Show Me A Hero - General Discussion

[seamusk]

My point on this is, that black communities have a history of being poor, working class, so not having jobs has always been the case. Struggling to keep a  job has always been the case. Not being able to afford higher education, has always been the case. But there was a time when being poor and out of work in a black community did not mean drugs and black on black crime, at least not to extent that it is today. I forgot the actor, he's from um, New Orleans and he played a detective on The Wire, the chubby faced guy, I like him, but I can't remember the actor's name. He was Treme too with Clarke Peters, he played a musician. But he talked about this on Bill Maher, about growing up in a poor black community in New Orleans and that even though it was poor there was still that sense of community. You had everyone looking out for their neighbor, so poor and jobless isn't the key IMO. 

Poor communities, regardless of ethnicity, have always had high crime rates. There certainly have been differences over time. And the growth of the drug industry and accessibility to guns has changed things a lot too. Keep in mind that there are various levels of poverty. There is working poor. There is non-working poor. Also, the high-rise projects are well documented to be particularly problematic. They are rarely built anymore for that reason.

[represent]

 

Poor communities, regardless of ethnicity, have always had high crime rates. There certainly have been differences over time. And the growth of the drug industry and accessibility to guns has changed things a lot too. Keep in mind that there are various levels of poverty. There is working poor. There is non-working poor. Also, the high-rise projects are well documented to be particularly problematic. They are rarely built anymore for that reason.

I'm fully aware of this having worked in a poor working to non-working class predominantly white community, which is rampant with drug users particularly heroine drug users. They have plenty access to guns as well, but....don't know if the area would feel more crime ridden if they built a bunch of high rises there though.  But it's definitely full of drugs, being used by people who are poor some jobless and some working class.

Edited September 3, 2015 by represent

[wendyg]

Not to hijack this very interesting discussion, but the mention of different types of poor reminds me of Alfred Doolittle in PYGMALION (or MY FAIR LADY) explaining to Henry Higgins that he's one of the *undeserving* poor. If you're not familiar with it, the text of this monologue is here: http://www.monologuearchive.com/s/shaw_006.html.

Edited September 4, 2015 by wendyg

[Neurochick]

In the first season of "The Wire" the neighborhood was full of low rises, short housing projects.  I think the issue isn't with the sizes of the projects but the common areas, places that no one owns.

 

Wendell Pierce is the "Wire" actor from New Orleans.  I heard him too when he talked about growing up in New Orleans, he's right.  Drugs fucked everything up in poor neighborhoods.  But, I believe that the loss of the manufacturing jobs contributed to people getting into the drug business.  Of course, racism plays a huge part as well.  Twenty years ago, I had an ex boyfriend who was unemployed and found a construction job like THAT.  He was Irish and his uncle knew someone who knew someone, who hired him.  

[represent]

 

In the first season of "The Wire" the neighborhood was full of low rises, short housing projects.  I think the issue isn't with the sizes of the projects but the common areas, places that no one owns.

OK, yes, this is it, this makes sense.  Thanks for the name, I always forget his name, but he's a good actor. I also think he has a chain of supermarkets which set up  in poor neighborhoods in African-American communities so that the residents can have access to fresh produce.  I  think they even give the residents rides to and from the markets seeing as lack of transportation is another issue. He was talking about this too on Politically Incorrect.

 

My cousin was a traveling/visiting nurse in NYC and in some of these neighborhoods you can't even get a salad from McDonald's. She went into a McDonald's and asked for one of their salads and the girl looked at her like she was crazy. She told her that she needed to check in the back to see if they carry salads.  And no, it wasn't that they ran out, it was that she wasn't sure they even sold them. I guess people never ask for them so maybe the manager stopped having them delivered to that location. I don't know, but the girl looked at her like she was speaking a foreign language. They truly don't have access to fruits and vegetables.

Edited September 6, 2015 by represent

[Mindymoo]

Did anyone watch the series twice and find the finale much sadder the second time around? I mean, when the first two parts aired, I read up about Nick on Wikipedia and was very sad, but watching it a second time devastated me and left me in tears. This was such a fantastic miniseries, and I can't wait to see what David Simon does next. (Even if it is just being a drunken narrator on "Drunk History".)

[represent]

I am going to watch it again because I missed the beginning minutes in part one so I missed the introductions of many of the characters.  I started watching when he was handing out flyers to people on the street saying that he was running for mayor. However, I have watched five and six twice, especially the final minutes because as sad as it was I just love the last shot with Mary and Doreen. I love that it ended with the shot of those two. I also love the song they played at the end even though it was sad and haunting. 

 

Does anybody know who that was singing?

Edited September 6, 2015 by represent

[Mindymoo]

Bruce Springsteen, believe it or not. At first I thought it was Annie Lennox!

[represent]

Oh thanks, it was beautifully haunting. A lot of Springsteen and Joel in this series, nice.

 

Was the main song of the series, a Springteen too?  That "Where ya gonna run to where ya gonna hide...." Not sure if that's the title but those were the lyrics right?

Edited September 6, 2015 by represent

[meep.meep]

I watched only the first hour on HBOGo and struggled to get through that much. Winona did nothing for me (sorry, Mark!), even though she was probably my spirit animal at least once during my more impressionable years (Heathers, Beetlejuice).

Me too.  Not going to watch the rest.

 

I did crack up when I realized it was Peter Reigert from Animal House under all that beard!

[ganesh]

I think Mary was the real hero, but Nick's work as mayor opened that door for her.

 

I had no idea Nick killed himself irl. I was so shocked. 

[BrittaBot]

 

Did anyone watch the series twice and find the finale much sadder the second time around? I mean, when the first two parts aired, I read up about Nick on Wikipedia and was very sad, but watching it a second time devastated me and left me in tears. This was such a fantastic miniseries, and I can't wait to see what David Simon does next. (Even if it is just being a drunken narrator on "Drunk History".)

I've only watched once so far but I was still devastated. I had a feeling he was going to kill himself when he rushed out of the house like that, but was telling myself no, no, no, no. Then the funeral interspersed with updates on everyone's lives and how they delayed you seeing Nay, his mom, and his brother till closer to the end of the walk, and then I just went full on Wahhhhh.

 

I don't think I would have had quite the same reaction if it wasn't for Oscar Isaac. This was the first thing I've seen him in and he got me really attached to the character, even when he was acting like a jackass. 

 

 I also don't think he cheated on Nay. You can tell when a guy is a cheater and he wasn't.

Edited September 7, 2015 by BrittaBot

[yellowjacket]

I couldn't watch part 5-6 until last night because of stuff.

 

I knew Nick Wascisko a little in the 80s, at New York Law School where we had some classes together (I did not graduate, couldn't stand it).  At the time I was also involved in Democratic politics (in New Jersey) so we had something to talk about.  He was a dynamo - he ran for council while going to law school and then passed the bar right before he ran for mayor.  Two tiny things I loved about the series were showing his NYLS JD degree, and him calling himself a "Polack" as a joke.  He actually would do that.  He looked nothing like Oscar Isaac except for thick hair and being short, but Isaac sure did him well with his acting.

 

Nick was the same as all of them, retail urban politicians.  He got up to shave in the morning and saw the President of the United States in the mirror.  He worked HARD, like really hard all the time, to be a successful pol.  The early success ruined him - he never could be the youngest mayor in America again, or be a nominee for a Profile in Courage award.  Too good too fast.  He pissed off a LOT of people by being so successful so young, and never really got the support of people who could have put him in a safe congressional seat or something - Daniel Patrick Moynihan, Mario Cuomo, others.

 

It was just so sad that he succumbed to his depression and anguish.  I guess his ambition killed him in the end. 

 

Show:  This was awesome TV.  The casting was perfection.  I wasn't familiar with LaTanya Richardson Jackson until now, except I guess for red carpets with her hubby Sam.  Someone needs to give her an Emmy, a golden globe, and a SAG award.  Catherine Keener was great as well but I just couldn't with the wig. They tried.  The young lady who played Billie, Dominique Fishback, was excellent and I hope we see her in many more things.

Edited September 7, 2015 by yellowjacket

[pasdetrois]

I adore David Simon but expected to be bored occasionally by this show's story. But I remained interested and entertained. Great actors really make the difference and I am so thrilled that many of them will now "do TV."

 

We saw Nick's neediness in the way he kind of smothered his girlfriend/wife at night, in bed. And her portrayal was the one off element for me, at least in the earlier episodes. She just trailed along beside him, and the actress gave a little giggle every time she spoke. It bugged. But the performance was stronger later.

 

My impression was that Nick simply manipulated the political tides that were handed to him in order to gain and hold office. I never had the impression he was impassioned about affordable housing. He loved the political game, and winning, and getting the attention.

[Wilson Cat]

Neurochick wrote:

 

But more importantly, Lester Freeman!!  (Fans of The Wire will know what I'm talking about)

Indeed.  I absolutely love Clarke Peters in everything he has done.  The guy oozes integrity whether as Lester Freeman in The Wire, or The Chief in Treme (heartbreakingly wonderful) and now in Show Me a Hero.  I struggled a bit with this series, but came around to appreciating that Paul Haggis and the writers did not lead us by the nose and explain every scene explicitly.  At times it would feel like a scene just popped up part way done only to segue to a new scene that was just as ambivalent and arbitrary.  It forced the viewer to think.  And that's a good thing.  I'd follow David Simon anywhere, as everything he has ever done has been top notch. HOMICIDE: Life on the Streets was astoundingly excellent.  The Corner.  The Wire.  Treme.  Show Me a Hero.  I hear his cohort, Richard Price, is working on a project, the timing and subject still undivulged, but I look forward to anything these guys do.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Wilson Cat

[Arcey]

I didn't watch this installment until just a few days ago, about a month after it aired. I just forgot to watch it, and I guess even though I really liked parts 1-4 more than I expected, and it all improved the more I watched, I just wasn't compelled to watch the last parts. Boy, am I glad I remembered it was still in my list of recorded shows.

 

I wasn't spoiled at all by real life, and had kind of forgotten about the beeper motif that opened the series, and I think was showed at least one more time. So I was devastated by the ending. I'm so naive, I didn't even really know for sure that his not answering his pager meant that he actually killed himself. I thought maybe he had an epiphany and went home. So seeing the funeral made me think he "probably" did it, but I still wasn't sure, probably because I was hoping he didn't. Seeing Nay and his mother leaving the church, and the pre-credits not mentioning him were a pretty good hint, but I still hoped not. (Well, up to a certain point anyway.)

 

I cried when he was shown "doing the deed," and was devastated. What a waste. How terribly tragic. I was so happy to see the updates of what happened to the characters. That was a wonderful remedy for the sadness -- it was good to see that most people ended up okay, at least on a superficial level. Like another poster, I also loved seeing Mary hang out with Doreen in front of her townhouse.

 

On a personal note, I grew up in the Bronx, about 10-15 up the Bronx River Parkway from Yonkers. We mostly went there for the early "suburban" shopping malls there in the 50's and 60's (I know, I'm old :) ), and I had an uncle who lived there who we visited just a few times. He wasn't my favorite person once I got old enough to realize that -- he would have been on the side of the angry mobs. Yuck. I moved to CA in the 70's and knew nothing about any of this.

 

A personal favorite moment for me was near the end, when Doreen's son fearlessly goes over to the "Poodle lady" and her dogs, after being rebuffed once, and the lady warms up to him and they strike up a beautiful moment. Those weren't Poodles, they were Bichons, and they were adorable. I happened to be watching that with the love of my life next to me, my amazing Bichon, with a much less pouffy haircut. I melted when the dog was up on her hind legs saying "hi" with her front paws. Awww, so sweet.

 

I'm so glad I watched this mini-series, which I probably did only because it was a David Simon project, with all the usual suspects on his team from Homicide and The Wire.