Chit-Chat: The Feels

[tearknee]

I just tell people where i am now that i grew tired of America. They don't need to know why.

I drank away friends and God knows what else over the years.

I hope my egg donor ("mom") is roasting nicely.

[Dimity]

37 minutes ago, tearknee said:

About me reminding people to think like a normal person might when looking at how the public or members of the marginalized 'vote against their interests' instead of someone that sits at home reading one of the Classics.

Classics?  I am going to guess you are thinking of Ivory Tower intellectuals, maybe turn of the 20th century bluestockings?  Because I can't think of anyone I know who sits at home reading the Classics.

ETA: And you seem to be assuming that only marginalized people vote against their own best interests.  That's simply, and sadly, not true, not true at all.  As the upcoming election here in Canada will make all too clear 😔.

Edited 3 hours ago by Dimity

[peacheslatour]

3 minutes ago, Dimity said:

I remember that "go out for a beer" thing being a big deal back when Bush Jr was president.  The weird thing about Trump is that his base seem to see him as just one of the guys, well one of the really rich guys,  but he's never made any secret of his disdain for anyone who isn't rich and working on getting richer.

They think he understands the problems of the working class!

[tearknee]

34 minutes ago, Dimity said:

Classics?  I am going to guess you are thinking of Ivory Tower intellectuals, maybe turn of the 20th century bluestockings?  Because I can't think of anyone I know who sits at home reading the Classics.

ETA: And you seem to be assuming that only marginalized people vote against their own best interests.  That's simply, and sadly, not true, not true at all.  As the upcoming election here in Canada will make all too clear 😔.

I was describing those who read Jane Austen, Tolkien, C.S. Lewis, Bronte and those such. Not study Latin or Ancient Greek.

[Dimity]

37 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

They think he understands the problems of the working class!

SMH.  And the really sad thing is, depending on your definition of the working class (for now I'm going to go with anyone who works for a living) thanks to Trump and Musk et al there are going to be a lot of people out of work in the coming months.  Whose financial precariousness he, of course, will accept no responsibility for, and which, likely he will even be bragging about.

Edited 2 hours ago by Dimity

[Dimity]

I've been trying to avoid reading too much about the tragedy over the Potomac and Trump's unhinged reaction to it but someone on FB just posted that the pilots on board the Army helicopter were two white men.  How does this jibe with Trump insisting the accident was because of DEI? 

[tearknee]

The Detritus of Economic Incompetence? (Congress not Biden)

Edited 2 hours ago by tearknee

[Notabug]

1 hour ago, tearknee said:

About me reminding people to think like a normal person might when looking at how the public or members of the marginalized 'vote against their interests' instead of someone that sits at home reading one of the Classics. This tends to be a systematic problem with web-based forums (and newsgroups before them). Not your fault, though.

I think the vast majority of us online are 'normal' and we don't have to do any sort of mental gymnastics to think like 'normal' people. I love to read, read a book cover to cover most weeks, but haven't read one of the Classics for fun in many years.  

We all tend to want to put people into neat little boxes and it just doesn't work.  Stereotyping is stereotyping whether it is people posting on web-based forums, Trump supporters or gay people.  

35 minutes ago, Dimity said:

I've been trying to avoid reading too much about the tragedy over the Potomac and Trump's unhinged reaction to it but someone on FB just posted that the pilots on board the Army helicopter were two white men.  How does this jibe with Trump insisting the accident was because of DEI? 

Because he has 'common sense' or at least that was what he said at his press conference when a reporter questioned the connection. I am sure one of those soldiers had a third grade teacher who was black or a flight instructor who was gay.  Clearly, they were the cause of the crash.  If you're expecting logic, you're looking in the wrong place.

According to news reports I've seen, the pilot was a white female who had over 500 hours of flight time and was accompanied by an instructor.  I feel so sad that her family is undoubtedly going to hear her skills and career dragged by a bunch of idiots.

BTW, despite Trump's assertions; the FAA has NEVER used DEI criteria in hiring or training air traffic controllers.

Edited 1 hour ago by Notabug

[PRgal]

Elon is going to be p!$$ed!

 

https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/liberal-leadership/article/chrystia-freeland-says-canada-should-target-elon-musks-tesla-in-a-tariff-fight/

[tearknee]

5 minutes ago, Notabug said:

I think the vast majority of us online are 'normal' and we don't have to do any sort of mental gymnastics to think like 'normal' people. I love to read, read a book cover to cover most weeks, but haven't read one of the Classics for fun in many years.  

We all tend to want to put people into neat little boxes and it just doesn't work.  Stereotyping is stereotyping whether it is people posting on web-based forums, Trump supporters or gay people.  

But most of the posters here and elsewhere online are acting all befuddled in their rage that Trump has won twice (or that Brexit happened and such). A strong indication that the educated middle and upper middle class isn't able to fathom the non-elite*

 

* Please don't tell me that your mother was a boilermaker. Regardless of your class background, if you went to university, have a white-collar job and live in an affluent suburb or area, you are part of the elite. Much of the political discourse takes place between rival factions of this elite, while the non-elite majority are mowing their lawns or watching the Kardashians and their predecessors and successors.

 

 

[Avaleigh]

41 minutes ago, Dimity said:

I've been trying to avoid reading too much about the tragedy over the Potomac and Trump's unhinged reaction to it but someone on FB just posted that the pilots on board the Army helicopter were two white men.  How does this jibe with Trump insisting the accident was because of DEI? 

According to NPR, a military official said that, at the request of the family, the name of the third member of the crew is not going to be identified. It's unusual for a name to be withheld, but I can't say that I blame the family one bit for making the request in order to protect their daughter's name and reputation considering how many people are using this tragedy to push false and hurtful agendas regarding DEI.

[bluegirl147]

18 minutes ago, tearknee said:

But most of the posters here and elsewhere online are acting all befuddled in their rage that Trump has won twice (or that Brexit happened and such). A strong indication that the educated middle and upper middle class isn't able to fathom the non-elite*

 

* Please don't tell me that your mother was a boilermaker. Regardless of your class background, if you went to university, have a white-collar job and live in an affluent suburb or area, you are part of the elite. Much of the political discourse takes place between rival factions of this elite, while the non-elite majority are mowing their lawns or watching the Kardashians and their predecessors and successors.

 

 

I disagree with pretty much everything you have said.  

You are entitled to your opinion but it sounds like you are judging people you don't know.

And for the record I have never watched any Kardashian show.

[peacheslatour]

14 minutes ago, tearknee said:

But most of the posters here and elsewhere online are acting all befuddled in their rage that Trump has won twice (or that Brexit happened and such). A strong indication that the educated middle and upper middle class isn't able to fathom the non-elite*

 

* Please don't tell me that your mother was a boilermaker. Regardless of your class background, if you went to university, have a white-collar job and live in an affluent suburb or area, you are part of the elite. Much of the political discourse takes place between rival factions of this elite, while the non-elite majority are mowing their lawns or watching the Kardashians and their predecessors and successors.

 

 

I'm finding some of your posts to be a little enigmatic. Do you mean Donald Trump and Elon Musk represent the working class better than Kamala and Tim Walz? If they are not at the top of the "elite" hill, I don't know who is.

 

[PRgal]

7 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

I'm finding some of your posts to be a little enigmatic. Do you mean Donald Trump and Elon Musk represent the working class better than Kamala and Tim Walz? If they are not at the top of the "elite" hill, I don't know who is.

 

If you ask some people, he’ll tell you it’s about behaviour or perceived behaviour.  You know who behaves like how “regular” people (ie blue collar/people without degrees/whatever) think the wealthy are like.  There are also those who believe that those with a certain income only fall within one or two ethnic groups and can’t fathom that someone like me could be of above average income.  

[peacheslatour]

4 minutes ago, PRgal said:

If you ask some people, he’ll tell you it’s about behaviour or perceived behaviour.  You know who behaves like how “regular” people (ie blue collar/people without degrees/whatever) think the wealthy are like.  There are also those who believe that those with a certain income only fall within one or two ethnic groups and can’t fathom that someone like me could be of above average income.  

Huh. That seems odd.

[Anela]

53 minutes ago, Notabug said:

I think the vast majority of us online are 'normal' and we don't have to do any sort of mental gymnastics to think like 'normal' people. I love to read, read a book cover to cover most weeks, but haven't read one of the Classics for fun in many years.  

We all tend to want to put people into neat little boxes and it just doesn't work.  Stereotyping is stereotyping whether it is people posting on web-based forums, Trump supporters or gay people.  

Because he has 'common sense' or at least that was what he said at his press conference when a reporter questioned the connection. I am sure one of those soldiers had a third grade teacher who was black or a flight instructor who was gay.  Clearly, they were the cause of the crash.  If you're expecting logic, you're looking in the wrong place.

According to news reports I've seen, the pilot was a white female who had over 500 hours of flight time and was accompanied by an instructor.  I feel so sad that her family is undoubtedly going to hear her skills and career dragged by a bunch of idiots.

BTW, despite Trump's assertions; the FAA has NEVER used DEI criteria in hiring or training air traffic controllers.

Nobody was stereotyping gay people. But since I did mention them before, because of the Log Cabin Republicans who are repeatedly shocked when their own party votes against them, I'm going to post this, too:

Idaho Republican legislators call on SCOTUS to reverse same-sex marriage ruling

Maybe there are gay republicans who don't want to get married. Even so, why would they support a party that seems to want that for every gay person?

41 minutes ago, tearknee said:

But most of the posters here and elsewhere online are acting all befuddled in their rage that Trump has won twice (or that Brexit happened and such). A strong indication that the educated middle and upper middle class isn't able to fathom the non-elite*

 

* Please don't tell me that your mother was a boilermaker. Regardless of your class background, if you went to university, have a white-collar job and live in an affluent suburb or area, you are part of the elite. Much of the political discourse takes place between rival factions of this elite, while the non-elite majority are mowing their lawns or watching the Kardashians and their predecessors and successors.

 

 

* Didn't go to university.

* Don't have a white collar job, or any job. I need one.

* Don't live in a wealthy area. I live in a red-ish part of a blue county.

* Both parents came from poor families, and we've only ever been "getting by". If we sold this house, we wouldn't be able to afford to move anywhere, but into a trailer. 

* Dad is a delivery person, he delivers things that other people order. He spent December, delivering Christmas to everyone. He's a blue-collar Santa.

* The only time the Kardashians have ever been on my screen, were when I fell asleep watching "Julie and Julia" on Bravo, and woke up to them screaming at each other. That was in 2012. I turned it off. My dad mows our lawn. 

8 minutes ago, PRgal said:

If you ask some people, he’ll tell you it’s about behaviour or perceived behaviour.  You know who behaves like how “regular” people (ie blue collar/people without degrees/whatever) think the wealthy are like.  There are also those who believe that those with a certain income only fall within one or two ethnic groups and can’t fathom that someone like me could be of above average income.  

Why would anyone assume that you are poor, because of your ethnicity?

Edited 1 hour ago by Anela

[tearknee]

Most people don't conduct discourse on poli-social issues. That point stands.

22 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

I'm finding some of your posts to be a little enigmatic. Do you mean Donald Trump and Elon Musk represent the working class better than Kamala and Tim Walz? If they are not at the top of the "elite" hill, I don't know who is.

 

An intellectual elite is still an elite.

[Anela]

Just now, tearknee said:

Most people don't conduct discourse on poli-social issues. That point stands.

I walked away from two older women, in December 2019, in a bookstore cafe, after I'd been feeling good and smiling at their chatter. They were laughing, and having fun, until they started talking about politics. The one loud woman was MAGA, and she was bringing up all of their lies, including those about college professors indoctrinating students. So, they ARE talking about politics, they're just spreading conspiracy theories they've heard. And Fox News talking points. 

[PRgal]

14 minutes ago, Anela said:

 

Why would anyone assume that you are poor, because of your ethnicity?

Especially in media, everyone generalized immigrant families to the same category of marginalization.  Even if the opposite is true right in front of them.  Or maybe people Judy pretend to ignore fact.  I was working with a music program where they stressed offering music lessons to minority communities.  The woman I spoke (South Asian heritage) with appeared surprised when I said piano and/or violin lessons were pretty standard for immigrant East Asian families.  This wasn’t in person but on Zoom, so maybe the body language wasn’t accurate?  I felt that she thought I was saying something unusual.  

Edited 53 minutes ago by PRgal

[peacheslatour]

2 minutes ago, tearknee said:

Most people don't conduct discourse on poli-social issues. That point stands.

An intellectual elite is still an elite.

I wish I knew what point you're trying to make. Is that people who educate themselves and disdain reality television aren't relatable to the average person?

[Anela]

For all the talk of stereotypes, I feel like liberals have been stereotyped a lot in this thread. 

[Spartan Girl]

2 hours ago, Dimity said:

I remember that "go out for a beer" thing being a big deal back when Bush Jr was president.  The weird thing about Trump is that his base seem to see him as just one of the guys, well one of the really rich guys,  but he's never made any secret of his disdain for anyone who isn't rich and working on getting richer.

Seriously! You’d be more likely to grab a beer with Biden and Harris than with Trump—remember when it was a big to deal see Obama and Biden grab burgers together? Oh, I miss those days…

[Dimity]

1 minute ago, Spartan Girl said:

remember when it was a big to deal see Obama and Biden grab burgers together? Oh, I miss those days

And Biden throughout his political career tried to take the train as often as he could.  Can you see Trump on a train?  Well maybe if he owned it.

[Spartan Girl]

I will never understand the mentality of people that consider Trump a “blue collar billionaire” while turning their nose up at Joe “Scranton” Biden as an elitist.

[Dimity]

10 minutes ago, PRgal said:

Especially in media, everyone generalized immigrant families to the same category of marginalization.

Assuming all immigrant families are poor is stupid, not a stereotype (not that stereotypes aren't stupid) but the stereotype most associated with people of your ethnic background are usually quite positive aren't they?  "You must be good at math" "I bet you're top of  your class" kind of thing.  One negative one I hear a lot has nothing to do with income level but with driving ability.  And god help you here if you are Chinese and female - Worst Driver Ever.

[Annber03]

5 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

Also having children is delayed because women want to focus on their career firsts.  And then when they do want a family they need fertility treatments which are not cheap.  Didn't Trump say free IVF for everyone who wants it?

If it wasn't so scary and legit handmaid ish I would laugh at the right's attempts to hold off this country becoming minority majority. Wanting to deport millions of brown people.  Banning abortions.  Making it harder for women get an education to enable her to get a well paying job.

You know one big reason women aren't getting married and having kids?  They can't find men they want to spend their life with.  The pickings were slim when I was younger and looks to be even worse now.

This. All of this. 

I'm single and without children and I'm perfectly happy with that, and I am not here for people thinking I need to fit their narrow view of how women should live their lives. I am all for people becoming mothers and getting married if that is what they want, but there are many of us who don't want that, or at least, it's not our main goal (If I ever meet someone I want to marry someday, I would be happy doing so, but I'm not looiking to do so right now), and that choice needs to be respected, too. I do not get why people think it's their business whether or not women like me are married and pumping out children. 

But yeah, for all the talk the GOP made about the economy, I'm not exactly sure how forcing women to have children they may not be able to afford is going to help with that. Course, if the  GOP were capable of using logic, they wouldn't be the GOP, so...

Edited 41 minutes ago by Annber03

[PRgal]

3 minutes ago, Dimity said:

Assuming all immigrant families are poor is stupid, not a stereotype (not that stereotypes aren't stupid) but the stereotype most associated with people of your ethnic background are usually quite positive aren't they?  "You must be good at math" "I bet you're top of  your class" kind of thing.  One negative one I hear a lot has nothing to do with income level but with driving ability.  And god help you here if you are Chinese and female - Worst Driver Ever.

It’s more the White leftist elite (save for the south Asian lady I mentioned earlier) who love to brush all non-White groups into one single category of marginalization, which includes income and education.  Only recently did I see media talk about Ontario’s new medical school prioritizing “underrepresented” minority groups (or whatever term they’re using) rather than racialized/minority groups in general.  Because we all know that this prioritizing means those of certain Asian groups aren’t included.  I guess they got complaints.  

[Dimity]

[tearknee]

38 minutes ago, Anela said:

For all the talk of stereotypes, I feel like liberals have been stereotyped a lot in this thread. 

For a lie to work, it must be shrouded in truth.

Lots of liberals hated Reagan but Bonzo won '84 in... well, we know.

Didn't help that friggin' Fritz and Gerry were his opposition instead of someone like John Glenn. Then we had to endure Monkey Business and then the Tank.

 

[Lugal]

3 hours ago, Notabug said:

I think it shows how complex people are.  Gay people not a monolith anymore than straight people or white people.  Gay is just one part of who they are and, as we all know, nobody agrees 100% with every plank in their party's platform.  It does seem a bit out there that someone might support a political party that wants to deny them basic civil rights; but I know more than a couple gay Republicans who feel the Republican party represents their interests better than the Dems. They seem to think that the Republicans won't be able to reverse the gains they've made; but, after Roe v. Wade, I think they're dreaming.  Still, they're smart, well-informed people and they believe what they believe.

Exactly! The only thing that all gay people have in common is that they are all gay.  It should be noted that Peter Thiel is gay and he supported Trump.  Because Trump represents his interests better than Biden would (It's the same for every group, there is a small elite that hold the majority of the wealth of that group).

[peacheslatour]

33 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

This. All of this. 

I'm single and without children and I'm perfectly happy with that, and I am not here for people thinking I need to fit their narrow view of how women should live their lives. I am all for people becoming mothers and getting married if that is what they want, but there are many of us who don't want that, or at least, it's not our main goal (If I ever meet someone I want to marry someday, I would be happy doing so, but I'm not looiking to do so right now), and that choice needs to be respected, too. I do not get why people think it's their business whether or not women like me are married and pumping out children. 

But yeah, for all the talk the GOP made about the economy, I'm not exactly sure how forcing women to have children they may not be able to afford is going to help with that. Course, if the  GOP were capable of using logic, they wouldn't be the GOP, so...

[Anela]

4 minutes ago, tearknee said:

For a lie to work, it must be shrouded in truth.

Lots of liberals hated Reagan but Bonzo won '84 in... well, we know.

Didn't help that friggin' Fritz and Gerry were his opposition instead of someone like John Glenn. Then we had to endure Monkey Business and then the Tank.

 

I have no idea what you just said. 

2 minutes ago, Lugal said:

Exactly! The only thing that all gay people have in common is that they are all gay.  It should be noted that Peter Thiel is gay and he supported Trump.  Because Trump represents his interests better than Biden would (It's the same for every group, there is a small elite that hold the majority of the wealth of that group).

Oh my god, nobody was stereotyping. But democrats are the ones supporting things like gay marriage. Republicans typically haven’t wanted their gay counterparts to be included in events.  
 

@Soapy Goddess so you’ve known about bird flu for months, but the understanding only kicked in last week? 

[tearknee]

Walter Mondale, Geraldine Ferraro, Gary Hart, Michael Dukakis.

 

*turns* "Hello, wall!"