Thea Queen: Speedy

[dtissagirl]

They couldn't have Oliver react in anyway to Thea shooting him because their dun-dun-dun dumbass plan depended on the audience also thinking Oliver was brainwashed. No hints otherwise, or the reveal would be ~ruined.

[Chaser]

Of all the new masks last season, and for all it's issues, Thea's was my favorite. She didn't suit up untill the end of the season and prior to that we saw her train. She had over a year of hardcore, intense, pull-no-punches training. Her trainers were the two best established fighters of the regular cast (I actually think Sara could beat Oliver in a head to head match, but thats a different topic). And I like the fact that she didn't just throw on a mask. She wasn't looking to be a Hero, she was just looking to be strong and not a victim anymore. But even after she got the ability, she found out she was still a pawn in someone else's game. Used again. She was lost, she needed some purpose. Roy gave her that. He found some meaning in his life when he put on that mask and recognized she could find hers too. That is how you pass the mantle.

 

As for how Oliver affected that when he left to join the LOA, I'm not 100% percent on that. Mostly because that's shaky story and difficult to work out. I do think that she did want to help others, but I wish they had explored it more. I think when Oliver 'died' they tried to make it seem that Laurel was stepping into his shoes (along with her sister's). But I think that would have had more of an impacted if they had Thea explore it after Oliver joined the LOA. It would have played into Thea's guilt over losing Oliver and taking him from the city again.

 

Like I said I prefer Thea's story to Laurel and Ray, but they could have put a lot more into it.

[wingster55]

(I actually think Sara could beat Oliver in a head to head match, but thats a different topic)

 

I think Nyssa should be able to take them both.

 

They couldn't have Oliver react in anyway to Thea shooting him because their dun-dun-dun dumbass plan depended on the audience also thinking Oliver was brainwashed. No hints otherwise, or the reveal would be ~ruined.

 

I think that ep alone gave hints about it. A bit of sadness would have been another one.

[dtissagirl]

I think the hints were completely unintentional, and a hilarious result of the whole brainwashing thing being terribly written. Plus the fact that this kind of writing assumes the audience is stupid, which -- it isn't. So you saw hints because you're smarter than the writing. The text intent was for people -- in show and in the audience -- to wonder if Oliver was really ~gone forever~, woe.

 

And I guess I disagree that Oliver would be sad that Thea shot him. Annoyed and proud, yes.

[BkWurm1]

I don't know.  I kinda thought when Thea shot him he DID look a bit hurt in his very subtle, PTSD way. 

[apinknightmare]

And I guess I disagree that Oliver would be sad that Thea shot him. Annoyed and proud, yes.

 

Proud as HELL. I'll be upset if they don't joke about it at some point.

I don't know.  I kinda thought when Thea shot him he DID look a bit hurt in his very subtle, PTSD way. 

 

Ah, see...I just think he looked surprised and annoyed, haha. 

[Starfish35]

I loved that scene, more so when we found out for sure he was faking it. There was a world of pissed-off big brother in that expression - it was like he was dying to yell at her but couldn't because he had to maintain his cover.

[AyChihuahua]

I was totally enraged when Morrigan first came up with the spec of him being brainwashed. (Brilliant spec on Morrigan's part.) They had three options with the brainwashing story: (1) go hard, and make it magic or repeated killing/LPing him (also magic, really) until he was batshit crazy, preferably after showing through Thea that the LP did that, or go with a MUCH longer time jump, probably at LEAST a full year; (2) ruin Oliver's character by showing him brainwashed through some regular non-magical means in three weeks; or (3) have him be faking it. If they'd gone with (2) I would never watch this show again, because despite all my myriad issues with S3 Oliver, he has never, ever, ever been portrayed as weak-willed. A regular person would take longer than three weeks to brainwash, for goodness sake. So for me, thank GOD he was just faking it. I honestly think they would have been smart to go with repeated LPing...they could have a big dramatic moment at the end of 3.20 with him being stabbed in the back by RAG and falling into the LP, plus it'd allow for more shirtlessness, because the LP could remove all his scars and reduce prep time.

Overall I think they underused the LP. It could have been so much more important and dramatic, but basically it's just a hot tub with healing abilities. Boring.

[BkWurm1]

Ah, see...I just think he looked surprised and annoyed, haha.

 

That's certainly there too.  When the arrow first goes through and he turns to see where it came from there mixed in with the WTH, I also see a touch of sad confusion in his eyes which then quickly changes to an angry pout as he stalks off.

 

For clarity, I just rewatched the scene.  Discovered that Ollie Al Guhl is not only evil but also a bit of a precognitive.  He grimaces in pain BEFORE the arrow hits him, lol. 

[apinknightmare]

For clarity, I just rewatched the scene.  Discovered that Ollie Al Guhl is not only evil but also a bit of a precognitive.  He grimaces in pain BEFORE the arrow hits him, lol. 

 

He totally is, haha. I thought for a while that Malcolm clued Thea in to the plan, and she was there to "sell" it, by shooting him in front of his League goons. Wishful thinking on my part!

[BkWurm1]

thought for a while that Malcolm clued Thea in to the plan, and she was there to "sell" it, by shooting him in front of his League goons. Wishful thinking on my part!

 

Ha!  Instead he just dressed her up and sent her to shoot him as she saw fit.  Good thing she didn't take more after daddy or she would have sent an arrow through Oliver's eye and dashed all of Malcolm's dreams. 

[kismet]

Thea by far is my favorite of the new masks from s3. I feel like her journey although robbed of agency for so many seasons, actually seemed to be getting on track towards of the end of s3 & she was taking control of her life choices. I also think her motivations are the most pure of the new batch. She just wants to use her abilities to help people. I think she has a lot of guilt over what MM & MQ did to the Glades and this mask is a way to give back to the communitty & help.

 

IMO - when she shot Oliver, I loved his expression of pissed off, anger & pride with perhaps a little remorse that she was being pulled back in. It definitely was a big bro WTF? moment. I think the brainwashing was not written well. But I thought SA acting was good and helped where the script failed him. Because his reaction could be played as either him breaking throught the brainwashing or him breaking through his self-imposed "faking it" mask.

[wingster55]

For clarity, I just rewatched the scene.  Discovered that Ollie Al Guhl is not only evil but also a bit of a precognitive.  He grimaces in pain BEFORE the arrow hits him, lol.

 

I totally saw that too. Unintentionally hilarious. 

[dtissagirl]

All of the talk about Thea in the Felicity thread reminded me of the .5 seconds they [non-]interacted in the crossover episode, and the forever lost opportunity of Thea going "why is my ex-boyfriend hanging out with my brother's ex-assistant? Are you two on a date? Why is this rando dorky dude on your date with you? Is the date going awful and that's why you look like someone died? I have so many questions right now."

 

Alas.

[statsgirl]

Self-absorption appears to be inherited.  Tommy must have got Rebecca's gene.

 

As Thea said, breaking up with Roy was the biggest mistake of her life. And that's saying something considering she left with MM and disowned her old life.

Edited August 21, 2015 by statsgirl

[dtissagirl]

I can fanwank Thea's self-absorption as a byproduct of her upbringing. Traditional billionaire education = treating the help as the help. Felicity was probably categorized as "Oliver's minion" in Thea's mind, and stayed there until 321.

[statsgirl]

I might chalk it up to adolescence but Moira was the same.

 

Now that you've pointed it out, it does show how little interest Thea had in Oliver's life and what he was doing ... ever.  She took over Verdant while he was away but we never saw her at QC or even talking to him about the family company in s2.  And while she did come back to Starling City when he pulled the family card in Corto Maltese, what did she think Oliver was doing all that year since he'd lost the company?

 

Oliver introduced Felicity as his friend to Thea in 1x21 but did Thea never ask him about his friendships or anything about his personal life?  Who he was hangign out with now that Tommy was dead and Laurel hated him?  What about Felicity showing up for Moira's Get Out Of Jail party?

 

By the time Thea was admitted to the lair in 3B, Oliver and Felicity were more distant but it doesn't explain why she knew nothing of her brother's personal life up to that point.

[AyChihuahua]

Thea's also really young.  I mean, I couldn't stand her in the beginning of S1, so I am in no way excusing all of her behavior because of her youth, and she was certainly old enough to know better when she left with Mass Murderin' Malcolm...seriously, a four-year-old would know better than that.  But I volunteer in animal rescue and work with lots of youth volunteers, and even the 18/19-year-olds are totally self-absorbed and obnoxious, and these are 18/19-year-olds who are nice enough to volunteer at an animal rescue.  Looking back I am sure I was the same way when I was her age.  I think she'll really start growing up in S4, and I'm looking forward to seeing her work with Oliver and the rest of the team. 

Edited August 21, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[wingster55]

I don't know if I would call the crossover scene as self-absorption. She was primarily there to ask if the group was ok as they...well weren't. 

 

Now that you've pointed it out, it does show how little interest Thea had in Oliver's life and what he was doing ... ever.

 

I think she honestly gave up after s1. Plus...Harper Island. 

[statsgirl]

I don't think Thea was on Harper Island the way Felicity was on Palmer Island.  Except for her backstory episode, every non-Team Arrow scene that Felicity had was about pushing either Ray or Laurel to their superhero status.  Thea, on the other hand, had plots that didn't involve Roy:

 

In season 1, Thea had her bratty period, under-age drinking and doing drugs, which led to her trial and her time at CNRI, links to Laurel and then meeting Roy.

 

In season 2, Thea was running Verdant, as well as her plots around Moira's trial, and then being kidnapped by Slade, finding out out about MM being her father, Moira's death and finally leaving with MM.

 

In season 3, she had the evil daddy plot, Chase the DJ, killing Sara which connected her to Laurel and Nyssa, and the learning to fight because Ra's was after her.

 

 

even the 18/19-year-olds are totally self-absorbed and obnoxious, and these are 18/19-year-olds who are nice enough to volunteer at an animal rescue.

Some years ago I was working on a project on depression that involved looking at in-patients' charts for information.  Down on the adolescent ward, there was a psychiatric resident who gave every patient he examined a secondary diagnosis of 'narcissistic personality disorder' and we were all "Have you even met a teenager?"  (The diagnoses unfortunately stayed on their charts because DOCTOR so of course he knew better.)

 

 

I think she honestly gave up after s1.

She gave up caring about her brother's life?  Other than MM, he was her only living relative.  How could she not want to know about what he was doing with his days, who his friends were now, how he was living?  Who was  helping him through Moira's death and then Sara's?  Thea was young but the family had been through a lot. How could the girl who cared so much about her brother in s1 that she pushed him to open up to someone, now no longer care about his health?

 

I'm going to give Thea the benefit of the doubt and say the answer is plot-driven writing which paired down interactions to only what is necessary for the season.  The same writing that doesn't show female friendships or have Thea wondering who Roy is with when he's in Verdant with someone she knows is also linked to Oliver, and what's going on since Roy works for the Arrow.

[wingster55]

Gave up trying to ask. He wasn't going to reveal the truth, so eventually she just shrugged her shoulders and stopped prying. 

[BkWurm1]

Gave up trying to ask. He wasn't going to reveal the truth, so eventually she just shrugged her shoulders and stopped prying. 

That works for season one and two but he went to Corto Maltese to bring her back and said she could ask him anything.  Soooo, just out of the habit? Or maybe they were walking on eggshells around each other trying to keep the new peace and just didn't push at all.

Edited August 22, 2015 by BkWurm1

[BkWurm1]

All of Thea's first season friends vanished after barely having any screentime or lines.

 

I wrote them off as not real friend, but just hangers on trying to lap up the Queen lifestyle and also the crowd that made it too easy for Thea to dabble in drugs.  When she started straightening up her life, she stopped partying all the time so they didn't have any use for her friendship AND I think she probably wised up and realized they weren't looking out for her interests.

 

Either that or Thea's one of those girls that drops all her other friends anytime she gets a boyfriend.  (I like my other ideas better)

[kismet]

I think it was a combination of thea stopping to ask about Oliver's personal life and Oliver stopping to have a personal life in s3 to ask about. By the time they made it back from corto Maltese there was a lot for them to work through between their issues, coping with moira's death, losing the queen life & the whole Malcolm situation that how they spent their free time was probably low on the list.

I don't think thea was ever self absorbed. She had normal spoiled brat syndrome with some temporary selfish tendencies. But even in her most obnoxious moments of s 1&2, she did always look to help others. She wanted to help OQ post island, tommy with laurel, moira post ws kidnapping, helping roy get better lifestyle, moira again post trial until she found out she'd been lied to.

Her decision to go with mm was so she could learn to be stronger. I'm not sure it was the best of ideas, but it wasn't the worst considering how little she knew of mm's ways. Perhaps if mq & oq had explained how untrustworthy he was, she might have been wiser. I can't fault her for wanting to be stronger. Everyone she thought she knew had betrayed her & lied to her, so she was not in the best headspace to be making decisions.

S3 showed a more mature thea so I hope that continues into s4.

[statsgirl]

It would have been a good idea on the part of Moira or anyone dealing with Thea's rehab to separate her from the friends who were doing drugs.  People can go through rehab just fine but going back to the old haunts and the old friends can bring back the same old pull.  As well as spending time with Roy, she got interested in running Verdant and it would be hard to do if she were partying and doing drugs all the time.

 

I think it was a combination of thea stopping to ask about Oliver's personal life and Oliver stopping to have a personal life in s3 to ask about. By the time they made it back from corto Maltese there was a lot for them to work through between their issues, coping with moira's death, losing the queen life & the whole Malcolm situation that how they spent their free time was probably low on the list.

It still doesn't make sense to me.  Thea knew that she was the only living relative Oliver had and that he had not only lost his best friend Tommy but also his longterm girlfriend Laurel, not to mention Moira.  Presumably the legalities of Moira's death and the loss of QC had been handled by the time Thea came back from Corto Maltese. Thea was still claiming she knew nothing about MM's whereabouts and finances were taken care of so what was there to work through for them? The emotional impact of Moira's death which should have involved Thea asking Oliver how he was getting through it and was there anyone helping himt.  And didn't she wonder what Oliver was doing all day long when she was at Verdant since he no longer had QC?

 

And even after Oliver told Thea that he was the Arrow and she saw Roy, Diggle, Felicity and Laurel in the lair, she didn't ask Roy about the Team?  I know she was overwhelmed by the knowledge that she had killed Sara but it seems strange that she apparently never talked to Roy about what Oliver had been doing the past few years and who was helping him.

 

I can fanwank with the best of them but I can't get my head around Thea apparently showing no interest in Oliver's mental health in s3 or what he was doing with his life.

[kismet]

I think she showed interest in his life, but not necessarily his personal life. They probably talked about moira, Malcolm & arrow stuff. I just don't think they talked about his love life. Felicity got mentioned as part of the team, but by the point thea found out about fs was already with rp. OQ probably kept his feelings about fs on verbal lockdown when talking to thea.

I have an older brother and we have talked about many things over the years. Everything under the sun. We talk a lot about our family, his kids & his job. His wife has been part of our family for over 16 years and I can count on my hand the number of conversations we have had about her. The primary reason is that he is very private about his relationships. So over the years I've stopped asking.

So I think both thea and I love our older brothers deeply but when it comes to conversations &question asking some things are just not talked about for a variety of reasons.

[BkWurm1]

I can fanwank with the best of them but I can't get my head around Thea apparently showing no interest in Oliver's mental health in s3 or what he was doing with his life.

 

 

In Corto Maltese we had a scene where Thea gets steaming hot coffee dumped on her and seems not to even feel it. Maybe her way of coping with the trauma this time around was to get emotionally numb as well.  Lack of curiosity is a symptom of depression. 

Edited August 22, 2015 by BkWurm1

[statsgirl]

Thea's non-reaction to the coffee linked back to her training by MM when he poured hot wax on her.  (It also demonstrated how clueless Oliver was about the changes in her.)

 

It makes sense that given all Thea's traumas, doing back to when the Queen's Gambit went down, that she would be depressed, and it makes sense that she would cope with that depression by shutting down emotionally.  I just wish I had seen signs of a depression to support it.

 

Thea was the only relative Oliver had left, and as far as she knew he had lost all the friends he was close to, and he'd lost the family company.  Maybe it's just me but I'm finding it hard to understand why she showed no interest in anything in his life. Forget friends, she didn't even ask what he did with his days?

 

Thea is  20. We hold Oliver to account for his actions when he was 22 and Sara for her's when she was 20.  When do we start holding Thea to account for hers?

Edited August 22, 2015 by statsgirl

[dtissagirl]

Oliver never asked Thea where were she staying when she came back from Corto Maltese. Thea never asked Oliver where the hell was he living. And then they moved in together... what, did they hire separate movers in different dates and asked them to sign NDAs so that each other WOULD NEVER KNOW? I'll never stop pointing and laughing at that.

[Genki]

I alway just assumed since Thea was hiding her relationship/training with Malcolm from Oliver, she didn't ask too many personal questions for fear Oliver may reciprocate.

 

They are both hiding stuff and both to blame IMO.

[AyChihuahua]

Thea is  20. We hold Oliver to account for his actions when he was 22 and Sara for her's when she was 20.  When do we start holding Thea to account for hers?

This is an aside, but I really don't hold them to account, particularly. People in their late teens/early twenties are still incredibly dumb and immature, so as long as their actions are thoughtless/impulsive/self-absorbed, I'm very forgiving. Oliver was a spoiled idiotic party boy who was cheating on his gf, like millions of other young men. Sara was a spoiled somewhat idiotic party girl, like millions of young women (including me at her age). That's why I didn't understand Laurel's rage, because their actual sins are so ordinary, not evil. I'm overall pretty forgiving of Thea, too, except for going with Malcolm. She may not have known everything about him, but she did know that he murdered more than 500 people, including the man she considered her father and Tommy, who she'd known her whole life. Oh, and he kidnapped Walter, who she adored.

[wingster55]

Oh, and he kidnapped Walter, who she adored.

 

Did she know that actually? I'm not sure if that was brought up to her explicitly. 

[Starfish35]

Malcolm kidnapping Walter as leverage over Moira was part of Moira's defense at the trial. It'd have been hard for Thea to miss it.

[AyChihuahua]

Thea was sitting right in the courtroom when Laurel had her big moment about how Malcolm had not actually murdered Walter, like he'd murdered Robert. Thea was well aware that Malcolm murdered Robert, Tommy, and 502 other citizens in the Undertaking, and kidnapped Walter. And she went away with him anyway. That's the only thing she's done that I really and truly do hold against her.

[Starfish35]

Yeah, it's something I have to choose to deliberately overlook, because I really like Thea, but I haven't found a way to spin that yet that makes sense to me. :(

[apinknightmare]

It makes sense to me that she'd go off with Malcolm regardless of what he'd done in the past if he had something to offer that she wanted. He did - which was the promise of not being weak anymore. I think she's matured a lot, and I love her, but Thea had a tendency to be a spoiled brat when she was angry, which she was at the time. I mean, this is the person who wouldn't even sign some papers to make sure her family didn't lose EVERYTHING THEY HAD because she was upset with them. 

[AyChihuahua]

It's not inconsistent; it's unlikable.

[kismet]

In many ways im glad she matured. I dont like that it required going off with mm, but im glad it happened. Her behavior although understandable & age-appropriate was getting a little bit too much when she refused to sign the papers or even listen to Oliver's side. I get that she was hurting & confused. But sign the papers & figure stuff out later. She was only hurting herself & making herself more vulnerable.

Edited August 23, 2015 by kismet

[wingster55]

I think that refusing to sign the papers and going off to MM are the two things she's done that I can't forgive. Everything else I can excuse...and I think she paid for going off with Malcolm heavily. 

[statsgirl]

Adolescents can be very ego-centric but the good ones, when it's pointed out to them that their help is needed or a view they're holding doesn't make sense, will look at the broader picture.  Thea going off with MM because she was angry at Roy (who she must have known was out fighting the bad guys) makes sense in the moment; her continued support of him doesn't.  (On the other hand, Thea must have known that Roy was out risking his life to fight the monsters who were killing people all over the city but because he didn't tell her, she stomped off to MM.  It's very me! me! me! and I don't think that being 20 excuses it.)

 

It makes sense to me that she'd go off with Malcolm regardless of what he'd done in the past if he had something to offer that she wanted. He did - which was the promise of not being weak anymore. I think she's matured a lot, and I love her, but Thea had a tendency to be a spoiled brat when she was angry, which she was at the time. I mean, this is the person who wouldn't even sign some papers to make sure her family didn't lose EVERYTHING THEY HAD because she was upset with them. 

What bugs me most about Thea is that often she ddn't seem to learn or to apologize for how she's messed up up someone else's life until she found out that Malcolm had drugged her to kill Sara.  I hope it was enough of a shock to get her out of her spoiled brat ways (we'll see in s4) since she was still being bratty in 3A.  She lied to Oliver about where she got the money to start up Verdant again, then lied to him again when she said that she had had no contact with Malcolm.

 

But worse I thought was that when Oliver found out she was hanging out with Malcolm, she said "don't make me choose between you and my father".  Malcolm Merlyn had murdered Oliver's father *them man who had raised Thea and who she loved) and his best friend and subjected Oliver and Sara to five years of hellm not to mention all the other people he had killed (including Frank) and those he left homeless.  Oliver had very good reasons to not want Thea hanging out with Malcolm and she treated him as if it were some out-of-line request.

 

I have the feeling that anything Thea does wrong now is going to be blamed on the Lazarus Pit.

Edited August 23, 2015 by statsgirl

[AyChihuahua]

But worse I thought was that when Oliver found out she was hanging out with Malcolm, she said "don't make me choose between you and my father".  Malcolm Merlyn had murdered Oliver's father *them man who had raised Thea and who she loved) and his best friend and subjected Oliver and Sara to five years of hellm not to mention all the other people he had killed (including Frank) and those he left homeless.  Oliver had very good reasons to not want Thea hanging out with Malcolm and she treated him as if it were some out-of-line request.

I just forgave/got past her general brattiness and self-centeredness (plus the drinking/drugging in S1). Basically everything that went on with her and Malcolm I personally find unforgivable. The show may be glossing over what an utterly evil sociopathic piece of crap Malcolm is, but I haven't forgotten, and Thea's convenient memory re his sins is definitely not something I can forget just bc she was young and stupid. As far as I'm concerned every plot point involving Malcolm is stupid and requires other characters to be stupid and/or blind to evil.

[statsgirl]

I agree about every plot concerning Malcolm Merlyn from 2x23 through last season being stupid.  I really like Barrowman too, but not to the point of weakening the show.

 

I didn't like that she walked out on Roy because 'you lied to me!' but I guess that could be put down to Malcolm too.  And yet over the hiatus between s2 and s3, I was excited to see what would happen with Thea being with Malcolm.  If she had opposed Malcolm with Moira's deviousness, I think it would have been much better.  But she took that willpower and instead of turning it toward Malcolm ("You are a psychopath but I want to learn what you can teach me") she turned it towards people who thought she shouldn't be with Malcolm and attacked them instead.   That made her look like a brat even more.

Edited August 23, 2015 by statsgirl

[AyChihuahua]

It would have been such a better storyline if she'd been using Malcolm. Nothing even complicated, just "I hate you and absolutely do not trust you, but I'm using you to train me, and I'll take some of your cash while I'm at it, too." But nope. They had her actually trust him and develop filial feelings for him. BLECH, and so dumb.

Edited August 23, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[BkWurm1]

I just forgave/got past her general brattiness and self-centeredness (plus the drinking/drugging in S1). Basically everything that went on with her and Malcolm I personally find unforgivable. The show may be glossing over what an utterly evil sociopathic piece of crap Malcolm is, but I haven't forgotten, and Thea's convenient memory re his sins is definitely not something I can forget just bc she was young and stupid. As far as I'm concerned every plot point involving Malcolm is stupid and requires other characters to be stupid and/or blind to evil.

I think the real explanation is that they needed Thea to defend Malcolm early on so that Oliver would leave him alone which they needed to set other plot in motion.  Her reactions and behavior don't make sense with the circumstances and as soon as the plot would allow, they let Thea react like she should have always been reacting which was the "I hate you but I'm using you.".   

 

Thea walking away with MM in the first place is questionable but I can explain it away with the trauma of her mother's murder and her not being capable of making rational choices.  I explain away her sudden attachment to him as a kind of odd Stockholm Syndrome or kind of subtle brainwashing that MM would have included in her training.  She was probably very vulnerable to suggestion and manipulation and that's the canon that I cling to in attempting to make Thea's 3A choices regarding Malcolm make sense.  We know at least that MM was not above messing with her mind.  He drugged her for Sara but he also had five months to bend her emotions and convince her that he was the one person she really could trust. 

 

Then finding out the truth about Oliver and how much daddy actually had been hiding from her broke through the conditioning.

[wingster55]

I forget..did we ever see her defend his actions etc? We only saw her wanting him around..which could be just because she needed a teacher.

[statsgirl]

She didn't need a teacher to teach her how to fight, unlike Oliver in s3.  She wanted him to teach her "how to be strong" so she didn't hurt again which applied to Malcolm who killed his own son and 503 other people that Thea knew about, including the man Thea had thought was her father, it means "how to be a psychopath".

 

Stockholm Syndrome is the kindest way to explain why she repeatedly lied to Oliver about associating with MM, because wouldn't she have felt closer to the guy who was her beloved older brother for 20 years than someone she only knew was her bio dad for 7 months?

[Carrie Ann]

Yeah, I don't think we ever saw Thea defending MM's actions, but she had apparently developed some sort of emotional connection to him, based on the moment where she asked Oliver not to make her choose between her brother and her father. (Honestly, the very lowest point for me with TQ.) She only really seemed to turn off her emotions for him when she learned that he used her to kill Sara, and even then, the show wanted us to believe she would have lost her soul if she'd allowed Malcolm to be killed (implying that she was still harboring some sort of feeling for/about him deep inside).

[dtissagirl]

Didn't Thea defend Malcolm to Roy, who then went back to Team Arrow-less and defended him also? She said something like "he thought he was helping the Glades", which actually me think Thea was still being mind-raped by Merlyn.

[Chaser]

....And then that conversation made Roy defend Malcolm right?

[Carrie Ann]

Oh Lord, I have blocked so many things about this season. I'm honestly just going to try my hardest to give every character a clean slate for S4--or at least one that is clean of their worst moments in S3.