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For me, it's not that Sam is upset about his idiot father and brother, it's this insane double standard that seems to only apply to Dany. According to the leaks, Sam flat out says that Jon should be king because he would never have done what Dany did to to the Tarlys. As has been pointed out above, Jon was fine with executing Janos Slynt for the egregious crime of not following orders. He also executed Olly, a child likely suffering PTSD from watching his parents get murdered by wildlings. Jon also nearly beat Ramsay to death with his bare hands, then stopped himself and allowed Sansa to feed the guy to dogs. Jon is a good dude, but the idea that he is some anti-violence pacifist compared to Violent Murderous Dany is ludicrous. Jon has showed time and time again that he is willing to kill people if he believes it is deserved. Also, the Ramsay situation showed that he did not have a problem with killing a prisoner of war who had committed serious crimes. The Tarlys were prisoners of war who committed treason and murder, so it is a similar situation.

Haha that is true! Maybe Dany and Jon fly to Dragonstone to have an emotionally fraught conversation about R+L=J while everyone else is eating dinner, then they return to WF just in time for dessert. I just had to look up a map of Westeros because I couldn't remember where Dragonstone was supposed to be in relation to the North and KL, and it seems like it's actually pretty close to KL? If so, then maybe you are correct and it is as simple as the survivors heading to Dragonstone for refuge / planning what to do about Cersei and the NK (assuming he's not killed in the WF battle).

Hmm interesting that it looks like Dany (and Jon?) are at Dragonstone in the new clip. Surely there’s no time in ep 2 for them to pop back there and then fly back to WF for the battle, so it would seemingly have to be ep 4 or later? Maybe Dany retreats there after the WF battle because she feels like she’s failed her people (especially if there are a lot of Dothraki / Unsullied casualties)? Or maybe they need to stock up on more dragonglass so DJ have to fly back and get some?

I wonder if Team Good Guys will splinter off into smaller groups from 8x04 onwards? For example, will say Arya, the Hound and Gendry head off on one mission, meanwhile Brienne, Jaime and Bran are doing something else?

It would be funny if in ep 4 Jaime goes to get Edmure out of captivity again to tell him that he needs to rally the Riverlands people to fight an army of ice zombies, and Edmure is all "...nope" and voluntarily goes back to his cell to hide out.

Is anyone else really curious exactly what episode 4 will be like? Will it pick up right after ep 3 and the survivors will be in a ruined WF making plans about where to go next? Will a few people have serious injuries that need to be dealt with, and will we see them burn the bodies of "big name" deaths like a Tormund/Pod type? Like, is it going to be a big "aftermath" type thing that's maybe a bit more slow and has minimal interpersonal conflicts etc? Or, will they do a time skip (say a couple of weeks to 1 month), and we open with the survivors in the Riverlands or wherever, plotting how to take on Cersei/KL etc?

I think it makes sense for Lyanna to pipe up publicly as she is a Jon fanboy who has never really seemed concerned with social niceties etc. It’s probably a combination of the Bear Island “warrior woman” mindset and the fact that she has been LoBI since she was quite young. The thing that seems most ridiculous to me are Sansa’s actions, because the show and writers keep saying that she has political nous yet her actions are those of someone with minimal political skills. In s5 Sansa agreed to marry Ramsey, and even discussed with LF about how her aim was to basically seduce him into loving her. Yet, Sansa apparently didn’t think she would need to sleep with Ramsey on their wedding night, even though bedding ceremonies are a thing in their world. Now obviously Ramsey’s actions and rape of Sansa etc was horrible and NOT justified in any way, but someone skilled at playing the game would have entered into a marriage alliance knowing that they would have to sleep with their partner to keep the charade up. In s6 Sansa is convinced that the North will rally behind the Starks and she shows herself unable to rally any Northerners to the cause. Davos is the one that manages to get the ball rolling with Lyanna. A skilled player of the game should have been able to get support from some Northerners. Then in s7 Sansa constantly criticizes Jon publicly, which shows everyone that the Starks are not a united front. A good politician would have saved the questions and criticisms for behind closed doors since the Starks ascension was so fresh. Then when Jon is leaving for Dragonstone Sansa never raised the idea of a marriage alliance, which any smart politician would have done (although to be fair apparently no one in Westeros has thought of a JD marriage alliance so Sansa isn’t the only one lol). When Jon is away and the Lords start bitching and hinting that Sansa should replace him, Sansa finally acts like a politician and placates then whilst turning down their offer. When Arya questions her about not supporting Jon she indicates she is playing the game and keeping them onside. Yet s8 rolls around and Sansa is apparently being cold to Dany. She is still questioning Jon but we don’t know whether that is in public or behind closed doors. But again, Sansa shows herself to be a political idiot as a skilled politician would be sucking up to the woman with 2 dragons and a massive army. Then Sansa should be secretly tasking Bran and Arya with digging dirt on Dany and seeing if she’s trustworthy, whilst tying to sweet talk Dany into getting the best deal possible for the North. My problem is not necessarily Sansa’s actions in and of themselves. My problem is that the writers are consistently claiming Sansa is a political genius, yet they have her act with with as much political skill as a ham sandwich.

Regarding dragons (and direwolves), I think there’s a good chance they will die anyway. I give ghost the highest chance of survival because he’s Jon’s, but even still I can definitely see him dying in the final battle protecting Jon. I kind of feel like dragons and direwolves were brought back specifically to assist with the fight against the AOTD, so once that’s over they will both be extinct again. Given Dany ended the first season birthing her dragons, with all this talk of callbacks I think there’s a good chance she will end s8 birthing the heavily forshadowed DJ baby.

I am giggling so hard that after a 2 year off-season where a certain shipper group were incessantly peddling political!Jon theories, it turns out that Dany is the one being accused by Sansa of using sex to manipulate Jon. Too funny!

Ooh interesting picture! I’m going to guess it’s something to do with R+L=J. Maybe Sam stashed the stuff he nicked from the Citadel in the library?

I am not liking all this talk about a Sopranos ending! Can you imagine if Tyrion really does have a trial in ep 6 and the show ends with Davos or whoever being like “we the jury find you....” and it just fades to black. We don’t know if Tyrion is found innocent or guilty or if he lives or dies etc.

It’s funny, because last season Sansa was much more in line with Dany’s mission than Jon’s. Sansa flat out told him that Cersei was dangerous and the one they needed to worry about, rather than the NK. So, why do people think Sansa will be appalled at the idea of taking out Cersei? After all, unlike Dany and Jon etc, Sansa is never on the front lines risking her life for her people, so her chances of dying in battle are minimal.

Apart from Lady of Winterfell, the only other real option I see for Sansa is the Vale. This is more because of book!Sansa though, as she is still kicking it in the Vale. If Sansa was to end up at the Vale on the show, I assume she would have to marry Robin. We do know he is supposed to be back in 8x06 so it’s not out of the question. However show!Sansa doesn’t seem too keen to marry and the last time we saw Robin he was still an incompetent buffoon. Unless Robin has had an offscreen maturation that would endear him to Sansa, it seems like the only reason she would marry him is for a political alliance. Given Sansa’s past marriages I’m not sure she would be keen on another political marriage, but who knows?

Of definitely, Maisie and Sophie have a history of saying kind of weird things lol. Sometimes I don't know if they are purposely trolling or if they just make shit up and run with it. Maisie's comment could be something that does not play out on screen at all lol. Oh man, I don't think I could handle another round of people screeching at each other about the AOTD and bending the knee. Although, I guess it would be funny if the tables turned and the Riverlands people were all like "you Starks/Northerners have no honour...Robb broke his marriage pact....the shit that has happened to us for the past few years is all your fault...we hope the AOTD kills you", and Sansa and the Northern idiots are all "the dead are coming, we need to put aside our differences and work together". Then poor Jon is just off in a corner like "FML".

That would be pretty funny. To be fair though, given all the drama in the first few eps there will probably be some initial tension between Dany and Jon when she learns the parentage bomb. There's probably a good chance that most of the issues are resolved after 8x03 though, whether it's Dany/Jon, Dany/the Northern idiots, or Jon/Arya/Sansa etc.

I’m quite curious as to how Jon’s parentage reveal will play out with Sansa and Arya now. I seem to recall a spoiler from one of the reputable sites that an emotional scene was going to be filmed in the crypts with Jon and another character. Initially most people thought it would be Arya, but from the trailer it seems that it may be a DJ scene. I assumed that Sansa and Arya would be quick to reassure Jon that he was still their brother, and the Starks would reaffirm their love and loyalty to each other and the pack etc. However, given all the drama from ep one, and the fact that the Starks look like still having issues in ep 2, I wonder if the parentage bomb will just add to the Starks issues? Maybe Sansa and Arya’s distrust of Jon will only grow when it’s revealed that he’s a Targ? If they already think his emotional attachment to Dany has clouded his judgment, perhaps they think his potential Targ family loyalty to Dany make him even more untrustworthy?

Maybe this is just setting the stage for Jon to easily peace out from Sansa and Arya at the end of the season, because he recognises Dany and their baby as his main family? Whether it’s by DJ leaving it all behind and living the simple life somewhere, or by DJ being in charge in KL etc. One can certainly understand why Jon would be more then willing to leave his annoying sisters in the dreary North to hang with Dany + baby in the South. I’m sure the love and support will be a nice change from the constant berating he receives up North! Besides, Arya and Sansa will probably be glad to see the back of Jon too.

Sansa and Arya might seem more reasonable if they actually expended even one second of effort in order to investigate Dany and see if she is trustworthy or a Mad Queen. 3ER Bran is right there and so far neither girl has asked Bran to “look” and get some intel on her. Arya is apparently a human lie detector yet she has not even asked Dany one basic question to “test” her. It makes the Stark girls look dumb and lazy. Although I guess this does finally finally prove that the Starks aren’t “better” than any of the other families. They are as equally untrusting, bitter, backstabbing and full of infighting as the Lannisters et al lol. ETA: Also, the Stark girls don’t know that Jon didn’t bend the knee until after Dany agreed to go North. But at the end of the day, I’m sure this is all just manufactured drama to keep things ticking along until the ep 3 battle. The survivors of the battle will probably come together with Team Dany and present a united front to go South etc.

I agree, unfortunately, that GRRM's intention could be that Dany needs to learn to be more restrained, and Jon will be the one to teach her(through the power of his penis or whatever). Hopefully, if this is the direction it is supposed to go in, D&D can somehow tone it down and maybe have Dany decide on her own that she wants to be "better" than her ancestors and not use fire anymore or something. Not that D&D are perfect and immune from sexist stories, but as you accurately pointed out this trope is very 80s/90s so they may realise that kind of storyline wouldn't be too popular now. I also thought that was strange. I know Sansa is LOW and everything, but I don't see why the other Starks wouldn't be participating in council meetings etc. Especially when Sansa and Arya buried the hatchet at the end of s7 and are presumably committed to working as a team.

Very true. And show!Jon has been presented as someone who would pretty much be the perfect ruler. He's a good fighter and willing to risk his life to protect others, he has overcome Westerosi prejudices and welcomed the Freefolk, and he's kind and fair and willing to give people the benefit of the doubt. The only flaw that show!Jon really has now is that he is maybe too trusting and truthful etc. However, it seems like we are supposed to agree with Jon that everyone needs to tell the truth and work together etc. and not play pointless political games. So really, his one flaw is not a true flaw. If Jon is named King in 8x06 (whether by himself or jointly with Dany as Queen), I don't think there's anyone in Weteros who would think he didn't deserve it and that he wouldn't be a good King.

Yeah, I agree that having 7 separate kingdoms and/or some kind of ruling council is really not breaking the wheel in any significant way. The Westerosi nobles will still be in charge and the poor common folk will still end up getting the short end of the stick. If the kingdoms agree to go their separate ways we presumably have say Robyn Arryn in charge of the Vale. That kid was severely messed up by his crazy ass mother and last we saw was a spoiled, inept child with a thirst for throwing people out the moon door. If Sansa is in charge of the North, we have already seen her advocate for Cersei-like policies of punishing children for their parent's sins and wanting to kick them out of their homes. Edmure has shown himself to be a buffoon and a weakling, and I would guess it would not be long before someone plots to dethrone him from the Riverlands. I'm not trying to suggest that Robyn, Sansa and Edmure etc. are evil and incapable of ruling, but that having them in charge is no different to having Dany and Jon in charge, apart from the fact that Dany and Jon have had more experience being leaders. I think the chances the IT will be destroyed are good, but whether you have DJ as King and Queen or the 7 kingdoms split up, who knows. The only way to truly break the wheel is to have democratic elections, but it seems very far fetched that Westeros will go from its current system to a more democratic voting system in such a short time frame.

I think in the books there is a lot more talk about how Aerys disinherited Rhaegar and his kids and names Viserys his successor. Possibly, Viserys was even crowned when he was a young child (I can't remember the full gist of it)? Thus, one assumes that in the books once Jon's parentage is found out it is not going to be a clear cut "Jon is the heir", because there is the legitimate school of thought that since Aerys disinherited Rhaegar, then Jon is part of that disinherited line and thus his claim is much weaker than Dany's. Now, again, I'm sure Jon would still have supporters in the books, just like Dany will. And as with the Stannis/Renly example, sometimes people are more than willing to back someone with a weaker claim if they like them better or get a better alliance out of it. I also wouldn't be surprised if the books have Dany and Jon marry to unite their claims, which is really what show Dany and Jon should be doing as well. Or at least their advisors should certainly be suggesting it. Then again, last season no one thought to bring up the idea of a Dany/Jon marriage (apart from Littlefinger!), even though DJ are two super hot, single, similar aged rulers who were working towards an alliance and were obviously keen to jump each other's bones lol!

I’m leaning towards Gendry surviving the series, mostly because I don’t know why D&D would bother bringing him back after such a long break just to kill him. There’s plenty of 2nd tier good guys who are surely going to die ie Pod, Jorah, Tormund, Edd etc, so they are not hurting for people who we will be sad to see die.

So given Friki seems to think that there is sexual tension between Arya and Gendry in ep 1, do we think Maisie was trolling when she gave that recent interview saying Arya is asexual? I think it was that same interview where Sophie said something about Sansa learning to love herself and not others, so could she have been trolling too? Maybe both Stark girls do end the series paired up?

First, lol that riding on dragons makes Jon and Dany horny. They are going full Targ in S8 I guess! Also, it would be hilarious if Jon and Dany called Sansa’s bluff about being in charge. They should tell her that will agree to put her in full control and let make all decisions, then ask her to outline her military strategy for the battle with the dead. They should also ask her if she is planning to lead their armies on horseback or dragonback, and Jon should offer longclaw to her so can kill WW. Sansa would probably piss her pants if she was actually put in charge and had to deal with all this stuff.