Sarah's Sober Second Thought Series: Return Of The Slay-tive

[Primetimer]

Sarah's favorite Buffy season gets off to a stumbly start as we meet a few old friends.

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[Wilowy]

That Giles moment alone in the kitchen is one of my favorites, too. And Willow's snot-face at the party, yes! 

 

Also yep, best moment:

 

[ethanvahlere]

And again, Joss still knew and trusted subtlety here (except for "Beauty and the Beasts", but I chalk that to the fact it was a transitional episode; besides, I didn't find Oz too sullen); he does't dwell on, for example, the reason why Faith eats so much whenever she can (when you live a spartan existence as she does, you eat like that when you can), and of course, my single favorite moment of the the episode; "There is no binding spell." As for Mr. Trick, I would argue that it's because he's a wanna-be Big Bad in a season that already has an implied Big Bad even before we meet him, so when you watch him knowing that, he does seem a bit lacking, but I still think K. Todd Freeman sells the part (I completely agree about Scott Hope, though).

[SilverShadow]

I cannot stand Dead Man's Party. Wilow, Xander, and Joyce are so effing hateful and snotty and sniping. And for Xander of all people to be so self-rightious makes my blood boil. The only episodes I hate more are Smashed and Wrecked.

Edited July 23, 2014 by SilverShadow

[Loandbehold]

I think Anne is the best of the season-opening episodes. And, I didn't like it the first time I saw it. Coincidentally, I got to watch it today (it was shown by FX today), and it brought out many of the reasons why I like it. We had Buffy first lost, but later reclaiming herself. The extended fight scene and Buffy's Gandhi quip. The example of a random act of slayer power when she rips the phone out of the wall at the blood bank, and her tea cozy speech. The Sunnydale scenes, as we watch the Scoobies dealing with Buffy's absence are also good. I was glad to see Xander and Cordelia get back together after their summer separation. I also think that they had every reason to believe Buffy had survived the Acathla apocalypse. The world hadn't descended into a hellish demon dimension, Acathla was silent, and there was no Buffy body in the mansion (all of which we learned, I believe, at the end of Becoming - I missed the first ten minutes of Anne this morning). 

 

I don't think anyone came across well in Dead Man's Party. Buffy was ready to run away again, Joyce gets drunk, Willow is at the height of passive-aggressive behavior, Oz decides to have a huge party at someone else's house without clearing it with the host, and Xander, who makes some good points, does so in a poor way. Which is one of his biggest flaws. Usually what he says has merit, but the way he says it is wrong because it's too harsh. This causes defensiveness in others, and that's understandable given the way he's speaking. Now, I admit that's coming from an unabashed Xander fan. While DMP is far from the best episode, I believe it's far superior to Where the Wild Things Are, Superstar, and the excrement that is Storyteller, which is not only worst episode of the series, but one of the worst episodes of any good series that I've had the misfortune of sitting through.

 

The introduction of Faith in the next episode really counts as the beginning of Season 3, which is my favorite season. I enjoyed Mr. Trick and, for someone who was a relatively minor villain, he caused a lot of problems for Buffy for half the season, which is what you want in a villain. 

[harrie]

I watched "Anne" this morning as well, and also recalled the things I like about it. In addition to the many good points made by LnB, I loved the way Lily decides to throw Ken off the platform; you can see her think, hesitate, and then commit.  Finally, when it really matters, Chanterelle/Lily finds her backbone.  (By the way, I also like the fact that Lily assumes the name Anne and turns into Annie, champion of runaways and displaced kids in Angel's LA.  But that's another show.)  Perhaps it's mawkish on my part, but I also liked that Buffy realized that she can run all she wants, but she's still the Slayer and will always be dealing with this shit. It's just who she is in addition to being what she is. And of course. heavy gate things piercing the villain's calves, pinning him in place, is always good. 

Edited July 26, 2014 by harrie

[VCRTracking]

Can't wait for Jane Espenson's first episode, "Band Candy". I liked season 3 but when this episode first aired, I was like "Now we're back!"

[Wilowy]

Just a side note, but Band Candy was directed by none other than Michael Lange, who is friends with Jane to this day and often directs episodes of my beloved current Scoobies on Criminal Minds. 

 

Yes, they are Scoobs. ;)

[KAOS Agent]

"Dead Man's Party" makes me want to throw things. I do understand where everyone's coming from but the passive aggressiveness and outright nastiness kills me. Even if I ignore the teenagers in this, the adults should recognize that this was a 16 year old girl who had been expelled from school, kicked out of her house, was wanted for murder and had gone off to kill her first love (demon or not, it's still rough) all on her own. How exactly did they expect her to handle all of that? And how do you think she's going to react when it appears no one wants her back? She'd returned to the town where she'd lost everything and if she thinks she's not needed or wanted, what teenager is going to want to stay in a place where she'll probably lose it all again? Of course, she's going to run again. And then they all fight zombies together and no one ever addresses the issue again. Why make everyone suck and then never bother to resolve it? I hate this episode so much.

[VCRTracking]

The situation was so frustrating because her mom and friends didn't know(but the audience knew) at that point what really happened at the end of Season 2. That Willow's spell to recurse Angelus worked and Angel's soul was returned but it was too late and Buffy had to send him to hell anyway to save everyone and THAT'S why she left Sunnydale. Her friends didn't know the amount of pain Buffy was in because she still didn't want to talk about it.

Edited July 25, 2014 by VCRTracking

[Spartan Girl]

Xander, who makes some good points, does so in a poor way. Which is one of his biggest flaws. Usually what he says has merit, but the way he says it is wrong because it's too harsh. This causes defensiveness in others, and that's understandable given the way he's speaking.

 

 

Summed up my feelings perfectly.  Even if whatever Xander says is technically right, he always comes off as a jerk while saying it.

 

I agree with everything everyone said about "Dead Man's Party."  And for the record, I wish Joyce had shown a bit more remorse for throwing Buffy out of the house.  IMHO, you forfeit your right to be upset that your child ran away when you throw him or her out.  She could have given her a little bit more slack about everything since she was the one that played a role in driving her away.

[Erratic]

I miss Pat :(

[DAngelus]

Buffy is horribly selfish, refuses to see anyone else's point in Dead Man's Party, and as usual tries to avoid the substance of Xander's points by belittling him, personally.  (Hey, it's an effective tactic; just wait until Anya starts attacking his sexual proficiency as a diversion!  Because when you can't argue with a man's logic, you can always hit him below the metaphorical belt.)  From comparing his right to speak to her to that of fucking Jonathan to making fun of his codename, she's just a brat all through the argument, even when she eventually acknowledges that he's right.

 

But hey, at least she let him talk to her:

 

WILLOW:  Buffy, you never—

BUFFY: Willow, please!  I can't take this from you, too!

 

Not sure which is more offensive here, Buffy's allowing Willow a bare three words before she cuts her off, or her implication that she expects "this" from Xander, but is holding Willow to a higher standard.  (After the argument, W/X can compare notes and decide which is more fun:  having Buffy look down on you, or having her patronize you.)

 

But, hey, all of this has been said many times before;  I think I practically analyzed the fight line-by-line back on TWoP.  And those Wayback Machine pages are just there, to be read at leisure, or transported here if necessary.

 

So rather than kick St. Buffy a little bit more, where she usually gets her fair share of brickbats any time this argument is brought up, why don't I do something more productive?  Such as inveigh against the Cult of Giles?  Because the G-Man is every bit to blame for the events of the episode as anyone else (if not more, given that he's the Watcher and this is his job), he usually just gets an unearned pass because he isn't in the room.

 

But…why isn't he in the room, exactly?  If Buffy's in an emotional crisis that freaking Oz and Cordelia are supposed to be able to recognize and cope with, how does that excuse her Watcher, the all-knowing and all-venerated (by a segment of fandom) Giles from ducking out on the goddamn party?  What's his excuse?  Oh, he was researching the cat, riiiiiight.  Because a resurrected cat, that's the crisis of all crises and much more important than his Slayer's emotional health.  When she's just back from running away for the summer.

 

IMO, Giles is pretty pissed off at Buffy (his snippy fighting with Joyce, as exemplified in the "art talk" conversation in this episode, isn't helping his opinion of the Summers women…one can only imagine how he felt in the Dawnverse version of these events) and ditches the party in an act of passive-aggression that makes Willow look like a freaking amateur.  Consider the chronology of the past 18 months from Rupert's point of view:

 

March, 1997—meets new Slayer, works hard to bond with her, despite her being far more strongheaded and disobedient than those who are trained for the job in advance.  Cuts her slack, allows her to have friends who work with her.  Tries not to think about what happened to her previous Watcher, and if this means that the Council is trying to kill him.

 

April, 1997—discovers his Slayer's boyfriend is a vampire.  Despite this, decides to allow and support the relationship, and let it continue and grow.  Also, apparently keeps this fact from the Council for over a year, given that neither Kendra nor Gwen Post nor Wesley has any idea about Angel's identity and/or his place in Buffy's life when they first come to town.

 

June, 1997—Decides Slayer is worth sacrificing his life for.  She's nice enough to not let him do it, things work out well, she takes off for the summer.

 

Fall, 1997—Continues to cover for Buffy.  Blithely assures Kendra that "no, no, [Angel's] good now", thereby setting the stage for Kendra's death.  Invites Angel into his home, apparently, given that Angel can enter in Passion.

 

January, 1998—With all of Giles's support and trust in Buffy and Angel, it's no surprise that they eventually "seize the moment", despite the fact that Jenny was voicing her concern about this just days before (cut scene from Surprise).  Continues to offer support, refusing to "wag [his] finger", despite his acknowledgement Buffy acted "rashly".  Meanwhile, Angel, whom Buffy has chosen to let roam free, kills lots of people.

 

February, 1998—Angel kills Jenny, and leaves her as a gag gift in Giles's bed.  Buffy apologizes and vows to kill Angel.  She doesn't.

 

June, 1998—Buffy finally kills the bastard, but only after Angel tortures Giles quite a lot.  Buffy then leaves town without even a word of goodbye (no indication the note she left for Joyce had any part addressed to him).

 

Summer, 1998—Giles flies all over the country looking for Buffy, who can't be bothered to send a postcard and let them know she's okay.

 

September, 1998—Buffy comes home, and acts like nothing happened.  She's all happy and chirpy in Giles's living room, doesn't acknowledge the work he did to get her cleared of her legal charges, and has yet to apologize.  

 

So, I'm not saying he isn't right to be pissed, I can understand it.  But still, hiding in the Library and apparently planning to ditch the party completely (if he hadn't found out that Joyce's mask was connected to the cat, would he have even bothered to call?) is a far cry from "[buffy and Angel] may well be in danger... as they have been before, and, I imagine, will be again. One thing I've learned in my tenure here on the Hellmouth is that there is no good time to relax. But Buffy's turning 17 just this once, and she deserves a party."

 

Yes, in the span of nine months, Rupert's gone from insisting on treasuring the affirmative moments in Buffy's life to trying to duck out on the awkward ones.  Yes, the part where she's pretty much responsible for the death of the only woman he's loved in the last 20 years and his suffering some very painful torture (which she repaid by running away) certainly has a lot to do with it.  But still. He's no angel in this episode, I'm just saying.

 

And then, we get one of the most IMO unjustly-praised moments in the show's run, right up there with the big barrel of non-funny that is "You made a bear? Undo it, undo it!".  It's the bit of pointless Anti-American bitchery in the car, as seen in Willowy's little graphic upthread.

 

Now, I don't carry a lot of water for Joyce Summers.  Most of the time I rather strongly dislike her, truth be told.  But, first of all, Joyce has been getting the short end of the stick from Giles because IMO his overt anger at her is his way of sublimating the subconscious anger at Buffy he can't bring himself to acknowledge just yet, and doesn't let out at all until "But, sadly, I must remind you…" five episodes down the line.  (By the way, I wonder how much of a coincidence it is that, after finally venting at Buffy just a little bit, Rupert spends almost the entire next episode [Lovers Walk] out of town on a sudden camping trip?  He must have been really afraid he'd completely lose it with her if he was around that week…)  But, even ignoring the basic unfairness of his taking out his Buffy-issues on Joyce, what exactly is G-Man's complaint here?  That Joyce didn't recognize that her mask could resurrect the dead?  Oh, sure.  That's fair.  Because Joyce is an expert in demonology, I suppose.

 

In fact, Giles, the actual expert on demons and the occult, the third-generation Watcher who has been training in this field for the past 24 years, didn't see anything out of the ordinary about the mask, either.  (Wesley, who actually reads the Watcher books, can identify Eliminati duelist vampires by Buffy's sketchy description of their weaponry, but Giles [who has apparently spent his years as a Watcher cross-indexing the porn] actually looks at goddamn mask and can't recall that there's a picture of it in a book in his Library, which one would hope he has read at some point since the Carter administration.  Way to go, G-Man.)  He doesn't remember seeing the picture of the mask before, and he will in fact blow right past it when he has the book open to the proper page later that same afternoon.  So how on Earth is Joyce, a vapid and petty housewife, supposed to have better knowledge of the mask than Giles, the highly-trained Watcher-man? His completely unfair blaming of Joyce for something she couldn't possibly have foreseen is jerkwater behavior worthy of…well, Joyce, actually.  So, yay for Karma, I suppose.

 

And then he goes and blames Joyce's alleged "stupidity" not on Joyce herself, but on her being an American.  Uh, hold on, Captain Green Card.  You can say a lot of bad things about Americans, but "we lack the occult skill to instantly recognize mystic objects that even a Council-trained demonologist can't spot" isn't really the strongest condemnation I can think of, to be quite honest.

 

So shut the fuck up and maybe next time sack it up and come to the goddamn party, okay, Tweed Boy?  Of course, if he'd been there on time, he might have had to do something other than take cheap shots at Cordelia, and (horrors!) might have told Buffy what a little brat she was being, rather than leaving it for Xander to take all the heat.  And, well, we can't have that, can we?  I mean, Xander's a whipping boy. Raised by mongrels and set on a sacrificial stone. Why let Our Beloved Giles get his hands dirty telling Buffy the truth when we can have fandom's least favorite do the job?  

 

(To quote Neal, Ted Buchanan's office mate: "If I sound bitter, I am.")

 

Despite all this, IMO Dead Man's Party is a much better episode than it's often given credit for being.  It's messy, but it's real.  I'd far rather have the Scoobies argue with Buffy than be reduced to a comedy sub-plot in a wretchedly-paced, emotionally-empty director's reel (hi, Anne!) or have them dropped out of the second half of the episode entirely (as they are in the otherwise-excellent Faith, Hope and Trick). Marti gets the tone right, and there are a lot of very funny bits before the angst takes over.

 

Plus one of our last sightings of Quippy Buffy:

 

BUFFY:  Hey, Pat!

(Ovu Mobani turns, gets a spade to the eyes, dies spectacularly.)

BUFFY:  Made you look.

 

So quite a ride, rocky though it might be.  Miles above the Band Candy garbage that Sitcom Jane will soon inflict upon us.  Top half of the season, and probably makes the Top 30 over all.  But JMO.

Edited July 26, 2014 by DAngelus

[VCRTracking]

I can understand where Xander is coming from but yelling at Buffy in front of strangers wasn't helping. Plus fans couldn't forget that he deliberately didn't tell Buffy about Willow's curse in "Becoming Part II"(I'm glad the show didn't either!)

 

I didn't expect Giles to go to the party because 1) he's not a social guy and 2)to outsiders he's still just the school librarian so it would be weird for him to show up there. Buffy's birthday party in "Surprise" was a private one at the Bronze. Giles was right when he said Buffy's party in DMP should be a more intimate affair but the others insisted to make it a bigger thing.

Edited July 26, 2014 by VCRTracking

[CletusMusashi]

KAOS Agent nails a lot of the things about the episode that are "off." 

But, honestly, at least for that point in the series, I like those flaws.

Real life has baggage. Issues that create group awkwardness do not always get settled. Bigger problems come along, fights get put on the side-burner, and life sort of drifts back to a semblance of normality.

Everything not being resolved sets the stage even better for things like Buffy keeping Angel's return a secret. 

Of course, too many things not being settled properly just turns the whole group into a miserable dysfunctional pile of idiots, so you've got to only do those rough edges in moderation.

A little bit in Season 3? No problem. Every single moment of Season 7? No thank you.

[Eidolon]

As liberal as Joss is, he isn't always politically correct, and I don't think he has to be to make good, even great, tv. Perfect people are rarely interesting.

 

Also, I like pissy Giles, and think he can get annoyed with us 'MERICANS from time to time, as well as the teenagers he associates with.

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎23‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 5:44 PM, Wilowy said:

That Giles moment alone in the kitchen is one of my favorites, too. And Willow's snot-face at the party, yes! 

 

Also yep, best moment:

 

Yeah, the stiff up lip forever. But in private....

On ‎23‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 6:30 PM, ethanvahlere said:

And again, Joss still knew and trusted subtlety here (except for "Beauty and the Beasts", but I chalk that to the fact it was a transitional episode; besides, I didn't find Oz too sullen); he does't dwell on, for example, the reason why Faith eats so much whenever she can (when you live a spartan existence as she does, you eat like that when you can), and of course, my single favorite moment of the the episode; "There is no binding spell." As for Mr. Trick, I would argue that it's because he's a wanna-be Big Bad in a season that already has an implied Big Bad even before we meet him, so when you watch him knowing that, he does seem a bit lacking, but I still think K. Todd Freeman sells the part (I completely agree about Scott Hope, though).

I liked Mr Trick but remember Faith wasn't supposed to live beyond the mid season, they changed their minds when everyone fell in love with the character/actress and with Faith as the Mayor's henchwoman there wasn't really room for him anymore. 

On ‎23‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 8:31 PM, SilverShadow said:

I cannot stand Dead Man's Party. Wilow, Xander, and Joyce are so effing hateful and snotty and sniping. And for Xander of all people to be so self-rightious makes my blood boil. The only episodes I hate more are Smashed and Wrecked.

No, they're all human as indeed is Buffy, one of the reasons they're so angry is that they missed her so darn much. 

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎24‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 2:39 PM, Loandbehold said:

I think Anne is the best of the season-opening episodes. And, I didn't like it the first time I saw it. Coincidentally, I got to watch it today (it was shown by FX today), and it brought out many of the reasons why I like it. We had Buffy first lost, but later reclaiming herself. The extended fight scene and Buffy's Gandhi quip. The example of a random act of slayer power when she rips the phone out of the wall at the blood bank, and her tea cozy speech. The Sunnydale scenes, as we watch the Scoobies dealing with Buffy's absence are also good. I was glad to see Xander and Cordelia get back together after their summer separation. I also think that they had every reason to believe Buffy had survived the Acathla apocalypse. The world hadn't descended into a hellish demon dimension, Acathla was silent, and there was no Buffy body in the mansion (all of which we learned, I believe, at the end of Becoming - I missed the first ten minutes of Anne this morning). 

 

I don't think anyone came across well in Dead Man's Party. Buffy was ready to run away again, Joyce gets drunk, Willow is at the height of passive-aggressive behavior, Oz decides to have a huge party at someone else's house without clearing it with the host, and Xander, who makes some good points, does so in a poor way. Which is one of his biggest flaws. Usually what he says has merit, but the way he says it is wrong because it's too harsh. This causes defensiveness in others, and that's understandable given the way he's speaking. Now, I admit that's coming from an unabashed Xander fan. While DMP is far from the best episode, I believe it's far superior to Where the Wild Things Are, Superstar, and the excrement that is Storyteller, which is not only worst episode of the series, but one of the worst episodes of any good series that I've had the misfortune of sitting through.

 

Controversial, Superstar and Storyteller are great eps (the latter rating 8.5 on the IMDB), not a fan of Jonathon huh? But we'll talk about it when we get there on the individual ep threads. I think a lot of people miss the point in Anne that when Buffy sees the Hell dimension it reaffirms her certainty that she did the right thing. 

On ‎24‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 8:10 PM, harrie said:

I watched "Anne" this morning as well, and also recalled the things I like about it. In addition to the many good points made by LnB, I loved the way Lily decides to throw Ken off the platform; you can see her think, hesitate, and then commit.  Finally, when it really matters, Chanterelle/Lily finds her backbone.  (By the way, I also like the fact that Lily assumes the name Anne and turns into Annie, champion of runaways and displaced kids in Angel's LA.  But that's another show.)  Perhaps it's mawkish on my part, but I also liked that Buffy realized that she can run all she wants, but she's still the Slayer and will always be dealing with this shit. It's just who she is in addition to being what she is. And of course. heavy gate things piercing the villain's calves, pinning him in place, is always good. 

Characters grow, that's why we love the Buffyverse. 

Edited July 24, 2018 by Joe Hellandback

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎25‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 4:40 AM, Wilowy said:

Just a side note, but Band Candy was directed by none other than Michael Lange, who is friends with Jane to this day and often directs episodes of my beloved current Scoobies on Criminal Minds. 

 

Yes, they are Scoobs. ;)

Yeah, I liked NB on that show (reason I started watching it) but MT was a revelation. 

On ‎25‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 5:31 PM, Spartan Girl said:

 

Summed up my feelings perfectly.  Even if whatever Xander says is technically right, he always comes off as a jerk while saying it.

 

I agree with everything everyone said about "Dead Man's Party."  And for the record, I wish Joyce had shown a bit more remorse for throwing Buffy out of the house.  IMHO, you forfeit your right to be upset that your child ran away when you throw him or her out.  She could have given her a little bit more slack about everything since she was the one that played a role in driving her away.

Everyone had their pain, everyone dealt with it differently, we can see everyone's viewpoint. 

On ‎26‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 3:22 AM, Erratic said:

I miss Pat :(

Yeah, me too, it would be nice if we could see that Joyce and Giles have a life and friends outside the Scoobs (MOO aside).

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎26‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 12:28 PM, DAngelus said:

Buffy is horribly selfish, refuses to see anyone else's point in Dead Man's Party, and as usual tries to avoid the substance of Xander's points by belittling him, personally.  (Hey, it's an effective tactic; just wait until Anya starts attacking his sexual proficiency as a diversion!  Because when you can't argue with a man's logic, you can always hit him below the metaphorical belt.)  From comparing his right to speak to her to that of fucking Jonathan to making fun of his codename, she's just a brat all through the argument, even when she eventually acknowledges that he's right.

 

But hey, at least she let him talk to her:

 

 

Not sure which is more offensive here, Buffy's allowing Willow a bare three words before she cuts her off, or her implication that she expects "this" from Xander, but is holding Willow to a higher standard.  (After the argument, W/X can compare notes and decide which is more fun:  having Buffy look down on you, or having her patronize you.)

 

But, hey, all of this has been said many times before;  I think I practically analyzed the fight line-by-line back on TWoP.  And those Wayback Machine pages are just there, to be read at leisure, or transported here if necessary.

 

So rather than kick St. Buffy a little bit more, where she usually gets her fair share of brickbats any time this argument is brought up, why don't I do something more productive?  Such as inveigh against the Cult of Giles?  Because the G-Man is every bit to blame for the events of the episode as anyone else (if not more, given that he's the Watcher and this is his job), he usually just gets an unearned pass because he isn't in the room.

 

But…why isn't he in the room, exactly?  If Buffy's in an emotional crisis that freaking Oz and Cordelia are supposed to be able to recognize and cope with, how does that excuse her Watcher, the all-knowing and all-venerated (by a segment of fandom) Giles from ducking out on the goddamn party?  What's his excuse?  Oh, he was researching the cat, riiiiiight.  Because a resurrected cat, that's the crisis of all crises and much more important than his Slayer's emotional health.  When she's just back from running away for the summer.

 

IMO, Giles is pretty pissed off at Buffy (his snippy fighting with Joyce, as exemplified in the "art talk" conversation in this episode, isn't helping his opinion of the Summers women…one can only imagine how he felt in the Dawnverse version of these events) and ditches the party in an act of passive-aggression that makes Willow look like a freaking amateur.  Consider the chronology of the past 18 months from Rupert's point of view:

 

 

So, I'm not saying he isn't right to be pissed, I can understand it.  But still, hiding in the Library and apparently planning to ditch the party completely (if he hadn't found out that Joyce's mask was connected to the cat, would he have even bothered to call?) is a far cry from "[buffy and Angel] may well be in danger... as they have been before, and, I imagine, will be again. One thing I've learned in my tenure here on the Hellmouth is that there is no good time to relax. But Buffy's turning 17 just this once, and she deserves a party."

 

Yes, in the span of nine months, Rupert's gone from insisting on treasuring the affirmative moments in Buffy's life to trying to duck out on the awkward ones.  Yes, the part where she's pretty much responsible for the death of the only woman he's loved in the last 20 years and his suffering some very painful torture (which she repaid by running away) certainly has a lot to do with it.  But still. He's no angel in this episode, I'm just saying.

 

And then, we get one of the most IMO unjustly-praised moments in the show's run, right up there with the big barrel of non-funny that is "You made a bear? Undo it, undo it!".  It's the bit of pointless Anti-American bitchery in the car, as seen in Willowy's little graphic upthread.

 

Now, I don't carry a lot of water for Joyce Summers.  Most of the time I rather strongly dislike her, truth be told.  But, first of all, Joyce has been getting the short end of the stick from Giles because IMO his overt anger at her is his way of sublimating the subconscious anger at Buffy he can't bring himself to acknowledge just yet, and doesn't let out at all until "But, sadly, I must remind you…" five episodes down the line.  (By the way, I wonder how much of a coincidence it is that, after finally venting at Buffy just a little bit, Rupert spends almost the entire next episode [Lovers Walk] out of town on a sudden camping trip?  He must have been really afraid he'd completely lose it with her if he was around that week…)  But, even ignoring the basic unfairness of his taking out his Buffy-issues on Joyce, what exactly is G-Man's complaint here?  That Joyce didn't recognize that her mask could resurrect the dead?  Oh, sure.  That's fair.  Because Joyce is an expert in demonology, I suppose.

 

In fact, Giles, the actual expert on demons and the occult, the third-generation Watcher who has been training in this field for the past 24 years, didn't see anything out of the ordinary about the mask, either.  (Wesley, who actually reads the Watcher books, can identify Eliminati duelist vampires by Buffy's sketchy description of their weaponry, but Giles [who has apparently spent his years as a Watcher cross-indexing the porn] actually looks at goddamn mask and can't recall that there's a picture of it in a book in his Library, which one would hope he has read at some point since the Carter administration.  Way to go, G-Man.)  He doesn't remember seeing the picture of the mask before, and he will in fact blow right past it when he has the book open to the proper page later that same afternoon.  So how on Earth is Joyce, a vapid and petty housewife, supposed to have better knowledge of the mask than Giles, the highly-trained Watcher-man? His completely unfair blaming of Joyce for something she couldn't possibly have foreseen is jerkwater behavior worthy of…well, Joyce, actually.  So, yay for Karma, I suppose.

 

And then he goes and blames Joyce's alleged "stupidity" not on Joyce herself, but on her being an American.  Uh, hold on, Captain Green Card.  You can say a lot of bad things about Americans, but "we lack the occult skill to instantly recognize mystic objects that even a Council-trained demonologist can't spot" isn't really the strongest condemnation I can think of, to be quite honest.

 

So shut the fuck up and maybe next time sack it up and come to the goddamn party, okay, Tweed Boy?  Of course, if he'd been there on time, he might have had to do something other than take cheap shots at Cordelia, and (horrors!) might have told Buffy what a little brat she was being, rather than leaving it for Xander to take all the heat.  And, well, we can't have that, can we?  I mean, Xander's a whipping boy. Raised by mongrels and set on a sacrificial stone. Why let Our Beloved Giles get his hands dirty telling Buffy the truth when we can have fandom's least favorite do the job?  

 

(To quote Neal, Ted Buchanan's office mate: "If I sound bitter, I am.")

 

Despite all this, IMO Dead Man's Party is a much better episode than it's often given credit for being.  It's messy, but it's real.  I'd far rather have the Scoobies argue with Buffy than be reduced to a comedy sub-plot in a wretchedly-paced, emotionally-empty director's reel (hi, Anne!) or have them dropped out of the second half of the episode entirely (as they are in the otherwise-excellent Faith, Hope and Trick). Marti gets the tone right, and there are a lot of very funny bits before the angst takes over.

 

Plus one of our last sightings of Quippy Buffy:

 

 

So quite a ride, rocky though it might be.  Miles above the Band Candy garbage that Sitcom Jane will soon inflict upon us.  Top half of the season, and probably makes the Top 30 over all.  But JMO.

That's not a post it's an essay! I thought my posts were in depth! How can you not like Joyce? Best TV mom ever!

On ‎29‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 6:18 AM, CletusMusashi said:

KAOS Agent nails a lot of the things about the episode that are "off." 

But, honestly, at least for that point in the series, I like those flaws.

Real life has baggage. Issues that create group awkwardness do not always get settled. Bigger problems come along, fights get put on the side-burner, and life sort of drifts back to a semblance of normality.

Everything not being resolved sets the stage even better for things like Buffy keeping Angel's return a secret. 

Of course, too many things not being settled properly just turns the whole group into a miserable dysfunctional pile of idiots, so you've got to only do those rough edges in moderation.

A little bit in Season 3? No problem. Every single moment of Season 7? No thank you.

That's not fair, season 7 had some standout fun eps, Him for instance is brilliant. 

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎30‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 4:55 AM, Eidolon said:

As liberal as Joss is, he isn't always politically correct, and I don't think he has to be to make good, even great, tv. Perfect people are rarely interesting.

 

Also, I like pissy Giles, and think he can get annoyed with us 'MERICANS from time to time, as well as the teenagers he associates with.

You must remember the background, Joyce blamed Giles for Buffy running away and whilst she's not altogether wrong you understand why Giles might resent it. It's more interesting when you consider how they act together in Band Candy. 

Besides, remember how snippy Xander (and even Flutie) are about Britain sometimes?