S01.E01: Pilot

[Aeryn13]

1 hour ago, TheGreenKnight said:

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All I remember is how it was said they had hated each other to begin with from one of the angels before they were forced together or John finding out about the Men of Letters when I thought he died never knowing what happened to his father.... The only thing good about that change is that hopefully the original actor for Henry Winchester on Supernatural appears on here as a cameo, always loved him. And then there's the deal with Azazel, which should only happen after she's with John romantically, and yet her mother is dead already unless I got confused (and why isn't Samuel dead??). I put this all in spoilers because I wasn't sure how much we're allowed to say about the original show here and didn't want to break any rules.

Timeline-wise, the show is set about a year and some change before the events of In the Beginning where Dean goes back in time and learns Mary was a hunter etc. So none of that stuff has happened yet.  

[Casseiopeia]

3 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

So none of that stuff has happened yet.  

The hated each other part should have happened.  And where is Deana? Was she mentioned? I don't remember.

[MAK]

7 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

And where is Deana? Was she mentioned?

I seem to remember that there was a casting announcement for that character, but can't remember who the actress was.

[Nick24]

7 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

The hated each other part should have happened. 

They might start hating each other later. In fact, this retcon has never been brought up again since 5.14 IIRC. They might change it here into something like ''The Cupid said it to break Dean to get him to say yes to Michael, but that was never the truth''.

[Casseiopeia]

2 hours ago, Nick24 said:

They might start hating each other later. In fact, this retcon has never been brought up again since 5.14 IIRC. They might change it here into something like ''The Cupid said it to break Dean to get him to say yes to Michael, but that was never the truth''.

I hope not. 

[MAK]

3 hours ago, Nick24 said:

They might start hating each other later.

They might start hating each other after the deal. Mary probably became even more secretive. 

Also, did they ever mention a date of marriage for them in SPN?  Was it immediately after the deal?

[ahrtee]

59 minutes ago, MAK said:

They might start hating each other after the deal. Mary probably became even more secretive. 

Also, did they ever mention a date of marriage for them in SPN?  Was it immediately after the deal?

It wasn't for three years.  I always wondered what happened in that time. 

Even before it was explained in Keep Calm and Carry On, it meant that they were engaged in 1973, but Dean wasn't born till 1979, and Sam was born just in time for the 10-year time limit.  I suppose Azazel had something to do with that.

DEAN: Dad told me. March 23, 1972, you walked out of a movie theater – Slaughterhouse-Five. You loved it, and you bumped into a big Marine and you knocked him flat on his ass. You were embarrassed, and he laughed it off, said you could make it up to him with a cup of coffee. So, you went to, uh, Mulroney's and you talked and he was cute and he knew the words to every Zeppelin song, so when he asked you for your number, you gave it to him, even though you knew your dad would be pissed. That was the night that – that you met –

MARY: John Winchester.

DEAN: August 19, 1975, you were married... in Reno. Your idea. A few years later, I came along, then Sammy.

So there are a few minor differences but nothing major.  The Song Remains the Same takes place in 1978, and Michael mind-wipes them in that episode.  They might make that fit in with the "new" canon.  

Edited October 18, 2022 by ahrtee

[MAK]

5 minutes ago, ahrtee said:

August 19, 1975, you were married... in Reno. Your idea. A few years later, I came along, then Sammy.

Thank you.

It's possible that Mary might have tried to break up with John after the deal to "protect" him.  This would also make things harder for their relationship, and the angels had to intervene so that they would get married. That's why there was a gap between the deal and wedding.

Also, Dean didn't come along til 1979. More time for things not working between them and a reason for angel intervention.

All of it could still fit in canon.

[tessathereaper]

13 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

The hated each other part should have happened.  And where is Deana? Was she mentioned? I don't remember.

There is time yet. I doubt it's going to be smooth sailing from here.  Besides I always kind of assumed, headcanon admittedly but not actually impossible, the Cupid screwed it up himself. (and it was a second hand story anyway the Cupid we met wasn't the Cupid who "worked" on them). Clearly Cupids aren't brightest angels of the bunch. And Winchesters never make things easy. LOL They always have to react differently than "normal" people would. 

I basically figured John and Mary were attracted to each other but the Cupid actually made it harder for them and they ended up getting together in spite of the Cupid's interference, not because of it.  I mean literally everything else, except that couple sentences from this Cupid, including both of their own memories of and reactions to each other was that they loved each other deeply, sure they had ups and downs but that's normal, esp for two damaged people like they were for reasons that had little to do with each other but it doesn't mean they didn't love each other.  I'm not going to put so much stock in a comic relief character from Season 5 who was telling a second hand story.

Deanna wasn't mentioned yet but I'm sure she will be.

Edited October 18, 2022 by tessathereaper

[Bergamot]

4 hours ago, Nick24 said:

They might start hating each other later. In fact, this retcon has never been brought up again since 5.14 IIRC.

I have always kind of taken that Cupid's statement, "They couldn't stand each other at first" with a grain of salt. For one thing, Cupid was portrayed as very silly, naive, and over-sensitive: he started crying if someone spoke harshly to him. So maybe a Cupid (or any angel, really) would not be the best judge of the intricacies of a human relationship, where two people could fight and be angry at each other, but still love each other.

27 minutes ago, MAK said:

It's possible that Mary might have tried to break up with John after the deal to "protect" him.  This would also make things harder for their relationship, and the angels had to intervene so that they would get married. That's why there was a gap between the deal and wedding.

I can see this happening. For all Cupid's rhapsodizing in My Bloody Valentine about love and about the "perfect couple" being the endpoint, all the angels really cared about was making sure that Dean and Sam were born. These were the orders they received as far as John and Mary were concerned -- as Castiel says about another couple in that episode, "They were intended to mate". I can see John and Mary complicating things and giving the angels a hard time in their attempts to carry out these orders.

[Bergamot]

16 minutes ago, tessathereaper said:

Clearly Cupids aren't brightest angels of the bunch. And Winchesters never make things easy. LOL

Yes, exactly! I don't think even the smartest angels are very good at understanding human emotions and relationships. But I'm sure that John and Mary, with their strong personalities and complicated histories, were especially challenging!

Edited October 18, 2022 by Bergamot

[LadyIrony]

Not sure about this one yet. The ep seemed very rushed and how John and Mary meet also seemed like a side story rather than something more memorial. What I liked about Supernatural was the lack of SJW preaching. So it was a little yawn inducing to watch Carlos prance about. 

So far I'm not caring for any of the characters. 

[tessathereaper]

9 hours ago, LadyIrony said:

Not sure about this one yet. The ep seemed very rushed and how John and Mary meet also seemed like a side story rather than something more memorial. What I liked about Supernatural was the lack of SJW preaching. So it was a little yawn inducing to watch Carlos prance about. 

So far I'm not caring for any of the characters. 

I'm sorry?  Carlos just...existing(which is literally all he does, he exists, no one comments about him one way or the other, he's there, he is who he is..)..is somehow SJW preaching?

[Aeryn13]

1 hour ago, tessathereaper said:

I'm sorry?  Carlos just...existing(which is literally all he does, he exists, no one comments about him one way or the other, he's there, he is who he is..)..is somehow SJW preaching?

I think Carlos is actually a character done right. Yes, he has a flamboyant personality. But Bobby had a grumpy personality. Garth had a dorky personality. And so on. All hunters seem to have something or other going on shtick-wise.

In the context of the show he just a hunter with requisite tragic backstory. But knowledgable and competent. And his vibe fits with the free sex, drugs and rock`n roll thing. I actually think in a contemperary setting, it would stick out more (in the speak in twitter hashtags way) but the hippie look and mentality fits with the time period. 

[tessathereaper]

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

I think Carlos is actually a character done right. Yes, he has a flamboyant personality. But Bobby had a grumpy personality. Garth had a dorky personality. And so on. All hunters seem to have something or other going on shtick-wise.

In the context of the show he just a hunter with requisite tragic backstory. But knowledgable and competent. And his vibe fits with the free sex, drugs and rock`n roll thing. I actually think in a contemperary setting, it would stick out more (in the speak in twitter hashtags way) but the hippie look and mentality fits with the time period. 

Absolutely.   He's there, he's knowledgeable and actually seems to me to kind of be the most mature of the 4 of them.  His personality is flamboyant but in a way that fits the whole hippie, free love spirit of the time, not with any particular sexuality.  Esp for the time, nowadays yeah there is this heavy puritanical streak everyone seems to have going but it was different in the early 70s when even serious businessmen often had sideburns and hair reaching to their collars(long hair by today's standards) and everyone was experimenting

My comment was on the notion presented that a bisexual simply existing was SJW preaching. I feel like it's the opposite as the show presents it, Carlos is a character like any other who just happens to be bisexual and played by a non-binary actor - of course his sexuality is part of him but not the only part or the most important part.  Carlos is as I said, to me anyway, seems the most mature and most knowledgeable.  And even that is kind of a refreshing change, yeah he's the most knowledge and most mature but he's not "boring" because of it, he's not a stick on the mud, etc like the "mature" one would usually be played as. 

[Lastcall]

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

I think Carlos is actually a character done right. Yes, he has a flamboyant personality. But Bobby had a grumpy personality. Garth had a dorky personality. And so on. All hunters seem to have something or other going on shtick-wise.

In the context of the show he just a hunter with requisite tragic backstory. But knowledgable and competent. And his vibe fits with the free sex, drugs and rock`n roll thing. I actually think in a contemperary setting, it would stick out more (in the speak in twitter hashtags way) but the hippie look and mentality fits with the time period. 

I still haven't seen Carlos as the stereotype some critics have accused him of being. To me, he fits right in with the Seventies. One of my fears was that Robbie would write them the way kids today talk and I haven't noticed that at all (other than someone complaining about the use of "my bad"). So far, Carlos has been fine but it's still a wait and see for now. We'll see once he gets some character episodes. I do think there is a chance he could become very annoying if they don't develop him more in the future (but I hear there are some big character things in 4 so we will see).

[Aeryn13]

11 minutes ago, tessathereaper said:

My comment was on the notion presented that a bisexual simply existing was SJW preaching. I feel like it's the opposite as the show presents it, Carlos is a character like any other who just happens to be bisexual and played by a non-binary actor - of course his sexuality is part of him but not the only part or the most important part.  Carlos is as I said, to me anyway, seems the most mature and most knowledgeable.  And even that is kind of a refreshing change, yeah he's the most knowledge and most mature but he's not "boring" because of it, he's not a stick on the mud, etc like the "mature" one would usually be played as. 

While they are not really similar character archetypes, the depiction of the sexuality reminds me of how they did Constantine, both in his own show and on Legends. Noone hid that he had former boyfriends and girlfriends but even when that was referenced or shown, it had just about all to do with his magic use, his crochety personality and his hell problems.

I think it's the same with Carlos. He is a hunter and it is so inconsequential who he snogged when. And obviously his character type in a 70s set show is "hippie". Latika is the shy bookworm, John is the skilled war vet yet new to hunting and Mary is the relatively experienced hunter who wants out.

[LadyIrony]

9 hours ago, tessathereaper said:

I'm sorry?  Carlos just...existing(which is literally all he does, he exists, no one comments about him one way or the other, he's there, he is who he is..)..is somehow SJW preaching?

Yeah it's just boring to be honest. As I stated the original series was free of that kind of crap and to see it in this is just cringe inducing and boring. 

That said the series itself is like a cheap knock off so whatever I guess. 

[dingochick]

Quote

A lot of times you have to throw the pilot out - like the first pancake. 

I love this analogy, gonna have to use it. And I agree…Mr. Dingochick and I always give the pilot a pass because it’s just laying some groundwork. 
 

I’m interested to see where this goes, but I did have The Flash vibes what with the Scooby Gang (yes, I know that’s a Buffy thing but hey). I also felt like there was a bit of Legends of Tomorrow vibe… maybe because I think the actress playing Mary looks like Caity Lotz. In that vein, I think the guy play8ng John looks like Tom Everett Scott (or a combo of Sam and Dean).

liked the Easter eggs, especially for Kim Manners. And I like the way the show is filmed, with kind of a grainy throwback look.l.though sometimes it seems blurry. 
 

Music was good, so no complaints. I’ll let Dean narrate and pick the music…I am apparently easy to satisfy. :)

[foxfreakinmulder]

I forgot about this because I haven't watched the CW since Supernatural ended. I take that back I tried getting into Walker Texas Ranger but didn't make it too far. I was surfing on HBO Max and came across this. I enjoyed it especially hearing Jensen's voice and seeing him at the end, yum ;-)  I do like all the side characters and love that it's set in the 70's I'm still in the fence about Mary I liked the young Mary from Supernatural flashbacks also that John. I think the actor playing this John took acting lessons from JP and looks like him at certain angels. I like it enough to continue watching.