Season 6: Speculation

[MadMouse]

So it looks like I've fallen behind in spoilers this summer.

 

Jaime in the Riverlands good lord they did it. Of course I have no faith they won't butcher his story. So has there been any news of Blackfish or Edmure returning? Any casting of Brackens or Blackwoods. That would give an indication of how much of his arc they're cutting out. 

 

So one of the Northern Lords is the SmallJon? No Manderlys or Mountain Clans? Boooo. This makes me realize more than ever they botched the Red Wedding episode. 

 

So they cast Euron and he looks pretty young. Is he still Balon's brother or is he going to be a Pyke? No word on my man Victarion and his volcano arm?

 

Any news on Dorne? No Arianne or Quentyn? Have they cast Dayne yet? Any new Dornish characters being brought in?

 

Has it been confirmed who's playing Tarly yet? Saw they cast Dickon and liked that he really seems like that exact opposite of Sam, hope they play him like the good kid he seems in the books.

 

I take it they're still saying Jon is dead right? Has there been any casting they suggests we might be getting a Rhaegar or Lyanna appearance? 

 

 

 

[Lady S.]

So it looks like I've fallen behind in spoilers this summer.

 

Jaime in the Riverlands good lord they did it. Of course I have no faith they won't butcher his story. So has there been any news of Blackfish or Edmure returning? Any casting of Brackens or Blackwoods. That would give an indication of how much of his arc they're cutting out. 

 

So one of the Northern Lords is the SmallJon? No Manderlys or Mountain Clans? Boooo. This makes me realize more than ever they botched the Red Wedding episode. 

 

So they cast Euron and he looks pretty young. Is he still Balon's brother or is he going to be a Pyke? No word on my man Victarion and his volcano arm?

 

Any news on Dorne? No Arianne or Quentyn? Have they cast Dayne yet? Any new Dornish characters being brought in?

 

Has it been confirmed who's playing Tarly yet? Saw they cast Dickon and liked that he really seems like that exact opposite of Sam, hope they play him like the good kid he seems in the books.

 

I take it they're still saying Jon is dead right? Has there been any casting they suggests we might be getting a Rhaegar or Lyanna appearance? 

No word yet on the Tullys, but I expect they're more likely than any Brackens or Blackwoods. What we do know is that the Freys are back in play. Bigger news is that Arya is said to be returning to the Riverlands, but not til the end of the season. WotW's sources also report Sandor Clegane is back, and I assume he's still in that general area.

 

One northern lord is the Smalljon, another is a Karstark. And the bigger news there is that Rickon and Osha are back, presumably with the Umbers.

 

Euron is cast, and apparently Aeron is too, though we don't have the actor's name there. Vic is almost certainly out. No indication that Euron isn't Balon's brother and a Greyjoy. The show could easily explain the age difference by making them half-brothers of different wives, but knowing the show, I assume they'll just ignore the issue completely. Other news there is that Theon is returning to the Iron Islands at some point. Alfie and Gemma Whelan have been spotted in the area.

 

The actor who plays Areo Hotah says he hasn't read his scripts yet and won't be called to set until later. That's really the only news out of Dorne. No confirmation on who is Arthur Dayne yet, but we do know a Spanish site is set to be the ToJ.

 

No confirmation on Randyll, but it's possible that is Ian McShane's mystery role. 

 

We know the ToJ and another Ned flashback is in, a recent call for "a young stunner", with a major twist in her final scene, could be Lyanna.

[ElizaD]

WOTW:

 

Sources report that today Game of Thrones is filming portions of a massive battle in Saintfield, Northern Ireland, that will likely be a part of episode nine. Preparations and the beginning of filming were seen in that area recently, but it was difficult to glean many details.

We’ve learned that the battle will involve many northern armies fighting including the Umbers, the Boltons, wildlings and more! The true major spoiler is this: Kit Harington a.k.a Jon Snow was also seen at the location, participating in shooting this week.

 

I think this 99% confirms a Stark reunion of some sort: they can't have three of them in the North and not have at least two run into each other. Sansa is around, Rickon returns after he's presumably been hiding with the Umbers, and Jon is in a battle that includes Umbers. The only downside is that if Jon kills Ramsay, it'll just emphasize that Sansa's rape was all about creating opportunities for the male lead to save (Theon) or avenge (Jon) her. I hope Ramsay dies in some other way that's painful and humiliating rather than a badass final stand that allows him to keep on looking as flawless as possible.

 

If Melisandre follows Jon, she should see her vision of Bolton banners burning come true in 6x09 or 6x10. Maybe Davos discovers that the Boltons didn't kill Shireen when he speaks to a dying Roose/Ramsay and kills her in the finale.

 

It's interesting that the wildlings are there too. Season 5 did a good job showing why they would follow Jon.

Edited September 10, 2015 by ElizaD

[nksarmi]

I hope we see parallel stories in the North in season six... Jon is resurrected and maybe he doesn't become king of the Wildlings but he definitely becomes their commander.  I hope they take vengeance on the NW betrayers (yes even Ollie).  And yes, I think Mel will see her vision come true but I also hope Davos eventually figures out what she did and kills her for it.

 

But I do hope we get to see Sansa reunite with Rickon in a separate story and rally the Northern lords to take Winterfell for her.  So that would be Stark reunion number one (I hope Brie stays with her).

 

Then I hope that while her army engages the Boltons that Jon's army is on the move to her.  Maybe things start to go badly or LF sides against her or something makes it look like she and the North are going to lose and then Jon arrives with his wildling army to turn the tide and put Starks back in Winterfell.  So he is then reunited with Sansa and Rickon (and I so hope Shaggy Dog and Ghost are reunited as well).

 

We deserve this story this season and it would put some of the right people in the right place to prepare for a battle against the Others.

Oh and I have to say that I really, really want to see Sansa negotiate herself a marriage to a Northern lord's son once she is properly widowed.  I really can just picture her saying to some Northern lady something like "once I became a widow, I would very much like to marry a Kastark and put things right between our families again."  And I really can see an Umber or something saying "we march to war to avenge King Robb and make Lady Sansa a widow! Huzzah!"

[Edith]

Maybe we will get the pink letter after all?

[ElizaD]

Maybe we will get the pink letter after all?

 

Ramsay's mention of Jon could lead to something in season 6. Even if Sansa doesn't head for the Wall, Jon might be resurrected only to find out that Ramsay thinks she's there and plans to fight him, giving him a reason to go to Winterfell.

[SeanC]

Oh and I have to say that I really, really want to see Sansa negotiate herself a marriage to a Northern lord's son once she is properly widowed.  I really can just picture her saying to some Northern lady something like "once I became a widow, I would very much like to marry a Kastark and put things right between our families again."  And I really can see an Umber or something saying "we march to war to avenge King Robb and make Lady Sansa a widow! Huzzah!"

After last year, I'm really not eager to see the show do anything more with Sansa's sexual/marriage history, since I'm rather skeptical that the aftermath of spending several weeks as a tortured sex slave is going to be given any meaningful expression.

[Avaleigh]

Oh and I have to say that I really, really want to see Sansa negotiate herself a marriage to a Northern lord's son once she is properly widowed.  I really can just picture her saying to some Northern lady something like "once I became a widow, I would very much like to marry a Kastark and put things right between our families again."  And I really can see an Umber or something saying "we march to war to avenge King Robb and make Lady Sansa a widow! Huzzah!"

Since I'm holding out hope that Sansa is the YMB(Q) I definitely don't want her married to any minor northern lord. The Karstarks pretty much suck anyway and I've been creeped out by the Umbers ever since I read that they're into that First Night shit. All of the other houses seem too minor to be considered. 

 

I'm holding out hope for her to end up with Jon. If not Jon then let her stay single or maybe even married to Tyrion. The last one definitely isn't ideal but I can see it happening. Harry the Heir can't live long. Not if LF has anything to say about it. I would almost be tempted to see her end up with LF for awhile just to see what sort of eruption would happen online. It wouldn't break the internet exactly but I can see a couple of mini riots breaking out. I don't think SanSan has so much as a snowball's chance. 

 

ETA:

 

I'm curious to know if Dickon is going to be married on the show like he is in the books. 

Edited September 10, 2015 by Avaleigh

[nksarmi]

After last year, I'm really not eager to see the show do anything more with Sansa's sexual/marriage history, since I'm rather skeptical that the aftermath of spending several weeks as a tortured sex slave is going to be given any meaningful expression.

I can't say that I blame you, but I would consider it a small compensation if she came out of it strong enough to ask for one of these lords to make her a widow.

[nksarmi]

Since I'm holding out hope that Sansa is the YMB(Q) I definitely don't want her married to any minor northern lord. The Karstarks pretty much suck anyway and I've been creeped out by the Umbers ever since I read that they're into that First Night shit. All of the other houses seem too minor to be considered. 

 

I'm holding out hope for her to end up with Jon. If not Jon then let her stay single or maybe even married to Tyrion. The last one definitely isn't ideal but I can see it happening. Harry the Heir can't live long. Not if LF has anything to say about it. I would almost be tempted to see her end up with LF for awhile just to see what sort of eruption would happen online. It wouldn't break the internet exactly but I can see a couple of mini riots breaking out. I don't think SanSan has so much as a snowball's chance. 

 

ETA:

 

I'm curious to know if Dickon is going to be married on the show like he is in the books. 

 

I actually rather like the idea of Sansa coming back around and deciding that she rather liked Tyrion after all.  And if they both survive this mess (and I think they will) I would like to see them at the very least become good friends.

 

However, I think there would be some strength in Sansa becoming the rallying cry of the North and her taking enough power for herself to negotiate her own marriage to a Northern lord while demanding that he bring her Ramsey's head would - to me - be the kind of "game player" I can see Sansa becoming.  And I find it somehow satisfying that Sansa - who couldn't wait to leave the North - could become the Stark who brings the Northern lords back together again and realistically marriage would be one way to do this.

[Avaleigh]

I actually rather like the idea of Sansa coming back around and deciding that she rather liked Tyrion after all.  And if they both survive this mess (and I think they will) I would like to see them at the very least become good friends.

 

However, I think there would be some strength in Sansa becoming the rallying cry of the North and her taking enough power for herself to negotiate her own marriage to a Northern lord while demanding that he bring her Ramsey's head would - to me - be the kind of "game player" I can see Sansa becoming.  And I find it somehow satisfying that Sansa - who couldn't wait to leave the North - could become the Stark who brings the Northern lords back together again and realistically marriage would be one way to do this.

Can't Jon basically help her accomplish this? 

[nksarmi]

Can't Jon basically help her accomplish this? 

I want her to do it without him lol.  I actually am not a fan of Sansa and Jon ending up together, but if that happens so be it.  If this was a romance novel, I swear she and Tyrion would meet up again and fall madly in love and live happily ever after.  But let's just say I would not be at all disappointed if what I described happened.  I don't think it will because every time I have hope for Sansa coming into power it doesn't happen, but I have still played out about three speeches for Sansa to Northern lords in my head as she calls them to war. :)

[Skeeter22]

I'm not a fan of the Jon/Sansa pairing, but the fact that Jon seems to be heading towards a showdown with Ramsay makes me think it's at least possible on the show. D&D came up with marrying Sansa to Ramsay back in season two. They've also really pushed the idea that Ramsay is the foil to Jon. I wonder if one of the reasons they were so keen to throw out Sansa's Vale storyline was because they thought the Ramsay plot would be a shortcut to getting her closer to Jon.

[MadMouse]

Jon/Sansa makes sense if you believe Jon will play a role similar to Aegon and his two wives. Instead of sisters for Jon it'll be cousin and aunt. Sansa is Rhaenys and Dany is Visenya. 

 

What I more curious about is how they'll use Bloodraven. Will he being doing voice overs during Bran's visions? Could he be used to hint more of Jon's Targ heritage until the Lyanna reveal? I'm firm believer in theory of a Rhaegar/Lyanna marriage and Bloodraven knowing he's legitimate (Mormont's raven). If Jon is involved in a huge battle in the North I think having him recount the tale of the Redgrass field while showing Jon fighting could be amazing. 

 

If anyone wants to hear a taste of what it could sound like listen to the first minute of the Skyrim trailer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpvM9uwOcUc

Edited September 11, 2015 by MadMouse

[ElizaD]

I've been expecting that the Bran flashbacks would happen as buildup to Jon's resurrection, but now I'm thinking that it can't happen very late in the season; surely Jon needs multiple episodes to cope with the realization that he's been brought back from the dead, come to some sort of decision about the NW/wildlings, learn about the Bolton situation and then take his army to join the fight. This has made me wonder if the Tower of Joy might not be a mid-season climax but the actual finale. They've cast little Ned so that's at least one flashback with baby Starks and if Young Stunner is Lyanna as a teen the casting call made it sound like she has at least two scenes plus a final scene with a major twist: that could be four episodes of content for Bran, and since Bloodraven got a big name recast I think Bran will have episodes without Stark visions, perhaps learning about different magics and the White Walkers. If the flashbacks are spread pretty evenly and the final one is in 6x10, could it be possible that it's some combination of Bran/the viewers getting to see the actual TOJ flashback and Bran/Bloodraven guiding Jon to Lyanna's tomb in the crypts so that he learns about his parents after defeating the Boltons?

 

After the news about the Northern battle and Arya still being in Braavos around 6x08, I think the Freys are going to be reintroduced as part of Jaime's story but not be defeated this season.

[Avaleigh]

With the info that Jaime is going to lead the Tyrell soldiers to the sept so that Margaery can be released my speculation is the following.

 

Tommen has asked Jaime to help Margaery and Jaime does this in spite of Cersei's wishes. She's already upset with him because of Myrcella so they finally have the break in their relationship. He also tells her that he won't be her champion.

 

Margaery's new devotion to the Faith is all bullshit. We know how easy it is for her to fake it if she has to. She's a lot more talented than Cersei in this regard. Margaery just doesn't want to run afoul of them again. She and Loras will still have a trial but she'll have a triumphant moment where Cersei can see that Jaime and Tommen were responsible for rescuing her from the sept and she won't have lost her hair or had to shame herself with a walk. That alone might be enough for Cersei to lose her mind completely.

 

I was under the impression that Patient Zero was a series that Natalie Dormer had signed for but apparently it's just a film so I'm less confident than I was that she's going to be executed. I still lean that way but now think that she and Loras might be able to get out of it. That's a way less exciting option but it seems plausible.

 

I just don't get the point of Margaery sticking around. If she dies though all sorts of things can happen. 

[Advance35]

Yep.  I know this show lives up to it's rep for tragedy and horror but the Tyrells really ARE smooth.   I am not going to be surprised if they come through this whole saga without losing anyone.

 

IF it plays as it reads, I see Margaery doing the "devotion" bit as an effort to begin distancing House Tyrell from the remnants of House Lannister in the eyes of the Faith and in the eyes of the Seven Kingdoms.   

 

I think Olenna, Margaery and Loras will be plotting how best to extricate themselves from the sinking ship, while Jaimie and Kevan try to smooth over burnt bridges in an effort to keep the alliance up and functioning. 

 

I just don't get the point of Margaery sticking around. If she dies though all sorts of things can happen.

 

I think chaos in Kings Landing is inevitable, though Margaery's demise would certainly catapult it into overdrive, but even with her and Loras alive and well, this whole thing has gone too far.   I am super curious about how LF will fit into this since I can't see him leaving Kings Landing with so many things up in the air.

 

Jaimie Lannister rescuing Margaery Tyrell and sparing her the same ridicule and shame Cersei suffered.......the Dowager Queen is going to spit nails.

Edited September 12, 2015 by Advance35

[ElizaD]

I was under the impression that Patient Zero was a series that Natalie Dormer had signed for but apparently it's just a film so I'm less confident than I was that she's going to be executed. I still lean that way but now think that she and Loras might be able to get out of it. That's a way less exciting option but it seems plausible.

 

Even if they aren't executed, I still think (and, I admit, very much hope) that the Tyrells will finally start suffering. Jaime going to free Margaery and the High Sparrow letting her go because she's acting holy/sees the Faith as a lesser evil than Cersei sounds like a good adaptation of Margaery's book release. IMO, the possible break and Jaime going to the Riverlands will be due to Cersei being upset that he got Myrcella killed and Margaery freed rather than Jaime falling out of love. But this reminded me of a Finn Jones interview that I'd heard about:

 

“There’s a transformation in Lora’s state and character and it’s fun to be able to go a little bit deeper and darker in the character. I’ve really enjoyed being able to go to those places.”

“The end of season six in particular is very shocking,” he said before going on to say that he couldn’t remember the scene he found most surprising from season five. “It’s so difficult to remember it because my head is so in season six, so I can’t even remember what happened in season five.”

 

Since it's a KL actor saying this, the first thing I thought of was the speculation that Cersei burns KL and flees to the Rock with Tommen. I can't see her doing that without making sure that at least one Tyrell dies. They're filming KL scenes in Girona rather than Dubrovnik, maybe this is KL's last season and one of the reasons for changing the real-world city (I vaguely recall hearing that the showrunners weren't happy with the reactions to the filming of the walk) might be that it's no longer as important for KL to have the same look.

[Lady S.]

I don't think a KL actor saying that means he can be assumed to be talking about the KL plots, pretty much all the actors hyped up the shock of the RW and FtW, and pretty much every season ending has been hyped as more shocking than the one before.

[MadMouse]

I've been expecting that the Bran flashbacks would happen as buildup to Jon's resurrection, but now I'm thinking that it can't happen very late in the season; surely Jon needs multiple episodes to cope with the realization that he's been brought back from the dead, come to some sort of decision about the NW/wildlings, learn about the Bolton situation and then take his army to join the fight. This has made me wonder if the Tower of Joy might not be a mid-season climax but the actual finale. They've cast little Ned so that's at least one flashback with baby Starks and if Young Stunner is Lyanna as a teen the casting call made it sound like she has at least two scenes plus a final scene with a major twist: that could be four episodes of content for Bran, and since Bloodraven got a big name recast I think Bran will have episodes without Stark visions, perhaps learning about different magics and the White Walkers. If the flashbacks are spread pretty evenly and the final one is in 6x10, could it be possible that it's some combination of Bran/the viewers getting to see the actual TOJ flashback and Bran/Bloodraven guiding Jon to Lyanna's tomb in the crypts so that he learns about his parents after defeating the Boltons?

 

After the news about the Northern battle and Arya still being in Braavos around 6x08, I think the Freys are going to be reintroduced as part of Jaime's story but not be defeated this season.

 

That's why I think Bran's visions, Bloodraven and Jon resurrection could play off each other. Biggest problem with that of course is we have no idea what visions they'll use or how much of Bloodraven's history will be kept in tact. 

[Alapaki]

Sources report that today Game of Thrones is filming portions of a massive battle in Saintfield, Northern Ireland, that will likely be a part of episode nine. Preparations and the beginning of filming were seen in that area recently, but it was difficult to glean many details.

We’ve learned that the battle will involve many northern armies fighting including the Umbers, the Boltons, wildlings and more! The true major spoiler is this: Kit Harington a.k.a Jon Snow was also seen at the location, participating in shooting this week.

 

 

Since I don't see a rationale for the Night's Watch to wage war on the Boltons (barring a Bolton attack on the NW, which Bolton has no incentive to initiate) I think this scene (if accurate) seems to confirm the long-speculated notion that Jon Snow's death/resurrection is used as a way out of the Night's Watch.  

 

In Season 5 Stannis never recruited the Northern mountain clans the way he did in the book.  It may be that Jon puts together an alliance of northerns to fight the Boltons.  

 

If so, it will be interesting to see which side Littlefinger comes down on.

[nksarmi]

Since I don't see a rationale for the Night's Watch to wage war on the Boltons (barring a Bolton attack on the NW, which Bolton has no incentive to initiate) I think this scene (if accurate) seems to confirm the long-speculated notion that Jon Snow's death/resurrection is used as a way out of the Night's Watch.  

 

In Season 5 Stannis never recruited the Northern mountain clans the way he did in the book.  It may be that Jon puts together an alliance of northerns to fight the Boltons.  

 

If so, it will be interesting to see which side Littlefinger comes down on.

 

I - and other I presume - are speculating that since there are less than 50 NW men on the show and the wildlings vastly outnumber them (and they have a giant) that there might actually be some retribution on the NW before Jon is even resurrected.  I would not be surprised at all if there was a fight between the wildlings and NW in the first couple of episodes.

 

By the time they get around to the big battle described here, I think Jon will probably be leading a wildling army but the NW will - more or less - be no more.

[mac123x]

She and Loras will still have a trial but she'll have a triumphant moment where Cersei can see that Jaime and Tommen were responsible for rescuing her from the sept and she won't have lost her hair or had to shame herself with a walk. That alone might be enough for Cersei to lose her mind completely.

 

I assumed that Marge (and Loras) will have a trial at which Olyvar comes forward and recants his previous testimony at the inquest, and maybe even state (lie) that Cercei coerced his false testimony.  My basis is the Littlefinger / Olenna conversation where he said he was giving her a "handsome young man".  Marge and Loras are cleared of all charges, and Cercei gets even more vindictive.

[Alapaki]

Assuming the show-runners are taking at least broad-brush direction from GRRM, it seems like Tommen is going to be faced with a war on at least three fronts: from Dorne in the South (set up at the end of last season); from the Iron Islanders in the West (with the presumptive casting of Euron and Tarly); and from whatever menagerie Jon Snow puts together in the North.  To say nothing of the uprising of religious zealots within the walls of Kings Landing.

 

Each one of those things constitutes a direct attack on the Throne, and the Lannister's failure to address any one of them would be seen as proof that they've lost control of the Kingdom.  

[Chris24601]

Assuming the show-runners are taking at least broad-brush direction from GRRM, it seems like Tommen is going to be faced with a war on at least three fronts... and from whatever menagerie Jon Snow puts together in the North.

Disagree on this one. Jon is far too busy dealing with the existential threat to the entire world posed by the Endless Winter coming down from the north to give a flying fig about who's sitting on the Iron Throne. If he's going to war in the North its NOT as a road to the Iron Throne, but to secure the resources needed to win against the White Walkers (and I strongly suspect that Winterfell will be THE key to it all... the narrative very nearly demands it).

Frankly, if the Lannisters had even an ounce of political saavy left to them, Jon would be their greatest ally. What better way to forestall all the cutthroats coming for you than to unite everyone against the great Other who threatens them all? Sadly for the Lannisters, Cersei is too petty, Jamie too conflicted, Tommen too young and Tyrion too banished for them to do anything other than self-destruct (at least Tyrion is well clear of the blast radius).

[ElizaD]

After the latest filming news, I've seen several people comment that Tommen/Margaery might be getting some of the content that Aegon/Arianne are speculated to have in TWOW as the young couple supported by the Faith and the people. Even if the 6x06 scene leads to Jaime/the Tyrell soldiers clashing violently with the Kingsguard/the Faith, I don't believe Tommen is dying that early. I'd guess that he and his queen return home in 6x06/6x07, Jaime and Cersei fight and he leaves for the Riverlands, and then Cersei gets up to something in 6x08-6x10 that wrecks the city, so that it's in ruins when Dany arrives in season 7 and sees that her vision of the abandoned throne has come true. However, it is a bit more difficult to see Cersei fleeing to the Rock with Show Tommen since he is older and in love with Margaery: if she gets Margaery killed, she'd need to be able to make Tommen feel someone else is to blame.

 

I've also seen random comments about Loras being tortured but I don't know the source of that rumor, I wonder if it's just based on the Finn Jones interview where he says Loras is transformed and gets darker.

[nksarmi]

In regards to Margaery and Cersei and the YMB(Q) - I really don't see how it isn't Margaery.  I mean outside of Cersei perhaps getting something right for once - I think this part of the prophesy that Cersei fears so much was just Maggy messing with her.  If I recall correctly, the line relates to when she will be queen and then "another, younger more beautiful" will come along to take all she holds dear.

 

I don't think that is any kind of ominous threat, I think it just refers to Cersei getting old and being replaced.  On the show, we have been led to believe that Cersei holds her children most dear, but I am not sure that is exactly true to the Cersei character.  I think Cersei holds youth and beauty and power most dear - then her children and Jamie are in there somewhere.  I think Cersei facilitated this part of the prophesy as soon as she had Robert killed because it was only natural that another woman would become queen at that point.  Said queen would almost certainly be younger and the more beautiful part was just a jab at a vain teenage girl.

 

I just really think Marg is the YMB(Q) and she was put in place to become so by Cersei herself.  The idea that she emerges from this mess as a loyal (or at least pretending to be loyal) member of the Faith is hardly surprising.  She was already loved by the people and eager to provide the people with food and make things better for them.  She must have decided she needed to play along with the HS if she wanted to save herself.  Tommen is shown as being so weak, he might actually need the Faith to save him. 

 

I can't really imagine that if Tommen and Marg emerge free and beloved of the people that there will be a major clash. Perhaps one begins but Tommen and Marg put a stop to it.  The HS seemed to be intelligent enough that he didn't want Cersei to admit that Tommen wasn't Robert's - probably because he knows that once he weakens Cersei and gets to Marg, he can control the king.  A different ruler might not be so malleable.

 

I think Marg's fulfillment of YMB(Q) will come into full fruition this year and now we just have to wait and see how Tommen might die for Cersei to go full on cray cray and burn KL down. 

[ElizaD]

I just realized that I've been engaging in all this KL speculation without giving a single thought to what Trystane will do or have done to him. Dorne has just fallen off the map.

 

I just really think Marg is the YMB(Q) and she was put in place to become so by Cersei herself. 

 

Though I'd like for Cersei to have a moment of realization that Sansa is alive and back in power in Winterfell/Riverrun/the Vale, I agree that Cersei causing her own doom by becoming paranoid about Margaery (who agreed to Joffrey's murder but would apparently have been quite content to be Tommen's queen) and escalating things until they're both destroyed is the interpretation that has the strongest support: Sansa doesn't have a clear path to becoming a queen and Dany will arrive so late that Cersei will have little left that could be taken from her.

[BlackberryJam]

I totally agree with this nksarmi. 

[nksarmi]

I just realized that I've been engaging in all this KL speculation without giving a single thought to what Trystane will do or have done to him. Dorne has just fallen off the map.

 

 

Though I'd like for Cersei to have a moment of realization that Sansa is alive and back in power in Winterfell/Riverrun/the Vale, I agree that Cersei causing her own doom by becoming paranoid about Margaery (who agreed to Joffrey's murder but would apparently have been quite content to be Tommen's queen) and escalating things until they're both destroyed is the interpretation that has the strongest support: Sansa doesn't have a clear path to becoming a queen and Dany will arrive so late that Cersei will have little left that could be taken from her.

 

I just can't fathom how to calculate Trystane in.  I'm still have trouble squaring with the fact that he's even bold (or stupid) enough to go to KL once Myrcella dies.  The only thing I would find believable is that Jamie and Bron jump off that ship (which HAS to be a Dornish ship or at least full of Dornish troops because seriously, do you send your prince to KL without his own men?  Even Ned has his own men!), the prince of Dorne turns it around and goes to demand an explanation from the Sand Snakes (if he wasn't in on it), and some merchant ship picks up Jamie and Bron and takes them back to KL.  I just can't make any version where Jamie and Trystane walk into KL arm and arm together make sense.  But I digress....

 

I was reading someone's post and it occurred to me that if I'm right about Cersei valuing youth, beauty, and power - than her attempts to take down Margaery through the Faith Militant is just another example of self-fulfilling prophesy.  Because it isn't really that Marg did anything TO Cersei, but it is her obsession with Marg that made the Walk of Shame possible.

[BlackberryJam]

Trystane could very well have gotten off the ship before Myrcella died. He might have been aware of the plan to kill her all along. 

[SeanC]

Trystane could very well have gotten off the ship before Myrcella died. He might have been aware of the plan to kill her all along. 

Doran and Trystane can't have been in on it.  Why would they allow Jaime to leave?

[polyhymnia]

I wonder if anyone is going to remember to feed those two dragons that are still in Meereen.  They feel like those fish that people forgot about when they went on vacation. 

[nksarmi]

I wonder if anyone is going to remember to feed those two dragons that are still in Meereen.  They feel like those fish that people forgot about when they went on vacation. 

I truly hope we get to see Tyrion - who has spent his whole life fascinated and reading about dragons - meet them.

[Alapaki]

Disagree on this one. Jon is far too busy dealing with the existential threat to the entire world posed by the Endless Winter coming down from the north to give a flying fig about who's sitting on the Iron Throne. If he's going to war in the North its NOT as a road to the Iron Throne, but to secure the resources needed to win against the White Walkers (and I strongly suspect that Winterfell will be THE key to it all... the narrative very nearly demands it).

 

 

Oh, I don't think Jon Snow has any interest in the Iron Throne.  He's practically the only one who has any perspective on the major bloodthirsty, undead, issue that needs to be dealt with.

 

But, the rest of Westerns appears to be either oblivious to a threat from the Others/White Walkers, or they believe they're sufficiently insulated.  

 

And an attack on the King's appointed Warden of the North is an attack on the Crown.  Tommen's failure to address it could further weaken the Throne's hold on the Riverlands, the Reach and the Vale.

 

I just can't fathom how to calculate Trystane in.  I'm still have trouble squaring with the fact that he's even bold (or stupid) enough to go to KL once Myrcella dies.  The only thing I would find believable is that Jamie and Bron jump off that ship (which HAS to be a Dornish ship or at least full of Dornish troops because seriously, do you send your prince to KL without his own men?  Even Ned has his own men!), the prince of Dorne turns it around and goes to demand an explanation from the Sand Snakes (if he wasn't in on it), and some merchant ship picks up Jamie and Bron and takes them back to KL.  I just can't make any version where Jamie and Trystane walk into KL arm and arm together make sense.  But I digress...

 

 

I don't see Trystane making it off that ship alive.  Maybe, after killing Trystane, Jaime and Bron return to Dorne to confront Doran.  Doran convinced them he wasn't involved in Mycelia's death; they both agree that the deaths of their children cancel each other out; and that Cersei is the real problem.

[nksarmi]

As I mentioned, there is NO way it makes sense for Trystane not to have tons of Dornish solders with him on that boat.  From what we can gather in season five, Trystane appears to be the ONLY heir to Dorne - he seems to even lack his sister.  So as much as the Dorne story seems to have been useless in season five, surely Doran would NOT send his only son and heir to KL (where his brother recently died!) without men to protect him on a DORNISH boat, controlled by DORNISH men.

 

So no matter what, I cannot see a way where Jamie kills Trystane or gets control of that boat.  So why in the world would Trystane be stupid enough to bring a dead Myrcella back to KL and expect to live?  He would have been weened on Oberyn's tales of evil Lannisters and what they did to his aunt and cousins.  Even if Jamie really does believe Trystane was innocent, why would the prince believe he would be safe in KL now?  Surely, he would turn the boat around and stay in Dorne would he not?

 

I am going to have to overlook a lot with this plot I think. Unless Trystane and/or Bron happen to have antidote on them and they save Mrycella's life - this plot just might make my head explode if I think about it too much.

Edited September 17, 2015 by nksarmi

[Hecate7]

I truly hope we get to see Tyrion - who has spent his whole life fascinated and reading about dragons - meet them.

 

As long as they don't give him the Quentyn Martell plot, that'd be cool.

[Haleth]

As I mentioned, there is NO way it makes sense for Trystane not to have tons of Dornish solders with him on that boat.  From what we can gather in season five, Trystane appears to be the ONLY heir to Dorne - he seems to even lack his sister.  So as much as the Dorne story seems to have been useless in season five, surely Doran would NOT send his only son and heir to KL (where his brother recently died!) without men to protect him on a DORNISH boat, controlled by DORNISH men.

 

So no matter what, I cannot see a way where Jamie kills Trystane or gets control of that boat.  So why in the world would Trystane be stupid enough to bring a dead Myrcella back to KL and expect to live?  He would have been weened on Oberyn's tales of evil Lannisters and what they did to his aunt and cousins.  Even if Jamie really does believe Trystane was innocent, why would the prince believe he would be safe in KL now?  Surely, he would turn the boat around and stay in Dorne would he not?

 

I am going to have to overlook a lot with this plot I think. Unless Trystane and/or Bron happen to have antidote on them and they save Mrycella's life - this plot just might make my head explode if I think about it too much.

You are absolutely right, but that doesn't mean the show writers won't do it anyway. :/

[Audreythe2nd]

After the news about the Northern battle and Arya still being in Braavos around 6x08, I think the Freys are going to be reintroduced as part of Jaime's story but not be defeated this season.

 

You know, I thought so too at first, but a couple of things give me pause. First, if the Freys/Riverlands are supposed to be such an important part of Jaime's story, then I don't think they would have delayed and substituted the way they have these past two seasons. It looks like whatever character development Jaime had in the RL in the books is going to be transferred to King's Landing this season. Why repeat it all again so late in the game? Secondly, the Freys seem like such small potatoes to the big scheme of things to be carried over into Season 7-8. It's also doesn't really jive with the way the show structures itself, to reintroduce previous characters like the Freys at the end of a season. I'm more inclined to speculate the following: the Freys will be reintroduced at the beginning of Season 6. Brienne and Pod will be involved, because that's who was involved in that region in the books (nevermind how they would get south when they're currently north - I just think they will). Jaime will head to that area for a reason that has more to do with Brienne than anything else (since the books have her taking him away from his men and his KG duties - the show will do some equivalent of that). But I think there will be some type of closure that we can't see right now. I realize I say this totally not knowing what happens with the Freys and the Riverlands in TWoW, but I just don't think the show is going to drag them into Season 7 territory. Whatever big thing that happens there will happen at the end of the season, and then the show will move on. That's my best guess.

 

Also, as much as the Dornish boat thing has been bugging me too, I've always known somehow that Jaime would end up back in King's Landing to start the next season (and I wanted him to, since that's where almost all of his best storyline opportunities are, aside from with Brienne), so I've made my peace with it. It's possible that Trystane himself, valuing the necessity of keeping the peace the way his father does, agrees to go to King's Landing with Jaime (who also seems to be valuing diplomacy and not starting a war) to accompany Myrcella's body as a show of good faith that he and his father had nothing to do with her death.

 

[nksarmi]

You know, thinking about if Jamie starts out in KL or on the boat - I wonder if there will be a time jump at all between seasons.  I mean, it would make the most sense to pick up exactly where they left off for Jon, Dany, Brie, and even Sansa/Theon - but that would really mean going back to the Dornish boat with Mrycella dying in Jamie's arms.  Do you think they will spend an episode or two resolving that plot - or do we think they will jump ahead and just show Jamie and Bron getting off the boat with Mrycella's body?

[magdalene]

I wish Jaime had just dreamed the entire stupid Dorne story line last season.  The only moment of it I liked was Jaime's wistful look when he sees Tarth in the distance. 

 

Like Talisa/Robb show Dorne comes across like bad fan fiction.

[Advance35]

And if anyone read it in the last 2 minutes, forget it.   It's supposedly already been proven false.   Darn, that sounded good.

 

But in terms of speculation I will say that I am beginning to agree with all the rumblings i'm hearing about this being Sansa's final year.      She's already in the North and if House Bolton falls there is absolutely nothing for Sansa to do the rest of the series.    I doubt they are going to have her character retire to Winterfell, taking care of Rickon until the conclusion of Season 8.    In my opinion if she doesn't realign with Littlefinger, then one way or another her goose is cooked this season.   This also fits with her seemingly reduced filming schedule.

 

I also think ALL the Tyrells will live this season and Kings Landing Casualties will be from the Lannister faction of the show.   The more I think about those "rumors" circulated, the only part that I could totally see happening is House Tyrell maneuvering House Lannister's fall, with a little outside help. Natch.

Edited September 26, 2015 by Advance35

[ElizaD]

The set photo of Jon wearing Stark-style clothing feels like the first time the show has spoiled the books. Of course season 5 killed Stannis/Shireen/Myrcella, but none of them seemed likely to make it to the final battle. The news about Kit sightings were similarly unspoilery since, like R+L=J, Jon's return seems to have been accepted as almost canon by the fandom. But Jon's new clothing implies that the theory that dying releases him from his vows was right. The deaths of Stannis/Shireen/Myrcella gave me the impression that because they were doomed, the show wanted to get that out of the way and killed them off in obviously different circumstances. Jon leaving the NW, on the other hand, is something that I now think is going to happen in TWOW, and before this photo there were also other theories that sounded believable.

[SeanC]

But in terms of speculation I will say that I am beginning to agree with all the rumblings i'm hearing about this being Sansa's final year.      She's already in the North and if House Bolton falls there is absolutely nothing for Sansa to do the rest of the series.    I doubt they are going to have her character retire to Winterfell, taking care of Rickon until the conclusion of Season 8.    In my opinion if she doesn't realign with Littlefinger, then one way or another her goose is cooked this season.   This also fits with her seemingly reduced filming schedule.

I don't know what you mean by "realign", but unless Littlefinger is defeated this season, that's a major part of Sansa's plotline that is unresolved (she also hasn't met Arya again, which I'm absolutely sure is going to happen; GRRM has as close as admitted that).  And as for "nothing for Sansa to do for the rest of the series", I'd call that dubious; we don't know what hardly any of the characters will do as the series becomes more White Walker-focused.  She's meant to have been learning skills that will be useful in the coming struggles; even with the Boltons gone, and even with Littlefinger gone, the politics of Westeros are far from settled.

 

Also, the Reddit rumour that Sansa dies was that she dies in episode 9, so that would not explain if she was filming less (that would only be the case if the character was killed early).

[Advance35]

Also, the Reddit rumour that Sansa dies was that she dies in episode 9, so that would not explain if she was filming less (that would only be the case if the character was killed early).

 

 

I didn't know the details of the rumor, I just saw it was something a lot of people were posting about.   And it as on ASOIAF not Reddit.     As for filming, they film out of order all the time.   IF Sansa buys it this year, she could've filmed her death scene first for all we know.   I noticed the the blog post linked above sounded a little pessimistic in regards to Sansa's future.

 

But it's all speculation at this point.

[Winnief]

We know from prophecy that Sansa's safe at least until she slays the Titan. (Aka Littlefinger.)  Beyond that I suspect she's the one Maggy warned Cersei about but nothing's certain except that Martin has *some* kind of plan for her which he just isn't finished with yet.  I think as the story evolved he realized *somebody* had to be the politician of the Stark family and decided the kid in KL was the natural one to learn that job.  Now when we're going to see the political side on display is anyone's guess. 

 

And yep it looks like Dying, freed Jon of being a Crow.  Should be fun for Kit getting to do some outfit changes!  Once he re-unites with Sansa she can start making him new clothes. 

[nksarmi]

Early on, I was concerned for Sansa when she lost her wolf.  But as the story has gone on, I "worry" for her less.  I really can't see a circumstance where her death would be more interesting or further the story more than her living.  Not everyone who survives the end of this story is going to sit the Iron Throne or rule a kingdom. Some are just going to be around to help rebuild and I can very much see Sansa helping Rickon rule in Winterfell. 

[SeanC]

As for filming, they film out of order all the time.   IF Sansa buys it this year, she could've filmed her death scene first for all we know. 

Yes, I know that they film out of order.  The point is that if Sansa were to die in episode 9, either way they would be filming a full season's worth of material for her, so that would not explain a supposedly lesser filming schedule.  If she were dying, they would have to tie up her whole story.

[Advance35]

We know from prophecy that Sansa's safe at least until she slays the Titan. (Aka Littlefinger.)  Beyond that I suspect she's the one Maggy warned Cersei about but nothing's certain except that Martin has *some* kind of plan for her which he just isn't finished with yet.  I think as the story evolved he realized *somebody* had to be the politician of the Stark family and decided the kid in KL was the natural one to learn that job.  Now when we're going to see the political side on display is anyone's guess.

 

 

I keep forgetting about that particular prophecy, sigh, it may be time for another re-read.   I read his initial draft of how he wanted this story to go and I wish he had been detailed about what exactly Sansa's fate was originally intended to be (assuming it's changed).   The only people that were supposed to survive were Jon, Bran, Arya, Tyrion and Dany if I remember correctly.

 

If you decide to scan the blog linked up thread, the blogger seems VERY pessimistic about Sansa's future.   It just struck me.   The bloggers confirms that Sophie Turner didn't/couldn't tell her anything but the blogger definitely didn't get the impression that there were brighter day's ahead for Sansa.   I just can't see GRRM/D&D letting Sansa just be Rickon's baby sitter for the remainder of the story.

 

Early on, I was concerned for Sansa when she lost her wolf.  But as the story has gone on, I "worry" for her less.  I really can't see a circumstance where her death would be more interesting or further the story more than her living.  Not everyone who survives the end of this story is going to sit the Iron Throne or rule a kingdom.

 

 

Book wise, Sansa's ongoing storyline has been one of the most unpredictable in the whole series (IMO) and I don't think it's about her potential death making anything else interesting.   I think it would be about condensing and slowly bringing down the curtain on a tale GRRM has spent decades on.   I think the only one's that are safe from this point forward are Jon, Dany, Arya, Bran and Tyrion.   Everyone else it's going to be unluck of the draw.

Edited September 27, 2015 by Advance35

[Winnief]

I get the impression that Sansa's story is the one that's evolved most for Martin from his original 'vision'.  He's publicly stated he thinks having her inform to Cersei about Ned's plan to leave was a mistake, (and that's why they didn't include it in the show,) and since then I think he's transferred some of his original plot for Arya to Sansa, like having an dynamic with Tyrion.  I think he was originally going to make Arya a romantic heroine but that clearly went out the window and so he put those elements on Sansa for whatever end happens there.  She might die soon but it would seem like bad storytelling.  I will agree that just having her baby-sit Rickon would be a waste of time, but with LF and the Lords of the Vale coming up North that opens up a LOT of possibilities.

 

Anyway, a lot of people seeing Jon in Robb's garb are thinking he's the new King of the North.  Now Jon would *never* steal Rickon's claim but what I think happens is that Jon agrees to lead the Northern forces in the name of young Rickon-and perhaps consciously or not models himself on the Young Wolf.