The Soviet Union is No More: Casting News, Story Arc Info

[sistermagpie]

4 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Which recent episode was it that Stan was standing in his bedroom looking down at the Jennings residence while Renee comes in and hops into the bed?  

I think it was The Summit. He saw Elizabeth come home--then she would have left again.

[SunnyBeBe]

14 minutes ago, sistermagpie said:

I think it was The Summit. He saw Elizabeth come home--then she would have left again.

Right.  I started watching it, but, gave up too early.  

Here's something interesting.  But, so open to interpretation.

Quote

Salke: They really want the ending here to be satisfying and also a little provocative in that it’ll make you think a little bit. About the right things. i think that like everything they’ve done here there’s that special care and handling, but it’s a little bit more this year.

http://variety.com/2018/tv/news/the-americans-keri-russell-matthew-rhys-final-season-fx-1202734453/

[Dev F]

On 5/27/2018 at 9:58 AM, TimWil said:

Colonel Oliver North-40. We are seeking someone with a strong resemblance. Fit but trim military build. Commanding, confident, savvy and charismatic. 1 scene in this episode, strong possibility of guest arc down the line.

 

Note-North shared a credit as story writer for one particular episode(“Martial Eagle”) due to his knowledge about the American government’s covert support of  the Contras in Nicaragua. I guess they couldn’t find an actor to play him, though, so they abandoned the idea of putting him onscreen. Or maybe North didn’t care for the idea?

Wow, that's fascinating. It's hard to imagine what kind of role North would've played in the season, though. I don't think he was some early version of Larrick, since the whole point of that character is that he was one of Emmett and Leanne's agents, and there's no way they had a storyline that accused a real, living person of being a KGB spy. Maybe originally Colonel North was the officer who tells Larrick about P&E's assault on the Contra training base in "Martial Eagle"? There would have to have been more to the scene initially if that's the case, since the current version is way too brief for a North cameo to have been worthwhile.

In any event, the "guest arc" possibility suggests that initially the writers planned to do more stuff about the official response to the training base attack, instead of just having Larrick go rogue and investigate the matter himself -- since, again, it's unlikely that they would characterize a real-life figure as having been involved in a unauthorized, murderous plan of revenge.

[SunnyBeBe]

15 hours ago, jjj said:

Funny, I just watched it again and came here to post that he is wearing the same shirt/tie in all his scenes in the preview.  I can't tell where he is in this image, right after he lowers the binoculars.  But when he says "All this time" and looks amazed, I think he might be in the garage'o'wigs.  

I've looked at the bedroom scene of Stan staring over at the Jennings residence and the wall background color is compatible, but, the angle of the way he is standing in the clip and the angle he would be standing in his bedroom don't mesh, imo.  Plus, why would he be dressed that way in his own bedroom?  I'm just stumped. 

[jjj]

Previous episode, "The Summit," when she comes home late after not killing the diplomat.

1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Which recent episode was it that Stan was standing in his bedroom looking down at the Jennings residence while Renee comes in and hops into the bed?  

55 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I've looked at the bedroom scene of Stan staring over at the Jennings residence and the wall background color is compatible, but, the angle of the way he is standing in the clip and the angle he would be standing in his bedroom don't mesh, imo.  Plus, why would he be dressed that way in his own bedroom?  I'm just stumped. 

Just because of the way he is dressed (overcoat on top of jacket), I assumed this is outdoors (binoculars scene). 

[TimWil]

1 hour ago, Dev F said:

Wow, that's fascinating. It's hard to imagine what kind of role North would've played in the season, though. I don't think he was some early version of Larrick, since the whole point of that character is that he was one of Emmett and Leanne's agents, and there's no way they had a storyline that accused a real, living person of being a KGB spy. Maybe originally Colonel North was the officer who tells Larrick about P&E's assault on the Contra training base in "Martial Eagle"? There would have to have been more to the scene initially if that's the case, since the current version is way too brief for a North cameo to have been worthwhile.

In any event, the "guest arc" possibility suggests that initially the writers planned to do more stuff about the official response to the training base attack, instead of just having Larrick go rogue and investigate the matter himself -- since, again, it's unlikely that they would characterize a real-life figure as having been involved in a unauthorized, murderous plan of revenge.

Very good points. I certainly agree with you re: Larrick-he couldn’t have been a “replacement” for North. Larrick was gay, for starters! I think had they brought on Oliver North he would have served an entirely different function onscreen.

Edited May 28, 2018 by TimWil

[SunnyBeBe]

It would make sense that the use of binoculars would be outdoors.  I mean, what would he have to look at from inside his room except the Jennings house.  And, I'll go out on a limb and say that it's not likely that anyone is home.  Not based on the way E was hauling ass to get packed last week.  So, it would just be an empty house. 

[jjj]

Absolutely, they will never go back to their house.  

11 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

It would make sense that the use of binoculars would be outdoors.  I mean, what would he have to look at from inside his room except the Jennings house.  And, I'll go out on a limb and say that it's not likely that anyone is home.  Not based on the way E was hauling ass to get packed last week.  So, it would just be an empty house. 

[Erin9]

Seeing Elizabeth turn the light off in the end was incredibly symbolic. They’re done. It’s all over. For good. 

[SunnyBeBe]

I noticed that in the two dinner scenes where we see Paige,  both times, she's wearing a grey striped top.  Sort of prisoner-like to me. lol(I realize that it's the old school prisoner garb and not the more current orange.)  The other dinner was in Episode 1 this season and it's gray with stripes as well.  I suppose it could be prison wear, but, it resembles POW wear too. 

[Umbelina]

5 hours ago, Dev F said:

Wow, that's fascinating. It's hard to imagine what kind of role North would've played in the season, though. I don't think he was some early version of Larrick, since the whole point of that character is that he was one of Emmett and Leanne's agents, and there's no way they had a storyline that accused a real, living person of being a KGB spy. Maybe originally Colonel North was the officer who tells Larrick about P&E's assault on the Contra training base in "Martial Eagle"? There would have to have been more to the scene initially if that's the case, since the current version is way too brief for a North cameo to have been worthwhile.

In any event, the "guest arc" possibility suggests that initially the writers planned to do more stuff about the official response to the training base attack, instead of just having Larrick go rogue and investigate the matter himself -- since, again, it's unlikely that they would characterize a real-life figure as having been involved in a unauthorized, murderous plan of revenge.

 

4 hours ago, TimWil said:

Very good points. I certainly agree with you re: Larrick-he couldn’t have been a “replacement” for North. Larrick was gay, for starters! I think had they brought on Oliver North he would have served an entirely different function onscreen.

 

I really think that was Larrick. 

Once they decided to make him gay and being blackmailed by the KGB for that?  North exited the project?

Honestly there is no one else it could be.  The Central America connection alone points to North.  When they are breaking storylines, things come up and change everything slightly.  (Anyone who has watched the extra features on Breaking Bad DVDs has seen this in action.  I love all those extras!)  One writer at the table says "what if?" or "he needs a stronger blackmail to do this" or "I don't think he'd do this just for money" and voila!  Suddenly the character being blackmailed and gay makes the most sense.  At that point Oliver North bails.

My guess is that the Larrick character WAS modeled on an "Oliver North type" but morphed in the writing room to become the Larrick we eventually see on the show.  They were never actually going to have a cookie-cutter version of Ollie North.

Edited May 28, 2018 by Umbelina

[TimWil]

8 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

 

I really think that was Larrick. 

Once they decided to make him gay and being blackmailed by the KGB for that?  North exited the project?

Honestly there is no one else it could be.  The Central America connection alone points to North.  When they are breaking storylines, things come up and change everything slightly.  (Anyone who has watched the extra features on Breaking Bad DVDs has seen this in action.  I love all those extras!)  One writer at the table says "what if?" or "he needs a stronger blackmail to do this" or "I don't think he'd do this just for money" and voila!  Suddenly the character being blackmailed and gay makes the most sense.  At that point Oliver North bails.

My guess is that the Larrick character WAS modeled on an "Oliver North type" but morphed in the writing room to become the Larrick we eventually see on the show.  They were never actually going to have a cookie-cutter version of Ollie North.

 

I disagree, I think the Larrick character was always planned on a separate track and was always meant to figure heavily in a major story arc that season. I doubt that Oliver North would have figured all that much in the overall story, it would simply have been a nod to verisimilitude (I do so love that word) on the part of Weisberg and Fields.

Edited May 28, 2018 by TimWil

[Umbelina]

55 minutes ago, TimWil said:

I disagree, I think the Larrick character was always planned on a separate track and was always meant to figure heavily in a major story arc that season. I doubt that Oliver North would have figured all that much in the overall story, it would simply have been a nod to verisimilitude (I do so love that word) on the part of Weisberg and Fields.

 

That's OK.  I just disagree.

https://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/04/23/the-americans-recap-the-oliver-north-story/

‘The Americans’ Recap: the Oliver North Story

The much further right view: 

http://humanevents.com/2014/04/18/oliver-north-and-the-americans/

Anyway, he was hired specifically for advice about someone VERY MUCH LIKE HIM and Iran/Contra.

North helped them write a character very much like him, aside from the "gay" working for the Russian's part.  There was no other character on screen like that.

Edited May 28, 2018 by Umbelina

[Dev F]

1 hour ago, Umbelina said:

Honestly there is no one else it could be.  The Central America connection alone points to North.  When they are breaking storylines, things come up and change everything slightly.

 

But the very essence of Larrick's character is that he's a dangerous KGB asset who turns on his former handlers. That's how the story gets from Emmett and Leanne being murdered to all the Central American stuff -- because Larrick is the only one of their agents who could've been involved. I can't think of how a single part of the existing storyline works with Oliver North in that role instead. Why would Claudia think that the top suspect in E&L's murder was a deputy on the National Security Council who was not connected to the Centre's work in any libelous fashion? (I'm also giggling at the idea of a scene that asks us to fear this very, very dangerous ex-marine -- then reveals that it's talking about Ollie North.)

What's more, surely the main antagonist of the season wouldn't have been cast for one episode with a potential "guest arc down the line." They would've made it clear that it was a major recurring role, wouldn't they?

Edited May 28, 2018 by Dev F

[Umbelina]

Maybe they only needed North for one episode, they got the whole gist of the character and tactics then.  Maybe they didn't like working with North, so they didn't pull him in as consultant on other episodes.  Too many options to guess at really.

Larrick was a VERY RELUCTANT spy, he only did it because they were blackmailing him.  His ideology and gung ho American patriotism was always present, right up until the very end.

[SunnyBeBe]

I'm still wondering about the binoculars scene where Stan lowers them after getting a big old look at something. Now, I'm wondering if he outside (there appears to be light reflecting on his face) and if he could be looking at the Russian Embassy.  Is there any way that if P and E don't go to NH, that they would go to the Russian Embassy for protection? Would they be let in, if they produce a Russian birth certificate or Russian passport?  Whether it's in DC or in Canada?  They may be in danger there too, but, would they know that? 

Edited May 29, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[TimWil]

Casting breakdowns #5:

 

For Season 6:

 

Glenn Haskard-late 40s-50s. Smart, unassumingly handsome, compassionate. A mid-level State Department employee, Glenn is struggling to care for his ill wife while simultaneously managing an important project at work. (MAJOR SEASON-LONG RECUR)

 

Erica Haskard-late 40s-50s. Warm, kind, frail. Erica is in the end stages of cancer and is struggling to help her husband Glenn come to terms with her approaching death. (MAJOR SEASON-LONG RECUR)

 

Note: Well, I wouldn’t have ever described Erica (as played by the brilliant Miriam Shor) as having been particularly warm or kind. I think most would agree they made the right choice making her somewhat cold and brittle, instead.

 

Fyodor Nestorenko-30’s. MUST SPEAK FLUENT (NATIVE) RUSSIAN. A young and ambitious KGB officer, he has recently been promoted and tasked with an important placement in the US. Once there he embraces and adapts quickly to the US culture. (MAJOR SEASON-LONG RECUR-SCENES IN RUSSIAN AND ENGLISH)

 

General Kovtun-50s. MUST SPEAK FLUENT (NATIVE) RUSSIAN. A highly ranking Russian official, he’s concerned that the progressive changes taking place in his country will destroy everything he’s spent his life building.

 

Janine-late 30s. African-American. The friendly, warm and easygoing wife of an FBI agent.

 

Bogdan-late 30s, early 40s. MUST SPEAK FLUENT (NATIVE) RUSSIAN. A kind, intelligent man working for a major Russian news agency. He is a good friend who gives sound and sympathetic advice.

 

Ilia-7-9 years old. Soulful, sweet. A young Russian emigrant living in the US. Non-speaking in first episode, may return with scenes in English/Russian.

 

Note: Accccch. Poor little Ilia. He never did get to speak, did he? Unless...maybe...he will in the finale?

 

Motorcyclist-20s-40s. Male. MUST SPEAK FLUENT (NATIVE) RUSSIAN. Badly injured and in need of medical attention after his motorcycle crashes on a quiet road. ONE LINE. IN RUSSIAN.

 

Note: This particular casting breakdown was for Episode #603 (Season 6, Episode 3) which was shot in mid November but the character didn’t actually appear until this past

Wednesday’s #609, which was shot in late February. Hmmm. I wonder if that flashback of Elizabeth back in the USSR was meant to be used earlier as a counterpoint to some other situation much earlier in the season?

 

OK, that’s a wrap, folks. I hope you found these interesting.

[SunnyBeBe]

Was the motorcycle driver the one that E left behind in the street? REF. characters above.  

I do think it's amazing that even stunt men have their description in that casting outline, but, nothing about Renee.  Odd.  

Edited May 29, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[Plums]

40 minutes ago, TimWil said:

Note: This particular casting breakdown was for Episode #603 (Season 6, Episode 3) which was shot in mid November but the character didn’t actually appear until this past

Wednesday’s #609, which was shot in late February. Hmmm. I wonder if that flashback of Elizabeth back in the USSR was meant to be used earlier as a counterpoint to some other situation much earlier in the season?

I think I actually heard that this was indeed the case. It might have been the Slate podcast where Joe and Joel confirmed, but this is super familiar to me, them mentioning that they intended for those flashbacks to happen earlier in the season. 

 

41 minutes ago, TimWil said:

Fyodor Nestorenko-30’s. MUST SPEAK FLUENT (NATIVE) RUSSIAN. A young and ambitious KGB officer, he has recently been promoted and tasked with an important placement in the US. Once there he embraces and adapts quickly to the US culture. (MAJOR SEASON-LONG RECUR-SCENES IN RUSSIAN AND ENGLISH)

This is interesting to me because as far as I can recall, we haven't actually heard Nesterenko have any scenes in Russian, have we? Whenever Elizabeth was spying on him, he was in meetings with Americans speaking English, and we haven't seen him outside of that context in any major way. So I wonder if that will be part of the series finale. He's not going to be indifferent to the fact that a pair of illegals the FBI is trying to capture just prevented his assassination and a coup of his boss. 

[TimWil]

Good points, Plums.

I meant to add in a note that I have a feeling that Nestorenko got a lot less screentime and dialogue than was originally planned.

[Ellaria]

Something else interesting from the notoriously unreliable IMDB...

There is a no-name character listed as an "Airline Guest." All of other characters listed are either known (Arkady, Renee, Father Andrei, Nesterenko) or FBI agents. From the preview, there is nothing to indicate that anyone is headed to an airport. And if there is a scene in an airport, it would likely require additional people (passengers, security, etc).

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt5780830/fullcredits?ref_=tt_cl_sm#cast

[Bannon]

On 5/26/2018 at 9:43 AM, Plums said:

so, Mo Ryan, with her early access as a reviewer, gave an extremely vague hint on twitter about the finale, saying that there's at least one if not two scenes with music that are going to be major tearjerkers. Someone replied that they looked up songs from 1987 and that they think they know what song she's referring to, and she said they might have. And that it's not Peter Gabriel. I just looked up 1987 songs and THERE ARE SO MANY POSSIBILITIES. I wish she hadn't said anything, tbh, because this is infuriating. 

I still want Phil to go completely over the top with a disguise, as Aerosmith's 1987 hit "Dude looks like a lady" is blaring!

[BingeyKohan]

25 minutes ago, Ellaria Sand said:

Something else interesting from the notoriously unreliable IMDB...

There is a no-name character listed as an "Airline Guest." All of other characters listed are either known (Arkady, Renee, Father Andrei, Nesterenko) or FBI agents. From the preview, there is nothing to indicate that anyone is headed to an airport. And if there is a scene in an airport, it would likely require additional people (passengers, security, etc).

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt5780830/fullcredits?ref_=tt_cl_sm#cast

I'd noticed that too - reading up on that 'actor' it seems like he's an entertainment exec so I interpreted it to mean he got a vanity walk-on part in the finale as a courtesy. But to your larger point, it does indicate there is an airplane or airport scene. Maybe Oleg and/or Nesterenko going home? Maybe Claudia? Maybe Arkady coming here? 

[Ellaria]

9 minutes ago, BingeyKohan said:

I'd noticed that too - reading up on that 'actor' it seems like he's an entertainment exec so I interpreted it to mean he got a vanity walk-on part in the finale as a courtesy. But to your larger point, it does indicate there is an airplane or airport scene. Maybe Oleg and/or Nesterenko going home? Maybe Claudia? Maybe Arkady coming here? 

Yes, probably a vanity walk-on. I suppose that additional people could be extras and therefore wouldn't require listing on IMDB. 

Someone going home is a great suggestion. Hopefully, it is Oleg.

[hellmouse]

4 minutes ago, Ellaria Sand said:

Yes, probably a vanity walk-on. I suppose that additional people could be extras and therefore wouldn't require listing on IMDB. 

Someone going home is a great suggestion. Hopefully, it is Oleg.

So far the preview showed them in a car, an interview said they filmed scenes on a train, and now a vanity walk-on part indicates an airline. Planes, trains and automobiles. I wish we'd get a last minute interview that hints at a boat. Or horses!

[BingeyKohan]

1 minute ago, hellmouse said:

So far the preview showed them in a car, an interview said they filmed scenes on a train, and now a vanity walk-on part indicates an airline. Planes, trains and automobiles. I wish we'd get a last minute interview that hints at a boat. Or horses!

Ha! Also, a middle of the night snowstorm on Staten Island - although I think they didn't necessarily want it to be snowing for the scene, it just happened to be so they either went with it or waited it out. I am someone who has even scoured the #theamericans hashtag on Instagram for random people posting pictures of what's been filmed in their neighborhood but I haven't spotted anything we haven't already seen.

[SunnyBeBe]

3 hours ago, Ellaria Sand said:

Something else interesting from the notoriously unreliable IMDB...

There is a no-name character listed as an "Airline Guest." All of other characters listed are either known (Arkady, Renee, Father Andrei, Nesterenko) or FBI agents. From the preview, there is nothing to indicate that anyone is headed to an airport. And if there is a scene in an airport, it would likely require additional people (passengers, security, etc).

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt5780830/fullcredits?ref_=tt_cl_sm#cast

Thanks for catching that. I had looked and missed it!  I think I saw it, but, then you have to look further to see that it's in START.  So, that really does encourage my interest even more!  So why one passenger on an airline?

Edited May 29, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[Ellaria]

On 5/26/2018 at 11:43 AM, Plums said:

so, Mo Ryan, with her early access as a reviewer, gave an extremely vague hint on twitter about the finale, saying that there's at least one if not two scenes with music that are going to be major tearjerkers. Someone replied that they looked up songs from 1987 and that they think they know what song she's referring to, and she said they might have. And that it's not Peter Gabriel. I just looked up 1987 songs and THERE ARE SO MANY POSSIBILITIES. I wish she hadn't said anything, tbh, because this is infuriating. 

Maybe we can narrow it down. Here are two 1987 songs that probably aren't in the finale:

The Bangles, "Walk Like an Egyptian"

Wang Chung, "Everybody Have Fun Tonight"

Edited May 29, 2018 by Ellaria Sand

[Dev F]

22 hours ago, Umbelina said:

Maybe they only needed North for one episode, they got the whole gist of the character and tactics then.  Maybe they didn't like working with North, so they didn't pull him in as consultant on other episodes.  Too many options to guess at really.

Oh, I don't think there's any connection between the number of episodes the actual Oliver North worked on and the number of episodes the character of Oliver North was scheduled to appear in. My point was, the casting notice for the character wouldn't have indicated that he was going to appear in a single episode with only the potential of a guest arc later if he was originally the proto-Larrick antagonist for the entire season.

As for the real Ollie North, the sense I got was that he consulted on the entire Contra storyline, not any one particular episode, and that they gave him a story credit on the most Contra-heavy episode essentially as a courtesy. In any event, he and the producers apparently parted on good terms, to the point that North later did press for the season out of the series' production offices.

7 hours ago, TimWil said:

Motorcyclist-20s-40s. Male. MUST SPEAK FLUENT (NATIVE) RUSSIAN. Badly injured and in need of medical attention after his motorcycle crashes on a quiet road. ONE LINE. IN RUSSIAN.

 

Note: This particular casting breakdown was for Episode #603 (Season 6, Episode 3) which was shot in mid November but the character didn’t actually appear until this past

Wednesday’s #609, which was shot in late February. Hmmm. I wonder if that flashback of Elizabeth back in the USSR was meant to be used earlier as a counterpoint to some other situation much earlier in the season?

Very interesting. "Urban Transport Planning" indeed.

This strengthens my belief that the painting in Erica's bedroom that haunts Elizabeth was meant to represent the disapproving look of young Liz's trainer after she left her comrade to die in the street. Obviously, that connection would've been much clearer if we'd seen the training scenes before most of the stuff with the painting.

Edited May 29, 2018 by Dev F

[jjj]

In an article on the Media thread, I read one mild spoiler that will not surprise anyone, about Philip's son in Russia.  Posting below for those who want to avoid it.

.

.

.

The showrunners were asked if we would get resolution about Philip's son back in Russia, and they said that well, it is inevitable that some balls will be left up in the air.  I was not expecting any resolution to that plot, but at least someone is remembering him!  I still do not understand the reason for his trip to the U.S.  You could lift out that entire plot and it would make not difference to anything else that happened that season or beyond.  

[SunnyBeBe]

I'm leaning towards a U2 song, like With or Without You or

 

Other options:

Lady in Red

At This Moment

[hellmouse]

6 minutes ago, jjj said:

In an article on the Media thread, I read one mild spoiler that will not surprise anyone, about Philip's son in Russia.  Posting below for those who want to avoid it.

.

.

.

The showrunners were asked if we would get resolution about Philip's son back in Russia, and they said that well, it is inevitable that some balls will be left up in the air.  I was not expecting any resolution to that plot, but at least someone is remembering him!  I still do not understand the reason for his trip to the U.S.  You could lift out that entire plot and it would make not difference to anything else that happened that season or beyond.  

I just wish they would explain why they felt that storyline was meaningful. I've never heard anyone ask them about why they spent so much time on his journey when it had zero impact on the main characters of the show, especially Philip. 

I could believe that they wanted to show how speaking against the Afghanistan war could get you put in a mental institution. I could believe that they wanted to show the mechanics of getting out of the Soviet Union, across Europe and to America. Those were interesting things to learn and see. 

But why did it have to be Philip's son doing it, and then end up with Philip utterly unaware of all it? That is the part I don't understand. I can't think of a similar season-long plot that had such little impact on Philip or Elizabeth. I truly wonder if they had some other plot line that they ended up scrapping. Were they satisfied with it, and why?

That is what I would ask them, if I could. 

[Ellaria]

1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Thanks for catching that. I had looked and missed it!  I think I saw it, but, then you have to look further to see that it's in START.  So, that really does encourage my interest even more!  So why one passenger on an airline?

Here's his photo.  Is he close in age to Paige or Henry?

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm7886036/

Yes, it is in "START." 

If you click on the name "Frank Fernandez" in the cast list, it does not go to the actor that you linked to. It goes to: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1871296/?ref_=tt_cl_t10.

That individual - as @BingeyKohan pointed out above - is an industry executive. That's why we believe that it is a "vanity walk on." And that's why we are questioning what type of airline scene this could be.

[sistermagpie]

2 minutes ago, hellmouse said:

just wish they would explain why they felt that storyline was meaningful. I've never heard anyone ask them about why they spent so much time on his journey when it had zero impact on the main characters of the show, especially Philip. 

And they seemed to create a brother and family for Philip just for Mischa! Ridiculous!  As if he was only important as an uncle and it raised no questions about the character we knew. They only even included him in one home flashback to show he existed and then Philip was back to looking like an only child again.

[SunnyBeBe]

7 minutes ago, Ellaria Sand said:

Yes, it is in "START." 

If you click on the name "Frank Fernandez" in the cast list, it does not go to the actor that you linked to. It goes to: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1871296/?ref_=tt_cl_t10.

That individual - as @BingeyKohan pointed out above - is an industry executive. That's why we believe that it is a "vanity walk on." And that's why we are questioning what type of airline scene this could be.

Oh, so not the young actor Frank Fernandez.  Interesting. It is quite the mystery.  But, at least, there is an airline scene. I'm glad to get that at least.  

[hellmouse]

7 minutes ago, sistermagpie said:

And they seemed to create a brother and family for Philip just for Mischa! Ridiculous!  As if he was only important as an uncle and it raised no questions about the character we knew. They only even included him in one home flashback to show he existed and then Philip was back to looking like an only child again.

Yes! And if Philip had a brother, why didn't the brother send tapes from home like Elizabeth's mother did? I always assumed he got no tapes because he had no living relatives. But noooo. 

The brother in the flashback was totally a retcon IMO and it was all so that Gabriel could unite Mischa with a family. But Philip has never once mentioned his brother. Ugh. It annoys me to think about all the things we don't know about Philip. I will crack up if there is another Elizabeth flashback in the finale. 

[SunnyBeBe]

So, I guess that it's not very realistic to expect P, E, Paige and Henry to get off a plane in Russia and have Gabriel and Mischa waiting with hugs and smiles.  I know...too much, but, in a way them admitting to no resolution with Mischa kind of reveals that none of them are going to Russia, because if they did, it's likely they would meet Mischa.  But, if they don't, due to death or arrest, then, his fate in left in the air. 

Edited May 29, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[BingeyKohan]

1 minute ago, SunnyBeBe said:

So, I guess that it's not very realistic to expect P, E, Paige and Henry to get off a plane in Russia and have Gabriel and Mischa waiting with hugs and smiles.  I know...too much. 

Like the beginning (and end) of "Love, Actually" - I wish! It is the Christmas season in the Jennings universe! 

[Ellaria]

5 minutes ago, hellmouse said:

Yes! And if Philip had a brother, why didn't the brother send tapes from home like Elizabeth's mother did? I always assumed he got no tapes because he had no living relatives. But noooo. 

The brother in the flashback was totally a retcon IMO and it was all so that Gabriel could unite Mischa with a family. But Philip has never once mentioned his brother. Ugh. It annoys me to think about all the things we don't know about Philip. I will crack up if there is another Elizabeth flashback in the finale. 

This story line had me scratching my head last year. Its like they abandoned it halfway thru writing it and then tried to tie it up with a bow ("let's give him an uncle that we have never mentioned so he has family"). I sometimes think that Mischa's story was more about Gabriel than Mischa.

14 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Oh, so not the young actor Frank Fernandez.  Interesting. It is quite the mystery.  But, at least, there is an airline scene. I'm glad to get that at least.  

I wonder if the airplane scene is part of a flashback. Perhaps P or E thinking back to when they first arrived here. That could explain one there is only one listed airline "guest."

[SunnyBeBe]

8 minutes ago, Ellaria Sand said:

This story line had me scratching my head last year. Its like they abandoned it halfway thru writing it and then tried to tie it up with a bow ("let's give him an uncle that we have never mentioned so he has family"). I sometimes think that Mischa's story was more about Gabriel than Mischa.

I wonder if the airplane scene is part of a flashback. Perhaps P or E thinking back to when they first arrived here. That could explain one there is only one listed airline "guest."

Yes, I suppose it could be a flashback scene in an airplane.  From his credits, the actor playing the man appears to be in his 40's or older, right? But, he doesn't seem to have much significance, so.......Not sure.  On a red eye flight, the planeis often pretty empty, but, maybe, there is one who makes some comment.  OR Maybe Stan interviews a person who was on the flight with E and P from Chicago?  lol   Or, maybe, P buys the guy's ticket and slips on the flight. 

Edited May 29, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[DrumJunkie]

To me, Mischa's storyline showed how the Center controlled the information that E&P received.  There was a lot of information control in Season 5, with the whole wheat issue and now in this final season with how Elizabeth only had enough information to be dangerous and do the Center's bidding.  To have Mischa turned away illustrated how Philip was serving a cold master, just like we see Elizabeth discover now.  The storyline helped us to feel even more empathy for Philip as he struggled with ideology vs. humanity.  It gave us a connection with his flashbacks and fleshed out a little bit about his family.  I think we have more backstory on Philip then we do with Elizabeth.  What family did Elizabeth have?  Was she an only child? I honestly don't recall.

21 minutes ago, hellmouse said:

And if Philip had a brother, why didn't the brother send tapes from home like Elizabeth's mother did? I always assumed he got no tapes because he had no living relatives.

I'm guessing that the brother didn't have the connections that Elizabeth's mother did, or even know such a thing was possible.  Did he even have a tape recorder?  Wasn't E's mother a lower-level party official (secretary, maybe)?

[jjj]

Here's another twist if the Jenningses would end up back in Russia: as far as Martha knew, she actually was married to Clark/Philip, right?  I don't think he ever told her he was already married, although he told her his real name.  I know she had no idea of Elizabeth's relationship with Philip.  Not that I am expecting to see them back in Russia...

Edited May 29, 2018 by jjj

[Plums]

I mean, I don't think it's ridiculous that they created the brother figure for whatever reason. We didn't really know anything about Philip's pre-KGB past at all before season 5, except the town he was from. If he has a brother, it's obvious they were not close at all and didn't keep in touch, and that in itself is informative. I really don't think it's ridiculous or out of nowhere that they wrote him as having a brother in season 5. 

Now, I don't know if they mainly did that for the benefit of the Mischa character or not, but however unsatisfying that whole mini-arc was wrt Philip, it served some purpose. 1) A lot of the time spent in the USSR in season 5 was just showing what a miserable place it was by that time. Oleg was becoming disillusioned with the system over chasing down the extreme corruption in the food supply chain to contrast with the Jennings thinking their food supply was being sabotaged by a nefarious outside actor until discovering no, actually their people are hungry because of incompetence and corruption at home. With Mischa (and also Martha, when we had glimpses of her), we got the even worse perspective of more normal civilians to contrast with the privilege enjoyed by Oleg's set. And his entire escape was a good illustration of just how dangerous and difficult it was to leave, even when you have a plan and resources laid out by a master spy.   

And 2)

3 minutes ago, Ellaria Sand said:

I sometimes think that Mischa's story was more about Gabriel than Mischa.

I agree. Gabriel lying to Philip and turning a long lost son away from his father without telling him was the straw that broke the camel's back. It really destroyed him to do it, and I think the guilt was so heavy for him, that it led to him trying to make whatever amends he could when he got back to Russia- by connecting Mischa to Philip's brother and doing what he could to make Martha's life better. And the thing with the brother is, Mischa is so happy to meet his father's brother and feel any sense of connection to this man he doesn't know, but we know that Philip and his brother are practically strangers and probably haven't seen each other since they were kids, and that's significant to me. It connects him to the rest of the Jennings family in that whatever understanding he develops of his father is not anywhere close to the whole truth. 

TL;DR I didn't mind the Mischa arc, lol. 

[Umbelina]

I really don't understand why anyone thinks that Elizabeth and/or Philip would be safe back in Moscow.

They would be killed.

The people Liz worked for are ready to kill Gorbachev, you honestly think they would hesitate for even one moment to kill Phil and Liz?  Liz already confessed to Claudia, who is with that group.  They are dangerous, they could expose heavy hitters to Gorbachev, they killed a KGB Officer. 

Their only chance of staying alive is defecting to the USA, and even then?  WOULD they get immunity for all they've done?  I seriously doubt it, too many murders, including 3 FBI officers in Chicago, a General, a sailor, the people in the warehouse, Amador, and once things begin to unravel, IF they were honest with the FBI in order to get that immunity?  At least 3 dozen other deaths.

I suppose they could simply try to run, but just like Philip's baby momma?  Who, by the way, was MUCH more prepared to run?  The USSR or USA WOULD track them down.  They don't have enough money or influence to buy off the people they would need to buy off to actually hide in Argentina or some other place.

They're done.

Hated the Misha story ending, hate that Elizabeth gets so many flashbacks to her past, and Philip's, which are MUCH more interesting (GULAG!) get dangled out there along with his father's mysterious death, and no resolve about his mother at all, just keep getting teased.

Edited May 29, 2018 by Umbelina

[hellmouse]

1 hour ago, Dev F said:

5 hours ago, TimWil said:

Motorcyclist-20s-40s. Male. MUST SPEAK FLUENT (NATIVE) RUSSIAN. Badly injured and in need of medical attention after his motorcycle crashes on a quiet road. ONE LINE. IN RUSSIAN.

 

Note: This particular casting breakdown was for Episode #603 (Season 6, Episode 3) which was shot in mid November but the character didn’t actually appear until this past

Wednesday’s #609, which was shot in late February. Hmmm. I wonder if that flashback of Elizabeth back in the USSR was meant to be used earlier as a counterpoint to some other situation much earlier in the season?

Very interesting. "Urban Transport Planning" indeed.

This strengthens my belief that the painting in Erica's bedroom that haunts Elizabeth was meant to represent the disapproving look of young Liz's trainer after she left her comrade to die in the street. Obviously, that connection would've been much clearer if we'd seen the training scenes before most of the stuff with the painting.

Just re-read an interview with Joe Weisberg and Joel Fields from Collider (‘The Americans’ EPs Joe Weisberg and Joel Fields on Navigating the Intense, Emotional Final Season) and they talked a little about moving things around this season. It made more sense to me in light of this casting information: 

Quote

Q: You’ve said that you knew what the ending would be, but that you had a few variations of that ending to decide between. When did you finally decide on the variation of the endgame that you were going to commit to?

WEISBERG: That’s an interesting question, but it’s hard to answer. Quite a few months ago, we picked the variation, but even up until recently, we were figuring out how to get there. Part of this season has been about making a lot of changes and adjustments to how we get there. We made some changes that felt very significant, about how we’d get there. So, even though that ending has stayed in place, the adjustments really mattered.

FIELDS: Even the small adjustments are big adjustments. I’m sure we’ll be refining it, down to the last frame in the editing room.

I would have loved for the horse/motorcycle collision to be in Urban Transport Planning because it certainly showed a need for it!

[SunnyBeBe]

https://www.fxnetworks.com/shows/the-americans/americans-s3-guide.pdf

This is the show's logo, so to speak.  On it, there is a sign that starts out, YOU ARE LEAVING THE AMERICAN SEC.....I can't make it out. It's right below Uncle Sam.   Anyone know where this is from?

Edited May 29, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[Umbelina]

It's when Berlin was divided up just as WWII ended, later to become the Berlin Wall.  The sign before you went into the Soviet section of Berlin.

[sistermagpie]

3 hours ago, Plums said:

I mean, I don't think it's ridiculous that they created the brother figure for whatever reason. We didn't really know anything about Philip's pre-KGB past at all before season 5, except the town he was from. If he has a brother, it's obvious they were not close at all and didn't keep in touch, and that in itself is informative. I really don't think it's ridiculous or out of nowhere that they wrote him as having a brother in season 5. 

Now, I don't know if they mainly did that for the benefit of the Mischa character or not, but however unsatisfying that whole mini-arc was wrt Philip, it served some purpose. 1) A lot of the time spent in the USSR in season 5 was just showing what a miserable place it was by that time. Oleg was becoming disillusioned with the system over chasing down the extreme corruption in the food supply chain to contrast with the Jennings thinking their food supply was being sabotaged by a nefarious outside actor until discovering no, actually their people are hungry because of incompetence and corruption at home. With Mischa (and also Martha, when we had glimpses of her), we got the even worse perspective of more normal civilians to contrast with the privilege enjoyed by Oleg's set. And his entire escape was a good illustration of just how dangerous and difficult it was to leave, even when you have a plan and resources laid out by a master spy.   

And 2)

I agree. Gabriel lying to Philip and turning a long lost son away from his father without telling him was the straw that broke the camel's back. It really destroyed him to do it, and I think the guilt was so heavy for him, that it led to him trying to make whatever amends he could when he got back to Russia- by connecting Mischa to Philip's brother and doing what he could to make Martha's life better. And the thing with the brother is, Mischa is so happy to meet his father's brother and feel any sense of connection to this man he doesn't know, but we know that Philip and his brother are practically strangers and probably haven't seen each other since they were kids, and that's significant to me. It connects him to the rest of the Jennings family in that whatever understanding he develops of his father is not anywhere close to the whole truth. 

TL;DR I didn't mind the Mischa arc, lol. 

Philip having a brother he's not close to is a story that would need answering imo. He himself stated in one of his very few talks about his past that he was raised thinking life was about hard work and protecting your family. Why would he already be not close to his brother at 16? What about their mother? If they're already estranged that's dramatic. When he mentions him to Elizabeth it's like it's no biggie.

I agree the story was about getting Gabriel to quit and show he went back to the USSR needing to create families since he just kept one from connecting. That doesn't change the fact that the most important thing about Philip's brother is that Philip has a brother and I want to know about him. I have no reason to care if the kid who wanted to meet Philip meets him instead. I mean, it's fine but obviously not the main point of interest. I already know Mischa's mom and grandfather who take up screentime and are technically connected to Philip but offer no enlightenment about him at all. At least his brother provided the admittedly great fact that he was super smart.

Also there's nothing in that scene that indicates they're particularly estranged since the nephew obviously knows about him. They haven't seen each other since adolescence of course but neither had Elizabeth and her Mom. Family is important to Philip and Elizabeth's mother did not seem particularly well connected as the wife of a coward. I assume the Centre would provide tape recorders since almost no one would have one and they'd have to vet messages. Did he get tapes from mom before she died? Did she die? These tapes were not about Elizabeth's mom having clout they were about keeping Elizabeth connected to her home so wtf would they not do that with Philip? Did his big brother never know about the milk gang or never beg for scraps with the other urchins?

Edited May 29, 2018 by sistermagpie

[Plums]

continuing the Mischa/Philip's family discussion in the Philip thread.

[JennyMominFL]

4 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

https://www.fxnetworks.com/shows/the-americans/americans-s3-guide.pdf

This is the show's logo, so to speak.  On it, there is a sign that starts out, YOU ARE LEAVING THE AMERICAN SEC.....I can't make it out. It's right below Uncle Sam.   Anyone know where this is from?

Sign at checkpoint Charlie... And others, in berlin