S04.E07: Crossing the Line

[paulvdb]

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A group on Mars takes drastic measures. Margo grapples with a new assignment.

Premiere date: December 22, 2023

[Haleth]

It was only a matter of time before someone got killed because of the strike. I don’t get Sam - one minute she’s saying things have gone too far and it has to stop, next minute she’s urging the strikers not to take Dev’s deal.

Dev and Ed are going to steal an asteroid?  Seriously?

[marinw]

1 hour ago, Haleth said:

Dev and Ed are going to steal an asteroid?  Seriously?

What could possibly go wrong? 

[bigmag]

What the strikers did should be considered criminal.  They removed access to all the spacesuits, effectively trapping (kidnapping?) everyone inside the hub.  What if something catastropic had happened and everyone needed to evacuate? And the removal of the primary bypass valve is criminal vandalism at the very least. 

Also, I've been trying to figure out how they got the injured personnel back to the main hub?  Surely they didn't drag/push them through that long underground tunnel, but what other option was there?

[Cramps]

I was wondering how they got to the injured astronauts too. 
 

I know Ed can be stubborn and self-centered, but now he’s just a petulant child who is breaking things because he didn’t get his way. I can’t decide if it’s organic or too big a jump for the character. 
 

More Margot! 
 

“Hey kids, let’s steal an asteroid!” 

[Haleth]

34 minutes ago, bigmag said:

Also, I've been trying to figure out how they got the injured personnel back to the main hub?  Surely they didn't drag/push them through that long underground tunnel, but what other option was there?

I assumed there were extra suits in the facility where the explosion happened and a vehicle to transport everyone back. 

[marinw]

Dev is playing 12 dimensional chess. I think he’s going to screw the people who accepted his offer because they aren’t dedicated enough or something.

I predict Alex will never leave Mars.

It would be hilarious of it turns out that the initial reading of Goldilocks was wrong, and if that asteroid is not filled with Unobtainium, but is in fact an unremarkable ball of rock like thousands of other balls of rock.

I don't know why I care, but where is Miles? Did he end up with Dev or Ed. I'm guessing Dev.

Edited December 23, 2023 by marinw

[PurpleTentacle]

So one of the demands was really to bring the asteroid to Mars? Well that is a dumbass thing to demand. But on the other hand, it doesn't seem like anybody countered that demand with something realistic before Dev came along. What a shitshow. Danielle really made me roll my eyes "What can we do except for meeting the workers demand, at least the ones that are reasonable? How can we really fuck them over?!" K. My respect for her tended towards zero at the end of that episode.

Dev: "The first 100 people to cross this line will recieve a quadrupel payday bonus." Um Dev, there were way less than a 100 people there. Was that really supposed to be an incentive to move fast?

5 hours ago, bigmag said:

What the strikers did should be considered criminal.  They removed access to all the spacesuits, effectively trapping (kidnapping?) everyone inside the hub.  What if something catastropic had happened and everyone needed to evacuate? And the removal of the primary bypass valve is criminal vandalism at the very least. 

Well what the company did should be considered criminal. Changing the contracts unilaterally in that way is nothing short of theft.

Also how is removing acess to the spacesuits kidnapping? Not being able to walk over to the refinery being equal to being kidnapped is a massive stretch.

Removing a part is not criminal vandalism, since it can be put back with minimal effort. It is theft. But considering the company just commited theft on a far, far bigger scale: Meh. Also nobody could have seen coming that those scabs would try to bypass a vital part. That explosion is on them, not on the people on strike.

5 hours ago, bigmag said:

Also, I've been trying to figure out how they got the injured personnel back to the main hub?  Surely they didn't drag/push them through that long underground tunnel, but what other option was there?

I assume the people on strike restored access to the space suits and buggies after the accident. They aren't monsters.

4 hours ago, marinw said:

It would be hilarious of it turns out that the initial reading of Goldilocks was wrong, and if that asteroid is not filled with Unobtainium, but is in fact an unremarkable ball of rock like thousands of other balls of rock.

That they can just devine at distance that it is supposedly filled with Iridium is still so laughable that it would be funny if it turned out to be total bullshit.

[whiporee]

I like Dev's plan. I think it's the only way to make Mars self-sustaining. And it's pretty shitty of the Earthers to have the Mars crew do all the hard work of capturing the asteroid and then take the fruits of their labor. Almost as though there was a metaphor working. 

I'd like some sort of breakdown of the operations of the base. I think most of the people who are there are Helios, not NASA or Roscosmos. The fuel refining must be Helios, because it's Helios contracts that are messing things up -- they aren't government employees or federal workers of any country. So the Earth nations are planning for Helios to help capture the rock, help bring it back to Earth, and then, as Margo told Irina, let other companies start mining it, too? They are the only ones who have put the capital into Mars, and now they are supposed to let one of the biggest payoffs of that just leave? Because it's easier for the Earth governments? Fuck that -- if I'm Dev, I do the same thing. Steal the bastard. 

I'd feel the same way if I were Ed. This has been his home for a decade. He's a cowboy used to frontiers. He doesn't want to go back to Earth -- he wants the people who have helped build Mars to benefit from Mars. (It's not hard to see why every Sci Fi story involving Mars colonization eventually ends up at this place). 

On a sidenote, Massey is KGB.  I don't think the USSR wants this to work at all, but they can't publicly say that. So they institute work slowdowns and unrest and strikes, and the opportunity slips on by without it really being their fault. 

Also, i don't like the idea at all of pushing a 1.1 km rock towards Earth for any reason, especially with how often things go wrong on this show. Once they have it coming towards us, they gotta then find a way to get it into orbit. That's a lot of mass to point at a fairly fragile, inhabited planet. 

 

[Haleth]

Where was Miles?

[PurpleTentacle]

2 hours ago, whiporee said:

I like Dev's plan. I think it's the only way to make Mars self-sustaining. And it's pretty shitty of the Earthers to have the Mars crew do all the hard work of capturing the asteroid and then take the fruits of their labor. Almost as though there was a metaphor working. 

As long as they are paid well I honestly don't see the problem. It's not like anybody but the two completely insane old men actually want to stay there forever.

Helios tried to pay the Mars workers with peanuts, but it does seem like they'll get paid well now, so the only reason to bring the asteroid to Mars is Dev's and Ed's egos and insane notions of staying on Mars forever.

Sending the asteroid to Mars means it will be exploited in decades instead of a few years, massively putting humanity back. It also won't make Mars self-sustaining. What do they need this much Iridium for? You can't eat it. It will give Mars power and influence though.

2 hours ago, whiporee said:

Also, i don't like the idea at all of pushing a 1.1 km rock towards Earth for any reason, especially with how often things go wrong on this show. Once they have it coming towards us, they gotta then find a way to get it into orbit. That's a lot of mass to point at a fairly fragile, inhabited planet. 

I still doubt you can put such a big asteroid into close orbit, but if we go with it, you can put it into moon orbit. The moon is surprisingly far away, which gives you a pretty good margin.

[marinw]

The Parmesan bit makes we wonder what kind of food they are growing on Mars. Must be all vegetarian. Meat and Dairy needs to be imported or is a black market item.

[marinw]

15 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

That they can just devine at distance that it is supposedly filled with Iridium is still so laughable that it would be funny if it turned out to be total bullshit.

Astronomers can make educated guesses about the composition of exoplanets in other star systems, but it is by no means a sure thing. They would need a sample of Goldilocks to know for sure.

[whiporee]

13 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

As long as they are paid well I honestly don't see the problem. It's not like anybody but the two completely insane old men actually want to stay there forever.

Helios tried to pay the Mars workers with peanuts, but it does seem like they'll get paid well now, so the only reason to bring the asteroid to Mars is Dev's and Ed's egos and insane notions of staying on Mars forever.

You could say the same about the American West or the colonization of the western hemisphere. People go to a place, they help to shape it, and it becomes a part of their identity. I don't know that I'd love to live on Mars, but there is an appeal to being a pioneer anywhere. 

[marinw]

5 hours ago, whiporee said:

You could say the same about the American West or the colonization of the western hemisphere. People go to a place, they help to shape it, and it becomes a part of their identity. I don't know that I'd love to live on Mars, but there is an appeal to being a pioneer anywhere. 

I'm reminded of this beautiful quote from Ray Bradbury's The Martian Chronicles, you can substitute "people" for "men":

“The Men of Earth came to Mars. They came because they were afraid or unafraid, because they were happy or unhappy, because they felt like Pilgrims or did not feel like Pilgrims. There was a reason for each man. They were leaving bad wives or bad towns; they were coming to find something or leave something or get something, to dig up something or bury something or leave something alone. They were coming with small dreams or large dreams or none at all...it was not unusual that the first men were few. The numbers grew steadily in proportion to the census of Earth Men already on Mars. There was comfort in numbers. But the first Lonely Ones had to stand by themselves...”

Edited December 24, 2023 by marinw

[PurpleTentacle]

4 hours ago, whiporee said:

You could say the same about the American West or the colonization of the western hemisphere. People go to a place, they help to shape it, and it becomes a part of their identity. I don't know that I'd love to live on Mars, but there is an appeal to being a pioneer anywhere. 

I don't think I could. Most people went to those places to colonise them, not to work there for a few years and then go back home. Also those places are generally conducive to human life. Mars is not.

The only people who want to stay forever we've seen at this point are Ed and Dev. Everybody else wants to get off that rock once they've made enough money for their families.

7 hours ago, marinw said:

Astronomers can make educated guesses about the composition of exoplanets in other star systems, but it is by no means a sure thing. They would need a sample of Goldilocks to know for sure.

They can as far as "rocky" or "gas" not much beyond that. You can get the composition of the atmosphere, if you can capture direct light from the planet. But as you say, for rock composition you'd need samples.

[BetyBee]

We've been binge-ing this show for about a month and last watched this episode. I'm not enjoying the Mars story. I've been disgusted with selfish Ed for many episodes now. I hate the Miles story. I'm sorry, but that actor makes such awful faces, I just want to punch him. I really hope the next few episodes can redeem this show, but I don't feel very optimistic about it, because the writing has gotten very poor. 

[marinw]

17 minutes ago, BetyBee said:

I've been disgusted with selfish Ed for many episodes now. I hate the Miles story. I'm sorry, but that actor makes such awful faces, I just want to punch him. I really hope the next few episodes can redeem this show,

Yes, this has been the weakest season thus far. Ed needs to die in a spectacular, heroic, redemptive fashion.

[Joimiaroxeu]

I wonder if Ed would have gone in with the strikers if Dani hadn't grounded him?

Margo setting foot on US soil seems like a bad idea. The CIA could just arrange an "accident" which leaves her dead. Really, most sincerely dead; not fake dead.

Aleida went all the way off on live TV, lol.

Happy Valley is located in a site four times bigger than the Grand Canyon? Is there actually a crater that size on Mars?

Alex is not here for Poppy. Guess he caught a bad vibe.

Dani didn't waste any time pulling rank with Dev. Good luck with that.

Leave it to Dev to make a great speech and end the strike.

Wait, what?! Steal the asteroid? I see an arrest in Dev's future. Ed will probably have a space accident that he doesn't survive.

Quote

Massey is KGB.  

Or CIA. I think Ilya is KGB.

[PurpleTentacle]

28 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

I wonder if Ed would have gone in with the strikers if Dani hadn't grounded him?

Doubt it very much.

28 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Margo setting foot on US soil seems like a bad idea. The CIA could just arrange an "accident" which leaves her dead. Really, most sincerely dead; not fake dead.

That would cause a massive political shitstorm, at a time where nobody wants it, because so much money is on the line.

29 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Happy Valley is located in a site four times bigger than the Grand Canyon? Is there actually a crater that size on Mars?

Happy Valley is the nickname the astronauts on this show gave the Melas Chasma.

[Joimiaroxeu]

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That would cause a massive political shitstorm, at a time where nobody wants it, because so much money is on the line.

I am confident the CIA could make it happen in a way that wouldn't remotely appear to be an assassination. And they'd do it at the most opportune time, that is, after Margo had completed the purpose of her visit to the US. Or perhaps Margo's importance would be overtaken by changed circumstances, such as some entity other than NASA or Russia gaining permanent control of the asteroid. At that point the Russians might decide they don't need her anymore and they'd end her themselves.

Edited January 4 by Joimiaroxeu

[PurpleTentacle]

16 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

I am confident the CIA could make it happen in a way that wouldn't remotely appear to be an assassination.

The sovjets aren't dumb. If Margo dies it's obvious. Even if she by some weird fluke died in an actual genuine accident, everybody would assume the CIA killed her.

There is also no upside for anybody. So the only reason could be wounded pride. But that order would have to come from from the highest place there is and frankly Gore doesn't seem to be the type to reignite the cold war even further and jeopardise the future of humanity over his pride. (also Margo defecting didn't happen under his watch, so he has basically no incentive)

So it's in the best interest of everybody to keep her very, very safe while she is on her trip. If anybody really, really wanted to kill her, I'm sure the CIA could get to her in Moscow. It's more difficult, might even burn some assets and/or connections, but it would be a lot less fraught diplomatically.

[Black Knight]

On 1/4/2024 at 7:47 AM, PurpleTentacle said:

The sovjets aren't dumb. If Margo dies it's obvious. Even if she by some weird fluke died in an actual genuine accident, everybody would assume the CIA killed her.

Agreed. All that would matter here is what the Soviets would think happened. It doesn't have to be proven in a court of law. And if Margo died, the Soviets would absolutely think that the CIA did it, and it would color the Soviets' actions towards the U.S. They'd do something punitive in return.

I really loved that whole sequence of Margo being escorted to the Molly Cobb Space Center in a limousine, her expression inside the limo before getting out, and her expressions as she made her way to the building.

I was amused by Ed's actions in the last episode, not because I didn't think he was being selfish and hypocritical and childish, but because I didn't expect it to lead to all that much. Unfortunately it got a little more serious that I thought it would. Shut up, Ed. I'm tired of his "us" shtick given that he didn't care a whit about these people until Dani found out he wasn't fit to fly and grounded him. Dani called him out a little bit during the meeting, but she should've gone on more.

Kelly also called him out a teensy bit, but not enough. He hasn't been there for his daughter and grandson in eight years, and he's actually not planning on being there for them for the rest of his life, however long that is (three episodes to go, right? I expect that long).

As for Helios? As problematic as it is to have various countries in control of space, having a corporation in control is even worse. All I need to remember about Dev (and Helios) is that back during the Martian space race, he refused to rescue another spaceship. There is at least some sense among the countries of the M-7, even despite their competing agendas, of something that is occasionally bigger. And, who are the striking workers in the employ of? Who are they really so unhappy with? Helios. But sure, it'd be great to have Helios be who gets that asteroid, and control of a Martian colony.

On 12/23/2023 at 1:55 PM, PurpleTentacle said:

Dev: "The first 100 people to cross this line will recieve a quadrupel payday bonus." Um Dev, there were way less than a 100 people there. Was that really supposed to be an incentive to move fast?

A number of people who were there were representing various groups. The first guy to cross the line mentioned he repped a group of 12, and Dev then told the remaining people that there were now 88 slots left. At least one other person crossing the line mentioned that they repped a group of 18. So the numbers would actually dwindle pretty fast. Between the two people we heard specifically from, that's 30 slots right there - almost a third of the slots.