DittyDotDot

I think Jack's gonna do his own road to Hell in his pursuit to kill Micheal. I think it'll be like Cass in S6, who had good intentions but didn't know where the line was and just kept getting himself in deeper and deeper. I think Jack is going to say, "What would Sam and Dean do" a lot, but it's going to get a bit twisted around and go too far. I don't think he's going to go full darkside necessarily, but I do think it will add shades of grey to his currently very white personality.

Isn't the idea of a multi-verse that there are infinite universes of infinite different outcomes? I mean, there should be a universe out there where Sam and Dean exist but didn't avert the apocalypse; a universe where John didn't raise Sam and Dean as hunters; a universe where only Dean exists and one where only Sam exists; a universe where Sam and Dean didn't exist and someone else averted the apocalypse; a universe where Sam and Dean only exist on a TV show called Supernatural... I agree that events in the alternate appear to be the same up until the moment Mary made her choice, but I don't think they were one universe that split in two; they were always two different universes, IMO.

Okay, that's weird, it played for me yesterday. Try this one:

I don't think it invalidates what Dean said to Mary. Dean didn't hate her because she made the deal--he understood that, he made one too--he hated her because she was hiding away from her own responsibility of making the deal and causing a lot more pain for them than she already caused them when she hid away from it the first time. Personally, I think it's foolish to make these deals--especially if you're a hunter and know that nothing good ever really comes of them--but I don't blame Mary for making the deal and never did. I blame her for not doing anything after she made the deal to protect her family. She probably couldn't have changed anything, but at least the effort would've shown she wasn't such a coward.

In general, the show has always hinted their finales are in May--usually the day finale airs. Superwiki.com has the timeline of All Along the Watchtower set on "May 18th, 2017." They don't usually give a specific date if there is none given in the episode or hinted at in a previous one. For instance, the timeline listed for Lost and Found is "immediately following the events of On the Watchtower." They have no specific dates for episodes in S13, but a few are "immedietly following...." I believe last season, they gave the time for gestation on a nephilium to line up with Kelly giving birth on the day the finale aired in The Future, but I'd have to look it up to be sure. In general, it's been my observation, the show usually runs concurrent to our time frame. For instance, in S5 it was October of 2009 when Dean got thrown forward in time in The End and also October of 2009 when the episode aired. And, Lucifer gave the date of the finale for the date Sam would say "yes" in Abandon All Hope. And, in general it's been my observation, if they pick up the premiere from when the previous season finale left off--instead of doing a few months time jump like say back in S10--usually the show starts to line back up with our time frame by the time they come back from the mid-season hiatus. They'll either outright state a date, have a holiday themed episode that lines up airing with the actual holiday, or they calendars or other clues to tell you what month it is. IMO, the biggest screwiness happened in S6 though when they couldn't keep track of the year time jump and decided to just ignore it. And, that's how they've operated with every time jump since--ignored it, that is. So the year isn't always accurate, but my impression has been that they're operating in the same month the episodes air, more or less. Just so you know, it doesn't really bother me, I just recognize that time can be screwy on TV. And, IMO, it has felt like six months has passed on the show. However, in this case, I actually think Jack being 11 months old instead of six fits his current development better even if there's no way 11 months have passed since the start of the season. I kinda feel like six months would've been about the time he ran off development-wise. Don't ask me why, it's just my impression.

I just felt like after the first couple episodes they started happening over the course of a couple weeks. And then after Jack ran off, I think there was a huge time gap there before they found him again. So, it didn't seem weird to me or make me pause when Mary said it--although, I'm not sure how she's kept track of the time considering she's been tortured and hanging in a cage where if she moved it would poke a hole in her--but I'll tell you what is weird now that I've thought about it. Technically, Jack was born in May of 2017, so he should be 11 months old. We know they'll end the season in May again--like always--so, you're right, time is pretty screwy when you think about it.

Well, it's been six months since the start of S13 and the show usually does run concurrent with time in our universe, so no I didn't think it was weird. I don't think Jack did it intentionally when he was in utero--just cosmic power leaking out into the world--but I think he can open a rift now, just doesn't know how without someone like Kaia because that's the only way he's done it before. Most of his powers have been untested so we don't know what he can and can't do. I'd say technically, no, he's not human if he has no soul. Just like I don't believe Cass was human when he had no grace; he was mortal, but can never be human if he has no soul. As to the other part, I'm not sure what still stands for anything in Heaven anymore. Not-so-marvy Marv turned a lot of switches and made a big mess up there, so maybe prophets are such a big deal to archangels anymore. Or maybe Raphael was the one tasked with protecting prophets and with him gone the job was never filled again? I dunno. Which reminds me, I thought it was pretty reckless and foolish of them to leave Donatello in a hospital, unprotected. He may be brain dead right now, but he's still a prophet of the Lord, you'd think demons and angels alike wouldn't mind poking and prodding at him to see what makes him tick.

Not really. If they were together on the day--which his other colleagues and friends were not--he might not have felt it was necessary to put it out on SM too.

I think they will. They don't yet know about Gabriel, so Lucifer is literally their only option right now. I suspect they'll approach Sister Jo and try and get her to flip sides again. Oh, see, I think the demon tablet is what allowed Asmodeus to worm in. Dontatello was being affected by the tablet before Asmodeus approached him. So, I think it was his lack of soul that allowed him to be corrupted by the demon tablet and then Asmodeus just took advantage of it.

I don't know if there is any way to give Don his soul back, but I agree, I was pleasantly surprised they finally had some repercussions for their prophet being soulless. It seemed a little too convenient that he could just go about his prophesying without a soul and have no repercussions. Wasn't it more that he had been corrupted by the power of the demon tablet? I mean, yes, Asmodeus was manipulating him too, but I thought the tablet was what had actually corrupted Donatello.

Didn't Cass say they were a primitive form of beasts he thought had died out centuries ago? I don't even like bacon, but I too want it on a T-shirt!!

Oh, I liked them both, Maybe they'll do something more with the character, but I suspect they left a brain dead Donatello so they didn't have to deal with a new prophet being made right now.

That was an enjoyable hour of Supernatural, more or less, but it should really get the hokey effects award. Personally, I think Cass did the right thing. There was no fix for Donatello and it seems Sam and Dean have forgotten that sometimes you have to get dirty in order to clean up a mess. And quite frankly, Dean's lecture about who gets to decide was nothing short of hypocritical. Plus, I like proactive and sassy Cass. There's already too much angsting about every decision on this show. It's nice to see someone just make a decision and live with it without all the drama. And, I'm all for less standing around and talking about how they can't do stuff...so, thanks, Cass! Wouldn't have minded seeing Dean stab Alternate Zachariah in the throat again, but Jack making him go poof was pretty satisfying too. Looks like my predictions of Jack "fixing" the alternate might be coming true? AU Bobby is just weird. There are many, many characters I'd love to come back in the AU and see a different version of them, but Bobby isn't one of them. I would rather they revisit original universe Bobby. I just have no investment in Alternate Bobby. Anyhoo, overall a good showing.

It's been a really long time since I've watched this episode so I'm not sure, but I believe it was part of the original score written by Jay Gruska.--he and Christopher Lennertz generally alternate the scoring of the episodes. Gruska writes a lot of the more melodic themes while Lennertz wrote a lot of the guitar riffs and such. There was an OST album produced at one time--actually maybe there were two, I can't remember. Here's a link to a playlist. It's not complete, but might be a place to start: ETA: forgot to also give you this link to the music for each season, both original score and "the greatest hits of mullet rock": http://www.supernaturalwiki.com/index.php?title=Category:Music

Awww...Kripke would be so proud that he's still doing God's work all these years later. ;)

The main rule for the site as a whole is just to be civil. There's a overall site FAQ here that tells you how to do stuff like quoting and embedding and whatnot: http://forums.previously.tv/forum/2499-faq-guides/ Specific Supernatural forum rules are here: and here: And, BTW, welcome!!

Okay @ganesh, I'll give you this one. That's a pretty good incentive to turn the radio off--if the car did indeed explode because the radio was left on!! ;) Yeah, I'm not sure what difference turning the volume down would do either. But then, I don't turn off my radio when I park either, so... . ;)

We didn't wear our uniforms or jerseys to school on game days. We were asked to dress up on game days, especially if we traveled. So, slacks and button down shirts for the boys and skirts or dresses for the girls. Cheerleaders only wore their uniforms during games or at a pep rally. But, yeah, I realize that might not have been true for other schools, but it always makes me laugh when the cheerleaders wear their uniforms to school anyway. It seems so ridiculous to me for some reason. I don't know. As to the PE uniforms: I generally point and laugh at that too unless it's a private school. I didn't know public schools did that even back in the day, but you do see it a lot on TV for some reason.

Not always...Adam was also burned and was brought back. I believe Samuel was probably brought back by angels just like Adam was. Again, I go by what I see onscreen, not by what other character's opinions are. Mary is Dean's mother, he's got a bit of a bias about her so I can't really take what he says as entire truth here. IMO, they have yet to SHOW Mary as a badass hunter. I never said she was incompetent, but I don't think that being able to do the job automatically means one is badass. IMO, they have presented Mary as knowing enough to get herself into trouble, but not really and truly a good hunter...yet. Which, IMO, has been purposeful in the past and in the present. She was young in the past and in the present she was out of her element. Plus, I think they purposely had the Brits glorify her and hold her up as a shining example simply because she was doing what they wanted; and vice-versa damned Sam and Dean because they wouldn't do what the Brits wanted. I don't think the show was saying Mary was the best hunter on the planet though, or even that she was a badass, but were showing us another thing the Brits got wrong. And, they got a lot of things wrong, IMO.

Obviously or I wouldn't have said it.

Why would it be difficult? No one else knew about the deaths, there were no witnesses--even John didn't see what happened to Samuel--unless she told someone, who would know? Why would she be fending off questions from coroners if she burned the bodies before anyone saw them? And, unless someone reported them missing--which, who would if they weren't well-known in the community--why would the police come knocking on her door? I think she only had to fend off questions from John and considering he was pretty trusting and naive at that time, I don't think it would've been very hard. I didn't say the Lisa and Ben mind wipe didn't happen, I said it didn't make sense to me and I call bullshit on it. However, there was never any hint or outright saying that an altered reality happened so I tend to go with what does make sense to me. And, I'm not saying the angels don't have the ability to alter reality on some level, but there was no indication that reality was altered here. Mary clearly knew the truth about her parents and John didn't, witch indicates to me that Mary simply lied to John and he believed her. I guess I just don't feel the need to make it any more complicated than that.

If it works for you, that's great. I'm not saying you're wrong, but that it doesn't for me. An altered reality would've been akin to the Lisa and Ben mind wipe fiasco that never works for me. It's too big and requires more than just John and few people having an altered reality. And, there was no indication in-show there was any altered reality, but lots of indications that Mary had been untruthful to John. So it makes more sense to me Mary covered it up. I'm not saying no one asked any questions, but there was no proof of anything so those questions went unanswered. I wouldn't be surprised if Mary gave her parents hunter's funerals quickly and quietly. They being hunters, I don't think they were really known in the community. I actually don't think it would've been all that hard given Mary's up bringing. I'd imagine they weren't the first bodies she's had to quickly get rid of and make some excuse about.

I think it would likely depend on where you went to high school. Small towns weren't generally very fashion forward and this being set in the Midwest, I'd have expected to see more jeans and T-shirts like they showed here. If it had been set in the Northwest, I'd have expected to see more grunge attire and if it had been set in California I'd have expected to see more typical TV attire of the time. In this case, I think the show reflected the area it was set in fairly realistically except for the cheerleaders wearing their uniforms to school. That's something that always gets an eye roll out of me...or maybe that did happen at some schools, but not at any school I've ever been at.

I go by what I see, not by what villains say, myself. They really aren't very reliable in their assessments, in my experience. Not to mention, most of the Brits had no experience at all. I'd guess they would've been impressed by a monkey, TBH. And, Mary was being a good little hunter monkey, so why wouldn't they think she was awesome? Doesn't mean that's the reality of the situation, though.

Altered reality? I never got that impression. IMO, Mary used her hunter training to cover it all up. John said Samuel had a heart attack, and given Mary's nervousness while they were talking about it, I suspect Mary told him that and never gave him a chance to see the body to disprove it. Probably said the same thing about Deanna. I don't think there was any altered reality, just typical hunter cover up, myself. See, I never have seen this badass hunter all the fans talk about. IMO, Mary is a very poor hunter and tends to get herself into more trouble than not due to her own over-confidence in her own abilities. Except when she had the BMoL gadgets to make up the difference. And, even then, she was still pretty dumb and had very little instincts of her own.