Speculation: Montauk Does Rashomon

[Evie]

Hmm...Episode 5 from last year is the one where Whitney cyberbullies one of her classmates. And then episode 4 of this season is the one where Noah takes the kids to go see his family after Helen gets arrested for being high. So, that leads me to believe that either Whitney or Helen is the one who murdered Scotty.

Helen being guilty would cause an uproar in my house. Whitney makes the most sense though, and I have ideas where that could lead next season.

[bunnywithanaxe]

RE: Whitney; "it's our baby"

 

Did Scotty fricken knock her up again?

 

(Speculatively I mean.)

Edited December 20, 2015 by bunnywithanaxe

[canolive]

Started to watch 3 days ago and binged through it.  Love it !  The intricacy of the story and build up of characters (why they act, react and evolve the way they do),  the alternate realities, the suspence, etc.  a nice ride.  Now my two cents.  I think we're heading towards a guilty verdict for the season finale and of course, an "innocent" Noah victim of a conspiracy.  I use the "c" word because there are several people resenting him and wanting him to suffer.

I was wandering how Margaret and Cole paths were going to cross, now we know.  And how she hates him more then ever now!  From the first show we saw that Margaret has brewed some ill feelings towards Noah for twenty years and now, that he has inspired her husband to leave her and is "responsable" for her beloved daughter to be estranged, she is sitting alone, on a lot of cash and influence to exact a Shakespearian revenge. 

It was also interesting to see the change in Cole's personality between the scene in NY, when he announces his engagement to Alison and when he's sitting in the witness box.  At the bar, Alison, at the sight of a Cole finally at peace and happy, decides to not tell him what she was going to (I'll comme back to that).  At the trial, we see a man with steely resolve.  He's on a mission to destroy (Noah, Alison, both?).  So what happenned ?  Well, I'm probably wrong, but there are clues.

There was some vague threat implied by Scotty in front of Alison's condo.  The next scene we see her meeting with Cole at the bar.  I think what she was not capable of telling him, was that Scotty was the natural father of Gabriel.  In a later episode, at the outburst after the auction, it is probably the news Scotty says would blow Cole's world away.  In the car, after, we see him probe scotty about it.  He will learn the truth.  And that could explain the change of personality and his out of character involvement in the death of his brother.  I mean, after what he went through after the death of his son... Also, he may learn that he's the natural father of Alison's daughter and since Lucia can't have kids... 

Max now probably hate Noah, after opening up to him and being told by his "friend" that without his money he's a big nothing. 

Also, one of the reasons for Helen relentless resolve in defending her ex, would be that she learned of her mother's involvement in the incident.  Anyway, we'll know in 24 hr.

P.S. I'm french from Montreal, so please excuse some wanky syntax here and there.

 

 

[marys1000]

I'm at all but the last episode of S1 and its already hard to remember some of my thoughts about earlier episodes. 

Lets see,

 

What is it with the lips?  Helen (Maura Tierney) has this weird thing with her upper lip, it always looks pursed or puckered up or something and she always

seems to be smiling no matter what is going on. When she is acting and moving it around.....it drives me crazy.  Ruth Wilson isn't quite doing  the trout pout (she has a bit of a natural one) she did with her lips in Luther which a bit of a relief.  Liked it in Luther but didn't want to see it here. 

 

Are there really people like Alison's mother?  I felt like she was a bit over the top, an exaggerated trope.  Maybe its because I live in the Midwest? 

 

I've enjoyed the show  immensely although there are times when its almost too intense.  Almost any scene with Oscar is very uncomfortable and I give that actor lots of credit for playing what is a straight sort of asshole bully role with some nuance, especially when he gives peeks at the tiny bit of humanity he actually has underneath. 

 

I am finding that the whole thing gets less credulous as it goes on, interspersed with some fine scenes.

 

The affair between Noah and Alison made sense to me including the end of summer break up.  Alison was trying to climb out of her grief and needed some sort

of intense experience (my amateur psychoanalysis) to help her.  Noah, intellectual urban modern man was struggling with feeling lesser than his

clearly very competent calling the shots wife and her overbearing monied parents.  That part on the beach where he tells her "I want to be in charge" I thought was

very telling.  We can't ever quite escape our animal biology. 

 

They have lots of sex.

 

I kept being struck at how not careful they were being all around town.  People pick up on sexual affairs easily. People always know.  Someone will always see you.  It was just...jarring how public and stupid they were being.  I couldn't stop thinking "no one would be doing that".

 

Summer ends. They part and get closer to spouses they clearly care about.    Yet they still think they are in love.   Not sure I get that.  At least I haven't been sold on it.  Do they have anything in common?  What do they talk about except a few words about the current crises?   Ok, so still thinking with organs other than their brains?

Apparently many people here don't like Noah.  On the one hand this obsession with "those are real people", i.e. the poor, struggling, uneducated, is irritating and insulting.  I've seen the artistic rich portrayed with this thought before but since I don't know any  rich and artistic people I don't know if this is a common thought or  just a trope.    I understand that he's feeling disaffected and smothered, especially at his in laws.  And that his safe life has left him uninspired with nothing to write about.  I do like that he is at least trying to figure it out, find connection by still teaching at a public school, electing to take some risks although something besides leaving his children might be more advised.  He is at least still thinking about and struggling with it all.  I sort of like Noah. 

 

I'm up to where Alison got on the train.  I don't understand why she didn't at least tell Cole - I didn't know he was coming, I'll get back to you, I'm not staying with him, I'm staying with my friend.  Why she wouldn't at least (re)consider running off with Cole.  Go out west, work on ranch, no water there.  Taking on someone who is divorcing with 4 kids is a super daunting prospect. Plus she thinks his wife might be pregnant.   No one could not have second and triple thoughts about that.  Actually I think if I were her and Noah jumped off the train, basically unplanned, perhaps a new kid and that tiny apt,  I would have told him, give me some time to think about this.  I'll take the next train. 

 

I read a lot of early speculation in this thread about whether Scott is really Whitney's baby daddy.  Would he come to PP as a friend?  IDK, doesn't really seem in his character. 

 

Truly dumb of Noah to lie about his being at the Edge.  So I understand that makes no sense  leads to the idea of him have a specific reason to lie.  Although people do clutch in situations like that. 

 

Alison sleeping with Oscar?  Ok I've done some stupid stuff like that but I don't see Alison doing it with Oscar.  Too much history, she knows him too well and doesn't like him.  It would have made more sense with a stranger.  But then paternity wouldn't be a question.  Bit of tortured plot there. 

 

The scene where the mother blames Alison for the death of Gabriel.  Very intense and very sad to hear about his death.  The scenes after were well written and crafted. But I don't see her actually doing what she did.  It was so deeply vile and snake like to say such things two years later as opposed to immediately after in crazed grief.  We've been given no evidence that the mother is a total evil bitch like that.  So regardless of the money thing her saying those things felt like a clunker to me. 

 

Obviously these are just my opinions of how people typically behave

--------------------

back after the last episode.

Wow, can't believe Alison when to stay at a commune?  with her mother.  That beggars belief. 

This episode the Noah/Alison perspectives weren't just different but addressed some whole other events. 

Like Noah beating up Scotty and it ends there and in Alison's Scotty is never seen, Cole pointing the gun at everyone and then suddenly its years later. 

Let me just add I loved Helen's scene when she convinces him to come back.  Sounded like she had done a lot of difficult soul searching.  But then off she goes, making take no prisoner individual decisions that brook no input by Noah.   

Edited December 24, 2015 by marys1000

[taragel]

Just wondering if anyone has thoughts on this coming season based on the trailers they've been releasing?

I find it totally surprising that they seem to be backpedaling almost entirely from Noah + Alison as a couple. I mean I'm sure by the end of the season they'll be interacting again but the fact that they're estranged and both seem to be gravitating back towards their exes is very surprising to me. I didn't expect that. I wonder if their original story ideas changed at all as Maura and Josh became more important to the narrative/show.

[truthaboutluv]

I didn't get Noah gravitating back to Helen in the promo. If anything, that exchange of her asking what about them and his complete, "what about us?" just made me embarrassed for her. Plus I'm pretty sure there is a shot of Noah hooking up with the woman at the university who in another scene is telling him that some were really against his being hired. Hell, if anything I think Noah might have built up some resentment towards Helen after having to spend three years in jail for a crime she did. Yes it was his choice but that doesn't mean he's all that happy about it. 

Now the promo definitely suggests that Alison may present a complication for Cole and Luisa and the life they've created with Joanie. Seems like in her typical fashion she disappeared but came back demanding to have a place in Joanie's life which puts strain between Cole and Luisa because Luisa probably thinks she's trying to take back the life she once had - Cole as her husband and their having a child together. This video of Ruth talking about what to expect of Alison in Season 3 is interesting. 

I have to say after last season, particularly with the Joanie lie and with what I have a strong feeling will happen with her and Cole this season, I'm REALLY, REALLY starting to hate Alison. I've never cared for the Alison and Noah relationship or bought it as some great love story and definitely thought she had a bit of victim complex about her, but in Season 1 and most of Season 2, I hated Noah more than her. But now, nope, really can't stand her. It it starting to seem like she's as selfish and awful as Oscar described her as but just hides it behind her tragedy of Gabriel dying and her blubbering lips and sad little eyes. I love the clip in another promo of Luisa saying to her, "there is something deeply wrong with you."

All that said, I do agree with you about the writers seeming to move away from the great Alison/Noah soulmate love. Hell in the clip above, Ruth says the season starts with Alison almost wanting to put her past with Noah behind her because she hated who she became in the relationship with him. 

Edited October 25, 2016 by truthaboutluv

[scrb]

I have a hazy memory of what happened last season.  Ironic I know given the main conceit of the show about characters having different memories of the same events.

So it was Helen who ran the guy over and Noah took the fall?

Three years in prison, including getting roughed up, probably has soured Noah on both women.

[truthaboutluv]

Yeah. Alison shoved Scotty into the road because he was attacking her and Helen, who was drunk and driving Noah's car because he too was drunk, accidentally hit Scotty.

[taragel]

7 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

I didn't get Noah gravitating back to Helen in the promo.

No, sorry, I should've been more precise--I'm surprised Helen is still so hung up on him and wanting to be close to him again, but I agree he's not interested in her. I wonder if her interest is just guilt or more than that.

But yeah Alison definitely seems to be poised to wreck Cole's marriage with....an affair. It's an interesting pivot on where the show started that I wouldn't have expected what with all the talk of soulmates that the original marketing campaign used.

[bunnywithanaxe]

A few predictions:

Gunther is dead, and has been for a long time. Noah is involved somehow. 

 

Noah's mom did not request him to put pills in her pudding. 

 

Now that we have we have discovered that Noah was kind of one of the Lockharts of his own town, we will discover that Noah's family has some connection to the family that cursed the Lockharts. Bonus pounts to the writers if they work it out to resemble the lyrics to that crazy ass Fiona Apple song.

[scrb]

I don't know about predictions but it seems the show runner and writers believe the only way to sustain this format with different POVs is to always have some central mystery driving it.

Well Rashomon was about a crime and revealing what happened through the narrative device.

But do they need that here?  What if it was some mundane "he said, she said" but just executed better?  Like look at the complex set of perceptions and motivations which drive behavior around infidelity, parenting, marriage, etc.  However they bolt on a whodunnit in S2 and now in S3.

The revelation is the carrot they're dangling to get viewers to continue watching.  Does Treem believe in that or maybe it's something the network is pushing on them.

[Tikichick]

Anyone think there's any possibility Ben is from Ecuador/has family from Ecuador?

With the dramatic shift in Luisa and her storyline I suspect she may be pulling the strings of Allison's disappearance. 

[Lozu68]

On 7/9/2018 at 10:03 AM, Tikichick said:

Anyone think there's any possibility Ben is from Ecuador/has family from Ecuador?

With the dramatic shift in Luisa and her storyline I suspect she may be pulling the strings of Allison's disappearance. 

With the way this show rolls...nothing would surprise me!! 

[LoveLeigh]

I think they are moving towards having Cole going back with Alison and Noah reconciling with Helen. I think that is how the series will end.