Season One: Law & Order Goes Cerebral

[WendyCR72]

And now "Jones". Awesome. Griffin Dunne played an awesome sleaze. But the wife, Denise, was either dumb as a box of hair or just willing to be as no one with half a brain would buy the story hubby gave her about the used condom on their kitchen floor.

[WendyCR72]

Red hair or blonde, short or long, Haviland Morris (now on in "The Extra Man", another good episode!) will always be Carolyn in Sixteen Candles to me.

[WendyCR72]

And I do like the hearing with the judge here. We saw it regularly on The Mothership, but it was so rare on CI.

[WendyCR72]

Oh, "The Good Doctor". Can't wait for the trial scenes with Carver ironically discussing cutting, knives, and his "Does this amuse you, Doctor?"

[WendyCR72]

I noticed last night that the last episode with the Lily Carmichael bored little rich girl/Paris Hilton/Kim Kardashian (but more the former here as Paris was big in the early 2000s!) wannabe with the crooked FBI agent - "The Insider" (thank you, TV Guide) - the line where Bobby told the FBI guy that he used Lily and that "pisses [him] off" wasn't bleeped or stricken. Ion seemed to be arbitrary as far as editing. And CI liked its bored rich girls with Daddy issues, what with S8's "Salome In Manhattan" actually making Paris/Kim Kardashian clone #2 the victim.

 

The actress playing Lily was familiar to me, and I've no idea why. I do know one of the suspects questioned, the guy with the knife, was Eric Millegan, who went on to co-star on Bones for three seasons as Zack Addy.

[Eolivet]

Oh, "The Good Doctor". Can't wait for the trial scenes with Carver ironically discussing cutting, knives, and his "Does this amuse you, Doctor?"

 

That's a great scene, but the Mothership did it before (and better) in the final part of the reviled-by-everyone-but-me trilogy, "Showtime."

 

Robert Knepper is born to play creepy, though. I don't think I've ever seen him play a nice guy.

Edited December 7, 2014 by Eolivet

[WendyCR72]

Robert Knepper is born to play creepy, though. I don't think I've ever seen him play a nice guy.

 

This is true, but I guess sometimes, typecasting can work to an actor's advantage!

[Donny Ketchum]

And now "Jones". Awesome. Griffin Dunne played an awesome sleaze.

Honestly . . . I only watch season one for this episode.  I don't care about the rest of it.  And even then, it's not for the whole episode I watch it.  Just for this exchange:

 

Goren: You had enough of this guy?

Eames: Plenty.  (Gets up.)  I need to go wash off the slime.

 

Other than that, season one is "meh" for me.  From there, I just wait for season two.

Edited December 8, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[WendyCR72]

Oh, "Phantom" is on! Great episode. I read on the TV Guide site that starting with next week's marathon, for any night owls, if any, the marathon will go from 11:00 a.m. until 3:00 a.m. the following morning instead of 1:00 a.m. (I guess Flashpoint, which used to start at 1, has ended or is being moved?)

 

Love watching Goren/Eames play with Charlotte Caspari.

[WendyCR72]

Sweet, good to know about the extended marathon. For a second, I was worried you were going to say they were downsizing the showings!

 

I noticed at TV By The Numbers in the Syndication ratings that L&O: CI is consistently in the Top 10. So I can see why it holds on.  :-)

[WendyCR72]

It has to help CI that SVU is so oversaturated on the airwaves, courtesy USA/MyTV showings. I can't even imagine how many hours of SVU run in an average week. CI and original recipe are a bit harder to find for franchise devotees. 

 

Here is the syndication ratings page. The next bunch is delayed because of the holidays, but it usually comes out on Tuesdays. SVU is also in the Top 25, but I was surprised to see, at least with these ratings, CI is higher. But the whole franchise seems to print money, so...

 

Ironically, I think the Mothership in terms of syndication is a hard one to find unless you have upper tier channels. It's now only on TNT at odd hours or We for the "regular" channels. As far as I can tell, anyway.

[Spartan Girl]

I would have liked one other ending scene for the tail end of "Phantom" where the wife confronts the scumbag for murdering her father, attempting to kill their kids, and for being a lying sociopath and tell them that the kids are never going to see their "hero dad" again.

 

I know this might be an unpopular opinion, but I still don't have one iota of pity for Viola Davis' character in "Badge."  I'm supposed to feel sorry for her because she wanted a better life for her kids?  She MURDERED two innocent children and their parents to cover her ass.  People like that should not be allowed to have kids.  I love Viola Davis, but that lady deserved what she got.

[WendyCR72]

I would have liked one other ending scene for the tail end of "Phantom" where the wife confronts the scumbag for murdering her father, attempting to kill their kids, and for being a lying sociopath and tell them that the kids are never going to see their "hero dad" again.

 

I know this might be an unpopular opinion, but I still don't have one iota of pity for Viola Davis' character in "Badge."  I'm supposed to feel sorry for her because she wanted a better life for her kids?  She MURDERED two innocent children and their parents to cover her ass.  People like that should not be allowed to have kids.  I love Viola Davis, but that lady deserved what she got.

 

Oh, I never felt sorry for her, either! But damned if Viola Davis didn't play the creepy overly-invested mama/dirty cop to the hilt. And I thought it was pretty cool to have S. Epatha Merkerson do a crossover and have Terry mixed up with Van Buren's history.

 

Apparently, Ms. Davis was very complimentary of this role in an interview some years after the fact, so it must have made some sort of impression on her, too.

[Eolivet]

I agree that we're not supposed to feel sorry for Terry Randolph. But to me, a great villain is one that makes you believe that they believe what they are doing is right -- as most criminals feel justified for committing their crimes (and aren't just homicidal maniacs). With Davis' portrayal, I believed that she believed her "ends justify the means" killings was purely out of the desire to help her kids. You could just see how she compartmentalized. Planning murders with the same fervor as she told her daughters to eat their vegetables. That's a good script, elevated by a command performance, IMO.

 

Contrast Davis' performance with the much weaker "trailer park mom" wanting her son to get into a good preschool from "Please Note..." or the dad from "Bright Boy" in season 2. All "I did it for my kid!" characters with similar motivations (killing to improve their child's life). But I found the mom from "Please Note.." and the dad from "Bright Boy" insufferable bratty children themselves, while I understood Terry Randolph. That's great acting, to me. That was all Viola Davis.

Edited December 29, 2014 by Eolivet

[Spartan Girl]

Excellent points, but the way she coldly and remorselessly executed that family and could calmly eat fish afterwards while subtly threatening her accomplice to keep quiet just repulsed me.

[Maherjunkie]

"Paris Hilton" was also in the awful "All In."  "Henry's wife" has a history of being stupid-she was in JAWS the Revenge!

 

Though I don't recall Michael Emerson killing his wife's father, just Cookie and her brother.

[FozzyBear]

Badge is one of my favorites precisely because Viola Davis's character is so horrible and Davis knocks that woman's particular brand of sociopath right out of the park. Such an outstanding performance. It's up there with Indifference from L&O OG for terrifyingly fascinating episodes.

[WendyCR72]

What added a level of creepiness to "Badge" was the very fact that Terry Randolph was a cop! Not to say they are super human but cops are supposed to protect people from the sociopaths and the psychos. So the fact that one wore the uniform and could execute a family without a pang of remorse was just...chilling.

 

On a side note, while I get why he did it - to assess angles and blood spatter - I was always grossed out when Bobby slipped on that bloodied shirt from the male murder victim.

[Eolivet]

"Paris Hilton" was also in the awful "All In."  "Henry's wife" has a history of being stupid-she was in JAWS the Revenge!

 

Though I don't recall Michael Emerson killing his wife's father, just Cookie and her brother.

 

I thought every time someone asked for their money back, they ended up dead. Maybe it was his mother-in-law...didn't somebody "slip" on a "patch of ice" or am I not remembering correctly?

 

Badge is one of my favorites precisely because Viola Davis's character is so horrible and Davis knocks that woman's particular brand of sociopath right out of the park. Such an outstanding performance. It's up there with Indifference from L&O OG for terrifyingly fascinating episodes.

 

Great point -- and parallel. "Pookie can't live without her daddy." :shudders:

 

And the Terry vs. Bobby's overexaggerated New YAWK cop scene is truly a thing of beauty.

[WendyCR72]

About Michael Emerson in "Phantom", there was an inquest into his father-in-law's death, if I recall. I think that was mentioned, and he had handled his in-laws' finances, as well. I think it was heavily implied that he had something to do with his FIL's demise as it was said that he was alone with his FIL when the "accidental fall" happened.

 

So I do think he killed his FIL as well as Frank Caspari. Cookie/Charlotte didn't die but was in a long-term coma, so maybe close enough.

 

On another note, I do think "Badge" was as creepy and affecting as "Indifference" on the Mothership. Creepy for different reasons and both disturbing, but both episodes were haunting.

 

Happy New Year, all!

[WendyCR72]

Hey Ms. Wendy? :) Is there or can I suggest if there is not a "In Memoriam" spot forum? Super sad about the loss of Edward Herrmann, who just the other day I was watching in L&O but whose teevee bona fides extend beyond that. Thank you and Happy New Year to you!

 

Eeeeek! The monkey! What a way to start 2015!

 

To answer your question, @Chattygal, there is an In Memoriam thread.  :-)

 

And reading the TV Guide online [where I discovered the Mothership is currently on TNT, yay! It is competing against SVU on USA now, funnily enough!], it appears Saturday is the last CI marathon on that day - again, this time 'til 3:00 a.m. After that, the marathon on ion appears to be moving to 6:00 p.m. Friday 1/9 to 3:00 a.m. 1/10. (On a side note, there seems to be more USA listings for the show than usual, too, not to mention cloo and the Universal channel...)

 

ETA: I made the Friday marathon sound like a one-timer, adding the dates. But that seems to be the new day and time: Fridays starting at 6:00 p.m. ET until 3:00 a.m. on Saturday mornings.

 

Happy New Year to all who post and/or lurk!

[Maherjunkie]

Shit, what am I going to do on Sat!  Cookie died, as Eames says she'll never know what a worm her white knight turned out to be.

[WendyCR72]

Not necessarily. As the doctor said, Cookie/Charlotte could be in that coma forever, so what Eames says still applies. But she was never said to have died. She was in that coma from her strangulation and the stun gun.

[WendyCR72]

Ah, "The Goren Show!" quote from Deakins (The Faithful), and S1 even had some humor in the Interrogation Room when Goren was questioning the homeless guy who broke into Beautiful Dreamer.

[WendyCR72]

Speaking of "The Faithful", and with all the times I have seen this, I'm surprised this didn't hit me until now, but why the hell was Carver pissed at Goren at the very end (when he threatened to have Goren's badge)? Because I recall 25 to life was the deal Carver had offered Father Capanna's attorney.

 

Was he mad that Goren talked to Capanna privately? If so, I don't think it was worth the outrage since Capanna took a deal that was offered in the first place. So I was just wondering if I missed something or if Carver had a bruised ego or whatever.

[Donny Ketchum]

Badge is one of my favorites precisely because Viola Davis's character is so horrible and Davis knocks that woman's particular brand of sociopath right out of the park. Such an outstanding performance.

 

What added a level of creepiness to "Badge" was the very fact that Terry Randolph was a cop! Not to say they are super human but cops are supposed to protect people from the sociopaths and the psychos. So the fact that one wore the uniform and could execute a family without a pang of remorse was just...chilling.

Not to step on any toes, but could we really have considered Terry a sociopath?  A psychopath, for sure, but last I heard, sociopaths do terrible things just for themselves and, possibly, their own enjoyment.  At least she was doing what she did for her daughters.

[WendyCR72]

I think Terry's daughters were just a means to an end, to rationalize all of the horrible things she did. Maybe she did love them, but it wasn't a "pure" love. Viola Davis really did rock it, though. Terry was just cold to the bone.

[WendyCR72]

MyNetwork just showed The Extra Man (and is now showing Poison). I still liked Goren toying with the fake DuPont there. I still say it was filmed earlier in S1 since KE's/Eames' hair was so long there.

 

And I said it before, but Bobby seemed so normal/savvy early on with his contacts and jokes. Sad how that sort of faded away.

 

And hey, Poison has the Briscoe/Green cameo, so there's that. The Tylenol scare episode, almost 20 years after the fact. I guess it made for good TV.

 

As an aside, not S1 related, as an animal lover, I was happy to see on VDO's FB page that his family has just adopted a rescue dog!  Always a good thing.

[Maherjunkie]

Good for them!  And Trudy was great too.  I see her kind on Snapped all the time.  Her mother was just a means to an end.

[WendyCR72]

Good for them!  And Trudy was great too.  I see her kind on Snapped all the time.  Her mother was just a means to an end.

 

I'm pretty sure the actress playing Trudy (and she did sociopathic bitch well) also played one of Mark Ford Brady's living victims in "Endgame" in S6, as the woman who came to the police station and talked to Eames alone for a bit when Goren went to get her picture removed from the website.

[Eolivet]

And hey, Poison has the Briscoe/Green cameo, so there's that. The Tylenol scare episode, almost 20 years after the fact. I guess it made for good TV.

 

 

I think the woman in "Poison" fits Donny Ketchum's definition of sociopath. She was vile and just...calculated. That's one of those cases that it's so terrifying, because you could almost see it happening (even with all the tamper-proof bottles, the technology these days...) but you almost can't accept it when you're watching. I think I'm having a delayed reaction to that ep -- didn't she use the money to buy a baby boutique (or am I misremembering)? Talk about a massive entitlement complex, feeling you are owed -- no matter who else suffers. Ugh.

[WendyCR72]

I think I'm having a delayed reaction to that ep -- didn't she use the money to buy a baby boutique (or am I misremembering)?

 

Sort of. She used the money she got from killing her husband (from the lawsuit) as payment for a franchise contract to sell baby clothes. So, basically. Still, yeah, she was COLD to the bone, not even speaking up for her accused mom until the scandal affected HER plans. (Due to the morals clause in the contract and her mother adversely affecting her chances and with the threat of having the contract terminated.)

 

And the fact that she clawed at the register counter, trying to hold on and shouting, "No!" as G/E arrested her would be comical if it wasn't so utterly disturbing. Funny that her hubby was named Lenny, especially since Briscoe popped up here.

 

As I said to @Donny Ketchum, I also believe the actress playing Trudy in "Poison" was the same actress who appeared in "Endgame" in S6 as a still-living victim of Mark Ford Brady, the woman who spoke to Eames when Goren left to get the woman's picture taken off of the website.

[Maherjunkie]

Yes, that was she.  She's a survivor in any format!

[WendyCR72]

Yes, that was she.  She's a survivor in any format!

 

Apparently. At least she wasn't a sociopath in her second appearance! (Just almost the victim of one; kind of ironic, that!)

[WendyCR72]

So, tonight on MyNetwork is "The Pardoner's Tale" (the one with the Ledger reporter killed and gubernatorial coverups) and "The Good Doctor". The former has Kate Burton in it, who seems to have made a career playing bitchy women on Scandal and Grey's Anatomy. Heh. She is also Richard Burton's daughter.) The latter one I like if just for Carver's courtroom snark.

 

But I'm most curious about "Semi Professional" on this channel versus ION since ION edited out a line, "pissed his pants" from the book Goren read from. I'm curious if MyNetwork will allow it. I have no idea why that would be a big deal, anyway. Guess I'll find out in a few weeks.

[WendyCR72]

Huh. MyNetwork has skipped "Enemy Within" and "The Third Horseman" (the latter is kind of a hot button issue, but still...) and is now airing "Crazy", a.k.a. Steven Keaton from Family Ties is a nutty shrink with a user girlfriend (the ex-Mrs. Axl Rose). I think this was Jenna Stern's first appearance on CI as the vindictive ex.

 

So no "Third Horseman" but "Homo Homini Lupus" (great episode!) is now being shown. Weird.

[Maherjunkie]

I always thought they used Stockholm syndrome way too casually on this show.  A 14-yr-old girl has just been raped and she near automatically identifies with her captor?  Fuck that.

[Eolivet]

I'd never seen the full episode of "Homo Homini Lupus" before (just the last 20 minutes), but just caught it last night.

 

While there are plenty of vile perps in this episode, I save extra consideration for Lucas Colter, the dad. His law-breaking greed caused his family to be kidnapped and his daughter to be raped. I was practically cheering when his wife shut down his "protective dad" routine that tried to stop Goren and Eames from questioning Maggie. I hope she divorced him and took the girls. What a spineless creep.

 

This episode, more than most that were specifically about greed, seemed to be proof that money truly is the root of all evil.

[Maherjunkie]

I love the Little Joe phone scene.  That is the Bobby I missed.

[WendyCR72]

I love the Little Joe phone scene.  That is the Bobby I missed.

 

That was awesome as was his dismissing the guy's lawyer with "Whatever" just before that as she tried to bargain. But what I really loved was Bobby in that restaurant, holding the gun up to the side of the scumbag rapist's head and innocently asking, "Are you gonna answer that?"

 

We so rarely got to see Bobby all bad ass with the gun.

[Donny Ketchum]

We so rarely got to see Bobby all bad ass with the gun.

We so rarely got to see him with a gun, period.  Eames, too, for that matter.  Logan, Barek, and Wheeler would have their guns way more often, but Goren and Eames rarely pulled out theirs, for some reason.

[WendyCR72]

We so rarely got to see him with a gun, period.  Eames, too, for that matter.  Logan, Barek, and Wheeler would have their guns way more often, but Goren and Eames rarely pulled out theirs, for some reason.

 

- I remember Bobby pointing the gun at Henry Talbot, the sleazy lawyer in "Jones", when he said the famous line, "Hey, Don Juan! You're under arrest."

- I also recall him pulling the gun on the fake Dennis DuPont's girlfriend as he ordered her to sit down in the hotel room...and then Alex guarded her with her gun in "The Extra Man".

- And, of course, what I mentioned in "Homo Homini Lupus". Bobby in the restaurant, and Eames killed a guy outside.

 

The only other times I can recall any gun use was in the Malcolm MacDowell episode where his son was killed and he was hateful to his Asian-born wife: Eames killed his other son as he tried to kill his stepmother. And Bobby and Alex both held a gun on Ray Wasneski in "Siren Call".

 

But out of 10 seasons, yeah...it really wasn't a lot, and I agree the other pairings used their guns more often.

[Maherjunkie]

I loved that part too!

[WendyCR72]

While there are plenty of vile perps in this episode, I save extra consideration for Lucas Colter, the dad. His law-breaking greed caused his family to be kidnapped and his daughter to be raped. I was practically cheering when his wife shut down his "protective dad" routine that tried to stop Goren and Eames from questioning Maggie. I hope she divorced him and took the girls. What a spineless creep.

 

Oh, yes. This. So much. I mean, sure, his father was a bastard to him, but I sort of got his point, even being so cold: His son was basically worthless. And it sickened me when his own mother-in-law, even after all of this, talked about how Lucas' dad never cut him a break.

 

Hello! Screw him. What about what happened to YOUR daughter and grandchildren?

 

Like you, I hope Coulter's wife left him in the dust when all was said and done.

[WendyCR72]

So, MyNetwork is now on to "Semi-Professional" and "Seizure" tonight. I'm curious to see if the "he pissed his pants" line Goren reads to Arnie/Artie will be left in since ION, for whatever reason, deleted it.

 

And I appreciated Deakins standing up for his detectives to Carver regarding Judge Blakemore.

[WendyCR72]

So, and it sounded like an obvious edit, even as it was VDO's voice: "Pissed his pants" on MyNetwork was changed to "he wet himself". Weird how each channel has different edits.

[WendyCR72]

MyNetwork is showing "Phantom" and "Yesterday" this Tuesday. As much as I like the former, the more I think about it, those poor kids probably should have been dead what with all the time spent with the perp's wife trying to call the guy. He had the gun and the kidswere knocked out. But hey, dramatic license, I guess. Right?

 

Always fun to see G/E playing with poor ill-fated Cookie Caspari, though.

[WendyCR72]

Ah, the scene where G/E toy with Cookie is on. Love the little cat-and-mouse game.

[WendyCR72]

So Yesterday is on, the one from the murder in 1983. And it just hit me that the guy, Ricky, was trying to get info on the creepy college pal via a pay phone. I forgot that. I thought everyone had cell phones by the early 2000s.

[Maherjunkie]

I think you mean Yesterday.

 

I too love Phantom, but I think Cookie buys the farm.  Hard to believe the mother is the victim in Silence of the Lambs.