarding the incoming characters/Felicity's potential love interests, I was curious, so I checked.

It's not clear if they chem tested Poppy or not. What is clear is that virtually everyone who started out as a love interest for someone on Arrow was announced as a potential love interest for someone in either the casting call or the press release, with the specific words "love interest" or "potential love interest," generally linked with a specific character on the show. The list includes Laurel, Tommy, Helena, McKenna, Roy, Dinah, Shado, Isabel (we got the "will sparks fly"), Barry, Sebastian Blood, Bronze Tiger (with China White; it's in a cut scene available on the DVD), Ray, that horrible Dj, Ted Grant, Tatsu, Poppy, and Alex Davis. A few characters were announced as incoming spouses/ex-spouses (Dinah, Tatsu). This has also been true for all of the love interests on Flash and almost all of the love interests on Supergirl.

Legends of Tomorrow is a special case, since all but one of the regulars and some of the guest stars originally appeared on other shows. Even there, however, all three of the guest stars in canonical love interest roles - Sara's nurse, the girl that Jax flirted with in one episode, and Rip Hunter's wife - were announced as love interests for those specific characters.  

Otherwise, characters who were not announced in press releases as incoming love interests or potential love interests for specific characters fell into the following categories:

1. Became or got a love interest in their first season appearance, but only after at least five episodes (Thea, Jax, Felicity, Captain Singh, Stein, Sara, Damien, technically Quentin with Dinah, technically Thea since the original plans for a Tommy/Thea romance were dropped, possibly Martian Manhunter if Alex and Martian Manhunter are meant to be read as romantic).

2. Did not get or become a love interest until at least their second season (Cisco, Snart, Lisa Snart, Donna, Deadshot, Lucas Hilton (kinda), Deadshot, China White (the scene got cut), Quentin, technically Slade, technically Caitlin, technically Henry and Tina - though since they were love interests decades back, they might not count)

3. As of now, still have never had a current love interest (Heatwave, Malcolm, the various versions of Harrison Wells, Wally West, General Lane, multiple minor characters like Moira's lawyer or the Bee villain, and dead characters such as Ra's Al Ghul and Amanda Waller;  sorta Joe West.)

4. Are Cat Grant's multiple implied offscreen relationships with various celebrities.

The exceptions to this are:

1. Maxwell Lord, played more as an antagonist than as a love interest for Alex and Cat.

2. Carly, apparently elevated to a love interest role during the filming of episode 3, when the producers realized that they had to get rid of the voiceovers - which meant expanding Diggle's role sooner than anticipated. She did not actually start a relationship with Diggle until much later in the season.

3. Shane, aka that guy that Thea made out with in episode 109, who did not rate a press release.

4. Nyssa, since the EPs wanted her relationship with Sara to be a surprise. During the filming of episode 213, however, someone from the show tweeted about a "major kiss."

5. Jonah Hex, in something that was only implied, and may not have been intentionally implied.

And, well, across four years and four shows, that's it - just five characters who were not described as love interests during the casting calls/press releases (or in Shane's case, not described at all), but were revealed as love interests/potential love interests in their first episode. And that's only if we include Jonah Hex.

Leave him out, and we're down to four characters - two from the first nine episodes of Arrow's first season. Of these, two (Carly and Maxwell) came in as potential love interests. In four shows in four years, totaling hundreds of characters, just two entered as existing love interests without a prior announcement in the press release. Two. And with Nyssa, we had those tweets. 

With the upcoming fall season, we have one report from a fan that Felicity will have a boyfriend in the season premiere. We also have a second report from another fan stating that Amell, when questioned about this, didn't deny the report, followed by Amell saying that fans had taken many of his statements out of context. Those reports came out prior to filming, so whatever is happening is not equivalent to the Carly situation (getting upgraded on set).  Unlike with Nyssa, we have no tweets suggesting that anything romantic will be happening during the filming of the first two episodes. 

We do have press releases describing three incoming male characters in recurring/regular roles: 

Wild Dog, a "cocksure ex-Marine turned vigilante. His reckless nature prompts the Green Arrow to take him under his wing." Non-romantic.

Tyler Ritter, a "new addition to the Star City police department." Non-romantic. This guy is a cop. 

Adrian Chase, an "irrepressibly charming" contemporary of Oliver's and a "man on a mission" out to avenge a tragic, violent loss from his own past, aka, Arrow's first season.

The "irrepressibly charming" part of Adrian Chase's description does suggest a potential love interest role - not surprising for a new regular on a CW show who is probably getting tested for either yet another potential spinoff or a Captain Cold/Malcolm like crossover role or possibly a long term role on Arrow. But given the history of the Arrowverse shows, the lack of the specific words "love interest" or "potential love interest" for his character suggests two possibilities: 1) this is not happening in his first appearance, and that this will be more of a Maxwell Lord situation - someone teased from his first episode, possibly with more than one person, but not actually paired up with anyone for the entire season, which does not match the fan report, or 2) Arrow plans to make his relationship with Felicity a surprise reveal, like Nyssa, in which case, it's kinda odd that Amell would spoil that.  Not impossible, but kinda odd.

So, yeah, while I'm not throwing out option two, since it happened before, I think the history of the Berlanti shows suggests that some skepticism about whether or not any of these incoming characters will be playing even a minor romantic role with Felicity is justified. It's equally possible that Felicity's speculated boyfriend is either another Shane - so unimportant he doesn't rate a press release - or like Cat Grant's dating life, end up completely off screen. 

As far as Oliver and Felicity are concerned, to me, at least, it looks as if Arrow is just doing its typical thing of putting off major, moving Olicity forward moments until sweeps months and the winter/May finales. Yes, Arrow had all that swinging around in episode 201, and followed up the first "I love you" with an interrupted date in 301, and Oliver and Felicity driving off into the sunset with an interrupted marriage proposal in 401, but all of those first season moments ended up being either static (201, 401, where their relationship was pretty much at the same place it was in the beginning of the episode) or actually a bit of a step back (301, where, after admitting he loved her, Oliver decided he couldn't be with her.) The big moments that have pushed their relationship forward have always happened in either sweeps months, in an episode originally scheduled to be in a sweeps month (320) or the winter/May finales.

The same pattern seems to be happening here. Arrow ended last season with a step forward: after breaking up with Oliver and saying she was leaving Team Arrow, Felicity returned to stand by Oliver's side after everyone else had left (step forward) saying "not a chance" to the possibility that she might leave him (also step forward). Following Arrow's usual timeline, that means that in 501, things should stay static (Felicity staying by Oliver's side) or possibly slip a bit backwards (though Amell's comment about friendship seems to contradict that) and stay that way until either November or the December finale. This isn't particularly surprising, and I don't think it means Olicity are over for the entire season. I think it just means that despite constantly saying that oh, no, we don't care about ratings/sweeps, Arrow continues to be a typical U.S. network show that cares deeply about ratings/sweeps.

[Morrigan2575]

Quote

During the filming of episode 213, however, someone from the show tweeted about a "major kiss."

That would be BamBam

Quote

I think it just means that despite constantly saying that oh, no, we don't care about ratings/sweeps, Arrow continues to be a typical U.S. network show that cares deeply about ratings/sweeps.

I always thought that was Bullshit. Of course they care about Sweeps.

Edited July 17, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[statsgirl]

Thanks for all that work, quarks.

I can't remember -- was Ted Grant promoted as a love interest for Laurel when the word first came out, or was he just promoted as Wild Cat and the Laurel pairing came in later?

5 hours ago, quarks said:

.Adrian Chase, an "irrepressibly charming" contemporary of Oliver's and a "man on a mission" out to avenge a tragic, violent loss from his own past, aka, Arrow's first season.

That also sounds like Ray, determined to fight crime because of the loss of his fiance.  They're also re-using the name 'Chase'.

Re-using old idea a bit too much, methinks.

[apinknightmare]

8 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

That also sounds like Ray, determined to fight crime because of the loss of his fiance.  They're also re-using the name 'Chase'.

Re-using old idea a bit too much, methinks.

Adrian Chase is an actual comic canon name for Vigilante though. 

[quarks]

8 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

Thanks for all that work, quarks.

I can't remember -- was Ted Grant promoted as a love interest for Laurel when the word first came out, or was he just promoted as Wild Cat and the Laurel pairing came in later?

As Wild Cat, a potential love interest for Laurel. 

[kismet]

I'm not really worried about anything they say or don't say about any of the characters. I enjoy commenting, analyzing and speculating. But I don't worry about Arrow. The writers will either deliver a good story or not. Nothing to worry about. If they fail to write a good story, then I'm gradually going to give up. At this point I've enjoyed about 60% on the series and had varying degrees of dislike for the other 40%.

I'm disappointed that we have so many newbies to contend with, but that's been an ongoing disappointment since casting. At least on positive note, it's more people to sacrifice to the greater good, so I can keep my fav characters alive since the writers love to kill off characters.

[tv echo]

Based on the EnStars spoiler (assuming it's true), I wonder if they're going to set up Tobias Church as the presumed Big Bad early on, but then it'll turn out that Adrian Chase is the stealth Big Bad for S5 - like, he starts off as a friendly, frenemy-type adversary for Oliver but you think he'll end up becoming an ally to Team Arrow, and then there's a 'shocking' reveal - perhaps at the end of the mid-season finale - when we find out his real agenda is to destroy the Green Arrow.

Edited July 19, 2016 by tv echo

[dtissagirl]

The SDCC edition of TV Guide comes out today, maybe they got an early look? If the quote is legit, that kinda lines up with the spec we were doing a few weeks ago of how S1 robot killer Oliver is responsible for the big bad.

It also gives me a little bit of hope that the writers are aware that the only way Bratva flashbacks work is if they make a whole lot of allusions to S1 robot killer Oliver.

[apinknightmare]

I thought the DA was going to be after Oliver for something he did while he was in the Bratva, so if it's something that Oliver did once he came back to Starling, that's good. Although the way it's set up leaves several questions: does this dude know that the current GA is the old Hood and not some new iteration like everyone else thinks he is? Maybe Roy shows his face when he turns up in town whenever he visits and his fake death is exposed? And if it IS the DA, and he's been setting up his revenge for years, does he know Oliver was the Hood/is the Green Arrow? If not, that's some coincidence. But then again, it is this show, so...don't make me jump through more logic hoops pls.