Season 6: Info, Casting and Spoilers

[ElizaD]

3 hours ago, Eyes High said:

HBO has updated their episode schedule to indicate that 6x08 will be running for 59 minutes.

That's so long that I wonder what will be included. Has it been definitively confirmed that Snowbowl is 6x09 like we assumed? If the battle is in 6x08, the Starks could have a couple of aftermath scenes in 6x09, but right now I can't see what that could leave Jon/Sansa in 6x10 except more aftermath scenes.

[OhOkayWhat]

@ElizaD , maybe 6x08 will be the Riverlands?

[ElizaD]

11 minutes ago, OhOkayWhat said:

@ElizaD , maybe 6x08 will be the Riverlands?

I'm expecting a Jaime/Brienne scene since they should both have reached Riverrun by then, but I think it was reported earlier that Arya will return to Westeros and be in the Riverlands in 6x10 and it would be weird to have some kind of big, screentime-consuming Red Wedding 2.0 in 6x08 two episodes before Arya shows up. Since she's going to the Riverlands, surely she'll need something to do and Frey revenge seems like the #1 answer. I don't think the battle of Meereen will be as big as Winterfell, which has gotten far more hype, and if the Wall falls this season only minor named characters can be there to witness it, so I wouldn't expect that to be a big 6x08 thing either.

[OhOkayWhat]

2 minutes ago, ElizaD said:

I'm expecting a Jaime/Brienne scene since they should both have reached Riverrun by then, but I think it was reported earlier that Arya will return to Westeros and be in the Riverlands in 6x10 and it would be weird to have some kind of big, screentime-consuming Red Wedding 2.0 in 6x08 two episodes before Arya shows up. Since she's going to the Riverlands, surely she'll need something to do and Frey revenge seems like the #1 answer. I don't think the battle of Meereen will be as big as Winterfell, which has gotten far more hype, and if the Wall falls this season only minor named characters can be there to witness it, so I wouldn't expect that to be a big 6x08 thing either.

I think we will have Riverlands scenes in 6x08 (the scenes with Lannister armies in the trailer) and also Riverlands scenes in 6x10 ( Frey and Lannister celebrating together or something).

[GrailKing]

On 4/27/2016 at 3:40 PM, ElizaD said:

I'm a believer in the Sansa hem theory and while I'm not as familiar with the swords as I am with the ladies' outfits, it would make sense for that to be Jon.

The flashbacks are the past, but as big as the Tower of Joy will be, I'm really interested in how Bran will be connected to the present and the future. Will he manage to communicate with another living Stark? Saying that Bran is like a detective also sounds good.

I think it could also be Davos, he was holding Longclaw in the promos, also I would expect a look of relief on Millisandre if that's Jon.

[SeanC]

Just from looking at comments from non-spoilered viewers, I think that Theon striking off on his own is going to be one of the more sudden plot developments in the show for them.  The writers rejigged Theon's ADWD material into a story that was all about aligning him with the Starks, between putting Sansa in place of Jeyne and all the 'sibling' talk and how the Starks were his real family -- none of that is from the books, and it reasonably would lead people to conclude that Theon's relationship to Sansa and the Starks is important going forward.  Whereas if he has a book story, it's presumably going to involve him and Asha heading off from Stannis' camp into the Iron Islands story somehow.

[Edith]

Episode 6 is 60 min! 

http://www.hbo.com/search?type=schedule&seriesIds=PMRS1663&q=GAME%2BOF%2BTHRONES

and the title for episode 5 is "The Door"

http://watchersonthewall.com/another-game-thrones-episode-title-revealed-hboasia/

Edited April 29, 2016 by Edith

[Eyes High]

1 hour ago, Edith said:

Episode 6 is 60 min! 

http://www.hbo.com/search?type=schedule&seriesIds=PMRS1663&q=GAME%2BOF%2BTHRONES

and the title for episode 5 is "The Door"

http://watchersonthewall.com/another-game-thrones-episode-title-revealed-hboasia/

Heh, I don't think anyone picked "The Door" in the WOTW episode title prediction pool. I wonder what this is referencing.

Episode 9 being 60 minutes suggests that BOTB is indeed in 6x09 and hasn't been moved.

8 hours ago, ElizaD said:

That's so long that I wonder what will be included. Has it been definitively confirmed that Snowbowl is 6x09 like we assumed? If the battle is in 6x08, the Starks could have a couple of aftermath scenes in 6x09, but right now I can't see what that could leave Jon/Sansa in 6x10 except more aftermath scenes.

Sequences have been moved around from episode to episode (it looks like the TOJ sequence was shuffled this season, as an example), but none on the stated scale of BOTB. If it was intended to go in 6x09, it will go in 6x09.

I'm guessing the reason 6x08 is similarly long is that there won't be much room in 6x09 to tell many other stories. It looks like some serious shit is going down in the Riverlands, which will probably take up a good chunk of 6x07 and 6x08. With that said, 6x09 looks like it's not intended to be a dedicated BOTB-only episode a la Blackwater. There was an episode board spotted in one of the production featurettes showing that the Mesa Roldan scenes with Dany, Tyrion, Missandei, Grey Worm, and the Unsullied were for 6x09.

As for the aftermath scenes, it seems like there are a few: the "giant busts down the door" bit and the scene in the godswood where Littlefinger is surprised by someone. The scene with Sansa in a dimly-lit room looking grim from the second trailer (and later looking at some bearded guy who may be Jon in surprise) could be at Winterfell as well, since an eagle-eyed fan spotted a grill-shaped thing in the background of the shot that looked a lot like the braziers at Winterfell seen in 6x01. That seems like a lot of aftermath for 6x09. Either the giant scene is shortly followed by Ramsay getting squashed by Wun Wun in 6x09, or the battle itself only ends with Ramsay's retreat back to Winterfell after his army is shattered in 6x09 and the actual dealing with Ramsay and figuring out what's going to happen next is part of 6x10.

I'm veeeeeeeery curious about who it is that approaches Littlefinger in the godswood.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that 6x10 is also likely to be 60+ minutes. 5x10 was 61 minutes.

Edited April 29, 2016 by Eyes High

[GrailKing]

LOL: someone sent this to Sophie:

[GrailKing]

4 hours ago, SeanC said:

Just from looking at comments from non-spoilered viewers, I think that Theon striking off on his own is going to be one of the more sudden plot developments in the show for them.  The writers rejigged Theon's ADWD material into a story that was all about aligning him with the Starks, between putting Sansa in place of Jeyne and all the 'sibling' talk and how the Starks were his real family -- none of that is from the books, and it reasonably would lead people to conclude that Theon's relationship to Sansa and the Starks is important going forward.  Whereas if he has a book story, it's presumably going to involve him and Asha heading off from Stannis' camp into the Iron Islands story somehow.

In the books he and Lady Dustin talk and they mentioned how they both wanted to be Starks, I also think Theon mentions his true father died at KL, either way there is a basis for the show to go that route; It's Sansa not Jeyne or Dustin for the show.

[glowbug]

Just because Maisie Williams doesn't show up in the Riverlands until 6x10 doesn't mean Arya doesn't arrive earlier in the season. One of Maisie Williams two truths and a lie is that Arya appears in the trailer more times than we think but we don't know it's her (presumably because she's wearing a different face). We know that's a truth based on Sophie Turner's two truths and a lie. Maybe Arya shows up in the Riverlands earlier in the season but with a different face. 

[SeanC]

25 minutes ago, GrailKing said:

In the books he and Lady Dustin talk and they mentioned how they both wanted to be Starks, I also think Theon mentions his true father died at KL, either way there is a basis for the show to go that route; It's Sansa not Jeyne or Dustin for the show.

Theon's ADWD definitely explores his conflicted feelings about the Starks, but the ultimate point is that he's not one, and cannot be one (and he never refers to Ned as his true father, as far as I recall).  GRRM pointedly does not begin with the premise that Theon's original sin is the betrayal of the Starks (as Benioff or Weiss put it); rather, his great sin is the murder of the miller's boys, for which he symbolically atones by helping to rescue Jeyne Poole, another anonymous person.  The show changes the plotline to be all about Theon reconnecting with an actual Stark and recognizing that Bran and Rickon were his real brothers, as Sansa asserts, which is not at all like the books, where Robb was the only one he felt he had any kind of positive relationship with.

[GrailKing]

29 minutes ago, SeanC said:

Theon's ADWD definitely explores his conflicted feelings about the Starks, but the ultimate point is that he's not one, and cannot be one (and he never refers to Ned as his true father, as far as I recall).  GRRM pointedly does not begin with the premise that Theon's original sin is the betrayal of the Starks (as Benioff or Weiss put it); rather, his great sin is the murder of the miller's boys, for which he symbolically atones by helping to rescue Jeyne Poole, another anonymous person.  The show changes the plotline to be all about Theon reconnecting with an actual Stark and recognizing that Bran and Rickon were his real brothers, as Sansa asserts, which is not at all like the books, where Robb was the only one he felt he had any kind of positive relationship with.

I agree, but there is a basis for it in the books, Ned Stark was his second father, and Dustin called him on it, also Robb being a brother to him and he should have died with him as far as the boys,it's hinted that at least one may be his as he got the mill woman pregnant, hence he's a kin slayer, which also could be rigged to form the brother lines that Sansa mentions.

 

ADWD

Edited April 29, 2016 by GrailKing
added bolded.

[Audreythe2nd]

3 hours ago, SeanC said:

Theon's ADWD definitely explores his conflicted feelings about the Starks, but the ultimate point is that he's not one, and cannot be one (and he never refers to Ned as his true father, as far as I recall).  GRRM pointedly does not begin with the premise that Theon's original sin is the betrayal of the Starks (as Benioff or Weiss put it); rather, his great sin is the murder of the miller's boys, for which he symbolically atones by helping to rescue Jeyne Poole, another anonymous person.  

Forgive me but, if this is the case, then I feel like it should be his original sin? I just think it makes more sense that way. 

I don't have a problem with it being framed this way, AND with his returning home to the Iron Islands either, but we'll see what kind of justification is used for that.

[SeanC]

1 hour ago, Audreythe2nd said:

Forgive me but, if this is the case, then I feel like it should be his original sin? I just think it makes more sense that way. 

It wasn't, though, because Theon didn't owe the Starks anything.  He was their hostage, not a member of the family, which GRRM never loses sight of.  That's the underlying tragedy of Theon's whole situation.  Theon's crimes were plentiful, but they would have been crimes whether he had been held at Winterfell or not.  The fact that the Starks were generally nice to him doesn't change his situation; the Lannisters would not have been entitled to Sansa's loyalty if they had been nicer to her.

Edited April 29, 2016 by SeanC

[Audreythe2nd]

46 minutes ago, SeanC said:

It wasn't, though, because Theon didn't owe the Starks anything.  He was their hostage, not a member of the family, which GRRM never loses sight of.  That's the underlying tragedy of Theon's whole situation.  Theon's crimes were plentiful, but they would have been crimes whether he had been held at Winterfell or not.  The fact that the Starks were generally nice to him doesn't change his situation; the Lannisters would not have been entitled to Sansa's loyalty if they had been nicer to her.

Be that as it may, I'm just saying that, in my opinion, this is not a change that feels disingenuous in the show. But that's probably a bit off-topic to the point of this thread. 

[bunnyblue]

The FrikiDoctor is spoiling things again. In his latest video he spoils all of episode 2. Is he right? Is he full of it? Eh, who knows. I'll post the big stuff under the spoiler tag again.

Spoiler

 

The Wall (2 scenes): The showdown between Thorne & Davos commences when suddenly Wun Wun breaks down the castle gates. Edd, Tormund, and other wildlings take control of the situtation. Edd places Thorne under arrest for killing Jon. No mention of what happens to the other mutineers. Edd, Tormund, and Davos go up to see Jon. Still dead. Final scene of the episode is Mel having her crisis of faith. Davos convinces her to try to resurrect Jon. She agrees; she washes Jon's body, throws a lock of his hair into the flames, and prays (in Valyrian) over his body. Ghost, Davos, Edd, and Tormund are the only witnesses. Nothing happens. One by one they all leave the room. Only Ghost remains, at the feet of Jon's body. Camera starts to pan away when suddenly Ghost perks up and looks over at Jon - who opens his eyes, takes a few deep breaths, and...fade to black.

Winterfell: Ramsay wants to attack Castle Black and kill Jon Snow because he knows Sansa is heading that way. Roose says they can't kill the LC of the NW and instead must rally the Northern houses. Harald Karstark pledges his loyalty (still pissed Robb killed his daddy), and Roose says they must get Houses Manderly and Umber to join them. A maester walks in and informs them Walda has had her baby. Roose assures Ramsay he is still his heir. They hug and Ramsay stabs Roose to death. No one in the room does anything about it. Ramsay tells the frightened Maester to inform the other Northern lords Roose has been poisoned to death. Next Walda encounters Ramsay in the courtyard of WF. They walk and talk a bit before Walda repeatedly asks him where is Roose. Ramsay leads her to the kennels and unleashes his hounds. Walda and baby Bolton are ripped apart by the hounds. 

Meereen: After chatting with Missandei, Grey Worm, and Varys, Tyrion goes to pay a visit to Rhaegal & Viserion. He sets down the torch, talks them for a bit, and one of the dragons approaches him. Tyrion unchains one of the dragons. The other dragon eventually goes up to him and turns his head so Tyrion can unchain him too. Tyrion does. The dragons start to stretch out and get restless so Tyrion hightails it out of there. No dragons escape.

 

A bunch of other stuff happens but I'm not typing all that out. 

Edit: Uh, I removed the link to his video because if that stuff is true, I don't want to get banned for linking to leaks. Sorry.

Edited April 30, 2016 by bunnyblue
Removed a link.

[SeanC]

Spoiler

The stuff about Davos trying to convince Mel to resurrect Jon doesn't make much sense to me.  First, why would Davos think Jon was so important as to necessitate such a step?  And second, Davos has no idea that Red Priests can resurrect people.

The stuff with the Boltons sounds incredibly fast -- and Walda giving birth already is really hard to make sense of, unless Sansa's time in the rape room lasted way longer than we've been lead to believe.

[Eyes High]

Spoiler

I will say that if Tyrion reenacts the Hiccup/Toothless bonding scene from How to Train Your Dragon with the dragons, I would be 1,000% on board with that.

Might as well share the FrikiDoctor spoils. I shared that rumour about the marriage vision that the Docmantistobogan guy claims is bullshit, so who knows?

[GrailKing]

I don't mind spoilers, but I know no Spanish.

Just double tag spoilers for those who don't.

[Audreythe2nd]

What did FrikiDoctor spoil that ended up being true before?

[bunnyblue]

11 minutes ago, Audreythe2nd said:

What did FrikiDoctor spoil that ended up being true before?

Nothing. LOL. He mostly breaks down teasers & trailers.

A few months ago he gave an overview of season 6, so I can't tell if he's lying or not yet. Someone else on this forum did some research on him and said he's some kind of minor spoiler celebrity in Spain. And, I think, Javi from L7R pointed his readers to this guy. Or something like that, my memory is foggy. But back to your question, he hasn't spoiled any episode like this before. I'm gonna wait and see if today's stuff pans out on Sunday. If it doesn't, I'll stop watching his videos. If he's correct, well, I guess I'll keep watching his videos. 

[Eyes High]

I think part of the deal with the bigger spoiler sources on the major fansites in the GOT fandom (WOTW, L7R) at least is that they don't spoil everything they know. In part, I think it's how they preserve what access they have and stop HBO from bringing the hammer down. Javi from L7R alluded in that big podcast to a number of things that he knew (big deaths, e.g.) but wasn't going to spoil. Smaller sources like random set extras can leak material anonymously without worrying about losing websites. Bigger sources who make their bread and butter by ensuring that they don't piss off HBO too, too much have no such luxury.

Basically, if this FrikiDoctor guy is one of the bigger spoiler sources, it makes no sense to me that he'd be leaking what he claims to be full episode summaries with abandon, because that's the action of someone who is fine with burning his bridges and cutting off future access to any good scoops.

[Lady S.]

Yeah, that's what I don't get, why would anyone give him Sue and Javi's secret knowledge if he was gonna spill it all on youtube? Javi will expand by answering people's questions but he still keeps stuff secret. 

Spoiler

It's possible Rams kills Roose this early, but the details about he gives sound really fishy.

[bunnyblue]

4 hours ago, SeanC said:

  Reveal hidden contents

The stuff about Davos trying to convince Mel to resurrect Jon doesn't make much sense to me.  First, why would Davos think Jon was so important as to necessitate such a step?  And second, Davos has no idea that Red Priests can resurrect people.

The stuff with the Boltons sounds incredibly fast -- and Walda giving birth already is really hard to make sense of, unless Sansa's time in the rape room lasted way longer than we've been lead to believe.

Spoiler

 

Yeah, the stuff at Winterfell seems to go down way too fast. The thing that pinged my bullshit meter is how is it that the maester informs Roose & Ramsay of Walda giving birth and then, shortly after, she's walking around outside with a newborn in her arms? 

 

At the moment, I don't know whether to believe this FrikiDoctor or not. The moment of truth will be upon him this Sunday. I want him to be telling the truth because it appears he has no qualms in spoiling everything WotW and L7R are reluctant to. And nice, in-depth spoilers are like catnip to me.

[Eyes High]

Looks like FrikiDoctor in his previous ep summary, posted two days before the episode aired, spoiled that Doran and Trystane were murdered in 6x01 and who killed them. So with that in mind...I'll summarize the rest of FrikiDoctor's spoilers, because why the hell not. I'm guessing that my Spanish is not as good as bunnyblue's, so be warned, in case this is the real deal:
 

Spoiler

Bran: Bran has a vision with Bloodraven at Winterfell. Benjen and Little Ned are sparring, watched over by the castellan (Rodrik Cassel). A girl arrives on horseback (Lyanna Stark). They talk about who's going to fight whom. One of the boys is Hodor, and he is capable of speech beyond "Hodor." Someone who appears to be Hodor's mother comes out and tells him to stop with this business of playing with nobles. Bloodraven places a hand on Bran and he comes to in the cave. Leaf is there as well as Hodor. Bran asks Hodor about how it is he came to lose his ability to speak and all Hodor has to say is "Hodor." Meera is sitting outside the cave, depressed. Leaf tells Meera that her (Meera's) role is important and tells her to go to Bran.

KL: Someone is in the streets talking shit about Cersei. He looks behind him and sees Frankengregor standing right there. Frankengregor smashes his head against the wall. Cersei wants to see Myrcella's corpse. The confrontation between Frankengregor, Cersei and the Lannister guards ends without violence. Jaime encourages Tommen to reconcile with Cersei. Jaime thinks better of hurting the HS when the other sparrows appear. Cersei and Tommen hug it out.

Meereen: Just as a gloss on what bunnyblue said, Tyrion successfully communicates with the dragons. Tyrion tells them that he's a friend of their mother. He tells them what's going on in Meereen, that he needs their help, and that Tywin had told him that dragons no longer existed. And they appear to listen to him. Varys witnesses all this. Tyrion as Dragon Whisperer is shameless fan service, but whatever, I'm here for it. Also, if this happens, the Tyrion Targaryen theory just got gasoline poured on it. Either way, there's a fandom meltdown incoming.

Braavos: Arya and the Waif fight, and the hand that grabs Arya's stick in the teaser is Jaqen's. Jaqen gives Arya the gears, and Jaqen tells Arya to follow him, and that's it.

Winterfell: FrikiDoctor confirms that the Umbers will betray the Starks. Also, that the Manderlys side with the Boltons, apparently??? Well, we know that the Manderlys don't side with the Starks, judging from the banners spotted on set on the Stark side (Mormont, Hornwood, etc.), so I guess that narrows it down. I can hear the fandom screaming bloody murder already.

Sansa/Brienne: Sansa decides to go to Castle Black. Later, she speaks to Theon and asks him what he's going to do. Theon worries that Jon will want him dead for all the wrong he's done to the Starks. Sansa promises Theon that she'll be able to explain everything to Jon and that he didn't kill Bran and Rickon. Theon is too ashamed of everything he's done and decides that he's going to go HOME. (Thus the episode title.)

Greyjoys: Scene between Balon and Yara. It's basically Balon bitching out Yara. Balon walks out on the bridge in the middle of a storm and meets an unknown man who removes his hood. It's Euron. Balon and Euron have a discussion. Balon loses his balance (not sure if Euron knocks him off) and falls to his death. Next scene is Balon's funeral.

 

Edited April 30, 2016 by Eyes High

[bunnyblue]

59 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

Looks like FrikiDoctor in his previous ep summary spoiled that Obara killed Trystane in 6x01. So with that in mind...I'll summarize the rest of FrikiDoctor's spoilers, because why the hell not. I'm guessing that my Spanish is not as good as bunnyblue's, so be warned, in case this is the real deal:
 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Bran: Bran has a vision with Bloodraven at Winterfell. Benjen and Little Ned are sparring, watched over by the castellan (Rodrik Cassel). A girl arrives on horseback (Lyanna Stark). They talk about who's going to fight whom. One of the boys is Hodor, and he is capable of speech beyond "Hodor." Someone who appears to be Hodor's mother comes out and tells him to stop with this business of playing with nobles. Bloodraven places a hand on Bran and he comes to in the cave. Leaf is there as well as Hodor. Bran asks Hodor about how it is he came to lose his ability to speak and all Hodor has to say is "Hodor." Meera is sitting outside the cave, depressed. Leaf tells Meera that her (Meera's) role is important and tells her to go to Bran.

KL: Someone is in the streets talking shit about Cersei. He looks behind him and sees Frankengregor standing right there. Frankengregor smashes his head against the wall. Cersei wants to see Myrcella's corpse. The confrontation between Frankengregor, Cersei and the Lannister guards ends without violence. Jaime encourages Tommen to reconcile with Cersei. Jaime thinks better of hurting the HS when the other sparrows appear. Cersei and Tommen hug it out.

Meereen: Just as a gloss on what bunnyblue said, Tyrion successfully communicates with the dragons. Tyrion tells them that he's a friend of their mother. He tells them what's going on in Meereen, that he needs their help, and that Tywin had told him that dragons no longer existed. And they appear to listen to him. Tyrion as Dragon Whisperer is shameless fan service, but whatever, I'm here for it.

Braavos: Arya and the Waif fight, and the hand that grabs Arya's stick in the teaser is Jaqen's. Jaqen gives Arya the gears, and Jaqen tells Arya to follow him, and that's it.

Winterfell: He confirms that the Umbers will betray the Starks. Also, that the Manderlys side with the Boltons, apparently??? Well, we know that the Manderlys don't side with the Starks, judging from the banners spotted on set on the BOTB side, so I guess that narrows it down. I can hear the fandom screaming bloody murder already.

Sansa/Brienne: Sansa decides to go to Castle Black. Later, she speaks to Theon and asks him what he's going to do. Theon worries that Jon will want him dead for all the wrong he's done to the Starks. Sansa promises Theon that she'll be able to explain everything to Jon and that he didn't kill Bran and Rickon. Theon is too ashamed and decides that he's going to go HOME.

Greyjoys: Scene between Balon and Yara. It's basically Balon bitching out Yara. Balon walks out on the bridge in the middle of a storm and meets an unknown man who removes his hood. It's Euron. Balon and Euron have a discussion. Balon loses his balance (not sure if Euron knocks him off) and falls to his death. Next scene is Balon's funeral.

 

I didn't know he had spoiled episode 1 in its entirety too. He posted the video on Friday 4/22. I just watched it and you're right, he did specifically say that Obara would be the one to kill Trystane. He also said that Ellaria would stab Doran in the chest. I don't think those details were leaked on Reddit or by that script-like thing that was also floating around last weekend. In the video. he also said that Jorah & Daario would easily find Dany's ring in the middle of that big-ass circle made by the Dothraki horde. Maybe this guy actually has a legit spoiler source. We'll find out in less than 2 days.

[WearyTraveler]

Spanish is my mother tongue, so, I've watched the video and here are a few more details as reported by Frikidoctor.

The Wall

Spoiler

• Wun Wun breaks through the door right before Thorne gets into the room where Jon and his companions are.  He kills one man on his path. Another one puts an arrow on his back, but this doesn't seem to affect Wun Wun in the least.  He takes the man and slams him against the Wall.
• Thormund also kills a NW redshirt.
• The rest of Thorne supporters depose their weapons, recognizing defeat
• Thorne and Edd have a talk where Thorne accuses Edd of being a traitor, Edd answers that Ser Alliser is the traitor because he killed the Lord Commander.  Then they arrest Thorne and take him away (presumably to an ice cell or whatever functions as a prison in the show version of Castle Black)
• Thormund and Edd go into the chamber where Jon is to see his body because Thormund wanted to (FD's exact words were "because Thormund had not seen him dead yet").  So they go in very solemnly and see Jon's dead body (I'm sure Thormund's reaction to this scene is going to slay me)

King's Landing

Spoiler

• Opens with commoners talking in the street. One of them making jokes about Queen Cersei along the lines of "the Queen is a whore, I saw her naked, look at the Royal family we have!". The other commoners laugh at his jokes. Eventually, the one telling the jokes leaves. He decides to go into an alley to pee, as he's doing so, he feels someone behind him, and when he turns he finds FrankenGregor, who smashes his head against the wall in front of which the man was peeing.
• Cersei, with the Mountain behind her asks some guards to get out of her way, they say it's the King's orders.  Jaimie and Tommen are in the sept with Myrcella's body and Cersei wants to go in to see her but Tommen ordered that she not be allowed in the sept. There's a tense moment, but Cersei turns around and leaves, the Mountain follows, and the guards are visible relieved that they didn't have to fight him.
• Inside the sept Jaimie and Tommen are having a conversation next to Myrcella's body.  Jaimie says he's sorry he couldn't do anything more for Myrcella, but he also scolds Tommen (FD doesn't say what exactly Tommen is being scolded for).  Tommen says he's sorry he couldn't do anything more for Queen Margaery, whom he is obsessed with. Jaimie says "son" what you have to fix is the relationship with your mother, your mother was imprisoned and you didn't do anything for her, you didn't want to see her. 
• Apparently Tommen calls Jaimie Dad when he's defending himself from these accusations.  Jaimie says that to add insult to injury, Tommen has ordered that Cersei not be allowed in the sept.  Jaimie tells Tommen he can't do that and that he should reconcile with Cersei because she would give her life for his (Tommen's).
• Tommen is apparently shaken by this and seems to be taking it into consideration.  Then he leaves
• Then the High Sparrow comes in and Jaimie asks him what sort of penance should he pay for incarcerating the Queen.  They talk about blood being spilled in the sept (convo from sneak peeks and previews).  Then Jaimie reaches for his sword but stops himself when all the sparrows surround him.  The High Sparrow tells him that they are poor and that they don't have any weapons but that they are also many, and many can overthrow an empire.
• Tommen goes to Cersei and asks for her forgiveness.  At first she's cold but they end up embracing.  This is apparently the seed for the future Lannister revenge.

Mereen

Spoiler

• Varys, Missandei and Grey Worm are at the pyramid.  They are discussing that in the cities around Mereen, the Slave Masters have regained their power and are once more in command, that Mereen is in danger, and that Daenerys has gained lots of enemies during her conquest.  Apparently they are concerned about the fleet burning, not because Dany couldn't sail to Westeros without it, but because it appears that without a fleet Mereen is weaker (I don't remember the show ever making a point about a fleet being necessary for the city's defenses, but they are making it so now).
• Tyrion says they have dragons.  But he also says that they don't fare well in captivity.  Missandei asks him how he knows this and Tyrion says it what he does: drink and know things.
• Tyrion heads out to the dragons' dungeon (pit, cell, pyramid, I don't know what they're calling it in the show).  He's mesmerized watching the dragons.  They are angry and restless, roaring and moving about.
• Tyrion leaves the torch on the floor and starts talking to the dragons.  He says he's their mother's friend and that seems to calm them some.  One of them comes closer to smell Tyrion. He starts telling the Dragons about their situation in Mereen and that they need their help. The dragons seem to understand him and get calmer as he speaks. Tyrion says his father told him dragons were extinct but here he is talking to two of them.  Then he releases the collar of one dragon, the other one offers his neck and Tyrion releases that one too.
• The dragons begin to stretch and feel their freedom and Tyrion hightails it out there, suddenly scared that they might turn violent again.  Varys is waiting for him at the exit.

Braavos

Spoiler

• Arya is training with the Waif, fighting with the sticks while blind. Jaqen's hand that stops Arya's stick. He seems satisfied with Arya's training, and then he asks he "Who are you?".  She says "No one". They do this several times.  Apparently Jaqen is starting to believe her and asks her to follow him and they both set off to parts unknown.

Winterfell

Ok, I'm gonna take a break from watching, pausing, typing, and go walk my dog (who looks like  a direwolf!) and then I'll come back and finish.

Edited April 30, 2016 by WearyTraveler

[SeanC]

Spoiler

Regarding the Manderlys, that would set up the "Fletcher" lord who gives a long speech indicating that he is changing sides, who sounds like Manderly.  Though I agree the lack of reports of Manderly banners at the battle is weird (there aren't any reports of them on the Bolton side either; reports always said it was Bolton + Karstark + Umber).

Also, if that report of the death of Walda and Bolton Jr. is correct, then I'm absolutely certain that the correct version of Ramsay's death as reported is the one where he's fed to his own hounds.

Edited April 30, 2016 by SeanC

[Edith]

Spoiler

If this is true then I can see the meltdown of the fandom after next episode.

• Tyrion Targaryen! especially is Viserion is the first dragon to approach.
• Dany as Azor Ahai! if Jon comes back like Beric and LSH then there is not doubt that Dany is the champion of fire (sounds logical). Also I don't see Melisandre staying with Jon if this happens. Maybe she goes to the free cities to find the champion, Arya sees her again and kill her? (far fetched I know).

Episode 3 could be about Jon. if there's not pyre or "his watch has ended" then a lot of people would consider him an outbreaker, especially the northern lords, which could be why is Sansa and Davos rallying the north.

Also L7R reported an scene of Jon convincing the Wildlings to fight with him against the Boltons, if Ramsay kills Roose and Walda this episode then I can see a certain letter as the reason for it. My only doubt is if he send it before or after receiving his "gift".

Edited April 30, 2016 by Edith

[SeanC]

9 minutes ago, Edith said:

  Hide contents

Dany as Azor Ahai! if Jon comes back like Beric and LSH then there is not doubt that Dany is the champion of fire (sounds logical).

Why?

[Edith]

25 minutes ago, SeanC said:

Why?

Spoiler

Always expected that his resurrection would be a little different but I guess it could still work.

Smoke from the pyres of the people that died after the Wildlings stormed the castle? 

Actually now that I think about it maybe there's something that could give us a clue in Melisandre prayer!

Either way I think a big spoiler is coming our way about AA. If is Jon or Dany or both! Or maybe the three heads of the dragons

 

[WearyTraveler]

All right, I'm back; so...

Winterfell

Spoiler

• A meeting is taking place in one of Winterfell's halls.  Roose is seated (presumably in the room's high chair or at the head of the table), Ramsay is there, and there are a bunch of other lords loyal to the Boltons in attendance. Harald Karstark is there.
• The first topic of discussion is Sansa's escape.  Ramsay is convinced that she will go to Castle Black to see her brother, and says everyone else knows that too. He proposes to take some troops to Castle Black, storm the castle and kill Jon Snow. Roose points out that if he kills the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, a mostly Northern institution which takes no part and is in charge of defending the realm, he would find the North against him.
• Roose says what Ramsay needs to do is seek alliances, and then he points out they already have an alliance with the Karstarks.  Harald confirms that after what happened between Robb and his father, they are pro-Bolton.
• At the meeting it is proposed that the Boltons seek to forge alliances with the Umbers and the Manderleys.  contending that with such a huge military force, they would be able to bend the North (Note from me: DF doesn't say the Manderleys will ally with the Boltons, only that the Boltons will seek this alliance, I suspect the Manderleys will deny the request in no uncertain terms).
• At this point DF suggests that the gift Ramsay will get is Rickon, who is staying with the Umber, as many have theorized, but he doesn't say this is part of the episode.  He does confirm that the Umbers will betray the Starks (although he doesn't specify when this will happaen) and says it pains him to say that.
• A maester enters the room and announces that Walda has given birth to a boy.  Ramsay congratulates Roose (in my head, I'm hearing "Danger, Will Robinson! Danger!!") and says he's looking forward to meeting his brother.   Roose stands up and Ramsay asks him to hug him, congratulating him again for the happy news. Roose tells Ramsay not to worry about Walda's son because Ramsay will always be his first born. They hug and Ramsay stabs Roose with a dagger in the stomach (DF says it's the liver, to be precise). Roose looks at Ramsay and falls to the floor, dead.
• None of the witnesses does a thing. The maester is flabbergasted.  Ramsay cleans the dagger and instructs the maester to send ravens to all the Northern houses announcing that Roose is dead, poisoned by his enemies.  The maester is still in shock and one of the meeting's attendees asks him what's wrong and if he didn't hear the Lord (meaning the new Lord of House Bolton).  Ramsay asks the maester "How did he die?" and the maester replies "poisoned".
• Later in the yard, Walda approaches Ramsay while she's carrying her newborn baby.  She's asking Ramsay if he'd like to see his brother.  Ramsay says yes and congratulated Walda. He asks her if he can hold the baby and Walda agrees. Ramsay holds his brother, looks at him and gives him back to Walda.  They continue talking and Walda asks where Roose is, to which Ramsay replies in non-answers.  Meanwhile, their walk is heading to the kennels.  Ramsay enters the kennels and Walda follows, still asking about Roose.  Ramsay opens the doors of two kennels.  Then Walda asks "Where is Lord Bolton?", Ramsay says "I am Lord Bolton".  He then whistles some special code (one presumes) and the dogs attack Walda and the baby, killing them and eating them. 

Sansa and Brienne

Spoiler

• Sansa and Brienne are having a conversation while sitting by a fire in the woods.  They discuss Arya, and Sansa wants to know what happened to her sister. Brienne tells her that she was with The Hound but that she lost sight of her. It's not clear if she tells her that she "killed" the Hound.
• Then the conversation shifts to what they should now.  Sansa says they should go to Castle Black to see her brother Jon. So, it's decided that's what they should do.
• Sansa talks to Theon and asks him what he wants to do, since they have decided to go to Castle Black to see Jon.  Theon says that he has done so many bad things to the Starks and has betrayed them so badly that, if Jon sees him, he'll want to kill him, and rightly so (meaning Theon agrees that he deserves death).  Sansa says she will explain to Jon that Theon didn't really kill Bran and Rickon and that she'd intercede for Theon.  But Theon is ashamed of his deeds and his behaviour and says he has to go home.
•  

The Iron Islands

Spoiler

• There's  a conversation between Yara and Balon. More than a conversation, it's a rant from Balon who is angry that Yara didn't rescue Theon.  He says she's wasted her time and to look at the mess the North is in.  Then he thinks the current chaos may actually be an opportunity.
• Later that night there's a storm and Balon is crossing one of the many bridges in his castle when he meets a man at the end of the bridge wearing a coat and a cowl.  The man pulls back the cowl to reveal he's Euron Greyjoy.  They greet each other and Balon asks him if it's true he cut out the tongues of all the members of his crew.  Euron says he did, in keeping with the name of his boat. Euron tells Balon that he (Balon) is done, and that new blood is needed.  They talk about the drowned God.
• During this conversation, Euron has remained still on his side of the bridge and Balon has been coming closer. Euron says he is the drowned God. The bridge is rocking because of the storm, and Euron helps it along by rocking it harder. Balon loses his footing and falls to his death.
• The next scene is Balon's funeral, which involves putting the body in a ship, pushing it out into the sea, Viking style.  Yara looks sad.

Final Scenes at The Wall

Spoiler

• Melisandre, wearing her glamour is talking to Davos in front of a chimney fire.  Mel recaps all the visions she had seen in the flames and says she was wrong about all of them. She seems down on herself.
• Davos tells her that he's seen her do extraordinary things and that he believes in miracles because of her.  Apparently Davos is asking her to perform a miracle (I'm not liking this at all....ugh!).  He encourages her to go see Jon's body, which they do.
• They go to the room where Jon's body is.  Apparently he's half naked (funeral ritual? eye candy for the ladies? necessary for the resurrection? teasing the fans who think Mel will fuck Jon back to life?), and Thormund, Edd and Ghost are there.  Mel washes Jon's body and cleans his wounds. She cuts some of his hair and throws it in the fire. And she sets out to perform a resurrection ritual on Jon. She places her hands above Jon's chest without actually touching it and starts reciting some prayer in Valyrian, over and over again. 
• Nothing seems to be happening.  Mel looks at Davos, doubtful of herself and the ritual.  Davos signals her to continue with his eyes.  She does, but eventually becomes desperate and begs the Lord of Light to resurrect Jon. She stops trying.
• Edd and Thormund leave. Then Mel leaves.  Davos looks at Jon's body and leaves too. Only Ghost remains.  The camera pans back. Then Ghost turns his head and perks his ears.  We see Jon's body from above. Jon opens his eyes with an intake of breath and hyperventilates. 6 times.

[WearyTraveler]

1 hour ago, SeanC said:

Why?

Yeah, I don't think so either. 

Spoiler

The series is "A song of Ice and Fire".  Rhaegar says to Elia, of Aegon, that he was "the prince that was promised" and that "his is the song of Ice and Fire".  We know that at first Rhaegar thought this was meant to be him, then he thinks it's his son Aegon.  But Aegon's head was smashed.  So, that leaves Dany and Jon, but Dany has no ice in her, only Jon does.  I think these are clear indications that Jon is AA.

Edited April 30, 2016 by WearyTraveler

[SeanC]

Spoiler

Most of this sounds fine, but unless there's some details really being lost in translation here, Davos being the impetus to resurrect Jon makes no sense to me based on what has previously been established about his character.

[WearyTraveler]

1 minute ago, SeanC said:

  Hide contents

Most of this sounds fine, but unless there's some details really being lost in translation here, Davos being the impetus to resurrect Jon makes no sense to me based on what has previously been established about his character.

I agree.  At the end DF seemed to be quite happy that he was right

Spoiler

regarding Mel being the one to resurrect Jon.  Apparently many of his followers on YT kept telling him that it wasn't her, or that it shouldn't be her, and he was quite pleased to confirm that it was indeed her.  I'm hoping it plays out differently because I really don't get Davo's motivations here,  Unless they are playing it as if he doesn't know Shireen and Stannis are dead, or they have a conversation regarding that.  Davos hasn't seen the WW, right?

I love that he's backing Jon now, but I don't know why.  Wouldn't he ask Mel to resurrect Stannis first?

[SeanC]

14 minutes ago, WearyTraveler said:

I agree.  At the end DF seemed to be quite happy that he was right

  Hide contents

regarding Mel being the one to resurrect Jon.  Apparently many of his followers on YT kept telling him that it wasn't her, or that it shouldn't be her, and he was quite pleased to confirm that it was indeed her.  I'm hoping it plays out differently because I really don't get Davo's motivations here,  Unless they are playing it as if he doesn't know Shireen and Stannis are dead, or they have a conversation regarding that.  Davos hasn't seen the WW, right?

I love that he's backing Jon now, but I don't know why.  Wouldn't he ask Mel to resurrect Stannis first?

Spoiler

If the writers were going to go this route this Davos, they really should have sent Davos to Hardhome with Jon as naval commander to flesh out the interactions between them, instead of having him on Stannis' march (where his role is ultimately insignificant). 

[GrailKing]

WRT the title The Door it reminded me of this song:

 

HERMAN'S HERMITS LYRICS

"This Door Swings Both Ways"
 

Everyone's life is bittersweet
It's a door that opens wide
And no man can call himself complete
'Til he's seen it from both sides

This door swings both ways
It's marked 'in' and 'out'
Some days you'll want to cry
And some days you will shout

This door swings both ways
It goes back and forth
In comes a southern breeze
Or a cold wind from the north

This door swings both ways
Lets in joy and pain
In comes the morning sun
And then the evening rain

This door swings both ways
Lets in dark and light
Every day you make the choice
To let in wrong or right

When shadows fall
You must prepare yourself for sunshine
For everything there is an end
And so my friend you must be brave

This door swings both ways
Which one will it be?
Will we live in happiness
Or dwell in misery?

This door swings both ways
Lets in earth and sky
Make the most of livin'
If you're not prepared to die
Make the most of livin'
If you're not prepared to die

 

[CofCinci]

I like spoilers... But man, I'm not used to them being this detailed. What an exciting episode!

[Alayne Stone]

Hmm, just read the spoilers.

 

 

Isn't Bran supposed to be in this episode? I didn't see anything on him and Bloodraven unless I missed something. And if these are true and Jon is resurrected at the end of ep 2, that will be one thing I am actually happy about with the show because I was worried they would drag it out for several episodes. The internet will no doubt explode afterwards.

Edited April 30, 2016 by Alayne Stone

[Eyes High]

Alayne Stone:

Spoiler

If you scroll upthread, I posted about Bran's scene. Sounds like nothing huge happens, other than the revelation that Hodor once had the power of communicating beyond one word and lost it somehow.

[WearyTraveler]

31 minutes ago, Alayne Stone said:

Hmm, just read the spoilers.

 

  Hide contents

Isn't Bran supposed to be in this episode? I didn't see anything on him and Bloodraven unless I missed something. And if these are true and Jon is resurrected at the end of ep 2, that will be one thing I am actually happy about with the show because I was worried they would drag it out for several episodes. The internet will no doubt explode afterwards.

 

9 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

Alayne Stone:

  Hide contents

If you scroll upthread, I posted about Bran's scene. Sounds like nothing huge happens, other than the revelation that Hodor once had the power of communicating beyond one word and lost it somehow.

Yeah, at the beginning of this video DF says he had already spoiled the opening scene on Wednesday, so I skipped that part

[GrailKing]

Maybe Hodor saw something that scared the daylights out of him???

[bunnyblue]

Alright, so I've read everyone's comments of the BIG spoilers, and I've got comments on those comments:

Spoiler

 

I don't think Jon not meeting the criteria of being reborn among salt & smoke means he's not AA or the PtwP. Hasn't GRRM stated that prophesies shouldn't be taken too literally? I think the important thing is that R'hollor brings him back and he will continue his fight against the White Walkers. Dany meets some of the criteria and so does Jon, they can both be the saviors.

I'm a little bothered, though, that the Night's Watch won't do the whole "And now his watch is ended" ritual in order to release Jon from his vows. I don't want him to be called an oathbreaker. I don't doubt Jon 2.0 will still be all about stopping the army of the dead, I just wanted him to do it fighting for House Stark and not as the member of the Night's Watch. 

I can't wait to see the fandom explode, one way or the other, over Tyrion being the Dragon Whisperer. I can accept his ability to tame the dragons is simply because he was fascinated with them as a child and read all about them. But if the explanation is because he's a Targaryen, I'll be satisfied with that answer too. I just want an explanation for why he's not roasted by R&V. 

This episode sounds like a complete joy! Well, except for the King's Landing stuff. Ramsay goes totally over the edge, Jon's get resurrected, we get more Ghost, AND we 2 dragons! I can't wait for tomorrow.

 

[SeanC]

1 minute ago, bunnyblue said:

Alright, so I've read everyone's comments of the BIG spoilers, and I've got comments on those comments:

  Hide contents

I'm a little bothered, though, that the Night's Watch won't do the whole "And now his watch is ended" ritual in order to release Jon from his vows. I don't want him to be called an oathbreaker. I don't doubt Jon 2.0 will still be all about stopping the army of the dead, I just wanted him to do it fighting for House Stark and not as the member of the Night's Watch. 

I can't wait to see the fandom explode, one way or the other, over Tyrion being the Dragon Whisperer. I can accept his ability to tame the dragons is simply because he was fascinated with them as a child and read all about them. But if the explanation is because he's a Targaryen, I'll be satisfied with that answer too. I just want an explanation for why he's not roasted by R&V. 

Spoiler

On the first point, I'm pretty sure you're released from your vows upon dying.  "And now his watch is ended" is just a ceremonial acknowledgement.  Though book!Jon decided to break his vows at the end of ADWD anyway.

Regarding the Tyrion parentage theories, I don't think the show has ever brought up the idea that you need to have Targaryen/Valyrian blood to ride a dragon.

[WearyTraveler]

2 hours ago, GrailKing said:

WRT the title The Door it reminded me of this song:

 

HERMAN'S HERMITS LYRICS

"This Door Swings Both Ways"
 

Everyone's life is bittersweet
It's a door that opens wide
And no man can call himself complete
'Til he's seen it from both sides

This door swings both ways
It's marked 'in' and 'out'
Some days you'll want to cry
And some days you will shout

This door swings both ways
It goes back and forth
In comes a southern breeze
Or a cold wind from the north

This door swings both ways
Lets in joy and pain
In comes the morning sun
And then the evening rain

This door swings both ways
Lets in dark and light
Every day you make the choice
To let in wrong or right

When shadows fall
You must prepare yourself for sunshine
For everything there is an end
And so my friend you must be brave

This door swings both ways
Which one will it be?
Will we live in happiness
Or dwell in misery?

This door swings both ways
Lets in earth and sky
Make the most of livin'
If you're not prepared to die
Make the most of livin'
If you're not prepared to die
 

The first thing that popped into my head was Dany's Red Door from the books, then The House of Black and White's door.  Maybe one of them will be referenced?

[WearyTraveler]

13 hours ago, Lady S. said:

Yeah, that's what I don't get, why would anyone give him Sue and Javi's secret knowledge if he was gonna spill it all on youtube? Javi will expand by answering people's questions but he still keeps stuff secret. 

  Reveal hidden contents

It's possible Rams kills Roose this early, but the details about he gives sound really fishy.

Perhaps is a sanctioned way to manage spoilers.  The fact that the first 4 episodes of s5 leaked still stings, I think.  It appears that FD is spoiling stuff fairly close to air date, so maybe they figure this would be a way to calm spoiler hounds without too much risk of everything spilling out way before it airs.

[ElizaD]

Winterfell:

So, Ramsay

does get almost the whole season to torture Rickon since the gift can't be Walda's baby, and the final thrill will be that the plot ends Jon/Sansa failing to save his life. Abandoned by the Umbers, Sansa raped by Ramsay and Rickon spending weeks or months as his terrified captive, about to lose the battle when Littlefinger arrives with the Vale army - the Starks are going to spend their "triumphant" season looking absolutely pathetic, beaten and degraded by Ramsay in every possible way until they're saved by the man who betrayed Ned. If Jon can't even manage to out-general and defeat Ramsay when he's fighting right outside his childhood home, he should have no chance against the Night's King. So it's up to Dany to be the savior then. Seriously, Jon will be resurrected only to be beaten by Ramsay and saved from the consequences of his own idiocy by the Vale army: that's absolute humiliation.

.

Bran:

I'm actually glad that it won't be revealed what happened to Hodor. That never really felt like something that needed a flashback and this way it'll remain a nice little mystery. Not getting all the answers makes the world seem a little bigger

.

Jon:

So he's awake but no one knows? I wonder how he'll make his dramatic entrance: surely the others can't find out he's been resurrected when Jon just casually walks into a room? I really like the idea that Davos could have gone to Hardhome with Jon, even though that would have meant not getting one last sweet scene with him and Shireen

.

Tyrion:

If there's no explanation for why he can interact with the dragons and no one ever mentions the Tyrion Targaryen theory, for which there hasn't been a single scene of setup on the show that's been preparing for R+L=J for seasons, I expect people will still keep on believing in A+J=T rather than accepting that non-Targs can ride dragons. I just hope GRRM has said no to the idea that only a single speshul royal bloodline can save the world

.

[Eyes High]

Tyrion:

 

 

It sounds as if Tyrion doesn't use any special techniques with the dragons other than talking with them. It's not a Hiccup/Toothless situation where Tyrion studies the dragons' behaviour and reasons out from there. Nor even is it a Nettles/Sheepstealer situation where he bribes a dragon with food to establish a bond. He just talks to them, and they respond to him as if he's an old friend.

Tyrion being a Targaryen at least would be an actual explanation for Tyrion effortlessly having a better rapport with the dragons than their mom. The alternative, that a non-Targ is so gifted that he can easily accomplish what even a blood Targaryen cannot, makes TV Tyrion into even more of a Gary Stu than he already is.

Edited April 30, 2016 by Eyes High

[SeanC]

4 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

Tyrion:

 

  Hide contents

Tyrion being a Targaryen at least would be an actual explanation for Tyrion effortlessly having a better rapport with the dragons than their mom. The alternative, that a non-Targ is so gifted that he can easily accomplish what even a blood Targaryen cannot, makes TV Tyrion into even more of a Gary Stu than he already is.

Spoiler

The weird thing is, Dany seemed to have a pretty good handle on them when she had one of the Old Masters BBQ'd.  They did exactly what she wanted them to, and didn't harm her or any of her men.