The Soviet Union is No More: Casting News, Story Arc Info

[hellmouse]

41 minutes ago, sistermagpie said:

I don't know if he would. Under the right circumstances maybe, but he's been doing this for 25 years and hasn't defected yet. Wouldn't it just give him more stress?

I agree - I find it hard to imagine William taking active steps to defect. We saw how he was unable to make the decision to NOT bring up the most recent bioweapon on his own. He wanted Philip's help. He said in the past that he wanted to fight Moscow when they made his wife leave, but he didn't. I think we're meant to see him as someone who will not take a bold step on his own.

However, what would happen if he were forced into a situation that required boldness? Maybe Don works out a trap with the FBI and William is caught in the lab. I could see him turning on Gabriel but would he turn on Philip and Elizabeth? He seems kind of fond of Philip. 

Edited May 20, 2016 by hellmouse
William caught in the lab, not Philip!

[Umbelina]

Or he could have been testing Philip to see if he might support the whole "screw the KGB" thing. 

He seems like a man on the edge to me, and I doubt he's on the show simply to be Philip's buddy and a bioweapon.

[sistermagpie]

18 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

He seems like a man on the edge to me, and I doubt he's on the show simply to be Philip's buddy and a bioweapon.

But being on the edge could take many forms. Defection is definitely one, but I think the reason I tend to think differently is I imagine someone who wants to defect would have a dream of a life for himself. I don't think William has that. So I almost imagine him, if he finally decides to act, doing something more suicidal or dramatic so he doesn't have to start over. (This dramatic thing could, of course, include selling out his people I guess, but it doesn't seem like he trusts the Americans much either.)

[Umbelina]

That's the thing though.  One thing the USA does very, very well is hiding people.  William wouldn't be asking for a fortune, IMO, he'd just want a safe place to have a different life, away from spies and toxic weapons.  He's unhappy, and really, what's his "best chance" here?  If he gets this weapon, Gabe told him he could "go home a hero." 

I don't think William gives a shit about either "going home" or "being a hero."  He certainly doesn't want to be where he is either, so defecting for him?  I think it becomes a very real option.

[hellmouse]

Also, when Philip told William he could "go home a hero", William scoffed and said "in a coffin". So it seems like the only picture he has of "going home" would be if he were dead. That's the future he's imagining, at least in terms of Russia.

[madam magpie]

Maybe Philip and Elizabeth bolt and can't go back to Russia?

[SunnyBeBe]

I'm concerned over the preview and the title of the upcoming episode. (Dinner for Seven) If they are right, it's a dinner with the Jennings family, Stan, Pastor Tim and Alice...is this correct?  I just can't get into that. I mean, that's a dinner that would be avoided at all cost, even if someone had to accidentally lose a finger in a kitchen mishap, but that dinner would NOT take place.  Granted FX has a way of manipulating the previews often in a way that does not reflect the true events of the episode, but if they do go that route, I'll be insulted.  Too contrived for my taste. 

 

It appeared that Elizabeth was in bed with Don again.  Is that right?  So, did she sleep with him for real AFTER that drugged and staged scene in her fake apt.?

[Umbelina]

I think it's likely that they invited the Pastors to dinner to diffuse everything and because Pastor Tim wanted to "see where we are at" and Stan, as he's done many times, just stopped by.  It's easy to envision Henry saying something like "Hey, have dinner with us!" or even for Elizabeth to feel it would look weird not to invite him, since she pretty much always does.

[sistermagpie]

9 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

I think it's likely that they invited the Pastors to dinner to diffuse everything and because Pastor Tim wanted to "see where we are at" and Stan, as he's done many times, just stopped by.  It's easy to envision Henry saying something like "Hey, have dinner with us!" or even for Elizabeth to feel it would look weird not to invite him, since she pretty much always does.

Yeah, that's what I assumed. They're definitely at dinner together since Tim asks Stan what Stan does and Henry answers. There would be little reason for them to intentionally have them all together.

I don't think Elizabeth sleeps with Don again. Pretty sure that's just a clip from the earlier ep where Don got out of bed after she tricked him.

[SunnyBeBe]

Oh, so it's one of those things that just happens.....well..that's about the time that there would be a fire in the kitchen, a HUGE emergency at work, sudden kidney stone, or major blood loss that required a cancellation of dinner plans. lol

[hellmouse]

This dinner for seven is certainly an opportunity for Stan to notice weird behavior and reactivate his spidey sense. I can only imagine how awkward Paige would be. And how awkward Pastor Tim and Alice might be! I don't think anything dramatic will be revealed at the dinner, but it is setting the table (lol) for future revelations and actions that will have to be taken. 

Maybe Pastor Tim will invite Stan to join their church. That would probably prompt Philip or Elizabeth to suggest that they all go together. Poor Henry would then end up having to attend church weekly, simply because he spoke up at dinner. 

[hellmouse]

10 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Oh, so it's one of those things that just happens.....well..that's about the time that there would be a fire in the kitchen, a HUGE emergency at work, sudden kidney stone, or major blood loss that required a cancellation of dinner plans. lol

I can picture Elizabeth going into the kitchen and setting something on fire, lol. A big fire, too.

[sistermagpie]

53 minutes ago, hellmouse said:

Maybe Pastor Tim will invite Stan to join their church. That would probably prompt Philip or Elizabeth to suggest that they all go together. Poor Henry would then end up having to attend church weekly, simply because he spoke up at dinner. 

I think that would more likely prompt Stan to politely turn down the offer. Just as any awkwardness at the dinner could easily be explained by Philip and Elizabeth not liking to have dinner with the Tims. The baptism dinner was hella awesome and nobody knew they were spies then.

[Umbelina]

I think that Stan might pick up on something the Pastors do or say though, it might bother him in some way, seem "off."  Frankly, that could be one of the things that eventually leads to taking a closer look at The Jennings.

[crashdown]

I keep thinking about one of the showrunner interviews that I read, in which they said that if the series were looked at in the traditional three-act structure, the end of this current season would be the end of Act 2.  Logically, I think the end of Act 2 has to be that Stan finds out about the Jennings, or at least that he starts to have a suspicion that will be explored next season.  But we have only three more episodes to get there, so I'll be very interested if that actually happens.

[SunnyBeBe]

Depending on what transpires, wouldn't it be a real stretch for Stan to figure out why a pastor and his wife would be socializing and friends with people they know to be KGB spies.I mean, it is rather bizarre.  Unless, he would suspect that they are ALL somehow involved. 

[Umbelina]

I just think the most likely to do or say something in a way that makes Stan's spidery senses ping would come from the Pastors.  I really think his body/mind/soul will be on high alert everywhere because of Gaad's death.  It may be a small thing that nudges him, but I have a pretty strong feeling it will happen.  Not an "aha" moment at all, but a "huh, that was weird" feeling.

[sistermagpie]

35 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

 

I just think the most likely to do or say something in a way that makes Stan's spidery senses ping would come from the Pastors.  I really think his body/mind/soul will be on high alert everywhere because of Gaad's death.  It may be a small thing that nudges him, but I have a pretty strong feeling it will happen.  Not an "aha" moment at all, but a "huh, that was weird" feeling.

 

Surely something has to come of it. Or else why stick them all at a table together? It seems Paige hasn't mentioned to Pastor Tim that her dad's bff and their neighbor is FBI counterintelligence. Since Tim wants to sit down and "see where they all are" it seems hard to believe he won't have something to say about that. Plus it looks like at the same dinner party, maybe, Stan's talking about Gaad being killed. 

Interesting that Stan did, in Philip's view, confirm his feelings about Martha back when he just said everything was crazy at work, then Matthew re-confirmed it to Paige in the last ep, and now Stan's telling Philip about Gaad, an operation about which Philip himself wouldn't have known about otherwise. Stan's getting chatty alright. 

[madam magpie]

Ohhhhhh I don't want Philip and Elizabeth to get caught! I hope the Groovyhairs are dealt with swiftly, and if we're truth-telling, I really want Elizabeth to be the one to do it. He's such a thorn in her side, what with stealing her kid for Jesus and all. 

[sistermagpie]

10 minutes ago, madam magpie said:

Ohhhhhh I don't want Philip and Elizabeth to get caught! I hope the Groovyhairs are dealt with swiftly, and if we're truth-telling, I really want Elizabeth to be the one to do it. He's such a thorn in her side, what with stealing her kid for Jesus and all. 

Another reason I'd kind of like her to do it is that I just have always gotten the vibe that Pastor Tim focuses on Philip as the important one because he's the man of the house. Yes, you could also say that since Philip was the one to confront him and Elizabeth the one to go to church group for so long he just got the wrong impression. (He even asks Paige at one point if her dad gives her a hard time and Paige says usually it's her mom.) But the way he seems with his own wife etc. I just really feel like this guy assumes Elizabeth must be under Philip's power and that Philip is the one with whom he should compete. 

It was one of the things I found a little disturbing about Paige going to the Tims as a surrogate family, that where the Jennings are equals with Elizabeth being the more controlling parent, Mrs. Tim seemed like an extension of her husband. She's never done anything to change that impression for me.

[madam magpie]

39 minutes ago, sistermagpie said:

Another reason I'd kind of like her to do it is that I just have always gotten the vibe that Pastor Tim focuses on Philip as the important one because he's the man of the house. Yes, you could also say that since Philip was the one to confront him and Elizabeth the one to go to church group for so long he just got the wrong impression. (He even asks Paige at one point if her dad gives her a hard time and Paige says usually it's her mom.) But the way he seems with his own wife etc. I just really feel like this guy assumes Elizabeth must be under Philip's power and that Philip is the one with whom he should compete. 

It was one of the things I found a little disturbing about Paige going to the Tims as a surrogate family, that where the Jennings are equals with Elizabeth being the more controlling parent, Mrs. Tim seemed like an extension of her husband. She's never done anything to change that impression for me.

Great point.

Kick his head through a wall, Elizabeth!

[hellmouse]

The NYT article about The Americans' renewal includes a photo that seems spoilery. It looks like Philip, Gabriel and another woman all in disguise with badges with the letter V on them - perhaps visitor badges?. Maybe the woman is the librarian Gabriel mentioned, and he's playing the old man and they are in William's lab?

http://nyti.ms/1WTQAWi

 

From left, Marceline Hugot, Frank Langella and Matthew Rhys in “The Americans.” CreditEric Liebowitz/FX

Edited May 25, 2016 by hellmouse
added caption

[sistermagpie]

Wow. I love that photo.

[SunnyBeBe]

I wonder if that preview where Paige is asking if they trust her or not, she's referring to her driving ability and not secret keeping ability. 

[SunnyBeBe]

I hope I'm posting this in the right place.  I considered the one on in the media, but wasn't sure.

Anyway, does anyone recognize the last photo on this link?  It looks to be on set of The Americans.  I can't tell if they have shown it or not. It says it was filmed in Brooklyn, but probably meant to be DC.  I know that is Elizabeth, but who is that with her? Philip?

(The first photos are of Keri and Matthew around town.) 

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-3491319/Pregnant-Keri-Russell-shows-growing-baby-bump-striped-steps-boyfriend-Matthew-Rhys-daughter-Willa.html

[CarpeDiem54]

That's Phillip.  They're both in disguise.

[SunnyBeBe]

Do you know if that scene has aired yet?  I didn't recognize it. 

[CarpeDiem54]

I don't know.  Doesn't look familiar, though.

[sistermagpie]

Philip's wearing the "three Gary Oldman characters at once" disguise he uses with William now and I think Elizabeth has worn that outfit once because I seem to remember people talking about the beret. (I think it was maybe one where they weren't actually interacting with each other?) But it might be from a later scene because I don't remember when Elizabeth wore that.

[hellmouse]

Those disguises were from when Philip meets with William after their "vacation", when William tells him about whatever virus they are trying to get now (lassa?). Elizabeth and Hans are doing surveillance. I like that disguise on Elizabeth - maybe she will wear it again sometime.

[BingeyKohan]

An article on the show's production design on The Awl hints that a location in the finale (communal apartment in Russia) could mean the return of Martha. Just spec (not confirmed) but... Plausible!

https://theawl.com/useful-things-6749f978b037#.ns2rr2mor

[SunnyBeBe]

9 minutes ago, BingeyKohan said:

An article on the show's production design on The Awl hints that a location in the finale (communal apartment in Russia) could mean the return of Martha. Just spec (not confirmed) but... Plausible!

https://theawl.com/useful-things-6749f978b037#.ns2rr2mor

Oh goodie!  That makes me feel better.  Now, I have some hope that we shall see Martha again.  I hope it's not too depressing though. Things might not be going so well. 

[Umbelina]

It may not be Martha though.  Oleg has family in Russia, as do, I'm sure, many other characters on screen.  That would be lovely though.

[hellmouse]

Very interesting! But I don't think it's Martha, for no particular reason. I guess I don't think they'd put her in a communal apartment.

I think it could be either another flashback (Nadezhda and Mom, maybe?), or maybe related to the episode title (Persona Non Grata) - maybe someone is sent back to Russia and we see them in their communal apartment? I could see William sitting miserably in a place full of people and things triggering his allergies. 

I love the production design on this show. They do a good job.

[sistermagpie]

According to research, would Martha even live in a communal apartment? I would never say never, but I thought there were some things saying that a defector wouldn't be. But yeah, Elizabeth's flashbacks certainly would take place in one, and we've never seen that aspect of it though Elizabeth talked about it.

[Umbelina]

I never ever thought she's be treated as a "hero" and a communal apartment seemed the most likely to me.  I mentioned it here several times.

[hellmouse]

MAYBE IT'S MISCHA JR!!

[sistermagpie]

59 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

I never ever thought she's be treated as a "hero" and a communal apartment seemed the most likely to me.  I mentioned it here several times.

I thought I remembered somebody saying something about that, just that American defectors were usually set up in their own apartment. Whether it's true or not wouldn't necessarily mean the show would do it that way, of course. 

[Umbelina]

Defectors that  are useful for propaganda?  Of course!

She's not that kind of defector.  She's a stooge that was caught in a honey trap, of no value whatsoever, other than FBI information they may get from her.

Actually a communal apartment might be the best thing for her, at least she would be immersed in the language, and probably learn faster, rather than sitting alone in her room too afraid to go out, or not knowing how to buy what limited commodities are available. 

[SunnyBeBe]

I don't know much about their communal apartments.  I would suppose it's not an easy place to have loud sex, according to what Tatiana told Oleg.  So, maybe, it wouldn't suit Martha very well. lol ..........................................................................................................

I did a little research on the communal apt living and I think I agree with those upthread who think it might be good fit for Martha. You aren't alone, you share your troubles and joys with the other residents. It's like family, when you have no family.  Maybe, it's not such a bad existence after all.  I mean, compared to what could have happened to her. 

Edited May 27, 2016 by SunnyBeBe

[Umbelina]

Well, she'd meet people and maybe marry one with their own apartment!  Communal apartments were common, so was sharing apartments with other families.  Communal generally meant your own room, but shared kitchen and bathroom.

[SunnyBeBe]

Well, now I'm disappointed. I was hoping the Moscow apt. would be Martha's, but now, I'm wondering if it was Oleg's mom from last night.  I was rather surprised. I thought his parents lived in a different type of place.  Anyone think that there may be another apt from Russia showing Martha?  The writers have to know that the viewers want to see that.  

Edited June 2, 2016 by SunnyBeBe

[curbcrusher]

On 5/20/2016 at 1:10 PM, hellmouse said:

I am curious about the title of the final episode - persona non grata. The internet tells me "In diplomacy, the term persona non grata (Latin, plural: personae non gratae), literally meaning "Person of no Status" refers to a foreign person whose entering or remaining in a particular country is prohibited by that country's government."

Since you can't prosecute those with diplomatic immunity, the host country will declare the person Peronsae no gratae, which means they have to leave as they no longer have any standing in the country. The term PNG is generally used, and was by Stan's boss in the 6/1 episode when we was talking about tracing the mail robot tape back to someone from the Soviet Embassy. He said something along the lines that all that will happen is that they will get PNGed. Basically meaning that they get kicked out of the country.

[sistermagpie]

Okay, there's a character called Mischa in the season finale according to IMDB, played by a young guy but not a child. Young Philip? Philip's son who may or may not exist? Just another Russian with the same name? The guy's got dark hair so could be all three. And he speaks Russian, obviously. Of course I hope for the first answer.

Edited June 8, 2016 by sistermagpie

[hellmouse]

1 hour ago, sistermagpie said:

Okay, there's a character called Mischa in the season finale according to IMDB, played by a young guy but not a child. Young Philip? Philip's son who may or may not exist? Just another Russian with the same name? The guy's got dark hair so could be all three. And he speaks Russian, obviously. Of course I hope for the first answer.

MISCHA JR! Living in a communal apartment!

I hope it's young Philip too. We need more of his history. The season started with a Philip memory - maybe it will end with one too! 

[SunnyBeBe]

There's a link on the media thread for an interview with the actress who plays Paige about the finale.  It's really good.  In it she says the finale contains some surprise twists, but also puts a button on some things.  Hmmm....what gets a button on it?  Pastor Tim?  Martha?  What needs a button on it the most?

[Bama]

Quote

What needs a button on it the most?

Paige's mouth? :)

[SunnyBeBe]

I still wonder what she was talking about.  Not many things buttoned up, IMO.  

[Umbelina]

Arkady, Oleg, and William are all gone.  3 buttons.

[scrb]

Interesting start to season 5.  They show the food shortages, which became more gradually severe just before the fall of the Soviet Union.

Then the defector talks about lack of food back home, which seems to really irk Elizabeth.

Oleg's new post is to investigate the corruption that his new boss blames for the food shortages.  He warns Oleg that they may go after people of privilege, who might include friends of Oleg's family.

Then after work, Oleg goes to his parents' apartment, which seems nice.  Oleg says he's hungry and can't wait to eat, so his family may not be dealing with the food shortages yet.

Will they carry this plot through the end of the series or will it just be a side plot to show the ultimate fate of Oleg's character?

Of course the food shortages were a sign of the economic troubles the USSR had, overspending on the arms race to try to keep up with the US.