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I think the Trickster actually made a comment to the effect that Dean was being tortured in hell. That's always been my head Canon although I've been told I'm wrong.

And Dean did spend six months in hell being tortured without breaking. My head hurts too.

I guess I wasn't very clear. I think hellhound and Metatron count but mystery spot and purgatory don't. Sorry.

I got exactly the opposite out of after school special. Sam left that school having been encouraged by a teacher to follow his own dreams and that's just what he did. He studied hard and went off to college. It wasn't until after Jessica's death that he gave up his dream (sort of) and he gave it up for revenge. Also in After School Special, Sam was shown as the one in the end who fit in and had friends. Dean was shown as the outcast. But as a kid, Sam was shown as ex cited about hunting and all Sully did was say he shouldn't have discouraged Sam from doing what he wanted to do then. And this was before After School Special in Sam's life so he hadn't decided he didn't want to hunt. I got the impression Dean was just trying to come up with something to say their Christmas's hadn't been totally pathetic. Pretty sad when a beer wreath is all you can come up with in my opinion. I could be wrong because I haven't watched that one lately but didn't Dean say something to the effect that that was a turning point where he decided to embrace the life. If he hadn't embraced the life before then he must have had some kind of problem with how his life was previous to that. In my opinion, Dean was making the best of what he had. I don't believe for a moment that he would have taken his freedom over having John around more. In my opinion, he would also have had more freedom, not less, if John had been around to be Sam's parent more. This was after Dean was 16 and embraced the life. Personally, I think he probably somewhere deep down felt he didn't have a lot of options by then. Sam didn't go back to school because he wanted revenge. And by the time he got revenge ( YED dead), he was on soul saving duty. Sam was trying to convince Dean that it had been worth it for Dean. I agree there. But Sam didn't remain in contact with Dean either. He broke off all contact with both of them. Or they actually tried to grow up a little and learn to give and take instead of just doing the easiest thing which was blow up at each other. Maybe they needed an anger management class so they could learn how to behave like adults. Yes. We just see things differently. I have said before and will say again, I think the writing for both brothers (and Castiel, and Crowley ) leaves a lot to be desired. Especially this year.

Just my opinion but if Dean's 6 months in Hell here don't count because it's an alternate timeline, then his deaths don't either. These should definitely count I think. I don't think this was ever presented as Dean dying. I actually think Dean said, during the discussion of Sam not looking for him, " I wasn't dead" in response to Sam saying that he thought Dean was dead.

Dean knew exactly what it was like to not feel like he fit in anywhere. It could be argued that his childhood was more difficult than Sam's. Sam had Dean as a pseudo Mom and Dad because, as Dean said to Mary, Dad was a "shell" of a man. Who did Dean have? And it was thrown in Dean's face a lot that his family didn't need him like he needed them. It is Canon that Dean was the buffer between Sam because of what he wanted and John and what he wanted from Sam. Who cared about what Dean wanted. We are never given anything to show either Sam or his Dad were concerned about what Dean wanted. Actually, Dean said all he wanted was to be a family. Did we ever see any effort by Sam or John to try for Dean's sake. According to the shifter, Dean had dreams too. Who cared about them. Who was there to steal Christmas presents for Dean? Who was there to give up Lucky Charms for Dean? Where was Dean's imaginery friend? I actually have more sympathy for Dean than Sam as far as their childhood. He didn't have anybody. By Dean's own admission, he had been Mother and Father to Sam. He gave up his chance at a normal life for Sam and gave up his dreams to take care of Sam. I can understand why Dean doesn't understand why his total commitment and putting Sam ahead of his own needs wasn't good enough. Maybe Sam didn't have friends other than Dean but Dean didn't have friends other than Sam. We got that with Just My Imagination. I hate that episode personally for IMO the retconning it did as far as how Dean took care of Sam. For me, it's not the times Sam doesn't remember, it's the times Sam rips into his brother. Like was mentioned earlier, we had Bad Boys and 5 episodes later we got the Purge. Anyway, those are just my opinions for what they are worth.

And the next year we got The Purge.

OK

LOL

I just don't do 14 minute Facebook streams unless it's something I'm really really interested in or I have no choice. Thanks for the info.

Don't really want to listen to a 14 minute video so can you answer a quick question as I'm confused? Is Jared donating money that he, Misha, and Jensen raised in the combined charity or is he donating the $120,000 personally? That's a lot of money!

Uhhohhh. I didn't mean to sound like I didn't believe you. Sorry! I don't have a lot of use for Singer. I understand killing off Charlie if her episodes didn't do well in the ratings. I didn't care for her but Singer's justification was exactly what Jensen labeled it IMO.

Is that true? If it is, it shows that Jensen doesn't have as much power bts as some folks think.

It will be interesting to find out what's real and what's misinterpretation regarding Ruth.

I was glad to see it to. Mark should be out celebrating...not checking Twitter :-)

Jim Michaels tweeted happy Birthday to Mark. Haven't seen an acknowledgement yet.

I don't know for sure. That's why all the "supposedly"s. It will be interesting to see what is the accurate quote.

Honestly, this is the most accurate assessment of the current state of affairs I have seen.

I also just saw a report that supposedly at PURCON, Ruth supposedly said she was not consulted or even told of her character's death before the episode. If that's true, it is another reason to fire Dabb IMO.

Ditto Jensen changed management so he must have seen a need. However, I haven't seen any improvements but maybe there have been.

Singer might have learned to not be so public with his comments after Felicia. He said (at a con?) that if Felicia called up and said she had 4 days for filming SPN, they wouldn't say no. Felicia tweeted that she was "sitting by the phone.". I don't want Charlie back either and I have heard that her episodes did not do well in the ratings but, IMO, these guys say whatever they think will get them off the hook with fans without a lot of thought to how accurate the statement is. Yes I am cynical.

Agreed!

This!! I think Jared was the top billed actor per his contract year one. There has been debate, but IMO, Jared was hired as THE lead actor originally and the first year Jensen wasnt considered co-lead. If that is the case and Jared had top billing in his contract, it would be next to impossible to negotiate it out. Jared would have to willingly give it up and that would be pretty not smart when thinking about his future after SPN. I don't either. I had understood it was Jensen that went to bat for Misha's when Sera Gamble was trying to write him out of the show. They appear to be good friends. I find it personally hard not to feel Jensen is being slighted when Misha apparently receives top billing when he does appear with Jensen. Misha is more important when he is in an episode than Jensen? Jensen and Misha are probably fine. That doesn't mean I have to be. :-)

OK. Thanks for explaining.