Fandom and Viewer Issues: "Fan" Is Short for "Fanatic"

[Souris]

The correct answer in this case is "They're all great! I couldn't kill any of them!" and leave it at that.

[Serena]

Apparently, Sean has been liking tweets like "How do A&E feel about having ruined Robin's character?", "Why do you treat Robin's character like trash?", etc. Just like Merida's actress! What's up with those people having no PR training? Those are his likes. Some are spoilery, so beware!  I have never tweeted anything at him, but apparently I am blocked! To be fair, I have tweeted that I think Robin is "terminally boring", shaded him when he was like "NBD" when Regina killed his wife, and called him a huge moron when he did his famous "bold and audacious" speech. But I'm sure I've tweeted worse about Regina (again, never AT Lana) and Lana's never blocked me! Maybe because she's too busy to Google herself...

Edited May 4, 2016 by Serena

[Curio]

I'm sorry, but something is wrong with the way this show is run when multiple actors take to social media to vent about the show's treatment of their character. Amy Manson, Michael Socha, and now Sean Maguire have voiced their opinions, and with good reason. It's hard to pin this issue on anyone but the writers at this point. 

[Serena]

I can't say that their complains aren't valid (except Amy's, she got more than enough screentime and even her own episode, and she was just a guest star). However, complaining on social media is just gonna give the actor a reputation as unprofessional (not to mention that it's spoiling upcoming storylines...).

They're also not really "voicing" their opinions as much as passive-aggressively liking other people's tweets. Robin has been a failure as a character since the beginning, but

Spoiler

Sean is only complaining now that he's being killed off.

Compare that to MRJ, who as far as I know handled being written off with grace.

Edited May 4, 2016 by Serena

[Rumsy4]

Well... how many people know that their twitter "likes" can be monitored easily? I do think it would've been smarter for Sean to refrain from "liking" some of these dubious tweets, but it's nowhere close to Amy Manson's snafu. 

I think Socha handled his disappointment with the Show fine. He was diplomatic enough to make it clear that he bore no animosity towards the writers and wouldn't mind working for them again. 

[YaddaYadda]

Sean's wife Twitter header is an image "Save Robin Hood" and a help save Robin Hood tweet related to some facebook campaign.

I don't know that this is the best way to go about things. I find it burns bridges more than anything. 

Edited May 4, 2016 by YaddaYadda

[Rumsy4]

Facepalm.

[Joanh23]

Ok well that pretty much confirms that Robin is not going to make it past S5!

[Serena]

I'm pretty sure it's written somewhere in his contract that he can't spoil the show, and supporting a "Save Robin Hood" campaign is not exactly subtle.

Maybe this is mean, but if these people think the show has ruined their characters... why would they campaign to come back? The writing's on the wall, the writers clearly only care about an handful of characters.

[sharky]

Yea, I'm not totally getting this either. Why are you spoiling the show that bad? Or is there a cliffhanger and Robin can be saved and we just don't know it? It's just.... I guess when it's your job, you may not be thinking about the fans getting spoiled as your main priority, but it's just tacky.

That being said, I think you're right @Curio. Alot of this has to do with this show adding characters that they don't know what to do with. But I don't blame the writers as much as I do A&E. They are the creators who have created this mess on a regular basis. Lost did this once -- added characters that were completely useless so they killed them off in one of the worst episodes of the entire series. But A&E seem to be making the same mistake over and over again. You would think that after the Socha interview and Amy and Sean's Twitter tantrums that they would learn, but I guess not.

[Selina K]

It's bad form for anyone to complain about their job on social media.  We have all kinds of rules on social protocol and I am 1. not famous 2. not making anyone near the money these actors make when they're on contract and 3. work for a "normal" company.  Certainly future employers would look around my social media input were I to apply for a different job an use what they find to inform their decision of whether or not I should be extended an offer.  If these actors aren't concerned about their professional perception, so be it, but to do it in a way that also potentially ruins the show for fans is just bad form.  Not to mention, I could see that behavior being fodder for lawsuits if ABC were to turn around and blame a drop in ratings on the spoilers, which consequently impacts revenue.  I think that is an unlikely scenario, but they tried that approach with Reality Steve, and he isn't bound up in contract paperwork with the network which I imagine would provide more basis for the network on which to build a lawsuit.  Were I an actor, I would tread lightly.

[Joanh23]

Yeah the ep hasn't even aired yet so they really should have waited till next week to have a go at the writers (if at all).  At least Amy Manson waited till after the winter finale aired to have her rant..

[YaddaYadda]

50 minutes ago, Joanh23 said:

Yeah the ep hasn't even aired yet so they really should have waited till next week to have a go at the writers (if at all).  At least Amy Manson waited till after the winter finale aired to have her rant..

Or wait until the end of the season which is in 2 weeks?

This just tells me there isn't a snowball chance of Robin coming back if Sean's wife is campaigning to have his character saved. The writers invested very little time in the character. He was MIA for 2-3 episodes in a row this arc, or standing in the background. He wasn't even a participant in rescuing his own daughter from Cruella and James.

I think the writers have made the decision as to which relationship for Regina that they wanna pursue, and we all know they can't write more than 1 relationship at a time.

[KingOfHearts]

2 hours ago, sharky said:

Lost did this once -- added characters that were completely useless so they killed them off in one of the worst episodes of the entire series

IMO, Nikki and Paulo got a better send-off than any Once character since Graham. At least the Lost writers owned up to their writing mistakes. A&E always try to sweep them under the rug.

#SaveRobin really makes no sense. I understand actors need jobs and they don't like getting killed off if they're regulars, but opening a campaign up to spoil it is just bad business. I doubt they'll find much support since Robin is such an unpopular character.

Edited May 4, 2016 by KingOfHearts

[Rumsy4]

I loved the Nikki/Paulo send-off episode in LOST. I hated all their other appearances in the Show. 

A twitter campaign endorsed by the actor's wife reeks of desperation, and is sort of embarrassing, tbh. Lbr, MRJ/Neal was way more popular than Sean/Robin, and that wasn't enough to save him. Sean might need to focus on auditioning for new roles rather than campaign to keep this one. I mean... the season is over in two weeks, and from I can tell, the writers mini-camp for S6 is almost done as well. I don't know what good this can do to his career.

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

I loved the Nikki/Paulo send-off episode in LOST. I hated all their other appearances in the Show. 

Replying in Other Fairy Tales. 

[tri4335]

4 hours ago, Serena said:

I can't say that their complains aren't valid (except Amy's, she got more than enough screentime and even her own episode, and she was just a guest star). However, complaining on social media is just gonna give the actor a reputation as unprofessional (not to mention that it's spoiling upcoming storylines...).

They're also not really "voicing" their opinions as much as passive-aggressively liking other people's tweets. Robin has been a failure as a character since the beginning, but

  Reveal hidden contents

Sean is only complaining now that he's being killed off.

Compare that to MRJ, who as far as I know handled being written off with grace.

MRJ did handle it with grace but as I've written before I do believe he gave a subtle hint that the reason his character was written off was because of Regina/LP.  He tweeted the night he died that the writers made a "bold" move when Regina was referred to as being "bold and audacious" in that same episode.  Eddie then confirmed that really though they want to tell other stories how can you when there is so much more to retread with Regina.

Let's face it OQ did not make the impact they wanted (given how little effort they put into it I don't know how they thought it would be awesome) and they need Sean gone. Even so, I'm surprised at the response by Sean and his wife.  There really isn't, maybe RC is the exception, any actor/ress on this show who can afford to be labeled difficult.  None of these folks are Meryl Streep or Tom Hanks. You need to do the job you're hired for and recognize pitching a fit is not going to go over well with either your bosses or co-workers.  And to be clear I'm not saying Meryl of Tom would do that only that they have clout to get what they want. 

From my perspective, I would make it a point to check out anything that RC, JMO, GG and CO moved onto but I'm not compelled to do the same for LP, JD or anyone else who has been on the show.

Edited May 4, 2016 by tri4335

[Serena]

OQ was doomed to failure when they declared them "soulmates" before they even met. Who does that? Chem-test the actors first! JMo and I think A&E even said, they hired Colin to be her LI, then hoped they had chemistry... you can't just decide beforehand!

Plus, viewers hate being "told" to like a couple. They want to be "shown". This is why so many of the most popular television couples - I think Pacey and Joey is the most famous example- are those who showed chemistry on screen before the writers declared them True Love. 

[Rumsy4]

3 minutes ago, Serena said:

OQ was doomed to failure when they declared them "soulmates" before they even met. Who does that? Chem-test the actors first! JMo and I think A&E even said, they hired Colin to be her LI, then hoped they had chemistry... you can't just decide beforehand!

If they only brought in Sean becasue Lana asked for a LI for her character, it explains why A&E put so little effort into building that relationship. I guess the Zelena vs Regina thing has always been their main interest since 3B. 

[Mathius]

30 minutes ago, tri4335 said:

MRJ did handle it with grace but as I've written before I do believe he gave a subtle hint that the reason his character was written off was because of Regina/LP.  He tweeted the night he died that the writers made a "bold" move when Regina was referred to as being "bold and audacious" in that same episode.  Eddie then confirmed that really though they want to tell other stories how can you when there is so much more to retread with Regina.

Really? I thought either Captain Swan or Rumple's turn back to evil was the more likely justification.

Quote

 

OQ was doomed to failure when they declared them "soulmates" before they even met. Who does that? Chem-test the actors first! JMo and I think A&E even said, they hired Colin to be her LI, then hoped they had chemistry... you can't just decide beforehand!

 

Yes, A&E said that they always had a long-term plan for Hook as a LI but knew that it may not happen if the chemistry wasn't right or if enough of the audience didn't respond positively to it, and that thankfully this wasn't the case.  With OQ, they just threw them together just because they wanted Regina to have all the shinies, and are now writing it out because it both didn't click with enough of the audience and because they think "good" Regina is boring and needs a reason to go evil again (not that I think she'll choose to go evil again, there will be an outside influence, but her inner evil coming back up in the first place is because of Robin's death.)  It's just a huge mess all around.

Edited May 4, 2016 by Mathius

[RedKeep]

I have a very hard time believing that Neal's exit had much to do with Regina. Neal is just one example for the many characters the writers were only interested in terms of how they could further someone else's story over course of the last few years. Neal was only ever Emma's love interest, Henry's father or Rumple's son. He had no real purpose beyond those roles, the writers showed no interest in developing him as a relevant character in his own right. Once they settled on Hook/Emma instead, the love interest role became even more irrelevant/non-existant to begin with, Henry the fictional character never 'needed' more family figures in his life from a narrative perspective, and since they apparently also had no interest in keeping Rumple from going evil again for long he served his purpose exactly by dying at Zelena's (sort of) hand. Regardless of how the writers may or may not feel about Regina, I never got the feeling they were that interested in Neal after he'd been officially revealed as Henry's father/Rumple's son.

[Souris]

4 hours ago, YaddaYadda said:

Sean's wife Twitter header is an image "Save Robin Hood" and a help save Robin Hood tweet related to some facebook campaign.

I don't know that this is the best way to go about things. I find it burns bridges more than anything. 

I'm getting such second-hand embarrassment over her behavior. I'm flabbergasted, to be honest. That's just tacky, and could give Sean the reputation of being unprofessional or affect his job prospects if potential future employers see it. Did the show handle Robin Hood well? Hell, no. But taking to social media is a bad idea. I mean, actors are let go from shows all the time. It's constantly happening. Look at the main characters killed off shows just this season! This isn't some great, special, different injustice.

[Serena]

I agree, Neal was there for their "shocking twist". However, the twist also dissipated most of the goodwill the audience had towards Bae, as well as him being miscast (MRJ is a good actor, just not right for the role), and the character became more of a liability. If he had been there, it would have been TWO people Rumple had to constantly put to sleep; and he clearly wasn't needed anymore as Emma's love interest. He wasn't magical, and his backstory precluded him having other connections to characters or dashing adventures. Coupled with his not-too-high level of popularity, that made him a logical death.

As for Sean's wife... based on past behavior, it doesn't surprise me. If you compare her to other actors' significant others, like Colin or Robert's wives, she's clearly less... let's say *reserved*.

Edited May 4, 2016 by Serena

[sharky]

4 hours ago, Joanh23 said:

Yeah the ep hasn't even aired yet so they really should have waited till next week to have a go at the writers (if at all).  At least Amy Manson waited till after the winter finale aired to have her rant..

To be fair, I think she went on a knee-jerk Twitter rant after the show aired because her part was completely cut from the winter finale and no one told her she wasn't even going to appear in it. "Oh hey, let's change the storyline and bring back Camelot at the end of the season, but not tell any of the actors." I think her Twitter rant was short and stopped when A&E actually contacted her to explain what was happening.

1 hour ago, Serena said:

As for Sean's wife... based on past behavior, it doesn't surprise me. If you compare her to other actors' significant others, like Colin or Robert's wives, she's clearly less... let's say *reserved*.

Most definitely. There was a big drama this week in a Facebook moms group I belong to when some mom started complaining about how her husband's anonymous company that she said rhymes with RicRonald's (it was another company but just as obvious). She finally deleted it when a bunch of people replied with "You're a moron." I feel like someone needs to do that with Sean's wife. So glad that Helen O'Donoghue seems like such a sweet, nice woman.

[tri4335]

1 hour ago, Mathius said:

Really? I thought either Captain Swan or Rumple's turn back to evil was the more likely justification.

Yes, A&E said that they always had a long-term plan for Hook as a LI but knew that it may not happen if the chemistry wasn't right or if enough of the audience didn't respond positively to it, and that thankfully this wasn't the case.  With OQ, they just threw them together just because they wanted Regina to have all the shinies, and are now writing it out because it both didn't click with enough of the audience and because they think "good" Regina is boring and needs a reason to go evil again (not that I think she'll choose to go evil again, there will be an outside influence, but her inner evil coming back up in the first place is because of Robin's death.)  It's just a huge mess all around.

 

50 minutes ago, RedKeep said:

I have a very hard time believing that Neal's exit had much to do with Regina. Neal is just one example for the many characters the writers were only interested in terms of how they could further someone else's story over course of the last few years. Neal was only ever Emma's love interest, Henry's father or Rumple's son. He had no real purpose beyond those roles, the writers showed no interest in developing him as a relevant character in his own right. Once they settled on Hook/Emma instead, the love interest role became even more irrelevant/non-existant to begin with, Henry the fictional character never 'needed' more family figures in his life from a narrative perspective, and since they apparently also had no interest in keeping Rumple from going evil again for long he served his purpose exactly by dying at Zelena's (sort of) hand. Regardless of how the writers may or may not feel about Regina, I never got the feeling they were that interested in Neal after he'd been officially revealed as Henry's father/Rumple's son.

 

32 minutes ago, Serena said:

I agree, Neal was there for their "shocking twist". However, the twist also dissipated most of the goodwill the audience had towards Bae, as well as him being miscast (MRJ is a good actor, just not right for the role), and the character became more of a liability. If he had been there, it would have been TWO people Rumple had to constantly put to sleep; and he clearly wasn't needed anymore as Emma's love interest. He wasn't magical, and his backstory precluded him having other connections to characters or dashing adventures. Coupled with his not-too-high level of popularity, that made him a logical death.

As for Sean's wife... based on past behavior, it doesn't surprise me. If you compare her to other actors' significant others, like Colin or Robert's wives, she's clearly less... let's say *reserved*.

So this response will be long to explain my thought process and I fully admit this is my speculation and my reading between the lines.  The meat of Neal's story wasn't that he was Emma's LI or Henry's father, it was that he was Rumple's son. There was so much they could do with that story but to do that they needed to limit the screen of someone else on the show and I believe the logical person would've been Regina once they decided that they were going with CS.  All reports were that MRJ was cast as Neal without audition by A & E, that they created the part with him in mind. That stands to reason that he went into the job thinking he was going to be one of the leads on the show with GG, JMO and RC (And who doesn't want to work with RC). Then we had the CO injury which derailed some of their plans, as well as screen time for CO and MRJ, and the anti-magic crew that was not well received in Season 2 and I think A & E became more enamored with telling the Regina/EQ story. 

MRJ is an actor who was expecting a meatier role, he didn't just want to stand in the background which has happened in many cases to all the other males on the show (RC notwithstanding)   My take on the situation was that he went to A & E to push for a larger role and was told that the story they wanted to tell was Regina's - hence the tweet.  I believe that is when they made the decision to kill off Neal and release MRJ, their friend, so he could pursue other roles. Something they haven't offered to others in the same situation.  They've remained cordial and that is why he has come back the few times he has and I have no doubt they would all work together again if the opportunity arose.  I also believe that RC would have preferred to work with MRJ and would've have advocated to eliminate Belle over Neal because he too thinks that was the bigger story. He was very clear last summer during SDCC that he was disappointed that MRJ was let go. RC wants to play Rumple dark and there was so much more they could've explored with Neal. RC has been clear that this is a paycheck and not necessary the best work of his life.  But my point is that they didn't want to increase MRJ's screen time and he didn't want to just hang around.

Why it wasn't Captain Swan - MRJ has remained friends with both JMO and CO and does not blame them at all for losing his job. They continue to get together with each other, include spouses - heck he even introduced Donal Logue, who is his best friend, to CO. These are not the actions of someone thinks that CO cost him his job.

[Rumsy4]

Taking the discussion to the Neal thread.

[Mathius]

Well, the Robin/OQ fans have really come out of the woodwork now that those spoiler pics were released, and they are furious.

I honestly feel bad for them.  I saw this event coming a mile away, but it still must suck for them to go through it.

Edited May 6, 2016 by Mathius

[InsertWordHere]

Spoiler

This is going to be ugly. I am already seeing hate for Hook and Emma reuniting over the grave. As if Robin and Regina didn't have sex in a crypt with "Marian" mere feet away. 

Edited May 6, 2016 by InsertWordHere

[Mathius]

Spoiler

OK, any of them who are doing that lose a lot of sympathy for me, especially since as you mention: it's hypocritical. 

And unlike with the OQ crypt sex where both parties were doing just fine all things considered, CS has been through metaphorical and literal Hell all season long, I think I can understand and forgive a knee-jerk, emotional hug and kiss when they FINALLY reunite. 

Edited May 6, 2016 by Mathius

[daxx]

I'm going to have to start using the block button if I want to peruse the spoiler tag on tumblr.

 

just, ugh.

[InsertWordHere]

1 hour ago, Mathius said:

  Hide contents

And unlike with the OQ crypt sex where both parties were doing just fine all things considered, CS has been through metaphorical and literal Hell all season long, I think I can understand and forgive a knee-jerk, emotional hug and kiss when they FINALLY reunite.

My response since I can't type outside of this box: Agreed. He just got came back from the dead, not a trip to the store.

Edited May 6, 2016 by InsertWordHere
These sticky quote boxes will be my undoing.

[Souris]

If you thought the fandom was bad before, it's gonna be even worse. The Emma/CS hate is already off the charts.

I think that's exactly what A&E wanted.

[Rosiejuliemom]

Since I'm a glutton for punishment, I decided to wander into the spoiler tag on Tumblr and take a look...hoo boy.

Spoiler

To say that a live grenade was just dropped would be an understatement. From accusations of Emma ruining Roland and Pistachio's lives to calling the writers racist to saying that Hook stole Robin's life force... A&E better gird their loins for the blowback.

However, I did see someone refer to the Olympian crystal as Hades's dildo, so there's that.

Edited May 6, 2016 by Rosiejuliemom

[InsertWordHere]

Spoiler

My favorite are the ones complaining about Regina losing her happiness because her boyfriend dies

when these same people have been complaining all season long that Emma is being too "clingy" with her boyfriend who has died three times.

[Curio]

On a completely different tongue-in-cheek note, I'm surprised the Swan Queen fandom hasn't jumped ship over to Wicked Queen yet. (Is that the name?) The writers seem to care more about Regina and Zelena's relationship than the Emma/Regina "friendship" now (thankfully), so hopping aboard the WQ train means they get: 1) Two women who have gone from antagonists to friends, 2) Non-manipulated gifs of canon scenes where they're holding hands and hugging, 3) The actresses are actually friends in real life and take lots of selfies together, 4) They're basically co-parents to Pistachio, and 5) The SQ fans actually seem to like Zelena, unlike their treatment of Emma where they inexplicably despise her yet simultaneously want her to be Regina's love interest. It seems like a huge upgrade to me.

[KateJones]

Except the ick factor that they're sisters which might be too much even for them. 

[daxx]

Sisters, shipping would be squicky like the Wincest stuff in the supernatural fandom...

[Curio]

Heh, I was just going to say, "Didn't stop the Supernatural or Game of Thrones fandoms." 

Half-sister vs. step-grandma. Pick your poison. 

[Serena]

Yeah, but Zelena isn't the show's protagonist and hero. Having the show protagonist and hero in love with Regina would validate her in a way anything else can't.

[Curio]

1 hour ago, Serena said:

Having the show protagonist and hero in love with Regina would validate her in a way anything else can't.

Oh, so you're saying the person the writers decide to pair Emma with—AKA the show's protagonist and hero—must be very important and their relationship would validate that character as an extremely vital piece of the story in a way anything else can't? Must be nice to be that character. ;)

[Souris]

I think some SQ are hoping for/demanding DragonQueen.

[InsertWordHere]

Now there are people complaining on twitter about Leanne Aguilera asking an "embarrassing" question. Good Lord, it's 2016. I swear the attitude to sex by some in this fandom boggles my mind, but the show's lack of healthy sex between loving couples doesn't exactly help.

[Curio]

3 minutes ago, InsertWordHere said:

Now there are people complaining on twitter about Leanne Aguilera asking an "embarrassing" question. 

I think she handled it well.

[Rumsy4]

I would totally be on-board for Dragon Queen!

[RadioGirl27]

Wow, Sean gives 0 bucks, he must be really pissed. (Spoilers in the link)

[Serena]

Aaaand that's the end of me feeling sorry for him. Really great idea pissing off Disney and ABC, Sean!

[Curio]

Spoiler

I doubt they care at this point. The episode is only a few days away and everyone guessed Robin's fate by now.

[Rumsy4]

I just lost a bit of respect for him. Sorry dude, but you only shot yourself in the foot with that.

[Serena]

They may not care but it's an hint of a bigger attitude problem. If I were a future employer I would think twice. A&E have reused many actors from Lost, do you think if he or other OUAT writers go on to create another show they would take the risk on him again? Now they know that a storyline decision he doesn't like gets him to lash out. Compare to

Spoiler

every other actress getting killed off this season, they've all been gracious about it, even though most of them were waaay bigger characters than Robin. Same with MRJ. Some men's egos are just that fragile I guess.

[YaddaYadda]

Eh, I thought his comment was funny. 

This is on ABC and who they choose to release these stills, and how much they release. That stuff was incredibly spoilery, and gave away most of the episode. I don't think he would have even said a peep had those stills not been leaked all over the internet by someone who was looking to gain more followers. I'm spoiled, speculated up one side and down the other, and I thought that move sucked.