The Enola Holmes Series

[festivus]

5 hours ago, Llywela said:

Yes, I suspected as much and said so above. A mention of Mycroft, even as an aside, still would have felt a little more natural than ignoring his existence completely.

Yeah, that bothered me. Just a mention that he's out of the country on so and so business would have been enough. 

[Kel Varnsen]

Watched 2 yesterday with my kids. It was pretty fun. The prison break was a great scene. Plus the idea that Moriarty is a genius Black woman who has become a criminal because there aren't any good options for her in life is a super interesting one to explore. I really hope they make a 3rd movie.

The only thing i thought wasn't great was it was obvious that the cop played by David Thewlis was evil because that guy is always evil. And every time he talked I heard the Shame Wizard.

[MisterGlass]

I agree with what some others have posted about the second movie being overly long.  There is a tight, entertaining 90 minute mystery movie tucked between scenes of unnecessary, over the top action, monologuing, and sometimes forced comedy.

They are still grafting some of the atmosphere of the Robert Downey Jr. Sherlock Holmes movies on this.  I like those movies, but this could be its own thing.

All that said, I enjoyed the development of the relationship between Enola and Sherlock.  Both actors are good at their characters.  I would like to have seen a full family reunion.

On 11/5/2022 at 6:35 AM, Llywela said:

I wished they'd incorporated more of Enola's story from the original novels, in which she is socially adept enough to know not to attempt to set up shop in Victorian London as a teenage lady detective, but instead employs all kinds of subterfuge and disguise to achieve the same end, positioning herself as the secretary of a (male, imaginary) detective

While what they are presenting is entertaining enough, this sounds much more interesting.  In these movies they are inconsistent about the rules of their Victorian society.  I can accept an alternate history if the rules are consistent within the world they've made.

Was anyone else permanently scarred by the story "The Little Match Girl" as a child?

Edited November 14, 2022 by MisterGlass

[Llywela]

4 hours ago, MisterGlass said:

While what they are presenting is entertaining enough, this sounds much more interesting.  In these movies they are inconsistent about the rules of their Victorian society.  I can accept an alternate history if the rules are consistent within the world they've made.

Was anyone else permanently scarred by the story "The Little Match Girl" as a child?

Yes. This isn't a book v movie thread, so I don't want to harp on the point, but I will say that while I can understand the reasons why they chose to play it the way they did, I do think they undermined the central premise of the franchise by presenting Enola as so socially inept, which is a sharp contrast to how author Nancy Springer used Enola's set-up as a much more covert detective to underline her intelligence, cementing the concept of her as a true sibling of the brilliant Sherlock and Mycroft.

Also - the disguises are a lot of fun to read. Enola hates the current fashion for corsets and bustles, but makes full use of both to transform herself, when she needs to, for instance padding them out with a change of clothes to give herself a fuller figure and conceal her youth (even her brothers, from whom she is still in hiding in the second book, walk right past her without recognising her). She sets up a whole office for a completely fictional male detective and positions herself as his mousy little secretary - even the landlady doesn't know who she really is. She interviews potential clients 'on his behalf', corresponds with them 'on his behalf', visits them with follow-up questions 'on his behalf', always conveying the myth that all the information she gathers is being faithfully relayed back to this unseen employer who is supposedly the actual detective, the brains of the outfit. And thus she uses everyone's expectations against them. None of them suspect this mousy little secretary for a moment. And she can shed that persona at the drop of a hat, changing her hairstyle and clothes and even her body shape to become a completely different person for other aspects of the investigation - like infiltrating a fancy party. I think it all would have been a lot of fun to watch, but I can see why the film makers wanted Enola to remain more immediately recognisable, although I do think they took something away from the character in the process. Her undercover attempts in the film are laughable by contrast.

Edited November 14, 2022 by Llywela

[Mabinogia]

14 hours ago, Llywela said:

I think it all would have been a lot of fun to watch, but I can see why the film makers wanted Enola to remain more immediately recognisable, although I do think they took something away from the character in the process. Her undercover attempts in the film are laughable by contrast.

Book Enola sounds awesome. While I like movie Enola, I wouldn't exactly call her brilliant. She's tough, she's a fighter, but as you say, her undercover attempts aren't great, she comes across as a bit dim to think that a teenage girl in Victorian London would actually get people to pay her as a detective and she is a bit too inept from being overly sheltered. I get that her mum wanted to teach her to defend herself physically, but I think she let her down a bit in teaching her how to blend into society enough to take it down from the inside. Of course Eudora is portrayed in the show as a bit of a bull in a china shop with absolutely no finesse so I guess it makes sense. 

[Sarah 103]

On 11/6/2022 at 1:47 AM, Irlandesa said:

I root for love.

I like tragic love stories, so it works for me. Tewkesbury knows Enola is a bit of a radical and that she wants to be detective. Enola will never be able to fit into Tewkesbury's high society life as a member of the House of Lords, and he has so much he wants to accomplish, he would never dream of giving it up for her, and they both love and respect each other so much that neither one would ever think of asking the other to make that drastic of a change.

I enjoyed the second movie. After Enola was arrested, I wonderded whether Sherlock or Tewkesbury would be the one to bail her out. 

The movie subtlety revealed early on why Watson was not part of the first movie. These movies are prequels. Watson and Holmes have not yet met. 

Question: Is the idea of police officer on the take and clothing being a giveaway that he living above/beyond his means something that is era appropriate, or is it anachronism? I love the idea that it goes back over 100 years, but I am well aware it could be an anachronism. 

Overall, I enjoyed the movie. I hope there is a third movie. 

[SeanC]

17 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

Question: Is the idea of police officer on the take and clothing being a giveaway that he living above/beyond his means something that is era appropriate, or is it anachronism? I love the idea that it goes back over 100 years, but I am well aware it could be an anachronism.

I don't see why it would be an anachronism. Policing was never a job that made you rich.

[BetterButter]

'Enola Holmes 3' Is in Development at Netflix