Spoilers, Speculation & All Things Media!

[WendyCR72]

I think - could be wrong here, but... - Castle will be Katic's "signature" role, and her subsequent career may be plays (as she is doing one soon for one night) and/or the indie circuit.

[chraume]

5 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

I agree she doesn't want to stay on network TV, but I've always been taught to never trash a former boss public ally or intentionally piss them off.  No matter how terrible they to you.  I would think that's also true in Hollywood. But, lots of people don't follow this rule and are successful. Time will tell.

Too true. Katherine Heigl is a prime example of that. Hollywood is a weird beast, so I guess we'll see what happens!

1 minute ago, WendyCR72 said:

I think - could be wrong here, but... - Castle will be Katic's "signature" role, and her subsequent career may be plays (as she is doing one soon for one night) and/or the indie circuit.

Completely agreed. Particularly roles that allow for travel or one-offs. Which is too bad for me, honestly -- I think she's a great actress, but I haven't enjoyed her choices in indie movies at all. 

[Thirteen]

No one came out smelling like roses at the end of this PR nightmare. So considering that there's nothing to brag about being fired, why would Stana's camp leak the news? And why didn't ABC throw her under the bus and said it was a mutual decision?

I just watched the bloopers, Stana doesn't look like she didn't want to be there.

Edited August 23, 2016 by Thirteen

[madmaverick]

33 minutes ago, break21 said:

Watched the bloopers - they don't seem like they are ready to strangle each other.  I think a lot of the feud was exaggerated and it more about contractual issues.

The bloopers seem normal, though I don't think they'd put anything weird on them either.  Of course you don't see the physical touching and teasing between them that we saw in the first few seasons, but we haven't seen that (nor did I expect to see that) for several seasons now.  Since S3 or 4, I think.  The thing is, neither of them seem like stupid people to me, and I don't see why either would want to risk their professional reputation by behaving badly on set in front of dozens of other eyeballs.  I could be wrong, though I really can't imagine either would resort to something like kicking other people.

I think it's interesting that very little appears to have come out about what, if any, contractual issues there were between Stana and the studio.

32 minutes ago, chraume said:

Is it ill-advised, though? (That's a real question, not just me being snotty.) Seems like, if that was a PR move from SK's team, it's worked out for her and likely will continue to work for her. She leaves the show with her fans more or less intact, and Castle fans at least willing to follow her to her next project -- which, while I might be blowing online fandom vs. actual fans out of proportion, NF doesn't appear to have done. She doesn't seem to have a real interest in staying on network TV for the time being, so even if ABC's pissed off, there are still lots of avenues and she seems to have good connections. 

I do think that online fans, especially the most vocal/partial, aren't generally representative of the entire audience of a show.  I think most people watch TV for casual entertainment and the percentage of people who will watch the future projects of the actors if they are good far exceed the percentage of people who will watch a future project because it involves their favorite actor.   If their future projects are good, no doubt the actors can garner more new fans to make up for any drop off.

23 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

I agree she doesn't want to stay on network TV, but I've always been taught to never trash a former boss public ally or intentionally piss them off.  No matter how terrible they to you.  I would think that's also true in Hollywood. But, lots of people don't follow this rule and are successful. Time will tell.

I read about some alleged feud between Vin Diesel and The Rock recently on the set of their movie.  One of them was pissed with the other for various reasons and took to social media to vent, without being specific, about male costars.  Supposedly studio bosses and those on set were displeased with the one who tattle tailed because what goes on set is supposed to stay on set, and resolved privately, not aired publicly.  I can imagine circumstances where, as in politics, if you're perceived as a leaker, that can come back to bite you in the ass.  In the end, though, I think if you can make money for a studio, they'll be BFFs with you. ;)

17 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

I think - could be wrong here, but... - Castle will be Katic's "signature" role, and her subsequent career may be plays (as she is doing one soon for one night) and/or the indie circuit.

I think Stana has ambitions in film, or perhaps, more realistically, on cable TV.  If that doesn't work out for her, she can always come back to network TV where I don't think she'll have problems getting a lead role, though there's no guarantee any show would be as successful as Castle of course.  I think anything resembling a network procedural would be her very last choice of employment though.

Does anyone know where the early scene in the bloopers with Stana's hand on Nathan's nose is from?  I'm blanking on so much of S8, ha.

Anyone seen the locked room extra?

Edited August 23, 2016 by madmaverick

[chraume]

14 minutes ago, Thirteen said:

No one came out smelling like roses at the end of this PR nightmare. So considering that there's nothing to brag about being fired, why would Stana's camp leak the news? And why didn't ABC throw her under the bus and said it was a mutual decision?

I think it's been touched on here a bit before, but I'd guess because the alternative is to announce that she's decided to leave, thereby garnering the wrath of everyone who's not an SK fan. Cote de Pablo, Mischa Barton, Katherine Heigl, Nina Dobrev -- regardless of what the actual reason given is, people tend to assume that they left because they thought they were too good for the show, and any subsequent show-tanking is their fault, etc. etc. There've been some successful actresses to leave their shows for sure, but it seems like kind of a crap-shoot to me, so why risk it? 

Also, this is 100% just my opinion, but "I got fired because I was underappreciated" seems like the least of all of the evils of this narrative -- ABC is sexist/is idiotic/fired an actress because they preferred an actor/believes that actresses are expendable/is incompetent and doesn't understand the show and what makes it successful, NF has a huge ego/is sexist/is threatened at the prospect of not being the show's fave/pushed an actress out because he hates her success/is a general asshole. Seems like (regardless of what actually happened -- all of that could be true!) she did come out smelling like roses imo.

Edited August 23, 2016 by chraume

[Thirteen]

2 minutes ago, chraume said:

I think it's been touched on here a bit before, but I'd guess because the alternative is to announce that she's decided to leave, thereby garnering the wrath of everyone who's not an SK fan. Cote de Pablo, Mischa Barton, Katherine Heigl, Nina Dobrev -- regardless of what the actual reason given is, people tend to assume that they left because they thought they were too good for the show, and any subsequent show-tanking is their fault, etc. etc. There've been some successful actresses to leave their shows for sure, but it seems like kind of a crap-shoot to me, so why risk it? 

Also, this is 100% just my opinion, but "I got fired because I was underappreciated" seems like the least of all of the evils of this narrative -- ABC is sexist/is idiotic/fired an actress because they preferred an actor/believes that actresses are expendable/is incompetent and doesn't understand the show and what makes it successful, NF has a huge ego/is sexist/is threatened at the prospect of not being the show's fave/pushed an actress out because he hates her success/is a general asshole. Seems like she did come out smelling like roses imo.

That narrative might work for her fans but not for her future employers.

[chraume]

10 minutes ago, Thirteen said:

That narrative might work for her fans but not for her future employers.

I'm not totally sure what you mean by that (whether you're referring to being fired or the possibility of being the leak), but that's fair. I don't think being fired for budgetary reasons is the career hindrance that being fired for misbehaviour/any other reason is, as it's not even especially a career hindrance outside of Hollywood, but given Hollywood's sneaky nature (apparently the SK/NF feud was just an open secret that everyone in the industry knew about), I'd assume that whomever the leak was, if people have found out about the, they could face some difficulties with future employers. 

[Thirteen]

8 minutes ago, chraume said:

I'm not totally sure what you mean by that (whether you're referring to being fired or the possibility of being the leak), but that's fair. I don't think being fired for budgetary reasons is the career hindrance that being fired for misbehaviour/any other reason is, as it's not even especially a career hindrance outside of Hollywood, but given Hollywood's sneaky nature (apparently the SK/NF feud was just an open secret that everyone in the industry knew about), I'd assume that whomever the leak was, if people have found out about the, they could face some difficulties with future employers. 

Absolutely. If her camp leaked the news and she wasn't fired for budgetary reasons as it was first reported, her job prospects don't look great. People within the industry probably know the truth.

[break21]

My opinion, I don't think she was fired because of NF but I think she was fired  because of problems with the network. 

[anoldfriend]

Genius PR move to let everyone believe you were fired when you were leaving anyway?

Only if her 12 loud Twitter fans and the country of Brazil is going to hire her next. 

Because homegirl hung a studio and network out to dry to look better on Twitter. Rookie move at best. More like JV. 

Doesn't matter that she might be done with network tv. In fact that's great she wants to move to cable. Lifetime welcomed her movie with open arms. THE LULZ!!!

Maybe Catherine Bell will retire from those nanny/witch movies and she can take over that role on Hallmark.

I like Stana and I think she is beautiful and talented, but I also don't like bullshit. I don't like that in a world where women are raped, beaten, and have their genitals mutilated she made everyone believe that she was the victim of some sexist conspiracy. Besides what did Nathan win? The prize of cancellation.

[FlickerToAFlame]

Is that Stana for sure in the nose picking part? I thought it might be from the watch and ring but wasn't sure. It has to at least be Beckett right, so maybe a standin?

 

anoldfriend: so was Stana always planning to leave the show and the decision was just made for her by the network/production company, pissing her off for not getting to do it her way?

Edited August 24, 2016 by FlickerToAFlame

[BellyLaughter]

4 hours ago, anoldfriend said:

Genius PR move to let everyone believe you were fired when you were leaving anyway?

Only if her 12 loud Twitter fans and the country of Brazil is going to hire her next. 

Because homegirl hung a studio and network out to dry to look better on Twitter. Rookie move at best. More like JV. 

Doesn't matter that she might be done with network tv. In fact that's great she wants to move to cable. Lifetime welcomed her movie with open arms. THE LULZ!!!

Maybe Catherine Bell will retire from those nanny/witch movies and she can take over that role on Hallmark.

I like Stana and I think she is beautiful and talented, but I also don't like bullshit. I don't like that in a world where women are raped, beaten, and have their genitals mutilated she made everyone believe that she was the victim of some sexist conspiracy. Besides what did Nathan win? The prize of cancellation.

That's exactly how I feel about her and "the narrative". I like her - I always loved Beckett but that was PR bullshit that I despise and have ZERO time for.  The fact that she allowed her hardcore, young female fans to cry foul over and perpetuate the sexist conspiracy garbage was something that is borderline unforgivable.... Just a sad way for what will probably be a career defining role to come to an end... 

Edited August 24, 2016 by BellyLaughter

[Thirteen]

1 hour ago, anoldfriend said:

Genius PR move to let everyone believe you were fired when you were leaving anyway?

Only if her 12 loud Twitter fans and the country of Brazil is going to hire her next. 

Because homegirl hung a studio and network out to dry to look better on Twitter. Rookie move at best. More like JV. 

Doesn't matter that she might be done with network tv. In fact that's great she wants to move to cable. Lifetime welcomed her movie with open arms. THE LULZ!!!

Maybe Catherine Bell will retire from those nanny/witch movies and she can take over that role on Hallmark.

I like Stana and I think she is beautiful and talented, but I also don't like bullshit. I don't like that in a world where women are raped, beaten, and have their genitals mutilated she made everyone believe that she was the victim of some sexist conspiracy. Besides what did Nathan win? The prize of cancellation.

In this case, Stana's PR camp sound amateurish at best and it can translate into career suicidal for their client. It also looks like some of her cast mates and crew, past and current, were blindsided by the news.

[femmefan1946]

There is one wild card that no one seems to mention much re; the Nathan /Stana 'feud'.

Stana married in 2016.

She married a guy from the Old Country. Who has been in the picture for a few years.

The wedding and honeymoon took place during filming, which was why Stana appeared so little in the early episodes.

Since they didn't elope and all the wedding and honeymoon were (probably) planned well in advance-- why not during the hiatus from April(?) to July (?) .

I don't think any of those four movies have been released yet. And outside of a one night Broadway appearance in a play that seems to survive on having guest stars every single night, nothing else announced.

Perhaps she has retired. Perhaps her husband has strong opinions on what kind of work she should be doing. Perhaps they want to start a family-- which has to be soon since she is already 36.

Meanwhile, Nathan took a scuba vacation with his brother and then filmed on ConMan and booked an arc on one on of the most popular TV comedies and has appeared at a couple of SF and comic conventions (San Diego and Australia that I've heard of ). He's also done some publicity for ConMan,which looks like a profitable venture for the three friends involved.

[S55]

I think that's Seamus' finger in Nathan's nose in the bloopers. The ring looks like the one he wears to me. 

[FlickerToAFlame]

Stana could have projects we don't know about yet. 

[Emma]

If one of my former employees hung me out to dry I'd bury them. Especially if I knew all the dirty details and had the resources to get all that info out there. 

ABC just took it all on the chin. I don't get that. Sure, Stana is small potatoes but that was a legit PR nightmare.

If us fans can figure out what went down then those involved surely know who did what and when. Yet those who were screwed by Stana only have nice things to say about her. I don't get that either. Maybe I'm just petty while others just want to move on and put it all behind them.

Or it just might be possible that Stana's hands aren't the only ones who are dirty.

Edited August 24, 2016 by Emma

[madmaverick]

11 hours ago, anoldfriend said:

Because homegirl hung a studio and network out to dry to look better on Twitter. Rookie move at best. More like JV. 

Doesn't matter that she might be done with network tv. In fact that's great she wants to move to cable. Lifetime welcomed her movie with open arms. THE LULZ!!!

Maybe Catherine Bell will retire from those nanny/witch movies and she can take over that role on Hallmark.

I like Stana and I think she is beautiful and talented, but I also don't like bullshit. I don't like that in a world where women are raped, beaten, and have their genitals mutilated she made everyone believe that she was the victim of some sexist conspiracy. Besides what did Nathan win? The prize of cancellation.

Sorry, what's JV?  I only know of it as joint venture in my world, but I don't think that's it here heh.

I remember thinking it perhaps not the wisest move to tell a reporter that she was developing a cable series while she was still employed on Castle last year, even though of course developing a series of any kind usually takes years.  But still, her then employer might not have been best pleased by her actively planning her future elsewhere and publicly sharing that.

Catherine Bell's a fair actress though I only know her from seeing a little bit of JAG but she seems to have disappeared after that long term series?  I haven't seen the male lead since either.  Maybe neither need to work that much after their financial cushion from JAG but it could also show that it's not so easy for leads coming off a long term show to move up, and I don't mean Hallmark movies.

I thought Stana's publicist was some big deal with some big name clients?  Maybe all they wanted was maximum publicity (I was a little surprised that Stana's wedding was used to generate some publicity as well after her self-proclaimed emphasis on privacy years ago), and she certainly ended up with more publicity than if she'd quietly left the show.  But yeah, I don't know that's worth it if her PR move would have made ABC displeased with her.  

9 hours ago, BellyLaughter said:

That's exactly how I feel about her and "the narrative". I like her - I always loved Beckett but that was PR bullshit that I despise and have ZERO time for.  The fact that she allowed her hardcore, young female fans to cry foul over and perpetuate the sexist conspiracy garbage was something that is borderline unforgivable.... Just a sad way for what will probably be a career defining role to come to an end... 

It wasn't just the young female fans crying foul over alleged sexism; it was the self-righteous older female fanatics who were crazily crying foul over NF and Hawley being sexist misogynist bullies - on the evidence of what, exactly?- that annoyed me extremely.  Whatever their flaws as actors and showrunners or whatever their issues in their personal relationships with Stana, I don't think people deserve to have their character assassinated in that way and accused as such without evidence. Some of her crazier fans were already perpetuating this sexism narrative throughout S8 and earlier (blaming NF somehow for her S7 contract negotiations), and then it got completely out of hand as the way her exit was framed appeared to validate that narrative to her fans.  The victim/villain narrative doesn't play well with me either if it's a one sided PR manoeuvre more than anything that neglects one's own role in events.  I can't imagine all those accusations of sexism emanating from the leak endeared Stana/her team to those who got thrown under the bus as a result.  I wonder if a desire to get back at those people for whatever reason was part of the PR equation, or just seen as collateral damage in the Hollywood PR game.

5 hours ago, femmefan1946 said:

There is one wild card that no one seems to mention much re; the Nathan /Stana 'feud'.

Stana married in 2016.

She married a guy from the Old Country. Who has been in the picture for a few years.

The wedding and honeymoon took place during filming, which was why Stana appeared so little in the early episodes.

Since they didn't elope and all the wedding and honeymoon were (probably) planned well in advance-- why not during the hiatus from April(?) to July (?) .

I don't think any of those four movies have been released yet. And outside of a one night Broadway appearance in a play that seems to survive on having guest stars every single night, nothing else announced.

Perhaps she has retired. Perhaps her husband has strong opinions on what kind of work she should be doing. Perhaps they want to start a family-- which has to be soon since she is already 36.

I don't subscribe to victim narratives for a strong, independent woman like Stana either in her professional or her personal life.  As far as I'm concerned, she makes her own decisions, for better or for worse.  I think her wedding did take place during the hiatus, though she then took further time off during the season.   I don't think it's fruitful to compare career prospects of the cast members, and at this point, I think it's too soon to tell anything.  I think Stana probably did have higher hopes for that movie of hers than Lifetime.  But she does seem very excited about the off Broadway play given the PR frenzy.

5 hours ago, S55 said:

I think that's Seamus' finger in Nathan's nose in the bloopers. The ring looks like the one he wears to me. 

But what scene was this?  I really don't recall.  I thought it looked like Stana's hand because of the watch, but I could be wrong.  

1 hour ago, Emma said:

If one of my former employees hung me out to dry I'd bury them. Especially if I knew all the dirty details and had the resources to get all that info out there. 

ABC just took it all on the chin. I don't get that. Sure, Stana is small potatoes but that was a legit PR nightmare.

If us fans can figure out what went down then those involved surely know who did what and when. Yet those who were screwed by Stana only have nice things to say about her. I don't get that either. Maybe I'm just petty while others just want to move on and put it all behind them.

Or it just might be possible that Stana's hands aren't the only ones who are dirty.

Maybe no one's completely clean in this mess, but I don't think it'd be smart for anyone thrown under the bus to leak anything further so I'm not surprised that ABC and Nathan had no comment except to wish Stana well.  I'm just curious if this kind of move and how it played out factors into future employment or not.  I think it's the thoughts of people in the industry that count more than what fans think. 

I have to say, I didn't foresee Castle getting dragged into drama and even tabloid territory.  It's a shame.

Edited August 24, 2016 by madmaverick

[Thirteen]

1 hour ago, Emma said:

If one of my former employees hung me out to dry I'd bury them. Especially if I knew all the dirty details and had the resources to get all that info out there. 

ABC just took it all on the chin. I don't get that. Sure, Stana is small potatoes but that was a legit PR nightmare.

If us fans can figure out what went down then those involved surely know who did what and when. Yet those who were screwed by Stana only have nice things to say about her. I don't get that either. Maybe I'm just petty while others just want to move on and put it all behind them.

Or it just might be possible that Stana's hands aren't the only ones who are dirty.

This is exactly why I have a hard time believing that the leak came from her camp. Professionally, she had nothing to gain. She also flew out of the country as soon as the news hit the Internet and wasn't available for interviews.

[break21]

1 hour ago, Emma said:

If one of my former employees hung me out to dry I'd bury them. Especially if I knew all the dirty details and had the resources to get all that info out there. 

ABC just took it all on the chin. I don't get that. Sure, Stana is small potatoes but that was a legit PR nightmare.

If us fans can figure out what went down then those involved surely know who did what and when. Yet those who were screwed by Stana only have nice things to say about her. I don't get that either. Maybe I'm just petty while others just want to move on and put it all behind them.

Or it just might be possible that Stana's hands aren't the only ones who are dirty.

My opinion, I've been in business enough to know that Stana got Stana fired.  I doubt anyone else held a role.  IMO, it was between her and the network.

[chraume]

 do agree that, if this were the case (which I believe it is), it would be abhorrent, don’t get me wrong. Not only because I hate the idea of playing into the narrative that her fans put out last season (that she was being written out of eps, vs. the oft-confirmed truth that she asked for eps off), but also because it threw literally every coworker under the bus. Forget NF; every cast- and crew-member who agreed to sign on regardless was harassed for not supporting her, called a terrible friend, said they were easily manipulated, only cared about the money (duh), sexist, etc. I don’t imagine that would have been the expected outcome, but it happened nevertheless – SK is the victim of a cruel, sexist workplace, was pushed out all season, was written out of episodes and given no screentime on purpose, but was intensely loyal to the show until she was unceremoniously shoved out, etc. etc. 

That said, I’m still not convinced that it would be career-killer. I’ll admit I don’t know much about it, so maybe I’m just a titch too pessimistic (true), but I’ve seen a reasonable amount of celebrities bash their employers (openly and publicly, neither of which really happened here), and still maintain good careers. Of course, the opposite is also true (although Heigl has managed to find work here and there, but she has the disadvantage of also having a publicly-tarnished reputation, too, and no fanbase to follow her from project to project). To be fair, I doubt that SK has the clout that a lot of the successful celebrities do, so maybe that factors in. I don’t know. If she sticks to (sorry if you love them, but – crappy) indies, I highly doubt she’ll see any damage at all. I just don’t expect to see her in a Disney movie anytime soon, or guest-starring on an ABC/ABC Studios show.

8 minutes ago, Thirteen said:

This is exactly why I have a hard time believing that the leak came from her camp. Professionally, she had nothing to gain. She also flew out of the country as soon as the news hit the Internet and wasn't available for interviews.

But then, who did have anything to gain? ABC sure doesn't look good, nor does NF or, really, any of the cast and crew. I'd think that flying out of the country was an easy way to not do interviews tbh, one way or the other. If she did quit, best to have plausible deniability that she never said she was fired. If she didn't, best to avoid trashing your ex-employer.

But I do think madmaverick is right. I think everyone shares a healthy amount of blame here, cast, crew, and network included.

[BlakesMomma]

"This is exactly why I have a hard time believing that the leak came from her camp. Professionally, she had nothing to gain. She also flew out of the country as soon as the news hit the Internet and wasn't available for interviews."

 

She gained a lot of publicity and sympathy with the whole sexist, mysogynist storyline going on at the time.  Maybe her people felt this was worth the risk.  Still seems to me she was the only one who came out of this mess looking somewhat sympathetic and unscathed.  At least with her fans.  But I tend to agree with anoldfriend that she may have created some problems for herself in the industry.

And if it was truly her choice to leave, but was leaked as her being fired for whatever PR purposes, then that's utter BS because her rep's confirmation that it wasn't Stana's choice to leave furthered the lie.  I just don't understand why the network/studio would go along with the false "firing" storyline in their response to the leak if it wasn't true.

[madmaverick]

9 minutes ago, chraume said:

 do agree that, if this were the case (which I believe it is), it would be abhorrent, don’t get me wrong. Not only because I hate the idea of playing into the narrative that her fans put out last season (that she was being written out of eps, vs. the oft-confirmed truth that she asked for eps off), but also because it threw literally every coworker under the bus. Forget NF; every cast- and crew-member who agreed to sign on regardless was harassed for not supporting her, called a terrible friend, said they were easily manipulated, only cared about the money (duh), sexist, etc. I don’t imagine that would have been the expected outcome, but it happened nevertheless – SK is the victim of a cruel, sexist workplace, was pushed out all season, was written out of episodes and given no screentime on purpose, but was intensely loyal to the show until she was unceremoniously shoved out, etc. etc. 

The amount of vitriol vented at others who were going to continue without her was ridiculous.  If they did not hold the power to make the decision to not re-sign Stana, why were they to be held responsible for wanting to continue with their jobs after the fact?  Nothing they could do to change the outcome at that point.  The victimizing narrative as you describe that was being perpetuated was indeed annoying.  It was like they forgot that Stana negotiated her own contract for S8 on her terms.  She got a raise, a producer credit, more time off.  If she didn't like those terms (and what's not to love?!), she didn't have to continue.  But she obviously did, so it was annoying to read all about how she was being cut out of episodes, out of DVD commentaries, out of bloopers, even, or so it was claimed before they came out. ;)  

6 minutes ago, BlakesMomma said:

And if it was truly her choice to leave, but was leaked as her being fired for whatever PR purposes, then that's utter BS because her rep's confirmation that it wasn't Stana's choice to leave furthered the lie.  I just don't understand why the network/studio would go along with the false "firing" storyline in their response to the leak if it wasn't true.

Maybe she sent out signals of disinterest in continuing all season long or even made it pretty plain that S8 would be her last when she signed on for that, and so the studio decided not to approach her especially given the iffy renewal due to declined S8 ratings, growing expense of the show, and bts issues with costar.  And so her PR leaked that she had not been approached (I forget if that was the exact wording or if the words 'not her choice' had been used), which wouldn't be false, but which also omitted that she'd not been interested in the first place.  Maybe her signs of disinterest throughout the season were yet another round of playing hardball with the studio and she did really want to continue, who knows, and it backfired.  Or she was offended that she wasn't even given the option to decline an offer, hence the leak, throwing the studio under the bus.

I just found it curious that it was the same Deadline reporter who did her puff piece at the beginning of S8 reiterating that there was no drama with the S8 contract negotiations and that she was excited for what was in store for her character who ended up with the leak about her not returning to the show.  Deadline was also the first to report on her participation in the Rabbit play.  Did her PR team have a direct line to Deadline or what? ;)

[Emma]

There's always at least one person willing to sing. Be it an actor, crew member, or a network suit.

A lot of people were screwed out of jobs because of this. 

I'm having a hard time believing that Stana not only shot herself in the foot, leaked the story, and then played victim falsely, and not one person is willing to take her to task for it? Really?

Actors who have pulled similar crap in the past were raked over for it. Some are still carrying that stink around years later. 

This situation though? It's like everyone turned mute and hope it stays swept under the rug. 

[anoldfriend]

8 hours ago, femmefan1946 said:

There is one wild card that no one seems to mention much re; the Nathan /Stana 'feud'.

Stana married in 2016.

She married a guy from the Old Country. Who has been in the picture for a few years.

The wedding and honeymoon took place during filming, which was why Stana appeared so little in the early episodes.

Since they didn't elope and all the wedding and honeymoon were (probably) planned well in advance-- why not during the hiatus from April(?) to July (?) .

I don't think any of those four movies have been released yet. And outside of a one night Broadway appearance in a play that seems to survive on having guest stars every single night, nothing else announced.

Perhaps she has retired. Perhaps her husband has strong opinions on what kind of work she should be doing. Perhaps they want to start a family-- which has to be soon since she is already 36.

Meanwhile, Nathan took a scuba vacation with his brother and then filmed on ConMan and booked an arc on one on of the most popular TV comedies and has appeared at a couple of SF and comic conventions (San Diego and Australia that I've heard of ). He's also done some publicity for ConMan,which looks like a profitable venture for the three friends involved.

She hasn't retired. At all.

The wedding didn't take place during filming, it was during the hiatus between season 7 and season 8. 

Three movies and one has gone straight to Lifetime, the other 2 are supposedly being released but I won't hold my breath. 

I'm not aware of a 4th feature. 

Start a family? Where is Jennifer Aniston when you need her? 

Old Country? FFS. 

Excuse me while I go wash the xenophobia off of me.

In any case I'm not sure what her marriage has to do with the feud. Besides the obvious.

4 hours ago, Emma said:

If one of my former employees hung me out to dry I'd bury them. Especially if I knew all the dirty details and had the resources to get all that info out there. 

ABC just took it all on the chin. I don't get that. Sure, Stana is small potatoes but that was a legit PR nightmare.

If us fans can figure out what went down then those involved surely know who did what and when. Yet those who were screwed by Stana only have nice things to say about her. I don't get that either. Maybe I'm just petty while others just want to move on and put it all behind them.

Or it just might be possible that Stana's hands aren't the only ones who are dirty.

Nope. It's better to not say anything because the public will always take the actor's side and whoever gets it out there first controls the narrative. 

Plus the show is gone so who cares? Beside us. Not even really me, I'm in it for the lulz. 

 

---

JV = Junior Varsity. Sports term. 

Edited August 24, 2016 by anoldfriend

[anoldfriend]

1 hour ago, madmaverick said:

 

Maybe she sent out signals of disinterest in continuing all season long or even made it pretty plain that S8 would be her last when she signed on for that, and so the studio decided not to approach her especially given the iffy renewal due to declined S8 ratings, growing expense of the show, and bts issues with costar.  And so her PR leaked that she had not been approached (I forget if that was the exact wording or if the words 'not her choice' had been used), which wouldn't be false, but which also omitted that she'd not been interested in the first place.  Maybe her signs of disinterest throughout the season were yet another round of playing hardball with the studio and she did really want to continue, who knows, and it backfired.  Or she was offended that she wasn't even given the option to decline an offer, hence the leak, throwing the studio under the bus.

Say it with me now: I KNOW WHO THE KILLER IS!

[Sonik Tooth]

I’m going with the most unspectacular narrative:

After playing Beckett for seven seasons with an increasing workload up to season 6 (I think  season 7 was already a bit lighter), she may have wanted to expand her acting/directing/producing horizon or have a better work/life balance. Normal stuff you think about when you have been with a job for a few years. Sometimes it works out and you get to keep your old job at a reduced workload, but sometimes you are in a position where you are indispensible and the company rather hires somebody else if you aren’t willing to work full time. Something like that might have happened. She wasn’t asked back because it was a creative challenge (less Beckett like last season) and because she might be relatively expensive. Hence budgetary reasons.

Quote

I like Stana and I think she is beautiful and talented, but I also don't like bullshit. I don't like that in a world where women are raped, beaten, and have their genitals mutilated she made everyone believe that she was the victim of some sexist conspiracy. Besides what did Nathan win? The prize of cancellation.

I would disagree. As soon as the tabloids picked up on alleged feuds and Nathan’s alleged nastiness towards her, Stana’s rep – when contacted – denied any issues with her co-star. I would solely hold the tabloids and blogs that withheld the information, and of course the “fans” responsible. Not only hardcore Stana fans but also those entitled entities who expected complete dedication and identification from the actors. And with those butt-sored fans, Nathan long lost their favour for not being a public shipper, for not publicly admiring Stana enough like his character admires Beckett, for treating the series like a job and “abandoning” them for valuing Firefly. And so these whiny little internet creatures strike back…

As for the leaking, maybe somebody picked up on her tweeting about the end of an era or something like that and asked their "sources".

[anoldfriend]

6 minutes ago, Sonik Tooth said:

 

I would disagree. As soon as the tabloids picked up on alleged feuds and Nathan’s alleged nastiness towards her, Stana’s rep – when contacted – denied any issues with her co-star. I would solely hold the tabloids and blogs that withheld the information, and of course the “fans” responsible. Not only hardcore Stana fans but also those entitled entities who expected complete dedication and identification from the actors. And with those butt-sored fans, Nathan long lost their favour for not being a public shipper, for not publicly admiring Stana enough like his character admires Beckett, for treating the series like a job and “abandoning” them for valuing Firefly. And so these whiny little internet creatures strike back…

 

I don't specifically remember her camp being the one to deny any issues. That makes it even funnier. 

But you bring up a good point either way, Stana and her rep did not create the narrative. But I stand by the fact that the lie of omission lit the match. You won't get any argument from me though that her fans are just as culpable, but that's why it worked so well. Her people know their audience.

[break21]

7 minutes ago, anoldfriend said:

I don't specifically remember her camp being the one to deny any issues. That makes it even funnier. 

But you bring up a good point either way, Stana and her rep did not create the narrative. But I stand by the fact that the lie of omission lit the match. You won't get any argument from me though that her fans are just as culpable, but that's why it worked so well. Her people know their audience.

I think SK and her PR team played the fans when she left, but I also think they over-estimated her value in the market.

[WendyCR72]

On 8/24/2016 at 3:20 PM, break21 said:

I think SK and her PR team played the fans when she left, but I also think they over-estimated her value in the market.

The thing is, like it or not and fair or not, Stana Katic is 38 years old. Not ready for dentures at all, but in Hollywood (with some exceptions, of course!), it's all downhill for an actress after 40. If Stana was a more high profile name, she may have had an easier time even after that day comes, but she isn't.

Many actresses out there in her age range are already relegated to mothers (and usually to actresses only 5 to 10 years their junior!), grandmothers (!), or sidekicks. It sucks, but there it is. For good or bad, if one never watched Castle, I doubt some still have any idea who she is. 

[madmaverick]

52 minutes ago, anoldfriend said:

Say it with me now: I KNOW WHO THE KILLER IS!

Are you sure the sexual tension won't be too much? :P

Went back to look at Deadline's original exclusive ;) about Stana's exit.  A point of interest is that she said that the decision for Stana's exit was made by ABC and ABC Studios, which isn't exactly what Dungey said about parallel tracks.  But of course Dungey is the only party that gets to communicate their version to the press, not anyone else.

Quote

I hear the decision for Katic not to return was made by ABC and ABC Studios. Both Fillion and Katic last spring inked one-year contracts, which are up at the end of the current eighth season. While the studio started making overtures to Fillion for a new deal months ago and has been in on- and off- talks with him since the beginning of the year, I hear Katic was never approached to re-up her contract and was not offered an opportunity to continue on the show. 

 

1 hour ago, anoldfriend said:

Start a family? Where is Jennifer Aniston when you need her? 

LOL.  Never liked Aniston so much as when she told the tabloids (and fans, don't forget) to stop obsessing over her stomach.

Quote

In any case I'm not sure what her marriage has to do with the feud. Besides the obvious.

LOL x2.  Ah, the obvious.  Sometimes I wonder if those in the know laugh at her fans who spin all sorts of conspiracies about the feud like he was jealous of her stardom supposedly eclipsing his, all the while ignoring the obvious, because, you know, why would a sophisticated unicorn like her ever go for a guy they so hate like him? ;)  I wonder what the protocol is for announcing a marriage in these circumstances to coworkers.  Do you communicate it directly to the most affected, generally, or not at all?  Would that be too JV?  Heh. To be a fly on that wall.

Quote

Nope. It's better to not say anything because the public will always take the actor's side and whoever gets it out there first controls the narrative. 

Plus the show is gone so who cares? Beside us. Not even really me, I'm in it for the lulz. 

Lulz accomplished. It was interesting to me that many fans would still take the side of Thomas Gibson despite his kicking a coworker.  I'm not sure a non actor would get the same kind of loyalty.  And in that case, it seemed that the writer who got kicked and got the story out there first controlled the narrative.  Of course Gibson kicked someone and that could be the end of the story so far as his employment is concerned, but after that kicking part got out, no one was really interested in the narrative preceding it.  What was the 'creative difference' that led to the kicking?

In Castle's case, it's interesting to me, that despite melodramatic allegations of crying and bullying popping up in tabloids (from where, I wonder), not one report speculated that a previous relationship was the cause of any tension. I would have thought that would be the obvious salacious place for tabloids to go.  And yet, they didn't.  I'm not even sure how/why the tabloids picked up the feuding story from Deadline reports and embellished it to the extent it was.  Were tabloids part of the PR plan or not?  Yes, Stana's rep made one denial to a tabloid that she had no issues with Nathan, but (thanks, google) the denial also came in a self proclaimed exclusive piece that was very sympathetic to Stana and made Nathan look like a Big Bad.  That piece even alleged they were made to go to couples' counselling together amongst other melodramatic claims, and yet, not one word speculating on a soured romantic relationship between the two.  Not once did Stana's rep have to deny a previous relationship between the actors. Interestingly, that was also a tabloid that did a piece on Stana's wedding and said it was informed by her rep about said event to her 'longtime love' with whom she'd been together for many years.   My opinion of tabloids couldn't be any lower so I'm just observing how they spun the story (Stana the poor victim) without necessarily concluding who was responsible for that story angle in the first place.

Edited August 24, 2016 by madmaverick

[chraume]

50 minutes ago, anoldfriend said:

I don't specifically remember her camp being the one to deny any issues. That makes it even funnier. 

I just want to note, if it's at all relevant -- her camp didn't deny any issues, they denied that she had any issues with him. 

18 minutes ago, madmaverick said:

In Castle's case, it's interesting to me, that despite melodramatic allegations of crying and bullying popping up in tabloids (from where, I wonder), not one report speculated that a previous relationship was the cause of any tension. I would have thought that would be the obvious salacious place for tabloids to go.  And yet, they didn't.  I'm not even sure how/why the tabloids picked up the feuding story from Deadline reports and embellished it to the extent it was.  Were tabloids part of the PR plan or not?  Yes, Stana's rep made one denial to a tabloid that she had no issues with Nathan, but (thanks, google) the denial also came in a self proclaimed exclusive piece that was very sympathetic to Stana and made Nathan look like a Big Bad.  That piece even alleged they were made to go to couples' counselling together amongst other melodramatic claims, and yet, not one word speculating on a soured romantic relationship between the two.  Not once did Stana's rep have to deny a previous relationship between the actors. Interestingly, that was also a tabloid that did a piece on Stana's wedding and said it was informed by her rep about said event to her 'longtime love' with whom she'd been together for many years.   My opinion of tabloids couldn't be any lower so I'm just observing how they spun the story (Stana the poor victim) without necessarily concluding who was responsible for that story angle in the first place.

I'll be honest, the tabloid was when I first started to wonder who, exactly, had leaked the story in the first place. Again, just my own speculation, but it seemed mighty convenient to me that, just as the shock wore off and people started to go, "Hey, actually, budgetary reasons don't make any sense..." an article conveniently drops, again with only a quote from an SK rep, that again spins it favourably for her, and is again released by a source that had previously had an exclusive (the wedding story came about through Us Weekly, right?) But I also think that wonder if the obvious really is the obvious, and perhaps everything we've been told is actually how things went down -- who knows?

Edited August 24, 2016 by chraume

[Sonik Tooth]

23 minutes ago, anoldfriend said:

I don't specifically remember her camp being the one to deny any issues. That makes it even funnier. 

But you bring up a good point either way, Stana and her rep did not create the narrative. But I stand by the fact that the lie of omission lit the match. You won't get any argument from me though that her fans are just as culpable, but that's why it worked so well. Her people know their audience.

Sorry, here's one link for example: http://www.usmagazine.com/entertainment/news/stana-katic-would-cry-in-her-castle-dressing-room-over-nathan-fillion-w203418

The relevant statement is in brackets of course. And I somehow don't believe that publicly commenting would have helped the issue because those people wanted to believe 1. it's all Nathan's fault and 2. Hollywood is sexist through and through. They would have spun it around again to make it fit. Like, she had to say it, she was pressured because she wouldn't get a job anymore if she stayed mum on the issue.

Of course there's still a chance that it's all Nathan's fault but there's also a chance that for centuries the Katic's and the Fillion's are having a family feud each searching for the Umbilicus Mundi...

[madmaverick]

19 minutes ago, Sonik Tooth said:

Sorry, here's one link for example: http://www.usmagazine.com/entertainment/news/stana-katic-would-cry-in-her-castle-dressing-room-over-nathan-fillion-w203418

That headline still makes me cringe.  Reflects poorly on both of them, regardless of the veracity.  Which I question.  I remember some crew member posting in response to some tabloid article saying that Nathan didn't bully anyone, Stana wasn't one to run off crying, and asking how people made this stuff up?!  Don't think it was in response to the article which the rep responded to though.  

Quote

The relevant statement is in brackets of course. And I somehow don't believe that publicly commenting would have helped the issue because those people wanted to believe 1. it's all Nathan's fault and 2. Hollywood is sexist through and through. They would have spun it around again to make it fit. Like, she had to say it, she was pressured because she wouldn't get a job anymore if she stayed mum on the issue.

Of course there's still a chance that it's all Nathan's fault but there's also a chance that for centuries the Katic's and the Fillion's are having a family feud each searching for the Umbilicus Mundi...

Some fans were saying why doesn't Nathan deny the tabloids' claims, he must be guilty. Why would anyone want to feed tabloids, I ask!  Crazy.

Also, I see his headline, "Connie Britton Eyes Early Exit [from her TV Show]".  They could have done that with Stana and Castle, and perhaps we could have had less drama.  Or perhaps not. 

Edited August 24, 2016 by madmaverick

[Thirteen]

Can we say that all the parties involved are guilty for not denying the tabloids' claims then?

[Sonik Tooth]

23 minutes ago, chraume said:

I just want to note, if it's at all relevant -- her camp didn't deny any issues, they denied that she had any issues with him. 

I think there are cases where such distinction is indeed relevant (can’t think of one at the moment) but if there is tension in the workplace, I can’t work properly and someone makes me cry, I would definitely have issues.

[chraume]

19 minutes ago, Sonik Tooth said:

I think there are cases where such distinction is indeed relevant (can’t think of one at the moment) but if there is tension in the workplace, I can’t work properly and someone makes me cry, I would definitely have issues.

Oh, completely agreed. I absolutely would. I was thinking more along the lines of, there's a distinction between "we didn't have any problems," and "I didn't have any problems with him," for some reason in my mind -- like, if there are any problems, it's not on my end (much in the same way that, per that article, she wasn't making him cry, therefore if there are issues it's not on her). But I work with kids and that seems to be the argument I get the most, so that's probably a necessary distinction only for me haha 

Edited August 24, 2016 by chraume

[Emma]

1 hour ago, anoldfriend said:

Nope. It's better to not say anything because the public will always take the actor's side and whoever gets it out there first controls the narrative. 

Plus the show is gone so who cares? Beside us. Not even really me, I'm in it for the lulz.

You seem to be in the know so I have to ask questions.

What's special about this case where it's best if no one says anything? Compared to similar cases where those involved were all to willing to air it out?

Happy to hear Stana isn't retired. Do you know what roles she's looking at? Any auditions she's been on? I understand if you can't mention specifics. I'm just hoping for a general direction she might be heading in.

I agree it's probably just fans that are still interested whatever their reasons. 

[Gant]

Quote

In Castle's case, it's interesting to me, that despite melodramatic allegations of crying and bullying popping up in tabloids (from where, I wonder), not one report speculated that a previous relationship was the cause of any tension. I would have thought that would be the obvious salacious place for tabloids to go.  And yet, they didn't.

I tried to minimize my exposure to tabloid trash during the heyday of the drama, but this was the one thing that jumped out at me: why no one made any allegations about romantic history gone sour? I'd have thought it would have been the easiest (and most juicy) way to attract readers. True or not doesn't matter, when did tabloids ever worry about assigning romantic angle to scandalous stuff? It suggested to me that this sudden avalanche of 'leaks' didn't originate so much from any random person(s) or the dam break due to the show's imminent cancellation, but was in fact controlled and carefully angled to serve a particular agenda. I don't really see any other reason for rags to avoid the bestselling sex stuff so completely in favor of supposed bullying. Maybe I'm too cynical, but I see it as logical :)

Watched the bloopers (haven't seen anything Castle for ages now, still have last episodes to catch on... maybe) and felt somewhat nostalgic, it used to be a fun show with likable characters/actors. I could have never foreseen it ending in such murky tabloid waters and ill will all around.

While I realize that nothing untoward could ever be put in bloopers, I still didn't get from them the feel of Castle season 8 as an unhappy set where everyone supposedly had to watch their step, observe power balances and keep different loyalties. Several Nathan/Stana interactions/reactions to each other sounded perfectly friendly to me, same with other actors (who were supposed to be all divided between 'mommy and daddy' according to fan narratives). If anything, were I a complete novice in Castle fandom matters, I might have thought that Molly was the one having issues with Nathan, lol. All that mouthing off and pretend pouting. Now, that's the kind of inside jokes that usually get misinterpreted by the fandom and spun into drrrama. Imagine if it was Stana or anyone else who reacted to Nathan this way, he'd have been raked over the coals for 'upsetting' her, being 'unprofessional' and an annoying jerk in general, lol.

But since people who usually get their panties in a twist over actors joking around are roughly the same people who love calling Molly unflattering names, it went completely overlooked. So I wanna be the first to spin a new theory! Molly hates Nathan, she can hardly stand him, but has to make nice because she's afraid of sexist bullying and doesn't want to ruin her career. In fact she's been non-stop crying in her trailer and sending secret notes of support to Stana's trailer, 8 years worth of notes!

[FlickerToAFlame]

@seamusdever Bloopers: yes, that was my finger, the "Satan's Ball sweat" line=scripted and yes, that was Nathan really tripping.

[Thirteen]

47 minutes ago, Emma said:

You seem to be in the know so I have to ask questions.

What's special about this case where it's best if no one says anything? Compared to similar cases where those involved were all to willing to air it out?

Happy to hear Stana isn't retired. Do you know what roles she's looking at? Any auditions she's been on? I understand if you can't mention specifics. I'm just hoping for a general direction she might be heading in.

I agree it's probably just fans that are still interested whatever their reasons. 

I've got another question. Why did she want to leave Castle so much? She might not be retired but she hasn't had much success outside Castle or shown any interest in changing that and her career doesn't seem to be going anywhere.

[anoldfriend]

59 minutes ago, Emma said:

You seem to be in the know so I have to ask questions.

What's special about this case where it's best if no one says anything? Compared to similar cases where those involved were all to willing to air it out?

Happy to hear Stana isn't retired. Do you know what roles she's looking at? Any auditions she's been on? I understand if you can't mention specifics. I'm just hoping for a general direction she might be heading in.

I agree it's probably just fans that are still interested whatever their reasons. 

Nothing special about this case, just in general it's better to not engage. That doesn't mean everyone will always follow it. 

Stana's team got to the media first. The studio/network took the high road. 

There is no win and no merit in issuing another statement. What would it say anyway? It would turn into a he said she said and you aren't going to change anyone's mind, and really like Sonik pointed out above, Stana didn't say she was fired. She didn't say anything really except thank ABC. Bloggers (I refuse to call them journalists) and Twitter decided what happened. Do I hold Stana accountable for that? Yes. Because I too have my fan moments and I expected more. 

Thanks to millennials new favorite word being "misogyny", the myth about the gender pay gap, and Donald Trump for being a loud gross douche bag, no matter what the real story is, people make up their minds and it's over. They cry conspiracy and slap a label on it and move onto the next thing to be outraged about. 

Something to note: None of this means I think TPTB handled all this correctly. It's just not the huge conspiracy people think it is. Two big fat egos ruined a show. Isn't the first, won't be the last. 

[anoldfriend]

22 minutes ago, Thirteen said:

I've got another question. Why did she want to leave Castle so much? She might not be retired but she hasn't had much success outside Castle or shown any interest in changing that and her career doesn't seem to be going anywhere.

Besides the elephant?

Only Stana can answer that. But from listening to the few interviews she gave over the recent years, I think she is grateful for the work, but probably bored and worried that all she will ever be is Beckett. It's not exactly Emmy worthy shit. 

[Kromm]

21 minutes ago, anoldfriend said:

Besides the elephant?

Only Stana can answer that. But from listening to the few interviews she gave over the recent years, I think she is grateful for the work, but probably bored and worried that all she will ever be is Beckett. It's not exactly Emmy worthy shit. 

Stana was beautiful, with good comic timing, and a lot of charm.

That said, while that made her enjoyable on this show it was never very clear to me if she could actually PLAY anything Emmy worthy. 

[Thirteen]

26 minutes ago, anoldfriend said:

Besides the elephant?

Only Stana can answer that. But from listening to the few interviews she gave over the recent years, I think she is grateful for the work, but probably bored and worried that all she will ever be is Beckett. It's not exactly Emmy worthy shit. 

The irony would be if after throwing a studio/network under the bus, all she will ever be remembered for is for playing Beckett.

And since we're airing Castle's dirty laundry, which part did Nathan play in the show's cancelation? Did he request to limit filming with Stana to two days per episode or was it more tabloid fodder?

Edited August 24, 2016 by Thirteen

[chraume]

17 minutes ago, Thirteen said:

The irony would be if after throwing a studio/network under the bus, all she will ever be remembered for is for playing Beckett.

And since we're airing Castle's dirty laundry, which part did Nathan play in the show's cancelation? Did he request to limit filming with Stana to two days per episode or was it more tabloid fodder?

I don't actually have any insider info or any knowledge one way or the other, but what struck me about the initial article from Deadline was the fact that it states the two-days-a-week stipulation, and it's the only part of the article that doesn't reference a "source" for the info, or say "allegedly," for what it's worth: "Fillion and Katic only filmed together two days a week this season, which was stipulated in Fillion’s contract amid reports of on-set tension between the two." I interpreted that (and the fact that, well, they weren't in an episode together for more than two days/ep) as more or less confirmation.

Edited August 24, 2016 by chraume

[Thirteen]

6 minutes ago, chraume said:

I don't actually have any insider info or any knowledge one way or the other, but what struck me about the initial article from Deadline was the fact that it states the two-days-a-week stipulation, and it's the only part of the article that doesn't reference a "source" for the info, or say "allegedly," for what it's worth: "Fillion and Katic only filmed together two days a week this season, which was stipulated in Fillion’s contract amid reports of on-set tension between the two." I interpreted that (and the fact that, well, they weren't in an episode together for more than two days/ep) as more or less confirmation.

That would have been the most unreasonable and absurd demand he could have ever requested for a show like Castle but ouch! it must have stung Stana's ego.

[madmaverick]

Stana has always seemed to me to be more into film than TV.   With the clock ticking, maybe she wanted to try her luck there and in cable TV, where everyone seems to want to go.  I think everyone's grateful for Castle, but after 8 years, it does become mostly just a job.  I also think she got married and she was ready for new beginnings in every sense of the word.  Remember how she suddenly chose to auction off that concert ticket she'd kept unbelievably for all these years for that concert she'd watched with Nathan during the pilot filming, and that shirt she wore to her Castle audition that Nathan cut off of her?  I think that was part of moving on, from the show, and from the elephant.  I'm not really a fan of aggressive PR moves, but whether they'll pay off for her, time will tell.

Not only was it amazing to me that the tabloids never seized on the elephant when the shit hit the fan, but that the existence of said relationship never emerged even in some harmless article throughout the years.  Neither of the two individuals involved seem like sharers in that sense, but I would have thought someone would have leaked something to the press.  You see mentions about on set romances for other shows all the time in mainstream entertainment outlets even after they are over.  But not here.  So maybe they ran a really tight ship on set until the shit hit the fan at the end.

I'd previously thought that any bts issues had climaxed around S5 (no pun intended heh), and things had settled more into a new normal after that with everyone moving on. I wouldn't have thought any animosity would peak again around S7/8, even with a marriage, unless perhaps there is more to the story than assumed.

Quote

 

Bloggers (I refuse to call them journalists)

 

This.

 

1 hour ago, Gant said:

I tried to minimize my exposure to tabloid trash during the heyday of the drama, but this was the one thing that jumped out at me: why no one made any allegations about romantic history gone sour? I'd have thought it would have been the easiest (and most juicy) way to attract readers. True or not doesn't matter, when did tabloids ever worry about assigning romantic angle to scandalous stuff? It suggested to me that this sudden avalanche of 'leaks' didn't originate so much from any random person(s) or the dam break due to the show's imminent cancellation, but was in fact controlled and carefully angled to serve a particular agenda. I don't really see any other reason for rags to avoid the bestselling sex stuff so completely in favor of supposed bullying. Maybe I'm too cynical, but I see it as logical :)

Count me in in that cynical cum logical boat with ya.  But due to a similar desire to minimize exposure to tabloid trash, I won't pretend to be an expert in the ways they operate.  One can only deduce.  It's just sad that they get so much mileage.  No wonder politicians use them along with actors to manage the narrative.

1 hour ago, Gant said:

Watched the bloopers (haven't seen anything Castle for ages now, still have last episodes to catch on... maybe) and felt somewhat nostalgic, it used to be a fun show with likable characters/actors. I could have never foreseen it ending in such murky tabloid waters and ill will all around.

Nor could I, nor could I.  I was feeling nostalgic too, so I watched some Caskett scenes on the tube.  Whatever their offscreen issues, onscreen, they just had something special, especially when they really engaged.

1 hour ago, Gant said:

While I realize that nothing untoward could ever be put in bloopers, I still didn't get from them the feel of Castle season 8 as an unhappy set where everyone supposedly had to watch their step, observe power balances and keep different loyalties. Several Nathan/Stana interactions/reactions to each other sounded perfectly friendly to me, same with other actors (who were supposed to be all divided between 'mommy and daddy' according to fan narratives). If anything, were I a complete novice in Castle fandom matters, I might have thought that Molly was the one having issues with Nathan, lol. All that mouthing off and pretend pouting. Now, that's the kind of inside jokes that usually get misinterpreted by the fandom and spun into drrrama. Imagine if it was Stana or anyone else who reacted to Nathan this way, he'd have been raked over the coals for 'upsetting' her, being 'unprofessional' and an annoying jerk in general, lol.

As it is, some fans are already so irked by the bloopers that they've produced an edited version with just Stana in it lol.  I get the feeling that's the way they prefer the whole show. ;)  It's funny how some are seeing discord from the bloopers, others nothing unusual.  You can just about tailor anything to your fan narrative if you twist it hard enough. ;)  If one person jokes, it's hilarious.  If it's another, it's annoying and childish. ;)

I thought the perception that the other actors didn't really appear to take sides, perhaps with the exception of Molly, was an indicator that there weren't really sides to take in a rupture flowing from something so personal.

1 hour ago, Gant said:

But since people who usually get their panties in a twist over actors joking around are roughly the same people who love calling Molly unflattering names, it went completely overlooked. So I wanna be the first to spin a new theory! Molly hates Nathan, she can hardly stand him, but has to make nice because she's afraid of sexist bullying and doesn't want to ruin her career. In fact she's been non-stop crying in her trailer and sending secret notes of support to Stana's trailer, 8 years worth of notes!

The language that's been directed at Molly re Nathan from fangirls is some of the ugliest and most disgusting I've seen in fandom.  That's real misogyny there.  Some study showed that 50% of misogynistic tweets actually originated from women.  Sad.

12 minutes ago, chraume said:

I don't actually have any insider info or any knowledge one way or the other, but what struck me about the initial article from Deadline was the fact that it states the two-days-a-week stipulation, and it's the only part of the article that doesn't reference a "source" for the info, or say "allegedly," for what it's worth: "Fillion and Katic only filmed together two days a week this season, which was stipulated in Fillion’s contract amid reports of on-set tension between the two." I interpreted that (and the fact that, well, they weren't in an episode together for more than two days/ep) as more or less confirmation.

I always found it curious as well that nothing was ever 'leaked' about Stana's contract.  Nothing at all.  Nothing about her presumably demanding more time off as part of her S8 contract.

[anoldfriend]

23 minutes ago, madmaverick said:

 

Not only was it amazing to me that the tabloids never seized on the elephant when the shit hit the fan, but that the existence of said relationship never emerged even in some harmless article throughout the years.  Neither of the two individuals involved seem like sharers in that sense, but I would have thought someone would have leaked something to the press.  You see mentions about on set romances for other shows all the time in mainstream entertainment outlets even after they are over.  But not here.  So maybe they ran a really tight ship on set until the shit hit the fan at the end.

Because right or wrong, whatever it was, whatever it wasn't, there was still an underlying layer of respect and realness. What happened wasn't to promote the show or themselves. Most of the time when stuff leaks to the tabloids it's from one camp or another. When you see "a source says" it's one of the publicists of the parties involved. Neither of them wanted to burn the other that way. No one is ever going to confirm that particular elephant. Nothing good will come of that, because while it should provide a certain level of empathy, it will just make someone a villain. Both of them actually depending on whom you speak to. 

[chraume]

31 minutes ago, Thirteen said:

That would have been the most unreasonable and absurd demand he could have ever requested for a show like Castle but ouch! it must have stung Stana's ego.

Oh, agreed. 

30 minutes ago, madmaverick said:

I thought the perception that the other actors didn't really appear to take sides, perhaps with the exception of Molly, was an indicator that there weren't really sides to take in a rupture flowing from something so personal.

That was my perception, as well. I know that some have interpreted that as actual vs. forced-and-scared-for-your-job friendship, but there does seem to be honest admiration from cast and crew from both sides, which I can only assume wouldn't be the case if one was a terror. I mean, obviously some play favourites -- some of the crew adore Stana, and Molly is obviously all about Nathan -- but that's true of everything, obviously sometimes people just like some people more than others. 

30 minutes ago, madmaverick said:

Stana has always seemed to me to be more into film than TV.   With the clock ticking, maybe she wanted to try her luck there and in cable TV, where everyone seems to want to go.  I think everyone's grateful for Castle, but after 8 years, it does become mostly just a job.  I also think she got married and she was ready for new beginnings in every sense of the word.  Remember how she suddenly chose to auction off that concert ticket she'd kept unbelievably for all these years for that concert she'd watched with Nathan during the pilot filming, and that shirt she wore to her Castle audition that Nathan cut off of her?  I think that was part of moving on, from the show, and from the elephant.  I'm not really a fan of aggressive PR moves, but whether they'll pay off for her, time will tell.

Well and, tbh, after eight years in the same job? I'd be bored out of my mind, too. It's not like Hollywood has a lot of "upwards" moves for actors -- it's all lateral, into new, and perhaps bigger, roles -- so staying in the same position would rarely have the challenges that keep people engaged in their jobs, I'd guess. No shame if she did want to try something new. I actually had the stupid idea to try to argue with one of her more ardent fans on Twitter earlier this year, who seemed personally offended at the implication that perhaps SK would be looking for new roles/would have asked for time off (which is not to say that I said that either of those had happened, or that I believed them to be true -- just that it was a possible alternative theory to reduced screentime instead of some massive conspiracy), which was as baffling to me then as it is now. I'd absolute want some time off even without BTS stuff to contend with. I love my current job and am still actively on a job search now to try to my hand at a new position with new challenges. 

30 minutes ago, madmaverick said:

Count me in in that cynical cum logical boat with ya.  But due to a similar desire to minimize exposure to tabloid trash, I won't pretend to be an expert in the ways they operate.  One can only deduce.  It's just sad that they get so much mileage.  No wonder politicians use them along with actors to manage the narrative.

That's actually a great question, I hadn't thought of it before. I know that there have been some tabloids over the years stating outright that they had been in a relationship, and while I thought it was BS then and honestly don't have enough information to form an opinion now, it is striking that even the tabloids that had previously speculated about it (like the Daily Mail, which is trash) went mum when given actual fodder for it (the lovers-gone-wrong angle would sell well, wouldn't it?)

Edited August 24, 2016 by chraume