The Returned (US) - General Discussion

[peaceknit]

Thank you so much, otto! i really appreciate it!

[editorgrrl]

For a while, I thought the dam would wipe everyone out and they would move on to likable  characters next season.  

 

Me, too!

 

Ben says he liked Lena better because she put out.  So Camille bangs Ben, and Lena feels it happening (the opposite of what happened during the bus crash).  Should A&E really be showing this because Camille is supposed to be 16?

 

Camille finishes banging Ben, and rolls off him.  When she tries to talk to him he doesn't respond because he's dead.  Camille banged Ben to death.  When Peter banged Claire she didn't die, and when Simon banged Rowan she didn't die -- so maybe it was the 'shrooms that killed Ben.  Or magical twin powers.

 

At this point in time, the black water starts to back up the drains in the bar, similar to the previous episode when Lucy noticed it after banging Jack upstairs (with still no idea what could be causing this?).

 

Well, when you put it that way, it reads as if "banging" makes the sinks back up with black goo. (And I totally agree that Camille's sex scene was kiddie pornish.)

 

If you have cable you'll be able to see the superior "Les Revenants" on the Sundance Channel which bought the rights and will be airing it later this year before they premiere season 2. Yes the scenery was nice but if you watch I think you'll be pleasantly surprised it's even better in the French Alps.

 

Yay! I rarely (never?) watch stuff with subtitles, but I'm interested to see how the French handled the material. I watched the first season of Resurrection (the ABC drama starring Omar Epps) and hated it.

 

I still sort of want to know why Simon is the only one who looks super pale. Or maybe he just is/was? But it looks enhanced to me and like he's made up to look dead when the others clearly are not.

 

I handwaved that Simon is pale because he's a goth. HIs Byronesque curls & his clothes also gave me that impression—I didn't realize he was dressed for his wedding. Plus, he's a musician.

[ottoDbusdriver]

It's been canceled -- no big surprise since this remake paled in comparison to the French version.  Well done Carlton Cuse, well done.  

 

Seriously, they should have just dubbed the original French version into English and removed the subtitles, it would have been way better for American audiences than this re-imagination tangent that this series took after Episode 5.

 

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2015/06/15/the-returned-cancelled-by-ae-after-one-season/417657/

 

Can't wait for Season 2 of the French version.

Edited June 15, 2015 by ottoDbusdriver

[dbklmt]

OttoDbusdriver, you beat me to the punch and what you wrote was exactly what I would have posted.  Bring on Season 2 of Les Revenants, the one and only The Returned which began filming on June 3, 2015.

http://tvline.com/2015/06/15/john-ridley-presence-pilot-ordered-abc/#more-619799

 

Here's some info on Season 2 and a plot synopsis.

http://www.ibtimes.com/returned-canceled-ae-does-les-revenants-synopsis-reveal-failed-season-2-plans-1967826

Edited June 16, 2015 by dbklmt

[nobody30]

I just finished watching the US version and the French version as well, and I'm kind of glad that I watched the US version first, because that made me wanting to watch the french version too, whoch is indeed better, as many of you have pointed out. Altough I didn't think the US version was that bad at all, but I can see why anybody would be dissapointed by it if you have watched the French version first.

 

In comparison I'd say that I thought that the casting choice for Lena didn't really play out that well in the US version (I mean they are supposed to be identical twins 4 years apart in age), and the relationship between the sisters was portrayed much better in the French version. I thought Victor was pretty creepy in the US version too, but in another way, kind of cutomized for US television, as he was kind of dehumanized (in the tradition of "Village of The Damned" maybe). In the French version Victor is just one of The Returned, sometimes afraid, but with some kind of special powers that he uses to hurt people, maybe like a confused child soul would do in such a situation. In the US version you sometimes get the impression that he is the mastermind behind it all, and some kind of evil ghost rather than on of The Returned.

 

The only thing where I definetley preferred the US version was the Simon-Rowan storyline/ relationship compared to Simon-Adele. I thought that the adaptions made in the storyline of the US version were actually pretty clever, especially closing the age gap between the two, which makes Simon much more of a real threat to Tommy, than in the French version to Thomas (he is much more a ghost from the past there). And I have to say that the actress that played Rowan really killed it for me in her  scenes, that was a highlight of the US version for sure. And whereas Thomas is portrayed as a caring fiance that is afraid of the whole situation, Tommy rather seemed like a creepy control freak to me (even though they both installed cameras) and kind of an ass too. The french Simon ia much more creepy, especially at the end. But I liked the adaptation made in US version when it comes to Simon's suicide, because of small differences in plot and dialogue you get the feeling that maybe Simon didn't kill himself, but Tommy could have done it.

 

Whereas the priest tells Thomas in the french version to lie to Adele about Simon's suicide, Tommy spins that "lie" in the US version himself. Tommy tells Rowan that he fell in love with her first sight, no word of that in the french version, which makes you wonder if the first sight didn't take place in the church at her wedding day but earlier, and he may got Simon out of his way. And whereas Simon gets himself shot by Thomas in the french version on purpose, because he didn't want to live anymore, Tommy shoots Simon in the US version kind of without need, kind of waiting for him to give him a reason. You see in which driection the clues are going here, I kind of enjoyed that.

 

The greatest bummer of the US version was the finale though, that was really aweful. Camille banging the life out of Ben, riding him wildly like a bull was anitclimactic, I mean I know we are supposed to think evil forces are at work, but she is supposed to be 15 or 16 and it's her first time, wtf? And the last scene with Simon, what are we supposed to think, it was all a dream, he can stop time, wth?

 

But I'm kind of glad too, because that way it was easier to let go of the US version, since it's definetly not renewed and Netflix isn't picking it up either, that way I can enjoy S2 of the french version this fall even more, which I'm really looking forward to, I thought the finale was awesome!

[dbklmt]

For anyone that has never seen the original The Returned, the French Les Revenants it will debut on The Sundance Channel beginning Sunday, October 18th.  All 9 episodes will be run beginning at 3 am in my time zone (PDT) with the first and the last ending at 12:45 pm.  Sure they will repeat them again before Season 2 debuts in the U.S. on Halloween, October 31st.  So excited to revisit season 1 again before seeing what happens in season 2!

[wayne67]

Agree.  I prefer the low-key reaction about dead people coming back--who wants to watch that level of hysteria over and over? 

 

While I don't want hysteria, it would be nice to have people reacting with a bit more confusion, surprise or other human emotions. At the very least asking a few questions about their death, afterlife and current situation would provide some useful information for the audience. Stuff like how you've been sleeping? any nightmares about death? was there a heaven/hell/limbo ?

 

It'd be like someone coming from war and everyone being too polite/intimidated to ask how it was. Humans don't tend to be that reserved. 

 

It's not like the revenants have to answer the questions but it'd be nice if someone asked. It would make the situation seem more realistic at the very least.

[wayne67]

I definitely don't believe he killed himself and not knowing the background wonder if the cop was already obsessed with Rowan and somehow caused the accident and swooped on in and took advantage of the situation.  

 

I'm confused/annoyed why Rowan is so ready to believe Tommy's word on Simon's supposed suicide. I'm also annoyed that even if it was true that she makes his suicide all about herself. It's not a "Why did you kill yourself?" it's a "How dare you kill yourself on my wedding day?" that comes off as so incredibly entitled and annoying that gets me. 

 

Her self righteousness about the cameras was thoroughly undermined by her suicide attempt. Way to prove Tommy's point that you're unstable and suicidal. I guess it's fine dumping your child off on Tommy by killing yourself without a second thought but Simon maybe killing himself is totally unforgiveable.

 

Suffice to say I'm not a fan of Rowan. 

[wayne67]

I would wish Rowan dead, but due to the nature of this show, it would be kind of pointless.  

 

I'm so over her. Maybe we could wish for her to remember that she has a sister in another town/state and she'll leave town and we'll be free of her blahness. 

[Commando Cody]

The kid who played Victor turned up as little Sam Winchester, on Supernatural, a couple of weeks ago. 

[wayne67]

Well the thing about Simon is he's DEAD and dead by his own choice so yeah I can understand Rowan decision in not wanting Simon to be part of her daughter's life.  As far as her sleeping with him, I don't know maybe just confusion, caught up in the moment of him being back, she did sleep with him before she found out how he actually died *shrug*.  If he died in a car accident or something that he wasn't in control of then yeah let him be a part of his daughter's life (as much as a dead man can be) but the fact that once he found out she was pregnant THEN he decided to kill himself--well that just doesn't speak highly of him wanting to be a dad now. 

 

IDK maybe I'm judging him too harshly; I don't hate the guy

 

Well didn't Rowan try and kill herself twice ? Once off screen implied and the second time was interrupted by Tommy. If we're keeping score that makes her twice as suicidal as Simon. So she's not automatically a better parent than Simon just because he MAYBE killed himself 6 years ago. Her most recent suicide attempt was a few days ago. Also she conspired to cover up his cold blooded murder. 

 

Neither of these people are winning the parent of the year award but at least Simon is admitting to a mistake he may not remember. Whereas Rowan is not taking responsibility for anything she's done. 

[wayne67]

Such a lame finale. I doubt I'll be watching the next season if there was one. I don't care if the town gets washed away. 

[hincandenza]

What I can't accept is that Camille's family isn't asking tons of questions. I realize she wouldn't have answers for them as her memory of how she came back is gone. But in real life, the family would be peppering her with "what do you remember?" "what did you feel before you found yourself walking up that road?" All sorts of questions to try to figure out how the hell this happened, rather than just almost calmly accepting it. Plus, WHY must these things always be kept a secret on shows like this? Why can't they tell everyone what's happened and see if somebody out there has some clue as to why, or whether more resurrected people are out there? Secrecy is always so annoying to me and so many plots in shows depend on people not sharing crucial information. I know, I know, plots would collapse if the characters were as transparent as they should be.

 

I don't know about French Victor, but I think this boy is plenty creepy with that little smile of his. I really can't figure out what part he plays in all this, so good job on that mystery.

Agreed.  I'm late to watching this, but just finished episode 3 on Netflix.  After episode 1, I was intrigued- and the Pacific Northwest setting, as well as a somber score from local artist Zoe Keating, made me give it a chance.  But now, three episodes in, I feel like I should bow out before I get frustrated with terrible writing.

 

I can't recall which writer it was, but read a quote from a sci-fi writer once talking about how the trick to writing well is to recognize you get one big suspension of disbelief, after which you have to write your characters and situations as realistic.  Want to write about time travel, or space exploration, or robots, or the dead coming back to life?  Fine, your audience will go with you... but you can't then also expect them to continue suspend disbelief- especially about something like "how human beings behave"- at the drop of the hat whenever convenient.

 

For example, I find the reactions of people to be so alien, so unreal, that it is jarring: are these people supposed to be androids, or are all the show's writers psychopaths who literally cannot understand or empathize with how actual human beings behave?  I can go along with "people start returning from the dead", but not with the completely banal reaction of Camille's family.  None of them have any real questions, or are freaking out that much, by what is a real, honest-to-God miracle.  Seriously, you've had a loved one come back to life years later, and you make... quesadillas.  Nor can I believe that a professional psychiatrist would find a mute (and creepy) young child on the side of the road, and keep him secretly in her home for days: if anyone would be aware of the law as well as know social service contacts to find the child a place to stay and figure out who his family is, it would be her.  Chief Tyrol's behavior might make sense if it turns out the brother/son was the killer, and he killed him himself when he found out what he was doing... but that guy looks awfully young to have been a serial murderer who last struck 7 years ago.  Nor do I believe a police officer, even a creepy obsessive stalkery one like Tommy, wouldn't be drinking himself into a stupor right now, with clear video and in-person evidence that his fiance's long-dead previous flame is walking and talking around your town.

 

And while the show might eventually explain it, the undead themselves are acting bizarrely, except for Camille: Simon and the old man's wife (Michelle Forbes?) are grown adults, and yet are acting mysteriously and secretive, which only makes sense if they know they were dead and have some e-e-e-evil  undead agenda.  If they were like Camille, and just poofed back into existence as if they never died, they'd behave like normal people, and be shocked at how everything has changed in what seems like a single day.

 

Not to mention, while the characters have never voiced this, the only real reason to keep it secret is not so that Gladys down the street doesn't start gossiping; it's because this would become a massive worldwide news story: provable examples of people coming back to life would be the biggest story in the world, and every media organization on the planet would be camped out in that town.  The secret has to leak out, especially if more people are coming back; this would be all over social media the first time someone posted video of the dead come back to life.  Countless millions of religious believers- and skeptics!- would be overwhelmed by what appears to be clear and convincing evidence that God exists, and is returning people to life: either because it's End of Days/rapture, or as a sign of his love and mercy.  

 

And I think that's what the sci-fi writer was referring to: once you make your suspension of disbelief, you owe it to your readers/viewers and yourself to organically explore what would happen, not force characters to behave a certain and implausible way just to fit your poorly thought out plot concept.

[ByTor]

Seriously, you've had a loved one come back to life years later, and you make... quesadillas.

Yeah, I'd prefer pizza :)

Nor can I believe that a professional psychiatrist would find a mute (and creepy) young child on the side of the road, and keep him secretly in her home for days:

This probably bothered me more than anything. Why didn't she drive his creepy ass to the police station?

[EarlGreyTea]

On 4/3/2016 at 10:13 PM, hincandenza said:

For example, I find the reactions of people to be so alien, so unreal, that it is jarring: are these people supposed to be androids, or are all the show's writers psychopaths who literally cannot understand or empathize with how actual human beings behave?  I can go along with "people start returning from the dead", but not with the completely banal reaction of Camille's family.  None of them have any real questions, or are freaking out that much, by what is a real, honest-to-God miracle.  Seriously, you've had a loved one come back to life years later, and you make... quesadillas.  Nor can I believe that a professional psychiatrist would find a mute (and creepy) young child on the side of the road, and keep him secretly in her home for days: if anyone would be aware of the law as well as know social service contacts to find the child a place to stay and figure out who his family is, it would be her.  Chief Tyrol's behavior might make sense if it turns out the brother/son was the killer, and he killed him himself when he found out what he was doing... but that guy looks awfully young to have been a serial murderer who last struck 7 years ago.  Nor do I believe a police officer, even a creepy obsessive stalkery one like Tommy, wouldn't be drinking himself into a stupor right now, with clear video and in-person evidence that his fiance's long-dead previous flame is walking and talking around your town.

 

So I just discovered this show on Netflix and this post right here articulates EXACTLY the problem I have with this show. Have these writers never lost a loved one? The family members' reaction to seeing their dead loved ones is decidedly underwhelming. I guess histrionics and fainting might not have come across on screen very well, but frankly, that's how these people SHOULD be reacting. For example, Camille's parents. They even let her out of their sight once they realize they aren't hallucinating. What person on earth would chill out in the living room staring out into space while their dearly missed loved one is in her room? And after that, asking questions about where the hell she was, or even having her checked out by a doctor? And if I was Camille, one of my first questions would be what year it was. Followed by obsessive Googling to see what I'd missed in world events.

Rowan's reaction was better. They're hitting all the right notes with her character. Having her think it was a hallucination for the first few episodes was interesting and realistic, even though Simon should have opened his goddamn mouth. That was annoying and clearly meant to draw out the tension for another episode.