cereality

While the Seewalds are obviously opportunistic in going after a Duggar presumably to get their son an "in" in the fundie world like Josh got, I just don't think they've had the time or money to let their own Godly-iness go to their heads like the Duggars. The Duggars seem to believe that they are a representation of the average fundie family. It's been a LONG time since they've struggled. They act like they deserve everything they have just because they are Godly -- as if those with less are any less religious. They've forgotten what it is like to work 40+ hours a week, feed 10 kids on one salary while living in a 3 bedroom home. The Seewalds -- for all their faults -- are still in that experience. Michael is 39 with like 6-7 kids and no education that we know of -- which means that he has likely had to hustle and work a lot of overtime in construction, windshield repair and whatever else he does just to provide. Now that he has seen the Duggars up close and personal and not just on TV -- he may not "get" their lifestyle of making easy money because you're on TV. While he may want Ben to have an easy life with the Duggars providing for him, I could equally see him respecting his son if he didn't buy into the fame completely and rather turned out to be a traditional Christian male provider -- i.e. one who makes money in construction/manual labor rather than just by looking pretty for a camera. Honestly I think the best thing for Ben would be if he takes the "fringe" benefits of being a Duggar -- i.e. a few thousand made here and there on speaking engagements and the like -- while carving out his own career in something like construction. I feel like that's his only shot of gaining some respect from JB and the Duggar boys. The more he "takes" from his in-laws, the more they'll be able to treat him as a worthless guy who relies on them.

I don't see Ben joining the military. The Seewalds may not be against it -- as they seem not to be as conservative/fundie as the Duggars -- but Ben himself doesn't seem like he'd do well with taking orders and getting off social media. Not to mention even if he decided to deal with it, I feel like Jessa would have an issue with it; after training, you are stationed wherever the military wants you. I don't see her doing well at remote bases in North Dakota or Alaska raising 6 kids alone while Ben is off training or on deployment for a year at a time. I think the Duggars' long term plan is to build an empire -- like what you see for Joel Osteen or Oprah. I think it will basically be a company that does speaking engagements -- and they'd have a lot of young people to preach about life/child rearing/marriage/politics etc; it would start with Ben and Josh and their wives and then absorb other Duggar sons in law who need a job. That kind of thing can turn into book deals, radio shows etc. -- enough that the families can live well even after the TV show goes away, which it will within a few years. Right now people are interested in Duggar weddings and grandkids -- but I don't imagine that 5 more courtships and weddings from now, it'll be interesting to anyone besides their hardcore followers, esp since no one is doing anything different. It could conceivably remain interesting if a few openly went fundie lite and we could watch them build whatever kind of lives they want in NYC or LA or something; but to watch kid after kid marry in Arkansas and have as many kids as God gives them will get old.

The Josh and Anna courtship didn't provide a useful primer on the Duggars' view of courtship. First of all it was mostly long distance and while I'm sure phone calls where chaperoned, it wasn't shown on TV as JB and Michelle hovering over a Skype call. In the few times that they met up in person, Josh took a few siblings, but no where did we see double dates with either sets of parents; I'm not even sure if the Duggar parents ever went down to Florida before the wedding. Nor did we see Anna's dad taking Josh out to do manual labor and having the brothers ask questions about how he'd support their sister etc. Maybe some or all of this happened, but the Seewalds wouldn't know because it wasn't on TV. Plus Michelle has said a few times that they treat girls' courtships differently. I think they're going to be far more intrusive with their daughters and feel much more comfortable double dating with them or humping in front of them than with their sons; with the sons I think Michelle takes the view of -- it's the bride's family's problem to provide a chaperone and sanction an activity.

Let's hope Duggar Towing brings in a decent amount of business because aren't his other jobs volunteer positions -- volunteer firefighter and constable? And while I can see the Duggar females going fundie lite simply because they are the ones who will have to bear the children, breastfeed, keep house etc. -- I think the older Duggar boys will want their brood of 8-10 or more kids so JD better be making money from his towing business. If the girl he's been seen with is the one he's courting -- she looks like Erin Bates with the big hair.

I think the Seewalds probably did have a bit of a change of heart. At first they probably thought it would be great to be affiliated with the Duggars -- they are well known in Arkansas in the fundie community, which would only help their son if he could hook a Duggar girl. So he impressed a Duggar girl -- the one who wants off the compound most -- and that was that. I think it was only after that point that the Seewalds realized what the Duggars really were like and what courting really would be like. Sounds like Ma and Pa Seewald dated in the way conservative Christians do. While they had seen the Duggars talk on TV about courting hypothetically, they probably thought it would mostly be like conservative dating -- they had no examples to go on because at that time there had been no Duggar courtships; if they looked at the Bates -- they probably saw examples of sweet conservative dating and thought that's what they wanted their son to do too. Then the courtship comes along with the father in law who never wants to let the "kids" be alone -- everything down to getting ice cream is chaperoned. At that point maybe the Seewalds starting having doubts but still thought -- it's ok, he can listen to her parents. Then JB keeps extending this thing while Jill and Derick marry quick after a long distance courtship and maybe Pa Seewald starts thinking -- I get how it is, he's not going to treat my boy well because my boy isn't "good enough" for them. However by that time horny Ben was so in love with Jessa that I doubt his parents could talk him into stepping back. Now the Seewalds can rant and rave on the internet, but really their son is "owned" by the Duggars. Also, I don't know how fundie courting is supposed to be, but in eastern cultures were there are arranged marriages -- it is the GROOM'S family that controls everything. In those cultures, the view is -- girls are a dime a dozen and your family/daughter is lucky to be getting our handsome engineer/doctor/lawyer son who will provide for her, you better listen to us or we'll walk and find another bride in a month. I've seen fighting on everything from dowry to dumb things like a 4 pm reception vs a 6 pm reception with the groom's family taking the tone of -- you better make us happy or we'll walk and your daughter will be a spinster. (Not suggesting that eastern cultures are like this now -- but that's how it used to be.) So maybe the Seewalds think they deserve some deference as the family of the groom -- though they're not exactly providing Jessa with a professional who can financially support her . . . .

I don't know what Ben and Jessa's deal is but they both don't look happy. I am not even comparing to Jill -- Jill is an outgoing, giggly person so of course when she was courting and dating she was showing everyone how over the moon she was for Derick. Not everyone is like that, and some people are a lot more reserved. However I have seen reserved people in love, and even they seem happy. I watched the engagement video -- in the church -- on TLC's website (don't know if that was also their "announcement" on TV yesterday). Aside from the fact that neither one is articulate enough to finish a sentence, I also thought that neither one looked at all happy. Ben seemed "relieved" that it was a done deal, and they both had the affect of -- I just closed a business deal. I get that that's what this marriage is -- she gets off the compound; he gets a job based on the Duggar name; and JB benefits because it's another season of stuff to film. BUT at the end of the wedding these two are stuck with each other for life. I guess like with all arranged marriages, they will grow to know and love each other; but it would be easier if they had some sparks of attraction or some excitement for married life already there to build upon -- the way we saw from Jill/Derick; even Josh/Anna -- Anna was very excited to build a home with Josh; Chad/Erin; Zach/Whitney. I didn't realize Ben's dad posted the part about "if a girl asks you to talk to her father, find another girl." That's telling and does seem directed at his son's potential for acquiring a controlling father in law. BUT couldn't Pa Seewald have had a man to man chat with his son, rather than posting on a blog and hoping Ben would take the message to heart? I'm not suggesting that you can talk a horny 19 yr old male out of anything, but when the courtship was taking forever and JB kept making Ben jump through hoops and wouldn't even let Ben and Jessa go to ice cream or mini golf alone and Ben was growing [ahem] "frustrated" -- couldn't Ben's dad then have said -- son we think she's a great girl but look at how her family is acting right now, it won't get any easier and we have no idea when they will actually allow you to marry or what you will have to do for work/life etc. after you are married -- there's lots of other fish in the sea, look at all the pretty girls at community college -- how about a date with one of them!? I also think Jessa has lost some weight. Nothing wrong with that but speaking from personal experience -- if you're not working out hard (and I don't think that family does that) and you lose weight like that in the face and neck -- often times it is from stress and unhappiness. It's not that you WANT to lose the weight, it just unintentionally happens. Shouldn't Jessa or her sisters or mom or Amy or someone notice and ask if everything is ok and how she is feeling about all the impending life changes?? I know when it happened with me -- and it was "only" work related issues -- I had quite a few people call me out on it and they won't listen to "I'm fine."

So now Ben and Jessa will speak along w/ Jill and Derick tomorrow re purity and relationships. That didn't take long to get out there with a public event a minute after the engagement. Even if the Seewalds aren't in the pre fab home business now, they may still be able to get Ben a discount on one to put on JB's property. Or doesn't Grandma Duggar have a number of rental properties -- the home Josh lived in as well as others? I imagine JB can get his mom to rent out one of those to the happy couple at little to no cost. I do think that they'll be pregnant immediately. I realize all of these fundie couples start trying immediately, but even then you do see couples get pregnant a month or a few months after marriage. With these two -- I'm thinking honeymoon baby.

So Pa Seewald rants and raves on his blog and suddenly less than a week later we have an engagement? Something doesn't seem right about it. I'm not one of the ones who believes that they've been engaged for a while; if they were and the engagement was just a secret for filming/ratings purposes or they didn't want to "announce" any kind of engagement until after Jill's wedding also to keep the family's name in the news longer -- Pa Seewald wouldn't have blogged about it. If anything he knows his son will benefit from TLC fame and wouldn't want to do anything to jeopardize that if they got engaged a few months ago but the Duggars said they wanted to keep it quiet until filming resumes. Hate to say it but it seems like -- Pa Seewald called out the Duggars last week. Suddenly JB decided that things are going well for the family right now with the Jill/Derick story line and he doesn't want bad press coming from a broken courtship, nor does he want a mopey Jessa in the new season as that'll hurt future courting prospects -- and viola God lays it upon his heart a few days later that he's tested Ben enough and Ben has passed with flying colors even though he still hasn't figured out an education or career. He calls Ben Monday-Tuesday. Ben goes with Daddy to pick out a ring on Wed., as I suspect the Seewalds may be paying for it. And by Thursday, we have a proposal. The entire timing seems to convenient.

If this is something going on between JB and Pa Seewald -- either because JB said no to a hand in marriage or said Ben needed a job/education or reprimanded him because of the bad publicity on the anti-Catholic stuff -- and Pa Seewald has taken offense or the dads clash enough that this whole thing ends, I'll actually feel a bit bad for Ben and Jessa. I don't know if they are actually in love with each other -- seems like a middle school romance. But Jessa seems to have gotten used to Ben or the idea of Ben -- the idea that she has someone to talk to and take selfies with and someone who will take her away from her current life. Ben -- well he seems to like having a girlfriend on his arm and is probably dreaming of the day they get to consummate. Either way only they can know if they love each other (or like each other enough to get married on the hope that they will fall in love as the years go by). If either JB or Pa Seewald put their foot down and break it off because that's what God (or they themselves) will, there will be some serious heartbreak. Zach Bates was apparently depressed for months after this break up and he hardly knew the girl (again - probably in love with the idea of her and the impending marriage) -- here they've spent ONE YEAR together taking selfies and showing the world how much they love and miss each other. That's going to be hard to get over esp. if it happens due to parental decisions. I suspect Ben will rebound quickly with some other fundie or some co-ed at U. Arkansas -- whether his parents know or not -- but Jessa -- I can see her going down the Jana road -- that incurable misery that happens when you feel like you'll be stuck some place for life.

Is Corey in denial? I think he is a good dad and loves his girls, but Ally obviously has a physical issue and I'm not sure that him just being "strict" with her and telling her she can't be carried or has to walk is going to be enough in the long term. I get what he's saying -- he wants to push her to remain mobile as long as possible -- but is Leah wrong -- that she gets tired and could use a wheelchair at least once in a while? Why is Corey so resistant to having the wheelchair around -- if she doesn't need it, don't use it; if she does -- it's there. It was like the previous episode where he was upset that Ally would see her sister do cartwheels when she can't or when he (actually both parents) were upset that Ally knew the name of her illness. She's 4 -- she will notice that she can't do what other kids can esp. given that she has a twin so she's with another kid her exact age all the time.

Comfortably -- meaning each kid has some kind of college fund even if not fully funded -- I'd say 2-3 kids. A little less comfortably -- along the lines of -- if you could to college we can give you a few thousand per yr but you better find merit scholarships for the rest -- 4-6 kids. Derick comes from a family of two. While he may be saying "as many as God gives us" because that's what his wife and inlaws want to hear -- in his heart of hearts, even if wants a bigger family, he may be thinking along the lines of 3-4. Even Josh who was raised Gothard has said -- as many as God gives us but if that's only 3, that's ok -- indicating a preference for a smaller family. Alyssa Bates said to Nightline that she'd be ok with something like 6 but can't see herself handling what her parents have. I think these kids who've grown up in these mega families honestly don't want what they had.

If Ben and his parents are so anxious for Ben and Jessa to marry, why not have Ben just ask JB for her hand in marriage already? Either he'll say yes and they can move forward or no and they can move on and find Ben another fundie courtship that'll have him married in 3 months? Is it because they're afraid of hearing no and being cut off from the Duggar fame/fortune so they'd rather keep this going until they can get to a yes? Or do you think he's already asked for her hand (or Pa Seewald has asked JB's thoughts) and has been told "not yet -- you need to go to school, get a job etc" and that's why Pa Seewald is frustrated?

I don't think it's all that bizarre that she goes and eats lunch with him sometimes; I don't get the sense that it's daily -- maybe it's their thing once a week or 2x a month or something. Aside from the fact that it breaks up the day for her, they're also newly married having barely gotten to know each other. They (esp Jill) are probably in the stage where they want to see each other all the time, and Jill may feel that being away from her love for 8-9 hrs is a LONG time. Derick presumably had relationships in college etc. and likely didn't think it was a big deal if he only saw those girls at the end of the day because they had classes on the opposite sides of campus all day long, but for Jill she's in that lovey-dovey phase that people go through with their first boyfriends of NEVER wanting to be apart. He's a nice guy and while I'm sure he doesn't want a rep for being that dude who always has his wife visiting work, I don't think he's going to say no to her coming for lunch once in a while. Anna spent a lot of time at the car lot at first and even with the kids, but now in DC she's obviously managing days on her own; Jill will get there -- this whole thing is a huge adjustment.

She'll be yesterday's news to fundie men, but I'm not certain she wants that anyway -- despite her courtship with Ben. To the regular conservative Christians out there -- people who'd be friends with Derick or with cousin Amy -- she'd be like anyone else; she had a relationship for a yr, it wasn't physical, it didn't work out so she moved on. It wouldn't be the end of the world for her. Besides she's pretty and has Duggar fame -- frankly she could probably even find another fundie and find a way to blame the whole thing on the Seewalds rushing her or Ben not being financially able to take a wife.

The reality is that things were fine for Ben until Derick came along. Ben was what the Duggars imagined their sons in law to be -- minimally educated, fanatically religious, and needing their father/father in law to set up a business for them. Then Derick comes along with the college degree and a corporate job and is still a Christian. As much as the Duggars don't want their own kids going down that road, JB does love his daughters and I think the realization may be hitting him that their lives will be easier and more similar to how they are accustomed to living, if they marry someone with an education/career/trade -- of which Ben has none. This -- combined with the fact that they didn't quickly need a newlywed couple bc they got one -- may have led JB to slow things down and put more obstacles before Ben; there's been talk that Ben is going to U. Arkansas this semester -- maybe JB is "requiring" that and Pa Seewald feels those are too many demands. I'm surprised Pa Seewald didn't directly call out Derick -- all those book learning kind of guys who need to be in college for yrs delay the age for marriage and thus people look at a 19 yr old wanting to take a wife as odd; Derick's got to be at least 24-25. I wouldn't be surprised if the Ben/Jessa courtship comes to an end. Though if JB is feeling like "God is calling him" to veto this, he should tell his daughter to get off social media and lay off the selfies. It will be easier to fade away if they haven't been seen in awhile, rather than posting selfies up until the night before the break up.

Wow -- if they want a Duggar daughter in their family, I'm thinking that calling out the Duggars directly re overzealous protection by the fathers of their daughters or the absurdity of "giving away pieces of your heart" or not giving young people any room to develop a relationship is probably not the right move. He makes apologies for his son -- that a 20 yr old is not going to be as wise or mature as a 40 yr old dad. He and the mom seemed DESPERATE to get Jessa and Ben together -- you could practically see it at that dinner. Do they not realize that the Duggars like sycophants and not people who call them out? I kind of wonder if this is the beginning of the end of the relationship. He says something about how not ending up with someone that you pursued a relationship with isn't the end of the world -- you haven't given away a piece of your heart bc you haven't had sex. I wonder if both sides are realizing this won't work? Maybe Pa Duggar has had a change of heart about Ben and that's why he's insisting that everything be super slow, and maybe the Seewalds are offended by that because they think their son is a catch and shouldn't be made to jump through hoops. With this post out there, if they want to break it off, they easily can. Just let it fizzle from the Duggar side and the Seewalds can make a few more statements about how Ben is ready to be married and didn't desire a years long courtship -- he thought he was getting into a standard 3 month fundie courtship which would end in marriage. The overall tone is offensive -- though I guess in their world there won't be too many adults pushing 30 or beyond who are unmarried -- bc he makes us all sound like worthless losers.

Why haven't they gotten married? I've followed on and off and it seems like Catelynn is desperate to marry Tyler and Tyler keeps saying vague things like "we have to work on things." Didn't watch couples therapy so it isn't clear what they're working on, but in Being Catelynn it seemed like trivial things like losing weight. And if Tyler doesn't want to marry, why not break up? I realize they've been together since middle school and it'll hurt, but it's not like it'll be any easier 2 yrs from now -- esp not with a kid. Do we think this kid cements the relationship? Or what finally drives them to break up, Catelynn as a single parent etc.? They've got to be in a better position financially now than at age 16 though. They have a home and 2 cars, though I imagine there are loans for all of those things. I imagine they made money off of Teen Mom, speaking engagements etc. so hopefully they've been wise with that. Why didn't they go to college when they had a decent amount of cash coming in from MTV consistently? While they make money now, it's if/when they can book a speaking engagement -- which can't be steady money. And how are they going to explain to Carly that they're keeping this kid but 5 short years ago they couldn't keep her? It's not like they're so settled now. Though maybe Brandon and Teresa back off even more and they get even fewer chances to see Carly.

Agree she has done domestic things her whole life and the one thing she doesn't need a man's opinion on is cooking, cleaning etc. In fact, she comes from a culture where women are to take care of those things without bothering the man, so I don't see her calling Derick from the grocery story asking about what brand of soap to buy. I can however see her deferring to Derick on more "worldy" things -- news, politics, sports etc. She has had no exposure to those issues, and she may feel that she must defer to her man's opinion on those types of things and not go "against" him in any way. Depending on how Derick is, I could see that throwing him or even actively driving him nuts. Some men are used to women being intelligent equals -- at least for day to day discussion purposes, even if the man controls the family. Derick may be the type who enjoys getting into a small debate about the news or sports and may not love for the wife to always repeat what he says. I don't think we've seen enough of him on camera yet to see what he's really like. Whereas Ben -- I can see how he would expect his wife to agree that the earth is flat, if he said so.

I really liked the "about the family" section. It seems like each kid from about age 18 on has/does something of their own; it's still a restrictive list of choices that fit within their beliefs but it seems like in the Bates family there are SOME choices. Good for Michael that she can go be a nanny for another family and be paid for it -- rather than raising her own siblings for free like the Duggar girls. And good for the ones who want to pursue music and record CDs or take college classes or work at a florist or whatever. It just shows how much the Duggars aren't paying attention to their kids. They could give their kids the same kinds of chances -- frankly probably more because they have TLC money and honestly 1-2 kids could easily get an "internship" with TLC where they could learn camera work, production etc. And frankly in the area in which both the Duggars and Bates live, it isn't all that "risky" to their faith to have kids out in the world. Sure they may be exposed to people who aren't Gothard, but working as a nanny or for a florist in the rural south, you are generally amongst conservative Christians; it's not like they'd be sending kids out into the world in LA or NYC where you have Muslims, Buddhists, atheists etc. I can't remember which Duggar girls got to "work" at a coffee house for a few hours -- probably Jinger with a chaperone -- but I really don't see what would be so wrong with letting a kid have that kind of small scale retail job. Heck -- JB probably knows a lot of the small business owners in that area, Jinger likely wouldn't be able to pick up more than 20 hrs a week anyway and those kinds of shops have a known clientele -- not that much risk of her being brainwashed and running away. I always wonder how much of this is how the Duggar kids are themselves. Do you think they've gotten used to a schedule of sleeping until noon (at least the boys) and doing nothing all day to where they don't want for more? Because Jill was able to carve out the job she wanted for herself for a short time until marriage -- she convinced her parents it was ok and they let her. Are the rest of the siblings just lacking in initiative or thinking it's too much work to come up with a scheme to convince mom and dad? Heck for as close as they claim to be to the Bates -- I feel like they could even tell Gil/Kelly what they wanted to do and say to them "could you pls talk to my mom/dad about why it's ok to work at a florist just like Alyssa did"?

Seriously. That article seems made up. It's not like Jill is used to being so entertained and now she's bored -- she grew up not even going to school and doing chores with her sisters all day long. This isn't someone who is used to having a hundred girlfriends at school and then heading out to a sports practice followed by dinner with the team -- I highly doubt her new life is so different or boring for her esp since her sisters are her best friends and she sees them pretty much whenever during the day. Derick -- ok maybe; he went from having a fun college dorm life to a 2 yr mission in Nepal where he was likely out and about all day, and now he's chained to a desk 9-5 but he seems like a mature guy who gets that everyone goes through this in their 20s at their first professional job. And I should hope their marriage isn't boring to them just yet -- they're likely trying and doing things they've only been doing for the last month; it should still be pretty exciting.

I agree the Amish put their kids in a better position than fundie families esp the men because most/all of them know a trade; if a typical Amish male were to leave, he could go pick up work with a contractor and make decent money -- enough to support a family. In contrast the typical fundie with no skilled trade and no college degree and no connections would more likely be relegated to retail or restaurant work, which doesn't pay nearly enough. I don't know if I agree about the shunning long term. I agree that Josh, Ben and maybe Zach (and probably all the oldest brothers in this faith) are more smug than their fathers and they'd be the first to shun a sister who wanted to go to college or marry someone that daddy didn't approve of or a brother who came out or wanted to leave to pursue college/military etc. But I also think that is because life hasn't kicked them in the a$$ yet. It's very easy to be smug and convinced that your way is right when you are young and taken care of. Josh only has 3 kids and a cushy job in DC right now. Ben still has mommy and daddy paying his way. And Zach is likely doing well enough in his county commissioner gig that having a kid on the way isn't financially stressful. We'll see how "devoted" these guys are to their fundie faith when they are on kid number 8, the Duggar fame has gone away, and they are back in Arkansas realizing how hard it is to raise that many kids on a used car salesmen's salary. I'm not suggesting that they will suddenly become pro-college, but I'm thinking in that case if one of their much younger sibs wanted to go to college -- they may get tacit approval as their older brothers would recognize how hard life really is. I also think that unlike the Amish if someone really wanted to bounce and was in fact shunned, it wouldn't be as big of a deal because they would have some community to turn to. There are people like Derick or cousin Amy who are affiliated with the fundie world but weren't raised in it and don't necessarily "believe" that way is right, as well as people like Anna's sister who left altogether who I think could provide some emotional support and maybe a place to go Christmas so a Duggar or Bates who wanted to leave would not be 100% alone. That in itself may inspire someone to leave at some point.

Anna may not realize he's gay anymore than Priscilla or the rest of the family did upon meeting him. I think Josh may have had some idea that he was "different" from any other guys he knows -- just by how blatantly negative he was, saying something like "I thought he had no life when I met him." But even if Josh does suspect, i wouldn't want to be the son in law going against the ENTIRE family's wish to get a daughter married off asap. The rest of the family is unexposed enough that they probably thing he is a happy religious man and that's what makes him so flamboyant. Frankly the entire family comes from the view of -- OMG a girl is 20-something and not married and her younger sister is married, let's get her hitched to anyone who is interested because God has sent him our way. If it ever comes out that he is gay, Anna and family may be "ok" with it -- he did what he was "supposed" to; he didn't act on any desires and instead married a woman, fathered children, and lived a Godly life; I don't think it matters whether her sister's emotional needs are fulfilled or not as long as there are more kids in the family.

So Joe is some fabulous builder that his wife brags about -- who keeps moving around and now has branched out into a side business of paper shredding? Something doesn't add up. Business people sometimes expand into related businesses -- like title insurance or real estate sales -- but paper shredding??

@floridamom -- I do agree that they are all over courtships right now because it's their first few kids getting married. Once they're on kid number 15, they will be so over the process of looking for a suitor who is a Godly young man with mission experience etc. and frankly it'll be harder for them to set up businesses etc. because how many used car lots, towing companies etc. does their small town need. The younger kids may get to de facto date with the girls being warned that Daddy will only give a hand in marriage to a guy who can provide. As with everything in this family, the younger kids may have it easier because they may actually be able to meet guys who are compatible, college grads -- and be able to hang with them without mom and dad chaperoning every conversation. The older kids in that family have gotten the short end of the stick as the parents are young and zealous enough to enforce their views right now -- which will cause some of the older girls to get stuck with guys like Ben.

Amber's husband is a douche. Apparently went to Seton Hall Law School according to LinkedIn -- no idea if he finished or not though; remember Albie Manzo also went to law school for a semester or two. Given that he's trained as a lawyer and is working with the Attorney General that's prosecuting the Guidices, you'd think he'd learn the difference between federal and state courts. Joe's charges are in federal court -- hence brought by the US Attorney's Office and have NOTHING to do with the State Attorney General. Too bad none of the cast is educated or well read enough to throw that back in his face. He does seem litigation happy -- Bravo better watch out as I see some kind of defamation or misrepresentation suit from this guy eventually. Loved the bravado in the after-show where he said he'd sue someone, put them through hell for 3 years, ruin them financially, and depose them for 8 hrs and make them his bitch. Huge talk from someone who has never practiced -- his experience seems to be in pharma sales, where he got fired and then brought a whistleblower suit, and now at this mortgage company that is advertising on TV. I'm guessing he's been to a deposition or two (watching not taking) and thinks he's an expert. Oddly I do know guys in the mortgage industry who feel that they are lawyers and take his attitude -- just because they have exposure to lawyers in foreclosure matters.